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[Music] [Applause] [Music] welcome to true crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
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for listening I'm your host Nick and with me of course as always from behind the glass is the man steering the ship
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he is the captain and together we would like to point out that only a total psychotic would listen to this show at
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two times the speed welcome to the show cap think you think you think you it's good to be seen it's
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good to see you thanks for listening and thanks for telling a friend this week we
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are drinking anheuser-busch's Budweiser an American lager and an American classic the one-time king of beers
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garage grade three bottle caps out of five and this week our fridge is full thank you to all of you out there but
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specifically first up thanks to Laura P in Washington and a big shout to Emily and Osage Minnesota next up we have
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Brian in Highlands Ranch Colorado and in Birmingham Alabama we have Andrea she is me and next up we
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have our friend Randy in Federal Way Washington and last but certainly not least we have a long-distance Sears way
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out to Lauren in Port Talbot Wales thank you to everybody for helping us out with
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this week's show if you want to contribute to future shows go to true crime garage comm and click on the
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called off the record so get hip to that it's hip to be square and that's enough
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of the business all right captain everybody gather round grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime
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[Music] all right we're back with part three of brandon swanson it's like we never left
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yeah some people cover this case in ten minutes we covered in ten hours ten episodes so going through these
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theories here captain we talked about how thinking sideways said it's impossible for alien abduction you said
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no time warp no sasquatch there are people and i find this a little strange but it is
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something that you do have to consider anytime you have a missing persons case is that the individual chooses to be
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missing that they decide to walk away from their life yeah we both agree in this case the fact that brandon seemed
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to be lost at some point so he's calling for help from friends they don't answer
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so then he calls and gets ahold of his parents and he's asking for help basically right and we agree that he
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didn't walk away from his life based off of his actions leading up to his last known whereabouts right and there's also
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it would make zero sense to call mom and dad yeah and decide to walk away that same
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night yeah and on top of that there is no nothing of his past or anything that his family is pointing to that this is a
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possibility mm-hmm one of the more plausible theories and this kind of branches into a couple different options
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here is that Brandon perished in some type of accident somewhere out there in that night this theory seems to be again
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one of the more likely ones although it's the problem here in this case will continue to be that they've not ever
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found Brandon they've never found any evidence of him clothing a jacket shoes anything of his glasses his phone
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anything like that but let's get into this theory let's break it down right Brandon was
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disoriented and confused about where he was that is not a question he was 20 miles from where he thought he was we
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know he got his car stuck in a ditch we know he was frustrated based off of what
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his parents were saying he decided to abandon the vehicle he starts started he took what he referred to as a more
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direct route across fields farmland off-road areas terrain he was not familiar with well not initially he was
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staying on the road initially and then he went off paths correct he's walking along fences and he states
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to his father he can hear running water meanwhile what else do we know he it's very dark that night
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Brandon is blind in one eye his father heard him exclaim oh [ __ ] and then the phone on Brandon's side goes dead so
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what happened here well let's be clear it doesn't go dead from our knowledge there's a disconnection the call drops
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what I'm sorry about that and and it's just words but you're right we need to clear that up because there is a hot
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debate about if his phone went dead or if it was still active yes after he says oh [ __ ] the call ends on Brandon's end
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from here a lot of people say Brandon could have fallen or could have walked into something this would be the river a
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well a sinkhole or some other type of obstacle let's go through this because I think we can very quickly eliminate some
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of these possibilities and this is based off of information that has come out and
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it's pretty wild you know readily available the sinkhole theories have basically been debunked by Jeff
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Hasse remember he's the search Manager that we spoke about who them methodically and meticulously was
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searching for Brandon all these years he stated that the radius where he calculated that Brandon could have
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possibly walked from his car and this is even after the call went dead according to the blog that he maintained
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that we referenced yesterday the site's details in the search is conducted for Brandon provided you know making these
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public he states that sinkholes form and karst or cave gyah now he also says that the only
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cardiology in Minnesota is in the southeastern part of the state the area where Brandon went missing is in the
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southwestern part of Minnesota basically he's saying he couldn't have fallen into
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a sinkhole because they're not there right the other thing he points out too regarding like Wells open Wells and
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things of that nature on farmland he points out that the farmland in this area of the country is extremely
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valuable and they all old wells have been capped off or replaced per Minnesota law so the days of large wells
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with buckets that people could fall into he saying are long gone right there could be capped off and also in this
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area these farmers and these people who live in the area would hear about this kid going missing and they probably
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checked their property for any signs of Brandon yes he's stating that all the water sources
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on these industrial farms were quote unquote high-tech by 2008 now old cisterns could exist but again if they
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do the searchers have never found one mm-hmm that could leave us with the river so we
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have a local woman who participated in the searches for Brandon she posted that the terrain out there is riddled with
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swamps bogs caves six foot tall grasslands wooded areas and ponds cattails along the riverbanks are eight
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feet tall at this time of year Brandon could have walked or fallen into you know the river or the swamps or the bogs
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at any point along this way his father says after Brandon says oh [ __ ] that he
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heard some type of what he describes as a slipping sound and we know that the scent dogs tracked Brandon to the actual
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River and then seemed to indicate that he got back out of the river so that this is goes into what you were talking
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about earlier captain where you have to wonder is it possible to brand and fall into the yellow
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medicine river and did something happen to his phone that he that he even maybe he didn't drown in the river or maybe he
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did maybe he hit his head and drowned in the river but you also have this theory
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that maybe he slipped into the river he gets out but his phone does not then the
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question is what his phone continued to ring for a few days even after submerged Jeff Hasse says yes
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this is a possibility that the the sound that the caller hears has nothing to do
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with the condition of the actual phone so this makes this a very possible thing here right yeah and sometimes wasn't you
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trying to call somebody if you don't have great service your phone will ring multiple times before it actually tries
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to connect to them right right so the idea being here that maybe something happened to the phone here's here's the
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the thing that you really got to consider right if he did fall into the river even if he got out he very likely
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could be soaking wet then we he's staggering along the road until he decides to stop and rest somewhere maybe
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this is a whole field or in the woods or an abandoned barn he could have died of
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hypothermia temperatures dropped to 39 degrees that night we both agreed that he was wearing fairly warmth clothing
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for that evening the river was only 55 degrees could Brandon have succumb to the cold especially if he was wet his
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body having not been found yet could be because it was either too obscured or has been scattered by animals plowed
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under and broken up by heavy farm equipment we have to remember that searchers were not able to access all of
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the farmland in the area some of which were covered thickly with high tight crops there's some interesting things
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that Jeff has States in his information that he's made public when he's talking about you know
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we reference how many dogs they used in the search for Brandon over the years the problem is at certain times of the
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years the the crops are at different heights and he says that the height of crops can make it extremely difficult if
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not impossible for a dog to find the scent right and it's it's hard to search in general when you have obstacles like
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that you see that in a case like the Long Island serial killer case jeff has he also states that this region
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receives nearly constant winds which can come from any direction these winds move sent from the source
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and deposited into what he refers to as scent pools this can throw off the cadaver dogs meaning there they won't be
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able to settle on an exact location of the remains the other possibility to that he points out is that the remains
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may have been scattered over a wide area and this could be by predators you know
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such as animals or that they were moved by human activities such as farmers tilling their fields or baling hay or
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corn stalks something like that mm-hmm then again we also have these access issues they've not been able to search
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everywhere that they would like to search they have been very careful to protect landowners property over the
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years generally avoiding searching fields with crops in them even though he states there's a very likely chance that
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Brandon ended up in a field right he states that this yeah this only leaves spring and fall available for them to
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search and then we have the difficulty of how much land there is to search remember he pointed out that you're
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prioritizing 98.5 square miles yeah he says Oh Lance yeah he says to effectively search a single 160 acre
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field a team a whole team of people must walk in excess of 10 miles in what he says is difficult footing along these
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same lines here captain he points out that not all the private land own along these
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same lines here captain Jeff points out that not all of these private land owners have agreed to searches because
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let's say Brandon attempted to seek shelter from the wind or from the cold right at some point along his journey
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maybe he crawls into an outbuilding or under some old machinery and then passes there he says that they've not searched
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all of the farmsteads in fact they've only searched very few of the farmsteads in the area
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well you said there was a radius that they had to search and there's a what was the percentage like they've only
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been able to search about sixty percent sixty percent of the area that they've prioritized yes well and to go back to
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the cadaver dogs to if you have like a small pond of water but it has a drains into something that the cadaver dogs
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normally do not hit inside the pond like the body could be in the middle of the pond the cadaver dogs normally hit where
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the water is training because that's where the scent is more dominant he also points out the conditions in Minnesota
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at that time of year and by his all of his knowledge and all of his experience it's his opinion that a body could
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become fully skeletonized within a week so that's very quick out there even calculating that Brandon's body was
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likely fully disarticulated by mid July of 2008 and he says this would be very likely at the latest and one of the
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things that makes this case so much more fascinating and like you've been talking
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about is the documentation of the search that really changes everything with as far as like the Brandon Lawson case or
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like even like Mara Murray like we don't have as detailed records of the searches
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that happen and in those cases right and so what is fascinating here and really educating at the same time is all the
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information about the search throughout the years detailed information where we have a complete
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understanding of look so many so many shows in so many news articles in so many website forums and message boards
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they keep coming back to the idea that something weird had to have happened because they've not found Brandon right
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the problem here is we have the the search manager the guy in charge in his team that is very publicly stating we
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had this huge area to search we went over the difficulties of the search or what could have happened throughout the
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the years wherever Brandon may be that adds to the difficulty level of the search and yet we have them saying
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there's still almost 40% of the prioritized area that we have not been able to get to you know which is sad
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because this is somebody's child this is people's friends the you know and I understand why some of the places
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haven't been searched but it's kind of sad yes I mean there's there's a multitude of reasons why certain areas
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have not been searched and some of it is just happenstance some of it is just the
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lay of the land itself what do we think happened here captain we we could spin our tires all day long on the
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possibilities and the searches and what has taken place over the course of 11 years or almost you know 11 years now
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what do we think happened well well let's take a quick beer break so we can gather our thoughts and gather some
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getting more out of every trip to come [Music] all right got that king of beer sing of
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beer king's king of beers sorry what did I say I don't know I'm looking at my notes and trying to talk at the same
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time I'm doing the same thing I'm moving some things around would you like to go
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first my friend yeah I can I think to me it's where does the evidence take us I think one with this search we will find
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you know with a banded car we're gonna find him within this area I think we're the the initial scent dogs hit into the
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river that's the yellow medicine river correct where they hit there I then came out of the river I think they should
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have just probably stayed in the river that's what my what my gut is telling me is the old [ __ ] again when he was
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talking to his father he's saying I'm along this fence line I can hear water and then boom all [ __ ] we have no signs
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of foul play but that does not mean that further down the line you know if there's send dogs
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just stop that further down the line there wouldn't be maybe something but we haven't had no reports of that so I
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think where the car was with possibly being tired I think with possibly being you know let's say buzzed I think
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there's some evidence that he had a few drinks he was frustrated he was tired he
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was walking he was trying to get help he was definitely lost or not in the area that he thought he was I think that
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area is very easy to be confused and I think you're gonna dive into that more but I think like I said the dogs take us
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to that area I think his conversation with his father on the phone points to being in that
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area and to be around that to that River mm-hmm we have not found his body now I
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think that is a leap like you said maybe 60% of this area has been searched for t
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he hasn't so could you find his body somewhere else yes and I understand that they also searched this river I think
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it'd be a lot harder to find his body in water in general so I I just think that
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kind of leads to it and I know like I said I know that's a leap to say well well you haven't found his body on land
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so therefore it puts him into water but I think there's other like I said those other pieces of evidence kind of points
00:25:09
us in the direction that there could have been an accident that happened along that that water line mm-hmm mm-hmm
00:25:16
I want to address a few different things that I think are confusing this whole situation from all of the armchair
00:25:26
detectives all the people on the outside looking in I think first I want to address the issue of I'm not totally
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discrediting or discounting the possibility of foul play but what I do want to discredit is the
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thought that because his name is on ViCAP means that he met with foul play and people keep going back to that well
00:25:49
law enforcement must know something that we don't know because they put him on ViCAP that is a possibility then they
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know something that we don't it's definitely a possibility but looking into that specific situation what I
00:26:05
gathered from the database is that ViCAP was alerted of Brandon Swanson's situation on March 5th of 2010 and then
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it was released to the public as being part of the ViCAP database on April 7th of 2010 now remember what we reported
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earlier that back in March of 2010 the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension became the lead
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investigating agency on the case new eyes look a cold case what I'm getting to here
00:26:38
captain is it's my thought that the reason that Brandon is on ViCAP is not because there is evidence of foul play
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or that he was met with violence it's simply because a new agency took over his case and decided to ask it to be
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applied to ViCAP as something that it can't hurt to put him on the database right the only thing that could hurt is
00:27:04
the rumor mill mm-hmm and then I also want to address the issue of him being disoriented or you know why he got lost
00:27:15
that whole situation first of all I question one how well he would have known any of these areas outside of
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route 68 and route 23 I seriously questioned that first of all how experienced of a driver is he he's
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only 19 years old and we have some stories that may indicate that he might have even lost his license at one point
00:27:40
and then people point out that well he traveled this route for a full school year to and from Marshall and Camby
00:27:51
where his school was I take I take a little issue with that too because this the typical school year at this school
00:27:58
is late August to mid-may it's not really a full year one and they take about a month-long break in the middle
00:28:06
of the winter so it's not a full year first of all and then second of all why would he know the area's off of Route 68
00:28:15
Grau 68 takes them to and from school so I really questioned how well he knew this area then on top of that we have
00:28:24
some confusion confusing things going on regarding the lay of the land so anybody
00:28:30
that has seen this area on a map will know that the streets and the roads the country roads out there are laid out
00:28:38
basically like a square grid yeah I believe there's a simple version of this map on Wikipedia
00:28:46
yeah I would I would encourage anybody to look up that simple version of the map and then use your own map app to
00:28:54
really zoom in on some areas and go through that trail that we discussed in detail regarding the dog's movements
00:29:03
when they were following or believed to be following Brandon's movements now what you will see here is regarding this
00:29:13
map okay so picture a square if you're not looking at it picture square route 68 runs diagonally from the northwest
00:29:22
corner of that Square to the southeast corner of that square above route 68 and below route 68 you have country roads
00:29:32
that are laid out in a grid now north of 68 we have street names and Avenue names
00:29:40
such as they're all kind of numbers there are some that are named but the overwhelming majority of them are just
00:29:47
numbers meaning like three hundred and sixtieth Street two hundred and eightieth Avenue one hundred in tenth
00:29:56
Street one hundred and fiftieth Avenue so on and so forth you get what I'm talking about now north of route 68 all
00:30:05
of the numbered roads if they're going east to west they are an avenue if they're going north to south or south to
00:30:16
north they are streets if you get south of 68 it flip-flops where all of the numbered
00:30:26
country roads going north to south are avenues and east to west are streets what I'm getting at here is you would
00:30:35
only have to take one wrong turn to end up going the wrong way if you let's say you are somewhat familiar with the area
00:30:45
and you are aware that oh avenues run east-west streets run north to south even though I'm lost I'm going to use
00:30:53
that information to guide me back to where I think I need to get to well if you make one wrong turn
00:30:59
basically take that whole square map that I just described and turn it on its side because now the streets are going
00:31:06
east to west and avenues are going north to south it's a very tricky area so I completely understand why somebody
00:31:14
anyone regardless of their situation how much they've had to drink how little they've had to drink what they've
00:31:21
ingested or not would get turned around and Confused in this situation and again
00:31:27
as we pointed out there are indicators to him that he is right in his statement where he sees I got a go across a major
00:31:34
road there is a river that runs into that town I must be where I think I write in the simple fact of the matter
00:31:40
is the people that say well he knew this area well he didn't because where he told his family he was he was not hmm
00:31:49
and that's all the proof that you need that he didn't know where he was that maybe he does know that area well but
00:31:56
that night um no he didn't know where he was at the other thing too that I think
00:32:02
gets in the way of really sorting through all of this is the oh [ __ ] moment right so this case
00:32:11
oddly enough made me think back to my childhood okay I'm a child of the 90s and what I'm talking about here captain
00:32:20
is the song the things that make you go hmm bye C&C Music Factory this was a 1990 release things that make you go
00:32:29
what hmm don't bother looking up the song it's as bad as you expect it to be mm-hmm okay
00:32:36
now look this case of course this is a tragic case here of this young man but it's truly a big question mark and why
00:32:45
so many people are fascinated by this case is that it's a big question mark now if you look at the lyrics for that
00:32:52
song the things that make you go hmm the lyrics in that song is listing out very
00:32:58
simply the things that make you go hmm now there are a lot of questions in this case but what I was really looking at
00:33:05
regarding the phone call he says oh [ __ ] and then the phone call ends I was really thinking to myself
00:33:13
what are the things that would make me go oh [ __ ] right and so we're going to put
00:33:19
ourselves in Brandon's shoes here so to speak now that could have been any number of
00:33:24
things it could have been some type of accident he could have hurt himself you know people people say a car up to
00:33:31
them pile of [ __ ] right whatever but the the problem is the call ends after this
00:33:39
takes place so you can't you can't just look at this and go oh what would make me say oh [ __ ] what would make me say oh
00:33:47
[ __ ] and then the phone the phone call ends you have to put those two things together because that's what took place
00:33:54
now of course it could have been some type of accident he could have fallen into the river the river kills his phone
00:34:00
but the other thing just as simple could be his phone is going to die right the phone is losing its charge it has no
00:34:10
battery life left his phone according to what you can the specs that you can find
00:34:16
online has 400 minutes of call time of talk time we know that this one phone call the last phone call took up 47
00:34:27
minutes of talk time that's one-eighth of the whole battery life right there now on top of that he
00:34:34
said wasn't a good thumb on top of that he's had multiple calls with mom and dad
00:34:38
before this last one he's also gone to two parties that night I mean this phone is basically a rock with antenna he left
00:34:48
his home by all accounts around 6:00 p.m. that night so he's been gone it's now 3:00 in the morning
00:34:54
he's been gone like nine hours so what I'm getting at here is our charger though that's very possible
00:35:02
but what I'm getting at here is that it's very likely that he could have been talking and talking and talking pulled
00:35:08
the phone away looked at the screen and went oh [ __ ] or got some kind of notification that he heard on his end
00:35:15
but his father didn't hear mm-hm and goes oh [ __ ] and then the phone goes dead simply because the battery life ran
00:35:23
out the thing here is that doesn't get us any closer to what happened to Brandon but what I'm
00:35:29
getting at is what I think is is so polarizing about that case this case is that phone call where I think it's just
00:35:36
kind of confusing and it's really clouding the whole situation the phone call and him saying ol [ __ ] may mean
00:35:44
nothing at all could be something super small something as simple as his phone dying and then
00:35:50
whatever took place took place after he no longer had the use of his phone I do think that there's some type of accident
00:35:58
that took place out there it that led to his demise mm-hmm that he probably did succumb to the elements at some point
00:36:06
that evening and I think it's very likely that he is somewhere in that area that they've been unable to search for
00:36:16
any number of reasons that's 40% of the area mm-hmm I think that's I think that's what it what happened here I
00:36:23
think everything that the people that are closest to this case are saying is probably exactly what happened he wasn't
00:36:31
that messed up he just he got disoriented because the area itself is confusing well it's late at night it's
00:36:40
not well marked it's it would be confusing for anybody traveling in that area he tried to turn around because he
00:36:47
knew had to go an extra mile or two to get to the next intersection and he was frustrated and upset that he wasn't home
00:36:53
already and he just wanted to turn around as quickly as possible and he ran into the bad luck of getting his car
00:36:59
hung up in the ditch and then he ran into further bad luck of having indicators pointing out to him that he
00:37:05
may in fact be where he thinks he is I think this is just at one of those tragic cases and unfortunately I've
00:37:13
heard statements from his mother and from his sister that are just heartbreaking where his mother says I'm
00:37:21
kinda come to the conclusion that we won't find Brandon in my lifetime and then his sister adds to that by going
00:37:29
I'm starting to think we won't find him in my lifetime yeah and because even if you take like I said my theory I lean
00:37:37
more towards the idea that he ended up in that River while we know what what the water can do
00:37:44
to bodies and speed up the composition you know decomposition of the body not to mention the weather out there being a
00:37:53
little more extreme and colder weather then and then also if you're right that he is somewhere in this 40% that they
00:38:05
haven't been able to search like you talked about yeah farm equipment you have you know a
00:38:10
lot of this machinery that's gonna be coming through you have animals you you have the the weather you have all these
00:38:20
things stacked up against you to actually find his remains mm-hmm right and I the thing I want to point
00:38:27
out here too captain is look I'm sure there's a lot of us out there listening to this and
00:38:34
going well whatever happened to Brandon would never happen to me I have GPS on my phone I have a much different phone
00:38:40
than what Brandon had to carry back in 2008 let's let's be smarter than that let's take this a step further put some
00:38:50
things in your vehicle put some safety precautions in your vehicle flashlights and he might have had something he may
00:38:59
he may have but it was a young kid this I think this is just a this was a friendly reminder to me or an unfriendly
00:39:06
reminder however you want to look at it a reminder to me that it's a good idea to have things like a flashlight
00:39:12
first-aid kit flares however far you want to take this thing blankets some people put bottles of water in their
00:39:20
vehicle this can happen to any of us and if you're better prepared you might have
00:39:26
a different outcome yeah and even though I really think my my gut feeling is correct and then even if it's not
00:39:35
correct then I would lean more towards the idea okay well maybe he made it out of the water and now we just haven't
00:39:44
found him and that that forty percent that hasn't been searched I can go with that that one of the things that really
00:39:51
makes me ponder this case more is the vehicles left and both doors are open mm-hmm that doesn't make a lot of
00:40:02
sense to me it seems one super strange to me and a bit creepy and scary at the same time
00:40:08
that's the only indicator throughout this whole story that whatever Brandon was telling his father and his mother
00:40:15
that something totally different could have been going on that's the only indicator to me one one way that I've
00:40:23
tried to apply some just very basic logic to why the the car doors would be open obviously if somebody came along
00:40:31
and tried to wanted to steal something or look for something of value in the car that's an obvious thing right but I
00:40:38
also wondered if look they were trying to use lights earlier in in this whole thing as a way of finding one another by
00:40:48
flashing the lights part of me wonders if Brandon look we know he was a smart guy there's nobody disputing that
00:40:55
I wonder if while he's troubleshooting his problem here if he thought you know I'm gonna head off on foot walking
00:41:02
Northwest towards this town yes I'm going to meet my father there but he's still under the belief at that time that
00:41:09
he is in the area of where his father is searching right so is it possible that he thought I'll take this a step further
00:41:17
and leave the car door open or doors open this leaving on the light inside of the car that my father might see so if
00:41:28
he doesn't find me at least he finds a car and I can we can use that as a landmark er to meet up so I kind of
00:41:36
thought that the only thing that makes that punches a hole in that thought in theory is that you think this might have
00:41:43
been discussed between Brandon and his father and it wasn't as far as we know yeah it's seen that detail to me seems
00:41:51
like something that's gonna keep this mystery around for a while right and his father and mother not only led the
00:41:58
search that night and really pushed to get law enforcement involved as quickly as possible but they've continued to
00:42:06
lead the sir for all these years yeah all missing children cases are difficult I think
00:42:13
there's an element of the fact that you both work getting up that night to go help him makes it even more difficult
00:42:22
mm-hmm well and I hope and pray that his mother and sister are wrong in their thought and their belief that they've
00:42:30
kind of come to the idea that they may never know what happened to Brandon in throughout their course of their
00:42:35
lifetime I hope that they're wrong with that the the family this has got to be haunting for them and they've already
00:42:43
kind of come to the idea in somewhat accepted the idea that Brandon's very likely no longer with us but to have
00:42:53
some answers would would be very big for them in this situation now there is a thing today called Brandon's law and
00:43:04
this is because of Brandon's parents Annette and Brian Swanson are responsible for the enactment of
00:43:12
Brandon's law which became effective in Minnesota on July 1st 2009 this law requires Minnesota police to begin an
00:43:22
immediate search for missing adults under 21 as well as older adults who are missing under suspicious circumstances
00:43:30
and Brandon's situation certainly falls into that regardless of what theory you favor or believe the Swanson's have kept
00:43:40
the porch light on for their son they have burned through many light bulbs in the 11 years he has been missing Brian
00:43:47
Swanson has acknowledged that the family likely won't find Brandon alive but they
00:43:53
still want to find him there has never been a memorial service for Brandon Brandon's sister is now married and
00:44:00
Brandon now has two nephews which he has never met the Swanson's want to know what happened to their son they say
00:44:08
quote you know people don't just vanish into thin air but it sure seems like he did
00:44:16
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garage all right captain before we wrap things up this week how about a little recommended reading we have one from our
00:45:09
good friend good friend of the show Billy Jensen his new book called chase darkness with me captain you and I hung
00:45:17
out with Billy at crime Con and he was kind enough to send a couple of copies of chase darkness with me to the garage
00:45:24
we can't wait to read it that's by Billy Jensen you don't have to write that title down though because you can go to
00:45:30
true crime garage com click on the recommended page and we will have that title there for you along with other
00:45:37
recommendations yeah and I think he owed us the book because he thought that uh Bob ruff was gonna outdrink me but uh
00:45:46
but like we know like everybody knows Bob ruff said good night therefore disqualifying himself and making me the
00:45:55
winner of the drinking contest at crime Con so Thank You Billy and thank you Bob
00:45:59
for quitting on the drinking contest that's right all right until next week everybody out there be good be kind and
00:46:08
don't let it [Music] [Applause]