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[Music] [Music] n [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you doing thanks for
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listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man who can finally afford College just kidding no one can
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afford College here is the captain and I'm not smart enough to go anyways it's good to be seen and good to see you
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the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true
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cry [Music] a busy and ambitious young college girl moves into her first apartment she is on
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her own she is happy she is social and outgoing and she's in school working toward her dreams of becoming a
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scientist but then in late September of 2004 someone attacked Britney in her apartment Dr Maggie Zigman Britney's
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mother led the charge looking for answers and for Britney's kill in 2007 Maggie began the Caravan To
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Catch a killer still to this day almost 20 years later Maggie continues to fight
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for her daughter and best friend 18-year-old Britney Phillips this is true crime garage and
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this is the still unsolved case of Britney Phillips [Music] Britney yavon Phillips was born to
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parents Dr Maggie Zigman and her husband John on October 4th 1985 Britney has an older brother his
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name is Josh he's just one year older than Britney now Britney Josh they spent their early years growing up in the
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State of Florida and then they moved to Kentucky for a brief period of time followed by settling down in the
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wonderful City of Tulsa during this migration period Maggie and John separated so Britney and Josh went to
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live with their mom after this divorce Britney was a social kid she was a big Runner and as a teen she even did some
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modeling she was also smart and very driven and her mother says this was not just as a young adult but her entire
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life she started kindergarten a year earlier than most kids she graduated from Tulsa Union High School in May of
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2003 I believe she was only 17 when she graduated from high school and she did her freshman year in college at her
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mom's alma mater which was eard college in Florida Britney wanted to become a scientist
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she was studying chemistry on a college scholarship so obviously very smart very
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driven but after wrapping up her freshman year this would be May of 2004 she decided that she was too far from
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home too far from Mom she became homesick and wanted to move back to Tulsa at the same time that Britney's
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moving back home her mother is moving to another city which is about an hour away
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from Tulsa yes this is the city of Chandler and and this is because Maggie works as a psychologist in a women's
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prison so Britney spent a couple of months in the early summer she's couch surfing at the home of a good friend and
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then she gets a job as a waitress at an Applebees restaurant she decided it wasn't for her so she decided to get a
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another job at a waitressing at another restaurant she decided to start taking classes at Tulsa Community College this
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is in July of 2004 Britney enrolled at Tulsa Community College fulltime and in August she moved into an apartment of
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her own the Glenn Eagles apartment complex this is just across the street from her old high school so she knows
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the area she's familiar with the area it's it's in her comfort zone yeah her new address was
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9407 East 65th Street the complex was a cluster of several two-story buildings very commonly rented to students at the
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community college it was thought to be a safe neighborhood and Maggie her mother
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felt very comfortable with the move and with the location and also we have her brother
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Josh he's a student at the community college as well so older brother's still nearby in case of an emergency mom's
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about an hour away in Chandler and everything was setting up to be great for Britney for
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2004 now researching this case did you get this feeling I got this sense that she was very bright kid
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worked very hard on academics then she went away to school again like you said kind of out of her comfort zone so now
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she's coming back but but it almost feels like in a sense that maybe she was also just burnt out a little bit and so
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this was kind of a reset in Britney's life I think you're exactly right here Captain it does feel like a bit of a
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reset it's going back home and realizing that look the academic part of going to
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college in Florida that wasn't an issue it's just many of us need to be close to
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our families and close to home and close to what we know and that's what it looks
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like with Britney here now she is making friends rather easily with other students
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at the community college she's making friends with some of the residents at her new apartment
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complex and she started casually dating a guy that that she had recently met at this time and it said that she took this
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man this young man to meet her mom Maggie over dinner she said that the young man seemed to be very nice very
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polite but she didn't get the vibe that the relationship was going to be a serious
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one seemed a little casual which is a little strange to me cuz I'm like if it's going to be casual then why have
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them meet your family but maybe it was also just like happen stance where it's like well
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we're going to hang out but then I made plans with my mom and I kind of double books so hey you want to go with me to
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meet my Mom that's the vibe that I get because we have all of her friends saying the same thing like that Britney
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did not have a steady boyfriend so nobody seems to think that this was something that was very serious
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now to fill in the blanks of the relationship and I think the moving back home is very telling about the
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relationship between Britney and her mother but her mother refers to Britney as her best friend so they were they
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were very close and now mom's living an hour away I think you're right Captain I
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think Mom comes home home to visit with Britney and she brings her date along as kind of a tag along
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for for the a nice dinner with Mom right so more of a tag along less hey meet my
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mother because this is kid serious around the same time too we also have Britney who is kind of reconnecting with
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an old boyfriend from high school this is someone that she dated in either ninth and or 10th grade his name is
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Billy so that's what's going on in Britney Phillips world at the time now unfortunately Britney is going to be
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killed she's our victim here this week and there's a lot of information that we have on her
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case and there but there's a lot of room here that that still needs to be filled
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up with information there's still some a good number of questions involved in this case and it's a bet it's a bit of a
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messy case and I think everybody will agree with that statement after we get into some of the details now one thing
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that is was surprising to Maggie so Maggie says that she found out after her daughter's death that Britney was hiding
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something from her which Maggie thought was strange because as said they were very close and this took place about two
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weeks before Britney was killed this is when Britney got a call from a close friend who lived in Texas and we are in
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Tulsa Oklahoma so it's not terribly far away the friend confided in Britney that
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she had been sexually assaulted by an ex of hers and ask Britney to come down to
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help her get through this traumatic period so she goes down there and with along with another friend they drive
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down to Texas they are going to console their friend and and try to help her get
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through this very traumatic situation right this is a surprise to mom because she said hey I'm going down
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there on vacation right I'm going to take a little vacation with my friend we're going to go to South Padre Island
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now Maggie feels that Britney wasn't on with her because she says if had I known
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while why she was going down to Texas I would have not let her go because she says I would have been too concerned
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about her safety because the circumstances of the sexual assault are or were unclear at the time right which
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is which is understandable but we have to remind the listeners Britney is not a minor so even though her mom could have
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suggested I don't want you to go that doesn't mean that Britney wouldn't have gone and I also you know I don't think
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she was necessarily keeping secrets from her mother it could be a situation as simply when something like that happens
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and somebody confides in you that sometimes they they want you not to tell other people exactly and so so it could
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be as simple as her friend said please don't tell anybody yeah I'm telling you this in confidence and
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and until I Chang my mind I'd rather not be discussed with others openly now it's
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believed captain that this trip took place around September 15th and as we've already covered and as you
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just said yes Britney is an adult she's 18 she's she would turn 19 on October 4th so it's we're just weeks before her
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19th birthday and yes she's already living in her own apartment so Mom might not have had the ability to completely
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stop her from going down there but by September 27th we have Britney she's back in Tulsa and she's fully immersed
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in school at this time she's studying chemistry she wanted to go into pharmaceutical
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research her course load was 16 credits so a lot of work now the 27th of September that was a Monday she had an
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allergy based sinus situation that was brewing and it sounds to me Captain like she had a lot of sinus problems and so
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she's not feeling well but she decided to go to class anyway now we know she was in class that day because she bumps
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into her brother Josh on the campus they talk very briefly say hello now this is
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going to get us to 6:00 p.m. on September 27th she went with a friend friend to an urgent care clinic again
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this is because she's not feeling well she toughed it out went to school that day now she's going to go to urgent care
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hopefully she can get some relief from this sinus problem right she calls her mother Maggie at
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7:15 that night and said that she had been waiting for 75 minutes without being seen she was stressed out because she
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had an 800 p.m. class so Maggie told her to leave she didn't get an appointment she she didn't get to see a
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doctor but said that she would schedule an appointment for later that week so Britney and her friend they leave the
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clinic it is known that Britney then went to an ATM at Bank of America she stopped at her friend's house at 51st in
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Memorial Drive and then went to class on the TCC campus do we know how much that
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she withdrew from the ATM that I don't know but I'm guessing with it being a college kid I'm guessing with
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it being a college kid it's probably not a significant amount of money that was that was my thought when looking into
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this case because you hear that she goes to the ATM and I thought well if it was
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a large number that law enforcement probably would know this and we'd probably know that information so it's
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it's probably really just a very nothing Burger on the on the timeline yeah and it's really just marking all of her
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movements when you see an ATM visit your mind goes to okay well could somebody have followed her from the ATM now while
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it's not out of the realm of possibility keep in mind she doesn't go from the ATM
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to home she goes to the ATM stops at a friend's house then goes to class and then drives a friend home after class
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and she does speak to her mom Maggie again on a brief phone call that night they Saidi love you the way that they
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always did so nothing's out of the norm as far as Mom Maggie is concerned Britney was actually expected to go to
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Maggie's home for the weekend so they were kind of shuring up those plans a little bit right now Britney would be
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killed and found in her apartment while we cannot say 100% with 100% certainty that after this phone call after
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dropping off her friend that she went home immediately but it's believed by law enforcement and by Britney's family
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and everyone that knows her that that would have been exactly what she was doing drop off the friend talk to Mom
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briefly and then she then go straight back to her house and there's nothing to suggest that that is not the case and
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that's backed up further by the lead detective on the case Jeff Felton who told told the Tulsa World publication
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that after leaving her friend's house it is believed Britney got into her car and
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drove home quote that is the last time anybody saw her about 9:45 p.m. we know she made it home but she never attended
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any of her other classes that week and that's that statement is important I want everybody to make mental note of
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that as we go through the timeline that 9:45 pm is about the last time anybody would
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have seen her we know that she made it home but she didn't attend any of her other classes that week this is going to
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take us to Tuesday the 28th Captain Maggie didn't speak to Britney and this is maybe of a little bit of concern they
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didn't talk every day they were very close but but Maggie says that they spoke practically every other day if you
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had to break it up now it gets a little tricky on this Tuesday right we have that statement by police but she never
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attended any of her other classes that week now to be clear on that it's actually a little bit murky it's I would
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say that it's unknown whether Britney went to class on the 28th on Tuesday the 28th so most articles most sources here
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say that she missed classes on Tuesday and the detective said that as well but what I want to be clear on here is do we
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know for certain that this was actually verified with the college one and two anybody that's attended College knows
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that sometimes they take attendance sometimes they don't have attendance records at all because when you're
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paying to go to school they don't really care if you show up or not it's not like
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it's not like high school where you're truant if you if you didn't attend yeah it all depends on on the teacher some
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teachers will tell you right away you miss more than three classes you're you're done but then other teachers will
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say as long as you do your homework and long as you take the test you don't have
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to show up ever so it's hard to tell what kind of teachers she had and also what types of classes because if you're
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in a class of let's say over a hundred people is anybody gonna really notice if you were there or not so even if the so
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if the teacher doesn't take attendance yeah you might have a hundred other people in that class but do they
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know her well enough to say oh yeah I remember her being there on the Tuesday and with all of that said it seems like
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so a quick breakdown the 27th we know she's driving home 9:45 p.m. that's the last time anybody saw her law
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enforcement saying she didn't attend any of her other classes that that week Tuesday we're saying could be a question
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mark if she attended any classes but it seems like law enforcement is set on the
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idea that nope she didn't go to school on the 29th she missed all of her classes and this date seems to be fact
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this is this is fact-based we can say with with 100% confidence she did not attend
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any classes on the 29th Maggie says that she tried calling Britney that day got no answer she left a message saying hey
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I'm calling to check on you can you call me she thought that maybe Britney was just sleeping a lot because remember
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last time she spoke with her she wasn't feeling well and feeling so poorly that she had to go to urgent care and never
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got to see the doctor right now we do have some of Maggie's words right here she says quote Tuesday the 28th I tried
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calling her didn't get an answer I left a voicemail tried calling her on the 29th didn't get answer again and I left
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another voicemail Maggie said that she wasn't really surprised she didn't get a hold of Britney as she knew she had late
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classes remember we talked about her her course load and had late classes on Tuesday and that Wednesday she just
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thought you know my daughter got busy or she doesn't feel well and she's just not
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calling me back now this just to be clear on the Monday she goes to class that's the day that she went to
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the emergency room that's the day she talked to her mom on the phone talking about how she's
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going to spend the weekend with her and then she drops her friend off and then she goes home that's that you I think
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you said the 27th that's the Monday correct right so on Tuesday we don't know if she showed up to school we have
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no record of her showing up all week okay I just want to make sure I'm I'm clear on that yep and it by the 29th now
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Mom is getting concerned now this is going to take us to the 30th which would be the Thursday this is a friend of
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Britney who has not been named in any of the research material that I could find
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or any of the uh newspaper articles but this is a friend who is now getting concerned saying look I haven't
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seen Britney in a while and I've also been attempting to get her on the phone she's not answering my calls and her
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friend saying this is very out of character and oh by the way I've not seen her on the college campus either
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for a few days so now we have Mom and friend who are concerned together right United in this concern
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for Britney Phillips and so the friend goes to the apartment on the 30th decided to call
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her father once she got there saying hey I'm at her apartment she's not answering
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I have an uneasy feeling she's call Britney's Dad no no she's calling her own father okay and saying dad what do I
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do and dad says I'm G to call the police so the friend's dad calls the police and
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requests the wellness check best thing you can do correct better better safe than sorry I wish and a lot of these
00:24:29
cases you know we have people that well I went and check the apartment and then I came back a couple days later no best
00:24:35
thing you do best thing you can do is call the police they're there to protect and serve us and this is one of the
00:24:42
services and don't ever feel embarrassed either because police do more of these welfare checks than the general Public's
00:24:50
aware of this is a this is a pretty common thing um especially well also you know if you talk to police officers and
00:24:57
you ask them what they would do if a loved one wasn't responding they would do the same thing and what's the harm
00:25:04
they knock on the door Britney answers oh I'm sorry I've been sick and then you you go hey nothing bad happened good
00:25:12
yeah back to work for the police and to really kind of put the listener into the
00:25:17
driver's seat here uh and fully experience the situation so the friend shows up to the apartment knocks on the
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door hoping that her friend's going to answer hoping that Britney opens up the door
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oh it's a misunderstanding everything's fine or I'm not feeling well decided to stay in the apartment for a few days
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till I feel better that's what she's expecting she knocks on the door gets no answer she checks the the door knob and
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she says the door's not locked and so she turns the door knob opens the door just a little bit and
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then closes it because she said she got scared so this is young woman too this is some one of Britney's peers one of
00:25:57
her friends so this is a young woman as well she gets scared that's why she calls her dad of course now police are
00:26:04
on the scene they arrived at the apartment and they confirm the door is unlocked they go inside they entered the
00:26:13
apartment on the 30th at 9:59 p.m. according to the police record they find unfortunately find Britney lying on the
00:26:22
floor next to her bed her head is pointing toward the foot of the bed and and she she's deceased at this time do
00:26:31
you have many details on this apartment is it a one-bedroom is it a studio apartment it's a small apartment yes
00:26:38
it's uh so she lives on the second floor from my understanding there's apartments
00:26:44
on the on the ground level and then on the second floor as well and she is in one of the end units so you have 16
00:26:56
apartments in this one building right there's no like shared space or common space there's you walk
00:27:05
up the steps to walk over to the door that you're of the apartment that you need to go to so you have eight on one
00:27:12
side eight on the other side she's on one of the end units so technically she only has one next door neighbor if that
00:27:19
makes sense yeah but the nice thing is because these apartments are so close you possibly will have eyewitnesses or
00:27:27
ear Witnesses yes now they're going to send out a deputy to Maggie's house remember she's living in Chandler an
00:27:37
hour away so it's at 1 a.m. that she finds out that that her daughter's been murdered the deputy tells her after
00:27:47
confirming that she is Maggie Zigman he says you need to call the Tulsa Police your daughter's been murdered she finds
00:27:55
out that Josh her son had already been notified by the Tulsa Police Department of his sister's death Maggie drives
00:28:03
straight to Tulsa but the cops would not let her into the apartment Britney had already been identified by her driver's
00:28:12
license and removed from the apartment and off to the medical examiner's office that is when detective Jeff Felton tells
00:28:22
mom Maggie that her daughter had been raped and murdered [Music] now that you've wrapped up 2023 and are
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00:34:19
to the windows to the walls onward and upward cheers to you Colonel cheers to you Captain we do have the autopsy
00:34:29
report here um so real quick is is it do you think it's a little fast how F how quickly they removed her
00:34:39
body and took it to get examined cuz you you figure like they have to you know do
00:34:45
the photographs they have to start collecting evidence obviously once they remove the body they can continue to
00:34:52
collect evidence but seems a little quick to me it does seem a little a little bit on the quick side it's been
00:34:58
about 3 or 4 hours by the time the body is removed but I think to a lot of that it it has
00:35:07
to do with jurisdiction I mean everything happens differently in every jurisdiction right but in this situation
00:35:13
my belief is the reason why the bodies were moved so quickly from the apartment is how she was killed so here's some of
00:35:21
the information from the autopsy report the the office of the chief medical examiner was notified of Britney's death
00:35:28
at 12:45 a.m. on October 1st so now we're to October 1st we were able to review some of this report and it
00:35:38
reflects the body was found by police and death pronounced at 2200 hours which is 10 p.m. now the narrative on the
00:35:49
autopsy report States the following this is the medical examiner's words I arrived at the the scene which
00:35:57
was an upstairs apartment on October 1st at approximately 1:45 a.m. I was led to
00:36:02
the bedroom the bedroom door leading to an outdoor balcony was open a used dried
00:36:09
tampon was near the body the body was on the floor immediately next to her bed her head was turned to the right and her
00:36:18
face was congested in purple there were numerous towels on the deceased and items of her clothing were a jent to her
00:36:28
one of the towels adjacent to the right side of the bed was soaked with decomposition type fluid she was clothed
00:36:37
only in a shirt I'm pulling from the report here this information because we're going to see how it will
00:36:45
be valuable to the investigation later but also this statement right here is interesting to me because there are a
00:36:53
lot of other source material out there that I found that said that she was wearing more clothing than just a shirt
00:36:59
but from the autopsy report says she's only wearing a shirt riger mortise was minimal and very easily broken in the
00:37:09
extremities it was absent in the jaw early decomposition change included drying of the fingertips focal
00:37:18
marbling focal bloating of the face decomposition fluid exuding from the nose and mouth and Mild decomposition
00:37:26
odor the hands were examined and no specific trace evidence was identified the hands were bagged and the body
00:37:34
packaged it says medical examiner left the premises at 3:15 a.m. now the cause of death was
00:37:44
xixia due to neck compression so strangulation right and of course she's going to show signs of peal hemorrhaging
00:37:53
hemorrhages in the eyes so it makes it sound like what they gather gathered in evidence as far as like her hands are
00:38:01
concerned is that our suspect that we should be looking for is not he wouldn't have had injuries to him it didn't look
00:38:09
like she was able to put up a fight that seems to be correct based off of that statement the other part of this report
00:38:17
is that there's no evidence that a ligature of any type was used right to paint this unsettling picture a little
00:38:26
more in detail here Britney was a petite young woman and So based off of the emy's report
00:38:38
here what it looks like to me is that somebody just overpowered her strangled her the hyoid bone was found to be
00:38:48
intact but the me is basically saying it was obvious just by with his trained eye
00:38:57
that we that he observed these abrasions on her neck that indicates to him this is the result of neck
00:39:07
compression she was unable to breathe and and died because of that obviously if you're law enforcement you're going
00:39:14
to be at her apartment you're going to be looking for what items are there what items aren't there you said that she was
00:39:22
only in a t-shirt but there's mixed reports on that but I'm going to go with the medical examiner report she's in the
00:39:29
T-shirt but what about any jewelry or did she have anything else on her when they removed the body from the crime
00:39:38
scene yeah so the personal effects inventory listed here we have white shirt as you
00:39:46
mentioned and we have white metal hoop earrings now this goes to the manner of how she was killed too she also has a
00:39:58
white metal necklace but it was broken and the as you heard before we went to the
00:40:06
break unfortunately the conclusion here is that she was raped and murdered so we
00:40:11
have a sexual assault that took place as well did did they say if there was any evidence of because sometimes
00:40:20
with these cases you know the killer will make the individual take a sh beforehand or
00:40:28
afterwards do we have any evidence if she did or did not do that well that's an interesting angle here because we do
00:40:38
know that the csis collected 70 70 DNA swabs from Britney's body looking for evidence including under her fingernails
00:40:50
now unfortunately the autopsy report says nothing about what was collected or found with any of
00:40:59
those swaps right so that doesn't mean that nothing was found it just means that it's not in the report that we were
00:41:06
able to see obviously they probably did a rape kit as well we do know that they did the toxicology and that came back
00:41:14
clean Maggie says that she was told that Britney was raped before she was killed
00:41:20
but the autopsy report makes zero mention of conducting a rape kit it does mention some external
00:41:31
examination again no evidence is listed here or no injury is listed here and there was never any mention by police of
00:41:40
DNA from a rape kit now one article does say that evidence at this scene suggested that a sexual assault had
00:41:48
occurred no doubt that was because she's partially unclothed and right Tamp removed the medical examiner didn't
00:41:59
record the core body temperature even though apparently he did measure it so I I don't know why to me unfortunately
00:42:10
Captain what it appears to me is that we have a not so great report here and maybe it's that that everything was
00:42:18
checked I hope but not everything was recorded if that makes sense right so if they did a rape kit well maybe they did
00:42:27
maybe they didn't we don't know because the report is kind of incomplete and look you could have a
00:42:34
great medical examiner you could have a great medical examiner that does a thorough job but part of doing that
00:42:42
thorough job is doing a thorough report yes especially when you have a case that's going to sit in the unsolved pile
00:42:50
for this many years this is something that people are going to need to reference right and you may not Mr
00:42:58
medical examiner you may not always be around to for us to reach out to with questions and we're going to have to
00:43:05
rely on your reports now we've seen this in other cases and we've talked about why this happens and
00:43:14
and how it makes sense but remember the core body temperature part of this report they don't conclude the
00:43:23
medical examiner does not conclude or even give an estimated time slate of death and I'm guessing that's based off
00:43:32
the science or evidence or lack thereof what we're going to have here is we're going to be relying on police to shorten
00:43:43
that window to make that that window of time as precise as it possibly can be to help us look for the person that
00:43:53
did this the the the man that did this based off of the information that police collect is that they narrow down the
00:44:01
time of death to 10 p.m. on the 27th to sometime early the next morning on the 28th again that's based off of nobody
00:44:14
sees her nobody talks to her after that 9:45 p.m. on the 27th and unfortunately Britney was buried on what would have
00:44:23
been her 19th birthday October 4th 2004 now we got to figure out who did this and this usually we have some suspects
00:44:36
that are right there the obvious suspects for you but not so much in this case right who could
00:44:44
have done this as we covered Britney has no steady boyfriend she has no known stalker or
00:44:53
enemies she didn't do drugs she led a very lowrisk lifestyle I'd also say that for the
00:45:01
majority of the time if somebody has somebody in their life that is being overbearing or
00:45:08
stalkerish that normally you tell your mom about it or tell at least some friends about it so it is possible that
00:45:17
she had somebody like that in her life but I would say unlikely because no word to the mother and no word to any of her
00:45:26
friends about it well and keep in mind she's been gone for a year right she's only at this location she's only back in
00:45:34
Tulsa for about three months yeah and then but it doesn't I actually think this makes things more complicated
00:45:41
because if I'm law enforcement I'm looking at this Co okay so we don't have anybody with red flags right away going
00:45:49
well this guy that she dated was a weirdo we need to look into him so you don't have these red flags right away so
00:45:55
you got to go okay well who was she dating and even though they might have been casually dating we need to question
00:46:03
them and then it makes a little bit harder because like you said she was in Florida for like a year okay who was she
00:46:09
talking to down there was there anybody down there that she was dating that maybe if we start looking into we're
00:46:15
going to see some red flags well and when you talk to everybody that knows her you talk to friends and family
00:46:21
everybody in her Social Circle and that doesn't lead you to a suspect then you do
00:46:26
your due diligence you got to go back to the crime scene right that that's where
00:46:30
you're hoping to find something pointing you to the person that did this now do we know how many total units there were
00:46:38
in this apartment complex because you I would I would assume again you got to look at her Inner Circle but
00:46:48
you also have to I think your inner circle becomes your community as well and her community would be a little bit
00:46:55
larger and a lot more people of her peers because like you said a lot of the people living in these apartments were
00:47:02
going to the Community College exactly and so it's a large apartment complex and we'll go through some more of the
00:47:10
details of that I want to get us back to the crime scene and tear through that but so we've already covered that
00:47:17
Britney lived in a second floor apartment at the Glenn Eagles complex her apartment was accessible by climbing
00:47:26
the exterior stairs from the ground level so you walk up the steps and then you can go to her apartment now there's
00:47:33
no exterior common area door or foyer there's no area for people to go into each apartment has its own entrance door
00:47:41
which led directly to the outside of the apartment now the key thing here one of
00:47:48
the interesting aspects of this crime scene is police can't find any sign of for entury so the question was how
00:47:59
did her attacker get into Britney's apartment right the thing that that's going to possibly lead you to your
00:48:07
suspect here is what's found at that crime scene so we have CSI at the scene they uncovered some very important
00:48:14
evidence as they were processing this apartment they find a seamen stain that was on the sheets like
00:48:23
bedding and then and then they a small amount of blood it's listed as a droplet of blood that was on one of the bedroom
00:48:33
walls now I want to be clear here because some reports vary that droplet of blood some reports state that it's on
00:48:41
one of the bedroom walls other Reports say that was it was on a hall a small hallway wall that led to the bedroom but
00:48:51
it shouldn't take too many tests to figure out does that blood match that seen right and that's that's one thing that
00:48:57
they're going to work on and yes it does belong to the same person that deposited those fluids
00:49:06
yeah so like you were saying if I'm law enforcement how did this person get in I
00:49:10
mean obviously you always have the possibility that Britney just didn't lock her doors yes that's correct so the
00:49:18
the other questions that you have here too was she lying in bed when she was attacked was she sleeping or attempting
00:49:25
to go to sleep that night when somebody or she coming in and out of the shower or not well and you know we've also
00:49:32
talked about this where no I so I don't I think we can get rid of the whole shower idea again it's not out of the
00:49:40
realm of possibility but what we do have is remember the friend that she drops off after class right police confirm
00:49:48
with that friend that the shirt that they found when they found Britney the shirt that she was still wearing is the
00:49:55
shirt that she wore to class that night and the shirt that she was wearing when she dropped off her friend and the
00:50:01
reports state that Britney's pants were found lying on the floor next to her so it sounds like to me either somebody
00:50:09
gets into this apartment somehow or is it possible you mentioned the shower idea which I think that's
00:50:17
interesting to examine because I I kind of picture this as she's getting ready for bed right uh or or not or or not had
00:50:27
the ability to get ready for bed completely yet and somehow the attack goes down and you know Captain it could
00:50:34
be as simple as bad guy knocks on the door and young woman opens the door it could it could be just that simple but
00:50:44
so what police are saying here is their exact words is quote it didn't look like
00:50:48
somebody broke in but there were some disruption okay what were the disruptions well the the disruption is
00:50:56
police are saying there was evidence of a struggle in the bedroom and it it appeared to them that
00:51:04
during the struggle the attacker had flung Britany against the wall so this is the wall opposite of
00:51:12
where her body was found so in the bedroom somebody pushed her or threw her into the wall so she's attempting to
00:51:20
fight this guy off this is based off of marks on the wall that I presume line up with marks on her
00:51:29
person right there have also been reports that the apartment was ransacked but Maggie her mom says it
00:51:38
just might have been my messy daughter lived you know this looks to me like my messy daughter lived here not that
00:51:44
somebody was going through the apartment looking for something this is the this is the part of the case that I cannot
00:51:51
make heads or tails of the screens you know the windows screens yeah there were four windows for
00:52:00
that apartment all four of these window screens were found inside the apartment they were removed from the windows and
00:52:08
inside the apartment she could have been trying to clean them that's what I wonder is this a situation where she
00:52:14
took them off and cleaned the windows and just didn't put them back on yet maybe she was going to do that the next
00:52:20
day seems like a weird thing when the mom's saying well look this my d was a little messy but I guess you could be a
00:52:28
little messy and you know you get into this apartment and you want to clean the windows and oh why I'm clean the windows
00:52:33
let me clean these screens as well I just look I'm not trying to take anything away from young people but I
00:52:40
was 18 once cleaning the outside of the windows of an apartment that I'm not going to keep for my the entirety of my
00:52:48
life was way down on the list of to-do items and that's why they call you dirty Grand
00:52:56
well here's the thing Captain the so if this would make sense if somebody were to have used that as a way
00:53:05
to get into the apartment right we've seen plenty of cases where you we have a cut window screen or window screen is
00:53:12
removed and somebody accesses the premises through the window yeah that would make more sense if it was on floor
00:53:21
number one and not floor number two she's on the second floor here the Second Story and all the
00:53:29
reports that I reviewed have said that there would have been no way for somebody to climb up the exterior of the
00:53:35
building and enter one of those windows and here's the other thing if you are accessing the apartment via window
00:53:44
you're removing one screen you're not removing all four to me if I saw that I would just start off with the thought
00:53:51
that this is probably not what the Killer used and more likely it was just that maybe Britney removed them to clean
00:54:01
the windows or maybe she was cleaning the screens herself the other thing too is it's not police removing them and
00:54:09
checking for fingerprints because it's the police that are saying we found the four screens removed and we we can't
00:54:15
sort out why that would be right the other problem here too is the medical examiner report has a weird note in it
00:54:24
that says that the French doors to Britney's balcony were open when he arrived so the problem here we can't
00:54:32
sort out based off of the medical examiner report were they left open by the killer were they left open by
00:54:42
Britney and somehow the killer got up to the second floor balcony and accessed the the apartment through these French
00:54:50
doors that she already had opened the other possibility here too would be that look it appears that she had laid there
00:54:59
in that apartment for some period of time did they open up the doors did police open up those doors to air out
00:55:09
the place a little bit before the medical examiner arrived here's the thing though before we move off of these
00:55:15
French doors Captain we have Maggie Britney's mom who says that when she went to go clean out the apartment that
00:55:24
there was lattice work that's on the outside of the French doors she says that that appeared to her to be messed
00:55:33
up is the way that she described it but she this is a very logical very smart woman Maggie and she clarifies by saying
00:55:43
look I don't know whether that was already like that or not or if it has something to
00:55:49
do with how the attacker accessed the apartment so it's it's wor worth noting here that someone could theoretically
00:55:58
have climbed up into the balcony we say this because we we know of a specific story where okay so Britney gets locked
00:56:08
out of her apartment and she had a friend a tall male resident friend who climbed up to her balcony goes into the
00:56:19
apartment and then unlocks the front door so I'm pointing I'm just pointing that out to show a situation where the
00:56:27
Apartment renter locks himself out of the apartment and doesn't is not locking the balcony
00:56:34
door so if I'm law enforcement like I said I got to start talking to our friends I got to talk to these guys that
00:56:42
she's been seeing even though they're casual these are part of her Inner Circle but because she lives an
00:56:49
apartment complex that has a lot of college age students a lot of people around the same age as her I got to put
00:56:56
them into the Inner Circle then I'm also going well who knew about this story about her getting locked out is that
00:57:05
somebody again in her Inner Circle that would have knew about this and and possibly knew that the balcony could
00:57:12
have been a point of entrance and not to look as if you were breaking and entering but also it makes you
00:57:20
wonder if I'm law enforcement I'm going okay who's your handyman around here how
00:57:28
many do you have because they would have access as well yes the apartment complex they're
00:57:37
going to have access to this apartment and some of their vendors would but you know not in the middle of the night the
00:57:45
the other tricky thing here too is I've seen this several times and this usually
00:57:50
you just find this with uh burglary cases but it's not terribly uncommon so the four apartments on her side that all
00:58:00
face the same direction they shared an attic together so you could if you lived in apartment a let's say it's apartment
00:58:09
a right you could climb up into the hatch through the hatch get into the attic above your apartment and probably
00:58:18
military crawl your way and open up the hatch and drop down into apartment B now
00:58:24
now we know that this is fact because the detective he did just that he went up into one of the hatches crawled
00:58:33
through and could drop down into Britney's apartment the thing is here and the detective he's six foot two he's
00:58:42
not a small guy so it seems like most people would be able to do that most people would be able to fit through
00:58:49
there I want I question who would even know that that's a possibility right it would seem to me like a very
00:58:57
list of people would know that those attics are all connected so like you're saying we handyman maintenance person
00:59:06
cable guys Telephone Company People Electric Company HVAC people who service the apartment complex
00:59:16
those are the people that I think might have some knowledge that that's even a possibility but I do want to be clear
00:59:22
here we do have police saying that we looked up there and we're not finding evidence that someone had been up there
00:59:31
that that was how that they access Britney's apartment well and because there's multiple
00:59:36
crimes again she was murdered but we have a rape then to me it's like what was the
00:59:47
intention was the intention that this person wanted to rape Britney and then after he did so
00:59:57
figured well I'll kill her to cover you know to try to cover my tracks cuz she knew me or got too good of a look at me
01:00:07
you know what what was the motive here here's some the options on how Britney's killer could have accessed the apartment
01:00:14
okay Britney could have let him in he was waiting for her when she got home right now this could be he's either
01:00:24
already in the apartment or forced his way inside with her you know as she's unlocking the door as you covered
01:00:34
Captain maybe he had a key somehow we also know that the killer could have climbed up onto the balcony
01:00:41
and access the apartment through the French doors I'm going to remove the attic hatch in that space from our list
01:00:49
because we have police saying that they found zero evidence that that's the case
01:00:54
we also find unfortunately no useful fingerprints were found in the apartment I do like the fact that you did bring up
01:01:04
this addict angle because if the cops weren't doing their job if they weren't doing their due diligence like we like
01:01:11
to say then they wouldn't even known this was a possibility so just to to hear that the cops seem to be looking at
01:01:20
every angle of how somebody could have got into the apartment makes me feel a little bit better about their
01:01:25
investigation oh exactly I believe that is very thorough investigation that took
01:01:30
place here and and it's fascinating to me that they seem to be looking at this through all angles right they're they're
01:01:39
going outside the box if you will to come up with how did this how did everything go down now unfortunately the
01:01:46
apartment complex did not have surveillance cameras and neither did businesses in the immediate area and I'm
01:01:53
not trying trying to squeeze in a plug here but you hear us and you've heard us on the show before one of our sponsors
01:02:02
has been Simply Safe for several years and you know I was telling someone the other day so I I have cameras on most of
01:02:12
us have the ring doorbell camera or doorbell camera by any number of different companies or
01:02:18
Brands but I have a camera near all of the entrances possible es and exits to my house and so all four sides of the
01:02:28
house have a camera on them and somebody asked me they go well that makes sense it seems a little seems maybe a little
01:02:38
expensive but um you know I I got one on my front porch and I think that's probably good enough and I said you know
01:02:45
maybe it is good enough I said but we cover so many of these stories we cover so many of these cases to me this is
01:02:51
going to sound really dumb to the average Joe but if something happens to me or something bad happens inside my
01:02:59
house even if I'm not around I want the bastard to be caught and those cameras are so valuable and I
01:03:08
we've said this when we talked about the Jennifer kessie case and some of these other apartment cases this took place in
01:03:17
2004 you know this is not 1970 not 1980s 2004 if you are a single individual especially a young
01:03:28
woman that should be at the top of your list when you go to look at these apartments and when you're talking to
01:03:35
the the company that's going to be renting you the apartment what is the security like here yes we know this was
01:03:41
supposed to be a safe area we know that this was supposed to be a it was noted to be a safe apartment complex but that
01:03:49
put that at the top of your list do you have security cameras do you have security measures that have been
01:03:55
taken because here in this situation while we cannot bring this young woman back but if we had those cameras we
01:04:02
might be able to see who or at least how this person gained access to her apartment yeah and like we say all the
01:04:10
time I mean an individual is attacking you assume they're trying to kill you and fight and Claw and try to do enough
01:04:22
damage that they're going to leave behind that DNA that they can test and then again maybe you you lose the
01:04:30
struggle maybe you end up losing your life but if if it was me I would want every possible way for the person to to
01:04:39
get caught and so a lot of these apartment complexes have a common place for people to enter and exit this one
01:04:47
doesn't but a lot of times you see when they don't have a common place that they
01:04:51
at least have cameras on the parking lot but it doesn't seem like we have evidence of that but then it made me
01:04:58
wonder do we have any evidence that we could look you know with the with the school being basically across the street
01:05:05
because we know that they would have some cameras no I mean we don't have any surveillance cameras in the area as the
01:05:13
the we know the apartment complex didn't have them and we know that the nearby businesses didn't have
01:05:23
them [Music] join us back here in the garage for part two and until then be good be kind and
01:05:46
don't litter [Music] [Applause]