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thank you [Music] [Music] thank you foreign garage wherever you are whatever you're
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doing thanks for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man that
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tried to amend his carnivorous habits here he is the captain yeah it's good to be seen it's good to see you thanks for
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listening thanks for telling a friend [Music] this week we are very excited to be
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nasty and that is enough of the business all right everybody gather around grab a
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chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] this week
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in the garage we tell the tale of a promising and popular college student one that has seen plenty of academic
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success in our True Crime Story a holiday is coming up which means a break in the college action
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so this will be a chance for our successful student and their classmates to take some time
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off finally getting the opportunity to take some time and spend it on oneself with a
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trip this is a chance to take a break and get away excited for the break and for their trip
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out of state our student decides to spend an evening out to celebrate going out to dinner
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and then a little drinking and partying afterward evening drinks turn into late night fun
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and late night fun turns into the small hours of the next day it's 2 am and things are wrapping up winding down
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it's time to go home and then poof just like that our college student disappears
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some say into the night and others say Into Thin Air long time listeners of this show are
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most certainly thinking of Brian Shafer a promising Ohio State med student gearing up for a vacation with his
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girlfriend out with his friends and having a great time when suddenly he's gone and now it's been over 15 years
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and he's still gone still missing one night he walked into a bar and 15 years go by and his name and photos of
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him are still listed on the Charlie projects website and the all missing persons database
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maintained by the Ohio attorney general Dave Yost office but we won't be telling you the tale of
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Brian Shafer again this week because sadly there is another student the very strangely experienced a quite
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similar fate a fate of possibly never being seen alive again or simply put lost but never found
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this week we will be covering another missing student from another Ohio College campus
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Judy Martins went out partying with friends on the night of May 23rd come morning she was gone
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and quite possibly lost and never to be found this is true crime garage and this is
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the case of Judy Martins [Music] [Music] Judy Martins was born on July 15 1955 to Proud parents Arthur and Dolores
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she would be the eldest of three children all three children were pretty close in age and Judy and her sister
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Nancy had a tight Bond Judy was born and raised in the nice community of Avon Lake Ohio which is up near the Cleveland
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area on the shores of Lake Erie Judy graduated from Avon Lake High School in 1973 and she enrolled to go to school at
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Ohio University in Athens but things changed a couple years in and she transferred to Kent State University
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yeah the rumors were that she was getting homesick sadly Kent State University is mostly known for the
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notorious Kent State shootings also known as the May 4 Massacre this was the killings of four Kent State students and
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the wounding of nine others all unarmed when 28 Ohio National Guard soldiers fired approximately 67 rounds at the
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group of students 10 soldiers in Nixon come in there Captain I'm not a crook but as set Judy enrolled in Ohio
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University where she completed two years of college after that she moved back home and eventually enrolled at Kent
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State where she moved into one of the dorms Judy was seeking an art major minoring in women's studies and she told
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her parents and fellow students she wanted to be a therapist or counselor and in 1978 she was well on her way she
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was completing her schooling at Kent State and she was a resident staff assistant at one of the all-female
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dormitories this is the Engelman Hall dorm and she was a volunteer counselor at the campuses pregnancy information
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center and that brings us up to the details of when Judy went missing yeah so the night question here captain or
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the days in question here will be the later part of May 23rd or the early hours of May 24
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1978. now here is The Disappearance as reported by The Columbus Dispatch which is one of the bigger newspapers here in
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Ohio and we will pause periodically to add in our own two cents or in my case one cent but the dispatch article says
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Judy was last seen at about 2 30 a.m May 24 1978. Witnesses told police she left the
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party headed for Engelman Hall only four to six minutes away on foot okay stepping in here Captain she was at
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Dunbar Hall this is an all-male dormitory building aldongs she was living alone at Engelman Hall an
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all-female dorm now the article that we are citing says four to six minutes on foot the best report that I think I
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could find out there states that it was 215 yards from door to door so two football fields-ish of a walk
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late at night by yourself now this might be conflicting information information I
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get is it's about a hundred yards but the issue becomes that there's two entrance ways there's a front entrance
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and a back entrance so maybe that is why there's a discrepancy on how many yards
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away it is yes and neither of us have made this walk ourselves so obviously we're going off of different reports
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from different people but I have been on the campus though the information I'm citing here came from the chief of
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police at Kent State University but again this is an old case and some of this information is 30 40 years old
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either way it's a very small distance correct well and one critical thing here that I think we should point out
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regardless if it's one football field or two football fields in distance is that
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we have a situation where Judy made this trip before you know this is a common thing that she would have done she was
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an evening outgoing person she was very sociable one thing that I think we should also mention here is a very
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general statement of her personality and I think this really sums her up very nicely is it was said by her friends
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that Judy was very sociable and very much the life of the party after hours but she was incredibly responsible she
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was never late to school never missed school never missed work never late to work she was top-notch go-getter during
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the day and sociable in the evening time so again a short walk by herself the middle of the night
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and a trip that she had done on foot several times she was also known to ride a bicycle around on campus and the bike
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is mentioned throughout our story and will be mentioned throughout our story but it was never mentioned I could never
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find any mention of this bicycle on the statement of how she was getting home that night it's always been stated that
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she was walking home that night now Judy was wearing a curly red wig over her long dark hair
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she was wearing I believe you said call it Gaucho style jeans a brown and yellow
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blouse beige trench coat brown boots and carrying a large white imitation leather
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shoulder bag okay so the wig and her get up for that night she was out and she was partying with friends so she was
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definitely playing dress up here that night later after she was reported missing several people
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would say that they saw her that night and Judy was dressed like a hooker these are their words and I don't think that
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they mean that to paint Judy in any kind of negative light here captain again I believe she was just playing dress-up
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that night so maybe she was telling people that she was dressing like a hooker that night well in that style of
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jeans would have been popular in the 70s think of a bell bottom but instead of them being tight and then flaring out at
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the bottom they just they're just flaring out all over they're flaring out all over but they kind of look like bell
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bottoms at the at the bottom and that's a good description and another good description is that when we say or she
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said or her friend said she was dressed like a hooker that night this is not like the movie Pretty Woman street
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walker type clothing stuff that is very revealing this is basically funny looking jeans and a button-up shirt
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the following day Judy was supposed to travel home to Avon Lake to get her new car when she didn't come home or didn't
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call home by that Friday Dolores her mother called Judy's room every hour without success yeah so she was supposed
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to go back to pick up her car but she was going to go on a trip yeah so that is one thing that I wanted to jump in
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here with on that story right because this is one of the confusing portions of the story let me finish up the next two
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sentences of this article real quick this is again is from the information from The Columbus Dispatch it says a
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fellow student officially reported Judy missing on May 26th please note that date May 26th which would be two days
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after the last sighting or supposed last sighting of Judy when her room was searched nothing was missing so she left
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behind her glasses clothing books and cosmetics now back to the double story there of picking up the car
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and or going on a trip so again Captain I found this to be a little troubling the how the how it was
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noticed that Judy was missing because I've seen these two different stories or different versions of What Judy was
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supposed to be doing on the 24th or the 25th and this was one of my questions when
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I met with one of the law enforcement agencies still investigating Judy's case so there's some good news there right
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this case is still very active you mentioned a trip to New York so there was two stories one that she's
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going home to pick up a car the other story is she was going with two of her friends from Kent State to go to out of
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state to go to New York and I asked law enforcement since we know that Judy didn't have a car on
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campus she rode that bike most places and her family says her family's words were that she was returning home to get
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her car or a new car so my question for law enforcement was well who was going to drive her to get to Avon Lake
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to retrieve that vehicle because obviously I think that would be my number one suspect because whoever that
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was was not the same person that reported her missing to my knowledge now the Memorial Day weekend was coming up
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and Judy Martins had planned a trip to New York with two friends and I believe some of the confusion here is possibly
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that maybe both stories are accurate that she would be doing both as we are talking about having five or six days
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when she could achieve both of these events yeah so possibly my schedules lighter at this point let me go pick up
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my car I'll bring it back to campus and then when we go on the road trip we're going to take my vehicle yeah because
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what I was told was no uh we didn't have any information that she was coming home
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but again the article in the dispatch those are the family's words so that portion there has to be
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some truth to that to me and then the law enforcement version is that New York trip has always been something that they
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were they were investigating the thing here though we need to remind the listeners that are not familiar with the
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state of Ohio we're talking about an hour and 15 to maybe an hour and 30 minute drive from the college campus to
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Avon Lake so this is something that she would if she was going to go home she would need someone to drive her there
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now we have Judy's siblings weighing in in the article and saying wearing contact lenses when she vanished they
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say no way would she have left her eyeglasses behind this is Steve Martin's her younger brother
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and saying that she rarely went anywhere without makeup according to her sister so remember it was quickly and easily
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determined that nothing was missing from Judy's dorm room leaving behind her glasses clothing
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books and cosmetics now anywhere you would see Judy's case you will absolutely see this portion of the case
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information repeated as there were several outside sources that would later say Judy left on her own the family says
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no her family says no and I say no but we will examine the mysterious details of those claims as our case unfolds okay
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so she's at this party and when we say party loose terms right because there it wasn't like there was
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hundreds of people there she was in another dorm having a couple drinks with people and hanging out there correct and
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I think to call it a party really is is something that just confuses the matter a little bit more I I would not
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describe any of these goings on to be any type of party they may have had a drink or two and and may have called it
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that or maybe she went to the dorm thinking she was going to a party and it was just as you said hanging out with a
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couple of people it was a little bit of uh room jumping or or going from dorm to
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dorm and we have some more details on that now the article goes on and says the week after she goes missing her
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family the Martin family had a sit-down meeting with Kent State president Brad Golding and they say that they left this
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meeting unimpressed Judy's sister Nancy said she believes that the University was still rebuilding
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its reputation after the May 4 1970 incident and didn't want any type of negative PR about their college
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campus or their college right and Steve Martin's agrees saying quote what was disappointing was
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the way that the investigation played out the university didn't want a whole lot of press end quote and we've talked
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about this with Brian shaffer's case but it's more obvious here isn't it no well
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no because it's a different time period obviously back then they're going hey we
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don't want if we talk about this too much we're going to get more newspapers we don't want the big newspapers to talk
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about this and Brian shaffer's case when you looked up medical student missing Ohio State it was flooded with the first
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few pages of Google that's all you could find within a few days once you typed in
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Ohio State student missing it didn't show up the University was able to bury it in
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Google searches and so just look if you're in a state and you hear about a college student going missing Google it
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and you'll find within a week that university has took control of the Google searches to make sure that those
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stories get buried so when Johnny from Iowa gets a letter saying he can go to the Ohio State University they
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want to make sure when that parent Googles or searches for the Ohio State University that's something
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from the actual University pops up well yeah your kid's going to go off and be living elsewhere for the first time not
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under your roof you don't want Mom and Dad or Mom or Dad separately or together don't want to send you know their their
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little their young their daughter or their son off to what they believe might be a dangerous place right and if the
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first thing that they Google about that college is missing a person then some red flags get thrown up there Arthur and
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Dolores speaking of parents the Martins kept Faith according to this article kept total faith in the police Nancy
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said and never hired a private investigator because they thought it would make the police upset Nancy
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believes investigators assumed Judy left on her own and broke contact with the family that's a mistake I'm gonna say
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this I'll I base my reputation on you have a missing person case immediately hire a private investigator
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but you're not trying to hinder the investigation at all you're just going to be doing your due diligence and the
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thing here in this case Captain I see a situation where the case got hindered the investigation got messed up very
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early on and it became a confusing and complicated case very early on unnecessarily like there were steps that
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could have been made that that would have made this investigation a little easier and speaking of which let's dive
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into the investigation and search for Judy because Judy leaving a party at 2 or 2 30 a.m to walk a short distance
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home and never making it there is obviously not the whole story there is much much more detail to it than that
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but the investigation really was just a poorly conducted investigation from the beginning and this was for several
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reasons the first was this was really an uphill climb in my opinion for the Kent
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State Police because years later and this would have been from information I found from 1983 so five years after she
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went missing we have Kent State Police Chief Robert Malone saying on record this is the only
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case that we have had at Kent State of a missing person who could not be accounted for he says I know it's the
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only one since 1973 when I came on board so now a 10-year span 73 to 83 according to
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Robert Malone now we need to keep in mind Robert Malone was not the police chief in 78 when
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when Judy went missing but he goes on to say with 17 000 students we get a lot of missing
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persons reports here but there always seems to be an explanation so think about that 10-year period when this man
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has worked there seventeen thousand students we get a lot of missing persons reports she's the only one in 10 years
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that we couldn't find out where she went or what happened to her so what happened
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to Judy on the night of May 24 1978 when Judy apparently left the party at Dunbar
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Hall on her way home to Engelman Hall first Judy lived alone so that caused a delay to report her
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missing she was missing and unaccounted for just no one knew so she was not reported
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missing until the 26th so that's two days now local police went to Judy's dorm and they find everything
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as it should be nothing's missing no sign of Foul Play no sign of a struggle no forced entry in fact there are a lot
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of theories out there in this case but I could not find one single source I spoke to three different people that
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know this case better than anyone else no Source says that Judy returned to her dorm that night
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no case expert says that she made it home that night and I could not find anything to suggest
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that she in my opinion made it home that night after going out so whatever happened to Judy that night
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it looks like it happened sometime after this party and before she could arrive at her dorm she's not reported missing
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for two days and then her family is notified after she's reported missing Judy's mom says she was calling Judy's
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dorm often looking for her so at least we have the knight in question narrowed down to a matter of a couple of hours
00:25:12
yeah and Captain I would put that window of time when something went down something bad happened to Judy between
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11 pm on the 23rd and maybe as late as 3 A.M on the 24th so some additional issues with the initial investigation as
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we said the Memorial Day long weekend yeah was the weekend after she went missing most of the students have left
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the campus by the time police start looking into this so they have no one to question
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or they're missing a lot of the people that they could question and not really anyone to help fill in
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the blanks here within the first couple of days and they just didn't take it seriously
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at first and look often we all become products of our environment and the environment at Kent State in the late
00:26:08
70s according to the police chief said that they were receiving two missing persons cases a week on average and in
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every case up to Judy's case the person was accounted for within hours or days of the report
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so you can almost see how the police themselves fall victim to this environment and the police likely
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thought that this would be the case here as well usually someone turns up they stayed with a boyfriend or a
00:26:37
girlfriend or they went home back home unexpectedly now regardless because think about how many missing
00:26:45
persons cases turn into homicide cases right right well your homicide investigation will go much better if you
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are not starting from scratch once you figure it out or decide that it is in fact a homicide case rather than a
00:26:59
missing person's case so what sort of things can one do well it's interviewing persons and
00:27:06
properly recording their statements you can take photographs of her dorm and belongings take photographs of all of
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the last known places she is believed to have been and photos of the people she was with did any of them have any
00:27:21
noticeable scratches or injuries none of that happened in this case so really this is just an all-out difficult
00:27:28
situation for the investigation as we can view it 40 years later and to make matters worse
00:27:36
according to Kent State they lost or destroyed the case File this is due to some [ __ ] records protocol hey now
00:27:46
and it's believed in the year 2000 that they got rid of the file now sometimes two in these older cases
00:27:55
Captain you find that the lead detective took the file home or the police chief took the file home but for whatever
00:28:01
reason when the case was being looked at again and this would have been in the last 10 to maybe 15 years
00:28:09
when they were looking at this case Again by a different agency other than Kent State Police well that's when they
00:28:14
learned that the Kent State Police file no longer exist on this case but some smart people did do some smart
00:28:22
moves one Judy was reported missing in two jurisdictions right she was reported missing where she was going to school
00:28:31
and two she was reported where she was from so she's reported missing an Avon Lake as well so Avon Lake was
00:28:40
investigating this case as well and they had a file of their own that in air quotes survived and we managed to
00:28:49
get a copy of the file that still exists [Music] thank you [Music] thank you all right we're back cheers mates cheers
00:29:17
to you Captain cheers to all the fine fine people out there so the investigative timeline as laid out in
00:29:24
the police file is as follows and it's going to start as early as late April or early May and that's their exact
00:29:33
statement here that in late April or early May of 1978 Jim young visits Judy at KSU
00:29:43
they are intimate per gym Jim young is or was Judy's long time on again and off-again boyfriend he was considered a
00:29:54
suspect in this case now we need to note that Jim is Judy's boyfriend from Avon Lake not Kent State he does not
00:30:03
attend Kent State right he says their breakup was pretty much Mutual and it basically involved that they
00:30:10
didn't see each other very much they lived in two different locations and so they both agreed to break up it sounded
00:30:17
like that Judy had some other concerns maybe Jim party too much or drank too much but According to Jim the breakup
00:30:26
was mutual and I couldn't really find any family or friends to go against that idea that the makeup the
00:30:34
breakup was Mutual yeah but just because it's mutual at one time doesn't mean it
00:30:39
stayed that way he did say that he would visit her on occasion at Kent State and
00:30:45
when she was home on break or during the summer time the two of them would hang out this is probably
00:30:52
information backing up the idea that everybody puts forward that they were on again off again well and also because
00:31:00
she's resident staff that means she has her own room and she would have been basically the hall monitor for her floor
00:31:09
or a section of her floor so it does suck that we don't have a roommate that is able to back up Jim's
00:31:17
claims what we do have though I I want to kind of go out of my way to point this out is it sounds to me Captain like
00:31:24
her family her remaining family and the friends that she had at the time are backing up to police what this young man
00:31:34
was saying now we should though make mental note of two things one his name because we're going to be going through
00:31:40
different names and different people during this timeline but we should also make mental note that
00:31:47
he was considered a suspect very early on in this case so the things that he says or suspicions around him as you're
00:31:54
pointing out Captain are important to this story but this brings us to May 19th now this will be the last day that
00:32:01
Judy's mother talks to her daughter on the phone and then we have May 23rd so note she disappeared on either the 23rd
00:32:10
or 24th this is the last time that Jim Young the former boyfriend or John Young says
00:32:18
that he talked with Judy on the phone now at one o'clock 1 pm approximately that afternoon
00:32:25
James kratchik reports seeing Judy in the Prentice Hall cafeteria sitting with a another student named Kevin Greer
00:32:36
Greer states that they were sitting and eating with Steve another classmate named Steve no last name given and that
00:32:45
kratchik borrowed coupons or meal tickets at this time from Judy Judy told him to pay her back as she would be
00:32:56
needing them by the end of the year I do want to point this out like this is just
00:33:01
another one of those little tidbits one of those little indicators along the way
00:33:06
that she was making plans she probably wasn't planning on taking off or at least a statement of hey yeah
00:33:15
I'll give you a meal ticket or two to cover you for today but I need these back before the end of the year well
00:33:21
it's similar like with the Brian shaver case a lot of people go well why would Brian go missing
00:33:27
from a bar when you look at the Judy Martin's case okay she leaves this party let's say roughly around two but nobody
00:33:35
was in her dorm room for multiple days correct so we don't know if she made it back toward dorm room so maybe she made
00:33:44
it back and maybe on her answering machine if there was one she had a message from some guy that she had a
00:33:51
crush on it that said come out to California and she decided to leave without a car
00:33:57
but we don't know that all we'd know is that there wasn't really anything Disturbed in her dorm
00:34:03
room right and just pointing out that there's nothing to indicate up to this point that she wasn't planning on doing
00:34:09
anything other than attending school for the remainder of the year right so this brings us to about 3 P.M that
00:34:17
day when Judy leaves a note for Charles Neville in his room and the note says that she stopped by when he was not
00:34:26
there now I'm not certain here Captain but from what I gather Charles is a popular
00:34:32
dude and may have been considered quite the catch back then so I'm not sure if they were just friends or if there was
00:34:40
something there but according to the investigation she dropped by roughly around 3 P.M that afternoon leaving a
00:34:48
note for Charles that evening Judy goes to dinner with one of her good friends and her name is Robin after dinner this
00:34:58
is approximately 8 30 p.m Judy leaves her friend Michelle Morgan's room telling her that she was going to see
00:35:06
Charles Neville she said she might stop back at the room after leaving Charles's place
00:35:12
now Charles lives in the dorm rooms as almost everybody that we're going to be mentioning did at the time right Kent
00:35:20
State for example is not a highly commuted College a lot of a good majority of the students live on campus
00:35:28
at approximately 11 pm this is where I think I really start to call things into question but this is the information
00:35:35
that the police have collected over the years at approximately 11 pm Judy leaves
00:35:42
her friend Robin's room in Engelman Hall dormitory she tells her that she is going to Charles Neville's room after
00:35:50
that Judy arrives at 233 Dunbar Hall stays there with Charles Neville's and John beckony this is in John's room
00:36:01
Judy removes the wig sunglasses and trench coat at this time remember she's playing dress-up that
00:36:08
night again around 11 pm approximately this is per Kevin Greer who we have already mentioned Judy stops by to see
00:36:16
if Bernie Caffrey would be there but he's not home so she talks to Bernie's roommate Leo robe for a minute or two
00:36:26
and then goes to Charles Neville's room Leo robe says Judy was dressed quote like a hooker okay so the important
00:36:36
thing here though to me Captain is now we have multiple independent Witnesses placing our
00:36:43
missing person in Dunbar Hall in the Dunbar hall building I guess the male dormitory yeah this is an all-male
00:36:51
dormitory so that doesn't seem to be really in question right we can question what was going on or how things went
00:36:59
down after this but it's not a question that she was there in that building at 11 o'clock and a little bit afterwards
00:37:07
yeah but here's what we don't know as we we're getting this information from Robin right no this information is
00:37:13
coming from all kinds of different sources independent sources so these this is statements from Charles from
00:37:21
Robin from James every person that we've mentioned so far on the 23rd all this information is coming from them yeah but
00:37:29
if you that's why you should let somebody finish talking but this information is coming from
00:37:35
Robins coming from Charles right what we don't know is what were Charles initial statements I'd
00:37:44
be interested to know that I'd be interested to know if they said hey well we we believe that she visited you on
00:37:51
the night she went missing and he said uh I don't remember or um I know I don't think she did and then
00:37:59
they got information from Robin and said hey well we got information from Robin that she headed towards your dorm and
00:38:06
then we got information from this other person that she was here and then he comes forward you see what I'm saying
00:38:13
like we we know what their statements are but we don't know exactly how they got them yeah that's
00:38:21
that's cool and the thing here is it's not really them coming forward you know I I I know what you mean by that but I
00:38:29
always kind of hate that statement right right because it sounds like they went up and called the police station or
00:38:34
knocked on the the front door and said hey I got a story to tell this is Kent State Police going around and asking
00:38:42
people did you see anything on the 23rd did you see anything on the 24th and you're right we don't know the exact
00:38:49
wording of questions that were first fired at any of these individuals but from my understanding and the way that
00:38:57
the information that we received reads to me is that these are all their initial statements when first
00:39:05
asked about that night and if anything changed when they were questioned at a later date right it's
00:39:13
noted in the information as well but also what's interesting too is we have this isolated
00:39:21
space that you would think and and we're kind of talking about this off air before we started recording was this is
00:39:29
78 smoking in the 70s you could smoke in the hospital buildings not all hospitals
00:39:37
but a lot of them you could you were smoking in a lot of the schools so I if I had to bet make a wager here I would
00:39:45
put my money on smoking was allowed in the dorms yes and and I think that becomes a big key here because if it
00:39:53
wasn't allowed but there was still a lot of smokers that you would have a gathering outside of the male dorm room
00:40:02
even though it'd be late but you know college students stay up pretty late so there I think there would have been
00:40:08
more eyewitnesses so if somebody would say hey they were smoking in the dorm rooms I go well there's probably not
00:40:14
going to be a bunch of people gathered outside or less people gathered outside to be eyewitnesses once she left the
00:40:21
all-male dorm rooms well smoking or non-smoking aside you're really hitting on something I think that's important
00:40:27
here Captain where you're right this is May it was a warm night that night she wasn't the only one going out and having
00:40:36
a good time that night there's a lot of people going out and having a good time that night and who knows how late they
00:40:42
stayed up we know that there was not much schooling or academic activity that was going to be taking place over the
00:40:49
next several days so this was a time to kind of let loose and if you were going to stay up or stay out till three or
00:40:55
four in the morning this sounds to me like this was a good night to do it at approximately midnight John beckony who
00:41:02
we've mentioned already says that he knocks on Charles Neville's door he and a friend are going to the 7-Eleven for
00:41:10
those that don't know what a 7-Eleven is it's a like a little convenience store a
00:41:13
little gas station also people know it as Heaven There you go beckony Returns the wig sunglasses and coat to
00:41:22
Judy at this time per his statement beckony reports that Judy is in quote good mental and physical condition at
00:41:30
this time May 24th at approximately 2 30 a.m Charles Neville's says that this is the
00:41:39
time that Judy leaves his room now a weird note in our timeline and there are going to be several of these as we get
00:41:48
further from her disappearance but this is the first one and this takes place on
00:41:54
May 24th so by all of the stories the information that we've received and every story out there
00:42:01
she goes missing sometime after leaving that male dormitory at 2 30 A.M right this brings us to 1 30 p.m on that
00:42:12
same day so if all those stories are right she's already missing just not reported missing at this time right we
00:42:20
have another individual who is named David horning David says or reports to police and this is where I think it's
00:42:27
appropriate to say comes forward it sounds like this man came forward and reports seeing a girl who matched
00:42:35
Judy's description and clothing at the bus stop near a sandwich shop he says a large yellow car pulled near the Stop
00:42:44
and the girl either got in or was pulled in he was not sure the car then abruptly
00:42:50
pulled from the curb and went to the far left lane it was then heading westbound
00:42:57
on Route 59 and I'm not saying that this individual is a lying whatsoever but it's not clear that he's stating that he
00:43:06
knew her before she went missing right does a guy that came forward after when they're growing hey we're looking
00:43:14
for this girl he goes well I saw a girl that looked similar I would hold a lot more weight to this
00:43:22
eyewitness if he said I'm friends with her I'm friends with Judy yeah and I saw her get into a car
00:43:31
then at that point what do we know what we know is that she went back to her dorm she probably felt you know she
00:43:39
slept in her own bed the next day she took off with somebody around 1pm 1 30 P.M
00:43:47
but this guy doesn't know her he's not friends with her so he's going hey well she look like the similar person
00:43:57
and so we have no clue if she ever made it back to her dorm room well and one thing that's really tricky in this case
00:44:06
here and again I mean we can keep circling around this but but I've not seen any information to suggest that she
00:44:14
ever made it home that night ever anywhere by by any of the investigating agencies any of her friends or family no
00:44:22
one's that seems to be one of the furthest things from speculation well I remember at some point and I could be
00:44:29
wrong but some of my buddies would live in like a all male dorm and then you'd have the all-female dorm and then you
00:44:36
have a co-ed dorm but some of the dorms you actually had to sign in even though like you lived
00:44:44
there like you had to sign in because it was past like midnight and they didn't have maybe somebody on guard to see who
00:44:51
was coming into the buildings yeah and that is very smart of you because that's one thing I was thinking as well like
00:44:58
would would there be a curfew because this was during the week would there be a curfew to get in or or
00:45:04
would you at least have to sign in or sign out and what I was told now again we're
00:45:11
being told this 40 years later so we can't hop in the DeLorean and no 100 but from what I was told was that it was a
00:45:19
pretty casual laid back atmosphere on campus that year and maybe even years after that I don't
00:45:27
know if her going missing changed some of that here becomes the problem with her going missing was like I said she's
00:45:35
basically like The Chaperone on her floor so she would she would be one of those
00:45:42
individuals if some other girl went missing on her floor they'd be going right to her right right to Judy and
00:45:50
saying hey what did you see what do you know can you talk to these other girls well not only that if there were someone
00:45:56
to get away with not signing in she would be able to do that right the uh statement about this this young man
00:46:06
seeing somebody matching Judy's description either getting into a vehicle or maybe she was pulled in he
00:46:13
doesn't know for certain as you pointed out Captain you're very right he's coming forward after the you know he's
00:46:20
seeing missing persons flyers and one thing that that I thought was amazing about this case you know we always have
00:46:26
these little very unique details in each one of these cases you would think that
00:46:31
at some point here in the garage after you've covered several hundreds of cases that at some point they just start
00:46:37
becoming carbon copies of one another where in Judy's case it was interesting to me that the story
00:46:45
on the surface is very similar to Brian shaffer's but then here we have this interesting unique portion to her case
00:46:53
where she's playing dress-up the night that she goes missing right how freaking weird is that so
00:47:00
they all become amalgamation of like a bunch of different cases so she when he says the the statement in
00:47:08
the police file is someone matching or someone matched Judy's description that this vehicle
00:47:16
which description is it is it the description of her playing dress-up that night that's a great point or is it the
00:47:22
description of her because she she looks very different that night than she does
00:47:28
the rest of the days and that is one thing that I found bizarre about this case because some of the missing persons
00:47:35
Flyers only had the picture from her from that night where she's wearing a freaking wig
00:47:42
you know like I mean this is a young beautiful college student and she looks but she's quite a bit
00:47:48
different she looks quite a bit different in in both of those images to me that's my opinion
00:47:54
and we'll post all those photos on social media so follow us on Facebook Twitter and Instagram at True Crime
00:48:01
garage if you want to see those photos the missing persons flyers in this case that I liked the best or that I thought
00:48:09
carried the most weight were the ones that had a recent photo of her as she would regularly look
00:48:17
and a photo from that night because I think it's crucial here when you're looking for someone this is how she
00:48:22
looks when she's not in her little disguise or playing dress-up that night but these are the items that we expect
00:48:28
to be with her or items that we might want to find because we can't locate her but like you said in her dorm
00:48:39
there's no wig there's no glasses no fake leather purse right to me that's more evidence that I can
00:48:47
lean towards the fact that she never made it back to her dorm right she's wearing contacts that night
00:48:54
she's wearing sunglasses none of those things are ever found in in her dorm now it's two days later as we said earlier
00:49:01
but it's at 4 35 p.m when the actual missing persons report is filed by a Michelle Shabbat I believe is how you
00:49:08
say her last name I probably got that wrong the report was taken by detective Brandon of the Kansas
00:49:17
the report was taken by the the report was taken by detective Brandon of Kent State University PD the then Judy is
00:49:27
reported missing to Avon Lake PD at about the same time this is a weird part to the case as well
00:49:36
May 27th the day after she's reported missing Judy's camera is secured this is by the Kent State PD
00:49:46
they obtain her camera pictures show how Judy was dressed that night so this is interesting because we
00:49:54
have the photos of Judy from the night that she went missing so how she looked that night and what she was wearing the
00:50:00
wig and all that and what is missing from the police information here though Captain is
00:50:09
and this is really anyone's guess where and from whom did they get the camera again
00:50:18
you know we everything we have says that she didn't come home that night so did she leave this camera with one of
00:50:25
her female friends or a male friend after dinner or was it recovered from you know a female friend's dorm or a
00:50:34
male friend dormitory room well like we just don't know it's it's an answer that
00:50:39
I would love to have yes and I think there's a couple things one it could have been our dorm room
00:50:45
or it could have been when she left her wig and and other items and that other kids dorm room and he returned those
00:50:53
items maybe he just didn't notice that she had a camera there uh and here's why I questioned that it
00:51:02
could be from our dorm room is it is it possible that she had this outfit took some pictures of her in this outfit
00:51:12
at some point in time and then just went hey I'm going out to have fun tonight have a couple drinks with my buddies
00:51:21
before I go on this trip and I'm going to put on my zany outfit you're right I'm with you I think that from the
00:51:28
information that I've seen it sounds to me like there's a a high probability this wasn't the first time that she wore
00:51:35
that outfit or the wig or some version of such but the other thing too is we know she was back at her dorm building
00:51:43
after dinner hanging out with different friends that she didn't go to dinner with so when we say she didn't go back
00:51:50
to her dorm that night I really want to underline and Echo what we were saying earlier that
00:51:57
I mean that that once she went to the mail dorm building that she didn't go back to her dorm that night I believe
00:52:04
that after dinner she probably went back there because we know she was in the building so why not stop by her own
00:52:09
place if you need anything or yes she may have dropped off her camera at that time not wanting to carry it around
00:52:16
already taking pictures of her and her friend hanging out before during or after dinner that's a very good point
00:52:23
and also maybe it's part of her responsibilities to then go and check on her floor and make sure
00:52:30
there's nobody reporting anything because that's part of their job I mean I I believe like
00:52:39
I believe they actually get paid to do that well on the following day on the 27th
00:52:45
Judy is officially entered as a missing person so this is technically now three days after she's gone missing the county
00:52:54
jail the hospital and campus Health Center are all contacted to see if she would be there for any reason at all and
00:53:03
of course they received negative results uh friends Michelle and Robin so this is
00:53:08
the one friend that reported her missing the one friend that went to dinner with
00:53:12
her that night and Judy's mom along with Sergeant hunt of the Avon Lake Police Department
00:53:20
on the 27th they have like a group call a group phone call that goes to Kent State PD and they basically ask what the
00:53:29
f is going on in the investigation my guess here is because they probably don't think that
00:53:37
kspd is doing anything or actively investigating the missing persons case that they think it's just another person
00:53:44
that will turn up in a few hours or a couple days well then when you see this look we always talk about all this
00:53:52
happened in a small town and this this law enforcement agency is not equipped to handle this right well that's what a
00:54:02
campus is is a small town and yes Kent State Police will know more about the nooks
00:54:09
and crannies of their little Community then State Police or the local law enforcement
00:54:18
but they're not equipped to handle a missing person case like this like once you don't find her
00:54:27
and I'm not even saying the 24-hour rule I'd say on a campus you don't find an individual in 12 hours
00:54:35
this needs to be handed over to the big boys well this is when uh Judy's mother says
00:54:42
that she is going to call the media and I don't I imagine this is like a threat of hey I don't think you're doing enough
00:54:48
or doing anything and we're not it's not gone unnoticed but and ask yourself this
00:54:54
question if you were questioned by Kent State Police or the sheriff department which one are
00:55:05
you going to be more intimidated by in this case it would be the sheriff's department you know what I mean it's
00:55:10
like there's a lot of people when they're on campuses they don't take even though they have what they are calling a
00:55:17
police department and they can't arrest you people don't take them as serious they look at them more as like security
00:55:24
guards then they do police officers look most of their work is going to be busting up
00:55:31
underage drinking parties or breaking up drinking parties especially back in the
00:55:37
late 70s catching people smoking pots smoking doobies um that kind of stuff so you're right you're absolutely right on
00:55:45
that now we said that there are going to be some weird things in the timeline and
00:55:49
here's another strange one on May 30th time unknown there's no time mentioned here I imagine this is a person coming
00:55:58
forward after the fact after they've witnessed this Deborah helmick claims to have seen Judy on Merrell Circle near
00:56:08
Engelman and that's as far as that statement goes again on May 30th this is at approximately 9 pm Bill Jones a resident
00:56:19
of college Towers says that he saw a tall girl with long dark hair being led out of the main door of the complex by
00:56:29
two males he said that the female seemed spaced out and heard her saying quote I
00:56:36
haven't been home since Tuesday but she wasn't all that tall yeah you're you're right um five foot four I would not
00:56:43
consider that to be tall correct again I think with some of these sightings of Judy what I think we need
00:56:51
to keep in mind is I don't think I think that they're seeing young ladies that look similar
00:56:58
they're just not seeing Judy and I think that these are just people that are you
00:57:02
know they see a missing persons flyer and they're trying to help you know I I saw this and it's probably nothing but I
00:57:09
want to make sure that I at least report it to the proper authorities and what did you call them Groucho pants is that
00:57:16
what they're called I no I called them Gaucho pants and I don't know if that's correct they're probably not called
00:57:21
Groucho pants uh but I also wonder because if somebody said to me oh well this guy went missing and he had a navy
00:57:31
blue hoodie and then three days later I'm like oh I saw this guy with a navy navy blue hoodie but he wasn't he wasn't
00:57:38
shorter he was a little bit taller I would report it like where it filled like I had to because
00:57:45
he had a similar item and like I said these were kind of these were popular pants at the time
00:57:52
so I wonder if there was some sightings just based off her clothing oh I saw a girl with
00:57:58
you know a flannel shirt in in these uh Gaucho pants on May 30th again no time given for this one Jim young the former
00:58:07
boyfriend is contacted he agrees to an interview and is told to make an appointment ASAP with a detective
00:58:15
at 2 p.m on that same day an attempt to interview Charles Neville's is made but he isn't in his room detective Stanley
00:58:24
instead finds John beckony who he then interviewed also on May 30th officers interview Bernie Caffrey in the hallway
00:58:34
at 3 30 p.m on the same day officers go to Jim kratchik's room they they re-interview him officers
00:58:44
state it takes several minutes for him to answer or open the door the officers requested to go into the room for
00:58:52
privacy purposes and find an unidentified female in his room he repeats that he last Saw Judy at 11 30
00:59:00
to 12 30 on May 23rd 24th along with Kevin Greer well we know why it took him so long to answer the door and put his
00:59:09
pants back on also on the 30th Captain this is at 4 45 officers stopped by Charles Neville's
00:59:18
room remember we already mentioned that they went there to speak with him again earlier that day they don't find him
00:59:24
he's not home and they speak to Bernie Caffrey and Jim kratchik in the meantime so now they're going to circle back to
00:59:31
talk with Charles Neville's again he is home at this time at 4 45 they enter Charles's room
00:59:39
again they probably asked if they could come in for privacy purposes privacy of the questions that they're going to ask
00:59:45
and they don't want right when you're interviewing people that may have been the last person or one of the last
00:59:50
people to see a missing person you don't want their story being broadcast to everybody else now do you no so they're
00:59:57
in Charles's room and officers stated that he repeated the same story that he told another Detective
01:00:04
so this would be the second time that they spoke with him per this statement and they said that Charles during this
01:00:11
visit speaks with his mother and his brother of course this is going to be via phone I believe that his mother and
01:00:18
brother are not only in another state but I believe that they are in two different states themselves he states
01:00:25
that his brother is an attorney at the time or will be an attorney soon and after speaking with his family he agrees
01:00:34
to a polygraph test with the police department and Charles was read his rights at that time and given a
01:00:42
statement form and he stated that he would complete these later as he was cooking dinner so
01:00:49
he agrees to the polygraph but it's not going to be administered right then obviously they're in his room they give
01:00:55
him a statement form to fill out this would be like what's your official statement right write it out and sign it
01:01:01
this is kind of your sworn statement right basically we know you've talked to detectives but now we want you to write
01:01:06
down that same story and here we go with back to casual atmosphere of the campus we have a
01:01:14
missing person here's your statement form that I need you to fill out but it's okay if you get to it later right
01:01:21
right it's like we don't want you to burn your dinner here Charles or your dong why don't you finish cooking have
01:01:27
your dinner have a nice night and give us a call when you've completed the form and my problem with this is he's a
01:01:33
person of interest because we're talking about what's happening two days after she possibly goes missing
01:01:40
what we do know is that she went out to dinner with a friend Robin they she comes back she's in her
01:01:49
her dorm building we know that because we have two different individuals stating that they
01:01:55
spoke with her there at that building and these are two people that didn't go to dinner with her yeah so is it
01:02:01
possible that she stopped by her room to freshen up or or to change clothes or to
01:02:07
grab something and then head over to this Charles guys dorm and in the and look anybody that's been a part of dorm
01:02:15
life when you're going to go visit with somebody you could just be walking past a room
01:02:21
and somebody pops out because they they spot you hey what's up Captain what are you doing and you sit there and talk to
01:02:27
him for a while or you pass a couple people that you are in class with and you go hey did you get homework done for
01:02:33
the day or whatever so she runs into some other people so we know she's in the all-male dorm room
01:02:40
and then we know that at some point she's in Charles's room we know at some point she's in somebody
01:02:47
else's room and then she goes back to Charles's room yep and this is per Charles Neville's and per these other
01:02:53
individuals as well and and those were the good old days when you just open up the door to your room and on a night
01:02:59
where there's a lot of activity and people out and about you never know who's going to drop in who you're going
01:03:05
to see or when a party's going to bust out in your place yeah and tell you you know you get labeled
01:03:13
icky flicky flicky and nobody wants to talk to you anymore so again she's in the mail dorm room we don't have anybody
01:03:20
that places her back into her dorm we don't have anybody that places her outside heading towards her dorm room so
01:03:31
look though then these individuals Charles John Jim Bernie and Kevin they all become Persons of Interest and we
01:03:40
need to know if their stories line up or if any of them have any nefarious background
01:03:48
I think those that's the starting point of the investigation but like you said they're already going about it in such a
01:03:55
such a lackadaisical Manner and to top that off here captain that will not be this will not be the end of the weird
01:04:03
activities or the strange events that will take place in this timeline [Music] so much more to get to to check out our
01:04:22
blog go to truecrime garage.com and please join us back here tomorrow in the garage
01:04:29
until then be good be kind and don't litter thank you foreign