00:00:41
Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thank you for listening. I'm your host Nick
00:00:47
and with me as always is a man whose real name is J Va Day Drunk by Night. Here is the Captain.
00:00:54
Yes, thank you very much. It's good to be seen. Good to see you. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend.
00:01:07
This week in the garage, we are very excited to be drinking and featuring Seafoam IPA by the brilliant folks over
00:01:15
at Jackie O's. Seafoam is an India Pale Ale with an ABV of 7% featuring Citra, Comet, and Simcoe hops. And if you're
00:01:26
looking for it at your trusted beer market, you can't miss it. It's the IPA in the beautiful blue can with a
00:01:33
seahorse on the side. Garage grade, let's go four out of five bottle caps. And this beautiful beer was brought to
00:01:40
us by these beautiful peeps right here. First up, cheers and thank you to Amber in Port Angeles, Washington.
00:01:48
And a big shout out to Nicole in Lafayette, Colorado. Next up, Captain, we have Jane in
00:01:54
Springville, Utah. And a big we like your jib to Mary and Bristol, Indiana. All right, here's a double cheers and a
00:02:02
long distance one at that to Fiona and Freya in Kilcoole, Kildare, and Ireland. And last but certainly not least we have
00:02:11
Alexa in Essex, Missouri. Everyone we just mentioned went to truecrimegarage.com
00:02:18
and contributed to this week's beer fund and for that, we thank you. Yeah, b e the w e double r u n beer run. And if
00:02:26
you need more true crime garage, check us out on the Stitcher app. All of the episodes are free and check out our
00:02:34
bonus show called off the record and that is enough of the business. All right, everybody gather around, grab a
00:02:41
chair, grab a beer. Let's talk some true crime. The 2008 stock market crash took place
00:03:39
on September 29th when the Dow Jones Industrial Average fell 777%. According to wealthsimple.com,
00:03:49
this was the largest single day loss in Dow Jones history up to this point. The stock market crashed in 2008
00:03:57
because too many people had taken on loans they couldn't afford. Lenders relaxed their strict lending
00:04:04
standards to extend credit to people who were less than qualified. Frankly, people with bad credit and
00:04:11
little to no savings were offered loans they could not afford. Meanwhile, banks were repackaging these
00:04:19
mortgages and selling them to investors on the secondary market. This and some questionable and in some
00:04:26
cases illegal activities by some lenders, banks, and real estate firms drove up housing prices to levels that
00:04:34
many could not otherwise afford. This did not happen overnight. These bad practices really started in
00:04:42
the '90s and kept building and building. A crisis was virtually inevitable. Once the housing market slowed down in
00:04:51
2007, the housing bubble was ready to burst, and it did. The aftermath of this catastrophic
00:04:59
financial event led to massive job losses and mortgage defaults. As investment firms collapsed and auto
00:05:07
makers stood on the verge of bankruptcy, the federal government stepped in and bailed out company after company.
00:05:15
The build-up of bad debt resulted in a series of government bailouts, starting with Bear Stearns,
00:05:22
followed by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Then the investment firm Lehman Brothers
00:05:28
collapsed. It was the largest bankruptcy filing in US history up to that point. Later that month, the Federal Reserve
00:05:37
announced yet another bailout. This time it was the insurance giant American International Group, AIG,
00:05:45
which ran out of money playing the subprime mortgage game. Each bailout announcement affected the
00:05:52
Dow Jones, sending it tumbling as markets responded to the financial instability.
00:05:58
Global markets were swept up in the panic, causing global instability. The Labor Department reported big job
00:06:06
losses across the board. This was the loss of hundreds of thousands of jobs, and the unemployment rate reached an
00:06:14
alarming 10%. The nation's biggest automakers, known as the Big Three, were in big trouble and asked the
00:06:23
government for help. The federal government took over the General Motors Company and Chrysler in
00:06:30
March of 2009. And Ford Motor Company received a bailout. Faced with job losses and increasing
00:06:38
mortgage payments, many lost their homes to foreclosure. The loss of home values combined with
00:06:44
declining stock totaled nearly $100,000 on average per US household at the peak.
00:06:53
Between late 2007 and mid-2009, the economy lost nearly 8.7 million jobs, and America stopped building
00:07:02
homes. This created hardships across the board for American families. This is True Crime Garage.
00:07:37
We started off this week discussing the stock market crash of 2008 as it does play a factor in this week's case. But
00:07:45
our story starts off nearly 30 years earlier with the birth of a baby boy. Jeffrey Russell Hall was born November
00:07:54
21st, 1978. His mother is JoAnn Patterson. I couldn't really find anything about his
00:08:01
father, but Jeff Hall's childhood is not our main focus in the garage today. Our
00:08:07
focus will be his adult life. In early adulthood, Jeff got married to Laeticia Neal and the young couple had two
00:08:14
children, a boy and a girl. Their names are Joseph and Shirley. Joseph was born June 19th, 2000.
00:08:24
Shortly after the birth of Joseph and then Shirley, Jeff and Laeticia split up. It wasn't long after the divorce
00:08:31
that Laeticia was pregnant, but not with another child by Jeff. No, Laeticia was
00:08:36
pregnant with twins by another father. The birth of the twins was successful. However, in 2003, the two still very
00:08:45
young twins were hospitalized for failing to thrive. This resulted in child protective services stepping in to
00:08:53
investigate the whole family and living situation. Social workers, which by the way may be the single most difficult job
00:09:01
in America, so cheers to those who do that job and do it well. The social workers reported that
00:09:07
Laeticia, and I'm guessing Captain her new beau's home, had no electricity or gas. That seems to be a reoccurring
00:09:16
theme here as of late on our show. We spoke a couple weeks ago on our Jalique Rainwalker episode about parents raising
00:09:24
their own children plus some adopted children in a home with no electric, no gas or outdoor plumbing only, but that
00:09:33
was by choice from those parents, right? The home that we are talking about right now, the
00:09:39
living situation that we're talking about right now, has those amenities. And I'm guessing that Leticia and her
00:09:46
man's home, well, they just chose not to pay those bills or could not pay those bills.
00:09:52
And the people over at the electric company, gas company, well, they shut that [ __ ] off.
00:09:57
I'm thinking here that this home only had running water because the good people over at the water company in most
00:10:04
areas won't turn it off even if you don't pay. So, social workers found poor living conditions for these two
00:10:12
children. A filthy house with maggots growing, living, and even flourishing on dirty dishes throughout the home.
00:10:20
Yummy. Yummy. Mhm. The children were not well taken care of. In fact, they were malnourished. The kids were not clean,
00:10:28
either. They were covered in dirt and worse, covered in bruises. So, we've got to take these children out
00:10:35
of this bad living situation. So, easy fix, right? When the biological parents are separated, we will just send the
00:10:42
kids to live with and be raised by dad, Jeff Hall. Right? Well, that's going to be wrong
00:10:48
because daddy's got a drinking problem. Right. Jeff Hall was on probation for driving under the influence. As a
00:10:57
result, his two children were temporarily placed with their grandmother. And then about a year later, this would
00:11:03
be 2004, by now Jeff must have cleaned up his act a bit because Jeff Hall was granted full
00:11:11
custody of his two children, Joseph and Shirley. After Jeff's divorce to his first wife
00:11:18
and the mother of his two kids, he was in a good relationship with a woman named Krista McCary.
00:11:25
And the two did get married, and they would go on to have three children together.
00:11:31
And it looks like they were all girls. So, eventually in the whole household, we have Jeff and his second wife,
00:11:39
Krista, his two children, Joseph and Shirley from Jeff's first marriage, and then Jeff and Krista's three
00:11:46
daughters. So, a larger family of seven all living under one roof. It's such a common theme in this country
00:11:53
where parents aren't able to take care of their one kids of the first marriage, and then then the
00:12:01
second marriage they go on to have more kids. And it's like you couldn't take care of
00:12:05
the first set of kids. Is it the ones that can't that can't take care of the kids the most tend to have the most
00:12:11
kids? Yeah. Are you trying to have enough kids so that eventually in like a Shameless
00:12:17
situation, they just raise themselves, they raise each other? Yeah, or maybe they're just such a great tax write-off.
00:12:23
Well, Jeff earned a living and provided for his big family with his job, of course, and Jeff is a plumber.
00:12:30
But then sometime in 2008, Jeff lost his job. Again, we should keep in mind for those not old enough to have
00:12:39
experienced this as an adult, but the wicked triad of the stock market crash, the housing bubble bursting, and the
00:12:48
massive job loss truly affected everyone in some shape or form, and of course, some more than others in this country.
00:12:56
Right. As said in the trailer, America in most areas anyway, stopped building houses, and a lot of people lost their
00:13:04
jobs, and some companies were disappearing. Well, and he was a plumber, but I think
00:13:08
his specialty was new builds. Right. And they really stopped building houses for
00:13:14
years. Mhm. And as said, some companies were disappearing. So, even if you know, you're laid off from your job,
00:13:22
but then eventually your company that you worked for goes away. So, that job disappears forever, for eternity. Mhm.
00:13:29
And it would take years for a lot of these jobs to return. Years for the economy to recover. Right, but a
00:13:37
plumber with new builds, once the new builds go away, you still have the trade of being a plumber. And people always
00:13:45
need plumbers. Right. And And he lost his job, and when he did, he was not finding work, and it sounds like this
00:13:52
continued for some time, a good deal of time. Upset by this, and in what is just a
00:13:59
display of bizarre ignorance, Jeff decided that minorities and Jews were to blame for the thinning job market and
00:14:06
his inability to find a job. This is going off of the words of his mother. I cannot tell you what influenced him to
00:14:16
to decide to join the local neo-Nazi movement, but he did. And her words are that it had to do with his inability to
00:14:25
find a job. Well, here's this guy that Look, the economy sucks. Your job is gone.
00:14:31
You can't find work, or or maybe you're not really looking for work, so then you
00:14:35
start looking for somebody to blame. And and then, for whatever reason, he's in a situation where
00:14:44
there's a local neo-Nazi group. Somehow, he not only becomes a part of that, he becomes a a thriving member. Yeah, he
00:14:53
becomes a bit of a leader in the local chapter. Now, we mentioned that the unemployment rate peaked at 10%
00:15:00
nationwide, but in Jeff's area, in his local area, it at one point was as high as 15%.
00:15:09
Those numbers are normally skewed down, so it could be as high as 20, 25%. For those that don't know, and despite
00:15:18
really what I think some may think, the neo-Nazism is a global phenomenon. It's not something that just is
00:15:26
happening or happened in this country. Mhm. Uh but it's representation is in other countries as well. In fact,
00:15:34
in many countries. And of course, neo-Nazis seek to employ their ideology to promote hatred and attack minorities
00:15:43
and in some cases create a fascist state. There's probably larger groups found in European countries than
00:15:51
than are found in the states. And as said, he would grow to prominence amongst these idiots, right? So, he
00:16:00
becomes a bit of a He's the leader of idiots. Right, right. He becomes a bit of a
00:16:06
leader, a vocal guy, a vocal leader in his local chapter. This is for the National Socialist Movement or the NSM.
00:16:15
And I guess the NSM is the largest neo-Nazi group in in this country, maybe in most countries. I I don't know enough
00:16:26
about this to be honest with you here, Captain. It's not something I've spent much time on in my lifetime
00:16:33
reading about. When you see some of these meetings, they're pretty small. And it also looks
00:16:40
like the average person that's attending, like seems like there's some normal people
00:16:46
or they appear to be normal normal on the outside. There's other ones that look like that
00:16:52
maybe their parents were cousins. Um it's it's it's a unique group. I mean, it's
00:17:00
it's like Walmart at at midnight. Uh-oh. That's that's that's That's rude to the to the Walmart
00:17:09
people. Well, so he is involved in this group and as said, he's a vocal leader. Now,
00:17:16
one thing where he really this really drops on the map where you start seeing this group
00:17:22
not just being involved because they're always involved in these like protest and things like that, but you see Jeff's
00:17:29
heavy involvement. This starts with a rally near a day laborer site in Jeff's hometown of Riverside, California. This
00:17:38
was in October of 2009. Now, at the rally Jeff and the rest of his band of idiots wore World War II era
00:17:47
Nazi uniforms. You You know, you don't have to use much of an imagination to picture one of those.
00:17:53
Not only did he join this little hate club, but apparently these members like to
00:17:59
play dress-up as well. Well, think about how stupid these individuals are. We We
00:18:04
can't get jobs. We're We're We're lazy. That's That's how I'm taking it. These guys are lazy. I know people struggled
00:18:12
through this time, but they're protesting day laborers. Guys that would sit on the corner
00:18:18
somewhere and hoping somebody would pick them up to take them to a construction site or whatever.
00:18:24
Instead of protesting, maybe you should have been in that line waiting to get picked up to do some work
00:18:31
that day. Well, Jeff would travel out of town and even out of state to join in on
00:18:36
these rallies. I mean, there were there were at least two that he went to that were out of state. I'm suspecting it was
00:18:42
was several more. And the Look, this is really when I question someone's motivations, right?
00:18:50
When somebody is complaining that, "Hey, I'm involved in this or this got me involved in this because I couldn't find
00:18:57
work." If that's the genesis of this whole weird hate club that you're in, I don't understand why he's not spending
00:19:05
more time out looking for work. It seems to be a lot of time involved with this with his neo-Nazi group,
00:19:12
and then also spending money on money that he does not have Right. on the on playing dress-up with
00:19:19
his friends. Right. And basically it's because if I hang out with these losers, I'm the king
00:19:25
of the losers, so it makes makes my dick feel a little bit bigger. It's people giving him an excuse for
00:19:32
this horrible behavior. In 2010, Jeff Hall ran for election against an incumbent for the Western
00:19:41
Municipal Water District Board as a member of the National Socialist Movement. Jeff, to what I hope is to the
00:19:52
astonishment of everyone listening, he received about a third of the vote. That's right, just a little more and
00:19:59
Jeff would have been elected and the good people of Riverside, California would have had a hate-fueled racist
00:20:06
sitting on the board of Municipal Water District. This, when people look at this
00:20:12
from the outside looking in, especially people in other countries, they'll go, "That makes sense because America is,
00:20:20
{quote} {unquote}, a racist country." That this guy managed to get a third of the vote. One problem, amongst other
00:20:28
problems that we have here in the states, is that people in communities pay very little attention to local
00:20:35
elections. Our voter turnout rate for local elections is is really despicable. Right. People don't pay attention, they
00:20:44
don't know what's going on, they don't care, and therefore they don't vote. Now, when you have a guy as vocal as
00:20:50
Jeff Hall, who says, "Hey, I'm with this NSM." He's preaching to his NSM brothers
00:20:57
and sisters and saying, "Hey, get out there and vote for me. Vote for me because then you're putting one of you
00:21:02
on this board of water." And actually the board of water, there is a decent amount of power that comes with that. I
00:21:12
won't go too much into it cuz I one I don't know a whole lot about it, but anybody that has seen one of my favorite
00:21:17
shows Goliath season 3 will understand that there is a decent amount of power and responsibility that comes with this
00:21:24
position. He did not get elected. In March of 2011, Hall and his group of about two dozen
00:21:32
white supremacists took to the streets in the affluent, primarily residential Claremont, Los Angeles County,
00:21:40
sometimes called the quote City of Trees and PhDs. They had a screaming confrontation with
00:21:47
counter-protesters of more than 200 immigrant rights activists who de who declared the group as racist.
00:21:57
Dozens of officers from several police agencies were on hand to keep the peace. Now, during this whole 3-year time
00:22:05
period, remember Jeff divorced his first wife, the mother of two of his children,
00:22:10
Joseph and Shirley, years ago. And the kids were taken from her. His first wife eventually moved out of
00:22:17
the state of California and remarried, but in early 2011, she moved back to California and because
00:22:25
she did such a great job as a mother the first time, she was attempting to regain
00:22:30
custody of Shirley and Joseph. In all fairness, though, people all make mistakes. People should be allowed the
00:22:37
opportunity to turn their life around and get back involved with their children's lives.
00:22:43
Agreed. Now, according to Jeff's mother, Joanne Patterson, she says that little Joseph
00:22:50
was a difficult child. He was volatile and at times even violent. Yeah, I said he was kind of a odd duck
00:22:57
from the beginning. Well, this all to the point that Joseph was kicked out of several different
00:23:04
schools over the years. I saw one report that said he attended I believe seven different schools. I'm guessing he was
00:23:11
kicked out of all of them. Wow. Uh some of the more notable offenses committed by Joseph, he attacked students, he
00:23:20
attacked school staff. I believe he was accused or did stab another child with a
00:23:27
pencil. And he was even um expelled for choking a teacher with a phone cord. Mhm. So, this is a very
00:23:37
violent little child. Yeah, it's the chicken or the egg though because he was also
00:23:44
I guess violently disciplined by his father. He was abused is is the way that I I see this. And I don't mean to argue
00:23:53
that point, but I'm just saying from everything that I read, it wasn't a situation where dad gets drunk and mad
00:24:01
and starts punching everybody. It seems to me like this situation was kid gets in trouble
00:24:09
dad takes the takes the punishment too far. The kid experienced in his abuse. Yeah, in his 10 years of life up to this
00:24:18
point, the kid experienced 20 times that child protective services were called on
00:24:25
his parents and they did not remove the child from the house. Maybe they didn't find anything wrong going on, but
00:24:33
usually where there's smoke, there's fire. And that's that's 20 calls. And the other thing too, a lot of his
00:24:44
his behavior and and the the problems that that Joseph has a lot of this stems from something we
00:24:51
talked about a few weeks ago with Jalique Rainwalker's case. It's a very similar situation.
00:24:56
During the pregnancy with Joseph, mommy and daddy were drinking and using drugs.
00:25:02
You know, mom was using smack and drinking alcohol all the time, and I understand she's the one carrying the
00:25:09
baby. Dad's just as much to blame. He was using drugs and drinking as well during that pregnancy.
00:25:15
So, they had a real problem with Joseph controlling his behavior, and then it sounds like, as the captain pointed out,
00:25:22
a real hob- a real problem with Jeff controlling his behavior as well. The difficult thing with Joseph, though,
00:25:30
is the real problem is not just controlling his actions, but it also seems like the understanding
00:25:38
of consequences of his actions. His grandmother said that that Joseph doesn't understand cause and effect.
00:25:47
And I think that this statement here, Captain, is a bit more complicated than just the way it sounds on the surface.
00:25:54
So, Joseph having the inability to comprehend the consequences of his actions goes beyond just his failure to
00:26:02
understand that he does something bad, he will be held accountable, and there will be a punishment for his
00:26:08
bad behavior. But also, it's his failure to recognize and be able to understand that his
00:26:14
actions also have lasting effects and consequences on others as well. Meaning, he doesn't understand that if
00:26:22
he violently attacks someone, it's not just Joseph acting out, it's not just Joseph getting that anger and aggression
00:26:29
out of his system. It is him physically hurting and causing harm to someone or something.
00:26:36
His violence can have a real impact, can cause real trauma, and can have lasting
00:26:42
hurt or damage, or even permanent damage or destruction. All right, we're back. Cheers. Let me
00:27:26
make these. Cheers to you, Captain. Cheers to all the people in the back. Did you have fun in Jamaica? I did.
00:27:34
Jamaica had fun because I was there. Well, it's we're all glad that you're back. I'm I'm glad to be back. All
00:27:41
right, Captain. Let's get back at it. We are now at April of 2011. And Jeff's dress-up hate club, well, they're
00:27:50
getting some media attention. On Saturday, April 30th, a reporter was on location at Jeff Hall's home. This
00:27:59
was for the purpose of witnessing one of their meetings. This was a typical Saturday meeting. I don't know if they
00:28:06
were hosted every other Saturday. It's my understanding it wasn't every Saturday. Right.
00:28:11
But they called this their Saturday meeting. Hosted by Jeff at his home, at his house.
00:28:18
And at this meeting, his wife and children are present. There is some video footage of small portions of this
00:28:26
meeting that are available. It does not appear that the children were participating in the meeting. They were
00:28:33
simply there and can be seen running in and out of the house. It's more more like a family barbecue. So, they might
00:28:41
not have been participating in the conversations being had during the meetings, but
00:28:47
you reporters talked to his mother about how these meetings went down, she said,
00:28:52
"Look, these were these seemed like family barbecues where people are happy to see each other,
00:28:58
having some drinks, grilling out food, and and kids would be running around playing." Yes, that is a part of it, but
00:29:06
I I want to be clear, there is some formalities to these to these barbecues. They they are official meetings, and you
00:29:13
can see video footage of individuals taking turns standing at the front of the room addressing the rest of the
00:29:21
group who are sitting in rows Mhm. uh hanging on every word of the person giving their speech at the time. Well,
00:29:28
and and I want to be clear there, too. They're they're not forcing the 10-year-old to sit down and listen to
00:29:34
every word, but those kids are in that area, so they're going to hear all those words.
00:29:40
They're going to They're going to hear all this hate speech. You can see the children in the video
00:29:45
footage that I saw, you can see them running in and out of the house, repeatedly opening and closing the
00:29:51
sliding glass door to access the backyard and then to come back in from time to time. So, you're exactly right,
00:29:57
they are hearing this, and it looks like most of the meeting portion was held in
00:30:03
Jeff's living room, and following a round of hate speech, they would finish off the get-together with a
00:30:10
cookout and then oftentimes games as well. The reporter interviewed Jeff and other members of the group and even
00:30:18
spoke with little 10-year-old Joseph, who showed off a leather belt bearing a silver insignia of the Nazi SS
00:30:29
that his father gave to him. The article would run in the New York Times in May of 2011. The title was
00:30:38
white supremacist immigrant rights activist face off in Claremont. This would be Jeff Hall's last NSM meeting.
00:30:47
You say it's called a NSM? National Socialist Movement. Not smart men? Right. Or no
00:30:55
This is my favorite. No stiff members. Well, in all fairness, there were females
00:31:01
members as well. That's why the members couldn't have stiff members. At 4:02 a.m. May 1st, 2011, 26-year-old Krista
00:31:09
McAirey calls 911. Yelling into the phone, she explains that her husband has been shot.
00:31:17
She's reporting her husband, 32-year-old Jeff Hall, has been shot in the head. There is some audio available online.
00:31:25
I've only managed to hear a clip of it, so not the full audio file, but you can hear Krista yelling.
00:31:32
And you can also hear what sounds like children crying in the background. She says that her husband has been shot,
00:31:40
and the shooter was her son, Joseph. When asked by the operator, "How old is your son?" Krista says, "10."
00:31:50
And the operator, clearly surprised by the answer, or maybe even to the point of believing they did not hear the woman
00:31:58
correctly, says, "Again, what age is your son?" And Krista says, "10." Now, if I could, Captain, I'd like to
00:32:06
read for you and everyone else a police report filed with the County of Riverside Supreme Court of California.
00:32:14
This was filed May 17th, 2011, and I think this best describes what the police findings were regarding this
00:32:24
homicide. All right. Now, mind you, this is an official document filed with the court, so it does get a little
00:32:30
repetitive as you must use names as much as possible to make it super clear who is doing or saying what.
00:32:39
Well, I think me and the listeners are all used to you being repetitive. On May 1st, 2011,
00:32:46
Riverside PD was dispatched to and the address is redacted, in the city of Riverside, California. Upon arrival,
00:32:54
Jeffrey Hall was found deceased on the couch with a gunshot wound to the left side of his head.
00:33:00
There were five children ages 10, 9, 7, 3, and 2 months old in the residence along with their
00:33:08
mother, Krista McCary. Those subjects were removed from the residence and transported to the
00:33:14
Magnolia Police Station for interviews. Detective Roberta Hopewell conducted interviews with four of the five
00:33:22
children. Obviously, the 2-month-old was not interviewed. During the interviews, three of the four
00:33:30
children knew where Krista and Jeffrey kept their gun. And the youngest, name redacted, 3 years
00:33:39
old, knew the gun was in the house. Okay, so before we we move on from that, Captain, let's clear that up. What
00:33:46
they're saying is there's five children in the home. The one's just a baby. We don't We can't interview the baby. But
00:33:51
of the four kids that we did interview, three of them knew exactly where the gun
00:33:57
was that was used to kill Jeff Hall, located in the home where the parents hid it.
00:34:03
And the youngest of these four did not know exactly where it was, but knew that there was a gun present in the house.
00:34:12
Mhm. So, it's no secret that there are firearms in the house, and these children know how to Some of them know
00:34:18
how to access this firearm. The oldest child, which is Joseph, admitted during the interview that he
00:34:25
was tired of his dad hitting him and his mom. Now, he calls his stepmom Mom, just be
00:34:32
clear. He's known her for for years and Krista really is the closest thing he has to to a mother. She's the acting
00:34:41
mother. Joseph said that he thought his dad was cheating on his mom and thought he might
00:34:47
have to choose which person he would live with. Joseph told Detective Hopewell he knew
00:34:53
his mom and dad had a gun and knew where they kept it. Joseph said he went into his mom and
00:35:00
dad's closet, got the gun, which is a Rossi .357 revolver, from a low shelf in the closet.
00:35:09
Joseph said it was right there on the shelf. Joseph told Detective Hopewell that he went downstairs with the gun,
00:35:16
pulled the hammer back, aimed the gun at his dad's ear while he was asleep and shot him. Joseph said he
00:35:24
went upstairs and hid the gun under his bed. That is where the responding officers
00:35:30
did find the gun when they arrived at the house. Detective Hopewell asked Shirley, 9 years old, about the guns
00:35:38
that were in the house. Shirley described the gun as small and black. She said mom keeps it on the shelf
00:35:45
behind the jewelry box. She said that all the kids knew where mom kept the gun. Shirley said mom had a small gun
00:35:55
and dad had a big one. There was also a rifle that was found in that same closet. Shirley said all the
00:36:01
guns were kept in the closet. She said that she had been target practicing with mom and dad, but was told not to touch
00:36:08
the guns. Detective Hopewell talked to Now, the name is redacted. I don't know the name of this child, but it's the
00:36:16
7-year-old daughter, who said she knew mom had a gun in the house and dad had a gun. She said mom
00:36:24
kept the gun in her closet where the clothes, jewelry, and other important stuff are.
00:36:29
She described the gun as black and silver. She described the gun sitting on a low shelf.
00:36:36
And this little girl put her hand up during the interview to about the level of her forehead and said that that is
00:36:44
how high the shelf was. So, this is a low shelf in the closet. The girl said that dad had a big gun,
00:36:51
obviously describing the rifle, that she saw him shoot at target practice and that he keeps it in the
00:36:57
closet. Continuing on, page two, the residence at again, address redacted, was filthy.
00:37:06
There was dirty clothing on the floors everywhere. You couldn't walk through the upstairs rooms without stepping on
00:37:12
clothing on the floor. The bedrooms smelled like urine. The bedroom mattresses, pillows, and
00:37:19
blankets were stained and soiled. The floors were dirty and didn't appear to have been vacuumed in a long time.
00:37:26
The bathrooms upstairs were also filthy. Officers located the .357 Magnum revolver under the bed in Joseph's room.
00:37:37
Officers also located an empty holster on the described lower shelf in the closet of the master bedroom.
00:37:45
A bolt-action rifle was also found in a locked case on a higher shelf in the closet.
00:37:53
There were several edged weapons in the closet of the master bedroom that were also accessible to the children.
00:38:01
Knives, bladed weapons, that sort of thing. The downstairs was very dirty. Empty
00:38:07
beer bottles were in the area and National Socialist Movement flag and California Republic flag were hanging in
00:38:16
the living room. A .22 caliber rifle was located in the garage leaning against the wall,
00:38:23
accessible to the children. The rifle was unloaded. There was an unlocked cabinet in the garage with
00:38:29
ammunition approximately 10 ft from the rifle. The cabinet contained .22 caliber
00:38:35
long rifle ammunition as well as several edged weapons that were accessible to the children.
00:38:42
This detective goes on to state, "I interviewed Krista about any abuse in the house against the children. Krista
00:38:48
said Jeffrey has been violent with Joseph and herself." Krista said Jeffrey kicks, hits, and
00:38:55
yells at Joseph more than the other children. Krista said that Jeffrey did these
00:39:00
things to punish Joseph. Krista said, "Joseph would get punished for being too loud or getting in
00:39:07
Jeffrey's way." He's The kid's getting punished for for pretty small infractions. Right. Krista
00:39:13
said Jeffrey would get out of control when he punished Joseph, including punching and kicking him several times
00:39:20
in the back. Krista said Joseph would get punished on a daily basis, but not always to the extreme punching and
00:39:27
kicking. Krista said Jeffrey would also punish the girls, but not like he would punish Joseph. Krista said the girls
00:39:34
would get yelled at, pushed, and spanked by Jeffrey for their punishment. The detective says, "I interviewed Krista
00:39:41
about the weapons that were in the house." Krista said there were two guns, and she knew that they were registered
00:39:47
to Jeffrey. The officer says they were not registered to There was no registration located. So, that they
00:39:54
weren't registered to anybody? That's what it sounds like, or at least based off of 6 days of investigation,
00:40:01
that's what they came up with. I don't know what they found after this was filed.
00:40:05
Krista said there was a rifle that was kept somewhere in the closet, and they also had a black revolver in a holster.
00:40:12
The black revolver is the one found under Joseph Joseph's bed used to kill his father.
00:40:19
Krista said the revolver was located on the lower shelf in the closet and she admitted that the revolver was on a low
00:40:26
shelf where the kids had access to it. Krista said that Jeffrey kept it there so he had access to it. Krista said that
00:40:34
she did not think the children knew where the gun was kept. Obviously, we've interviewed four
00:40:42
of the five children. Mhm. And had the the youngest child been old enough, she would have known where the gun was
00:40:49
as well, right? Cuz three out of the four know exactly where it is and and the fourth child knows that it's in the
00:40:55
house somewhere. Well, this is laziness upon your responsibilities. And I I want to go back to one of the
00:41:02
things that you said is when you see the reports, there's cameras inside their home.
00:41:11
It doesn't seem a mess to me or I agree. dirty at all. I mean, the what you described,
00:41:21
that's abuse to have your kids sleeping on piss-filled beds, for your house to be that dirty,
00:41:30
that's abuse. That is laziness of your responsibilities. So, if you're not even willing to clean
00:41:36
up your or help your kids clean up their bedrooms, are you going to really know if the your
00:41:43
guns are secured and away from your children? Well, but what I see here, Captain, is no attempt
00:41:49
to secure the guns. It's not like they all we forgot and this happened. It It just appears that they there's no
00:41:56
attempt to really The most that they're doing to keep these guns from the kids is to tell
00:42:02
the kids, "Don't touch the gun." Yeah, but it's just so weird to me cuz and again, I'm not the reporter, but the
00:42:09
house doesn't look dirty. So, the fact that the upstairs is just a disaster area. But, you have to believe it. I
00:42:16
mean, it's it's a official report. But, I it's very possible they go, "Oh, well,
00:42:21
we have some a news reporters coming over. We got to clean the downstairs real quick."
00:42:26
And that's what I think happened. And I agree with you. That was what jumped off
00:42:29
the page to me immediately. I'm like, "Wait a second. I just watched video footage." Now, mind you, it's not
00:42:35
They're not going around and looking in every crack and crevice of the house. rooms, you know.
00:42:39
It's two rooms that you see. And you're getting really a, you know, eye-level view of the living room and maybe
00:42:46
portions of the kitchen at times. But, that's what I thought, too. I'm like, "Wait a second. This This report
00:42:53
what they're reporting here in this court report is from roughly about 12 or less than 12 hours later from what was
00:43:01
videotaped Right. on the day before. And I'm like, "That house didn't look dirty
00:43:05
to me." And to be honest with you, it looked fairly clean. The The small portions that I could see. But, you're
00:43:11
right. The The report as it reads is clearly specifically talking about the upstairs of the house, which is not
00:43:18
visible in any part of the video footage that I saw. Yeah. So, we go on about We're talking about
00:43:24
the inability or the the lack of caring to secure these guns away from the children. It sounds like,
00:43:32
you know, old Jeff wants to have at least this handgun accessible to him at the quick. So, in that thought,
00:43:41
he's not gone a step further to have it available to him, but not to the children or anyone else.
00:43:49
And the detective does get Krista to admit on the record. It says right here, "Krista admitted the closet door does
00:43:56
not have a lock on it." So, they don't even have the ability to lock the closet door to keep these guns from the
00:44:04
children. To which, after that statement, the detective says I advised her that there
00:44:10
was so much junk and clothes on the floor that I did not think the closet door could shut. Krista just acted
00:44:17
surprised that the children knew about the gun. Krista said that Jeffrey did bring the
00:44:24
gun out occasionally and put it on the nightstand for protection. Krista said Jeffrey took Joseph target shooting
00:44:32
when they went to a border trip so Joseph knew how to shoot guns. The detective goes on to state that the
00:44:40
conditions of the he says apartment which seems confusing to me because it very much it's always described
00:44:47
everywhere else as a house and it looks like a house to me. Yeah, I thought you can see the outside of the house during
00:44:53
the report as well. Yeah, I don't know if maybe it was a duplex or Right. But but it looks it's a house, right? We can
00:45:00
agree on that. Or maybe they were renting the house so that's where the term apartment came from. There you go.
00:45:06
The detective says that the conditions were filthy and not sanitary for the four children and infant to live in. The
00:45:14
residence was also unsafe with loaded weapons as well as edged weapons readily accessible to all of the children.
00:45:22
There appeared to be some abuse of the children by Jeffrey according to Krista although there were no bruises found at
00:45:28
the time of these interviews. There have been numerous contacts to this family by child protective services
00:45:36
but most of the allegations were unfounded due to a bitter child custody dispute over Joseph and Shirley
00:45:44
by Jeffrey's ex-wife. That is the official report that was filed for the court system. Right, so we have
00:45:52
this 10-year-old that doesn't seem to understand a great deal about cause and effect.
00:45:59
It seems also like he's been abused by both sets of parents and he's been in situations where the situation becomes
00:46:06
abusive. Being dirty or pee-filled beds. And And then his dad becomes the leader of losers and he's
00:46:17
constantly s- probably speaking hate speech plus speaking about violence towards other
00:46:25
people. Yeah. And it's I mean, look, it's a We talked about the stock market crash
00:46:32
and all of the the bad practices and misdealings that were going on behind the scenes that really led to that.
00:46:41
Where you see something that, "Hey, this is inevitable. There is going to be something bad that will come of this."
00:46:49
That's the same thing with Joseph. He's born with behavior issues and disabilities because mom was using and
00:46:57
drinking during the pregnancy. He's a victim day one on this planet, on the big blue marble.
00:47:04
And then he's raised by a guy that can't control his actions, right? You're trying to You're trying to teach this
00:47:10
kid to learn about consequences, learn cause and effect, learn to behave, learn to control your actions, but yet the the
00:47:18
father in the household every time he gets mad or sees something or hears something he doesn't like, it's a smack
00:47:25
or it's a whack or it's a yell. It's the father using violence to solve his problems does not teach the child to do
00:47:33
anything different. Right. It's a very lazy way of trying to discipline a child.
00:47:39
And on top of that, you have again, these children are born with these lazy parents and
00:47:44
then the parents continue to have more children. It's like you're you're too lazy to one, take care of yourself, let
00:47:51
alone take it care of a child that you brought into this earth and now you're going to have five of them to take care
00:47:56
of. It's ridiculous. And you you also have a man who is preaching that there are masses of people out in this world
00:48:04
that are lesser than you, that are not equal to you. To a 10-year-old, does he even identify that
00:48:12
what that means? Does what is his understanding of all this hate speech that's going on? And look,
00:48:19
when the camera was on, it I mean, it it didn't sound super crazy, super violent stuff that
00:48:27
they were preaching. Right. But who knows once that camera was off what kind of talk was going on? Was this man
00:48:34
screaming about genocide? Right, right, but these were Let's not get it twisted. What they were
00:48:40
saying was uncomfortable to hear. If I heard that in public, I'd be the first one to say, "You need to
00:48:47
shut your mouth. You don't know what you're talking about." You know what I mean? Uncomfortable to
00:48:52
hear. I'm sorry. Go ahead. What I'm saying is in their meetings, what they're talking about is it's still
00:49:01
hate speech. They might not be saying, "We're going to go around killing everybody."
00:49:06
Yeah, 100 Yeah, I'm I'm not confused about that. Right. What I'm saying is it's speech
00:49:10
that I won't stand for. And whether it's in somebody else's house or in public, but
00:49:15
Yeah, I'm wondering how far does it go when the cameras aren't there. I mean, we have we have a lot of things going
00:49:21
on. And And again, we're getting the perspective of a 10-year-old, but he's saying some pretty
00:49:29
scary things to the detectives when he's being interviewed. Look, this this statement by Joseph is
00:49:35
terrifying. He's told police that a few days before the shooting, his father Jeff threatened to remove all of the
00:49:44
smoke detectors in the home and set the house on fire while the family is sleeping. Right.
00:49:52
That's horrifying. if that really happened. That is a horrifying thing for a child to hear. And then let's times
00:49:59
that by 10 because it's your own father saying that to you or to your family. This is This child is telling police and
00:50:07
detectives that he is being hit and kicked by this man. And he's also witnessing his mother
00:50:15
who technically is his stepmother, but it to him it's his mother being abused by this man as well. Hit And he even
00:50:22
describes it a few days before he shoots his father that that Jeff threw a glass
00:50:28
or or a beer bottle or something of that nature at Krista cutting her on her face.
00:50:34
And I find it interesting that in that report he says he kind of feels like there is a divorce
00:50:41
that's going to There's going to be a split up that's going to happen between mom and dad. He's going to have to go
00:50:46
choose who he lives with. You almost wonder he's old enough to know and understand
00:50:51
that Krista is not his biological mother. That maybe he won't get a choice. He'll be stuck with this
00:50:57
piece of [ __ ] loser. The guy that he's scared of. He's afraid of his father. His father was dealt a good hand and his
00:51:03
and his father pissed it all away and was lazy and didn't work hard and then wants to point the finger at everybody
00:51:10
and wants to blame everybody and other cultures and other religion and people of other colors are all to blame
00:51:18
but himself. He's not He's blaming everybody but himself. And this weak-minded piece of [ __ ] then takes it out
00:51:29
on children and his wife. That shows you how big of a loser this guy was. Of course, if he's if he's
00:51:36
blaming masses of people for his for his failures, of course he's blaming his own
00:51:44
family behind closed doors for those failures as well or for his own unhappiness.
00:51:50
Yeah. And he strikes out and lashes out at them like a like a like a child would
00:51:55
like a like a like a infant throw or a toddler throwing a temper tantrum. It just shows that all their the their hate
00:52:03
speech and all their rhetoric is nonsense. I mean, these people that go well, we just want to
00:52:08
protect the white race. You don't want to protect the white race. You don't even want to protect
00:52:14
your own children. They're sleeping in pee-filled beds. You're protecting your children, you
00:52:20
massive pile of [ __ ] Of course, Joseph was arrested. He was taken to juvenile juvenile hall.
00:52:29
The other four children were taken into protective custody. This is because Krista was later arrested and charged
00:52:36
with criminal storage of firearms and child neglect. Look, I'm for people owning guns, but the most
00:52:45
important part of owning firearms is being a responsible owner of firearms and understanding that
00:52:53
you you are responsible for that gun at all times. Right. No matter where it is,
00:52:59
no matter where you are. You are the one that needs to conceal that and keep it locked away from
00:53:07
a child. This this boy, regardless of his problems, even regardless of the abuse that's going on, let's set that
00:53:13
all aside. But this kid knew where this gun was. And when he talks to police, he clearly
00:53:21
you can blame this on his age, you can blame this on his disability, you can blame it on
00:53:26
everything under the sun. But when he's talking to detectives, he's saying things that are clear that
00:53:33
he does not understand the consequences of putting that gun and shooting his father behind the left ear at zero
00:53:41
range. At near zero range he shot this man. Right. He says to detectives "I just wanted to I just thought I would
00:53:49
teach him a lesson. I just thought that I I would teach my father how it feels to be hurt and maybe he would learn
00:53:56
something from this and we could be friends again." He also asked the detective "How many
00:54:01
lives does a person get?" He in some other questioning he says to says about his father "I I hope we can
00:54:08
be friends again uh if he's not dead." He doesn't understand what he did or what's going on.
00:54:17
And and guns and ammunition readily available to to a child of that age very very dangerous. Yeah, partly that's
00:54:23
disability but also that's partly his age. The well, yeah, but but also the lack of
00:54:29
responsibility that his parents took upon themselves. It's just like if you saw a 10-year-old
00:54:35
that didn't know how to ride a bike, you don't blame the 10-year-old for not knowing how to ride a bike. The parents
00:54:41
never took the time to try to teach the child. So the fact that this kid never had
00:54:47
maybe never had a conversation on on life and reality and anything. Right, but this is a whole
00:54:54
different story maybe not even a story at all if they would have bothered to just lock up the guns.
00:55:00
Now Joeyann Patterson Jeff Hall's mother and Joseph's grandmother she was given temporary custody of the
00:55:09
other four children. On a interview that she did with 60 Minutes she said that she was not surprised that Joseph killed
00:55:18
his father. But she expected it would not have happened until her grandson was much
00:55:24
older. On January 14th, 2013 Joseph Hall despite his age at the time of the killing was found to be
00:55:35
responsible for Jeff Hall's death. Joseph was sentenced to a juvenile detention facility until he reaches the
00:55:42
age of 23. He is eligible for parole at the age of 20. Joseph turned 20 years old in June of
00:55:52
this year. So then it again it becomes the conversation of chicken or the egg and as far as 10-year-olds or or I guess
00:56:01
young children committing violence against their parents that would end in death,
00:56:09
there's not that many cases. It seems like there's multiple reports that I've seen
00:56:14
where it's like nine 10-year-olds since 1980 and then I've seen also reports where
00:56:21
it's like this happens roughly once a year. But I thought something that was kind of
00:56:28
telling from the grandmother was that she suspected that her grandson would eventually kill his father.
00:56:36
It just would happen later in life. Yeah, I mean so let's let's analyze that for a second. I I take her statement to
00:56:44
mean possibly a couple things. Maybe it's her opinion that this boy, Joseph, was was
00:56:53
violent and misbehaved and misunderstood the world from day one and it never changed.
00:57:02
And it never changed when he was five, when he was seven, when he was 10 years old. It never changed and he was violent
00:57:08
enough that that she believed you know, it's difficult when you analyze her statement because you go
00:57:15
does it does that mean she believed he would kill someone or or specifically kill
00:57:22
his father. Right. at some point in his life. You also have to wonder is she deflating the blame that that you could
00:57:31
put on the victim here. And that's what's very difficult in the telling of this story and even when you hear
00:57:38
interviews by the family of Joseph of Jeffrey Hall and Joseph Hall, you have a situation where
00:57:46
look, the victim is not likable. The The victim is is talking about some pretty disgusting and disgraceful things and
00:57:54
teaching them to his children likely. Definitely teaching them to not only his children but other children. And
00:58:02
it's hard because you don't want to victim blame somebody and again, the problem with death in this case is
00:58:11
this racist bastard you can't write his wrongs either because he's dead. So, there's there's no changing him now.
00:58:23
Yeah. But then on the on the flip side of things, would he have gotten worse and would he
00:58:31
have made this small group of small-minded individuals would he have of made them stronger and would they
00:58:39
have caused harm and would it have gone from not just protesting and hate speech
00:58:46
to actually criminal activities against other people? And you wonder if it's just a better world now because he's not
00:58:54
here. Well, it's exactly the same thing that we talked about a few weeks ago when we
00:59:00
were talking about the 1995 article written by criminologist John Dilulio where he's discussing look, when you
00:59:07
raise children in a in a terrible environment that is filled with with hate or neglect or or violence,
00:59:19
this is what you're teaching them to become. They they they they fill they become one
00:59:25
of those three things where they either neglect their own children or they grow up to become violent and you start to
00:59:32
see that violence lashing out to others in the communities in the early ages of even teenage years.
00:59:41
And with with Joseph, again, it's a difficult situation, Captain, because his statements to police clearly
00:59:49
showed to me he does not understand the ramifications of his actions or anything
00:59:55
that he did that night. It doesn't it doesn't make it that he should not be punished. Right.
01:00:02
And I say that because what you're doing is you're you're creating a dangerous situation for the public if you continue
01:00:09
to allow this child to to live in a community. You're you're putting everybody else in danger because
01:00:15
of that. And hopefully hopefully he was young enough when he went into the system and look, I'm going
01:00:22
to get attacked for this because there's not a lot of people that like the system. I don't blame you. I'm not I'm
01:00:26
not cheering on the prison system here, but what I am hoping for in Joseph's case
01:00:34
is that he can live in an environment that has clear rules that are black and white. That there are no gray area.
01:00:41
There is no father smacking, punching, kicking him. There is no father overreacting and
01:00:48
beating him up over something. Mhm. That this child is able to live in an environment where there are clear-cut
01:00:55
rules, that there's some form of education that he can get and maybe he can live in an environment where he can
01:01:03
be rehabilitated. And he can move on from this at some point because we are already at a point
01:01:10
where parole is is a discussion for this young man. Yeah, it's really interesting because when he asked the
01:01:17
question "How many lives does my father get? It's very clear that the child doesn't understand what it is
01:01:28
to be human. But clearly his father believing that there's some kind of superior race or that we're different.
01:01:40
It's clear that he didn't understand what it was to be human. For everything True Crime Garage, check
01:02:04
us out at truecrimegarage.com. Check out the store page. We have some new shirts,
01:02:10
we have hats, we have beer koozies. Get all the good swag at truecrimegarage.com.
01:02:18
All right, Captain. Thank you to you. Really good stuff this week. We will be back next week with another off the
01:02:24
record on Monday and another case for you on Tuesday. Join us back here in the garage. Until then, be good, be kind,
01:02:31
and don't litter.