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Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks for listening. I'm your host Nick and
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with me as always, ladies and gentlemen, not since the time of Conan the Barbarian and Destroyer have we seen a
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force so disruptive. This is the Captain. Well, I did bring my sword, so watch what you say. It's good to be seen
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and it's good to see you. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend. Today we are drinking Peroni by Macro
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Brewery in beautiful Roma, Italy. Garage grade three and a half bottle caps out of five. Peroni Original is brewed using
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not only the best ingredients, but the same recipe since 1846. And my favorite word to describe Peroni
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is crisp. This is a crisp beer. You know how at the bottom of the refrigerator there's that little drawer that says
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crisper on it? Well, you won't have to put your Peroni bottles in there because it comes crisp straight from the
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brewery. Don't you tell me what to do with my damn bottles. And this beer is brought to us by some crispy garage
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critters. First up we have Esther and Spencer from Chicago who says they are frequent visitors to our great state of
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Ohio listening to True Crime Garage all the way. And a big cheers to Pat from the Boston
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area. We also have Sarah Lou from Portland, Oregon. She asked, "Why don't you guys have a glass of wine in the
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garage?" My answer would be, "Well, I don't know, Sarah." You know, and today might have been a good opportunity
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seeing how we're flying the old garage ship to Italy. So maybe that's something we'll have to keep in mind. Regardless,
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cheers to you. Well, my answer would be I I sometimes have a little bit of a problem with drinking wine.
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I I drink too much of it. Next we have Rebecca from Well, let's see if I can nail this on the first attempt, Captain.
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Mississauga, Ontario, Canada. So if I got it wrong, I apologize to all the good people of Mississauga including
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Rebecca. That That doesn't even sound right. Next, back in the states, we say hi to Vanessa from Greenville,
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Tennessee. Vanessa says she loves the show. The Captain is hilarious. So an old tip of the old cap to the Captain. I
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think she meant hilarious looking. And last but not least, we have Shannon from Fisher, Illinois. So thanks to everybody
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for filling up the fridge. And if you want to tip the old cap to the Captain next week, go to truecrimegarage.com
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Check out the store page. We have some t-shirts. Uh I got some little goodies for
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the iTunes store. That's enough of the business. Everybody gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer. Let's talk some
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true crime. You should have told everybody to grab their sword. Florence is the capital city of the
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region of Tuscany. Florence was the center of trade and finance during the Middle Ages and was
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considered one of the wealthiest cities of that era. It is considered to be the birthplace of
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the Renaissance. Today it is a city known for its architecture, famous monuments, and
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Renaissance art. Each year millions of tourists flock to the area. Florence is one of the most beautiful
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cities in the world. But amongst all of this culture and beauty lies a stain. Gruesome and ugly stain
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that has permanently left its mark on Florence and scarred the city forever. Because in the second half of the 20th
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century, something awoke a monster that was sleeping in the hills outside of the
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great city. For nearly 20 years, the monster crept in the dark under a moonless sky
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ambushing its prey. Over a dozen people were murdered while making love in parked cars in the hills
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of Florence. This monster has not only ended many lives, but destroyed families and
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terrified the hundreds of thousands that live in the area. It does not take supernatural insight
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into the dark side of the human soul to see absolute evil that not only lies within, but oozes from the monster.
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Over 100,000 men have been investigated. Over a dozen men have been arrested. And countless lives have been ruined by
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false accusations. There have been suicides, exhumations, poisonings, body parts sent in the mail,
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and seances in graveyards. It quickly became clear to the entire country that Florence now
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had its very own serial killer. A killer unique to the area, but disturbingly familiar to us in the
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United States. The monster's murderous crimes are hauntingly similar to that of the Son of
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Sam, the Phantom Killer of Texarkana, and the Zodiac. But unlike his evil American brothers,
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no one would survive the Monster of Florence. For us, our story starts on Saturday,
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September 14th, 1974. Just about 40 km outside of Florence. A young man, 19 years old, named
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Pasquale, who worked at a local bar, spent that evening with his lovely young girlfriend, Stefania,
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who was only 18 years old. After a few hours at one of their favorite spots, a local disco club, the
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two hopped in Pasquale's small car, a blue Fiat 127, and drove off into the night.
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The young man knew he had to have his sweetheart home at a reasonable hour. But before dropping her off, the two
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were looking for a little privacy. So they went and parked the car in a secluded area near a lake.
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Sometime just before 11:45 p.m., a dark figure approached the vehicle. There was no moon that night, so it was
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particularly dark out. The dark figure got very close to the car's driver's side door.
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The couple likely did not see this as they were quite busy. Suddenly, five gunshots broke the
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night's silence. Pasquale was hit all five times at a close range. Once in the heart and four times in the
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body. Then, four more gunshots, all hitting Stefania. None in vital parts of her body.
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The dark figure, the monster, walks around to the passenger side door, pulls the door open and grabs Stefania
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and pulls her out of the car. The monster throws her to the ground just behind the car near the tailpipe.
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The monster pulls out a knife and lunges toward the very badly injured girl. And
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with this very sharp knife, he stabs her 96 times. The monster then violated the woman's
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corpse after he grabbed the necklace from around Stefania's neck and yanked it off of her.
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The monster picks up Stefania's purse and dumps the contents on the ground. Before leaving, he walks over to
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Pasquale, who has by now died from the gunshot wounds. The monster stabs Pasquale five times.
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Their bodies were discovered the next day by a farmer. This is True Crime Garage.
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And this is the Monster of Florence. The Monster of Florence, Captain, one of a very famous case worldwide. And the
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first double homicide that we're going to discuss is the one that took place in 1974 described right there by our
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wonderful narrator. I don't know who that guy is. He's very very talented. You should see him. He was he was
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reading that, telling that story, and playing the cello at the same time. Blew my mind.
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Yeah, blindfolded. Blindfolded. The thing here is, Captain, so let's go through that crime. Let's talk about
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what evidence may have been found and if there were any leads in that double homicide of the two young people that
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were shot that night in their car. Now, a little bit of background on the two young people, well, they they had a
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long-term relationship. This was not a one-night fling. I know they were very young. Pasquale was only 19 and Stefania
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was 18 at the time. But they were high school sweethearts. They had been together for some time and they were out
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enjoying the evening together and then they're gunned down in their vehicle. Mhm. Um as far as the autopsy goes and
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the findings of that, you know, we already said that Pasquale he he was already dead when he was stabbed. He was
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shot first and then for some reason the killer went back to him and stabbed him five times.
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As for Stefania, she was shot four times and then stabbed. There's there's two different uh arguments here. One being
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that she was stabbed 96 times, the other that she was stabbed 97 times. Who knows? I mean, that's a lot of stab
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wounds. I don't know if you're going to be able to determine if exactly how many
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it was. Right. Regardless, um it was determined that the first three times that she was stabbed is what
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actually killed her. And it is believed by the investigators that the remaining 93 or 94 stab wounds were made
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postmortem. And most of these stab wounds focused on the female areas of the body. A lot of them being what
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people would typically dub superficial stab wounds. Yeah, there's going to be some very gruesome stuff in this
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episode. Just a warning there. Well, I'm glad that you dropped that warning because uh another very strange thing
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about this crime, uh the killer had placed a vine shoot inside the female victim.
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Placed the what? A vine shoot. Like a some kind of vegetation that would have been growing in the area. Okay. Um the
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authorities did find, as far as evidence goes, they did find shell casings at the
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crime scene. All of these came from bullets that were used in a Beretta handgun. They were .22 caliber long
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rifle bullets. And both the ammo and the gun are commonly used guns or commonly owned
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guns in this area. Mhm. And as we mentioned Stefania's necklace, uh it must have been stolen.
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Um she It was reported that she was wearing it that night and it was not found at the crime scene. Uh the
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investigators found Stefania's bra and purse about 200 m from the murder scene. Remember, we had said that the killer
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had taken her purse and dumped the contents of it onto the ground. Now, more than one witness driving in
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that area that night reported hearing gunshots around 11:45 p.m. And judging by reports of what time the
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couple left the disco, the investigators believe that the couple were parked at the location for about an hour or so
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before the shooting took place. As for leads, well, there were there were a few, but
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as you will see, there is not much detailed information for investigators to work with here.
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So, yes, uh two of Stefania's friends came forward in the investigation. One says that on the day that the couple was
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killed, Stefania told a friend that she had a strange encounter with a man that had scared her. Now, Stefania failed or
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did not give any further detail about the man. You know, didn't mention if she knew his name.
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But what what was the situation? Didn't give a description of the man or didn't even say what had terrified her about
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this situation. So, it was just basically, I met this guy, he freaked me out, and that's it.
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Yeah, or I was I was I was here and this happened. It was a very brief thing, but
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it was enough for after she was killed for her friend to come forward and say, "By the way, she happened to mention
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this casually to me the day that she was killed." Mhm. Okay, the next lead again
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comes from a friend of Stefania's, a a different friend, says that the couple had been in somewhat of a secluded area
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just days earlier. Uh Pasquale was giving Stefania a driving lesson. Mhm. Uh but they said that a man had followed
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them. They believed that a man had followed them to the location and was watching them during the course of this
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uh so-called driving lesson. Um the thing here is though, this again, it's one of those things that you know,
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when when you are talking to your friends and when you're talking to your family and something weird happens to
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you that day, it might only be just a weird little thing that happens, right? But then if when a crime like this takes
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place just days later, all of a sudden it's a big thing that you're wondering, "Well, why didn't I nudge that person
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further? Why didn't I say, 'What kind of car did you see?'" Right, right. "What color was the vehicle? What did
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the man look like? Was it somebody you knew?" You know, uh these are things that happen to us in our daily lives and
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we, you know, kind of casually tell our friends and family about it. The other lead, um this came from
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several people. Came from a bunch of young couples that would park in the same area where the couple was killed.
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These couples told investigators that they had often seen men watching them. Uh voyeurs observing the couples as they
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were being romantic in their vehicles. A bunch of peeping Toms. Is what you're saying?
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Thank thank you, Captain. Uh here's what I think is funny about this. Yeah, we we knew this guy was
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watching. And it didn't stop you? Um well, the thing here that that was that was obvious to me very quickly in
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this case that that was foreign to me um because not being, you know, from the area or even familiar with it, I didn't
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realize that there's a whole community of this going on in Italy. And if anybody in Italy is listening to the
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show and they're thinking that I'm speaking out of turn, I'm only going off of all of the information that I've
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consumed. So, what are you saying? I mean, you say there's a community. What I've been
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told, okay, from everything that I've read and found and watched, is that there's there's two things going on
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here. Um that that during the times of these crimes, um that a lot of young people would would remain living with
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their parents until they went off and got married. So, these people that are in long-term relationships or or in love
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with somebody and they want time alone with this person, it's very common that they would spend an evening or a couple
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of hours in in in a vehicle parked somewhere. Well, this is pretty common in the states as well, right? Well,
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yeah, but I but I got the vibe that it was it's happening a lot, you know, like like overwhelmingly
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uh compared to how it's happening here. You are just you're going to have to finish the show. I'm going to have to
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get my plane ticket. Oh, now you sound like one of the peeping Toms. So, I'm No, who said I wanted to be the one of
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the peeping Toms? I was going to get my own car and go out there. Have some fun. Rent a big car
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with some leg room. Yeah. The thing here is, Captain, though, what this has what this has inspired, let's
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say, is now you have a bunch of men that go out in the evening and they watch these young couples. You know, they kind
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of Yeah, they kind of hide in the bushes, hide in the woods, and Flicky flicky. and watch these young
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couples. I've even heard that, you know, you know, as more recently, that some people have,
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you know, brought technology into this quote-unquote hobby. Now, amongst these peeping Toms or voyeurs, they call each
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other Indians. I guess that's some kind of term that they've come up with. I've seen it used in many reports regarding
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these crimes. However, I think it's a it's a degrading the Indian population by using
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that name. The pilgrims never talked about the Indians like being peeping Toms. no complaints of
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being watched from a from the Chief peeping Tom. So, we won't call them that. We'll just call them peeping
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Toms. We'll call them watchers. Uh but regardless, when we speak of these people, you'll call them watchers.
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who we are talking about. Or losers. Well, according to uh newspaper reports, uh one of the
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mysteries surrounding the murders that investigators thought would really help point them toward the perpetrator of
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this crime is that the investigators wanted to know this a simple answer to a complicated question, in my opinion.
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Okay. Was the killer waiting for just any couple to arrive in this area, or was the killer waiting for this
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specific couple to arrive? Or did the killer just happen to come across them and kill them? I think there
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needs to be more questions there. I think you're right. I think the other question would be what I think is more
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likely is, you know, was this individual was this peeping Tom as and he's not at this
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point that the killer we don't know is a peeping Tom. Right. But was he just you
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know, was he stalking them? Was he following them? Because the the idea that yeah, if look if this is happening
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in a bunch of points and you got you know, make out lane over here and make out look out you know, make out mountain
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over here. You can just sit there all night if you want. But that works I think as far as a peeping
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Tom not a professional. Um but I'm just saying that's what I think a peeping Tom would do just let's
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go to the area that people are making out or fornicating and let's hang out there.
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To me as far as the murder is concerned it'd be I follow these people. I went to the
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disco with them. They left the disco. I followed them out here. I think you bring up a good point because we see at
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least two of her friends coming forward stating that there was something that had taken place
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in the days leading up to the murder where Stefania thought something weird was going on being followed being
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watched or strange encounter with some some weird dude. Um and I think you're right Captain. I
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think that they they didn't ask enough questions as well and and one question I have regarding this particular crime
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would be why why would the killer stab the boy after he was dead. I mean he had shot
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him five times by that point and then he goes back and stabs him another five times. I I don't know why but my my
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question Well, possibly just a adrenaline, right? You're exactly right. Could be adrenaline but I also wondered
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if he wanted to make sure that the the boy was dead. Right. That he had some concern that he left him alive. Now why
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would he be concerned? Well, one his mission was to go out obviously and kill these two young people but two
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was he was he worried that he could be identified if he left anybody alive? Did did they happen to know him?
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Had they seen him before or was there something about him that would give himself away as far as his identity?
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Well, I mean at the end of the day if you leave somebody alive there's always a possibility that they're able to
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identify you later. And then the other thing is the overkill with the female victim.
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He degrades her and and stabs her over 90 times. That usually indicates some type of personal relationship or some
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kind of previous relationship with the victim. Yeah, I mean I see that but I also see
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that you know, that victim could be a symbol for something Mhm. greater you know, where it's like maybe just a
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hatred towards women and and so you know, that victim is it's not so much that he hates that victim
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it's she's the symbol for every female that he's ever hated or that has ever tormented him or didn't give him enough
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attention or maybe it's mom issues. Well, and to me the other thing here Captain is what what I think is
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absolutely terrifying is that rather than him being concerned rather than the killer or killers being
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concerned that they might be observed by somebody else or that another couple might pull up in a
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vehicle or they could have been spotted by somebody rather than being concerned about that the killer seemed to be more
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focused and concerned about actually finishing the job about he had an idea of what he wanted to go out and do it's
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it's almost ritualistic in a way Yeah. and he was going to continue and finish this job no matter what. He was going to
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take his time do what he felt he had to do before leaving the area. But he's also again if he is concerned about you
00:24:05
know, somebody coming up on lovers lane or something this guy has a knife and he
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has a gun. You know, so what is he worried about? The other strange thing here Captain and this
00:24:16
on. I was just going to say I don't think a murderer you know, after he's done murdering somebody is scared that
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he's going to be murdered. Well, I meant spotted that he would be identified or there would be witnesses
00:24:28
to something. Well, yeah and that's kind of hard to know just cuz we don't know the exact layout of where they're at.
00:24:35
Like how open was it? Was there a bunch of was it a big field? Was it you know, was there some trees blocking the
00:24:41
entrance? Who knows? One thing I also wondered about and this is a detail that's not widely reported
00:24:48
but later Stefania's grave was vandalized. And I don't have details on how it was vandalized just that it was
00:24:56
it was vandalized. Now that makes you wonder and question was this a coincidence? Does this or does this
00:25:01
further point to that the killer may have known her and had had hatreds toward her or coincidence because
00:25:08
sometimes stupid people just do bad dumb things and it could be completely unrelated to the crime. Yeah or it could
00:25:15
be something where somebody read something in the paper and they're just a sicko. And they're like let's let's
00:25:21
deface if we deface her grave then then people are going to be talking about this. We'll start some rumors. Well, the
00:25:28
investigators continue to look for the killer or killers of the young couple despite the few leads that they have to
00:25:35
go on. Now just under 7 years later on Saturday June 6th, 1981. This is just about 15 km outside of Florence. A
00:25:46
couple who'd been together for quite some time went out for ice cream. This is 30-year-old Giovanni and his
00:25:52
girlfriend Carmela who is just 21 at the time. They went out for you know, it's it's June, right? So it's nice and warm
00:26:00
out and even though it's late at night, let's go out and get some ice cream. It's about 10:00 that night. After they
00:26:07
go out they decide that they're going to go and park at a place that is again frequented by other couples looking for
00:26:15
privacy but also a location that is frequented by these peeping Toms or voyeurs. Mhm. So while they are parked
00:26:23
there they they are attacked. Uh investigators have reason to believe the man was attacked first. Giovanni was
00:26:31
shot three times. Once in the heart, once in the lung and then in the head. Carmela was shot five
00:26:39
times. One of these shots was at point-blank range to the chest. This was the death blow.
00:26:46
After she is shot the monster pulls Carmela from the vehicle and over to an embankment about 12 m away. Then he cuts
00:26:56
her jeans all the way up to the belt. I couldn't find where a report of where this cut started at what location you
00:27:05
know, low on the jeans. I'm guessing quite low on the jeans because you know, maybe even the bottom of the
00:27:11
pant leg or legs because for what was about to take place the jeans would have had to have been basically removed. Uh
00:27:19
I'm going to say this as politely as I can without leaving anything to question but the killer removed the pubic area of
00:27:27
the female victim. This was done at the previous crime as well. Um again the killer opens up the purse and
00:27:37
scatters the contents on the ground and just like at the first crime scene the monster stabs the male victim
00:27:45
postmortem. So there's a lot of evidence that maybe it's the same killer or possibly a
00:27:50
copycat killer. I mean we we're talking about the first crime happening in '74 and now this crime has taken place in
00:27:57
1981. There's a lot more to get into and we'll get right back to this after this
00:28:02
quick beer break. All right, cheers mates. Cheers everybody for filling up the fridge and
00:28:34
the the beer fund. Cheers to you. The the bodies were found by a policeman out walking with his son
00:28:43
the following day. Uh at this time the male victim was still in the car and the driver side door window was shattered.
00:28:52
Mhm. When investigators found Carmela she was as we said at an embankment. Now this was about 12 m away from the
00:29:00
vehicle. So the first question that comes to mind here Captain is you know would you say that the perpetrator
00:29:08
appears to be relatively strong or at the very least in good physical condition? 12 m away from the vehicle
00:29:16
would be about 39 ft. Now I I don't know any of the uh you know, height or weight
00:29:24
of this woman of Carmela. However, I've seen pictures of her. She appears to be of average height and weight. But that
00:29:31
still seems 39 ft seems like a considerable distance to carry somebody that probably weighs 100 to 115 lb.
00:29:40
Right but he you know, maybe not carry he might have dragged. Well, that that was one thing that I was
00:29:46
curious about because um you know, there were there were no drag marks found on the ground or the body according to the
00:29:53
evidence that I reviewed. Yeah, but again it's it's all about terrain. I mean, if if we're talking about a rocky
00:29:59
area, then then you're going to see some of that on the body, but if we're talking about a you know, grassy
00:30:05
the grassy knoll, right? You're not going to see you know, the marks on her body. You know, you
00:30:12
could drag somebody through the grass and it's not going to you know, mess up the body. And none of the
00:30:17
evidence pointed towards anything as as far as mud or dirt on the hands and knees or the bottom of her feet or
00:30:24
shoes, but I guess that information is not necessary because you know, there they're stating that she died from that
00:30:31
point-blank gunshot to the chest and died in the car, then obviously she didn't walk or crawl 39 feet away. Well,
00:30:38
right. And I think as far as the detectives go, yeah, is is this murderer is he does he have some strength? Is he
00:30:45
able to pick her up, put her on the shoulder, carry carry her wherever he needs to, right?
00:30:51
Or is he dragging the body? Or is there two suspects? Right. So, that that'd be the
00:30:58
other question. I'm not suggesting that this man, if it is a single perpetrator,
00:31:03
I'm not suggesting that he needs to be a hulking person, you know, a giant man. I'm just simply saying that you could
00:31:10
you could probably if it's a sole perpetrator, you could probably rule out a a 79-year-old man or a or a very small
00:31:18
man that maybe only weighs 110 lb. The thing here though, remember we discussed in the first crime It could be a very
00:31:26
strong small man. Built like a fireplug. In the first crime, the necklace was stolen from the female victim. In this
00:31:35
crime, Carmela's necklace was found at the scene. However, it had been laid across her mouth. So,
00:31:43
her mouth is open, Right. and I don't know if it was I'm guessing that the necklace would have been broken, you
00:31:50
know, yanked off of her neck rather than someone taking the time to unclasp it. But it was laid so it would be going
00:31:57
across her mouth or or through her teeth if you want to say that, almost creating
00:32:02
some kind of smile with the with the necklace there. Both victims were stabbed in the abdomen
00:32:09
as well. So, I mean, there's again, you know, I know where I know there's somebody out there right now
00:32:15
going, "It's a true crime show. You don't need to tell people." No, look, I'm trying to
00:32:20
if this is too much for you, try a different episode. So, we have a lot of mutilation as far
00:32:26
as the pubic area goes, but above that in the lower abdomen, there's a lot of stab wounds as well.
00:32:33
And and that happened on both victims. Yeah. So, so what's the motive of that? That that that is my question. You know,
00:32:42
it again, it almost seems with the removal it almost seems like that's some kind of
00:32:47
ritualistic aspect to these crimes. The investigators has been widely reported in this particular crime that
00:32:55
the investigators believe that the couple saw or detected the presence of the monster before they were attacked.
00:33:02
They have reason or more likely they probably have evidence to believe that the couple was trying to flee when they
00:33:10
were attacked. With a car? Trying to flee with the car or Well, I think okay, so I have a I have somewhat of a
00:33:20
description of the state that the bodies were found in, okay? The the male victim,
00:33:27
his his pants were not all the way on, okay? So, it what what the the investigators believe is that he was
00:33:37
compromised because he was not dressed, but he was trying to get dressed uh and flee
00:33:44
the scene. You know, that maybe maybe he was trying to get dressed and then trying to start the car.
00:33:50
Other than the other than him pulling up his pants, I don't know what other evidence they had to suggest this to
00:33:58
them other than it's been reported as such. I'm I'm guessing that they had more evidence to point towards this.
00:34:04
Maybe they found the key in the ignition. Maybe they you know, the key was in his hand, you know, there's
00:34:10
there's anything there's these little bits and fragments and pieces that we will we may never know, but it's always
00:34:17
been reported that they believe that they they had detected or heard or seen somebody approaching the car.
00:34:23
Well, that'd make me wonder. Okay, a couple things. When somebody's going to go park with their significant other,
00:34:30
normally like I said, you you park in an area and there's some kind of you know, blockade at the entrance, you
00:34:38
know, like maybe some trees or something. So, but you're going to park far enough away from the entrance that
00:34:43
when you see you know, headlights, Mhm. then it kind of gives you a warning. Okay, okay, got
00:34:49
to put my Jimmy away, right? So, what I'm wondering about this this attack is did they park far enough away
00:34:59
and did they have some headlights come in and then they go, "Okay, we we got to get decent, you know, we don't know if
00:35:06
this is a cop or not." That that to me seems more likely than you know, this individual just rolling
00:35:14
up on them and shining a flashlight. Right. You know, because if he's trying you know, what sense would it make if he
00:35:23
was parked somewhere else or just got there by foot and started approaching the vehicle with the light
00:35:30
flashing towards them. Mhm. You know, unless he wanted to create more fear. Maybe he wanted to
00:35:35
see that fear. But so, then I'm now I'm wondering, do we have other vehicle, you know, tire tread or what?
00:35:44
Well, we we don't have any of that. We don't have any evidence of that here. And but you bring up a good question
00:35:50
because with the first murder scene, the bra of the female victim and the purse are found 200 m away from the vehicle.
00:35:58
So, that would suggest that this individual is walking. That that was my first initial thought and then I
00:36:04
recalled some some information that we gathered from Theodore Bundy, who when he talked about
00:36:10
his crimes Let's call him Ted. When when Ted would leave the the crime scene, the
00:36:15
murder scene where he was dumping a body, and he would take a lot of the females um
00:36:22
identification and any of their personal items with him. And he said, you know, they they thought he was some kind of
00:36:29
mastermind of going undetected. How did you go so undetected for so many years? What did you do with their stuff? Did
00:36:37
you burn it? Did you bury it? He goes, "No. I just simply drove away from the crime
00:36:42
scene from the murder scene, and I would randomly toss an item out the car window
00:36:46
as I was driving. Once I got far enough away, I just randomly tossed these things out. They have a way of
00:36:53
disappearing." Now, he had the benefit Bundy had the benefit of the bodies not being found for a considerable amount of
00:37:00
time. Here we see two crime scenes where the bodies are found the very next day.
00:37:05
Almost as if somebody takes little to no precaution, does not mind them being found. And again, we talk about the
00:37:12
mutilation to the female victim. It's almost that somebody not only does he have this ritual, but he also has
00:37:21
a need to to shock and disturb whoever's going to find or see these bodies because he leaves the victim, the female
00:37:28
victim outside of the vehicle. Yeah. Yeah, or was she outside of the vehicle when she he approached them? Were they
00:37:36
both outside of the vehicle? Well, they can determine that she was killed inside the car.
00:37:41
Based off of blood splatter. Is that Blood and bullets and all that that that type of evidence. They can
00:37:49
determine that she was killed inside the vehicle. And then the first and removed and same
00:37:53
same scenario in the first crime. In the in the first and and what we have here,
00:37:57
the key piece of evidence to really connect these, you know, is this a copycat or the same person is the
00:38:03
the shell casings are very similar. And and both of these murders. Yeah, and we couldn't tell you the story of the
00:38:10
monster of Florence without discussing a a fine gentleman and captain I like this guy a lot. This
00:38:16
is Mario Spezi. Mario worked for one of the area's more prominent newspaper publications. He
00:38:23
spent he was sent to this crime scene the day after the murder when the bodies were found to cover the story. Okay. And
00:38:32
here is a brief version of Mario's account of what he saw when he arrived on the scene that day. He says, "The boy
00:38:39
seemed to be sleeping in the driver's seat, his head leaning on the window. Only a little black mark on his temple,
00:38:47
and the car window shattered by a bullet, indicating that it was a crime scene. The girl's body lay some feet
00:38:55
behind the car at the foot of a little embankment amid scattered wildflowers. She had also been shot and was on her
00:39:04
back naked except for a gold chain, which had fallen between her lips." Now, according to Mario, everything at
00:39:13
the scene was unnaturally composed, um immobile. There were no signs of struggle or confusion. And I found this
00:39:23
I found this to be very interesting because you know, when we spoke with prosecutor Juan Martinez, who who
00:39:29
prosecuted Jodi Arias back in that was episode 23 of of True Crime Garage, available in the iTunes store, shameless
00:39:38
plug there. But when we spoke with Juan Martinez, remember he said that in his jurisdiction, what they do as
00:39:45
prosecutors is when there's a murder scene or they they whoever the prosecutor that gets that case is sent
00:39:52
to the crime scene relatively quickly after the discovery of of the victim. And he said that one thing you know, so
00:40:00
this guy's been to dozens and dozens of murder scenes as well as Mario Spezi who's covering these murders and crimes
00:40:07
in Italy. Mhm. And both of them had the same thing. They're saying that when we show up to these murder scenes, one
00:40:13
thing that is obvious to us is an obvious sign of a violent struggle. You know, that there's usually blood smears,
00:40:20
there's furniture that's knocked over, there's things that are broken, there's things scattered on the floor. Uh it's
00:40:26
an obvious sign of a violent struggle. Where Spezi is saying the thing that was different for him about this crime and
00:40:33
he knew immediately that this was going to be different from anything that he's ever investigated before or reported on
00:40:39
before was that when he arrives at this crime scene, it's it's composed. It there is no sign
00:40:46
of violent struggle. This is simply somebody came upon these people and attacked them and killed them very
00:40:54
quickly and precisely. Well, I I can't remember every detail cuz it seemed so long ago. But uh you know, the
00:41:01
first case we ever covered in the garage and I I do remember sweating a lot. I do remember sweating a lot. I also
00:41:09
remember uh that's when you you didn't understand the idea that you had to talk into the mic so you just kind of walk
00:41:15
around the garage. Mhm. I wanted it to be a walking show. You've confined me to a chair.
00:41:21
Yeah, you need to well, peo- people need to be able to hear you. Um So, but in that case, we covered the
00:41:28
Phantom Killer and there was there's several attacks, which is that's kind of what we got going on here.
00:41:35
But there is some of those attacks, there was a struggle and some there weren't. Right. A- A- so so right now we
00:41:41
have two two attacks. No sign of struggle pretty much on either one. Mhm. Uh to me,
00:41:48
that's why I don't I don't put any weight into the investigator saying that they saw the attacker.
00:41:57
Therefore, they're trying to get away. Right. Like I I don't put a lot of weight in
00:42:01
there because to me, we we also have a shattered driver's side window. Mhm. So to me, this guy is stalking from a
00:42:10
distance. Right. Approaching them. And you know, depending on how how bright it is outside
00:42:18
or how much his eyes are able to adapt to the darkness, uh maybe there is a light on in the car,
00:42:25
who knows. Right. Um Or maybe the car's still running. Then I think this individual is just
00:42:33
stalking from a distance, coming up and that first shot is through that window and hitting the
00:42:39
male in this attack. And I think you're right here, Captain. I think he the killer got the jump on
00:42:46
them, let's say, because because all of these shots hit a target. They weren't, you know, immediate death
00:42:54
shots, but they all hit a target. So, either this guy's a super you know, super marksman or he's very
00:43:02
close to the vehicle, very close to these victims when he's shooting at them. Yeah, and well, we have evidence
00:43:08
that some of the the some of the wounds are, you know, what's it called? Uh point-blank range.
00:43:16
Right. So, So yeah, I would assume that you have some of those and so maybe these other and now this is '80 '81. So,
00:43:26
maybe the forensics isn't up to par with what we have now. So, they might not be
00:43:31
able to tell you how exactly far away he was. But I'm I'm guessing this guy wasn't any more than 5 ft away. Right.
00:43:38
And possibly right up on the window Right. even. And you pointed out some obvious signs of of
00:43:44
links, you know, of of similarities into the previous crime. A couple of other things that we haven't mentioned yet
00:43:51
though, you know, the first crime takes place in the month of September, this one in the month of June. So, both
00:43:57
warmer months. Um they also take place on a Saturday night as well as moonless nights. So,
00:44:06
these would be nights that would be particularly dark out. Mhm. Uh both both on a both on a weekend.
00:44:11
it means there. Um and in the warmer months. Now, Mario Spezi as I said is a seasoned and might I add a very talented
00:44:20
investigative journalist. He is covering the case and his article covering the crime, well, it became a newspaper
00:44:28
sensation. And eventually he revealed that a serial killer was stalking the countryside of
00:44:34
Florence. The newspaper pointed to something that the police had overlooked. This killing, this double
00:44:40
homicide was similar to the double homicide that had taken place in the hills north of Florence back in 1974.
00:44:47
That's the first crime we discussed. Right. The um the this prompted the police to compare
00:44:54
the shells, the bullet casings recovered from both crime scenes. They discovered
00:45:00
that the bullets had been fired in fact by the same gun. Yes, it was a .22 caliber Beretta firing Winchester H
00:45:08
series with a copper jacket, which according to the ballistics experts, not only came from the same gun, but very
00:45:15
likely came from the same box of 50 bullets. Mhm. Uh so the the gun the this gun had a defect. Uh
00:45:25
it had a defective firing pin that left an unmistakable mark on the rim of each shell. So now, you know, they know that
00:45:34
this is a one-of-a-kind marking. So there's no question this is the same gun. So now they have a huge
00:45:40
breakthrough, but of course, a scary one. And Spezi appears to be right in his assessment that Florence is dealing
00:45:48
with a serial killer. Well, and what I think is so scary is the time that has elapsed. I mean, '74 to '81, that's a
00:45:55
long period. And what other crimes might have happened during that that we that we're not aware of. Mhm. The police
00:46:02
report also noted that the killer had used a particular knife with a special notch in it. And Spezi
00:46:10
throughout his time covering the case would come to the conclusion that this was probably what he calls a scuba
00:46:16
knife. Scuba Steve. Yeah, I I don't know really what that means, scuba knife. I mean, I'm guessing
00:46:23
it has some ridges on one side. Correct. Well, following Spezi's breakthrough in the case, the excitement
00:46:30
of the readers of the newspaper was through the roof. They wanted to learn more about the crimes, more about
00:46:37
the monster and more about any possible leads in the case. Mhm. Uh Spezi wrote many many articles about the crimes and
00:46:44
poss- and possible suspects. During some periods, he was releasing an article a day about the case. Once Spezi
00:46:53
wrote about one suspect who was a priest who frequented prostitutes for the thrill of shaving their pubic hair.
00:47:00
What? Yeah, he also wrote about a psychic what? Yeah. I said there was a priest that liked to visit prostitutes. To
00:47:09
shave them. To shave their pubic hair. That was his his fetish and Spezi thought that it was worth telling the
00:47:17
community about because he thought it was a strange enough fetish that it might carry over to something that the
00:47:22
monster was doing. He also wrote about pay you to shave you. No. No, thank you. He also wrote about a psychic who spent
00:47:31
a night in the cemetery where one of the victims were buried. The psychic claimed to be sending and
00:47:38
receiving messages from the dead. And Captain, you know how much via email or was it
00:47:46
Was that USPS? Stamps.com. Walkie-talkie. Uh You Captain, you know how much some of
00:47:52
the listeners love it when I or or better we bring up psychics, right? So, I couldn't when I came across this
00:47:57
portion of the story, I couldn't help myself and had to include cuz you're That's what you're
00:48:02
That's your weekend job. Yeah. Makes a psychic on the side. Yeah, if you I mean, call the show. I'll do a
00:48:08
reading. The public was now reading about the crimes almost daily and discussing them
00:48:14
at bars, around water coolers and in many social settings and they loved talk about this in garages, I heard.
00:48:21
Yeah, they and they loved to indulge in the wild speculation. They were getting a lot of wild speculation from Spezi's
00:48:28
articles and I think that might be why they were so popular. Now, later that year, Mario Spezi was actually the one
00:48:35
who named the killer the Monster of Florence. Yeah, which is such an interesting name because when you think
00:48:41
Florence, you think love and romance and all this stuff and then to toss in, you
00:48:45
know, such a bad word. Mhm. You know. Well, he had covered other like European serial killer. So,
00:48:51
he was kind of he had some insight into this and I think he had uh you know, kind of saw other nicknames
00:48:59
that were given to killers and this was one that he really really thought was terrified the
00:49:05
community and I think there's no better name than what he came up with. Right. Now, okay. So, following the second set
00:49:13
of murders, remember we talked about the peeping Toms, the voyeurs, the the watchers.
00:49:17
Mhm. The the priest that are into shaving. Well, forget forget about the priest. I
00:49:22
think that was just that was just an odd story that happens to be part of this. Um
00:49:27
The the police got some information. And with this information, they went and they picked up one of these watchers.
00:49:35
Okay. Uh so, do you want to hear about this guy, Captain? His name was Nick. No, his
00:49:40
name was Enzo Spalletti. Old Enzo Spalletti, belly full of spaghetti. Yes, he was born in 1945. He
00:49:49
was an ambulance driver and a peeping Tom. Um Well, those things don't go together.
00:49:55
Well, it's his hobby. Um he he His car was spotted in the area of the crime scene of the second crime scene.
00:50:03
Okay. Uh, now that night he was out with one of his {quote} {unquote} nighttime expedition friends. So, like we said,
00:50:11
there's there's people that go out and do this by themselves, there's people that go out with their friends and do
00:50:16
this, there's It's like like finding Bigfoot. It's It's a strange thing to think that
00:50:20
there's a whole community of these peeping Tom watcher people. I'm going to go find Bigfoot. I'm going to go watch
00:50:26
people touch each other. But the key thing here is, Captain, his friend, when interviewed by police, tells them that
00:50:33
he went home. The friend went home around midnight. And Spalletti was still in that area. Spalletti tells his wife
00:50:42
and some customers uh that he had saw a young couple murdered that particular night. Uh, he
00:50:50
also mentions some of the mutilations that were done before the information is released to the public. This was
00:50:58
information released in the newspapers. Okay. Um so, because of this, this is why he's called into questioning. When
00:51:06
questioned about where he was that night, he starts off by making up stories and telling lies. It's after
00:51:12
about 6 hours of questioning that he admits to being near the crime scene, but he insists that he went home after
00:51:19
his friend left at midnight. Now, the problem that Enzo Spalletti gets into here is that when his wife is
00:51:26
interviewed, she she does not agree with him leaving at midnight because she says
00:51:31
that he didn't come home that night until around or after 2:00 a.m. Right. Spalletti is arrested and he's
00:51:39
imprisoned. Now, while he is locked up, a strange A stranger calls his wife and calls his brother.
00:51:48
And both state that this is not a voice that either one of them had recognized. Right.
00:51:54
But basically, his wife is told on the phone from the stranger, "Tell him to be quiet. He soon will be acquitted and
00:52:01
released from jail. A little jail time will serve him well, the idiot. What was he thinking saying he knew the victims
00:52:10
from the newspapers when the newspapers didn't release that information until the next morning."
00:52:16
So, a strange phone call to get to the wife of our number one suspect. And Eddie Spaghetti, he he might have known
00:52:25
this couple if they were known to, you know, park, right? You'd think, you know, this guy
00:52:30
is going out, has a partner in crime, um peeping Tom partner. Mhm. What they do, hold each other's hands and [ __ ]
00:52:37
while they beat off? Oh my god. Anyways, no, but it's like it's weird, so maybe he did know the
00:52:44
couple. Maybe he saw more than he's, you know, leading on the investigators on what he saw. But there's So, we got this
00:52:51
weird call. So, we're Let's just assume this is the murderer. But if this is the murderer that's
00:52:57
calling and saying, "Hey, look, he's going to be acquitted soon if he just shuts up."
00:53:02
Right? Right. Then, we can assume what I was saying from the beginning that this this person
00:53:08
is stalking these people. And not only is he stalking everybody, he's stalking that whole area. And that And he knows.
00:53:15
He He has his He has his hand on on the pulse of the city. Oh, somebody is arrested for my crimes. I
00:53:22
will go out of my way to connect with that person's wife, brother, friend, whatever, right?
00:53:30
So, I mean, we're talking about somebody that's very dedicated to what is happening. Yeah.
00:53:36
Yeah, and it It's strange in a way that that his wife is getting the phone calls. Now, of course, we don't have any
00:53:42
proof of these phone calls other than his wife saying it and his brother saying it. Both of them would have a
00:53:48
motive to see their husband or brother not imprisoned for four heinous murders. Okay, so the murderer calls and says
00:53:55
he's going to be acquitted soon and he's going to be released. So, then what happens? Well, he Enzo Spalletti is
00:54:02
still locked up in prison. And in October of 1981, this is October 22nd, uh just 30 km from Florence, another
00:54:13
young couple, this is Stefano, uh he's 26 years old, and Susanna, who's 24, they went out to dinner that night and
00:54:21
around 10:00 p.m., uh they say they're going to go to the movies. Well, they are found dead the next day.
00:54:29
Stefano was shot four times, um two of these shots in the heart, and he was stabbed four times postmortem.
00:54:38
According to the investigators' reconstruction of the crime, Susanna it was shot five times, and then like the
00:54:47
others the other crimes, she was pulled from the car and placed about 10 ft away
00:54:52
from the vehicle. Uh her female area is mutilated. It was reported that when the
00:54:58
two were found, Samantha Sorry, Susanna had a chunk of hair in her hand. Now, it's not clear if this chunk of hair
00:55:08
belonged to her boyfriend or if it belonged to the perpetrator of this crime. Mhm.
00:55:17
For some strange reason, Captain, and this is These are the things that boggle the brain,
00:55:23
but for some strange reason, this bit of evidence has been lost over the years. The hair? Yeah, the the the hair that
00:55:30
was reported to have been found clenched in her hand. Uh, and this part This next part is unlike
00:55:39
any of the other attacks. Okay. The monster, for some reason, pulled the man's body out of the car this time. And
00:55:47
it is believed that he did this because the body of the man was, for some reason, obstructing him from removing
00:55:56
the girl's body from the vehicle. Okay. Uh, so Stefano's body was found laid out, or let's say, maybe more
00:56:05
appropriately, Stefano's body was dumped or dropped by the driver's side door. Mhm. Um the police reported that the
00:56:13
driver's door was jammed for some reason. So, this means that the monster carried the dead body of the man from
00:56:21
the passenger side of the vehicle, pulling it out from the passenger side, and took the time to carry it around the
00:56:27
vehicle and then dropping it on the driver side of the vehicle. Which, like you said before, is
00:56:33
different but the other two crimes, but it makes me wonder if this uh murderer is trying to like
00:56:40
you know, commit a perfect murder in his head and then to create a perfect scene
00:56:46
outside. Yeah. You You know what I'm saying? You know, and you tapped into something
00:56:51
interesting there because one thing that I kept coming across when the description of this particular crime and
00:56:56
the reconstruction of this crime comes up is it's often mentioned that there's some
00:57:01
kind of psychological factor in there that the the killer might be trying to separate the man from the woman before
00:57:09
he does the mutilation to the woman's body. Um so, like you said, that he might be he he's created in his his mind
00:57:17
the way he wants this thing to go down or the way that he wants it to look when it's found, and he's going to He's
00:57:24
painting a picture for for people to see. And I think you tapped into something very interesting there,
00:57:29
Captain. Now, the Of course, the female victim, her purse was dumped, the contents was dumped on the ground. Uh
00:57:37
police were unable to determine if anything of the female victims was missing from the crime scene. They
00:57:43
couldn't tell if she had missing jewelry or anything from her purse. Mhm. Um they
00:57:47
did find some evidence. You know, we're talking about a killer that so far has left very little evidence other than the
00:57:54
shell casings at the crime scene. They found a size 11 shoe print uh near the vehicle. Um Also, not far from the
00:58:05
vehicle, they found And this This is going to sound strange. Um they found a pyramid-shaped black basalt stone
00:58:12
uh is found near that vehicle. Mhm. Uh Uh What is one of these things that they're talking about?
00:58:19
Okay, so basically, it's a picture like a like a rock, you know, that maybe somebody would try to to sculpt or shape
00:58:26
into some kind of form. Mhm. Uh so, this is a dark bl- almost black or black um stone that someone has shaped into
00:58:35
almost a pyramid-type shape. Okay. I've seen pictures of this one. It appears to be
00:58:41
a a little larger than two fists put together. Um So, pretty big. Yeah. Yeah, and this is something that that we will
00:58:49
come back to. Uh but this is this strange object is found and noted as evidence in this
00:58:56
particular crime. Now, after this the murders take place, there's another strange phone call situation. Okay.
00:59:06
Uh this is before the bodies were actually found. Someone called Susanna's mother. Now, the strange thing here is
00:59:16
um I believe that that that Suzanne she you know, she lived I know she lived with her mother. But the thing is, I
00:59:22
believe that they had recently moved that it that they were living with her her aunt uh pretty recently. And once
00:59:30
they had moved, the number was not listed at the time of Suzanne's death. Um she did not Her mother did not
00:59:38
recognize the voice of the caller. Um she said that that the caller said that they had important information
00:59:46
about Suzanne that they needed to give to Suzanne's mom. Right. Then the call was disconnected for some reason. Maybe
00:59:53
the caller hung up, but regardless it was disconnected. And there was no further communication regarding whatever
01:00:01
important information this caller had to give to Suzanne's mother. Now, keep in mind, like we said at the top of this uh
01:00:08
crime, that Enzo Spelletti is still behind bars during this whole attack. And due to the
01:00:17
attack matching that exactly of the monster. Not exactly, but Well, very close. We have the body We have the
01:00:26
male's body pulled from the vehicle. However, we have the same gun used. Mhm. And the same ammunition used in this
01:00:34
particular crime. So, Enzo Spelletti cannot be the perpetrator of this crime and most likely cannot be
01:00:41
the monster himself. Yeah, possibly. There's some other theories about that. Um there was a lead in this case. Um
01:00:50
there was a you know, the phone call. We discussed that. Um but there was also a
01:00:55
situation where Susanna had told her mother that she believed she was being followed. Again, we're hearing the same
01:01:02
thing time and time again, Captain. That someone was following her in a car uh when she was out walking and driving.
01:01:10
Right. She didn't give a description of the vehicle to her mother. Um and she didn't say if it in fact was more than
01:01:17
one vehicle. Could have been possibly two vehicles. But again, we're seeing a vague description of somebody watching
01:01:24
or somebody being feeling though that they're being followed before they end up being murdered. Yeah, which goes to
01:01:31
my original thought of you know, possibly somebody stalking stalking their victims. We have so much more to
01:01:37
get to regarding the Monster of Florence, and this case is a huge one. So, we have a jam-packed day for you
01:01:43
tomorrow. We also want to thank all of you for joining us in the garage today. That's right, you. I'm talking to you.
01:01:50
Thank you for joining us in the garage. We We hope you're having a fantastic day
01:01:54
or a fantastic evening. Regardless, we'll see you right back here tomorrow in the garage. Until then, please be
01:02:00
good, be kind, and don't litter.