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thank you [Music] [Music] thank you welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
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for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man who hit St Patrick's Day like a hyper juicy
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Berserker here is the captain I drink all the green beers not just one all of them it's good to be seen and good to
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see you thanks for listening thanks for tuna friend [Music] I am and we are extra excited to be
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Company this is called Order and Chaos and this one is a special one from tactical Brewing this is a pina colada
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of the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime
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[Music] thank you [Music] the St John's Sheriff's Office ramped up their investigation quickly determining
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that Michelle O'Connell's death was a suicide Michelle's family disagreed the Hasty closure of the
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investigation and the rushed ruling did not sit well with them and they demanded
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further investigation but this was very very complicated because not only was Michelle dating a
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deputy in the St Johns County Sheriff's Office her mother and brother Scott worked for St John's Sheriff's Office as
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well Scott was a deputy like Jeremy and actually introduced Michelle to Jeremy right Patty Michelle's mother was a
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clerk in the office but despite their affiliation with the Sheriff's Office Michelle's family realized very quickly
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that the Sheriff's Office had closed ranks almost immediately in order to protect one of their own
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even at the crime scene this was very interesting to me here Captain this part right here this does not sit well with
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me at all so let's go back to the crime scene Jeremy's family was allowed in to the home
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Michelle's brother a sheriff's office deputy in that jurisdiction was held back by his fellow officers he was not
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allowed to enter the home that makes zero sense of course they could have been trying to Shield him from seeing
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his sister dying on the floor I get that but for another thing here her family Michelle's family says that
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she would not have absolutely would not have killed herself and I get it most families in suicide cases say this but I
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believe that there may be some proof here so let's start off with this idea one fact in this case is that Michelle
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had just landed her dream job and was supposed to start this dream job the very next day she
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would be working full time in a daycare center for kids this was a dream of hers
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teaching and working with children the job offered things that she had been striving for working towards in her life
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these things such as benefits including health insurance for her and her daughter and a retirement plan
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and the Clincher she could bring her daughter Lexi to work with her every day Lexi would be allowed to attend the
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daycare with her mom the daycare that her mom would be teaching at we also know that Michelle had plans to meet up
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with a friend Mindy Fox on the night that she died furthermore around 10 pm Michelle text
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her sister who was watching her daughter Lexi saying quote I'll be there soon to pick
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up her daughter and Michelle was in fact packing to leave Jeremy for good right we know that based off of what Jeremy
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said we know that off of one of the couples after the concert actually goes back to Jeremy's house with Michelle and
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Jeremy they witnessed some of this they're only there for a few minutes but they say that when they left two
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things happened Michelle was packing to leave Jeremy that night and Jeremy told the other couple
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everything would be okay so they decided to leave but again look at the motive why would you be packing anything up if
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you're so distraught and thinking of killing yourself exactly that's what I'm getting at here why would you tell your
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sister you're picking up your daughter why would you tell your friend that you still intended to hang out with her that
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night Mindy Fox and why we know that Not only was she packing based off of these
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Witnesses based off of what Jeremy says but also the crime scene photos show suitcases packed why would she pack and
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then kill herself yeah it almost seems like once that couple left well he knew that he was in control of
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the situation now and he was going to try to stop her from leaving we also have Michelle's family that says they
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have evidence that Jeremy was abusive saying that Michelle had confided in her family about this a few other details
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that that need to be included here uh some information and we'll just throw the information out there and you can
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interpret it in any way that you see fit their wonderful beautiful listener so some of the information is that Michelle
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had lunch that very day the day that she died with her sister Chrissy and told her sister that she was scared of Jeremy
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and was going to be leaving him that night after the concert Chrissy was one of the people that counseled her and
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told her hey don't go to this concert at all just skip it forget about it right Michelle tells her
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don't worry about it I purchased the tickets long before I'm going to the concert
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her sister told the New York Times that Michelle told her that she was injured after Jeremy had shown her a quote
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submissive move where he slammed her down now I've heard this referred to as a body slam type technique this story
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seems a little complicated we have persons that say they believe this was abuse we have Jeremy and others that say
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we were just goofing around and maybe it got a little out of hand he was showing
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her a move this according to him and some others but again other people thought that there was something more
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going on than just hey we were goofing around well it seems like everybody in her family and her friends said if you
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viewed this relationship as a whole if you just simply said pass or fail or is it a positive relationship or a negative
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one that most people thought it was a negative relationship too much fighting there's too much
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arguing well and like I said earlier Captain sometimes these situations are abusive and sometimes they're just two
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people physically fighting and we do know that Jeremy did admit that sometimes when they argued it had
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gotten physical in the past he told law enforcement that in his statements we should also note that Jeremy is six
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foot one 225 pounds at the time and Michelle's five foot four 119 pounds at the time well here's where I disagree
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with you when I when you're saying that sometimes there's an abusive situation and sometimes it's a couple that fights
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and then they get physical as a man you then have to remove yourself from that situation and if
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if you continue to have arguments that escalate into violent situations as a man
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you should remove yourself from that relationship and on top of that he's a deputy
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if domestic violence calls come in and they show up at his house and he gets arrested he can lose his job
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but I don't think in any stretch of the imagination that this Jeremy Banks man is any definition of a man we have some
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evidence of him being a hot head like I said yesterday and this comes from Thanksgiving 2009 when Jeremy had an
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argument with Michelle's brother Justin because Justin did not feel that Jeremy was treating his sister very well
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so Justin asked Jeremy to and Jeremy let it be known that he was caring at the Thanksgiving
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dinner table this the real mature this guy's a piece of [ __ ] and I would have been like oh
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you're carrying I I am I'm going to castrate you you son of a [ __ ] that's what I would
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have said uh who gives a [ __ ] oh I'm carrying and here's the thing too is because somebody stuck up for her I
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wouldn't be surprised if there was a lot of abuse physical verbal emotional mental abuse this guy seems like a turd
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basket I think we should take a better look at the crime scene or the death scene
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we know that Jeremy's service pistol was found lying on the floor on Michelle's left side reminder she was right-handed
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her family pointing out that they believe this is an issue and does not jive with the story or the findings of
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the Sheriff's Office the retention holster that held his gun was there as well the holster is
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designed a retention holster is designed for someone unfamiliar with the weapon to have trouble drawing it from this
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holster to pull the weapon out of the holster we have a a few different sides to this argument one
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if you don't think it's suicide you might make the argument that Michelle may not have known how to pull the gun
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from The holster and therefore could not shoot herself the other argument would be she lived with this man for over a
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year and he may have shown her at some point how to remove the gun from The holster
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this is what is typically referred to as a level three security when it comes to
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these types of holsters there's from my understanding Captain there's like four different levels and what you have here
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in in this situation again I don't know exactly what kind of holster he was using at the time but typically what you
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have in this situation is level three retention there's four levels of retention holders
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the higher the number the more retention the more difficult it is to get the gun
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out of the holster typically when we're talking about law enforcement they usually carry level three retention
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holsters this to make it difficult if they are in an altercation for someone to take their
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weapon out of their holster right makes sense I go back to his carelessness of just having his gun and his holster out
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when he claims that he said to her you know don't do something stupid or don't do something to harm yourself if you
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actually thought that she was going to harm herself and you're not the giant the biggest giant piece of [ __ ] in this
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world you go make sure that your gun is secure you make sure that your gun is locked away that's correct captain and
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here's the thing the the there were two shots that were fired and we know that based off the evidence at the scene the
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9-1-1 call and Jeremy's statements to detective Heinz most people will argue in a suicide type
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situation you would not expect there to be two shots that just the simple fact of having two shots is an indicator that
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something else was going on that she was being attacked rather than deciding to take her life
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I'll counter that by saying that I don't think the second shot necessarily determines anything for us
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outright because there are there's plenty of proof that in these types of scenarios that a
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suicidal individual has fired a test shot prior to turning the gun on themselves right now you could also
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argue that there's an altercation taking place there's a physical attack going down and maybe that first shot was
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delivered by Jeremy intended for her and it missed its mark in this physical altercation again I
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think that it's just too irresponsible to say that because there were two shots it couldn't be a suicide I think that's
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just as irresponsible as the investigation or lack of investigation that they did initially in this case to
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begin with so if you're faulting them for their lack of Investigation don't do the same thing yourself yeah a lot of
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people think that they're covering for their Deputy but like we stated there's members of Michelle's family that works
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for that County so I think some of their protection is for their lack of Investigation I think
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they should have done their due diligence again bring in other law enforcement to double check your work
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okay captain and here is something that is almost unheard of in fact we've reviewed
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hundreds of these types of cases maybe not this exact scenario but hundreds of True Crime cases and I've never seen
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this in any case that we've covered so far there is a follow-up interview with Jeremy and rightfully so because I don't
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think that the first one was very well structured to begin with but in this follow-up interview Jeremy
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admits to detective Heinz that quote I've already read the report I know I probably shouldn't have I just wanted to
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know what went down on the other side end quote okay well have we ever reviewed a case where a
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person who may be sitting in the suspect chair someone who maybe looked at as being involved in someone's death
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had the privilege of reading the police report or the report that's been put together by the Sheriff's Office prior
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to being interviewed a second time by one of the detectives in charge it's completely irresponsible he should not
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have been privy to that information and also where are these tests done why why didn't they do a ballistic test to see
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if he fired a gun that day why not do a test on on Michelle to see if she fired a gun that day correct him reading this
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report too gives him the ability to know what lies to prepare in advance to explain away evidence that points
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away from suicide and the reason why this is completely irresponsible is because he has actions
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that day that showed that he was trying to control the narrative the way he was acting on the 9-1-1 call the way he
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started acting when they got a pulse and then making statements in the initial interview again like you said maybe it
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was too casual I think that would be a tough situation to be in especially when somebody's being erratic but he's then
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telling in the initial interview that he was basically trying to control the narrative yes this is when Miss
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Congeniality detective Heinz should stand up end that follow-up interview March into the Sheriff's
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Office and say look boss our investigation has been completely compromised Jeremy's read the report
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even when he knew he should not have he just admitted that to me on tape right it would be responsible it would be the
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right thing for us to do boss to cancel our investigation and bring in an outside agency if you didn't do it on
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day one this was your opportunity right and detective Heinz decided not to do that she continued to conduct a very
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casual interview follow-up interview with her colleague Jeremy Banks everybody say it with me all at once
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dropping the ball you're dropping the ball according to a scathing expose by the New York Times the St John's
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Sheriff's Office rushed to judgment that the case was a suicide or more disturbingly decided to cover up a
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murder as a result they never bothered to one collect or even check Jeremy's phone or Jeremy's and Michelle's
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computers two canvas the neighborhood three require the officers on the scene that night to file reports documenting
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their observations as required by Saint John's Sheriff's Office protocols four assemble a timeline for that night
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or maintain a crime scene log five collect and test evidence at the scene including a bloody t-shirt and a
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glove six test the gun handle and Trigger for Michelle's DNA they also did not check
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any of the bathroom sinks or shower traps for blood evidence they also fail to interview the family
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Michelle's family despite repeated requests by the o'connells for an opportunity to weigh in well tell me if
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I have this right we have a picture of Jeremy banks at the concert and that shirt that he was wearing at the concert
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has not been found that's absolutely correct I mean 100 correct like come on people to put it plain and simple
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the O'Connell family repeatedly requested an independent investigation into the death of Michelle O'Connell and
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despite it being protocol when there was an officer involved suspicious shooting
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the Saint John's Sheriff's Office desperately tried to keep the investigation in-house in fact they even
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sat down with the o'connells and explained why the FDLE had not been requested to help out
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Lieutenant Charles Bradley said to the O'Connell family in a recorded interview quote to be honest with you my
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investigators are far and above better than what FDLE is ever going to give you end quote this of course
00:21:18
is false and self-serving the two investigators on the case had handled just three homicides between them
00:21:27
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how language is learned foreign [Music] we are back a much a much needed beer break because
00:23:14
this case Colonel just gets me steamed it's under your skin I'm steamed I just I don't I I just don't
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get it I don't understand why there's so many cases where it's like you you sign up to be a cop so you can
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protect and serve so you can do the right thing live by the letter of the law and it just seems like so many of
00:23:39
these individuals are are willing to compromise their integrity well Deputy Menard does not fit into that group in
00:23:50
my opinion in fact she was one of the first on the scene that night she goes on to tell 2020 that protocol
00:24:00
we are trained that when we arrive to every scene the the scene it's a homicide scene that we
00:24:07
have arrived at until proven otherwise but she says in this situation quote immediately it was almost like they were
00:24:15
taking Jeremy's word that she shot herself at that point we were told it was a suicide
00:24:23
so that goes against their training it goes against this Sheriff's Office protocol and what they train their
00:24:29
deputies to do when they arrive on a scene where there's been a death well no and so let's let's unpack that a little
00:24:37
bit because like you said the protocol is to go this is a homicide until proven otherwise
00:24:45
so once everybody starts assuming it's a suicide and not investigating as a homicide anybody that's set by and
00:24:52
watched that happen anybody that step by and let that happen and let them just go
00:24:58
well this was a suicide and we're not going to investigate it they're they're just as guilty in my mind
00:25:04
when you when you see the wrong thing happening and you just stand by you're as wrong as that wrong thing happening
00:25:11
like this is what's wrong with the world well I don't fault Deputy Maynard at all
00:25:16
I mean she's telling us what she witnessed and what she believes is wrong with this investigation no no
00:25:23
I'm not blaming her I'm just saying that all the other deputies that were there that just went along with this narrative
00:25:29
and didn't do the work to go hey we need to stop what you're talking about we need to investigate this as a homicide
00:25:35
they're equally as wrong as what I'm saying the other weird thing here Captain is the pills that were found in
00:25:41
Michelle's purse and found in her jeans pockets but none were in her system and the facts of the matter are this
00:25:51
those pills in the pill bottles that they found in her purse or in her jeans Pockets belonged to Jeremy right they
00:26:00
were not Michelle's pills her family pointed out that if she wanted to die and I agree with this one
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thousand percent why wouldn't she have OD'd on these pills instead of shooting herself right and we should note
00:26:14
that per the Sheriff's Office investigation none zero none not one single pill or bottle
00:26:23
had Michelle's DNA on them this according to tests that were later conducted that in itself is one of the
00:26:31
most suspicious things in this investigation and that was found at the death scene yeah I'd say it's number two
00:26:39
for me as far as suspicious things because like you said if there's no DNA found on the pills or the bottle that
00:26:46
means somebody placed these pills in these bottles in those locations to me the only person there at the scene
00:26:54
is Jeremy so why would Jeremy do this it it's to establish a narrative and it's the narrative that he's been trying to
00:27:03
establish in other points of this investigation it goes along with the the statements that he's
00:27:09
giving to detective Heinz in the back of her car just an hour and a half after the bodies
00:27:15
found yeah and you know I was able to talk to a retired detective about you know showing up to a scene and and
00:27:25
working in the scene knowing that it's possibly a suicide and the first thing he said is look
00:27:32
statistically women don't kill themselves by gunshot then this detective said to me do you
00:27:39
know what one of the number one things that women do on the day that they commit suicide if it's planned
00:27:46
they get their hair done and do their makeup and all that stuff yeah because they want to look presentable
00:27:52
even in death put in a barrel of a gun and pulling the trigger I'm not saying it's impossible because
00:28:00
she's a woman unfortunately it happens every day I what this detective is telling you is absolutely true the
00:28:06
statistics bear that out and tell us that but unfortunately it does happen every day
00:28:12
so I don't want to circle around that too much when there's other to me bigger red flags glaring red flags
00:28:19
with with things at the at the scene there now within a four month period And this is four months of increasing
00:28:26
pressure by the public and by the family to bring in an independent impartial investigator
00:28:35
or investigators the sheriff in charge of St John's this is David B shower he begrudgingly requested an independent
00:28:45
review of the case in January of 2011. within two weeks of starting on the case agent Rogers who came in from
00:28:54
the FDLE uncovered two female neighbors who were standing outside around 11 pm on the night of the shooting they're
00:29:02
outside chatting and smoking the women were Stacy Boswell and Heather ladley Rogers interviewed them
00:29:10
separately under oath and they both said that quote a man and a woman were screaming they could hear a man and
00:29:18
woman screaming Ms Boswell said in an interview with the New York Times there was something wrong there was nothing
00:29:25
playful no nothing it was somebody that was scared they were arguing we heard her yell help and there was one gunshot
00:29:35
and then she yelled help again and there was a second gunshot Ms ladley told agent Rogers after that they heard
00:29:45
silence saying that it was probably 10 maybe 15 minutes and then the sirens came
00:29:51
according to Ms Boswell that's why they didn't call anybody they hear this screaming the screams for help people
00:29:58
were arguing they hear gunshots they don't call this in because they hear the sirens coming within 10 to
00:30:08
15 minutes now I will say this Captain this 10 to 15 minute window you could look at it
00:30:15
two ways as suspicious or it's relatively quickly after they're hearing the shots we know that the call came in
00:30:21
at 11 20 and Deputy Menard says that they were on the scene by 11 25. so that's all that's five minutes of your
00:30:29
ten minutes or that's five minutes of your 15 minutes just the response time to the scene so it doesn't
00:30:38
sound to me like if these Witnesses are right with what they say and what they say that they've heard it doesn't seem
00:30:44
to me like there was much of a delay in calling in 9-1-1 now of course every minute counts and it would appear that
00:30:51
there would have been some delay the other thing that's interesting to me here is someone yelling help
00:31:00
you don't yell help and then shoot yourself yeah that doesn't make any sense I don't yell help twice you do
00:31:06
yell help when you're being attacked I don't know if you yell help in the situation
00:31:12
if he's confronting you with the gun maybe that's the first thing that instinctively flies out of your mouth
00:31:19
to me it doesn't the whole help thing doesn't make sense either way but it's certainly 100 percent does not make
00:31:25
sense with the suicide well no it makes sense if he's beating you now agent Rogers arranged for the Secret
00:31:33
Service to give both of these women polygraph tests and according to agent Rogers they passed these tests now
00:31:41
remember Jeremy stuck to his story that he and Michelle had not argued their breakup was somewhat peaceful I guess
00:31:47
he's outside she's inside while she's packing but here's another point of contention because you've got these two
00:31:55
eyewitnesses and if you believe them then Jeremy's story is not correct because if she did yell for help for
00:32:04
whatever reason before she killed herself he would have heard that and so why wouldn't he report that to
00:32:11
the other officers the thing that I do not like here is the sheriff then goes out of his way to say
00:32:18
look these two witnesses are not credible they said they're outside smoking uh they're potheads and they can't even
00:32:27
figure out if they were stoned that night or not so they're not credible well Jeremy's not credible either if you
00:32:34
want to go down that rabbit hole because he's telling you well I had about I don't know five six tall boys so that
00:32:40
means you had you know roughly 12 Beers that's that's a lot of alcohol here's what I say to the sheriff when he calls
00:32:48
into question The credibility of these two possible ear Witnesses you do not get to decide sir you chose that night
00:32:55
not to Canvas the neighborhood and interview neighbors you cannot then decide later when another agent comes in
00:33:04
and finds ear Witnesses you do not get to have an opinion about these Witnesses because you disregarded them from the
00:33:12
initial steps of the investigation as soon as your deputies put a [ __ ] foot on that scene you disregarded any
00:33:20
opportunity for a witness statement you do not get to decide you do not get an opportunity nor an opinion in my opinion
00:33:29
well these ear Witnesses they don't have a dog in the fight so you're going to believe everything that your Deputy says
00:33:36
this Jeremy Banks this [ __ ] bag he's threatened people you know people think that he's been violent with Michelle in
00:33:43
the past he's definitely definitely a douchebag and then on top of that when when they
00:33:51
get a pulse he starts putting dents into a police car and and that's the person you want to protect
00:33:58
that's the person you want to stand up for that that means you're as big of a piece
00:34:03
of [ __ ] as he is in March of 2012 we now have a special prosecutor that's been brought in and this is to handle
00:34:13
the case because now keep in mind basically the the the very nuts and bolts of this thing
00:34:18
is that the Sheriff's Office investigation concluded suicide FDLE is brought in it looks like they
00:34:28
think that this is a homicide and Jeremy Banks is the suspect that's the very simplest form to put it
00:34:36
without going through a lot of information to get there right in March of 2012 a special prosecutor uh met with
00:34:45
the O'Connell family and actually announced the closure of the case telling them that they found
00:34:52
insufficient evidence to prosecute Jeremy Banks the prosecutor told the family that
00:35:00
here's why we cannot prosecute Jeremy Banks there was GSR on Michelle's hands three medical examiners ruled her death
00:35:09
a suicide and her DNA was found on the gun so the prosecutor says the facts as they
00:35:18
currently exist do not support the prosecution of Jeremy banks for any homicide offense so once again this
00:35:25
investigation is over there's so many red flags but the number one for me is the ear Witnesses
00:35:33
Michelle yelling for help that's what they heard makes no sense that you'd yell for help
00:35:40
and then kill yourself the other thing that is a giant red flag is these pills in the pill bottles
00:35:50
that's obviously somebody at that scene is tampering with evidence and then on top of that
00:35:58
his erratic actions his past the negativity surrounding him and Michelle's relationship
00:36:08
the fact that we can't find this shirt that he was wearing that night again tampering with evidence
00:36:17
and then him trying to control the narrative and his horrible acting job and I think his Freudian slip
00:36:25
well I'll tell you the truth and then he gets all calm and then he becomes clear proving that his initial
00:36:33
demeanor on the 9-1-1 call was a fraud I mean how can you not investigate this more and like you said
00:36:47
well eventually they do but the thing is is I think maybe they missed their window and if they would have done
00:36:52
certain things and investigate it like a homicide and let the evidence take you where it
00:36:59
needs to take you maybe that's the reason why they're not able to prosecute this individual
00:37:06
they're also not able to prosecute because they did not do a thorough invest ing right as
00:37:12
you set foot at that scene we have it being worked like a suicide this is per one of the deputies on the
00:37:20
scene and from my understanding the deputy that arrived second at the scene is stating this much
00:37:27
and we know that the from the sheriff's own words he admitted that the Sheriff's Office
00:37:35
failed to Canvas the neighborhood for Witnesses failed to interview family members of Michelle's
00:37:44
which you would in suicide situations or homicide situations to figure out State
00:37:49
of Mind of all the individuals involved so on and so forth failed to isolate Jeremy banks failed to interview Jeremy
00:38:00
Banks fail to photograph Jeremy banks in a structured environment after the shooting occurred
00:38:08
so you go well there's insufficient evidence to prosecute well maybe that's because when you showed up to the scene
00:38:15
that night you weren't looking for evidence right to prosecute that's why you don't
00:38:20
have it after the fact it now you talked about the ear Witnesses not having a dog in the fight
00:38:27
and that's why we like them that's why we lean on the side and give them credibility they pass polygraph tests
00:38:33
administered by the Secret Service that should add to the credibility as well here's somebody that maybe has too many
00:38:40
dogs in the fight and I really did not see this coming based on how the early stages of this
00:38:49
investigation and story go but Scott O'Connell Michelle's brother who works for the Sheriff's Office
00:39:02
may have too many dogs in the fight it's his sister who is now deceased it's his Department that he works for
00:39:10
declaring it a suicide he has sided with the sheriff and with the Sheriff's Office
00:39:16
and so he is the only person the lone wolf of the O'Connell family that stands with the Sheriff's Office
00:39:27
and from my understanding their there is no speaking to Scott O'Connell the the remainder of the O'Connell
00:39:38
family does not speak with Scott O'Connell yeah like he said he has maybe too many dogs in the fight but
00:39:46
maybe that's self-preservation maybe he knows that if he doesn't stay in line with his his Department that they'll
00:39:57
figure out a reason to get rid of him I don't know why somebody would put their job above their family but
00:40:05
um it's possible I think that he must believe that the sheriff's office is correct there is a Dr Phil episode where
00:40:15
you can see the family squabbling uh back and forth in front of millions of viewers where he is stating
00:40:23
our sister killed herself and my family just refuses to believe it the the other weird thing here too and
00:40:30
I've we've seen this once or twice but it's still very uncommon this this goes down
00:40:35
to November of 2013. this is when Jeremy Banks sued the FDLE and agent Rogers claiming that they violated his civil
00:40:44
rights by wrongly accusing him when the case had been ruled a suicide now keep in mind it was his Sheriff's
00:40:52
Office begrudgingly as it may be that asked for the FDLE to come in and do a review of the case right
00:41:00
so when you ask for an independent agency to come in and do a review of the case
00:41:05
it doesn't necessarily mean that they care a whole lot of what the determination was prior to them being
00:41:13
brought in so I don't know that this technically violates his civil rights according to
00:41:19
as he stated it in the lawsuit wrongly accusing him after it had been ruled a suicide
00:41:26
what we do know too is that Rogers did detain Jeremy banks for a very brief period of
00:41:33
time he had put into place that they would search Jeremy Banks's home while he was being questioned
00:41:44
at the station by agent Rogers the interview ended a lot earlier than the agent had
00:41:55
anticipated this because Jeremy request an attorney so there's going to be no more questions at this time he should be
00:42:02
free to go however the agent not wanting Jeremy Banks to be on scene and potentially manipulate evidence
00:42:13
detained him from going home at that time now the short of it without a whole lot of back and forth this didn't didn't
00:42:20
go down overnight but a judge did dismiss this lawsuit that his civil rights were not in fact
00:42:30
uh violated by the FDLE or agent Rogers Jeremy Banks should be pissed off too because if he is not a murderer and he
00:42:40
is just a victim of Michelle taking her own life he then becomes a victim of them not
00:42:47
doing their due diligence and not doing a thorough investigation from the beginning
00:42:52
and if I was being questioned by anybody I would be pushing for that you need to do a thorough investigation
00:43:00
you need to make sure that you cross your t's and Dot your eyes because if the family starts questioning this if
00:43:07
the community starts questioning this we have answers for all those questions because I want to leave no doubt that I
00:43:15
wasn't involved in the death of Michelle one thing that we've not hit on yet here
00:43:20
Captain is something that was brought up by the state attorney's office citing examples of issues with potential
00:43:26
evidence in this case and there were several but among other things was a black glove that was
00:43:33
photographed at the scene of this air quotes investigation that was not taken into evidence and the state attorney's
00:43:41
office is on record as saying quote and because that item was not collected we were not able to determine the
00:43:48
evidentiary value of that end quote what would have been found what could have been found on this black glove had
00:43:56
it been collected you have to wonder could it have been a whole lot of gunpowder residue a whole
00:44:03
lot of GSR on this glove that's certainly a possibility but what is not a possibility is Michelle
00:44:12
O'Connell putting on the glove shooting herself removing the glove and placing it outside of the house where it is
00:44:20
later photographed that's not a possibility the other problem that I have with this
00:44:26
is Michelle's jaw was fractured into locations and there's two camps one is saying well
00:44:36
this could have been caused by the gunfire and others saying that that doesn't necessarily always happen
00:44:44
so again you have people that hear an argument getting out of hand you hear a woman yelling for help
00:44:55
they said she sounded scared well is it possible that he was beating on her as that took place
00:45:06
is it possible that he fractured her jaw before he put the gun in her mouth again
00:45:13
not a doctor I've said it a few times just in case people get confused I've said it many times throughout the years
00:45:19
I'm not a doctor here but I can rely on what I've heard in the statements given by the doctors who have personally
00:45:26
examined the decedent and what we have here is a little bit of pushback right where if she was in the middle of a
00:45:36
physical altercation with Jeremy Banks and then he shoots her the pushback is well wouldn't there be some bruising on
00:45:44
Michelle and the medical examiner who we've not gotten to this yet did a follow-up autopsy after Michelle's body
00:45:54
was exhumed in January of 2016 his response to that question well shouldn't there be some bruising on Michelle if
00:46:01
that in fact was the case his response was that the amount of bruising can depend on how quickly the person is
00:46:11
killed after those blows or injuries are administered meaning that if if that was the case and
00:46:22
she dies relatively quickly after some hits then we may not see the bruising here
00:46:30
yeah I want to give the body a chance to create the Brew the bruising the jaw being fractured and it was a
00:46:41
pretty obvious fracture which was weird that it was missed the first time around
00:46:45
but his answer to that is this we do not he does not believe that it was done or
00:46:52
occurred because of the gunshot because there was no damage to soft tissue areas that would he would expect
00:47:01
to see if it was done per the gunshot and what's interesting to me here is the amount of force that it would take to
00:47:12
break the jaw the jaw is one of the most one of the strongest bones in your body
00:47:17
right so the amount of force that it would take to break that jaw what do they say
00:47:22
in boxing you and I love love to watch a little boxing they say chin music right
00:47:27
give them a little chin music knock them out hit them right bust them right in that jaw with an uppercut knock them out
00:47:35
this medical examiner says that there's a good chance that she took a hit maybe with the butt of a gun and that the
00:47:41
force of that blow the breaking of that jaw may have knocked her unconscious and
00:47:46
then she was shot through the roof of her mouth go back to what the sheriff's office
00:47:50
said earlier the detective said it would be very difficult for a person in an altercation to allow a gun to get
00:48:02
into their mouth really close your mouth you can easily turn your head from side to side you
00:48:08
could duck you could Bob you could weave there's a million things you could do to
00:48:12
get the nose of that gun out of your mouth and they're saying it had to be this is
00:48:17
one of the determining factors for us amongst others that it had to be suicide because we would not expect to see a gun
00:48:24
in the mouth of a shooting victim well guess what if this medical examiner is right after
00:48:31
the exclamation and says she may have been unconscious when that shot occurred that changes that whole perspective
00:48:41
right then and there yeah it's just sad you know because if it's suicide then they didn't do right
00:48:48
by their own officer to do a correct and thorough investigation but it's it's but it's just a
00:48:57
it's a sad and frustrating case overall Dr William Anderson who did the second autopsy pro bono so he's not being paid
00:49:07
for his opinion he's giving his expert opinion after conducting a second autopsy
00:49:16
Dr William Anderson says in my opinion it was a homicide quote there was a gunshot wound to the mouth that put a
00:49:24
hole in the tongue but didn't do any other damage to the teeth to the gums to the floor of the mouth the very soft
00:49:32
tissue that basically would have been destroyed if there had been enough force from that blast to break the jaw end
00:49:38
quote Anderson goes on to say that the mandible is a very strong bone one of the strongest in
00:49:46
the body for it to break and no other damage to the mouth to be caused indicates it was not caused by The
00:49:53
Gunshot and this fracture was fresh not old furthermore he noted that Michelle's
00:49:58
tongue was retracted and blocking her Airway as it could have been if the gun was forced
00:50:05
into her mouth but it would not have been if she put the gun in her mouth herself quote the findings are most
00:50:13
consistent of blunt force trauma causing incapacitation of Ms O'Connell and subsequent gunshot wound inflicted by
00:50:24
another again his opinion it was a homicide yeah you have the fractured jaw you have
00:50:30
the pills with no DNA for Michelle on them you have the ear Witnesses you have his erratic Behavior you have their past
00:50:40
relationships you can't find this shirt one of the Deputy thinks that he cleaned
00:50:46
himself up I mean there's just so much pointing towards that he's guilty of this crime but even if he's not guilty
00:50:55
then you need to do your due diligence to figure out if it's a homicide or a suicide so where does the case stand
00:51:02
today I think that we can sum up where it stands today and I'm going to refer to a
00:51:10
letter that was written by the mother by Patty O'Connell this letter was written
00:51:16
to the Saint Augustine Record and it says my daughter Michelle O'Connell was found shot dead September
00:51:24
2 2010 and her Deputy boyfriend's home he told his co-workers she did this Deputy Jeremy Banks co-workers failed to
00:51:35
investigate they only took his side no investigation was possible for Michelle the public needs to know that no one in
00:51:45
the St Johns County Sheriff's Department or state attorney's office ever asked our family what happened
00:51:53
why no one from the Saint Augustine Record has ever interviewed us even after the
00:52:00
New York Times and the PBS Frontline stories in November of 2013. why Sheriff shower admitted to major
00:52:12
mistakes but claimed to the record in a story December 12 2013 that he quote got
00:52:19
it right how the sheriff investigated his deputy the conflict of interest quote no man
00:52:28
can serve two masters end quote the FDLE should have been called in immediately our family told the
00:52:36
sheriff's office that Michelle told us and her friends that she was a victim of domestic violence
00:52:43
the sheriff did not investigate the sheriff and the prosecutors rushed to conclude it was a suicide without
00:52:51
evidence the sheriff's national accreditation must be reviewed by the Council on Law
00:52:58
Enforcement accreditation this week and be suspended revoked or placed on probation
00:53:05
Jeremy Banks was allowed to read the investigation before his formal interview and treated like a brother not
00:53:13
a suspect why two respected crime scene experts determined it was a homicide and three
00:53:21
determined it was not suicide but no charges were filed why deputies did not canvas the neighborhood
00:53:30
why the cut and bruise on Michelle's eyelid was the result of violence yet we were
00:53:37
told that a gun discharged forward not backward that Michelle used her non-dominant left
00:53:43
hand to grasp the gun upside down with no hand injury and that the shell casings ejected on
00:53:51
the wrong side all physical impossibilities why two witnesses heard an argument a scream
00:54:00
and a shot another scream and a second shot the sheriff knowingly lied to the justice department about them the deputy
00:54:07
claimed there were no raised voices one medical examiner changed his mind another barely looked at the file
00:54:17
Lieutenant Bradley callously said my Michelle busted every tooth in her head he wouldn't let me see any photos I held
00:54:26
firm this made him angry he showed me some photos but not all why after claiming it was a suicide the
00:54:35
sheriff would not look me in the eye and would not look Michelle's Daughter Alexis in the eye either
00:54:41
why the sheriff bragged about paying for Michelle's funeral why the only person currently under
00:54:48
investigation was agent Rusty Rogers who suspected sheriff's deputy Jeremy Banks
00:54:56
and Michelle's death why there must be an FBI and Federal grand jury investigation of Michelle's death and
00:55:04
possible civil rights violations cover-ups collusion and other Crimes by law enforcement
00:55:10
I am grateful for the public support for this our family is thinking about a Michelle O'Connell house a safe place
00:55:19
for victims of the national epidemic of officer-involved domestic violence yeah it's a very powerful letter by
00:55:26
Michelle's mother and that is where that investigation that story sits today the
00:55:32
o'connells still needing help and still Seeking Justice for their daughter Michelle but then in January of 2019
00:55:42
the teenage boy came home to find his father shot dead this is a homicide that many have
00:55:49
suspected could be directly connected to the death of Michelle O'Connell but we'll have to dive into that next
00:55:57
week [Music] I want to thank you guys so much for joining us here in this true crime
00:56:15
garage flying garage ship if you're looking for our bonus episodes or the first 50 episodes those are
00:56:23
available at True Crime Garage in our store so check those out Colonel do we have any recommended reading for the
00:56:30
beautiful listeners this week Captain we are recommending the angel maker arsenic
00:56:36
a midwife and modern history's most astonishing murder ring by Patty McCracken this just came out yesterday
00:56:43
and this is a great read you're going to want to check this one out you can find
00:56:47
that recommendation along with many many more on our recommended page on our website truecrime garage.com and until
00:56:55
next week be good be kind and don't live thank you foreign [Music]