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[Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever
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you are, whatever you are doing, thanks for listening. I'm your host, Nick, and with me is a man that recently blew a
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20point lead in his pingpong match. He is here, ladies and gentlemen, to remind us that second place is the first loser.
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He is the captain. >> All I know is I got five rings now. Where's your rings, Cleveland?
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>> What happened to you, Captain? That that ping pong match, you really fell apart
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there. >> Yeah, I have bad knees. Today we are drinking Fuzzy Baby Ducks IPA by New England Brewing Company.
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Garagegrade 4 and a half bottle caps out of five. This is a fantastic citrus single hop IPA, one of Connecticut's
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finest beers by one of their finest brewers. Fuzzy Ducks was brought to us by some of our warm and fuzzy friends.
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First, we have Josh from Ontario, Canada. >> Next up, we have Chelsea from Alabama.
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>> Yeah, Chelsea says, "Alabama loves y'all." Chelsea recommends that we check out the Good People Brewing Company,
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especially their El Gordo Imperial Stout. >> That was my nickname in high school,
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Captain. I am Well, I was El Gordo. >> Uh, you should use that name for the show.
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>> Let's go to Fort Worth, Texas, and say hi and thank you to Matthew. Next, we have Gianna, who says, "I love the show
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and would love to hear some Michigan true crime." Well, we did cover the Oakland County child killer case. Of
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course, that was episode 28. And like all of our older episodes, that one is available in the iTunes store and on our
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website store page. >> And from Vernon, Connecticut, we have Michael. Big shout out to Michael.
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>> From Parts Unknown, we have Alexandra. Thank you, Alexandra. Also in Parts Unknown, we have Sue. So, thank you to
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Sue. And from Parts Roaming, we have Marzon, who says, "Hi, guys. I listen while driving on my 50 states tour and
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thank you for making my drive much more enjoyable. Marzon, make sure that you use a boat or a plane for the Hawaii
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portion of your trip. >> And from Springfield, Missouri, we have a big shout out beer shout out to Julie.
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>> Julie says, "Keep on rocking in the free world." Well, thank you, Julie. And last
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but not least, we have Nay from Echo Park, California, who says, "Thank you guys for putting out an entertaining and
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informative pod. grab some sticky monkey from Fire Fire Stone Walker Brewery. >> I will not grab no sticky monkey.
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>> So, thank you all for pitching in this week's beer fund. And if you want to kick it in for next week, go to true
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crimegar.com and click on the donate button. >> Yeah, you can just take your hand off
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that stingy monkey and then click on the donate button. And like always, we like
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your channel. That's enough of the business. Everybody gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer, and let's talk
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some true crime. [Music] [Music] The worst grade school shooting in US history. At least 27 dead, 20 children,
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seven adults, including the principal. And the gunman killed himself. and all over this town in churches like the
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United Methodist Church behind us. Well, the lights are on and they are still open for prayer tonight.
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>> They will be all night. People have been gathering here for prayer, to lean on
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each other and lean on a belief in something bigger than themselves, to help get through what is just impossible
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to believe here or anywhere else. The sentiment here echoed in what you're seeing now down by the Washington
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Monument in DC. Uh many members of the Connecticut delegation was there. But this story is really about their home
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here, New Town, Connecticut. Just 27,000 people. This is a place where people know each other. Families know each
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other. And what happened today is known by all. And it's not just about how many
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were lost. It's about the age. What is hitting everyone so hard is the reality of these being children that were
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targeted by a madman. We now know his name. We know he's 20 years old, Adam Lanza. We know that before he came to
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this school, he shot his own mother, Nancy, in the face, killing her at her home. The looming question is why this
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man then decided to come to this school. He shows up at a place where they're making gingerbread houses in preparation
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for the holidays and Christmas presents. Just kids, a man in black enters with a
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vest and multiple weapons and begins a massacre. [Music] Coline was not the first school shooting
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in history, but if you ask people my age, that's the first school massacre that we remember. And you hate to force
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yourself to rank these tragedies, but Sandy Hook certainly is one of the worst. These stories are becoming a
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common occurrence. We won't say it out loud, but we are becoming a little numb to these horrible events.
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>> Mhm. >> We used to kiss our kids and send them off hoping that they would learn
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something and make us proud. But these days, we kiss our kids and we hope that they come back. Once we shake off the
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shock and try to comprehend these tragic stories, we must know why. We seek out to answer every question one can think
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of. But even after we have done so, we are still confused. We have we have to blame someone. That part is easy as
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usually the guilty party is found close to his victims with a bullet in his head. But that's just not enough. That's
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not good enough because kids are not supposed to die. Parents are not supposed to bury their children. And
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children and young adults are supposed to have too many exciting things to look forward to in their lives to ever think
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or consider of carrying out these plans that end lives, ruin families, destroy communities, and break the hearts of a
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nation. Why do these things happen? Is the problem our gun control laws? Is the problem mindaltering pharmaceuticals
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that treat our troubled youth? Or is it the bullies? We simply may never know. But we're not going to stop asking why
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and we're not going to stop looking into these events to try to prevent them from
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happening again. >> Yeah. I believe most people our age or maybe a little younger uh the the times
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of high school or middle school or elementary school being in a place of safety, a place of education, a place of
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where you had so many first experiences. Maybe your first best friend, your first
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girlfriend, your first kiss. who knows what it was. Schools were a place of safety, a place that you would reminisce
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on once you left school, you know, the the glory days. And now schools, when you see a school flash on the news
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screen, you don't think, oh, something positive, you immediately assume, oh no, another school shooting happened again.
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And with Sandy Hook, it's more heinous because the victims were of age six and seven.
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>> Yeah. And the the hard thing here, Captain, was, you know, when we met in the garage last week and we left saying,
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"Okay, next week is Sandy Hook, we're very quickly thrown into the mix when we dive into these cases." And this one
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especially where where we're, you know, it's so difficult to to research because
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of the tragic events. It's so difficult to report on this because it's such it's
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such a horrible crime that happened. The key thing here though is that at the end
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of the day, this story is about not about the monster that carried out this crime, but about the this story is about
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the school of Sandy Hook and its wonderful teachers and students. By examining in a case like this, we might
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be able to see what some of the causes were and that might be able to put us on higher alert so we could prevent a
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tragedy like this happening again in another school, in your town. But it also is a reminder that life is short
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and life is precious and while we're here on earth that maybe we should have more respect for each other and more
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love for each other. Sandy Hook Elementary School is in the town of New Town, Connecticut. New Town is part of
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the Danberry metropolitan area and the New York metropolitan area. One person that everyone probably knows is Caitlyn
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Jenner, who of course back then would have gone by the name of Bruce, attending New Town High School. The
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population of New Town is about 27 28,000 people. So, this is not a big town. This is more of what I would call
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a sleepy town. This is an extremely safe community. Very, very low crime rate. >> It's like a modern Mayberry.
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>> Two of the residents in this community in 2012 are Adam Lanza and his mother Nancy. Now, let's go back here a little
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bit. We have Adam Lanza was the second of two children of Peter and Nancy Lanza. Their first son is Ryan Lanza,
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who is four years older than Adam. The Lanza family moved to New Town when Adam was only 6 years old back in 1992. This
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is when Peter became the VP of finance for General Electric, which is one of the more prestigious companies in the
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New Town area. Peter is described as a workaholic, often getting into work very early in the day and then staying until
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10 p.m. or even later. Nancy took care of the kids. Nancy grew up on a farm in New Hampshire and from a young age,
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hunting was a hobby of hers. She would often go hunting with her older brothers. Uh she did work for John
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Hancock before she decided to stay home with her two boys. If you watch the documentary New Town, you'll notice that
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these are largeriz houses, normally like two to fourc car garages, and their lots
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are bigger. So, the average lot, I would say, and I'm not I don't know the whole
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area, but I'd say there's a lot of lots in this area that they're small communities, but they have about 2 acres
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per lot. >> Yeah. Quite a bit of space between the homes there. Um, at a very young age,
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Adam seems different. Um, and this is noticeable by his parents and his loved ones. When he is five years old, he is
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diagnosed with Asperger syndrome, which is a form of autism with a significant difficulties in the realm of social
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interaction. Uh, shortly after that, he is diagnosed with sensory processing disorder. This affects the body's
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sensory signals. The SPD center describes this as signals that are not organized into appropriate responses,
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creating a neurological traffic jam that prevents certain parts of the brain from
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receiving information needed to correctly integrate sensorary data. Adam displays all of the common symptoms of
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this of this SPD. uh avoiding groups of people and kids, recoiling from touch, flinching at sudden movements, seeking
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seclusion, and he also prefers to be in the dark. Adam definitely seemed a little different, and with his asberers,
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obviously, we we know why some of those things would make him seem different, but it didn't seem like he was that
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interested into fitting into any group. >> No, he never seemed to speak much or to
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try to make friends. He just never seemed interested in making friends or relationships with other people his age.
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Um, at home, he also didn't seem to want to have much of a relationship with anyone in the lands of home other than
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his mother. Nancy was very much a helicopter mom when it came to Adam. Nancy and Adam built a bond through
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target shooting. This starts when Adam is very young. Uh, he shoots his first gun when he's four years old. Nancy
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encouraged their shared hobby for target shooting and an interest in firearms. This was really the only outdoor
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activity that Adam seems to enjoy. Because of Adam's disorders, Nancy was overly concerned that Adam would become
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the target of bullies. Adam's peers would often describe Adam as picked on occasionally, but really, for the most
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part, Adam was really, he really wasn't bullied. He was just kind of ignored. With Adam's SPD, his anxiety grew a lot
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more at home. He would have these temper tantrums which would grow with age. And
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so every time he'd have these temper tantrums, it would like he become more violent.
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>> And the number of these fits as well, they increased. >> Yeah. And this was getting worse for
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Adam in his middle school years. >> Yeah. And it's around this time that one of his middle school teachers would
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discover some of Adam's drawings. Now, these are images depicting people in various states of death. At home, Nancy
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is finding similar drawings of Adams, as well as printouts showing scenes of death and violence that he had found on
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the internet. Uh Nancy does seek help from a professional regarding these images that she's finding and concern
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about Adam's well-being and maybe where his head's at, >> but she does not feel that Adam's needs
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were being met by that professional. And this would be difficult for any parent to deal with with a typical kid. But in
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Adam's case, his his communication skills are not the best. >> Regardless, this is a difficult thing to
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to experience and to deal with because your your son is roughly, let's say, 14 at the time.
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>> And you know, I can remember being a kid and I'm not going to pretend that to be
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some kind of expert parent, nor do I fully understand this disorder uh or either of these disorders that he has.
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But, you know, when you're a young teenager, you know, especially for me, you're listening to Metallica and things
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like that, and you doodle at school while you're trying to pass time, and skulls creep their way onto uh, you
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know, my my notebooks in my journals and things like that. Now, did I have any fantasies about going out and and
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collecting skulls or or or, you know, creating havoc or death? Well, a side note, we once were called to the
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principal's office because we had a band in high school and uh our buddies made a
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poster and they called us into the principal's office cuz they thought that the drawings were satanic. Now, we
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didn't make those drawings, but we didn't disapprove of those drawings either. Were we satanic kids? No, we
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were not. We just happened to be in a band and we just, you know, whatever. We thought it was creative. Well, and of
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course it raised a red flag for the the principal or vice principal or whoever called us down there and then then they
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notify parents and then parents have to to be concerned because here's the issue
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too, you know, and I understand Adam, you know, they found these drawings at school as well as at home.
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>> Uh, which makes it, you know, that more troubling. But in our situation, it was
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I think my parents kind of reacted like, well, maybe I should treat this like it's some kind of big deal because the
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school thought it was a big deal. They didn't they they saw it and really didn't didn't really didn't get it
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either. >> Yeah. I don't think my father ever got why I was in a band. Now in Adam's
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situation, it's different. It causes more of a red flag, if you will, because he has lack of social skills and lack of
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social life. >> And he just doesn't even talk to anybody. I mean, he doesn't talk to his
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family. He doesn't talk to his classmates. He just doesn't talk, period. >> But to her benefit, she seeks
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professional help for Adam. >> Yes, she does. and she ultimately ends up removing him from that situation.
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It's reported by her friends that her complaint was she was so sick of hearing people tell her that Adam's just going
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to grow out of this situation. But but again here that's where I kind of take a bit of problem with the situation
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because yeah all these maybe the teachers and the school counselors and this professional that you've sought out
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are telling you he will probably grow out of this. If you're feeling that his needs are not being met, maybe stick
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with it a little bit longer. >> But what a scary situation to be in as a parent. And maybe she had this gut
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intuition that maybe there was something a little more sinister going on with her
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child. >> Around this same time, Adam's parents, well, their marriage starts having
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problems and Peter and Nancy, they would separate a couple of times before Nancy
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would file for divorce in 2008. >> Uh Adam's temper tantrums are getting worse. And this is an example of one.
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There's there's actually one day before school. This is when Adam is in 8th grade. Adam is actually taken to the
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hospital due to an anxiety attack that he's experiencing. This is primarily because of his SPD. He was afraid of
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going to school. And it's not because of the kids, you know, he wasn't afraid of
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going to school because he was bullied or because he wasn't performing well in school. No, he was afraid because of
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this disorder. He was afraid of like loud noises and the crowded hallways, the slamming doors, the lockers, the
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loud kids. All of this was making it much harder for him to go to school or to navigate through the hallways in the
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classrooms. >> Yeah. And I have a longtime friend that is an educator and his specialty is
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autistic kids or kids with aspberers. And this is a common um symptom is that they really are disturbed u by loud
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noises and by a lot of commotion. Well, on this one situation where he's taken to the hospital, Nancy talks to the
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doctor and she wants to try to get a note from the doctor stating that Adam should be homeschooled. She wants to
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keep him home for the remainder of his eighth grade year so that he can kind of settle in. He can he can focus on
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schoolwork and not have to go to this place that's causing him this massive anxiety and a bit of trauma, so to
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speak. Mhm. >> Uh she wants to keep him home from 8th grade before he enters high school, but
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this does not end up happening. She doesn't get a note from the from the hospital and she doesn't keep him home.
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>> Yeah. And in hindsight, you wonder if this would have helped his disorder, helped what he was going through. Um but
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I guess we'll never know. >> And it's in 8th grade that we start to see an increase in the troubles with
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Adam as well as the disorders that are preventing him from wanting to go to school. Well, now that he's in high
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school, you would think that, you know, the kids before weren't so they weren't necessarily mean, but they weren't
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really attentive of him. He was just kind of invisible, the invisible kid. >> But I wonder if that that bullying uh or
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being picked on ramped up much in high school. >> Well, you're exactly right. He is kind
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of the invisible kid. It's we're going to see that same underlining sentence that we had said earlier where he's not
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he is picked on occasionally. It's described as picked on occasionally, but no one ever called it bullying.
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>> My Right. My only problem with this though is this is coming from all outside sources. Right. And so I had a
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really good friend in middle school that actually switched schools going into high school, did not go to our high
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school. He was picked on so much that his family, everybody decided, hey, he's going to a different high school. Now, I
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knew that because I was one of his best friends, but people around didn't really
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understand, well, why is he not going to our high school? And I'm going, well, you didn't understand how bad it was.
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Now, the difference between my friend and Adam was my friend talked to his parents, told counselors what was going
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on. I wonder if in Adam's case, there was a lot of bullying or being picked on and and some other things going on that
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just never were reported. Well, you have you have two arguments here. Um Nancy would Nancy believed that he was being
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picked on, that he was bullied, where you have the school children and his peers saying that no, that wasn't the
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case. He just he we knew he was different. Uh he didn't fit in. That's that's easy to see. But he never tried
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with us. He didn't want to talk to any of us. He didn't want to have a relationship with any of the kids here.
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And therefore, I don't think any of the kids made an effort on their end either.
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>> Well, Nancy wasn't helping out Adam at all with giving him that Lloyd Christmas
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haircut. that it's strange that you say that because there's actually a story by
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the the man that cut his hair for years and he described the situation as strange because you know you go to a
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barber shop or you go to get your haircut and it's usually a place where the the person cutting your hair is
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trying to make small talk with you and usually you make talk back and sometimes it's it sparks up conversations and
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whatnot. This was not the situation for Adam or for Nancy. And I and I bring NY's name into this because the man
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specifically says that on every time that Adam went to get his hair cut, he was he was with his mother. His mother
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would come in and basically tell Adam where to go to sit down. >> Uh Adam would go to the the barber chair
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and rather than, you know, the barber says, "I constantly tried to to make jokes or to talk about things that were
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going on to spark up conversation with the boy." >> Yeah. try to ease his mind when you put
00:22:01
that metal bowl on his head to give him the haircut. >> And and I think a lot of that too is
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that, you know, these barbers usually are are are people people person. >> Yeah. And he probably saw that this
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there was some anxiety with this young man. And he was trying to make ease the ease the trip for him. But he said that
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Adam would just stare at the tiled floor. And it was it was strange that the boy never really interacted with
00:22:25
anybody at the shop there. It was all of his mom kind of telling him where to go.
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Okay, Adam, we're done now. Let's leave. Um, you know, like I said, a bit of that
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helicopter mom. >> Again, I think the whole uh hindrance, you know, hindsight of the whole thing
00:22:41
is maybe she was enabling him too much and holding his hand too much and not not enabling him to grow.
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>> Mhm. And you worry that that might have been the situation had she been successful taking him out of eighth
00:22:54
grade. maybe sometimes sometimes these fears we have to face them to to overcome them. Um once Adam starts high
00:23:01
school uh they started off by they put together a plan to kind of ease him into the school.
00:23:07
>> Uh this plan was devised by Nancy working with the school and the school's officials. He started off the year in a
00:23:13
private setting and once he got used to the new school, to the high school, he was slowly introduced into the
00:23:20
traditional classes with other kids and he was taking a lot of honors classes. Again,
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>> even though he had these disorders, he was not he was not a dumb kid, you know,
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he was he was bright and he he excelled at academics. >> And oddly enough, um Adam seems like a
00:23:37
little bit of a cartoon character. >> Yeah. His peers and the school officials would later recall that Adam wore the
00:23:44
same outfit to school every day. He wore baggy khaki pants and the same blue polo
00:23:49
shirt and he carried a briefcase. Uh, >> and I wonder if it's not the actual same
00:23:54
polo or if it was just like we have multiple of the same outfit, but maybe Adam didn't really give a [ __ ] So then
00:24:01
his parents were like, you know what, we'll just kind of give him a uniform. >> Yeah. I don't think that, you know, he
00:24:07
he's not communicating well with anybody. I don't know that he's able to communicate or desires to communicate to
00:24:14
his parents what he wants to wear to school. So maybe they just buy some things that he seems comfortable with.
00:24:19
But yeah, he could have created his own uniform wearing that same blue polo shirt and khaki pants. The weird thing
00:24:24
about the briefcase, first of all, that's a strange thing to carry in high school. Uh, but the thing about this too
00:24:30
is a lot of people when they saw the briefcase opened, they said it was practically empty. So, it seemed even
00:24:37
more strange that he would carry this briefcase. It sounds to me there's a lot of accounts that when he was trying to
00:24:44
navigate through those hallways that he was using the briefcase as kind of a buffer between him and the other kids
00:24:50
that he would typically walk right on the edge of the hallway, right up against the wall and keep that briefcase
00:24:57
either right out in front of him or to the side of him that would kind of block him from the other children.
00:25:02
>> Yeah. Well, with the asberers it would, you know, that makes a lot of sense because he does not want to be touched.
00:25:08
Most uh people with Asperers have a real issue with personal space. >> And it was not uncommon for Adam to
00:25:16
require an escort to help him navigate through the hallways of the high school. >> And we'll get right back to the case
00:25:22
after this quick beer break. Cheers everybody. Where we left off, Adam Lanza was entering high school. His mother is
00:25:29
concerned. Nancy is concerned with his uh mental state and kind of what's going on in his head. and she's having a very
00:25:36
difficult time communicating with Adam. >> Yeah. And at the start of his sophomore
00:25:42
year, uh we do see a little bit of progress uh from from Adam as far as the social aspects concerned. Uh he
00:25:49
surprises everybody and he signs up for an afterchool program. Uh this is one of
00:25:56
those AV tech clubs uh where he is the he's video recording the school's basketball games. Um, so what we're
00:26:04
seeing here, Captain, I believe, is that we have this young, troubled man, right?
00:26:10
This this boy who has trouble fitting in and he doesn't want to be at school because of his anxieties and his
00:26:16
disorders. >> However, he's very smart and I think that when he's starting to see classes
00:26:22
that challenge him a little more, that he's able to dive into that and this might peique his interest and he's
00:26:28
coming out of his shell a bit here. Uh he's he's in a way opening up >> and like we said a lot of his classes at
00:26:34
this point are honor classes. >> Yeah. And he's taking things that seem a little little more fun to him like shop
00:26:40
class and then he's involved in this AV tech club. Um he does trade in the blue polo shirt uh for a green one and he
00:26:49
will wear that shirt for the remainder of his sophomore year. uh he does lose the briefcase and he he gets a more
00:26:57
traditional baguh that you would be used to seeing. Um >> yeah, I always rock the two straps.
00:27:03
>> It's around this time that Nancy starts adding to her collection. She's purchasing more guns, more firearms.
00:27:09
Again, she is encouraging her son's hobby of target shooting because other than this AV tech club, he Adam still
00:27:18
doesn't have any hobbies other than video games and target shooting. Uh it is believed that she kept some of the
00:27:24
guns for herself, but that she also gave some of the guns to Adam. Now, this has
00:27:29
been a topic of of discussion quite a bit that that were the guns, you know, the guns were obviously hers and maybe
00:27:36
she should have kept them locked up better, but there's plenty of evidence here that we will see going forward that
00:27:43
these guns were purchased for Adam. >> Mhm. Now we remember we have this divorce that the parents in the family
00:27:50
have just gone through recently and it's Adam's classmates that say that Adam was
00:27:55
greatly affected by his parents' divorce and that while he did not talk to most of the other kids, he did seem to write
00:28:02
about the separation often. >> Mhm. >> In September of 2009, Adam starts playing and becomes obsessed with a
00:28:10
video game called Combat Arms. This is a multi-player game. It's a modern style firsterson shooter game. The player is
00:28:18
in control of a gun and the object of this game is to kill the most enemy players. In this game, there is a form
00:28:26
of game play where whomever kills the most players in the shortest amount of time is the winner. And you can also
00:28:33
increase your kill number by killing yourself. This situation is quite different from real life. Obviously, in
00:28:40
the game world, he would fit in. He would fit in, you know, they would have these forums and these groups that you
00:28:46
could talk to. He was accepted into these groups where he would discuss game strategies and occasionally joke around.
00:28:53
Uh Adam creates an online and gaming persona in which he calls himself cane bread. This becomes a positive social
00:29:02
experience for Adam. Yeah. For I think a lot of parents you'd might go, "Well, this is a little odd." But the fact I
00:29:09
mean, the fact that he is talking to anybody or he's excited about anything that he is social with, uh, that's a
00:29:17
positive step in the right direction. And it's probably because of these games that he's playing, but he's also having
00:29:25
an increasing military obsession and fascination. Adam also becomes involved in an online community for gun
00:29:32
enthusiasts. uh he knows his stuff too from from his interactions on this form. Again, he fits in very well and he's
00:29:39
knowledgeable about firearms. >> Yeah. Now, what we're also seeing with Adam is that he's not very good with
00:29:45
social situations, but it seems like when he's behind a computer screen or a TV screen when he's playing these games
00:29:52
that he's kind of excelling more so than he ever has as far as the social communication. And it seems like he's
00:30:00
definitely willing to. Yeah, he's fitting in and he's reaching out to other people and communicating with
00:30:05
them. I do want to point out that this, you know, I mentioned the game Combat Arms that this is only one of many games
00:30:12
that Adam was playing. Uh most of these games were very violent games. >> Yeah, I've never actually heard of that
00:30:18
game before. >> I had not either. So, I and I don't know where to like rank these games as far as
00:30:24
violence go. It sounds to me like all of them were pretty violent. One of the games that he was playing is a situation
00:30:30
where the shooter was even killing women and children in the game. >> Yeah. Which is awful. But in this case,
00:30:36
in this conversation, if you will, the big conversation always is with these violent ga games, are kids more likely
00:30:43
to commit violent acts. I don't personally have an answer or a stance on that. >> I don't have an answer either. And I
00:30:51
don't want anybody saying, "Well, Nick's saying take away the violent video games." Because I think there there is a
00:30:55
place for them. Uh but one thing that we see time and time again in these situations where you have a mass
00:31:01
shooter, especially one that's a younger person that we are seeing a common it's
00:31:08
a common occurrence that these guys are playing violent video games. And I say guys because almost all of these crimes
00:31:14
are committed by young males, >> right? But then the question becomes did the violent game you know in you know
00:31:20
did the violent game cause the person to become more violent or was this person already a sociopath or a psychopath and
00:31:28
they were drawn to the violent games. >> I think each situation is probably different. Um I don't think that we can
00:31:35
say that it's the violent video games 100%. I do think that what it does do though is that it desensitizes them. you
00:31:42
know, when you're logging 500 hour, you know, there there was one of these games. I'm I'm not sure if it was the
00:31:47
Combat Arms game or not, but we talked about how violent that game is, but there was one of these violent games
00:31:52
that Adam had logged over over 500 uh times that he had played the game. >> And and I think in defense of his mother
00:32:00
on this, I mean, Adam is in honor, you know, in honor programs and he's doing well in school academically, not
00:32:07
socially. and his only social avenue are these games. So maybe she thought this was, you know, this would help his uh
00:32:15
social skills outside, you know, in the real world and not just the virtual world. Well, is it kind of an easy way
00:32:22
of being a parent that when you have a son that likes to lock himself in the basement and he's taped off all of the
00:32:28
windows so that he remember he likes to be in the dark, he prefers to be in the dark. Is it an easy way to be a parent
00:32:34
when when your your troubled son just goes off into the basement for hours upon hours and you don't have to deal
00:32:40
with him? You don't have to put up with the temper tantrums because he's happy. He's entertaining himself and you're not
00:32:47
really fully aware nor seem to >> care what he does in that room because you know he's safe and you know that
00:32:54
he's he's entertained and he's not disturbing you. Well, and in NY's defense, I mean, you have a child that
00:33:01
has a lot more challenges, faces probably more challenges than the typical kid. Um, but we see this time
00:33:08
and time again with just typical kids. You know, the parents just go, "Oh, well, you're on a phone or you're on an
00:33:13
iPad or whatever." Do, you know, who cares if it's healthy for you. Uh, I just don't have to deal with you right
00:33:19
now. I do think though that it again it desensitizes these kids to that certain level of violence even though it's just
00:33:26
onscreen violence. Uh but again if he's if he's logging over 500 games on this one particular game that's thousands
00:33:33
upon thousands of hours spending watching those violent images over and over again. And we do know from studies
00:33:40
that if if a kid is young enough that they almost cannot separate the the the reality, you know, real life reality
00:33:48
from what they're seeing on the screen. >> And I Right. And I don't know much uh I
00:33:52
don't know a lot about Asberers, but I've also heard that, you know, they can get hyperfocused on something. And so,
00:33:59
do you really want your kid that can get super hyperfocused on something to be hyperfocused on killing people or, you
00:34:07
know what I mean? or or violence in general. >> Well, it's around the same time that
00:34:12
that Adam would start to spend countless hours studying mass killers online. He spent about 7 months or so just
00:34:20
collecting information on these killers to the point where he was an expert on mass murderers
00:34:26
>> to the point where he was going on to Wikipedia and he was correcting entries.
00:34:31
You know, if people had put wrong dates on there, he would go in and correct them. if somebody had put, you know,
00:34:37
names of locations were wrong, but most of the time he was correcting the weapons that were used or descriptions
00:34:44
of those weapons that were used in those attacks. >> Yeah. And at this point, Lloyd Christmas
00:34:48
is getting pretty creepy, right? And I think at at this point I can put point a finger at Nancy on the idea of if your
00:34:57
kid that is hyperfocused on mass murders and going on Wikipedia and changing dates and stuff, this is something you
00:35:05
should be aware of. >> You're right. Yeah. Or or at least have a hint of it. Right.
00:35:10
>> Right. >> If if you're if he's spending hours and months on this project that he's
00:35:15
created. >> But Well, but okay. I'm going to play devil's advocate for myself. Okay.
00:35:20
>> But if he's not communicating, >> it makes it tough. >> How would she know? I mean, you'd have
00:35:25
to go the extra step and look at, you know, look, here's a I'm not a parent, but I think all parents should do this.
00:35:32
I I was a parent for a time. I was a stepfather, and kids had cell phones and iPads, but at any time, I would just go,
00:35:42
"Let me see your phone." Like, they might be laughing a little too hard, and I just go, "Let me see your phone." And
00:35:48
if they didn't want to give me their phone, >> that phone was taken away for a week,
00:35:52
but it was constantly checking their, you know, not constantly, but you know, just doubleeing what is their uh what
00:35:59
are they searching on the internet. >> Yeah. And I and I like these households where you see parents saying, you know,
00:36:05
there's not a closed door in this house. This is an open door house. You know, the we're not going to hide behind
00:36:10
closed doors. So that way everybody in the household kind of knows what's going on with the children. I I do understand
00:36:16
the older that these kids get that gets a little tougher. They do deserve some privacy.
00:36:21
>> Well, and it's harder in this community as well because these houses were larger.
00:36:27
>> Yeah. >> So, it wasn't like, you know, the shoe boxes we live in. I mean, these were
00:36:32
houses that, you know, a person over here, you know, on one side of the house and the person on the other side of the
00:36:37
house might not even hear each other. >> Not only larger, but emptier. I mean, as
00:36:42
Adam has gotten older, you know, the parents get divorced, the father moves away. Uh Ryan's four years older than
00:36:49
him. He moves away as well. Uh the the house is big and it's and it's empty. >> Mhm. You know, internet searches aside,
00:36:57
there's a lot of items that Adam had that his mother should have found. Well, we talked about him researching these
00:37:03
mass killers and wanting to know everything about them, but he also kind of had some kind of like memorabilia of
00:37:10
them where he he had newspaper clippings and stories that he had printed from the
00:37:15
internet regarding these different mass shooters. So, those were would be physical items that his mother could
00:37:21
have found. Now, one of the most disturbing, probably the most disturbing item that that we know of is a
00:37:28
spreadsheet that he created. Now, I'm not certain that this was a physical spreadsheet. I don't know that he
00:37:34
actually printed this off and referenced it, >> right? >> But we do know that it was an at least
00:37:39
an electronic thing that he had stored on his computer. Now, what was this spreadsheet? This was he had he had
00:37:46
listed several hundreds of mass shooters. And just just to hear that sentence alone is terrifying to remind
00:37:53
yourself that there's been hundreds of these situations, >> right? But he had listed several
00:37:58
hundreds of these mass shooters and created this spreadsheet that has been reported to have been approximately 7
00:38:07
foot long in length. >> Yeah. So, we don't know if it was actual physical or if it was digital, but if
00:38:13
you did print it, then it' be 7 foot in length. >> You're right. And it would be
00:38:16
approximately 4 foot wide. >> Jesus. >> So, this is a massive uh collection of data here. And this this appeared to be
00:38:26
Adam had ranked them from, you know, number one to whatever, however many hundreds of these people he had
00:38:34
researched, but it seemed to be mostly based off of who had had the most kills or created the most dramatic situation.
00:38:44
Um, you know, so we we have that's some pretty extensive research there, Captain. um some serious time that he's
00:38:51
spent diving into these these other people that that are creating havoc. >> Yeah. And frankly, this is becoming a
00:38:58
lot more disturbing. >> After some faculty changes at the high school, Nancy started not to believe
00:39:04
that Adam's needs were being met. Remember, we talked about when he started his freshman year, he she had
00:39:10
worked with some school officials so that he could start off in a private setting. Yeah. And he could work his way
00:39:15
into the general population of the school. um one of those faculty members or I I
00:39:21
don't know exactly who she worked with to be honest with you, but they were no longer there at the school as as the
00:39:27
years gone by. And at some point she feels that there are not there's nobody there that understands Adam that
00:39:34
understands his disorders and or his needs, >> right? She doesn't have an ally in the
00:39:38
fight anymore. >> Correct. So this would be uh his junior year. just after his junior year, Nancy
00:39:46
decides to take Adam out of New Town High School. Uh, and it's it's reported by people at the school that that Nancy
00:39:53
seemed to be angry with the school, but Adam also seemed to be angry with the school because of this because he was
00:39:59
leaving this place. Even though he had this anxiety about going there, we did see some progress while he was in high
00:40:06
school. And like you said, you know, it's supposed to be a place that you look back on that that's of good
00:40:12
memories. Um, even though he had this anxiety, we don't know that maybe he didn't have good memories there. You
00:40:19
talk about a boy that that it his family's moving away. It's just him and his mother in a house
00:40:26
>> other than violent video games and research about violent criminals. that maybe his only social interaction
00:40:34
outside of those four walls was the school. Maybe the only thing he was leaving the house for was to go to
00:40:41
school. I mean, other than the shooting range and to go rent some video games. >> Well, and I wonder also at this point he
00:40:47
was playing video games online, I'm assuming, and being in part of that community. Sometimes kids, you know,
00:40:53
will find a couple buddies at school that also play. So maybe he had a couple people that maybe just even said hi to
00:41:00
him and maybe that was enough for him to enjoy that experience at school. >> You're right. It could be a bit of a
00:41:05
common ground. Give him something to talk to other kids about. Um so after high school, after he's taken out of
00:41:12
high school of his junior year, uh Adam is enrolled in Western Connecticut State
00:41:17
University. Nancy believed that he would do better in a more adult environment where there would be less chaos. Um any
00:41:25
>> well I feel for her too because at at some point you're grasping at straws, right?
00:41:31
>> Yeah. I don't The thing is what we're seeing is we're seeing a a mother that cares. She absolutely cares. It's just
00:41:38
she doesn't know what to do. And I and I don't know that that most of us would know what to do in this situation.
00:41:45
>> But we're seeing her try some different things. To me, I just question if she could have
00:41:52
received a little more information from the people around her on on ways to cope
00:41:58
with this and to deal with this. Um, I don't know that her answers were always the best. And I know that I'm sitting in
00:42:04
a seat where I'm able to look back after this >> terrible tragedy and and go, "Well, she
00:42:09
didn't she didn't do the right thing." Did Did Nancy love Adam? Yes, 100%. We see we see that we see a mother giving a
00:42:17
lot of effort here but uh you know we we also know that effort doesn't always take place of intelligence or or
00:42:26
informative decisions >> right and and I think sometimes uh we'll never know but I think
00:42:32
sometimes people are lost causes you know it's like you know the whole what came first is the chicken or the egg we
00:42:40
don't know but I mean possibly in this case he just had these demons inside him from the beginning.
00:42:45
>> Yeah. There's also some question with Adam about on top of these disorders, did he have any kind of anorexia? Um,
00:42:54
you know, because he is a very thin, very thin young man. >> Um, and so that there's been a lot of
00:43:01
question about that. I've heard different accounts. Couldn't really put my thumb down on it if that was the
00:43:07
actual case. But I know that his size and his stature also led her to believe that that he would be a even more so a
00:43:15
target of bullying. >> Yeah. I think when you see pictures of him and some of the famous pictures of
00:43:20
him, you know, he looks I mean he he was 20 years old at the time of the attack.
00:43:27
He doesn't look 20 at all. >> No, >> he looks almost 12. >> Yeah. >> And his his bone structure in his face
00:43:33
is very prominent and and >> he almost looks malnourished. very pale. Uh but again, we said he preferred the
00:43:40
dark and and and you know, we know he was in the basement constantly at home with the with the windows taped up so
00:43:46
that there was no light coming in. >> Yeah. And then a lot of these kids that get super focused on whether it's iPad
00:43:53
or or video games or whatever it is that they lose track of time and they they don't, you know, they forget to eat or
00:44:00
they don't even care to eat. >> Academically, he had no problem with high school. Um, and intelligence-wise,
00:44:06
he had no problem with handling the classes or or the the school. Um, it's just I just really wonder here I if
00:44:15
that's the right thing to do to remove a kid from high school and then place them
00:44:20
in an adult setting, in an adult environment such as a as a community college. >> Yeah. In all fairness though, I mean,
00:44:26
you know, high school is not a huge step up. You know, going from high school to
00:44:30
college is not a huge step up. So, it's not like, you know, he would have been a
00:44:35
senior the following year, so he only stepped up one year in advance. >> He did take seven classes uh when he was
00:44:42
at Western Connecticut State University, uh receiving a 3.28 grade average. Um so
00:44:49
again, academics is not a problem for this young man. Um in 2010, Adam's father, Peter, now let's talk about
00:44:57
their divorce for a little bit. Okay. Peter, we had said, was very successful. Worked for General Electric, uh, was a
00:45:04
vice president. He he made approximately like half a million dollars. >> Oh, good for him.
00:45:09
>> Well, in the divorce, uh, >> how did you say that? Divorce. >> Yeah. Nancy received a lot of alimony or
00:45:18
a lot of child support, right? Um, but it was also agreed upon the two that they both understood that Adam had
00:45:26
plenty of issues with his >> needs as well. >> And Peter understood that Adam needed to
00:45:33
be cared for practically 247, >> even even as a young man and probably as an adult as well. And so he understood
00:45:42
that his son that nobody could go off and work a full-time job and care for him at the same time. So, I don't think
00:45:48
that Peter fought any of anything that was decided in the divorce. He it was agreed upon that he he gave almost half
00:45:55
of his salary to Nancy so that Nancy could stay home, provide for Adam and take care of him.
00:46:01
>> Yeah. And that's good on Peter, right? >> And and again, this was not only for the
00:46:06
time that Adam was a child, but as an adult as well. Nancy would receive this amount of money for the rest of her life
00:46:13
with steady increases annually as well. Um, so money is not the problem. >> Money is definitely not the problem.
00:46:20
>> But what is also decided is that Nancy would have primary custody of the kids.
00:46:25
>> Mhm. >> And but Peter's going to spend regular time with the children as far as visits
00:46:30
go. You know how these things work. You take them on the weekends or for holidays. Uh try to take the kids
00:46:36
places. So he's spending an ample amount of time with both of his sons. Uh, it's
00:46:41
in 2010 that Adam's father, Peter, begins dating again, or at least to the point that it's serious enough for Adam
00:46:49
to recognize this. And at this time, Adam decides to stop seeing and communicating with his father. At the
00:46:56
same time, he also decides to do the same with his brother, as well as an uncle that he was close to growing up.
00:47:04
Also, in 2010, Adam receives his driver's license. Uh but again, the only places he's really interested in going
00:47:11
to would be the shooting range and the video game store. Uh he also drops out of school at this time. He stops going
00:47:18
to college. So 2010, there's a there's a lot of things happening here, right? Uh
00:47:24
we we see we see a boy that's taken out of high school. He goes into the college
00:47:29
situation for one year and then he shortly after that he's dropped communication with his father, his
00:47:36
brother, his uncle, collects his driver's license, practically just staying at home. Might as well not have
00:47:42
a license at all. With the exception though, it should be noted though he was going to the shooting range on occasions
00:47:48
by himself at this point once he had the driver's license. Um, but then dropping
00:47:53
out of college ultimately. One could assume that he's going to the driving range with his own guns as well.
00:47:59
>> But right, of course you mean the shooting range. He's not going to the driving range and scaring the hell out
00:48:04
of the golfers with his own guns. >> Let's fast forward in time just a little bit to 2012.
00:48:10
>> Yeah. Nancy Lanza starts getting out of the house more. We have to think about
00:48:14
this situation here. We have a we have this troubled child and it's probably caused her obviously a lot of stress uh
00:48:21
on her life and her situation. And in 2012, she she develops some more friendships with some of the locals. She
00:48:28
starts going to a local pizza place for a beer or two during happy hour a few times a week.
00:48:34
>> Um, some of the information that we would later find out about the relationship between Nancy and Adam
00:48:40
would be from some of these friends that she created at at this happy hour. >> Yeah. Everybody needs somebody to vent
00:48:47
to, and what better what better way to vent than with some pizza and beer. Well, she also starts going on overnight
00:48:54
trips with friends from time to time as well. You know, it Adam is very much an adult and even though he doesn't have
00:49:00
any hobbies or anything other than locking himself in the basement and playing violent video games, he's fine
00:49:06
with inside of those four walls. He's able to care for himself. And she goes on these overnight trips. I believe she
00:49:13
went on a dozen or so in uh the year of 2012. Um, remember we talked about Adam having
00:49:21
this growing obsession with the military? Well, he had he wanted to become a Marine. And this was something
00:49:28
that he was only really being vocal about with his mother >> and he had posters all over the walls in
00:49:35
the basement of different combat situations, you know, things like tanks and aircraft carriers and things that
00:49:41
you would heavy machinery that you would see in the armed forces. Um, at some point Nancy has to have a long talk with
00:49:51
Adam and explain to him that he's never going to be a Marine. Um, this obviously
00:49:57
because of his disorders, he could never be a Marine. He I mean, you're talking about a kid that had trouble leaving the
00:50:03
home, a person that had trouble going to school, >> which I have some uh trouble with
00:50:10
because I think on some level she could say, "Well, look, you know, we get you into some counseling and there are
00:50:16
certain things that may, you know, maybe set it as a goal. Maybe he won't reach that goal, but it gives him something to
00:50:22
kind of get out of bed, get out of the basement, try to do something productive with his life." She would also tell
00:50:28
friends that she's hanging out with that Adam's time in front of the computer screen or in front of a video game game
00:50:34
screen seems to be increasing now that he has less responsibilities or obligations.
00:50:39
>> And he also seems to be turning away from her as well. Uh maybe this is just him getting older or maybe this does
00:50:48
have to do with his time spent with these video games. >> Yeah. Or maybe, like I said, I I I
00:50:52
believe on some level she has this mother's intuition and maybe that she knows that there's something more
00:50:58
sinister going on here. Adam is 20 now and Nancy is still finding disturbing drawings in his possession. You know,
00:51:07
this thing that that all the experts, the people at the school had told her he would probably grow out of. Well, now
00:51:13
he's 20. He's a young man. He's not a boy anymore. And she's still finding these disturbing drawings. one of them
00:51:20
and and these are drawings that he these are sketches he's making. One such sketch is of a woman holding a rosary
00:51:27
and she is shot she's being shot by machine gun fire. >> Okay. >> Another one is an open field and in the
00:51:34
open field lie mutilated bodies of children scattered throughout the field. Their faces are so bloodied that you
00:51:41
couldn't discern any of their features. >> Yeah, at this point this guy really needs to be seeking professional help.
00:51:48
And there is also a drawing of a what appears to be a younger Adam with a with blood pouring from his forehead and his
00:51:57
arms are held up into the sky. It's like a almost like a suicide picture that he's drawn of himself.
00:52:03
>> We had Lloyd Christmas just keeps getting creepier and creepier. >> Well, we had the talk about her
00:52:09
explaining to Adam that he couldn't become a Marine. Yeah. >> Uh here's some added stress though to
00:52:13
the situation because now >> Nancy starts discussing the idea of moving to another state with Adam. Um
00:52:21
and the plan was to move to Washington state which is quite a bit of ways from Connecticut.
00:52:26
>> Is this for a romantic >> No, I I don't know the reasons for the moving, but it doesn't sound like she
00:52:33
had developed any type of relationship that would have taken her there. Um but but Adam was to go with her. Um so so
00:52:40
that family portion would not be disrupted. It would just be transplanted. Um >> again, Adam at first he seems pretty hip
00:52:50
to the idea of moving, but as it becomes closer to, you know, the goal of moving
00:52:56
and as these talks become more and more serious, Adam starts to shut down even more. Now he now we're seeing the
00:53:02
opposite reaction from him. He's not liking the idea of moving. Uh Nancy was planning on moving with Adam to
00:53:08
Washington State. This probably would have taken place sometime in 2013. Uh but also the other thing here too
00:53:17
that that has not been well reported in my opinion was that by this time NY's health is really starting to fail her as
00:53:24
well. Um this again is probably a lot of this is probably just >> due to stress.
00:53:30
>> Yeah. cuz she's only 52 years of of age, you know, and a lot of her friends seem
00:53:35
to think that she she appeared to be healthy, but she did have some uh she had some hidden health problems uh that
00:53:42
that were coming about and really starting to take their toll on her uh as she was still trying to care for her now
00:53:50
adult son. >> Yeah. And before we get to December of 2012, uh tell me again about NY's dream.
00:53:57
>> Well, this was a situation that happened. This is something she told her friend about uh in September of 2012
00:54:04
that she had had a dream about Adam that she she in the dream she was outside with Adam. They were enjoying like a
00:54:11
beautiful day, right? >> Mhm. >> When all of a sudden a large gust of wind comes and it starts to slowly lift
00:54:18
Adam up into the air. Now Nancy runs over and grabs Adam's legs, and she's trying to hold on to him, but the pull
00:54:26
just starts to get stronger and stronger, >> and then she loses her grip on her son,
00:54:32
>> and Adam slowly lifts up into the air, higher and higher into the sky. >> Nancy watches Adam get smaller and
00:54:39
smaller as he gets further and further from him to the point where she cannot see him any longer. It's kind of crazy
00:54:47
dream when you think about how involved she had to be and being that helicopter mom and always watching over him and
00:54:55
even when she couldn't be there trying to make sure others were watching out for him as well. And as he's growing
00:55:01
older, you know, this this is the dream that she has that that at some point he's a man. And on top of that, if her
00:55:07
health gets worse, who's going to be around to to watch after him? Well, and maybe some kind of
00:55:14
metaphor for the fact that he was withdrawing anyways, or like I said, and what I've been saying from the get-go, I
00:55:21
I really believe that she had a gut feeling uh uh about her son and and and a a gut feeling that she didn't want to
00:55:29
have. Well, what should have happened here, Captain, is that gut feeling. You got to use that and talk to some other
00:55:37
people. Again, I my complaint here is not that Nancy didn't care for Adam. I think she cared for him an unbelievable
00:55:44
amount. >> Mhm. >> Um I just don't think that she even though she thought she did, I don't
00:55:49
think she knew what was best for him. >> Well, thank you, Captain Obvious. >> I also want to talk about a few other
00:55:56
things that were taking place leading up to December 2012. >> Mhm. >> So Nancy, these are all things that
00:56:02
Nancy had told friends of hers. Um, now keep in mind we the neighbors would describe Nancy and Adam Adam as kind of
00:56:11
like ghost like they were just not there. You know, this was a community where people went out and they spoke to
00:56:16
their neighbors and they did things in the community. Well, Adam we know obviously didn't do that.
00:56:21
>> And other than some friendship that that Nancy had, we don't see a lot of that
00:56:27
either. And a lot of that's probably her being home with her son caring for for her son.
00:56:31
>> Yeah. Or just the extra stress of it. Um, but she would tell friends that leading up, this is just a couple weeks
00:56:39
before uh the event took place, that she had had an experience with Adam. Th this
00:56:46
was he was not leaving the home by this point. >> 3 months before December, he was
00:56:52
basically on lockdown and he had locked himself up and he's not leaving the house.
00:56:57
>> Self locked down, >> right? He He's not going to the video game store. He's not going to the
00:57:02
shooting range anymore. He's not going to the driving range either. >> Yeah. He's not doing anything with this
00:57:06
driver's license. And things got so strange that he at some point started only communicating with his mother
00:57:14
through email. >> They live in the same in the same home. The two of them are in the same home and
00:57:20
he's only communicating with her through email. Now, >> one thing that happened too was that
00:57:26
Nancy was planning a, you know, we talked about these overnight trips that she started to do. Well, those were just
00:57:32
that, just over one night. They were just short trips. Well, late that year, she was planning to take a much longer
00:57:39
trip. She wanted to go to London. And this would be a bit of a household experiment, if you will. This would be a
00:57:47
point for her to go off and have some leisure time and get away from the stresses of home and to see if Adam
00:57:54
could handle himself for more than one night on his own. >> Yeah. Because normally at this point as
00:57:59
a parent, you know, your your child is 20 years old, sometimes moves away to go to college or if they're still living at
00:58:08
home, they're in school, they probably have a job, they're just not around the house that much and it becomes back, it
00:58:14
gets back to me time, >> right? >> And she doesn't have that luxury. >> Now, Adam bumps his head. She reports
00:58:21
this to some of her friends that there's some kind of accident in the home and she she states that he bumped his head
00:58:28
pretty badly and he was taking it very badly as well. So he's he's injured somehow. We don't know the details of
00:58:35
this, but for whatever reason, and it's probably this situation, she states that
00:58:40
she canled her London trip and simply just states to friends that it's because of things going on at home that she's no
00:58:48
longer going to go on this London trip. >> And I'm sure she's talking to Adam about
00:58:52
this trip. So maybe, you know, maybe it's this elaborate plan because he doesn't want her to leave.
00:58:57
>> Mhm. And she I mean, she's really backed in a corner here, right? I mean, she
00:59:02
he's no longer communicating with his father and >> or brother or uncle and now he's only
00:59:09
communicating with you through email. >> Yeah. And now you can't go somewhere. You can't take this trip because he
00:59:15
probably does need somebody to look after him. He might not be able to handle uh being alone for that amount of
00:59:21
time, >> right? But there's also there's probably something going on through her head,
00:59:25
right? NY's head. >> He's 20 years old. She wants to She wants to get on with her life. She
00:59:33
wants to have a life, >> right? >> I wonder at this point it's going, "Okay, well now am I because he's my
00:59:41
son, am I am I locked down forever? Am I, you know, handicapped by his handicaps basically?
00:59:49
>> Um, it's really tough spot for her to be in. >> Yeah. And she can't get the father
00:59:55
involved. She can't push Adam off onto the father to to get away for a week because he's broken communication with
01:00:01
him and and now only communicating through to you through email. If you if you attempt something like that, he
01:00:09
might break off communication with you as well and might be lost completely. >> Well, you're right. Right.
01:00:13
>> This brings us to Friday, December 14th, 2012. Mhm. >> Now, sometime between or sometime before
01:00:21
9:30 that morning, Adam got up and he's planning something and he's doing some things in the house. We're a little
01:00:28
unclear of what those movements are and we'll come to those later. However, what
01:00:33
we do know that takes place that morning before 9:30 is that Nancy at only 15 52
01:00:40
years of age, she's shot dead. >> And this is the situation. She's found in her bed still wearing her pajamas.
01:00:50
She's lying on her back and she's shot four times in the head with a 22 caliber Savage MK2F
01:00:59
boltaction rifle. >> Mhm. >> Now, she's shot at such a close distance that they are almost certain that the
01:01:08
barrel of the gun would have been touching her head. Meaning that even if she was still asleep when this took
01:01:15
place, she probably there was probably enough time that from the time that it was pointed to her head that she may
01:01:22
have opened her eyes just in time to see her son shooting her, >> right? >> Um the
01:01:28
>> hopefully not. >> She was shot so badly and at such a close range four times that it almost
01:01:34
took off her head uh to to to put it, you know, >> bluntly. Yeah. Obviously, we don't we
01:01:40
don't fully know if he took her hostage for any length of time or if she was aware of what was going on. All we can
01:01:47
go off of is the evidence that we see afterwards and that of her being in her bed, still in her pajamas. So, it is
01:01:53
assumed that she was probably attacked in her sleep that morning. >> Mhm. >> This all took place uh just before 9:30
01:02:02
and right afterwards. uh if if he killed her at 9:30, then immediately afterwards
01:02:08
he got into her car and he drove away. >> And the problem with covering these shows are these cases is we all know
01:02:18
what is next and that's what we're going to dive into tomorrow because I I I just
01:02:23
can't do >> Yeah, I think it's been enough for one day. >> Well, it's been enough for the whole
01:02:28
week. You know, I you I can't iterate as we we put cases on there, then you dive
01:02:35
in and it physically affects you and it's and and this one uh more so than anything, watching the documentary uh
01:02:43
New Town, which you know, at the end of it has it has noformational value really
01:02:51
>> other than the pain and the suffering that these families go through. And but we you know we signed up to do a
01:02:59
show every week on true crime and we it was too almost too late to back out. >> Yeah. Yeah.
01:03:05
>> Um but just for anybody that's concerned about listening tomorrow, we will be um as
01:03:14
respectful as we can and and very aware of, you know, we don't want to cause anybody emotional uh trauma from
01:03:23
listening to the show by any means. If it's something you don't think you can handle, by all means, don't listen to
01:03:28
that show. Um but we will not be graphic about that or anything. We want to be respectful to
01:03:36
the victims and the victim's family. >> On a lighter note, I do have some recommended reading for today um this
01:03:43
week recommending The Spider in the Fly by Claudia Row. Uh, in this superb work of literature, true crime, a uh,
01:03:52
spellbinding combination of a memoir and a psychological suspense, we have a situation where we have a female
01:03:59
journalist who chronicles her unusual connection with a convict convicted serial killer and her search to
01:04:06
understand the darkness inside of him and what might lie inside of all of us. Now, I'm recommending this one not only
01:04:14
because it's a fantastic book, >> but because last week I misspoke when we were talking about the National Forest
01:04:20
serial killer. >> Oh, you or me misspeak. Never happens. >> Well, I last week I was referring to a
01:04:28
uh another serial killer >> and I call I said Joseph Francois and his actual name is Kendall Francois and
01:04:36
I was actually just going off of off of my poor memory there. But uh this book is about uh the journalist having a
01:04:44
relationship with Kendall Francois, that serial killer that I talked about briefly in our last episode.
01:04:50
>> Was it just a friendship or was it sexual? >> No, no, no. She she was a journalist and
01:04:55
she was uh reporting on his story once he was already in prison. So she went to meet with him on multiple occasions. Now
01:05:03
she's a young attractive journalist. So, this is very kind of Silence of the Lambsish, you know, where you have the
01:05:09
young woman meeting with the the the psychopath. Yeah. And there I want to read a little quick caption from the
01:05:16
book to you. Uh it goes like this. Well, well, Claudia, >> can I call you Claudia?
01:05:22
>> I have to give it to you. When confronted, at least you're honest. As honest as any reporter. You want to go
01:05:29
into the depths of my mind and into my past. I want to peek into yours. It's only fair, isn't it? And that was by the
01:05:38
serial killer, Kendall Franco. >> Wow. That and that really comes off as that Silence of the Lambs type feel.
01:05:44
>> Yeah. So, check out The Spider and the Fly by Claudia Row and you can do that
01:05:48
by going to our website. We have our recommended page. You're going to see lots of books to choose from, even a
01:05:54
couple of movies on there as well. And again, a special thanks to everybody that shares on social media. It's it's
01:06:00
been awesome. uh check out some of our new stuff on YouTube. Uh make sure you tell a friend. Uh we appreciate it and
01:06:07
it it's the reason why we're able to give we've been trying to do two parters almost every week now.
01:06:13
>> And we will see you again here in the garage tomorrow. And until then, be good, be kind, and don't litter.
01:06:28
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