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foreign [Music] thank you foreign garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host
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Nick and with me as always is a man that knows that it takes a little more than a
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week to prepare a good impromptu speech he is the captain I will speak at weddings and I'll speak at funerals just
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call my agent it's going to be seen and it's good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a friend
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[Music] foreign we are drinking Fat Tire Belgian white ale by the new Belgian Brewing Company
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garage grade three and three quarter bottle caps out of five this is not the first time we've drank Fat Tire in the
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garage and it won't be the last 5 .2 percent ABV and you can certainly taste the hints of oranges and coriander it's
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a really good pick-me-up beer and I know some people turn up a nose to this but it's a great beer to drop an orange
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slice into as well and this week's beer was brought to us by a handful of Great Garage listeners first up we have
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Patrick in Southeastern Massachusetts and a big shout out to Leanne and one of my favorite places to visit Maui Hawaii
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next we have a long distance cheers to Stacy and Castro Valley California and also in California we have Kim in
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Salinas California and from Tecumseh Kansas we have a big shout out to Nicole we like Yoji and I want to give a thank
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you to Isabella in chelmer Australia and last but not least a big shout out to Danielle and Dayton and her mother Patty
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in Canton Ohio so thanks to everybody for filling up the fridge for this week's show if you want to help us out
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with next week's Beer Run go to truecrimegarage.com and click on the Donate button and check out our t-shirts
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on the store Page at 2 crime garage.com we're going to be working on new merchandise with you know some beer mugs
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some coffee mugs some stickers a bunch of stuff coming in 2018. and something very exciting Captain most of you out
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there will know this already but we have some special information we have crime con that is coming up the first weekend
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of May yes and you can check out details at crimecon.com and guess what if you use our little code here TC garage you
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can save yourself 10 on your tickets for this year's crime con yes so sign up come hang out with us we'll be drinking
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at the hotel bar hotel motel Holiday Inn well and if you want to save some money
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make sure you use code TC garage at crimecon.com to get your tickets for this year's crime con 2018. all right
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that's enough of the business gather around grab a chair grab a fat tire let's talk some true crime
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[Music] [Applause] thank you [Music] foreign in January of 1984 someone or someone's
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they were going around to different homes and attacking people in their homes in the Aurora and Lakewood
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Colorado areas now one thing we have tasked ourselves with for today Captain is there are
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several common questions regarding these attacks now we should lay it out here quickly before we get to the questions
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but in the first attack we have a husband and wife that are attacked in the middle of their night in the middle
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of the night in their bedroom they both survived the attack the second attack happens just Days
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Later where we have a 50 year old woman who's attacked inside of her town home she's raped and killed
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the third attack a woman is sexually assaulted and attacked in her garage she basically has no memory no she's in a
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coma for weeks yeah of the attack or the attacker and then the final attack that
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we can see the fourth attack is the Bennett family in the middle of the night somebody snuck into the Bennett
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family home they a fight ensued between the attacker and Bruce Bennett the father
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and the attack left the father dead the mother dead the oldest child dead and the youngest child was sent to the
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hospital who suffered horrible injuries and through many it took many surgeries to
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try to um try to put it so that she could try to have a normal life after this attack and
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having lost her family she would eventually go to on to live with her grandmother Constance Bennett now the
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questions that we've seen that are common to these attacks in this cold case from 1984 Colorado
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is were the four attacks connected and if there were no signs of forced entry how did the Intruder get into the
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homes of these people how did the did the killer know the victims or if not how did he choose
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these particular people or houses what was the motive for these attacks and the killings the attacks and the killings
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ended with the Bennett family why why did the the killer stop did the killer himself die or did he just stop killing
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or did he move to another state so several things to get to here today and I think if we can answer a lot of these
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questions we might be able to have a better idea of who in fact perpetrated these attacks let's start with the
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obvious question first were these attacks connected well that was a question that many people had speculated
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on for nearly 20 years it was the thought of locals and the thought of a lot of armchair detectives that
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it's likely that all four of these attacks were connected I mean we have the simple fact of we can't find any
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sign of forced entry in any of these four attacks it appears that the same weapon was used or the same type of
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weapon a hammer or something similar was used in all four attacks correct uh there where we have either a single
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female or a family being attacked so the victimology is similar the the gaining entry to the home might be similar and
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we also have the same weapon so it would have looked it would look that these attacks that all occurred mind you
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within the span of 13 days in roughly the same area that they must be connected yeah and I think because
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the timeline is so short you'd have you one would assume the problem that armchair detectives have had for those
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for those 20 years or nearly 20 years I should say is that the details of the cases we don't have hardly any
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information regarding the hobbins child case and that could be the first attack we do get some more information
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regarding the second attack the attack that's the the death and murder of Patricia Smith and then there's a ton of
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evidence or a ton of information out there on the Bennett family murders and that's the one that that's the cold case
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that kind of resonated with the community and with the people of Colorado that's the one that they would
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remind you of the anniversary of it and if there had been any movement in that case since since it had occurred in
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1984. well one out of the four attacks two of the attacks people survived uh well actually in three of the attacks
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somebody survived but the Bennett family case is you know it's it's pretty much the whole family yeah and all of those
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attacks we don't really have anybody that's able to describe the attacker you know so if if we would have had a
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surviving member of the family in each case go describe the attacker to us we could determine just based off of that
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if they were in fact connected or potentially connected yes and I think I'm going to assume and we'll probably
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get into this a little bit later but I'm going to assume that they had some um details about the attacker but not
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enough where that they could you know make a sketch or anything the only details that I could find and I do I'll
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give them to you now but it will Circle back to it later um was from the first attack from that
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hobbins child attack there there is a rumor floating around and I want to be clear that I feel that it could be a
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rumor there's information out there to suggest that Kimberly may have seen the attacker inside their home before she
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was hit before she was struck over the head and in this situation she describes an African-American male who was in her
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words well I I can't say for certain that these are her words that's why I want to be clear that this might be a
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rumor was that she had stated that the man was well over six foot and and in in these
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same reports I've also seen the word enormous used to describe this potential attacker but what we saw yeah I heard he
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was a tall piece of [ __ ] or enormous piece of [ __ ] what we would later learn
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like I said nearly 20 years later this was in 2002 that they announced remember there was DNA collected at several of
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the crime scenes the DNA of the person who murdered the Bennetts was found at the Bennett family home as
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well as the person that murdered Patricia Smith and her home yeah they announced in 2002 that the DNA from both
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of these crime scenes matched the DNA collected at the other crime scene right so those those two are at least
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connected correct um we can say science with scientific proof that those two cases are connected
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and those in fact involve all of the actual murders that only leaves the other two cases where people were
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attacked left for dead but in fact recovered later at the hospital now in those situations we have there
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was a bloody boot print that was found in the Bennett's garage okay so it was OJ
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yeah it was O.J Simpson um they what they did was they actually cut this this boot print out and saved
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it and preserved it for many many years probably to still to this day like Bigfoot the thing here is there was a
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similar if not identical boot print that was left in the garage of Donna Dixon so
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that would connect that one as well yeah there I found two reports of this so obviously this is not something that has
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been widely reported but it appears that we have scientific evidence that that all the murders are in fact connected
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and it's very likely that whoever attacked Donna Dixon in her garage was the same person uh that killed the
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Bennett family is there any information about the first attack as far as missing items
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no there's there's like because some of the other cases that will say you know she had diamond rings or
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diamond earrings or something and those were taken but it seems like with the first one there is no report of items
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missing okay so yeah not only is there no report of items missing but we also have some other lack of evidence or lack
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of information regarding the hobbins child attack we don't other than it being stated that
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no forced entry was used to get into the home we don't know how you know we don't
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know how they either determine that or B the way that this person gained entry what we do know is that the two victims
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were sleeping in their bedrooms so they didn't answer the door we can gather that much as you stated we don't
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know if there was anything taken from the home we don't know if Kimberly was sexually assaulted like some of the
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other females were in other attacks right doesn't mean she wasn't it just wasn't reported correct
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um and we don't know how much of uh if there was any struggle at all before the actual attacks occurred so what we heard
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in the first trailer there where I'm describing the actual attack a bit of that is dramatized okay because
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there is no information the information that's received that that I have found would suggest that they were in their
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bedroom sleeping when the attack occurred this makes me question if Kimberly in fact even would have seen
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the attacker at all right it makes me question that was she struck before she could have had the opportunity to see
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him or was the room dark enough that she couldn't make anything out regard guarding this person before she was
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struck over the head you're talking about she was either struck over the head before she had the opportunity to
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open her eyes or immediately after doing so and suffering such a terrible head injury also would make you question or
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me anyway question the validity of what she thinks she may have saw yeah you're not calling her a liar you're
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just saying again who knows I mean the attacker could be wearing a mask that the attacker could
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be wearing face paint you know if you're breaking into a house at night is it really that absurd to think that maybe
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the person would be wearing face paint you wake up poor ski mask right ski mask you wake up you're in the dark your eyes
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are adjusting maybe she believes she saw African-American male but like you said
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I'm with you how much can you trust what she what information she's putting out there I'd say probably none of it we
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know that this was the the middle of the night we know that this attack occurred
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in January of Colorado I can't State what the exact temperature was that night but I can tell you that I
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wouldn't put it at a question that the person was wearing something to cover their face not only for as a disguise
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but two to protect themselves from the elements um you know it being January in Colorado
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anyway so the other thing though here Captain is I came across two detective interviews uh that occurred over the
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years both of them have stated several times during these interviews that they believe that the Bennett family murders
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were connected to two other cases uh one that we say said was proven by DNA and the second one they wouldn't say it
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directly uh the Dixon the Donna Dixon attack but I'm I'm assuming that's what they mean that they they are pretty
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convinced that the three of them are connected the problem as we're pointing out is the hobbins child attack has so
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little information right but their evidence is the DNA connection and the boot print yes
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okay so this is this is pretty interesting here Captain armed with the DNA evidence that they announced in
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2002. now let's go to June of 2002. the then district attorney Jim Peters he obtained a John Doe arrest warrant
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charging John Doe this would be the person uh whose DNA was left at those two crime scenes with 18 counts
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including four first-degree murder charges and a bunch of sexual assault charges
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why is this important um because this is interesting because they have this person's DNA they don't know who he
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is but when there there's an opportunity that at some point this guy could commit
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another crime could get picked up for some reason where they would be required to take his DNA enter that information
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into certain databases and it would link the two now the problem here is if he were arrested in Aurora or
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Lakewood it's very likely that they um you know they would they would keep him immediately
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the thing here is let's say this guy committed a crime in Maine or in Florida or in Washington and he's picked up
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somewhere and they collect his DNA and it hits on in one of these databases well now the the local authorities of
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wherever this man is arrested can go you know what we know we only picked you up
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on a DUI and we would typically release you for this but we can't release you because there's an arrest warrant for
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you in the state of Colorado right so he would be held until he could be extradited and charged with these and
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brought to trial but there was another thing learned by this right yeah by the release of these of the DNA being
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connected between the two cases the other reason why this is so valuable and one thing that they told us when they
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released this information was that the police actually spent a lot of time when investigating the murders of the Bennett
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family members they spent a ton of time looking at actually actual family members of the Bennetts of having
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committed this murder right the triple murder because it was so heinous well not only that but it I think it's more
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for this point that earlier that night that same night that they were attacked just hours before they had that birthday
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party right where they had a bunch of people that they knew and a bunch of family members to their home
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and I think that the police were working on a theory that maybe either someone had returned to the home like some like
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I could go back to the home hours later and go hey I forgot I forgot my hat or I
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forgot my coat and gain entry into the home that way yeah or you could be like I forgot my wig the other thing though
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too is the thought that maybe somebody had concealed themselves somewhere in the home waiting for the family to go to
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sleep and then decided to attack them in the middle of the night um the DNA evidence was used to test
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against people that they were looking into whether it be Bennett family members or people that knew the Bennetts
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maybe it's people that worked at the Family Furniture store they were able to use this DNA to clear those people and
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with this information we could definitively say that three of the four attacks are connected then the question
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becomes how did this Intruder get into the house if there's never a sign of force entry okay so I was able to track
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down a couple of different news articles that took place that were written well after the crimes took took place this is
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from 1994 from the Rocky Mountain news and I'm not going to read the entire article but there are some things that I
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think that we should highlight here and in this article the person that is being
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interviewed is Constance Bennett now in this article she's going by Connie I'm assuming that that's what her friends
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and family actually called her but she's re she's recounting what took place 10 years ago from this interview and she's
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stating that the next morning when the couple had failed to show up at work she remembers thinking that she better go
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check on them because of something like carbon monoxide poisoning or carbon monoxide leak in the house yeah she
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stated that when she arrived to the home she walked up the sidewalk she saw Deborah's purse lying on the front lawn
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with its contents Spilled Out once inside the home she found Bruce inside the bloody spattered house on a
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Stairway leading from the main floor to a lower level he was bludgeoned and his throat was cut
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this is a direct quote from Constance or Connie stating I called 9-1-1 I couldn't
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remember the address she said I had to run outside to get it I was hysterical I guess we'll get back into a bit of that
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in a little bit but the other thing that she states here is she says after she called 9-1-1 the
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important information here is that she says 10 years after the attack I believe whoever
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committed this crime crept through the unlocked garage door in the quiet Darkness maybe on a mission to kill
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could have been looking for money maybe high on drugs and she states that she doesn't think that it was anyone who
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knew the Bennetts now I took this information then I I looked at this other article that was found from The
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Denver Post in September of 2003 and this article is different this one is written by a neighbor who is kind of
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he he doesn't talk so much about the crime itself yeah uh but he's kind of talking about the neighborhood and about
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his family and what what having lived next door or lived across the street from this triple homicide and how it has
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affected them and their neighborhood and he's stating you know that ever since that day this guy and his family are dog
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people they always own dogs uh before the attacks good people he said that they people they own Irish Setters they
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had always had Irish Setters before but now after the Bennett family was killed that they own Dobermans that they got a
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more aggressive uh dog because of this attack now the thing here is though that he
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states he had been watching a E's cold Crime Files one night before writing this article
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and he stated that he he thought that the almost forgotten Bennett case was a perfect uh would be perfect for this TV
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show Annie's cold Crime Files so he was kind of thinking back and reflecting on what he remembers of the crime in that
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night and he says the memory of that night was burnt in my mind the garage door was open all night
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he died of a slit throat his wife and daughter were bludgeoned to death little Vanessa survived so
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in the case of the Bennett family we have the mother speculating that the killer entered through the unlocked door
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from the garage nowhere in that article does she state that the garage door was open when she
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arrived at the scene however we have a neighbor saying stating that that memories burned my mind the garage door
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was open all night so what I think we can gather from that is that it's very likely that the Bennetts
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accidentally left their garage door open most people don't lock the man door that
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goes from your whatever room into your garage that's sexism and it's it's likely that the Killer
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walked in through the garage through that unlocked door and started walking into the home caused some noise he woke
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up the family and Bruce comes down the steps and they they fight now the reason why I read that other thing about
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Constance saying that she called 9-1-1 but couldn't remember the the address remember they had only moved into that
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home about three months before they were attacked and killed so it's you know not
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unheard of that the mother wouldn't remember the address they had only lived there a short time but the reason why I
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read that bit was one thing that I had always wondered about this case Captain was if this fight would have taken some
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time between Bruce and the attacker and the Intruder I had always wondered why Deborah his wife hadn't called 9-1-1 and
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and I had always speculated that possibly the killer before entering the home had cut the phone line outside we
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now know that that wasn't the case he never cut the phone line because that's the same phone line that Constance later
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used to call 9-1-1 to report her son and his family having been attacked right okay so how did the killer gain
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entry into these different homes I think here we can't say with definitive proof
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that he entered through the garage door but then I started looking at the Patricia Smith
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case remember she lived in a town home and I guess when I pictured this in my mind I
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was picturing you know like a condo but what I started doing was I got on Google
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and I googled her address and I couldn't find that creepy it would only show me like the bank of town homes
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let's say um you you have the Main Street there and then you would turn in and you have
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multiple town homes they all share the same numbered address but they are distinct by a letter
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so I couldn't confirm which one was actually hers the home that she was killed in what I could confirm was
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looking at that bank of town homes they all had garages I just assumed her home never had a garage because her daughter
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describes pulling up and seeing her mother's car outside parked outside right that doesn't mean that she didn't
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park her car outside open the garage door and then go in through the door leaving that that door unlocked right
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and again she could have heard her attacker come into the home she goes downstairs to
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investigate or she's still upstairs by the time he gets upstairs to attack her [Music]
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[Applause] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music] all right cheers mates cheers a little more information here Captain
00:26:52
before we get back to our questions that we want to answer for this the Aurora Cold Case Squad there is a detective
00:26:59
there Steve Connor uh he asked the parabon Nano Labs company this is a company based in Virginia to use its
00:27:08
newly developed technology to create an image of the perpetrator based on DNA predictions to determine the suspect's
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ancestry eye color hair color freckling and face shape now remember some of you will remember we've discussed this on
00:27:25
cases before this is newer technology and they had DNA from two of the crime scenes this is that snapshot DNA Imaging
00:27:33
and we we've discussed this on several other cases one that comes to mind is the April Tinsley case
00:27:40
there are some things to discuss here Captain the images generated as requested by the detective show the what
00:27:48
the perpetrator may look like key word here we need to use is may look like but it shows what the perpetrator may have
00:27:56
looked like at the ages of 25 and 55 years old now keep in mind we don't obviously we
00:28:04
don't know the age of the offender these are just two ages picked by the detective at his request yeah there's a
00:28:13
part of me that likes that they do this but the more information I find about this because
00:28:19
basically what it's doing is it's coming up with a composite sketch based on the
00:28:25
DNA but this DNA doesn't tell you certain it only tells you it's so vague so it's
00:28:35
almost to me where it's like do the DNA test do a description but I don't necessarily
00:28:42
think they should do an actual drawing well you're right there Captain I I actually think they should do the
00:28:49
drawing but the reason why I say that you're right is that as much as this could help your investigation locating
00:28:55
this perpetrator it could hurt you in a sense that there's a chance that the actual offender today may not
00:29:03
resemble either of these pictures given and and meaning it could hurt you in the
00:29:08
fact that where you and I on the street might look at a guy and say you know what I know he lived in the Aurora area
00:29:15
back in 84 and he suddenly moved uh and and he's been here for 30 years but he doesn't look anything like the guy well
00:29:23
why would he not look anything like the guys because you you have some pretty generalities here of based off of what
00:29:30
the person would look like let's say the the older image showing him at age 55. well this is showing this to me it only
00:29:37
shows the face you know from the neck up and this appears to be somebody that would be of average weight well one
00:29:45
thing that would would change his General facial appearance simply would be if he was thinner than this or more
00:29:53
heavy set than this yeah also you can't factor in how hard of a life has this person lived is this somebody that's
00:29:59
been drinking constantly for the past 30 Years and may may have wrinkles and and
00:30:04
not look anything like this or or a smoker or somebody that's tan or or what if he was using his apartment for a
00:30:12
place for smokers to go to yes we've seen the effects that they've seen on Cosmo Kramer hideous Jerry hideous look
00:30:22
away so the the uh Cold Case detective he states that one thing he wants us to focus on is not so much the image that
00:30:32
has been created but that we should focus more on the physical description that is given
00:30:39
because of this information and stating that we are you know we're looking at a Caucasian person this is
00:30:45
somebody that would be leave to have the ancestry of Northern and or Central European ancestry they have fair to very
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fair skin color eye color would be green or blue eyes hair color would be brown or blonde hair and would have a few
00:31:05
would have few to some freckles so obviously we can't figure out how tall the person is how much they may
00:31:13
weigh what kind of lifestyle choices that they've made since then that could change their appearance in some
00:31:19
different ways talking about Colorado and talking about this uh snapshot DNA I did see one where the where Colorado
00:31:28
used this technology to create an image of somebody and this was a um a person that I believe he was guilty of
00:31:38
a couple of rapes and had moved away and somebody saw the image of this person and sure enough made the right phone
00:31:46
call and this guy was picked up and they were able to determine that it was in fact him
00:31:51
the the funny thing here well not the funny thing but the thing here Captain is the guy he did look almost exactly
00:31:57
like the image maybe I should take back my no I don't think so I think I think it's right to
00:32:04
have a little bit of concern I we've seen it we've seen it used in several cases I've only seen one case where it's
00:32:10
actually led to the apprehension of the actual individual and this is why I said that I
00:32:17
think they had some evidence that this murderer was Caucasian because you know one of the things that Steve Connor said
00:32:27
was this gave us proof that they were Caucasian oh that they had some thought that this was a Caucasian male and then
00:32:36
this DNA evidence proved right that thought and I I kind of wondered maybe it could have just been a speculation
00:32:42
obviously but he he said that now we have definitive evidence and so again that makes me feel like he they knew
00:32:51
something before him where it makes you wonder it had somebody seen something was there some kind of eyewitness that
00:32:58
saw somebody fleeing the scene or did somebody see possibly maybe another motorist happen to see somebody driving
00:33:06
or tailing Donna Dixon in a car behind her and it was all I can tell you was it was a white guy or one of the people
00:33:13
that survived you know later said hey I believe it was a white guy the this thing thing here is we can only we
00:33:24
can only speculate as far as what the survivors go so we according to the information we have that was
00:33:32
reported in the papers and the media the three-year-old that survived she has no
00:33:37
recollection of the attack now is that simply that police said you know what we're going to state that in the media
00:33:43
so that this this guy doesn't come out of the woodwork and come looking for the Lone Survivor of the Bennett family
00:33:50
attack right uh you know she's a minor we also have Donna Dixon could be the same thing they could be protecting her
00:33:57
I have heard one of the detectives say in an interview that Donna Dixon has no recollection of the attack as far as
00:34:05
Donna Dixon knows she got out of her car and next thing she knows she woke up a week later in a hospital bed and and has
00:34:12
no clue what happened you bring up an interesting thing here though because we said earlier that there was some
00:34:18
loosey-goosey information out there that possibly Kimberly hobbin's child had stated that the attacker that attacked
00:34:25
her and her husband James in their bedroom that night in January 84 was a large African-American man and with this
00:34:34
DNA evidence what that would point out to us is is one of two things either either a uh this is not connected these
00:34:44
three other attacks are not connected to the first attack right or B for whatever reason she thinks that she
00:34:51
saw a black man and it wasn't possible it was actually this guy and it's all four of them are connected one after
00:34:57
what the hundred and seventy some episodes yeah with you uh I'm starting to learn a couple things
00:35:05
about what fascinates you about cases and you're a sucker for letters yeah well uh yes I am if I'm I'm a
00:35:15
sucker for with letters When a Killer would communicate with the media or the police uh whether it be letters or
00:35:25
through phone calls um and you you're kind of in a roundabout way getting to what I know
00:35:31
you know uh we need to get to at this point is the bloody letters that were left at the Bennett crime scene yeah and
00:35:40
could this be when we say letters though we mean could this be the name of the killer that was left on the body of one
00:35:47
of the victims this wasn't released to the public until 2015. the way that this works is this so
00:35:54
when the when the killer lifted Melissa's body this is the seven the seven-year-old
00:35:59
when he lifted Melissa's bloody body from her bed there were letters embroidered on this person's shirt that
00:36:08
transferred that were transferred in blood to the little girl's pajamas so investigators have always believed that
00:36:18
the letters could identify the killer's name or possibly the business where he worked or had worked at one time
00:36:26
this was something regarding the release of this information this was something that police and detectives they debated
00:36:34
for many many years on whether or not they should release this information to the public yeah because okay so the the
00:36:42
arguments for both sides would be one the Killer is probably very likely unaware that he left this evidence at
00:36:50
the crime scene and this could be deadly information when you find this person and you have him in the interrogation
00:36:58
room is he once you finally present this information to him how's he going to be able to explain it
00:37:05
away right so that could help to make an arrest then on the other you have where
00:37:11
if he knows about this information going into the questioning he may come up with
00:37:15
a plausible excuse or just be set off ready to deny it emphatically from the get-go right
00:37:22
because he knows the informations out there so regarding this this was something that the police actually
00:37:26
worked on right but the other side of the coin was that if you don't release it that you have such a Time Gap that
00:37:35
you know if you worked for a business that is now closed or closed way back in let's say 85. then like if you would
00:37:43
have released this information n85 or 84 that more people would be aware of this
00:37:50
business right and you had 30 years that have gone by by the time they finally do
00:37:55
release the information this information may be no good to to maybe it was only good to somebody that's not around
00:38:01
anymore right uh that could have provided you the proper tip the police they did work this information for quite
00:38:08
some time before releasing it to the public they actually sent it to two different labs to try to decipher what
00:38:16
the letters were or what they actually said uh they sent it to a Canadian lab who came up with the letters
00:38:25
[Music] p-e-t-a-w Dash c as in cat so p-e-t-a-w-c now the strange thing here though
00:38:37
Captain is they sent it to like we said two Labs the other was an Arizona lab which came up with something completely
00:38:43
different they came up with r-i-c-h-a-r so the second a c a i c h a r could be like the name Richard or Richards or
00:38:56
Richardson so why why would they come up with two completely different things well okay
00:39:03
you gotta you gotta keep in mind a couple of factors here first of all the obvious that would be something you and
00:39:09
I and other garage listeners could probably figure out is depending on how the killer picked up this girl how he
00:39:18
was holding her when the when they transferred the letters transferred in blood could mean several things either
00:39:25
the letters would be upside down they would be backwards simple things like that that you and I and others could
00:39:31
fairly you know easily figure out right the other issue though too is think about how this is not like you're taking
00:39:38
a like you're taking a stamp you know as something you dip in ink and then and then stamping it onto a piece of paper
00:39:46
and it dries immediately and it stays there no this is something that blood-soaked clothing the victim is
00:39:53
wearing potentially blood-soaked clothing that the Killer is wearing as well there could have been and there's
00:39:59
hours before the bodies are discovered so you're talking about swelling of these letters uh you're also talking
00:40:06
about Distortion of these letters and from the reports that I have been able to find that talk about the details of
00:40:16
this actual layout of these letters would describe that the way that her pajamas were at
00:40:24
the time that they believed that those letters transferred to her clothing was that there would have been folds on
00:40:32
those pajamas or right not and not only just folds but you're going to have also
00:40:37
a situation where he might have picked up the victim pressed his body against her
00:40:42
released her a little bit pressed his body against her again see what I'm saying or moved so removed her you know
00:40:48
friction right so the so the first time you if you press your body against and then when you release if then her
00:40:57
pajamas fold in a different manner this is why there could be such confusion right right so again those the two that
00:41:04
the labs came up with one is p-e-t-a-w-c and the other is r-i-c-h-a-r um very interesting stuff here I it
00:41:16
doesn't really lead me to anything but but then again I'm also not aware of companies back then
00:41:24
um you know companies in the area back then in 83 84. I do like the the chance of a possible name of Richard or
00:41:32
Richards or Richardson um something to that effect but back to our questions Captain you know we talked
00:41:40
about the DNA we connecting some of these cases we've talked about the how would the killer gain entry to the homes
00:41:48
with no signs of forced entry personal belief of mine is that the killer came in through the garage door I know that
00:41:54
when you and I you know you and I are roughly the same age and I know in my neighborhood growing up when I was a kid
00:42:02
oftentimes you could tell if your friend and his family were home during the daytime by simply looking out your door
00:42:09
or going down the street on your bike and seeing if their garage door was open yeah and you know when I was growing up
00:42:16
that and I grew up in the late 80s early 90s well you know uh I mean late 60s and so I I wouldn't be surprised if it
00:42:28
was a similar situation in this neighborhood in Colorado in these neighborhoods in Colorado
00:42:34
um and you could simply have a situation where the Bennett's having a busy house
00:42:39
full of people for the birthday party forgot or failed to close the garage door for whatever reason before going to
00:42:46
bed right well it's a good possibility that oh we're having this little birthday party for our daughter and
00:42:54
we're having some friends and family over and we're drinking a little bit you know and then it you get your kids to
00:43:00
bed and and maybe the the husband um you know passed out on the couch or whatever
00:43:05
you know personally I believe and it's just my speculation but I believe that would be the case with the hobbins child
00:43:11
case as well where the killer slipped in through the garage into the locked door
00:43:16
and then crept up into their bedroom in the middle of the night yeah now the next question we have to address Captain
00:43:21
would be did the killer know his victims and if not why did he choose these particular people or houses and I guess
00:43:29
you can throw in with that question what is his motive yeah I think you could um
00:43:35
for me anyway I mean my answer is is pretty much this I don't think that this guy knew his victims at all
00:43:43
I think that these were probably crimes of opportunity I think this guy was hell-bent on rape and murder so when
00:43:54
we talk about motive let's first jump to motive I think this guy was was hell-bent on
00:44:00
rape and murder I truly I think that's what I see here right I don't think he snuck into the Bennett home for any
00:44:06
other reason he wasn't there to steal anything he was there to attack whoever was in that home I don't think he knew
00:44:13
who was there right and you're saying there's a crime of opportunity because if their garage door was open yeah it
00:44:20
could be as simple as this guy's trolling neighborhoods oh that garage door's open yeah he goes out at two
00:44:27
three in the morning under the cover of of Darkness finds a home that happened to leave their garage
00:44:33
door open and here's the thing I would you know maybe you know that theory could be proved wrong whether these
00:44:40
garage doors were left open or not I think there's evidence to point that they were in fact open therefore to me
00:44:47
for it for for a victim that he wanted to Target to happen to leave their garage door open the probability of that
00:44:53
is crazy you can't even start to think about those numbers so this to me is a crime of opportunity how does this carry
00:45:00
over to Patricia Smith and to Donna Dixon I think he saw those two driving we know they were both returning to
00:45:08
their home shortly before both attacks occurred yeah so he'd be out trolling you know for maybe possible situations
00:45:16
later in the day and he just sees these females yeah and I mean they're they're attractive ladies that are driving
00:45:21
they're returning to their home both brunettes I don't know if he had a type or not it's tough to say that he had a
00:45:27
type when we're when I'm also saying that he he just picked houses because they happened to leave garage doors open
00:45:35
um well but with two of the victims he saw them driving yeah and I I think that that it's just that simple I think this
00:45:43
guy I mean you're talking about if it was in fact the same guy we know three of the attacks were but let's lump in
00:45:50
the fourth one well right but what I'm arguing is that you could kind of say that maybe he does have a type because
00:45:54
he saw these two you know these two females driving and he didn't I mean he probably saw multiple females driving oh
00:46:01
I guess we chose these two he chose to follow those two yeah and they they look similar I mean one's a little older but
00:46:08
you know they do look similar and the reason why I pick the motive is and I know it seems like I'm kind of not
00:46:14
giving a great answer here for motive but I don't think it's crazy to suggest that this guy was just hell-bent on
00:46:20
murder and rape you're talking about four attacks in the course of 13 days that is somebody that is has already
00:46:29
spiraled out of control this is somebody that is is attacking at a frequency that is unheard of well and
00:46:37
this kind of answers the next question you know why were some attacks you know during the day and some at night and
00:46:44
really like you were saying it could just be opportunity yeah we can't really whenever the opportunity arises for him
00:46:52
where whenever he doesn't have to be accountable for his time or whereabouts right and he sees a potential victim
00:47:00
whether it be women that he's followed in cars or homes that appear easy to get into he strikes and that makes him an
00:47:09
extremely dangerous and scary individual individual we're talking about nice communities too and whether it be a nice
00:47:16
Community poor Community bad Community whatever these are these are vicious horrible crimes yeah
00:47:24
so then I guess the final question is then why did they stop I mean obviously this person is a monster a monster like
00:47:33
this just doesn't just stop because they they seemingly have stopped and when we
00:47:38
say that you know the thing here is they they have stopped in that area and we can say that for certain the other
00:47:46
thing is they have his DNA and they have his DNA on file if somebody crept into somebody's home in the middle of night
00:47:51
and murdered a family and left his DNA there whether it be 15 20 years later right on the other side of the country
00:48:00
we're going to know that this killer didn't stop but they might have escalated you have a
00:48:07
lot of factors to throw in there I think well I think the first Factor you throw
00:48:11
in is that the last quote-unquote Hammer Slayer attack that you know again Bruce put up one
00:48:21
hell of a fight and maybe he'd maybe this murderer said you know what that's too risky I can't take that chance
00:48:29
anymore this this Hammer thing doesn't make any sense anymore because if I if I'm faced
00:48:36
with somebody like Bruce again I might not come out Victor right and so they could change
00:48:42
um you know the way in which they uh the weapon they use in the in the murders they could change the weapon that they
00:48:52
use or stop altogether uh the the the Intruder Also may have occurred in injury during that because you and
00:49:01
you're right to point out the Bennett and I don't think that I don't think that that's
00:49:05
um I think that there's plenty of proof there that there's good reason why that potentially may have been the last
00:49:12
attack or certainly the last known attack because the major thing that's different between that attack and the
00:49:19
previous three attacks is he actually has to fight with somebody yeah we got we got to put in some other factors here
00:49:25
so it's 1984 right it's we don't know much about DNA at the time yeah they collected it at two of the crime scenes
00:49:33
he may have left it most likely left it as a result of the rapes that occurred at those two crime scenes
00:49:40
the thing here is though that I keep kind of going back to is this guy whoever was doing this these are
00:49:48
extremely risky crimes that this guy is committing these are extremely risky attacks and murders
00:49:55
that he's committing we have two where he enters a home in the middle of the night and presumably doesn't know what's
00:50:03
on this other side of that door yeah he doesn't know how many people are in the home doesn't know if there's dogs in the
00:50:09
home to our knowledge I would consider that extremely risky event the other thing is the other two
00:50:16
crimes happened during the daytime one where one where he attacks a woman in her garage yeah she may have arrived
00:50:26
at home by herself but you don't know if there's somebody inside that home right
00:50:30
same with Patricia Smith who came home she happened to come home by herself and there happened to be nobody inside the
00:50:37
home I think what what may have occurred here and this is pure speculation on my
00:50:42
part but I think that Bruce God bless him I think he injured this guy in some manner during the the fight that took
00:50:51
place in the Bennett household yeah I think this guy might have been injured and chose to move elsewhere or attack
00:50:58
elsewhere because of this injury I think that the the injury could have been a giveaway
00:51:06
I think this guy was actually either apprehended or killed at another CR at another
00:51:11
attempted murder scene yeah because chances are he's breaking into places so he could have broke into a place had the
00:51:20
cops called he went to jail for burglary or breaking and entering they didn't know he was a murderer but also during
00:51:27
this time period they didn't collect DNA so if you're arrested now they're going
00:51:31
to collect DNA put you on file but this is before this mandate so he would have to have been arrested before that
00:51:38
mandate now did he get out and just kind of stop who knows I would say that somebody like
00:51:44
this this kind of monster is probably not going to stop the other question here too is
00:51:51
you know it seems like his motivation was you know sexual in nature so was there an opportunity
00:52:03
the garage doors open he goes in struggles has this fight and then there's kids involved and is
00:52:11
that just enough for this monster to come back after the attack know that his time is running out
00:52:20
and maybe with these kids involved decides to take his own life that's a possibility yeah as well yeah I think
00:52:28
you're right I think suicide maybe like I said I believe it's a person that's already spiraled out of control before
00:52:34
some of these attacks occurred right yeah suicide could be very likely um again I think that if he didn't kill
00:52:42
himself that you're looking at a situation where the frequency of these attacks I wouldn't expect him to stop I
00:52:49
would expect him to continue to attack and probably fairly soon maybe because well maybe because of the injury that I
00:52:58
believe may have occurred at the Bennett house that he took some time off let's say to recover I think that for somebody
00:53:05
a little psychological thing here that I would throw in is somebody willing to enter a home in that does not know
00:53:12
what's going on in that home or who is in that home or what weapons that the members of that family may have
00:53:18
this might be somebody that's very confident in their physical ability and when they sustain an injury they may
00:53:27
be limited in the sense where they for a temper temporarily are not confident in
00:53:32
their physical ability they take a take some time off and then attempt another one of these high risk Crimes by
00:53:40
entering someone's home or attacking someone in broad daylight in another location and the police didn't just they
00:53:46
just didn't connect the the two and maybe he went off and spent some time in prison and maybe it was a lengthy prison
00:53:53
sentence by the time he gets out he's no longer confident in his physical ability
00:53:58
because he's older or maybe some injuries occurred while in prison or maybe he passed away during that prison
00:54:05
sentence yeah all kinds of factors here I think the only thing that we have to go off of is a couple things one the
00:54:14
letters the bloody letters so I would say anybody that's listening to this case that is from that area
00:54:21
from Lakewood or Aurora or Denver maybe this guy worked in Denver and traveled to attack
00:54:28
but think about this you know round 84 to the family member of yours commit suicide to family member of yours
00:54:38
go away for a time period maybe passed away in jail or maybe one was sick and passed away
00:54:47
but maybe this family member or a friend of a friend was a little kind of shady do these letters do you want to go over
00:54:56
those letters again real quick yeah do they mean anything to anybody out there listening and the fir the first guess
00:55:02
was p-e-t-a-w-c and the next set of letters was r i c h a r and anyone with information should
00:55:12
contact the Aurora police detectives at 303-739-6106 or the Lakewood Police Cold
00:55:22
Case hotline at 303-987-7474 foreign [Music] [Applause] we want to thank everybody for listening
00:55:39
thanks for filling up the fridge thanks for all those little donations you know it helps keep the heat on in the garage
00:55:46
and it's freaking cold my friends so everybody you stay warm out there until next time be good be kind and don't
00:55:53
litter [Music] thank you