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Freedom calls we're here to answer call us at 1 888 [Music] [Applause] freedom [Music]
00:01:43
welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks for listening I'm your host Nick and
00:01:49
with me as always is a man that's counting the votes and he's using the old one for you two for me system here
00:01:56
is the very reliable trustworthy captain yeah the votes are in there will be no president only captains it's good to be
00:02:04
seen and good to see you thanks for listening thanks for telling a [Music] friend this week we are very happy to be
00:02:17
featuring I70 Colorado logger by the good people of Odyssey Beerworks this is not your typical logger it's delicious
00:02:26
and refreshing just like what you would expect from a traditional logger but this one is a little more well-traveled
00:02:32
and life's an odyssey not a destination garage grade three and A2 bottle caps out of five and let's give some cheers
00:02:41
to some of our non-traditional and well-traveled friends first up cheers to Troy and Bravo Utah and a shout out to
00:02:48
Danielle in Townsville Australia next up we have a cheers to Linda and eera Pennsylvania and a big we like your jib
00:02:57
to Katie and Madison Wisconsin next up Captain we have Rachel and Parts Unknown she is the proud owner of a feeling FY
00:03:05
shirt and part of the ban the van movement and last but certainly not least we have lesie and Odessa Texas
00:03:13
everyone we just mentioned went to True Crim garage.com and helped us out with this week's beer fun yeah BW are you in
00:03:20
a beer run for everything true crime garage check out our website true Crim garage.com if you're looking for our old
00:03:27
episodes download the Stitcher app it is free and we have a bonus show called off
00:03:33
the Record and that's on Stitcher premium and if you're wondering about the presidential counts in Parts Unknown
00:03:40
well the winner and still Champion is old FY Malik and that is enough of the business all right everybody gather
00:03:50
around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime [Music] in the Psychedelic Jazz rock song
00:04:28
writers on the store St Jim Morrison and The Doors warned us that there's a killer on the road starting in the 1950s
00:04:37
Americans eagerly built the planet's largest public work the 42794 M National system of Interstate
00:04:47
and highways before the concrete was dry a spectre began hunting the road and his means of travel
00:04:56
are very much an important and necessary part of his Arsenal the nation's murder rate shot up
00:05:03
as its expressways were built America became more violent and more mobile at the same
00:05:10
time these killers and what we call them mostly depends on his methods of murder
00:05:16
his victims and how he chooses his attack there's The Hitcher the freeway killer The Long Hall killer there was
00:05:25
Norris and Baker cruising around Southern California and a van that they nickname murder
00:05:32
ma there was Stark weather the hot rotting juvenile delinquent who led the National Guard on a multi-state man hunt
00:05:41
in which the killing of 11 people inspired two indelible pieces of American art Bruce Springsteen song
00:05:49
Nebraska and Terrence Malik's film Badlands there was the call me God DC sniper attacks of 2002 where long long
00:05:59
distance serial killers positioned the barrel of their Bushmaster xm15 rifle through a hole cut at the rear of a
00:06:06
Chevy Capri to pick off their prey and there was the I5 killer a True Crime Story told here in the garage in
00:06:15
episodes 313 and 314 back in June of 2019 the story of a homicidal sexual predator with an appetite for
00:06:25
unspeakable acts of violence la enforcement faced the awesome challenge of catching a suspect
00:06:32
responsible for committing such ugly crimes crimes that filled Every Woman Within his striking range with
00:06:40
horor unfortunately his striking range was Interstate 5 and its tentacles spanning over, 1300 miles in three
00:06:49
states California Oregon and Washington leaving a trail of victims along the way this week we tell the True Crime
00:07:01
Story of an unidentified serial killer a story that at times will share similarities with some of the atrocities
00:07:10
previously mentioned 20 years after Jim Morrison prognosticated that there's a killer on
00:07:17
the road this killer hit the pavement this serial killer used the interstate system as a hunting
00:07:24
ground this is a story of a white knuckled monster seething behind the wheel eager to make his
00:07:32
appointment but as he's driving the interstate what is driving him to kill he's a dealer of motiveless murder a
00:07:41
predator with deadly accuracy a coward who killed seemingly just to kill and then vanished into the
00:07:50
world he disappeared and remains unidentified we have no caged monster to point to and say that that did this
00:08:01
instead we only have a moniker the I70 killer this is true crime [Music] garage Interstate 70 or I70 is a major
00:08:25
East West interstate highway in the United States that runs from Utah to Baltimore Maryland I70 approximately
00:08:34
traces the path of old US Route 40 East of the Rocky Mountains and it runs through or near many major cities
00:08:43
including Denver Topeka Kansas City St Louis Indianapolis Columbus Pittsburgh and
00:08:51
Baltimore I70 is 2,151 MIL long and some of those major cities that we just mention mentioned
00:08:59
will be important to this week's case especially Indianapolis Indiana where we will start off this takes place on
00:09:07
Wednesday April 8th 1992 we have 26-year-old Robin folder she's working she's going to be helping
00:09:17
out a friend at work the friend was not feeling well and Robin told the coworker
00:09:22
hey no problem I can come in and cover your shift today Robin worked at the pist Shoe Source on the East End of
00:09:30
Indianapolis Indiana she was one of only two full-time workers at this location now there were a couple of part-time
00:09:39
workers there as well but not on this day Robin was a manager pess is an international discount Footwear chain
00:09:48
that has been around for decades and I believe is still active today yeah boogo there you go now because this store was
00:09:56
operating with a very small staff this required that at times they run the store with just a single employee and
00:10:05
again that will be the situation on this Wednesday this made some of the employees uncomfortable the store did
00:10:12
not have a lot of problems or issues but did experience shoplifting on occasion as most stores do this store does not
00:10:21
have any security cameras and at the time the only real security measure was a buzzer that would go off when the door
00:10:29
was open notifying staff that someone has either entered or exited the store Robin in particular did not like being
00:10:37
alone in the store at nighttime and her sister would often drive to the store and kind of just hang out with Robin
00:10:45
during her solo night shifts but our case is going to start out on this Wednesday afternoon Robin working alone
00:10:56
now next door to the pals is a Speedway Gas gas station that is still there to this day a lady named lacricia she's
00:11:04
working at the speedway she gets a phone call from the district manager of the payas store who says hey I've been
00:11:12
trying for about 45 minutes to get in touch with my employee Robin at the pays I've tried numerous times and no one is
00:11:20
answering the phone could you go next door and make sure that she's all right lacricia goes next door and she enters
00:11:28
the SHO store she does not see Robin in fact she does not see anyone at all what
00:11:34
she does see is an open cash register now she works at a gas station so she's very aware of what this could mean so
00:11:42
this is enough for lacricia yeah this means trouble she leaves the store goes back to the speedway and calls the
00:11:49
police saying she thinks that the pays has been robbed or possibly a robbery in progress this of course is going to
00:11:58
trigger a Speedy response officers arrive on the scene and they are in the store at
00:12:05
2:21 p.m. they find Robin Dead on Arrival she was located in the back of the store in a stock room police
00:12:15
theorize that the killer took Robin to the back of the store either just before or after removing money from the
00:12:24
register Marian County conducted the autopsy and the info released to the public at
00:12:32
the time was that Robin was shot twice the shots were to the right side of her head in the back of the head and fired
00:12:41
at quote a reasonably close range and from a small caliber gun Robin's purse and coat were found in the store and her
00:12:51
car found parked outside so police pointed out that this made the robbery angle in motive a
00:12:59
little strange they felt that if somebody came in there and the sole purpose of the
00:13:06
attack was for robbery right and it resulted in Murder that this individual would have taken just about everything
00:13:14
they could get their hands on and it doesn't appear that they did that not just because of her purse maybe maybe
00:13:21
it's as simple as they didn't see her purse but what we do know is there was $50 left in the register
00:13:29
so police were very upfront about this here Captain stating this is not a store that they would expect a robbery to take
00:13:38
place it's not a store that's going to have a lot of cash on hand not a great Target for a robbery and then to top
00:13:46
that off they find $50 left in the register yeah but there's been several people especially like people that rob
00:13:54
banks often where they talk about you go in the the main thing is to have a location that that that there's no
00:14:01
security mhm you might only get a couple hundred bucks but your risk of getting caught is so low that you can now you
00:14:08
just have to duplicate that over and over again right I guess the thing that makes this one extra tricky is the
00:14:14
murder that's involved right why not as you just pointed out perfectly the security level at this store is terrible
00:14:24
there there is none we have a single female working by herself that day there's no cameras and it's fairly quick
00:14:31
that you can get back on a speedy route out of town as soon as you hit this store the murder makes it weird and then
00:14:38
I want to talk about the $50 left in the register real quick we've we've discussed this on other robbery
00:14:45
homicides in the past and one thing that's tricky here is we don't know the details of why $50 was left was it
00:14:53
something that the killer chose to do or did unwillingly did not know that they did this sometimes you keep the larger
00:15:01
bills underneath right and maybe it was just overlooked he didn't check there yeah maybe it was wrapped up in a rubber
00:15:10
band maybe it was taped and we we never hear of you know there was $ 51.79 left in the register cuz I always
00:15:19
wonder about that I'm like I can't imagine the person taking the time to scoop all the coins out of the register
00:15:26
as well I doubt they had exactly $50 and coins in this register but the thing is
00:15:31
again if the sole purpose of this attack is in fact robbery usually the perpetrator will
00:15:41
have or Force the employee to assist them in some manner in the robbery meaning tell me where all the money is
00:15:49
show me is there a safe you know is there any money that that's you've not told me about so usually they're good
00:15:55
about getting all of the cash that they can because they are threatening the employee to help them figure out where
00:16:03
all the money is right but then as far as law enforcement goes or a detective goes you go okay well maybe the robber
00:16:11
just didn't know that there wouldn't be that much money in a store like that so maybe they're not like a highly
00:16:19
sophisticated robber MH but the murder makes you believe that the person knew the person working at the store the
00:16:29
victim right because what we have here is a situation where the murder seems unnecessary for the purpose of robbery
00:16:36
you could have went in there if this person does not know you boom you stick a gun in the face show me where all the
00:16:43
money is okay I got the money I'm out I'm in my car I'm heading towards the freeway no murder necessary right show
00:16:50
me the money the timeline I think here is interesting let's go through this real quick too so we have the police who
00:16:58
said it in the papers immediately that they were looking for persons who had been in the store that day to come
00:17:04
forward maybe they had seen something or heard something of importance whether or
00:17:09
not they knew it so anybody that shopped at that store on that day we want you to
00:17:15
come forward and speak with us because you may have seen something that went down prior to this robbery and homicide
00:17:23
yeah no offense to Payless but when I was a kid and You' get Payless Shoes which have
00:17:28
several times you would not want to admit to your friends that you had Payless Shoes on you would say maybe you
00:17:35
got your shoes from Kmart or Walmart or anywhere other than Payless what they really wanted what police really wanted
00:17:43
Captain was to speak with a customer involved in the last transaction the last known transaction so the last
00:17:51
transaction was recorded on the register at 1:12 p.m. the purchase was for one pair of women shoes and one pair of
00:17:59
men's shoes police were on the scene at 221 this is what the time that they say that they found Robin deceased right
00:18:09
this is after lria went into the store and then called it in again this is a robbery and progress call so response
00:18:17
time should be very quick and multiple units responding to the scene well I wonder if if the last customer was like
00:18:24
a ruse I go in there I act like a customer I talk to them I'm acting like I'm buying a pair of women's shoes a
00:18:32
pair of men's shoes if I do that you don't know what kind of customer I was if I was a female or male I'm getting
00:18:40
into know knowledge of the layout how many people are working because if I come in as a a nice respectable customer
00:18:48
oh yeah you know how do you like your job do you like working here H it's okay but I I don't like working by myself all
00:18:56
you work by yourself she Rings up the order and then that's when you turn on the person and so then
00:19:04
it doesn't matter that they saw you or talk to you because you know that you're going to murder them that's interesting
00:19:10
and I tell you why because we actually have a very short period of time here when you piece everything together we
00:19:18
know we have the last transaction at 1:12 p.m. we have police on the scene at 2:21 p.m. so just a little more than an
00:19:27
hour later and hour 9 minutes actually right and it doesn't matter how much money you spend in the store cuz you're
00:19:33
just taking them back anyways and during that hour n minutes we have several things that we knew took place all right
00:19:40
we have lri who went to the store and then she calls police so she finds the store empty and the register open now
00:19:48
she does not go through the entirety of the store but it's very likely that the store was empty at that point so let's
00:19:57
back this up just a few minutes if you back this thing up let's say 10 minutes 15 at the very most between the time
00:20:03
lacricia shows up police arrive on the scene now we're talking about less than an hour and if you factor in the words
00:20:10
of the manager who called lacricia at the speedway and says I've been trying to get a hold of Robin for 45 minutes
00:20:19
and no one has answered the phone so that means either Robin was attacked and killed very close to that last
00:20:27
transaction per that 45 minutes that now puts us at like 140 at the latest or the attack is
00:20:36
in progress when the calls first start taking place right so a small window of time that's key but not only that but
00:20:44
the location is going to be key here in this case as well and the rest of the cases that we discuss this Payless store
00:20:52
is now one of those batteries Bulbs Plus store it's a stand Al loone store located in a busy area of town that's
00:21:02
one thing when looking this up on the map that really struck me as bizarre it seems like there would be a lot of
00:21:09
activity in this area foot traffic people driving there's a lot of um fast food businesses in this area so this
00:21:18
store is located in a busy area and right by the pays is that Speedway that we mentioned right a paint store and a
00:21:28
car repair place now paint stores aren't that busy but if you go just past those
00:21:33
are the immediate businesses if you just go one business past all those you have
00:21:37
things like McDonald's Taco Bell places that you would expect to be busy even on
00:21:42
a Wednesday afternoon Taco Bell Taco Bell M that might be dinner tonight paint store car repair place this
00:21:49
Payless Shoe Source is at 7325 Pendleton Pike Indianapolis Indiana just off of Interstate 70 on the East
00:21:59
End of Indianapolis it's just 6.9 miles from Interstate 70 via Interstate 465 repeat that again how many miles
00:22:11
it's about 6.9 miles from Interstate 70 that's still that's still a distance though so according to my maps roughly a
00:22:19
7-minute drive from I70 now there was a witness but what he witnessed well everyone will need to decide
00:22:28
the importance of what he saw MH Jeff mayrose he's the manager of the MB paint store said that he saw a man in a green
00:22:41
jacket walking down Pendleton Pike he said the man carried a long bag and mayrose assumed that he was some type of
00:22:49
Hitchhiker or maybe a homeless person he said that the man came from the direction of I 465
00:22:58
which intersects with I 73 Mi south of the pike the man in the Green Jacket stopped at May Rose's store I don't
00:23:08
believe he went in he repeatedly circled the building before sitting on the curb
00:23:14
nearby mayose said that the man remained there for about a half an hour maybe more staring at the Payless Shoe Source
00:23:23
across the street and you know rumaging through his long bag that he carried the
00:23:30
man said mayrose was mumbling talking to himself and even giggling at times MH mayrose reported the I'm sorry mayose
00:23:41
reportedly said the man he saw was either on drugs or he had mental problems did anybody get a look at any
00:23:49
of the items in his long bag no I don't there's no reference of that uh what we do have is Jeff mayrose from his views
00:23:59
said that the strange man disappeared around 2: p.m. maybe a little earlier maybe a little later MH he did say that
00:24:07
he caught a glimpse of the man calmly trying to hitch a ride going north back to
00:24:14
i465 he's witnessing this man who's in the area kind of Behaving strangely sitting in the parking lot of his paint
00:24:23
store he says staring at the pals across the street man disappears for a little while and then he when he reappears he
00:24:31
sees him he believes trying to hitch a ride back North right which again it's eyewitness report so you got to take it
00:24:38
a little bit with a grain of salt but the idea too that somebody's going to rob um a shoe store being a green jacket
00:24:47
with a long bag and then decide to hitchhike after they robbed and murdered somebody seems a little odd right seems
00:24:56
extremely odd because I want to take this a step further I keep hinting around the idea that the the robbery is
00:25:03
less a part of this than it than it may be that the murder might be the actual motive here and if that is in fact true
00:25:11
we don't know but if it is in fact true that means that this individual likely showed up to that area knowing their
00:25:18
intent was to murder someone and then as you pointed out how dumb would it be to
00:25:23
say oh I have no way of getting out of here other than my own two feet or my giant Thumb in the air trying to hitch a
00:25:30
ride out of this area I mean right if he doesn't successfully find a ride or if he can't haul ass out of there fast
00:25:37
enough on his own two feet he could still be standing there near the store when police arrive on the scene at 221
00:25:44
p.m. but like I told you when I worked in Richmond we had downtown Richmond like the historic district is what they
00:25:52
called it there's multiple Banks and we started getting robbed all the time like
00:25:57
all the different banks now my my bank never got robbed they they were having a really hard time trying to catch the
00:26:03
person because they're they're either showing up with a bicycle leaving with a bicycle or showing up on foot and
00:26:10
leaving on foot so they knew that the perpetrator had it these different Escape zones but it was so much harder
00:26:18
for them to catch that's true and this being a busy area with a lot of buildings a lot of businesses and a lot
00:26:25
of times these businesses and buildings are going to back up to neighborhoods someone I guess could be out of there
00:26:30
pretty quickly or at least uh in an area where it'd be harder to track them down
00:26:35
now very sadly Robin folder was only 26 years old she was a very kind soul she was intelligent hardworking and a caring
00:26:45
person said her sister Susan Robin wanted more than anything to get married and start a family only 26 years old
00:26:52
Captain falder's family later complained to the Indianapolis Star are about what
00:26:58
they thought were numerous security lapses at the business They Carried their concerns to the Payless Executives
00:27:07
in the end the Indiana Department of Labor cleared the business of any wrongdoing we should point out that the
00:27:15
police have been fairly vocal that they believe if in fact this Green Jacket man
00:27:23
was the perpetrator of this murder they believe that he was sitting in the parking lot of the paint store watching
00:27:30
the PS Sho Source store to determine how many employees were there and if in fact
00:27:37
this killer was seeking a female victim to look and confirm that it would be a solo female
00:27:48
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hp.com / garage major phone carriers make you sign contracts with rigid data plans to
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trap you into a kind of forced phogy sounds pretty insecure if you ask me at Consumer Cellular we believe in a more
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phone plans monogamously Consumer Cellular when Freedom calls we're here to answer call us at 1888
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00:30:07
back cheers mates cheers to you Captain cheers to all the people in the back now
00:30:13
3 Days Later April 11th 1992 just 3 days later we will have two more victims this
00:30:22
is Patricia major and Patricia Smith Patricia major is 32 years old she is the owner of the lbde de Elegance bridal
00:30:33
shop located at 4613 East Kellogg in witch Kansas we're in a whole different state here Captain I was born in a
00:30:42
different state Patricia and her husband Mark Majors bought the store in February
00:30:47
of 1991 so just uh about 2 months earlier he says the store was primarily for her
00:30:58
saying that she really enjoyed working with the customers and the bridal environment it's important to note that
00:31:04
the couple owned both the lbde the Elegance bridal shop and the sir Knight tuxedo informal wear shop these were
00:31:14
adjacent shops located at 4613 East Kellogg and 4609 East Kellog well like you said the
00:31:22
first crime happened on a Wednesday this is now a Saturday a Saturday in April of
00:31:27
1992 we have Patricia Majors she will be working with employee Patricia Smith her
00:31:33
ma name is trenle Patricia Smith is 23 years old a nursing student at witch state with plans to eventually pursue
00:31:43
pediatric care she's a newlywed married to Norman Smith for 9 months by this point in our timeline this was the only
00:31:53
case and there's going to be a series of these the the only case involving multiple victims investigators believed
00:32:01
the killer was under the impression that there were there was only one woman in the store at the time normally Patricia
00:32:09
Majors was not in the store on a Saturday at this time the women had stayed past the typical 6:00 closing
00:32:17
time so by the time that this takes place Captain the store should have been closed but they stayed past the closing
00:32:24
time because they were waiting on a male customer who had called ahead and arranged to pick up a cumber bun after
00:32:31
hours at some point after 6:00 p.m. police think that the women opened the door to a man who they thought was the
00:32:39
customer that they were staying late for do we have a note about this customer do
00:32:43
we know if we knew the name of the customer we know exactly who he is and and we'll get into that this is going
00:32:50
off of police theory that the attacker arrives at the store the women let him in thinking he's the customer they've
00:32:59
been waiting on then the attacker ushers them to the back room of the bridal shop
00:33:04
that served as a work area and office and there the man shot both women in the back of the head with a 22 caliber semi
00:33:13
automatic firearm the man did steal some cash from the register and walked away but not before a brief confrontation
00:33:22
with the actual customer who had made arrangements with the lady to pick up this cumber bun after closing time so he
00:33:31
arrives at the store thinking he's just going to go in and pick up his cumber bun and be on his way right the actual
00:33:37
customer arrived to pick up the cumber bun and encountered the killer the killer let the man go but this was only
00:33:45
because the man refused to enter the store the way that this goes down and we do not have this man per se his name and
00:33:57
what he says exactly went down we have the police statements and the police reports of what they say this man told
00:34:04
them it sounds like when he encountered the killer the killer tried to get him to come into the store itself had he
00:34:13
gone in who knows what would have happened I'm guessing he might have done the same with this guy dead man yes he
00:34:22
may have ushered him to the back room and killed him as well the customer notified police once the killer left so
00:34:29
the way that this goes down he does not go into the store he flees the area there is a discrepancy of when the call
00:34:36
came into to police because it's going to be this customer that calls police and says hey something terrible is going
00:34:43
on where's he calling from that's what's difficult again we don't have this man's
00:34:49
name or his direct statements we have what police say he told them right there's a discrepancy of when he called
00:34:57
most reports stay say that it was over an hour prior to the police arriving I I don't know I don't love that that
00:35:06
sentence I think it's I think it's confusing it sounds like he called something in and then police didn't
00:35:13
bother showing up to the scene for an hour it's very likely though that this customer did not know that the women
00:35:21
were dead in the store he could speculate that but he wouldn't have seen that he didn't enter the store he's has
00:35:28
no way of knowing that there are two people who have been killed in the back of this store but did he see a gun yes
00:35:36
because if the guy with the gun goes get in the store you first start off by going hey buddy with a gun suck it not
00:35:43
going in the store you're going to you're going to have to shoot me out here where there might be some
00:35:49
eyewitnesses or better chance that you're going to miss do not insult the man with the gun but here here's the
00:35:57
difficult thing well but hold on my point is better to insult him than to follow his directions regardless of how
00:36:05
this went down Captain the thing that we can say I believe for certain is that there is some time that passes between
00:36:14
when he encountered the Killer and when the phone call was made and when police arrived on the scene I don't know if
00:36:21
that means that this man had to go find a pay phone it's 1992 or if it was one of those things
00:36:29
sometimes look when you walk into a situation that's terrifying shocking something you're not expecting you don't
00:36:37
necessarily behave rationally upon witnessing or experiencing that situation this man may have just done
00:36:45
what came naturally and got back in his car and drove home and then made the call once he was home once he had calmed
00:36:53
down on the drive home and said there's something going on here I better make sure report this or the fact that he
00:36:58
might have had a wedding he was going to that night it was a Saturday he was needing his cumber
00:37:04
bun what what if he was like w this thing just went down but I got to make it to this wedding I'm the best man in a
00:37:11
wedding or I'm maybe he continued on to the wedding and phoned the police from there again he does not know that a
00:37:17
homicide is taking place and a double double homicide at that he would in fact though provide details to police so that
00:37:26
they could put together a composite a composite sketch of the suspect he described the man as white 5' 7 in to 5'
00:37:35
8 in tall about 150 lb with reddish colored or light colored hair and a stubble beard police on the scene found
00:37:46
Patricia major dead and Patricia Smith was mortally wounded more than an hour later again when the customer called 911
00:37:55
to say that he had seen an armed man approaching the store well all the victims are roughly in the same age
00:38:01
range correct Patricia Smith was taken to St Joseph hospital where she was pronounced Dead on Arrival there we have
00:38:11
unfortunately her father Bob trenle who said I touched her hand as she lay there
00:38:16
on the table he's recalling the minutes after he arrived at the hospital her husband said quote I was
00:38:24
expecting Trish was her nickname I was expecting Trish home at 6:15 that night I waited and she didn't show up Norman
00:38:32
Smith said quote I thought maybe she had a late customer so I called the store and there was no answer Smith said he
00:38:39
tried calling again around 700 p.m. but when no one picked up he knew something was wrong police interviewed both
00:38:47
victim's husbands Norman Smith and Mark Majors after they each drove to the crime scene that Saturday evening but
00:38:56
quickly concluded that neither was connected to the slangs mark major said he reopened the bridal shop shortly
00:39:05
after the murders only to sell it 5 months later he never remarried he said of his wife we had an absolute textbook
00:39:15
marriage we were best friends so it sucked textbook it was a textbook marriage there you go he's saying that
00:39:23
it actually took him about 13 years to fully accept and get through the grieving process but he never really
00:39:30
moved on he said he Harbors no ill feelings toward law enforcement for not catching Patricia's killer this should
00:39:39
not be a spoiler alert to anybody out there this is not a spoiler because we said in the trailer this is an
00:39:47
unidentified serial killer that we're working with that we're talking about here today now after 26 years Bob
00:39:55
trenle father of Patricia Smith said that he did not expect Patricia's murder to be found in his lifetime 26 years
00:40:06
after the fact he's saying this to the papers and unfortunately Robert William Bob trenle of Topeka formerly of
00:40:15
Witchita passed away on March 15 2018 well the problem that they're working against is the randomness and if
00:40:25
we believe that these two are connected now we have miles upon miles and cities upon
00:40:35
cities where this individual could come from yes we first started off in Indianapolis Indiana and our second case
00:40:45
is taking us all the way to Witchita Kansas so let's talk about the location of this store it's located at 4613 East
00:40:55
Kellogg Drive wit talk Kansas and according to my maps and directions it's 1 hour 17 minutes drive to Salina now
00:41:07
Salina is the most direct location where I70 intersects it's 93 Miles via 135 North
00:41:18
or and I'm going to throw this in as an aside because I'm having going through this case the city of toeka Kansas comes
00:41:26
up several times uh in this case so I'm going to throw this out there too you could go up I35 to toeka Kansas this is
00:41:36
a 2hour 136 M drive to Topeka Kansas an I70 runs right through Topeka it's also 10 hours away from
00:41:46
Indianapolis that be correct my friend let's go 16 days later 2 weeks and 2 days later on April 27th 19
00:41:57
1992 we have 40-year-old Michael Milo maau better known to his friends as Mick he is working and he
00:42:08
will be working in his mother's store this is called Sylvia's Ceramics shop located at
00:42:16
26:15 South Third Street in Tero Indiana we're back in the Hooser State Captain he is the only male to be killed
00:42:28
in any of this series of attacks now prior to starting at the ceramic shop with his wife
00:42:36
Sylvia Mick's father owned a barber shop this was called Phil's barber shop for 20 years in the same location it was
00:42:48
shortly before the murder that it transitioned from the barber shop to this Ceramics
00:42:55
store and investigators believe that the killer chose this store because the store's solo woman's
00:43:05
name Sylvia's Ceramics so if in fact this killer is seeking targets seeking stores that are
00:43:13
being operated by a single solo worker female worker this the sign on the store in
00:43:23
front of the store indicates that that might be what this killer would find once he enters the store a woman working
00:43:30
solo but what else do we know about this individual about about his surveillance
00:43:38
of these areas that he's going to Rob and potentially murder somebody well let's let's continue on
00:43:47
through hold on a second this is a good point we have eyewitnesses that saw him um stalking or peeping Tom or
00:43:57
whatever you want to call it running surveillance on on his first location from across the street so again maybe he
00:44:06
picked this location because it's a single a single female name but even if he was watching the store from a
00:44:16
distance there's a the son I believe he has pretty long hair for a male and so it it's possible
00:44:26
if he was running surveillance on his next Target he wouldn't have known it was a man from a distance yes and that's
00:44:36
part of the investigator's theory on this particular case in the series is that maau or Mick he had long hair and wore a
00:44:50
ponytail and he was also a smaller guy so it's believed that if in fact the killer was watching the store if in fact
00:44:59
he could see this man from outside of the store through a window or a glass door that if he only saw this man from
00:45:09
the back that he may have believed it was a woman working by herself again that goes to the idea of the name on the
00:45:18
sign itself M that would indicate a small business a small store operated by owner operat
00:45:26
store he might be expecting to find Sylvia inside working that day again though I think um law enforcement knows
00:45:37
this and and but just to kind of state the obvious they're picking places where you
00:45:43
know the register is not going to be filled it's not going to be a big score financially right but you are going to
00:45:50
get a score of of some kind right it's the tradeoff that you were talking about earlier if you want
00:45:57
to make a whole bunch of money you go rob the McDonald's that had served a billion Big Macs that day but you're
00:46:04
going to encounter five or six employees in the store and probably several customers at the same time you walk into
00:46:11
Sylvia's ceramic shop how much money are you expecting to get but you're also coule hundred bucks maybe yeah you're
00:46:19
also expecting you know what I can watch the store for 15 20 minutes and and determine that there are no customers
00:46:26
inside the store I'm only thinking I'm going to encounter one employee right now the investigators went as far and
00:46:33
they seem pretty firm on this so I don't know exactly did you grab them how they've pieced This Together mhm but
00:46:41
they seem pretty firm on this idea that that Mick very likely never saw his killer and they believe that the killer
00:46:51
may not have seen the front of Mick or his face until after he had already killed the man this this shot in the
00:46:59
back of the head thing too has to be something right yes that that it's it's always the same way like like that
00:47:09
that maybe that means they know what they're doing is wrong well you wonder is he too cowardly to have to look them
00:47:16
in the face right before or during the killing you know you you also think it makes sense too we've seen this several
00:47:25
times in other cases where the customers or employees inside a store during a robbery are taken to the back room they
00:47:34
get on their knees and they're shot in the back of the head that's not terribly uncommon right and that is what they
00:47:41
believe took place at the bridal shop suck it nope not going to the back of the room well it's it may be get shot
00:47:50
here get shot in the back of the room I don't know these are these are horrible situations hopefully and I pray none of
00:47:56
us here or none of us listening ever find ourselves in such situations yeah but the more and more we cover these
00:48:02
cases you know get in the car don't get in the car get in the van don't get in the van you know let me tie you up don't
00:48:10
let them tie you up hey let's play this little magic trick with some handcuffs don't do that you know it's it's almost
00:48:18
like we see time and time again the ones don't that don't follow directions almost throw the killer off their
00:48:28
game because they're expecting these people I got a gun they're going to they're going to listen to what I say
00:48:34
I'm I'm powerful the problem with that though is with that analysis is the the people that don't survive aren't there
00:48:42
to tell us exactly what went down especially when we have a killer who gets away they may they may not have
00:48:48
agreed or or gone along with any part of it and ended up right right the same you
00:48:54
know it's it's regardless it's it's it's sad I'm still going with my idea that you asked me to do something suck it
00:49:00
let's just get this done and over with you know I'm not going to be put somewhere to be tortured right or you're
00:49:07
not going to tie me up while you torture somebody else but the best advice that you've given is that don't get in a car
00:49:13
don't if you're already outside don't go in a place that's not outside right stay
00:49:18
as close to the public or outside as you possibly can okay this is this is strange because we have the
00:49:26
investigators who are very firm on the idea that Mick never saw his killer that the killer likely never saw Mick's face
00:49:34
until after he had already shot him they say that there is everything to indicate
00:49:41
that Mick was reaching for a small white ceramic house on a shelf when he was shot at close range in the back of the
00:49:49
head this is curious for a couple reasons one could you have a situation where he's busy just stocking a shelf or
00:49:58
moving things around going about his normal business his normal daily routine and the killer comes into this is a
00:50:06
small store comes into the small store you know mixes just one minute I'll be right with you and before he can turn
00:50:14
around boom shot to the back of the head or is this a situation where the killer
00:50:20
came in maybe had the gun concealed and needed just enough time to pull out the gun said hey I would like to look at
00:50:27
this item or could you hand you know how can I help you sir could you hand me that and he turns around and then he
00:50:34
shot so I don't know why I think right but I think the customer ruse trick makes so much sense because you could
00:50:41
you learned so much about the store within minutes of being inside and even if another customer came in you just
00:50:50
have to wait them out so you you would know that the store was empty most of these stores have little dingers
00:50:58
on the door so you would know if somebody else came in and you would get the lay of the land
00:51:05
real quickly or within a couple questions like we were saying before MH to know that this ended individuals by
00:51:12
by themselves and you would think after the the last attack if in fact the Killer really wants to only walk into a
00:51:21
situation or kill in a situation where there's just one employee working that maybe they go in under the
00:51:29
rul of being a customer to confirm right that in fact that there's nobody else in
00:51:35
the in the building itself I don't know how much I believe that that the killer never saw Mick's
00:51:44
face or that Mick never saw the killer I I again we don't know what information the police have to kind of sound like
00:51:52
they're pretty firm on this idea MH I question this for several reasons because what I think we're dealing with
00:52:00
here captain and I've I've not really been good at hiding this for at all because I don't want to I
00:52:08
don't know that I think that robbery is the primary motive here I see a series of killings where it sounds to me and
00:52:16
looks to me like killing might be the motivation might be what this guy is after and the robbery is just something
00:52:23
that takes place during in this goal of killing I don't think if and if that in fact is true there's no reason for me to
00:52:34
believe that this guy walks into this little store and all of a sudden discovers oh it's a man working not a
00:52:40
woman and then walks out that's a possibility but I think we're dealing with a guy that once he's made up his
00:52:46
mind he's going to strike he strikes so what we have here is we have Mick maau is shot once and in the back
00:52:55
of the head with a 22 caliber gun the there was still a small amount of money in the
00:53:03
register so again the robbery motive is very weird here but macau's wallet was gone however police found $15 in macau's
00:53:14
pocket so the killer took the time to take the wallet but didn't check the pockets his body was discovered by a
00:53:22
customer around 415 p.m. the investigation seemed Feud it was as if a ghost had walked in shot the
00:53:33
man and then left leaving no trace of himself behind it was virtually and this is coming from the words of the
00:53:41
investigators on this case it was virtually a Cold Case before the end of the week the killer walks in boom kills
00:53:49
the guy leaves no evidence behind and walks out and leaves they've got got nothing to work with well and it doesn't
00:53:58
take I was just thinking about this I mean if you go to these even small towns to find a location where there's a strip
00:54:05
mall or whatever it wouldn't take you long to I mean a couple passes up and down the strip mall to to see who's
00:54:13
working who's not working what store has a lot of people what store seems very not you know not busy during that time
00:54:22
well and if you've mastered your ruse as a customer as you and I keep kind of hinting toward you may not even have to
00:54:29
watch the store at all you walk in and if it's not what you want maybe you leave right you know it's it's it's
00:54:35
again it's one of those situations I do believe though if the if everything seems right to this guy once he decides
00:54:42
to strike he strikes now the thing that might turn him off or the thing that might make him abort this mission is
00:54:50
walking in and finding himself in a busy store but if you're in front of a small
00:54:55
storefront a small store and there's one car or no cars you got a pretty good idea what's going on inside those walls
00:55:03
yeah or or you don't like the situation it's as simple as oh I forgot my wallet or you guys have a nice day and you you
00:55:12
walk away your store sucks walk out I I believe that if they would took this composite which eventually they have and
00:55:20
and they start connecting these cases together that if they would to ask about other other stores if they saw this
00:55:28
individual in their store they might get lucky with some eyewitnesses you know going into other
00:55:36
stores and not being a place that he wanted to be involved with or again you know we have evidence that this guy is
00:55:44
stalking his Target and I think it wouldn't be that hard from a distance to get a lay of the land the location as
00:55:55
with the others will be important this small store was located at 2615 South Third Street in terot Indiana this was
00:56:05
just a 2-minute drive .9 miles from Interstate [Music] 70 and if you're ever curious what what we
00:56:28
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00:56:35
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00:56:45
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