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[music] [music] [music] All right. Howdy, partner. >> Welcome on in. >> Welcome on.
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>> Come on in. >> Come to the garage. >> Don't let the door hit you. I love when
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people say your guys' accent cracks me up. >> Well, it cracks me up, too. >> Smalter. Did you fer?
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>> Well, when you when you grew up watching this much HeiHehaw, >> they call me Heihaw.
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>> Yeah. [laughter] >> Which I It must have been really funny back then. Maybe it was never funny. I
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don't I don't know. I don't I don't know that I ever got that. >> We were probably just too little. But
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but sometimes when you watch shows that you thought were funny for the you know as an adult you're like why did I laugh
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at this? >> I used to think this was great. >> Shows you thought were funny when you
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were a child. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I'll skater. But on the land of I think we've talked about this before,
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but if you're going to make a a true crime documentary, if you're going to cover a case, one of
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the the best things you can do is is get subjects that talk a little funny >> is de Yeah. Develop an Ohio accent. No,
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like with the West Memphis 3, it it made a little twist to the story and uh and it almost seemed like it put it Well,
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because we're not from that area, it seemed like it kind of puts it in a little box. Everybody becomes in that
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little world. >> Yeah. >> And um but yeah, so we're talking about the Stephen Avery case this week. There
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was some news. There was a confession. Um, >> is this Do you think that this news is
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like super widespread? >> It is because Well, what what's strange is >> cuz I'm on I'm on the internet all the
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time and I don't think I've seen any >> Well, that's the thing. >> Pop-ups. >> I didn't see any popups about it.
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>> I was told of this by you which which was >> which was sent by a listener like, "Hey,
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have you checked this out?" Now, normally when something like this happens, maybe you get 10, 20
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uh emails or direct messages on social media. I only got like one or two. >> That's why I'm questioning if this is
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like widespread or do you think that it's like >> I think it is because when I Google
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searched it, it was like pages and pages of like Inside Edition, uh the Today Show, like CNN. There's a bunch of
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people that at least covered the story. Do you think that maybe the interest level is
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kind of kind of bouncing around in the middle of of the meter there because it's kind of a we have some new
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information. There's a break in the case. Oh, we got to wait to find out if it's true. Well, so what happened was
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what happened was they had Stephen Avery's uh attorney come came out and I believe on Sunday she or Saturday night
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she actually posted a Twitter message saying here's the confession. I believe she actually showed a picture of the
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front of the letter. Um, >> so but she even said this might not matter at all >> and and there's going to be a lot more
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work that we have to do on this and she didn't seem that confident. So for for somebody that if anybody knows
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anything about her um they know that she's a very confident person. Kathleen Zelner,
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amazing uh attorney, and I just like the way she views a lot of things. So, the fact that she came out and said, "Look,
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there's this there's a new documentary that's being made, and I think it's by a different set of team than who made
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Making a Murder, but I believe >> it's a series called Convicting a Murder, >> I believe. So, and it seems like they've
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been doing research on on the documentary for about 18 months, and they got a known uh killer from
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Wisconsin. Through their research, he confessed to the crime, meaning that Steven Avery would be innocent, meaning
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that Brandon Dassie would be innocent, meaning that he would have been the one that killed Theresa Halbach.
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I do want to point out that I feel that Katherine Zelner, did I say her name right?
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>> Yeah. >> Okay. I believe her to be of of great integrity as well. And that's why I I I
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love following her. I love that she is on this case. She strikes me as the type of defense attorney that would probably
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walk away from somebody that she believed to be guilty unless she can represent them in that fashion.
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>> Right. >> Um, and I say that because a case we covered, the uh Tony Muny, which was a Columbus
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case, it's it's unsolved. It's incredibly cold by this time. It's I think it was 1983.
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There was a a suspect that was named as a suspect in the papers in our Columbus newspapers here. He was considered a
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suspect because he was a bit of a traveling serial killer and he he targeted uh children or boys the age
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roughly the age of Tony Muny, >> right? Katherine Zelner represented him. And actually what she did was was not
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only represent him in in court, but she also got him to confess to future or future to other uh murders and other
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crimes. and she convinced him to to give a list, provide a list to her that, you
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know, and and that's kind of an old story, but that's really where her, if you want to call it fame, kind of
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started. That's where she became a household name in Illinois, I believe. And so, this is really interesting that
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this has come about because this could mean that there's a confession to the murder of Terresa Hallback. Uh there's
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some some things right away and I had not read the confession or didn't know the details of of such, but you and I
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had an interesting conversation before we flipped on the mics that my immediate thought was I I pointed out I
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said Katherine Zelner has offered or her team has offered a reward for information in the case.
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>> Yeah. And that and that is what the >> the confession starts off with one attorney Kathleen or yeah Kathleen
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Zelner and it's saying I am making a claim to your reward offer for the information in the Stephen Avery case.
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>> I would like the money. >> Yeah, that's what it starts off with. So that shows you the motive.
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I don't know why she Okay, maybe it was starting to get leaked out and that's why uh Zelnner posted this.
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That's what I'm guessing. Um I'm trying to blow it up so I can actually I know on oxygen.com
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there's actually um says I'm making the claim to your reward for the information in the Stephen Avery
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case. I've been trying to contact you by phone and through a friend and a family
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member, but seem to get nowhere. It's hard to read because it's >> it's a picture of and you have to zoom
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in. >> Yeah. And it's uh I wanted to say it was in cursive, but it's not it's uh but it's kind of it's
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not the clearest handwriting. Do you write in cursive? No, I speak in cursive though.
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>> Okay. Uh but yeah. So I but but I again I'm fascinated by this because you can make claims all day and want to
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try to get that money, but if you can't prove it, and I think that's kind of what Zelner is saying. If
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this guy can't prove it, then you know this is just nonsense and who cares and we need to move on. So
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>> likely my my gut tells me it's a lie. You know, unless we see some some information like you said and like she's
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saying, unless there's some way of backing up some of the story, it sounds like >> the the inmate, which they've not named
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the inmate, right? >> No, they have. the they have >> Yeah. >> Okay. Sorry. The article I read said
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that they would not name the inmate until such and such. >> Well, that's why I think this blew up
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because it it started leaking. And so then of course it gets uh the inmate who identifies himself as Joseph Evans.
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>> Oh. >> Started off his letter by stating, "I making a claim to your reward." The
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information in the Steven Avery case. Uh, but it says October 31st, 2005. I was on my way home back from Shabboan.
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And as as I was >> Shabboan, that's where the um John Candy in Home Alone where his uh uh poker band
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was from. >> Remember she hitch your ride? She had a hitch a ride. I'm trying to uh
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>> So, this dude's a convicted killer, correct? This Joseph Evans or who identifies himself as Joseph Evans?
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>> Yeah, as I was It's hard. I can't make I need to make this damn thing bigger. I
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can't see it. Uh, zoom in. >> Okay, while while you're figuring it out, let me go through this. It says,
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"Joseph Evans, a Wisconsin prisoner serving life imprisonment for murdering his wife."
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Yeah. So, yeah. So, on my way back from Shabboan and as I was coming, that would be the word, coming
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into Manito, I went out to Avery Savage uh Savageard. Salvage art. >> Salvage. Sorry. Savage. It's both. It's
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a salvage and savage art. >> It truly is. You're You're right on both. Both. >> It's just so weird because like
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if you saw the letter, like from a distance, it looks kind of clean, but it's just just little things like his
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his O looks like a I there. So, uh, [sighs] he was coming into, uh, he decided to go
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out to the salvage yard to see if they had a cover lens for the front passenger side.
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Uh, I I'm guessing that's >> for his headlight or something. >> Yeah. So, it was for the light because my wife
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hit a car just weeks earlier and I needed to replace my back window on my Chevy Tahoe.
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So, when I went out there, I was told to go out in the yard and talk to a person named Earl or something like
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that. So, I drove and that's there might be more pictures of this letter, but this is the only one I'm seeing. I think
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they don't want to release >> cuts off >> everything. Um but on oxygen.com because
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I want to give them at least credit says that um and his letter uh you know he's serving
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life sentence for killing his wife like you said claims he was stopped he stopped at the salvage yard looking for
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parts for his wife's car. He wrote that he visited the same day as Halbach. Uh he was and she was there taking
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photos of the car for her job. He claims that he was driving through the property. Halbox stepped in front of his
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car and he hit her causing her to fall and strike her head on a large rock. He said that he got out to check on her.
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She was dead so he put her in in her rav before driving her up to the Avery home
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for help. Nobody was there. He wrote uh that he panicked, drank some brandy, and
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swallowed some pills before entering um Avery's unlocked trailer home where he claims he stole Avery's rifle. He
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wrote that he pulled Halbach's body out of her car, shot her three times, though
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he didn't explain why since she was supposedly dead already, and then he put her body back in the car. Evans wrote
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that he then uh burned her body in a burn barrel on the property all while drinking brandy and consuming more
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pills. Now, a lot of this to me sounds like nonsense, but the fact that you start going,
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"Well, he's consuming a bunch of pills and drinking." But okay, so he was convicted in 2009
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for killing his 40-year-old wife in 2008. >> Yeah. >> He claims that he accidentally shot his
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wife, but we know that eventually he's convicted of her murder, serving life in prison.
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>> Uh I I don't know what order any of this stuff is taking place in the the letter
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to Katherine Zelner, but >> that's not clear. Yeah. >> Yeah. It's kind of you're getting little
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snippets, but here's a snippet that I found. This is according to patch.com. >> Old patch.com.
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>> Yeah. Patchadams.com. >> All right. >> It says, and this is a quote. Don't anybody get mad at me. I didn't say
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this. Joseph Evans said it. >> Oh god. >> Don't hear what I'm not saying. [laughter]
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Uh, it says, quote, "Keep your panties on and your skirt down because I'm not out to screw you. This is a deal
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relationship. you, me, you'll win when I give all up and the full cover up story
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that took place and how the state and others used me to get to Steve. I'm done with all that. I'm jumping ship to look
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out for myself and my children and eight grandchildren. Your choice. I'm already
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set. Now it's up to you for the next move. So, so at some point in this letter, he's claiming that
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>> he was aware of the cover up and involved >> Yeah. >> in the cover up. >> Well, here's one problem that he's
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facing is this jack ass wagon face. Um is this is letter is to Zelner. You know, keep your panties on. I'm not
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trying to [ __ ] you. Well, guess what, Joseph Evans? You ain't that smart. You're not smarter than Zelner. So, if
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you are telling the truth, she will get all the piece of of evidence that she needs, which is great.
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Uh, if it's true. And if you're lying, she will figure out that you're lying and you'll get nothing. and and now you
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just promoted your people now kind of know who you are now. Uh so good, you just promoted yourself as a scumbag. But
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the letter goes on to request I think a $2,000 down payment. Um and he also requests uh a4 million
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instead of $100,000 originally offered. But son of Sam Laws, he wants to give this money to his kids and his
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grandchildren probably, >> right? >> Because he's not going to be able to. >> So this patch.com patchadoms.com
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>> patchadams >> has um one, two, three, four, five, six, seven. It has counting exercises. No,
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it's has seven um snippets of the confession letter if people want to get on there and and read more of that.
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Yeah. So, I guess um that Joseph at some point uh mailed uh different letters to
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several local news outlets in 2016 claiming claiming that Avery had confessed to him during their time as
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cellmates that he killed Halbach during the um during that time. So, okay. Oh, we we
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have a guy now confessing wanting money and but this guy earlier was saying that
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Avery confessed to him. So that it's it's very strange. >> Very strange. And but
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>> I'll tell you how strange it is or if it's if it's just pathetic, right? >> Right. I get that. But it's also like
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one of those things. It's it's he this this asshole's got nothing to lose. He's like, you know what I mean? He's
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probably thinking, "What are they going to do to me? give me another life sentence. I'm I'm stuck in here
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regardless. Maybe I can get some money for my family. The problem with that th this is how a lot of these dudes
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operate. They're just they're [snorts] self-centered. They care nothing about anybody else. And it's it's making a
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name for himself. It's it's getting his fat picture in the papers. And it's it's
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it's disgusting. And it and it is sad. And here's the other bad part of it. If Stephen Avery is guilty of
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>> Yeah. >> Theresa Halbach's murder, then you're putting a very dangerous person back out
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in society. >> And it's not that simple. They don't want Steven to go. We know that.
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>> Uh Zelnner is not an idiot. Like I said, I mean it. Look, if it was another lawyer on this case, they would be
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going, "We have a guy confessing, >> right?" And that's why I'm glad that it's her on this case. And I'm glad that
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this this what I called a strange situation is now in her hands. I have full faith and confidence that she will
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handle it brilliantly and and handle it the best way that anybody possibly could. She'll get to the truth and that
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that's so for the people that think that Avery might be innocent or think that he
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might be guilty. I think you you can take you can take a whole bunch of good feelings out of
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knowing that that Zelner is the one working. Uh and I understand that she's working on his defense, but
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>> yeah, >> there there's a lot of slime balls out there and I don't believe she is one of
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them. >> Okay, so Newsweek reported this is just in a tweet. making a murderer uh
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confession may be false, but Kathleen Zelner says helpful tips have been shared. Okay. Um
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on the 24th she put all you need to know about the confession and then she posted a link.
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Um, yeah, it's basically saying that that that the confess confessor has no credibility.
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Um, but again, >> did you see did you see his picture? Did you see his mug shot?
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>> I want to punch him in the face. >> He [laughter] looks like somebody you want to kick.
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>> Yeah, I would like to kick him right in the throat. >> Hey, spread your legs, son.
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going to kick you in the grundle. Um, no. It's It's weird because there's a part of me that goes, "Ah, this is
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stupid." And my >> It's interesting, isn't it? Stupid. >> Well, I mean, just we have there's been
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several cases that people have, you know, made weird false confessions to and they didn't go anywhere and it's
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just a distraction of getting to the truth. But there, but again, I love the fact that Zelner is on the case because
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she'll get to the bottom of the confession and if I mean, she's she's so good that she could probably get the guy
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if he's not telling the truth to be like, "Yeah, you're right. I I watched the documentary and I decided to get
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involved." >> Um, but also if if it was true that, like you said, if it's not true, she's
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not going to just go to the end of the earth to try to get her client free, >> right? Um, and so yeah,
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>> she's not the type to push forward uh these these crazy claims and outrageous
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>> Yeah. >> theories. >> And I think that's the thing though, too, that people always wondered uh and
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we talked about with the OJ case, there was so much evidence against OJ, but there was also evidence of a cover up.
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There was also evidence of tampering with evidence. So, it can be both happening at the same time. And the more
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I've watched and I don't want to go back I cuz I I just went back and watched the
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Adnon four-part series. I don't want to go back and watch Making a Murderer uh cuz it just takes so long and you just
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go down all these rabbit holes. But just from what we've learned from her team and and some other people, this didn't
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go down in the manner in which they they first originally claimed. And we know that for a fact. So,
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what is the true story? Don't know. Um, and is Stephen Avery uh guilty of it? Um, don't know. I don't
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know. But it's uh it's very confusing and and hopefully we get some more answers.
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>> Yeah. Yeah. And I I I I know that we will. I I feel very confident that we will. I don't know.
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>> But I'm hoping this whole thing is not completely bogus and it's just a guy trying to get some attention and trying
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to outsmart people to get some money cuz one he like I said he won't outsmart him
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which is I know but if it is but maybe there's something there just like she said maybe the confession is [ __ ]
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but maybe there is something there that we just get more answers. So, if I got this correct, he originally states that
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Stephen Avery confessed to him. >> Yeah. It seems like there was a claim in like 2016
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>> and then then he his new story is I did it. Could >> I'm wondering have we had any anybody
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publicly say that the two were actually >> cellmates >> cellmates or had access to one another?
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It seems that I it doesn't seem that oxygen.com is confirming it, but it seems like they're
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>> they're pushing that. >> They're led to believe that that was uh something that was true for but again,
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it could have been for 3 days or we're moving this prisoner around. So, you're here for a week,
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>> right? >> Who knows, >> right? [music] >> [music]