00:00:00
Ever walk past a place for rent and wish you could just take a peek inside? Maybe
00:00:04
even explore the layout, envision the natural light streaming through the windows, or plan where your vinyl record
00:00:10
collection would go. At apartments.com, you can with tools like their 3D virtual
00:00:16
tours. You can see the exact unit you could be living in. Really envision yourself in your new home with
00:00:22
apartments.com. The place to find a place. How do you make chicken nuggets like [music] 7,000% better? Short
00:00:29
answer, you let Taco Bell make them. Long answer, start with all white meat chicken nuggets, bread them in crunchy
00:00:35
tortilla chips, and serve them with Hidden Valley Diablo Ranch. [music] Yep, that's Hidden Valley Ranch mixed with
00:00:41
Taco Bell Diablo sauce. It's exactly what it sounds like and somehow even better. [music] Simple math, spicy
00:00:49
results. Crispy chicken nuggets from Taco Bell, a brand new classic at participating US Taco Bell locations for
00:00:55
a limited time only while supplies last. Welcome to Off the Record. I'm your [music] host Nick Crime.
00:01:12
>> It's good to be seen and it's good to see you. Off the Record. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend.
00:01:19
>> True Crime podcast. >> Be good. Be kind. And don't for >> gather around. Grab a chair. Grab
00:01:27
[music] a beer. Let's talk some ground. [music] >> New tonight, inside the investigation of
00:01:38
a possible [music] break in one of our area's biggest mysteries. What happened to Brian Schaefer? He was an OSU student
00:01:45
who disappeared back in 2006, never to be seen or heard from again. >> Now almost 14 years later, Crime Tracker
00:01:53
10 brought a potential clue to police. Angela Anne explains how the FBI [music] got involved, what they found out, and
00:02:00
what happens next. >> When it comes to missing persons in Ohio, there is [music] one name that
00:02:06
probably resonates more than any other. Brian Schaefer. His case has the makings
00:02:11
of a Hollywood movie. A young medical student [music] last seen going up this escalator to a popular campus area bar,
00:02:19
but video never showed him leaving. Or did he? Nearly 14 years after Brian disappeared, this photo recently started
00:02:27
circulating of a man supposedly [music] homeless and American in Tijana, Mexico.
00:02:33
It said, "Help locate." [music] Facebook groups dedicated to finding Brian swore it was him. The theories
00:02:41
grew rampant. Brian was alive. So, we brought the photo to the attention of Columbus police and Detective Blanch
00:02:49
Tucker. >> When you first saw this, what did you think? I was like, "Wow, it could be."
00:02:54
Could it be? It's a possibility >> because it does look a little >> like him. It does.
00:03:00
>> It was the first big break for the Brian Schaefer case. Crime Tracker 10 got unprecedented access to the files
00:03:06
showing the endless interviews and the leads police exhausted year after year. >> We still get calls and we still receive
00:03:14
tips. Despite those tips [music] and the neighborhood searches, plus please for information, answers [music] never came
00:03:21
until this photo. >> It appeared that it could be Brian Schaefer. Um, but to see if it was him,
00:03:29
um, I contact, you know, the FBI who assist us in a lot of our cases, um, to see if they can do a facial recognition.
00:03:37
So, the FBI [music] compared the Tijana man photo with the others they already had in a file of Brian. [music]
00:03:44
It took four weeks, but finally, Detective Tucker had her answer. >> That it wasn't him.
00:03:51
>> It was not him. >> Him. Correct. >> Was that a letown? >> It was. Um, my hopes were high that it
00:03:58
could be him. >> Foul [music] play has never been ruled out, nor has the fact that Brian maybe
00:04:03
just took off. the stresses of life, med school, and losing a mother to cancer. [music]
00:04:09
>> Do you feel that somebody that has been interviewed in the past maybe withheld
00:04:13
information? >> I do. >> You do? >> Mhm. >> But you can't say who yet. >> Can't say who.
00:04:19
>> Under CPD's [music] new cold case initiative, Detective Tucker is now reviewing every binder once again.
00:04:25
[music] And while this photo is now a dead end, it is at least for her progress in [music] a case that
00:04:31
continues to haunt. It would mean closure. Not just closure for us, but closure for the family and the friends.
00:04:39
>> For Crime Tracker 10, Angela Anne, 10TV News. >> There is still a reward for any
00:04:45
information that could help solve this case. You can leave your tip anonymously with Crimestoppers [music] of Central
00:04:51
Ohio. And there's the number 614461 tips. [music] >> [music] >> So, back to the night in question.
00:05:13
I think it's reasonable to question Clint. He was there when Brian [music] went missing, quote unquote. Meredith
00:05:21
was there. these two random girls that weren't so random that he was talking to, Amber and Brighton, they were there.
00:05:29
Who was this third girl that they were with? Did she have any involvement? Why were they going to the bar? These four
00:05:36
other guys, what what are their relationships? Did they have motivation to get rid of
00:05:44
Bryant? But also, I think you could go even further back and go, well, he he had contact with his dad that night. He
00:05:51
also wanted his brother to come out and he and his brother declined that. But what was going on in the background? His
00:06:00
mother passed away and there was some insurance money. Now, so a lot of people go follow the money. Who if Brian
00:06:09
disappears or Brian dies, who benefits? Well, his brother would benefit financially and so would his father. A
00:06:18
lot of people have speculated those two theories. So, let's uh just look into the the speculation against the brother.
00:06:25
>> So, I did have a tip that Derek killed Brian for insurance money. And at first,
00:06:32
you know, I thought it was a little crazy, but the person that was telling me was Kevin Miles. And I mentioned him
00:06:37
before. He's the former president of Central Ohio Crimestoppers. And while I do appreciate Kevin's opinion and his
00:06:46
time, this is a theory that I have been able to eliminate. Derek definitely had an alibi with multiple people. And there
00:06:55
is absolutely no evidence that Derek harmed Brian. >> And has Brian even been declared legally
00:07:02
dead? >> He has in uh in 2013. >> Waiting seven years for that would be would be something to to consider. You
00:07:11
got to weigh that factor in. >> And also, they were all getting money. Randy, the father, was getting money.
00:07:18
Brian was getting money. Brian didn't, as far as we know, didn't have that money in his possession at the time.
00:07:26
Derek was going to get money. So, they were all getting money. I don't want to say that somebody wouldn't kill somebody
00:07:32
for not much money because there's times in your life that a hundred bucks is a lot of money and then
00:07:41
there's times in your life where you're like 100 bucks wouldn't change much. So I think one of the issues with this is
00:07:51
like you said Kelly he had he's on the other side of town. He has many people that see him there. Obviously, the bar
00:07:59
closes, so at some point he could have left, but it just there there doesn't it doesn't
00:08:07
make a lot of sense. And then it's like, yeah, they had a confrontation at the mother's funeral, but it seemed from
00:08:16
everybody I talked to that that was kind of worked out already. >> Yeah, it was definitely worked out. And
00:08:22
I haven't found any one that has told me that there were any issues between Derek
00:08:27
and Brian. It seemed just to be between Randy and Brian and Derek. >> And we don't know where this tip was
00:08:34
coming from into Crimestoppers, >> right? And I think that's the the tough thing too is like did this tip come in
00:08:42
and then did Crimes Stoppers go, "Hey, we think there's a lot of weight to this, but
00:08:48
in the last 20 years, they're not beating a drum, like a very loud drum that this is what what happened to Brian
00:08:57
Schaefer." >> And you know, based on the way Kevin told it to me, too, I'm not actually
00:09:01
sure that this was a tip that came in to Crimestoppers or if this was his own personal opinion. My problem with a lot
00:09:07
of these theories in the these cases are people come up with the theory and then they try to find evidence of
00:09:16
the theory instead of looking for answers and having those answers and evidence lead them to a theory. I can't
00:09:24
remember the venue that we have discussed this theory before, Captain. I think it was on off the record. We've
00:09:32
talked about the Derek theory. We've talked about the Randy theory and in both of those conversations, maybe it
00:09:39
was the same conversation that we covered both of those bases. I got pretty worked up, very defensive of
00:09:46
Randy, very defensive of Derek and the family. And so, I'm not going to repeat that here today. I just don't I don't I
00:09:56
don't like either one of these theories, but that's just my humble garage opinion. And then the elephant in the
00:10:03
room as far as theories go is when you talk about this case. Again, I think because only certain individuals
00:10:12
are talked about, we're not talking about the four guys that they go to meet. We're not talking about the two
00:10:20
random girls as much. We're not talking about the mystery girls so much. But who
00:10:24
does Brian go to the bar with? He goes with Clint and Meredith. And I think because Meredith talked with police and
00:10:32
because she took a polygraph that the police have come out and said, "Hey, we believe what she's saying and we don't
00:10:38
view her as a suspect." She doesn't become a suspect online. But the person that was cooperative for a time period
00:10:49
and then gets a lawyer and then refuses to take a polygraph and then his lawyer makes the statement of, "Well, if you
00:10:57
want to know why Brian went missing, you should ask Brian." That has led to a lot
00:11:03
of online speculation that either Clint is involved in Brian's disappearance and
00:11:10
that could go multiple ways. That Clint is responsible for his death or that Clint knows more about what happened and
00:11:18
that could be a nefarious thing or that Clint knows that Brian went to start a new life and why is he being secretive
00:11:25
about this information? The other thing that people say looks strange about Clint is he moved away, which I should
00:11:34
remind people, I think he moved away because of schooling, but he also changed his name. And so those add up to
00:11:43
a lot of people have the theory that that Clint knows more. >> Yeah. Actually, when I first began my
00:11:49
deep dive into Brian's disappearance, I 100% thought Clint was guilty. But the more I researched, I kept noticing that
00:11:57
there just wasn't really anything there about Clint at all. He showed up to every flyer distribution.
00:12:05
He made all the phone calls to the hospitals and jails looking for Brian. He was calling friends. It it seemed
00:12:13
that he was very involved in everything after Brian's disappearance. But they were basically portrayed like they were
00:12:20
best friends when in all my research, I just don't see that. I see them more as drinking buddies. They had a little bit
00:12:28
of communication, but their communication would pick up right around any drinking holiday such as St.
00:12:33
Patrick's Day or New Year's Eve. So, I I don't really think they were as close as
00:12:39
everyone thought they were. One reason that a lot of people think that Clint is suspicious or guilty is because of the
00:12:48
dine episode that he did. And in that episode, it kind of appears that he's talking bad about Brian.
00:12:57
But based on everything I've heard, everything Clint said in that dine episode was true. Brian would get drunk
00:13:06
and start bar fights or just instigate things. Um, he would get drunk and go flirt with girls and talk to girls. So,
00:13:15
while it may have seemed a little harsh without all of those details, everything
00:13:21
he said was true. >> Yeah. And I think that's one of just something that I think is
00:13:28
maybe a little bizarre in the true crime world is that Brian went missing. Oh, Brian was a guy that
00:13:36
lit up the room. Brian was an angel. Well, if that's the narrative that you're going to get, that's not going to
00:13:45
help us in the investigation. You just want to know the truth. And so, you can have a guy, everybody said he's
00:13:53
a sociable guy. A lot of people said he was nice guy, but then I think there's different versions of Brian. I think
00:14:01
there's the version of Brian when he's sober, and I I think there's a version of Brian when he's intoxicated. I mean,
00:14:09
I think there's evidence on the surveillance footage and evidence of other people that were there at the bars
00:14:15
that night and then also like financial records of how much this guy was drinking. And then you have his father
00:14:21
coming out and going, "Well, he wasn't intoxicated. He didn't drink that much." And then, but then then knowing what we
00:14:28
then learn about Randy, well, Randy drank often, so maybe he just thought, "Well, yeah, my son drinks, but it's not
00:14:36
that much, you know." Yeah, like in comparison >> you're you also mentioned different
00:14:41
versions of oneself. I have witnessed and I think most of us will agree with this statement. There are versions of
00:14:48
ourselves too that when we are in the company of our parents and he may not have drank a lot in the company of his
00:14:57
father. That could be very true to Randy. But again, we we I don't know how much Brian had to drink that night, but
00:15:07
I am on record multiple times, having described Brian as visually what I'm seeing there with Brian on the camera,
00:15:16
he appears to be intoxicated to me. >> Yeah. And I think it's not that far-fetched to think that's a
00:15:23
possibility. He went to several bars that night. >> They're celebrating. He There's nothing
00:15:28
wrong with being [laughter] It's legal to drink. I mean, so there's nothing wrong with that. They're out
00:15:34
having a good time. Does that factor into why he is not here today? I think it absolutely does. And then as far as
00:15:41
Clint goes, I won't I don't want to speak to him specifically, but I do think that I've always said that I
00:15:49
believe Brian was met with foul play, and I put that at the top of the list as as far as theories go. For me, I think
00:15:56
he was met with foul play that that morning between the bar and his home or somewhere, you know, between that bar
00:16:07
and wherever he his destination would have been for that night. And I think that it was somebody out that night that
00:16:14
was responsible for why he is not here today. Now, that doesn't have to be somebody in his direct party, but
00:16:23
somebody that was out that night is responsible for why we are having this conversation. And this Brian Schaefer
00:16:30
thing is become such a big mystery. Like you said, they're celebrating the night.
00:16:35
Unless you live by a college campus, you wouldn't have a lot of understanding of
00:16:41
this, but they're celebrating, hey, spring break time. So, guess what happens on that night? More kids are
00:16:50
they're they're going out to celebrate. They might just be going home for the week. They might just be staying on
00:16:55
campus for the week, but it's hey, less celebrate. So, there's more kids out at the bar that night. And then they're at
00:17:03
a complex that has multiple bars, so there's more people in that area. And then the fascinating thing to me
00:17:11
with these college campuses is I didn't go to that college, but I went to those college bars often. You might be at a
00:17:18
college bar with a hundred people and 60 of those people don't even go to that college. And I could see a confident in
00:17:27
shaped guy rubbing somebody the wrong way. And again, we have evidence of it. I think Clint trying to be as open and
00:17:35
honest about his friend and about his former roommate is important to the case. Hey, well, yeah, most people we
00:17:46
wouldn't leave behind, but Brian was flirting with these girls and he would we had other friends there, so after we
00:17:54
tried to hunt him down, we couldn't find him, so we left. But also, we walked to
00:18:00
the bar. So, we figured, again, a lot of times people treat their male friends different than their female friends.
00:18:06
Well, maybe I want to leave my female friend there to walk home alone because she's a female. But, oh, my male friend
00:18:13
walked to the bar, so he'll be fine. He'll walk back. And then also if there's evidence that he gets out of the
00:18:19
bar, we have a lot of surveillance footage that we see a lot of the people that he
00:18:25
was supposed to be there with left. So if he is walking home, again, not that far of a distance, but not safe,
00:18:36
not a safe area to walk home by yourself. And as far as Clint goes, it's important to know that, you know, he did
00:18:42
have an alibi for Friday night going into Saturday morning in Meredith. She was also his alibi for Saturday evening.
00:18:49
And all day on Sunday, his alibi was basically Alexis and the Schaefer family. >> Well, to back that up, Meredith takes a
00:18:57
polygraph test. And don't you think detectives are going to say, "Do you have any more knowledge of where Brian's
00:19:04
at? Did were you involved in any action that would have harmed Brian? Did you kill Bri? These are questions that they
00:19:12
would be asking her during the polygraph test. So, if she's answering them correctly, the polygraph test she
00:19:19
passed, she's not showing deception, and the cops believe her, then you go, "Well, chances are, again, unless
00:19:26
they're this murderous duo, they don't have any more knowledge, or at least Meredith doesn't have any more knowledge
00:19:34
than she's sharing." >> Yeah. A lot of people speculate that when Clint picked up his car Saturday
00:19:39
morning, that that is when something happened to Brian and that is when he killed Brian. But CPD did loom in all
00:19:46
Brian's apartment and they they definitely went through his apartment with a fine tooth comb and there were no
00:19:52
signs of a struggle or anything like that in Brian's apartment. >> Well, I I like to compare cases and in
00:19:58
the Adnan Siad case they go Heyman Lee goes missing. Her ex-boyfriend Adnan does not call her ever again. Doesn't
00:20:09
call to check in on her. So people point that as evidence that he might might be
00:20:14
guilty of the crime. Then people look at her current boyfriend at the time that she was supposed to meet up with and he
00:20:23
doesn't call her either once she goes missing. So then people point that as to possible evidence that he's guilty of
00:20:30
the crime. And so in the Schaefer case, if you go, well Clint, it maybe is possible that he had some involvement in
00:20:37
Brian going missing. Well, Clint calls him after he sees him last. Well, actually, he doesn't call him. He gives
00:20:43
the phone to Meredith and she calls, but it comes from his phone. And then later
00:20:47
the next day, he calls to say, "Hey, yeah, I know we got we lost you the other night at the bar, but hey, I'm
00:20:53
just calling check in on you." So, again, I don't to me that's not much of a that's not much evidence to anything,
00:21:02
but but there it is. He called him tw at least twice after they lost contact. >> A lot of people think it's strange as
00:21:11
well that, you know, he got the attorney and everything so soon after, but so did
00:21:17
Meredith. She got an attorney as well. And a lot of people say, "Well, Clint stopped all communication." Well, he
00:21:24
didn't. He stopped all communication with Columbus Police Department unless his attorney was present, which is
00:21:30
normal and what a lot of people would do in that situation. But I actually have letters of communication up until like I
00:21:38
think it's like a month before Randy passes away where Clint was still talking to Randy Schaeer.
00:21:43
>> Again, I think this is where the devil's in the details and people go, "Oh, well,
00:21:46
he lawyers up." Well, he didn't lawyer up and stop talking. And how many cases have we seen people get alone in the
00:21:56
room with detectives and they feel uncomfortable and feel like the detectives are pushing him in a certain
00:22:02
direction to confess to something that's not true. And if Clint felt any of that
00:22:09
and again how close is he with his parents or his friends or whoever? He goes back and says, "I I was in this
00:22:16
room and they were they were just being mean." And it could have just been his parents going, "You know what? You're
00:22:20
going to get a lawyer and you can communicate with them, but we're going to make sure that lawyer is present."
00:22:27
And then once you get a lawyer, news flash, listen to that lawyer. So once he gets a lawyer, then then some of those
00:22:35
actions you those aren't actions from Clint. you whatever actions are happening from the lawyer, you have to
00:22:42
go, well, those those are actions coming from his uh his his advisor. It's his his lawyer at that point is his advisor.
00:22:52
>> And you know, I actually had detective Hurst tell me if I was ever in a situation where someone wanted to give
00:22:59
me a polygraph, not to take it. So, I asked him then why he was so suspicious of Clint, and he said it was just
00:23:05
because he said no. Well, and me and Nick have talked about this multiple times. There there's no win.
00:23:12
If I pass it, and if I pass the polygraph test, people go, "Oh, well, it's polygraph test." And they're not
00:23:20
fully accurate. But if I fail, then I look bad. And then if it's inconclusive, I look bad. So, I don't think there's
00:23:29
much of a win and taking exclusively on AMC and AMC Plus. >> We got a possible train killer out
00:23:50
there. >> A brand new season of the hit series Dark Winds. >> Big cases put everyone on edge and this
00:23:56
one's big. She's coming. >> From executive producers Robert Redford [music] and George RR Martin.
00:24:04
>> If that girl talks, this whole thing unravels. >> Dark wins. Sundays exclusively on AMC
00:24:14
and AMC Plus. >> Adam Pal here and I'm John Gabri. >> We're a couple actors and best friends
00:24:19
who you may know as the host of the TV show 101 Places [music] to Party Before You Die. Now, we're bringing you a
00:24:24
comedic look at health and wellness with our new show, Staying Alive. >> We'll have guests like our friend, actor
00:24:29
Jerry Oonnell, >> ketamine therapist Dr. Steven Ratowitz, [music] Paul Sheer, Ego Wodm, Jillian Bell, Dr.
00:24:36
Doolittle. [laughter] Staying Alive with John Gabers and Adam Pal is [music] out right now. Get them a
00:24:42
week early and ad free with SiriusXM Podcast Plus on Apple [music] Podcasts. >> Picture this. It's the end of a long
00:24:48
week. You're unwinding in the tub listening to your favorite true crime podcast and then chronic hives come back
00:24:57
again in the middle of the episode. What a wet blanket. Looks like another spell
00:25:03
of itchy, swollen, red, or skin colored hives. If you have chronic spontaneous urtdicaria or CSU, there may be a
00:25:12
different treatment option. Worried about your chronic hives interrupting our next episode? Learn more at
00:25:20
treatmyhives.com/g. >> Okay, finally, finally, we put out episodes about OCD. And by now, you know
00:25:28
OCD is not just about liking things organized or liking things in color order. It is a serious, it's a highly
00:25:34
misunderstood condition. It can show up in so many sneaky ways. In the episode, we talk about how OCD can be managed and
00:25:41
treated with the right kind of therapy, which is why I want to talk about NOCD. So with the right kind of help, a
00:25:46
specialized therapist who gets what you're experiencing is trained to treat it. OCD [music]
00:25:51
can become so much more manageable. At NOCD, every therapist deeply understands OCD. NOCD [music] is covered for over
00:25:59
155 million Americans, and they make sure that between sessions, you're supported. They have inapp tools,
00:26:05
therapist messaging, they have support [music] groups. putting out the OCD episodes were really important for me
00:26:10
because a few years ago I was diagnosed with it after years of thinking it was just anxiety and getting the right
00:26:15
therapy has helped so much and it's been really heartening to hear how much these
00:26:19
episodes have already helped people with OCD and people who know others who are suffering from it. So if you're ready to
00:26:25
start getting help from therapist who truly understands OCD, visit nocd.com to book a free call. That's noocd.com.
00:26:47
trending on NBC4i.com tonight. The Ohio Attorney General's Office along with the
00:26:52
Columbus Division of Police, they have released an age progression photo of Brian Schaefer. He's the young man who
00:26:58
was last seen at an Ohio State bar almost exactly 15 years ago. digital anchor Christine Barone joining us now
00:27:05
from the NBC4I streaming center with uh more on this picture and what's being done about this cold case. Now Christine
00:27:12
Brad and Darlene I spoke to Ohio Attorney General Dave Yos this afternoon about the case. He said that he actually
00:27:18
hates the term cold case but quote if there is such a thing this is probably it. Schaefer has been missing since
00:27:25
April 1st 2006. Video has him entering the ugly tuna saloona but never coming out. police actively investigated for
00:27:34
years, but no solid leads as to where the then 27year-old medical student could be appeared. Why do you think this
00:27:41
case continues to captivate the public and continues to draw even national attention, you know, through True Crime
00:27:48
podcast and blogs and different things like that after all of these years? >> Well, look, you've got a college kid,
00:27:54
bright future in front of him. Uh we see people go missing on purpose sometimes,
00:27:59
but there's usually some kind of a backstory. Uh and we kind of don't see that here. It's just like that TV show
00:28:07
vanished almost. And uh so I I think it's something that at the core of our being bothers us because
00:28:17
these kind of things are inexplicable. >> Anyone with information about the case
00:28:22
is asked to call Columbus police. We have their number listed on NBC4I.com as well as at the bottom of your screen.
00:28:39
So, we come to our last theory, [music] and this is not one that's talked about often, but
00:28:46
and Kelly, let let me know if you agree with me on this. This theory is not one that I that ever really crossed my mind
00:28:57
until talking to individuals that have worked on this case. >> Yeah, I was the same way.
00:29:02
>> You know what I mean? Like this is one that comes up. This is one that has been
00:29:07
I won't even say comes up. This theory has been pushed on to me by several individuals and several individuals that
00:29:15
I don't find to be like dumb asses. Right? So when they talk about this theory, uh they'll talk about it
00:29:24
obviously more passionately, but it's definitely one that has been coming up for the last 10 years. Yeah,
00:29:31
it's actually a theory that when I was talking to Don Corbett and he told me, I I thought he was a little crazy, but I
00:29:42
kept listening and he told me that he actually had suspicions that Randy Schaefer could have harmed Brian.
00:29:50
So, of course, me being me, I was like, "Okay, well, I'm going to dig into this and try to prove Dawn wrong." I haven't
00:29:57
actually been able to. So, it's not a theory that I have eliminated and it is something that I continue to
00:30:03
investigate. Randy had he had the motive to do it with the infighting over the life
00:30:10
insurance and Brian had told Renee about the affair that Randy was having. Randy was
00:30:18
controlling the narrative to the media. He was cut off from CPD and then in return they had the tip that Randy had
00:30:27
killed Brian and buried him in his backyard. So they took cadaavver dogs through his house and through the
00:30:34
property looking into it. Um I can't prove Randy ever left Brian's apartment that night.
00:30:41
>> What you're saying is one he has two points of motivation. the insurance money and fighting over
00:30:48
that. And then also Brian's the one that told his wife that he was cheating on him, right? So those are two
00:30:57
motivations. And then we go, well, Randy doesn't have an alibi that night. >> Randy doesn't have an alibi until
00:31:04
Sunday. >> So that's weird. And then I also think the other thing that's weird is Brian
00:31:11
was supposed to show up to his house the next day and he doesn't. and Randy doesn't seem that concerned. Randy
00:31:17
doesn't seem to be that concerned until maybe Monday. And then again, so you when you talk to
00:31:26
Don Corbett, you're like, Don, you you must have lost your mind. But remember, who is Don Corbett? Don Corbett is a a
00:31:33
private investigator that's working with Randy Schaefer. So, the guy he's working
00:31:39
with now he's getting suspicious of and one of the reasons uh don't take take this as a direct quote, but I want to
00:31:46
say that Don was saying, "Hey, I kept telling Randy, you know, we got to look into a different direction other than
00:31:52
Clint." And he kept doubling down. Randy kept on going, "No, we got to look into
00:31:56
Clint. Clint is involved. He knows something." So, no alibi, multiple motives. doesn't seem that concerned for a time
00:32:08
period. And then the thing that has always bothered me is he pushes a narrative and pushes
00:32:15
who Brian was and what he was doing with his life. And pretty quickly when you start looking into Brian's story, you go
00:32:22
that is not a true version. But like Nick just said earlier, you do act differently around
00:32:30
your your parents or you can act differently around your >> and it doesn't hurt your missing
00:32:36
person's case or to to have the public identify and symp and sympathize with your victim,
00:32:48
>> right? It doesn't hurt it doesn't hurt the the case. I mean, what what hurts the case, and we've even had push back
00:32:57
on some cases where the victim is somebody who's addicted to drugs or the the victim is not a saint, uh, let's
00:33:06
say, uh, for for one reason or another, and we'll get an email from somebody like, you know, why did you feature this
00:33:14
case? out of all the cases uh you know this this guy uh that you were talking about who who really cares he was up to
00:33:22
no good or or he was drug addicted or whatever. So there is a different level there are varying degrees of of victim
00:33:31
as far as the general public is concerned. That's not our thoughts here in the garage. But again, it does not
00:33:38
hurt your case to not only get the information out there, to get the people talking, to get
00:33:45
people to to identify with your case, but also identify with your victim and even
00:33:51
sympathize with your victim. >> Yeah, Randy also portrayed himself in a different light. And I think that is the
00:33:59
one thing that keeps this theory hanging in there for me is because you know Randy
00:34:07
he was Brian's I mean without Randy Brian's case would not be where it is today and have all of the
00:34:14
media coverage that it has. So I totally credit him for all of that. However, Randy wasn't as good of a person as he
00:34:23
put it out there to be. Um, a lot of people have no problem that know R or knew Randy believing that
00:34:32
Randy could be responsible for Brian's death. When Brian and Derek would have girlfriends in high school, they would
00:34:39
not even come over until they made sure Randy was passed out because he would make perverse comments. It It just seems
00:34:47
I didn't know Randy very well. And when I thought Dawn was crazy, it was because my opinion was based off
00:34:56
what I saw on the news coverage that Randy did. >> Yeah. Wasn't there some rumor that when
00:35:04
they're searching Brian's place that Randy smacked a girl's bottom? >> Yes. Alexis's.
00:35:14
>> Yeah. So, and there was all these other rumors that I heard too that people [clears throat] that were in
00:35:20
communication with Randy about the case that they basically had to tell Randy multiple times, like, you know, you
00:35:31
can't talk to me a certain way or in one case the the the lady wouldn't talk to him unless he was
00:35:40
on speaker phone with her husband in the room. >> Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of stuff like that. But
00:35:46
again, being a pervert doesn't make you responsible for killing your son. And >> no,
00:35:54
>> and then I would also I I guess you could play it two ways. If you seem disinterested, then maybe you
00:36:01
become more of a suspect, but uh also people have talked about this the searches that Randy did on his own.
00:36:12
And so it's kind of like, it reminds me again, I like to compare cases. The Mara
00:36:15
Murray case, there was a lot of speculation that maybe Mara's dad was somehow involved. And
00:36:24
then you find out that he was going up almost every weekend and spending hours and days and doing his own search
00:36:32
parties for years. And it's like you you might play that card one time to go, "Hey, look, I'm out
00:36:41
here searching for my daughter. I'm not involved." You want to play that card for years.
00:36:48
You You see what I'm saying? >> Mhm. >> So, and one of the issues here, and again, I think when we first covered
00:36:57
this case, I didn't have much of an understanding of Derek. I I didn't get it. If my brother went missing, then I'd
00:37:06
be shouting from the rooftops. The more I've looked into this, the more I can understand that
00:37:14
Derek's relationship with this case is going to be different than anybody's, and we shouldn't force our ideas on what
00:37:23
we think we would do uh with what he should do. And and so at the end of the day, Derek lost his mom, then lost his
00:37:32
brother, lost his father. And so this could be a very difficult thing to talk about. And so if
00:37:40
there was an And then could you imagine somebody like Derek talking to other investigators,
00:37:47
other people, and if they start speculating your dad and you don't think that there's any
00:37:52
truth to that, I mean, that would be a difficult thing to deal with. Also, >> it would be difficult if you thought
00:37:59
there could be some truth to it as well. >> Yeah. >> And you know, while Randy didn't seem
00:38:06
very concerned when Brian first went missing and Alexis was calling around, to be fair, not a [clears throat] lot of
00:38:12
people seemed very concerned at first. And actually, a lot of people seemed to think that Brian was going to show up at
00:38:19
the airport on Monday, but Randy was the only one that was adamant that Brian was
00:38:24
not going to show up. Now, of course, that doesn't mean he's guilty, but it makes me question why he was not
00:38:31
concerned initially, but very adamant that he was not going to show up at the airport when no one else seemed to be.
00:38:38
>> Yeah. And sometimes people get like a parental feeling. It's difficult, too. And it's also difficult to judge
00:38:44
somebody like Randy because everybody that we've talked to, friends and family members, they go,
00:38:52
"Yeah, well, Randy drank often and he drank a lot." And I guarantee you that probably
00:39:00
ramped up more once his wife passes away. And I guarantee you that probably ramped up a
00:39:06
little bit more when his son goes missing. So, some of these weird actions or some of these weird
00:39:15
moments, you you again, I don't want to give him a pass, but you just wonder, was he more intoxicated? You know, cuz
00:39:24
from what I've heard, like it he didn't just have to be intoxicated at night. He
00:39:28
could have been intoxicated during the day. And so, again, that doesn't give anybody a pass, but that gives us a
00:39:36
better understanding of where he was at. But he's a tough one. And then anybody that's listening to this and goes, "You
00:39:45
guys are crazy to think that it's possible that that Brian's dad was involved." Well, it's not that crazy
00:39:55
when Columbus PD brings cadaavver dogs out to the property twice. They wouldn't waste their time or waste their resource
00:40:04
resources. I could see them doing it once to go, "Hey, we got a couple leads." Uh, the dad said a couple weird
00:40:10
things. Hey, let's just do this so we can check that box, but I I don't see them doing it twice unless they had some
00:40:21
some solid reason to do it. >> And they cut him off as well, like completely from knowing any information.
00:40:27
And they used the excuse that it was because he would go to the media and tell the media everything. But that
00:40:34
doesn't seem to be the case based on my communication with Hurst. So, I've been on record as saying I think that Brian
00:40:41
was met with foul play that morning. And I still think that theory is to me anyway,
00:40:51
I think it's one of the better theories. It's the theory I like the most is that
00:40:56
somewhere between him leaving the bar and walking home that he was he encountered the wrong group of guys. And
00:41:06
I I still believe that I I I know that we've had some discussion about conveyor belts and things of that nature, but I
00:41:15
still think unfortunately I hope I'm wrong. I still think unfortunately that he's in the the landfill.
00:41:22
>> Yeah. I think all these theories, again, they're not my theory or Kelly's theory.
00:41:32
They're just theories that have been put out there from people that we've talked
00:41:37
to about this case that have been looking into this case for a long time. To reiterate the point of this whole
00:41:45
conversation is to get this information out there, the best way we can so other people that
00:41:54
are looking into this case have this information. You can have the band name Rockhouse. You can have the information
00:42:02
that we've talked to them. You can have the information that these two random girls Brian was talking to, there was
00:42:08
another girl. Was she in involved somehow? We don't know. But it's just a question that we have. Who was she? Why
00:42:17
hasn't she been named? Why wasn't she talked to? Why wasn't these two girls, Amber and Brighton, why weren't they
00:42:23
talked to more in depth from the detectives? Why didn't the detectives look more into the four guys that Brian,
00:42:34
Clint, Meredith were meeting that night at Ugly Tuna? Why wasn't certain things done? And then I think there's other
00:42:42
things that have been done that just haven't been reported on as much. So, we want to get that out there so if
00:42:49
somebody's going down this rabbit hole, they know that scent dogs were brought in, that they know that Columbus PD
00:42:58
believes that Brian Schaefer got out of the bar and got out of the complex. So, it's just to put this information
00:43:06
out there to continue the conversation to shine a light on this situation. It's almost 20 years
00:43:16
And it doesn't seem like we're that much closer to the truth than the day he went
00:43:23
missing. [music] [music] Want to thank everybody for joining us here in the garage each and every week.
00:43:47
Thanks for telling your mother. Thanks for telling your brother. A big shout out to Kelly Bruce. She has been working
00:43:53
on this case for many years. And like I've said many times on this podcast, we've been in conversation basically
00:44:00
weekly for the last year on how do we get this information out there? What do we do with it? And also trying to track
00:44:08
down new leads and new individuals to talk to. If you're not following Kelly on Facebook, she has a Facebook page,
00:44:18
Brian Schaefer, Dead or Alive. She's already posting a lot of stuff, a lot of updates, a lot of new information that
00:44:25
she is getting because a lot of people are reaching out to her. So, one of the things that we talked about in these
00:44:31
episodes was this party picture, four individuals. Some of those individuals being guys that Brian was hanging out
00:44:40
with at the ugly tuna. and one of those guys we thought possibly could be Brian Schaefer. We're pretty sure, I'd say
00:44:49
99.9% sure based off people reaching out to us that the guy that we thought on the far right of that photo, which we
00:44:58
thought could be Brian Schaefer, the individuals that have reached out to us say, "Hey, that's not Brian Schaefer.
00:45:04
It's actually this other guy." And they've been able to help us identify the individuals in that photo. And yes,
00:45:12
some of the individuals in that photo were guys that were hanging out with Brian, but we don't now believe that the
00:45:18
guy on the far right is Brian. And that's the whole point of having these conversations. You don't always have
00:45:26
answers, but there's information and it's important to get those out. So, follow Kelly Brian Schaefer dead or
00:45:33
alive on Facebook. Like I said, a lot of updates already happening. And it's also
00:45:38
exciting cuz many people of different law enforcement departments have reached out to Kelly. So now they're already
00:45:44
setting up interviews and conversations. So maybe she can learn more from those individuals that have worked on Brian's
00:45:52
case or feel like they have some expertise to lend to the conversation. And the conversation is going to
00:45:59
continue. I'm happy to announce that me and Kelly have already talked about gathering up information and trying to
00:46:07
do some kind of off thereord special episode on any of the Brian Schaefer updates as as we get them. But me, Nick,
00:46:16
and Kelly will be back for a conversation April 18th with not just us, but many others. It's a live panel
00:46:24
discussion about the Brian Shaver case. April 18th at Brew Dog in Columbus, Ohio. The tickets are on sale now. They
00:46:32
are going quickly and all the money is going to be raised for Porch Light Project. It's something that's near and
00:46:40
dear to Nick's heart. And if you haven't been following the Porch Light Project,
00:46:44
they've been doing great work and getting answers, solving cases. And so, we're hoping that we can raise this
00:46:50
money that will go to DNA testing on other cases. And we hope that this conversation about a cold case can bring
00:46:58
closure and answers to other cases out there. And we couldn't do this without you guys. You guys are simply amazing.
00:47:07
And I'll be forever grateful that you have changed my life. So please join us. Free hugs and free drugs. Scratch that.
00:47:16
Free free hugs. April 18th at Brew Dog in Columbus, Ohio. Tickets are on sale now and they're going fast at true
00:47:24
crimegar.com. If you have any tips or information about Brian Schaefer, no matter how big
00:47:31
or small, please contact the Columbus Police at 6146452358. And thank you so much for sharing all
00:47:41
these cases on social media. It means the world. Until next week, be good, be kind, and don't litter.
00:47:55
Welcome to Off the Record. I'm your host Nick Crime. >> It's good to be seen and it's good to
00:48:02
[music] see you. Off the record. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend.
00:48:08
>> True Crime Podcast. >> Be good, be kind, and don't crime. >> Gather around, [music] grab a chair,
00:48:15
grab a beer. Let's talk some True Crime. >> [music] [music] >> Hey, this is Jeff Lewis from Radio Andy.
00:48:51
Live and uncensored. Catch me talking with my friends about my latest obsessions, relationship issues, and
00:48:56
bodily ailments. With that kind of drama that seems to follow me, [music] you never know what's going to happen.
00:49:01
>> You can listen to Jeff Lewis Live at home or anywhere you are. Download the [music] SiriusXM app for over 425
00:49:09
channels of adfree music, sports, [music] entertainment, and more. Subscribe now and get three months free.
00:49:15
Offer details apply.