00:00:00
when it comes to Quality sleep Ashley has you covered with top mattress brands at winning prices and with special
00:00:06
financing options available you can snooze now and pay later plus your mattress purchase helps give the gift of
00:00:13
better sleep to children in need and US Special Operations forces visit your local Ashley store or shop online today
00:00:22
and make every snooze count financing is subject to credit approval C store or ashley.com for d details at Consumer
00:00:31
Cellular you get the same exact coverage as the largest carriers but for up to half the cost same thing up to half the
00:00:38
cost up to half the cost for the same thing 50% the money for 100% the same thing I hope I'm making myself clear
00:00:46
Consumer Cellular when Freedom calls we're here to answer call us at 1888 Freedom half the cost savings based on
00:00:53
cost of consumer cellular single line 5 GB data plan with unlimited talk and text compared to lowest cost single line
00:00:57
postpaid unlimited talk text and data plan offered by T-Mobile Verizon May [Music]
00:01:23
[Music] 2023 [Music] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
00:01:46
for listening I'm your host Nick and with me as always is a man who celebrates his victories the proper way
00:01:52
with sloppy Stakes at trones here is the captain yes we are the champions it's good to be seen and good to see you
00:02:00
thanks for listening thanks for telling a [Music] friend this week we are very excited to
00:02:11
be featuring Bob's your uncle which is a delicious English pub ale from the master Brewers at low res brewing in the
00:02:19
windy city Sweet Home Chicago as they say Bob's your uncle is a medium bodied Brown beer featuring traditional UK hot
00:02:30
garage grade 4 out of five bottle caps and here's a little praise and thanks to some of our good garage friends first up
00:02:37
a cheers to steo from the Mean Streets of Hallstead and a big we like your jib to Ron RL and Cleveland Georgia and last
00:02:46
but certainly not least we have a very special shout out to my man Bart Harley Jarvis in beautiful Parts Unknown
00:02:54
everyone we just mentioned they went to True Crime garage.com and contributed to
00:02:58
the Beer fund and for for that we thank you yeah b r n Beer Run make sure you go to
00:03:08
our store Page we have a promo code going on until the 12th so you need to get on it right now the promo code for
00:03:17
25% off is cheers 2023 check that out and everything true crime True Crime garage.com and Colonel that's enough of
00:03:29
the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true
00:03:49
[Music] crime [Music] the Browns Chicken Massacre is a rather Infamous case especially in the greater
00:04:10
Chicago area first called the Palatine Massacre then later known throughout the nation as the Browns Chicken Massacre
00:04:18
was a mass murder that occurred in Palatine Illinois when seven people at a Browns chicken and pasta fast food
00:04:26
restaurant were killed there are three kinds of towns those where everybody knows everybody those where nobody knows
00:04:34
anybody and those somewhere in between like Palatine the newspaper headline was horrific to say the least and reads
00:04:44
seven massacred in Palatine Police find bodies of two teenagers five adults and restaurant
00:04:52
coolers the Chicago Tribune reported that seven people were fatally shot and their bodies found sad Saturday in
00:05:00
Walking coolers at a family run chicken restaurant in Palatine nearly 24 hours after the grizzly Discovery police would
00:05:08
not name a motive as police inside the Browns chicken and pasta searched for clues some restaurant workers speculated
00:05:18
that the visibility of the restaurant's safe may have attracted the killer Palatine Police refused to give details
00:05:26
of the slangs but police sources said a local man was taken in for questioning in connection with the
00:05:34
killings police said they found the bodies at about 2:30 a.m. Saturday more than 5 and 1/2 hours after closing
00:05:43
authorities learned of trouble at the restaurant when parents of one employee called police concerned that their son
00:05:51
had not returned home from work when officers arrived at the store they found a rear door unlocked inside side they
00:06:00
found the seven bodies some face down in a cooler and a walk-in freezer the slanging stunned other
00:06:09
Brown's employees who rushed to the restaurant at Daybreak to learn which of their fellow workers had been killed
00:06:18
this is true crime [Music] garage here in the garage we are forced to use a lot of jarring terms such as blood and
00:06:43
murder but there are few words more disturbing than Massacre all of these True Crime cases that we cover we
00:06:51
certainly understand and remind everyone that the victims in these cases in these
00:06:57
stories are always many any more than just the deceased unfortunately anytime we have multiple murders the Doom and
00:07:06
Gloom factor is Multiplied of course but also keep in mind the magnitude of the shock wave of grief Terror and anger
00:07:16
that spreads for miles into the neighboring communities and cities just like we all witnessed very recently with
00:07:25
the Idaho University case unfortunately now your Hometown is in the National Spotlight and only strictly for
00:07:34
extremely undesirable reasons the best you can hope for is that in some very human way that possibly unification and
00:07:44
strength of community can rise above tragedy and at the very least the person or persons responsible for such
00:07:53
senseless violence can be brought into that light exposed and severe punish Ms carried out swiftly there are very few
00:08:02
ways to deal with such loss and that is one that I offer up to you and that's what we have here today captain in the
00:08:11
garage a massacre a tragedy of great magnitude that hit this community near Chicago now let's go back 30 years ago
00:08:24
almost exactly 30 years ago to today's date we have such great tragedy that came with so many questions it was most
00:08:33
certainly a massacre and unfortunately we are talking about the murder of seven innocent people as long as you didn't
00:08:40
skip over looking at the title of today's show well then you know we are talking about the Browns Chicken
00:08:46
Massacre you have heard us report in previous episodes quoting more than one detective when asked to describe the
00:08:53
scene of a massacre more than once the same haunting and disturbing phrase is given wholesale
00:09:02
Carnage the name to sum up such Carnage in this case first was labeled the Palatine Massacre that's because of
00:09:11
where this case took place and the otherwise wonderful city of Palatine Illinois technically speaking it's the
00:09:19
Village of Palatine motto a real Hometown and as you heard described in the trailer by at least one resident
00:09:27
there are three kinds of towns those where everybody knows everybody those where nobody knows anybody and
00:09:34
those somewhere in between like Palatine and that would certainly fit the bill for a town of over 42,000 back
00:09:43
in 1993 this is a Northwestern residential suburb of the great City of Chicago Palatine is one of the largest
00:09:52
communities in Illinois with the current population of about 68,000 people on January 9th 1993 no one thought that
00:10:02
they would wake up to such horrific news and we read just one of the headlines for you in the trailer seven massacred
00:10:10
imp Palatine Police find bodies of two teenagers and five adults and restaurants coolers now because of the
00:10:18
hour in which the murder scene was discovered by police the story did not hit the Chicago Tribune until the
00:10:26
following morning's paper but the front page laid it all out there describing what little was known about the crimes
00:10:34
at the time the bodies were discovered by police in Walkin coolers at the Browns chicken and pasta restaurant at
00:10:42
about 2:30 a.m. on Saturday January 9th for those not familiar Browns Chicken is
00:10:49
a chain of fast food restaurants specializing in fried chicken for those who are not familiar with Browns chicken
00:10:56
and pasta It's or Origins go all the way back to 1949 and then Brown's Chicken expanded
00:11:04
to many locations throughout the United States in the 1970s and to this very day
00:11:10
Captain there are still a whole bunch of Browns Chicken locations in and around the Chicago metropolitan area as the
00:11:18
Chicago Tribune put it Palatine lost its innocence long ago somewhere after World
00:11:23
War II but as of January 9th 1993 Palatine joined the roster of shattered towns whose very names echoed tragedy
00:11:34
too enormous to place in any context that Saturday afternoon As word lit through Palatine that seven people
00:11:43
had been found murdered at the local Browns chicken and pasta many residents were too stunned and baffled by the lack
00:11:53
of details to register any grief at all let's dive into the timeline of this massacre so the papers aren't offering
00:12:02
much in the way of details about this case especially early on here Captain but of course we will be able to provide
00:12:09
those details of this case the investigation and the evidence as well the seven people were found in the small
00:12:16
hours of Saturday morning but let's back up to that Friday night the restaurant closes at 900m now anyone who has ever
00:12:25
worked in the restaurant business knows exactly what this means 900 p.m. hits restaurant closes doors are locked no
00:12:34
new customers no more orders no new sales now we've got to clean the place put everything away finish up any of the
00:12:45
daily paperwork drop all monies in the safe lock up and leave just like most food industry businesses often the
00:12:53
closing procedures and the staff closing duties of the restaurant if Thea restaurant is slow leading up to that
00:13:00
closing time well a lot of those task can be completed before closing or at the very least you can at least start on
00:13:08
those tasks it's been reported many times over that closing procedures at this Browns Chicken location were
00:13:16
usually completed by 10 p.m. so we have a situation you close at 9: and roughly 1 hour after closing all the duties are
00:13:25
done and now everyone is heading home or elsewhere unfortunately that would not be
00:13:31
happening here on this night we have many eyewitnesses in this case and almost all of them report it was
00:13:39
business as usual on a typical Friday at Browns Chicken that's correct captain in
00:13:45
fact all of them reported that it was business as usual that afternoon and that night leading up to closing and
00:13:53
that will be a key factor in this case because remember we've talked about other cases where we have a shooting or
00:14:00
un unfortunately a massacre in a restaurant or store and the customers of that day and of that night they are all
00:14:09
essentially Witnesses who can later come forward and they can start to fill in the gaps of time in your timeline to
00:14:17
when everything was fine everything was normal they might even be able to clue you in on a potential suspect or
00:14:23
anything odd that they saw when they were present at the scene unfortunately here Captain all of our
00:14:32
victims that we will be discussing they were all working at Browns that night none of the victims were customers the
00:14:40
victims we have here we said there were seven we have husband and wife Richard and Lynn
00:14:47
ellenel they were actually the owners of this restaurant Richard was 50 years of
00:14:54
age and his wife Lynn was 49 also killed were two te teenage male employees Rico
00:15:00
Solace and Michael Castro we also have two employees in their 30s Thomas Menace and Marcus
00:15:09
Nelson and then we have the seventh victim who was a cook this is 46-year-old guadaloop Maldonado the
00:15:18
slain workers may not have been discovered until several hours later in fact we know that they were discovered
00:15:26
in at 2:30 a.m. or roughly 2:30 a.m. but had certain things not fallen into place
00:15:33
and certain people not taken certain actions that night it could have been hours later
00:15:39
until the discovery this gruesome Discovery there at the Browns Chicken restaurant yeah if it weren't for the
00:15:46
parents of Michael Castro then the these victims would have been found probably not till the next
00:15:52
day when they had to open up the store Michael Castro he's 16 he was working to have extra money to spend on his prize
00:16:01
possession which like most 16-year-old males was his car Michael spoke with his parents early in the night I don't have
00:16:10
a time for that Captain but I'm guessing it would it would have been after arriving for his shift because he spoke
00:16:19
with them via phone now one key detail he tells his parents is hey we're closing at 9: his parents know it takes
00:16:27
about an hour so for the closing duties to take place he doesn't live very far from the restaurant at all so Mom and
00:16:39
Dad would be expecting Michael Castro to come home about 10:1 15ish on that Friday night he tells them on the phone
00:16:47
right after work I'm coming straight home so they're expecting him well he's 16 so at some point it's Friday night
00:16:56
Mom and Dad realize Michael's not home home around midnight is when Mom and Dad start getting concerned what we have
00:17:06
here is a gap of time where we know that the restaurant closed at 9: and the bodies are not discovered until about
00:17:15
2:30 a.m. so that puts us at about a 5 and a half hour window where we have a lot of questions what the hell happened
00:17:24
in that 5 and 1/2 hours where everything was fine when the restaurant closed at night
00:17:29
but then we have seven victims at 2:30 a.m. 5 and a half hours later well and like you said one of the protocols when
00:17:36
you're closing up shop whether you're working in a restaurant or a bank or anything like that is all right business
00:17:43
is closed lock the doors so we can assume that at 9:00 the doors were locked yes and we can assume that and
00:17:53
the other thing that we can later understand is that at some point the doors have to be locked because we get
00:18:00
witnesses that will tell us that they found the doors in the locked position so sometime after midnight Mom and Dad
00:18:06
Michael Castro's parents they're getting concerned they don't live far from the restaurant and they decide you know what
00:18:13
we'll head over there we'll see what's going on they drive over to the restaurant Unfortunately they see their
00:18:19
son's vehicle still parked in the parking lot the restaurant everything from the outside appears to be normal
00:18:26
the doors that they checked were locked and now they're wondering okay what's going on they knock on the doors nothing
00:18:34
happens nobody answers they return home they decide that they're going to call the police they notify the police that
00:18:40
their son is missing they tell them of everything that they know the police are not really concerned they don't share
00:18:47
the same concern as the parents but then the parents call back with uh with a follow-up call saying look this is
00:18:56
really not like our son and regardless of what what you're saying yes he's 16 he could be out partying with some
00:19:01
friends however the case is this we went to his place of work where he was supposed to be and come directly home
00:19:09
his vehicle's still there so unless he hopped into somebody else's vehicle there's something going on here yeah and
00:19:15
not just Michael's vehicle but there's other employees vehicles that are still in the parking lot correct so they
00:19:22
really kind of pushed the envelope here and police show up to the Browns Chicken
00:19:27
restaurant along with Castro's parents they check the doors again same result restaurants
00:19:36
closed restaurants locked we don't know what's going on everybody Parts ways right now after a little bit more of
00:19:43
time expires this is when the Castro parents call back and sayl I know you've already checked the restaurant once I'm
00:19:51
insistent that the restaurant be checked again we got to be doing more here to find my son
00:19:59
than just waiting well I bring up those other cars because if I'm law enforcement and we have a teenager's
00:20:04
parents calling saying hey our son's missing well he he worked that day it's possible he went out with some friends
00:20:12
and they picked him up from work but what doesn't make any sense to me if I'm law enforcement is the multiple cars of
00:20:19
multiple employees parked in the lot exactly and I will say this though in the defense of the Palatine Police here
00:20:28
I've worked in the restaurant business I've worked at bars and one thing that I loved one of the key factors why I liked
00:20:36
working in that business in that industry when I was younger was there was always somebody to hang out with
00:20:43
after work if you worked the second shift or the closing shift there was almost always a party or a gathering
00:20:50
afterwards that's because the colonel is a party animal so it's not crazy to think that maybe they all went somewhere
00:20:59
together but as parents you got to push the envelope and that's what they did so
00:21:03
now we're checking the restaurant again and this is when the police find a side door that was actually unlocked the
00:21:13
officer tells Castro's parents and that very good by the officer says look you need to stay out here in the the parking
00:21:21
lot you can't come in here with me I I will I need to go in and check out what's going on and I'll report back to
00:21:28
you if you're this law enforcement officer once you find that unlocked door I think your nerves would shoot through
00:21:36
the roof because that that is a red flag that is telling you there is something wrong and man God bless that guy though
00:21:47
CU he has to then tell the parents you need to stay back and it's my job and it's my duty to Serve and Protect and I
00:21:54
got to go in here well and this officer is a different officer than the one who responded the first time so he may know
00:22:02
or may not know that the the building has been checked prior but if you did know that again like you said Captain
00:22:10
all those cars in the parking lot nothing appears to be a Miss from outside you've got to be really
00:22:17
concerned now that you're finding that unlocked door given the situation he goes in on his own the way that this
00:22:25
goes down is he says that once he went in there he immediately felt like something wasn't right so he was
00:22:31
probably seeing some kind of signs of a struggle but what we end up with is he stumbles upon these seven
00:22:43
bodies and then of course all hell broke loose so at approximately 2:30 a.m. the victims were all found in the
00:22:52
back kitchen area and as reported some victims were located in the walk-in freezer and some in the walk-in cooler
00:23:00
immediately the scene is sealed off what we have here that's interesting to me though for our investigation and for the
00:23:08
night in question is that the police arriving and checking the restaurant prior to 2:30 sometime after midnight
00:23:17
the Castro checking the restaurant prior to 2:30 this already to me is going to close up some of those gaps in our
00:23:25
timeline so we know the restaurant closed at 9: everybody should have been done with their closing duties around 10
00:23:31
and heading out of the the place of business and once we get shortly after midnight we know that the outside of the
00:23:38
building appears to be and the parking lot everything outside is in the same state as it is found at 2:30 so now
00:23:46
we're starting to go okay whatever happened here had to have gone down somewhere between closing time at 9900
00:23:53
p.m. and when the restaurant was first checked after midnight yeah we don't know how thorough that first check was
00:24:00
because it's it's very possible they did a check but they didn't check all the doors but man to be that officer to come
00:24:08
across that scene I mean you're going to feel that in your gut your nuts your butt in your Pizza Hut a lot more to get
00:24:15
to in this case right after this quick beer [Music] break this show is sponsored by better help do
00:24:43
you look forward to the holidays maybe you struggle with seasonal Blues this time of year can be a lot and it's
00:24:49
natural to feel some sadness or even anxiety about it but adding something new and positive to your life can
00:24:54
counteract some of those feelings therapy can be a bright spot something to look forward to to make you feel
00:25:01
grounded and to give you the tools to manage everything going on if you're thinking of starting therapy give better
00:25:08
help a try it's entirely online designed to be convenient flexible and suited to
00:25:13
your schedule just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist and switch therapist
00:25:20
at any time for no additional charge find your bright spot this season with betterhelp visit betterhelp.com garage
00:25:27
to day to get 10% off your first month that's betterhelp hp.com major phone carriers make you
00:25:39
sign contracts with rigid data plans to trap you into a kind of forced phogy sounds pretty insecure if you ask me at
00:25:46
Consumer Cellular we believe in a more consensual and healthy form of monogamy free of contracts and more flexible to
00:25:52
your data needs this way you stick around not because we force you to with contracts and fees but because you love
00:25:57
our phone plans like ardently love our phone plans monogamously Consumer Cellular when Freedom calls we're here
00:26:05
to answer call us at 1888 Freedom you can live out your Master Chef dreams when you find a professional
00:26:13
on Angie to tackle your dream kitchen remodel connect with skilled professionals to get all your home
00:26:19
projects done well visit angie.com you can do this when you Angie that [Music] all right Colonel we are back cheers to
00:26:45
everybody for joining us here in the garage and cheers to another year with the colonel cheers to you Captain let's
00:26:52
get back into our timeline here so as we said after we have this gruesome Discovery immediately the scene is
00:27:00
sealed off the Cook County medical examiner's office is notified of the situation and detectives and evidence
00:27:07
technicians are requested to the scene evidence collection begins as soon as they arrive police will be busy to not
00:27:18
disturb the bodies or the crime scene but also collecting evidence all the while they have to photograph the bodies
00:27:26
from several different angles so police are busy photographing and videotaping the
00:27:33
scene at 8:30 a.m. we have the medical examiner this is Dr Robert Stein he arrives on the scene in this case the
00:27:44
victim identification was delayed and this was on purpose it was delayed to preserve the crime
00:27:53
scene after the medical examiner is finished with his initial investigation then we're going to have
00:28:01
the technicians transport the bodies to the morg this does not take place or start to take place until between 4:00
00:28:09
p.m. and 700 p.m. this is when the bodies were removed from the restaurant the following day which will be Sunday
00:28:17
January 10th is when the autopsies would be performed all these procedures I'm assuming are taking longer because we
00:28:25
don't have just one victim we have multiple victims let's get into the layout of this restaurant as we are all
00:28:35
familiar with often times there are casual and fast food restaurants located in front of or very nearby shopping
00:28:43
malls and shopping plazas well that was the case here this store sat at an angle
00:28:50
almost tilted diagonal in the Square shaped parking lot that surrounded the restaurant directly to to the south of
00:28:58
the restaurant you have the Northwest Highway to the West is North Smith Street and to the North and the east of
00:29:07
the restaurant you have larger businesses Browns Chicken was a standalone restaurant with its own
00:29:13
parking lot so surrounding the parking lot for Browns Chicken you have these two
00:29:19
roads that see a decent amount of traffic and then on the other two sides you have parking for the other larger
00:29:28
surrounding stores and businesses the front of the restaurant more so facing the highway is decorative it has the
00:29:37
words Browns Chicken in large cursive lettering across the front roof side overhang the restaurant is a square
00:29:46
shaped building windows line the front of the building with small bushes just below it looks very similar to me to uh
00:29:57
McDonald's building because of this design the entrance and exit ways were on both sides of the restaurant so we
00:30:07
don't have any entrance in through the front it's on the sides both sides there was a set of double doors on each side
00:30:17
inside we have the front of the house with entrances seating and room for lines in to form in front of the two
00:30:26
registers and then of course you have the back of the house with the cookers coolers prep
00:30:32
table and office you have the counter with two registers separating the front of the house from the back of the house
00:30:41
the victims were found in the back kitchen area in the walk-in freezer and walk-in cooler area two of the victims
00:30:49
Richard ellenel and Thomas Menace were found in the cooler this is on the west side of of the restaurant the other five
00:30:59
victims were found in the freezer now when the first officer went into the restaurant he went in through the
00:31:07
unlocked door this is actually referred to by the employees people that work there as the back door but it's
00:31:14
technically to the very back of one of the sides of the restaurant right this leads directly into the kitchen area
00:31:23
this is referred to as the back door because this is a door that was common L left unlocked for employees to come in
00:31:30
and out for their shifts for trash removal and if they needed to bring in supplies to the restaurant so even when
00:31:39
it's working if the if the employees are in their working this door is often left
00:31:46
unlocked just because it makes things quicker more efficient for employees to get in and out throughout their shifts
00:31:54
now when that officer goes into that kitchen area immediately through the door he enters the kitchen area as we
00:31:59
said he says he knows right away that something is wrong he did see some signs of a struggle but the sight that took
00:32:07
him immediately from concern to crisis mode was when he spotted a hand and a foot sticking out of the partially open
00:32:16
freezer door as it would turn out the hand belonged to the lone female victim and the foot sticking out was one of the
00:32:25
teenagers that was F found dead at the scene all seven victims were shot to death Lynn's throat was
00:32:33
slit but later it was stated that it was The Gunshot that had killed her blood had pulled up significantly in the
00:32:43
walk-ins by the time the officer found the bodies now there was a good deal of hold back information in this case and
00:32:51
that was for good reason one of course it's always good to have some hold back information these would be intimate
00:32:58
details of the crime that only the lead investigators and the killer or Killers would know this is also to protect the
00:33:06
investigation itself from a false confession I was just going to say the more cases that we covered and we when
00:33:12
we talk about this holdback information and and law enforcement having to keep things close to the chest this show is a
00:33:19
is a prime example that we live in a sick world with some sick people but think about how sick it is that you have
00:33:25
to hold back in because there's some sickos out there that want to confess to these crimes
00:33:33
yeah and you're going to have that on two different levels you're going to have people that come out of the
00:33:38
woodwork and they confess to a crime for whatever reason usually they got some screws loose when they're doing that
00:33:44
either they want to take credit for something that they didn't do or they are mentally ill that's not terribly
00:33:52
uncommon the other thing too that you want to protect with this hold back information
00:33:57
is the in the Integrity of your investigation and the Integrity of the officers in charge of the investigation
00:34:05
right because you could have some pretty aggressive detectives and officers that
00:34:11
are able to get to pull out a false confession from somebody who is confessing only because they feel
00:34:18
pressured by the police very good point also in this case what we will see is there will be reward money for
00:34:25
information in this case leading to an arrest and a conviction that money just like in
00:34:31
Deli it got to be a very significant amount and it grew over time so now we have another situation where it's not
00:34:41
terribly uncommon for someone to come forward and say things like you know so and so told me that he did the Browns
00:34:47
Chicken murder so why don't you go and arrest him and give me that money well that's when investigators can go no well
00:34:54
what else did he supposedly tell you do you know where the murder weapon is and so on you need to give us something here
00:35:01
before we're just going to open up our pockets and and uh well more importantly go and arrest this man and then take him
00:35:08
to court now we'll get into the hold back information here in this case in a bit because this is to me a very
00:35:16
fascinating aspect of this case it's because things were done just a little differently here in the Browns Chicken
00:35:25
case some details that were not held back however and that were released to the public through the media were we learned
00:35:36
just like the captain had said that all of the victims had been shot to death the one victim also had their throat cut
00:35:44
we also learned very early on that some of the victims had multiple gunshot wounds and also that a bloody broom was
00:35:53
recovered at the scene and the locals put put a lot of speculation into this bloody broom and wondered what kind of
00:36:02
killer would have stuck around in an attempt to clean up the scene or why the the broom would have been bloodied at
00:36:09
all we don't get any information from law enforcement as to why they believe that the the broom was had a significant
00:36:19
amount of blood on it I think anytime that there's a crime that's committed at a place of work it can blur the lines of
00:36:26
what the motive is there could be a motive of Revenge there could have been a motive of just simply we're going to
00:36:35
rob this place and we're going to leave no eyewitnesses but there are times where we've seen in cases where the
00:36:45
motive is Revenge or the motive is murder and well we're we're here so we might as well just take some cash with
00:36:52
us as we go I want to stay at the crime scene here for a bit captain and discuss
00:36:57
one what the detectives are looking for and two a reminder every crime scene is unique every crime is unique it's not
00:37:06
like playing a video game and once you've conquered a few levels well you're just playing those levels again
00:37:12
remember when we were kids after a while you know everything you knew everything
00:37:17
there was to know about let's say Mario World right you you play those boards once you've conquered them once you've
00:37:26
defeated them you can forever go through those boards and there is zero mystery left to you now you don't have that in
00:37:37
real life or in these investigations you don't solve a few murders and then get called to a scene and now with your
00:37:45
experience a murder scene holds no secrets to you so every crime scene is different every case is unique of course
00:37:52
your experience can only help you going forward but again you still still have to unlock the secrets of the crime scene
00:37:59
now one simple thing here one simple fact that holds true of every crime scene investigation is that you are
00:38:07
looking for anything that is foreign to the scene itself that could be connected
00:38:13
or traced back to the perpetrator it could be anything maybe it's something obvious like in the Idaho case that one
00:38:22
for foreign item was a sheath from a knife detectives knew the the victims were attacked with a knife and we find
00:38:30
no knife at the scene but oh what is this sheath doing here so that's an example of something very obvious now we
00:38:38
could also be talking about something that is not obvious at all take for example the 1986 Jessica Gutierrez case
00:38:47
where that one foreign item or your one clue all the evidence they had there was one single thumb
00:38:56
print that was found on a window frame so much harder to find and by the way that episode we
00:39:04
covered that episode in the garage it's Jessica Gutierrez episode number 48 with
00:39:09
a follow-up episode on off the Record episode number 147 now while the fingerprint Captain is
00:39:17
obviously so much more difficult to find the great thing about the fingerprint is
00:39:25
that God bless it the finger print is so incredibly unique so that is very good evidence because you're not only looking
00:39:32
for that foreign item at the scene left inadvertently or otherwise by the perpetrator but you need to be able to
00:39:38
connect that item or Trace that item back to your per a fingerprint is great evidence
00:39:46
because you have fingerprint databases and because you can't take someone's fingerprint from one place and put it
00:39:54
somewhere else remember it's not just about learning who did what it's being able to prove it a good detective is
00:40:01
always thinking about the court and making sure his actions her actions hold up in
00:40:07
court and get the conviction the fingerprint then proves that that person that individual was at this location
00:40:16
period now one thing that was unique in this case was the location of the bodies
00:40:23
so you're at an immediate disadvantage because of the number of victims but here you have an
00:40:32
advantage to the bodies uh to where the bodies were found we have them found in a cooler and a freezer so in this case
00:40:42
you have the luxury of taking much more time at the crime scene because the bodies are secure and in the cooler or
00:40:53
the freezer will help with preservation on some level so you have two key factors that
00:40:59
determine how quickly body should be removed from a crime scene one is the security of the scene or the security of
00:41:07
the bodies two is weather you don't want weather to disturb your crime scene disturb the bodies
00:41:16
here neither is a concern now do we have any information on if these victims were
00:41:22
killed where they were found or were these victims moved moved after they were murdered there was a lot of
00:41:29
evidence pointing to them being killed exactly where they were found now think about this when you're thinking of crime
00:41:37
scenes if if I could apply science fiction to real life here for a second ideally you would want investigators
00:41:45
would want to be able to freeze an entire crime scene Forever Frozen in time undisturbed so it could be visited
00:41:52
over and over again if necessary right but of course we can't do that so you have to get it right you have a ticking
00:42:01
clock hanging over your heads counting down the minutes remaining for you to do so for you to get it right and until
00:42:07
that crime scene has to be disrupted by removing the bodies and removing law enforcement and the technicians and
00:42:15
investigators from the scene itself now in this case 1993 suburb of Chicago keep
00:42:23
in mind blood evidence blood spatter evidence spatter investigative techniques were
00:42:29
very much in Vogue at this time these were techniques that were being used to better understand crime scenes and trace
00:42:36
evidence back to perpetrators they had been using this evidence for depending on the department depending on the law
00:42:44
enforcement agencies and their resources for about 10 years or so maybe longer in
00:42:51
better equipped agencies what they were learning and what they were doing with this information was this was helping
00:43:00
them to better understand the crime scene and track down the perpetrators but because of this they also understood
00:43:09
that there would be future advancements in technology they knew that crime scene
00:43:15
detection that things like blood saliva skin cells and other things will eventually lead to DNA work being
00:43:23
applied to investigations right they were already talking about it specifically in this case and of course
00:43:30
other cases as well but were unable to use DNA at that point but it's absolutely brilliant that this was
00:43:38
already on their minds already something that they were looking forward to in this case and in other cases to solve
00:43:47
homicides now do we have any information because we know all the victims were shot where all the bullets
00:43:56
of the same type this is something that was a little bit tricky in the hold back
00:44:05
information so one thing that was interesting here was that it was reported that police believe that two
00:44:15
guns were used in the commission of these crimes what we ultimately learn is no that wasn't the case it was a
00:44:27
it was one gun a 38 caliber what's tricky here is I don't think that this was information that was fed to the
00:44:38
media from law enforcement I think that this was something that some reporter or
00:44:43
somebody just kind of came up with ran the idea or suggested this theory that two guns were used and police thought no
00:44:52
need to correct them no need to sort that out and straight straighten that out for them that now becomes hold back
00:44:58
information for us that only we only believe that one gun was used so obviously when you have seven victims
00:45:05
and and this news is coming out to locals the fear level goes through the roof because we don't know if it's a
00:45:14
robbery that went bad or like we said a Revenge killing or just some psychopath or Psychopaths on the loose and a spree
00:45:24
killing a lot of the locals started saying well this is due to a lack of security to this business yeah and
00:45:32
you're going to have this right PE people want to throw blame around this is a huge tragedy everybody's hurt
00:45:38
everybody's heartbroken we want answers why the hell did this happen how can we prevent this going forward and of course
00:45:46
the first thing that's pointed out as you said Captain was this belief in a lot in a lack of security at the Browns
00:45:54
Chicken restaurant and and you know what they're they're right I can't say that that was the whole driving force behind
00:46:01
whatever happened here but it is obvious that you do have a lack of security and
00:46:07
we know that because we talked about that quote unquote back door technically a side door but a door that is accessed
00:46:16
by workers and in and out constantly now I will say this in Brown's defense that's extremely common again I've
00:46:24
worked at a bunch of restaur I the majority of them had a door that was always unlocked if there was
00:46:30
somebody in the building that door was unlocked usually it is a back door or a side door now some of the places that
00:46:38
I've worked will have like a surrounding either fence or wall brick wall where yes there's
00:46:48
no cover from overhead right but you have to be let in through a locked space and then you can access that door
00:46:59
that remains unlocked well one of the first things that I thought when examining this case was when I worked at
00:47:07
a bank depending on where the branch was if we had a bunch of employees that had
00:47:12
their cars in the parking lot we were supposed to keep those doors locked until all the procedures were done but
00:47:18
if you trying to be a good manager and this is 1993 I don't think anybody had remote
00:47:25
starts on their car so in January around the Chicago area it's going to be pretty
00:47:31
cold so is it possible that they let people out to go start their car and then come back in that that's one of the
00:47:38
things I initially uh was interested in in this case yeah and you're right you want to figure out when the perpetrators
00:47:46
gain access to the restaurant was it before they closed and locked the front doors let's say or was it after the
00:47:54
closing time now again that back door what they're calling the back door remained unlocked
00:48:00
the other problems there were some other problems with security here at this particular restaurant one we have owners
00:48:08
leaving with money right now that's not terribly uncommon managers often leave with money as well but that is something
00:48:15
to consider when looking at the overall security of your business it's very easy
00:48:21
to intercept somebody with a large amount of cash when they are exiting the building before they get to their
00:48:28
vehicle so here the owners usually took the money home with them or would deposit it at the bank on their way home
00:48:36
another problem is the safe itself was visible to customers from the counters where customers would go up to order
00:48:46
their food and purchase their food right and also the other thing look it's 1993
00:48:51
it's not it's not 1945 there were no security cameras in this restaurant and I that's something I
00:49:00
just do not understand and I I get it it's 1993 it's significantly different than things are in
00:49:07
2023 but not having security cameras yes they would have been rather expensive at
00:49:12
the time but we do ads for it and recommend things like simply safe and ADT we're very lucky to have had them as
00:49:21
sponsors on our show and we are huge proponents here at the garage because look of all these things that we talk
00:49:29
about we are recommending to everybody secure your home secure your businesses get security cameras put security
00:49:37
protocols into place because here's the thing sometimes it's not about capturing
00:49:45
what happened or having a recording of what happened it's also a major deterrent to somebody to come in and do
00:49:55
something something like this or attempt to rob a [Music] place want to thank everybody for
00:50:13
joining us here in the garage make sure you subscribe to the show so many people
00:50:19
listening that don't subscribe and it really helps the channel grow it's such an intriguing case make sure you join us
00:50:27
back here for the conclusion tomorrow right here in the garage until then be good be kind and don't
00:50:33
[Music] [Applause] look [Music] you can start your day off right when you find a professional on Angie to get
00:51:15
your plumbing right first connect with skilled professionals to get all your home projects done well
00:51:21
visit angie.com you can do this when you Angie that