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Heat. Heat. Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks
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for listening. I'm your host, Nick, and with me is a man that may not have both ores in the water, but we put him in
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charge of this garage ship anyway. He is the captain. I don't really know what a
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ore is. It's good to be seen and it's good to see you. Thank you, Jim. Tonight we are drinking 100 million
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angels singing garage 4 and a half bottle caps out of five. Check out this very smooth double IPA brewed by the
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fine people of the Texas Ale Project and beautiful Dallas, Texas. And 100 million
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angel singing is brought to us by Jennifer in Lexenberg, Wisconsin. Hello, Wisconsin.
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Next up, we have Kelly and Parts Unknown. Captain, our show has inspired me. I think that you and I should buy a
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big plot of land and we'll start up our own township. We'll call the town Parts Unknown. We'll invite everyone to come
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live there with us. And then, of course, we'll build a wall around it. >> No. And it'll just be And no houses
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allowed, only garages. Uh, next up we have Blair in Atlanta. Blair follows us on Instagram. She's one of your
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followers there, Captain. We also have another loyal Instagram follower. This is Christa from Delcab, Illinois.
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>> Hello, Christa. >> We also have Jana from Minnesota who says, "Try Bigwood Brewery. They have a
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coffee stout called Morningwood that we we should be trying." >> Well, the funny thing was my nickname in
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high school was Bigwood and your nickname in high school was Morningwood. Top of the morning to you. And last but
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not least, we have a birthday shout out. I have a message to pass along here, Captain. So, here it goes. This is to
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JL. Happy birthday. Here's to another year of just rolling with it. That's from MK. That's Julie from Michael. I
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don't know if I was supposed to say that last part, but it's too late now. So, thank you to everybody for helping out
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this week. And if you want to buy us some beers for next week, go to true crimegar.com and click on the donate
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button. And we like your jib. That's what we do. Was that a Mr. Miyagi jib? Hey. All right. Do you want to grab a
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chair? How about a beer? How about we talk some true crime? Hey. All right, everybody. Grab a chair. Grab a beer.
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Let's talk some true crime. Brandon Lawson, an oil field worker and father of four, was last seen when he
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left his San Angelo, Texas home on August 8th, 2013 while traveling on Highway 27. 77. He
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ran out of gas. He called 911 and he has not been seen since. His cell phone is also missing. Brandon is a Caucasian
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male. He was 26 years of age at the time of his disappearance. Brandon is 5'9 in
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tall, 230 lb with brown hair and blue eyes. He was last seen wearing a yellow shirt and camo shorts and white Nike Air
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Max shoes. If you have any information, go to missingbrandonlawson.com. All right, where we left off, we were
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dissecting Brandon Lawson's 911 phone call. >> This has been at the center of this
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mystery. A lot of people have speculated if you could just figure out what he is
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saying during that 911 call, we could figure out what happened to Brandon, what he was afraid of, and maybe where
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he is today. >> So, let's take a listen to that 911 call. And this is going to be in its
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original form. 9 2,13 0 50 and 38 seconds. 91 emergency. >> Yes, I'm in the middle of the field.
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It's safe. We're just pushing some guys over right here going toward Javelin on both sides. My truck ran out of gas.
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There's one car here. Got to take the woods. Please turn. >> Okay, now run that by me. We're not
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talking to him. I accidentally ran into him. >> Ah, you ran into him. Okay. >> Got the first guy.
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>> Do you need an ambulance? >> Yeah. No, I need the cops. >> Okay. Is anybody hurt?
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Hello. Hello. Hello. 9 2,13 0 50 and 38 seconds 91 emergency. >> Yes, I'm in the middle of the field.
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We're just push some guys over right here going towards Javelin on both sides. My truck ran out of gas. There's
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one car here the woods. Please hurry. >> Okay, now run that by me talking to him.
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I accidentally ran into him. >> Oh, you ran into him. Okay. >> Do you need an ambulance?
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>> Yeah. No, I need to call. >> Okay. Is anybody hurt? Hello. Hello. Hello. Here's where we're at, Captain. We got
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through the first what I would call first two sentences. >> Mhm. >> And what we what we believe we're
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hearing there is yes, I'm in the middle of the field. State trooper pulled some guys over.
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>> Where we got hung up is what I would call the third sentence. And that was the we're out here, they're out here
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going towards Alberlin or GA Gavlin. >> Yeah. >> Uh >> on both sides. >> On both sides. So let's let's hear that.
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Let's hear what we're calling the third sentence and try to break that down. out here going towards a on both sides.
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Out here going toward both sides. >> So what I'm hearing here is I I hear they're out here going toward blank on
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both sides. They're out here going towards Gavlin on both sides, which Gavelin doesn't really register with
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anything >> right to us, >> right? But are you hearing the same they're out here? I think it sounds more
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like we're out here. >> We're out here going towards blank on both sides, right? Which which seems
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>> which either way whether you whe whether we go with what you think it is or what
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I think it is, it still gives us, you know, kind of a parameter of what where it makes sense as far as a conversation.
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>> Yeah. But going towards something on both sides, what does that mean? Does that mean because there I'm picturing
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like two vehicles going in opposite direction on on the same road. You know that that
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you can't be going towards the same thing facing opposite directions, >> right? It's a it's a little unclear
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>> and unless unless he's talking about people being over on the side of the road,
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>> right? >> They're on both sides. Maybe one one's pulled over on one side of the road,
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one's pulled over on the other side of the road. You know, that's the best I can come up
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with there. Either they're out here going toward blank on both sides or we're out here going towards blank on
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both sides. >> Both sides, right? We we both agree on the both sides. So, let's play the next
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clip and see if that clears the air on anything. >> My truck ran out of gas. There's one car
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here. You got to check the wood. My truck ran out of gas. There's one car here. got chased to the woods.
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>> So, I'm hearing here, "My truck ran out of gas." >> Mhm. >> And someone got chased to the woods or I
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got chased into the woods. >> It sounds like he's saying woods at the end there. But we we do have a little
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information going into listening to this 911 call. We know that his truck ran out
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of gas, so that makes it kind of easy to hear, but I but I think we could hear it
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in a in a slowed version. >> My truck ran out of gas. There's one car here. Guys taking the woods
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ran out of gas. There's one car here. You guys chasing the woods. Now that sounds completely different to me when
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you slow it down like that because now I'm hearing there's one car here. >> Mhm.
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>> It almost sounds like there's one car here. Guys chased him to the woods. Yeah. I'm going to play you something
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that I found interesting when I was dissecting it. If you take the part that everybody it seems like on the internet
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agrees upon is my truck ran out of gas. Now I'm just going to loop the my >> sir.
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>> When you slow down that beginning part the my to me sounds more like a a f is
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coming out. So it's almost front truck ran out of gas. >> Uh now I don't know how much I actually
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buy that. Uh, I I think it's I think some of that is when you are slowing things down, it starts kind of messing
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with your head a little bit. >> There's there's a couple things in there um that that I question right away. So
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it, you know, we've said he sounds to be out of breath, and it almost sounds to me that when he's talking to the
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dispatcher, >> that some of these words are distorted because he's like he's inhaling and
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exhaling as he's saying these words, >> right? >> And therefore with with me, I do hear
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the f but but it almost sounds like that part of that is him kind of exhaling into the word.
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>> Yeah. Um, I just want to point it out, not so much to say, hey, look, I think
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he's saying front, more to point out the idea that when you do slow down and you
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start manipulating these things, you're going to hear things just way different than you're normally used to hearing
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something. So again, a my starts sound like front truck. >> Yeah. >> But we do know from, you know, his calls
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to other people that his truck did run out of gas. So my makes a lot more sense. Again, take into account that
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this guy's scared. >> And now, now you got to take into a couple accounts. One, is he scared
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because there's these guys here and this and this state trooper pulled these people over or somebody pulled them
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over. >> You know, it it's very possible that he says state trooper, but for some reason he says state
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trooper. >> He maybe he only thinks it's a state trooper. It's out there. It's dark. It's
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the middle of the night. Who knows how long he's been up. Maybe it's a security car or something with lights on it you
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would think was a cop car or a state trooper. >> Well, there's a lot of old cop cars that
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they sell to people that don't have the red and blue lights, but they still have
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the giant spot. >> Yeah. >> So, by having the spotlight, maybe he thinks, "Oh, well, this this thing
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happened and somebody shined a spot. This is a state trooper or this is a police officer." Blue spot.
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>> Mhm. Well, >> can I get a blue spot? Well, the the other thing here too, Captain, is that
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I'm thinking like, okay, and I know I shouldn't do this. I said throw everything out and and create with a
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blank canvas and kind of figure out just let your ears tell you what he's saying.
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Don't put any preconceived notions to any of it. But, however, this portion is so garbled to me that I almost have to
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use what I think I'm hearing and apply the the previous things to it. So, again, my truck ran out of gas. We know
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he ran out of gas. And if we if we believe our first two sentences, yes, I'm in the middle of the field. Staper
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state trooper pulled some guys over. What what I'm going at with that is that that that last line I'm getting guys
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chased him to the woods. And the reason why I'm kind of coming up with that is he's already referred to a group of
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people as guys earlier. >> Um there's one car here. If we're right that he pulled some guys over, we would
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assume that there's one car here. And meaning there's one car that it's not marked. It's not the state troopers car,
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>> right? Or since he's calling four cops, he's saying, "Hey, look, there's one there's one cop car here."
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>> Well, that's a possibility as well. And then, but where I'm going is guys chased
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him to the woods. >> Well, the only he refers to the group of guys as guys. So, if he uses that same
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word again to to describe these unknown people to him where he says him, I kind of believe that he might be talking
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about the state trooper because he's already kind of identified him specifically as a state trooper,
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>> right? >> You know, um you know, he pulled some guys over, state trooper pulled some
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guys over, guys chased him to the woods. >> Yeah. So, I think as you know, we're not
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going to figure it all out, but let's start with the idea that there's him, there's state trooper, and there's guys,
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>> at least two, right? >> So, in this story, we possibly have four, maybe five, cuz maybe there's
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somebody with the the state trooper. >> Let's dive into the next line. >> Please hurry.
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>> Well, that's very clear. You know, he's saying, "Please hurry." That's very easy
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for us to detect right there. Let's connect it to the previous line to see if it helps us out any ran out of gas.
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There's one car here to the woods. My truck ran out of gas. There's one car here to the woods. Please turn.
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>> Okay. A couple initial thoughts when I listen to the whole phrase when he states uh the guy chased him. There's
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like a kind of pause. >> If there was going to be a edit, that's a time for a edit. But what we can
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clearly hear is, and what I mean by edit is that there's some odd stuff happening
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as far as the audio clip goes. >> Okay? >> Where it's like it kind of sounds clipped, not so, you know, uh, he is
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running out of breath, >> right? >> And I think that's clear and so we got to take that into account. But that
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little phrase, it's kind of clipped. So it's almost like maybe there's an edit there. If there was going to be edit
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there, that would make it make the the clip part would make sense if there was an edit. Uh but again, with his
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breathing pattern being so kind of erratic and he's like forcing himself to talk and and still trying to catch his
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breath, it's hard to know for sure. You know what's weird here? I almost feel like he's started running again at
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around this line like because this line is so like the pause you said in the breathing heavy. I almost feel like he
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stopped to to make this 911 call. He thought he could make the call very quickly.
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>> He's very afraid of something that's going on out there and so he's he's trying to stay on the move. It's almost
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like he's at the end of what he's going to tell the dispatcher. He thinks he's provided enough information, right, for
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them to send some help and he's going to get on the move again. Please hurry. You
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know, meaning that he he did I think he was so afraid that he didn't want to he had to weigh. Do I stop running to make
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a phone call and try to save myself or or does that put me in more danger? almost like, "All right, I'll make this
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phone call and man, as soon as this thing's done, I'm gonna start up running again."
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>> I haven't done any kind of forensic audio before, >> but a lot of people when they're talking
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about the the transcription is, you know, the the issue is anytime she talks, we know what she's saying. We
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know what the dispatcher is saying. Not a lot of people have been diving into what he's saying, why she's talking.
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>> Yeah. Let me >> So, the next line is her talking. And so let's play that line.
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>> Let's play that line and then I got some more questions for you. >> Okay. Now run that by me. We're not
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talking to him. >> Okay. Now run that. >> Can you play that the slow version? >> Okay. Now run that.
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>> Okay. Now run that. >> All right. My first questions that I have for you, Captain, there's a there's
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a couple things here that I want to talk about. First off, >> I'm assuming that she sounds a lot more
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clearer than he does. Obviously, >> is that must be partially because of the recording. We can assume that she's
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being recorded much clearer because she's >> she's she's on a landline. He's on a
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cell phone in in a bad area. As far as cell phone reception goes, >> he's labored breathing,
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>> right? And it's probably when the calls are coming in, it's probably recorded on
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the dispatchers's end. And so probably that would make it clearer, too. >> But furthermore, to make it even harder
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to hear, Brandon, is now you know the way you know the way how an ear responds to certain noises and sounds better than
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the rest of us. someone if someone's talking in a higher pitch compared to Brandon who has a lower tone,
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>> the it's my understanding the higher pitch will be clearer. Is that correct? >> Well, you're right. That's why most
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people don't understand me as well as they understand you because I'm so low and manly and sexy and uh No, no, but it
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just our ears are adapted to hear higher frequencies and the and normally around
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you look at like 5k 6k frequency wise is like roughly the human voice sits nicely
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and kind of is is and that and that frequency can also become piercing as well. Okay. The thing here is so she's
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saying, "Can you run that by me again?" Um, she almost can't get that whole sentence out,
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>> right? She's in the same boat we are. We just can't we can't pick apart everything he's saying.
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>> Yeah. >> And he's out of breath and that's clear. And then he cuts her off and he says
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like the one I'm talking to him, >> he Yeah. He He starts to talk and I can't hear the first word or if he's
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like building up to talk or just breathing. And I hear and we're not talking to him.
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>> Yeah. We're not talking to him or the one I'm talking to him or when I'm talking to him.
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>> Which which is here's the the other thought that I have on this on this particular line.
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>> Mhm. >> This line almost sounds to me like he might be still on the phone with the
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dispatcher but actually talking to somebody else that's in front of him. >> Yeah, it's very possible. and we're not
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talking to him. Um, like somebody else asked him a question because he almost seems to be saying something that
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doesn't go along with what she's asking him. >> And it's almost like he's responding to
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somebody else that's asked him a question. >> Yeah. And I think if somebody asked me
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my final opinion on that line of what he's saying, I'd say it's inaudible to me.
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>> Okay. I'm going I'm going to go with and we're not talking to him. >> And here's the next line.
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I need >> I will do that again. Slowed down. >> I'm hearing not till I ran into him or I
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totally ran into him. >> Mhm. But but the thing I start to question here, Captain, is is he
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correcting himself? I'm almost wondering if maybe that first line maybe he misspoke,
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>> right? >> Because the >> because he's trying to catch his breath. >> We're not talking to him.
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>> I totally ran into him. I you know I >> really close. Yeah. >> Yeah. I wonder if he's almost correcting
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himself that he that he misspoke. Uh partially because the dispatcher is talking. Maybe he's not fully
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registering what's going on. There's a lot going on at the moment for Brandon. >> And I think I that's the only way I can
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almost make sense out of that first line. You know, we're not talking to him. I totally ran into him.
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>> You know what's odd to me? And and maybe you don't find this odd, but it's >> Yeah.
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It's just every time I play the stuff over and over >> like this, it's like it's like it gets
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sadder and sadder >> be because it it sounds more scary the more we dive into it really. I mean, the
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more you like think about the lines and think about what's going on with Brandon,
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>> it does get it does get more sad. it, you know, when you listen to it at full
00:22:59
speed, just once through, it doesn't really hit you yet how scared he sounds until until you really get into it here.
00:23:07
>> And I think it's that just uh that protector in me where you just wish that >> you can it's cuz you're hearing it so it
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feels like it's it's happening right now and that you there's some way that you could help him.
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>> You're exactly right. >> You know, but you can't do anything but just listen and try to dissect. The next
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line we will hear is the dispatcher talking. >> Ah, you ran into him. Okay. Ah, you ran into him. Okay.
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>> So, a lot of people have speculated that they can hear gunshots. I would say that
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you could possibly make something out. There's definitely like a hit in this. Okay.
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>> And it'll happen right after like right when she starts talking. You'll hear >> Oh, you ran into him. Okay.
00:23:51
Oh, you ran into him. Okay. Now, that could be distortion. That could be anything happening. It could be her
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hitting her hand on a desk or or anything. So, >> Brandon could be coughing. You know,
00:24:03
sometimes when you're out of breath, you're running, there's a cough, >> right? And to me, if he was coughing, it
00:24:08
was he's holding the phone away from him when he coughed, which most people would
00:24:12
do. >> Gotcha. >> So, let's dive into the next line. >> Let's hear that again one more time. Got
00:24:23
the first guy. >> Got the first guy. >> Initially what I hear him say is I got the first guy
00:24:32
>> or got the first guy. Now there's a lot of other speculation that people think
00:24:36
he's saying shot the first guy. >> Yeah, that's that's the scary line that a lot of people go to is he shot the
00:24:44
first guy or they shot the first guy. Um, I hear just the first guy like like he's answering the dispatcher when she
00:24:52
goes, "Ah, you ran into him." >> Just the first guy. >> Just the first guy. Um, but I've also
00:24:57
heard people say, "Yes, the first guy." Um, or he got the first guy. You know, remember we're talking maybe somebody
00:25:06
got chased into the woods. He got the first guy. >> Got the first guy or shot the first guy.
00:25:11
I really to me my ear says he's responding to the dispatcher and he's saying just the first guy. Again going
00:25:18
with the thought that there's more than one guy there that he doesn't know or recognize. He can't put a name or title
00:25:25
to these people. >> Mhm. >> And he's clarifying, yeah, I ran into him, but it was just the first guy.
00:25:31
>> There's a couple things I found during this clip when I was like slowing it down and manipulating it more that I
00:25:37
think we'll you'll find pretty interesting. Uh, but we'll get to that right after this quick beer break.
00:26:01
All right, cheers, mates. Let's uh dive into some of the things I find weird about this clip. I'm going to actually
00:26:06
slow it down and let's see if you could see what I'm talking about. Okay. Or I guess here would be the better word.
00:26:22
>> Before he starts talking, there seems to be about three syllables and you can
00:26:26
visually see it on the waveform. Can you just loop that section? That's not Brandon's voice at all. Like,
00:26:39
it doesn't have the same tone. It doesn't like it doesn't even come off to me as if the phone is away from his face
00:26:45
and and you're hearing Brandon talk. It's doesn't sound to me like him at all. >> And we're going to hear another clip
00:26:52
later, a little, you know, not much later where a lot of people speculate that it's another person talking, but
00:26:59
I've never seen on any message board. And now what I did was I took that clip. It's the, you know, the slow down
00:27:06
version. I took that clip and all I did was, you know, cut off the front part and then I added some volume just so you
00:27:12
can hear it. But that's all I did. And it's it's definitely, you know, it's weird cuz I I hear,
00:27:20
you know, God bless you or confession. Yeah, I >> I heard confession, too. Or is that you?
00:27:29
Or >> Yeah. Is that you? >> The thing here that that's even more scary though, Captain,
00:27:35
>> and look, here's what I can tell you just as far as audio engineer goes. Like
00:27:40
a lot of people talk about that if somebody was far away, maybe a couple feet away.
00:27:47
>> They not everything that they register on a cell phone, >> right? >> But this was loud enough that it it
00:27:55
registered a waveform. Like I said before, you can visually see this. >> Yeah, I saw it on your computer right
00:28:01
there. And and I was actually convinced that there was nothing there until you you pointed it out on the computer to
00:28:07
me, slowed it down, and then we hear it. Confession. The And again, it's not Brandon's voice. I I would put my stamp
00:28:16
on that. >> Uh the thing that scares me big time is >> What would your stamp say?
00:28:22
>> Um >> Captain Morningwood. Morningwood, >> please send beer. Uh the the thing that
00:28:28
scares me though here is where before I thought before you slowed that down, I thought he's saying just the first guy
00:28:37
responding to the dispatcher. >> Right. >> Now it almost sounds like >> this this is somebody asking him a
00:28:44
question, not the dispatcher, and he's responding to whomever that person is. >> No, that's not what I hear it as. What I
00:28:51
hear it as is the guy is talking and saying something and he is telling the dispatcher that's
00:29:00
the first guy. >> Oh, like like Okay, now you got his voice on recording, >> right?
00:29:06
>> That's the first guy, but he Okay, so he >> and so and then the whole idea when he
00:29:10
said, "Well, I ran into him." And then we've talked about, well, just the first guy.
00:29:15
>> Yeah. But but now with this other piece of information, maybe he's saying, "Hey,
00:29:20
that's the first guy." >> Now, I'm going to assume here because I don't know for certain, but he has a
00:29:26
Droid Razor phone, uh, is what's listed as his phone. >> Yeah. >> And I'm assuming that that would work
00:29:34
>> very much the same as the iPhone, the m the microphone on the iPhone. >> Well, it depends on depends on who you
00:29:41
ask. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> There's some, you know, Apple elitist and stuff. I'd say they're all they're
00:29:46
all pretty compatible. >> I'm halfway asking you and halfway thinking through this out loud here, but
00:29:51
I'm just thinking with with my phone, like you said, it's even if I pull it a certain distance from my face, you're
00:29:59
not going to you you may not hear me talk at all. >> Right. That would be a blessing.
00:30:04
>> Um but the thing is this guy, whoever whoever says it's Am I crazy? It sounds
00:30:09
like it definitely sounds like a man's voice to me. >> Yeah. um he he's loud enough or he's
00:30:15
close enough >> that it got picked up by the phone >> that it got picked up. And if you're
00:30:20
right where he's trying to point out to the dispatcher that that's the first guy
00:30:24
>> Mhm. >> then then it's loud enough to Brandon that he thinks it's being recorded and
00:30:30
very clearly as well. >> Well, then it changes your perception. Before we've kind of thought that, you
00:30:34
know, he ran into some bad dudes and there's some stuff going down maybe with the state trooper. Who knows? But that
00:30:42
he was running away. But what if, you know, he ran out of gas, ran into this situation, the cop, uh, you know, ran
00:30:50
after these guys >> and he ran after the other guy. >> Mhm. >> You know, that's like guys trying to get
00:30:55
away or something and he chased him down, >> you know, and that's why he's calling
00:31:00
the cops. I need the cops. >> Yeah. >> Cuz I got, you know, cuz think about this way. If I broke up a fight,
00:31:06
>> you know, who who am I going to call? I can't contain them forever. >> Mhm. I need the cops. You know, I got
00:31:12
one of the guys right here. >> But if he's responding to this person that we cannot see, that we cannot
00:31:18
identify, >> then do you feel like that must be somebody in an authorative an authoritative figure, meaning like he's
00:31:28
he's choosing to talk to this person over the dispatcher at this point. You know, he's the the dispatcher is
00:31:35
essentially his lifeline, >> right? Yeah. >> So, you have to decide whom you're going
00:31:40
to answer if you only think you may have a limited amount of time to speak. Um, clearly if if he is responding to this
00:31:48
person that we don't don't know anything about, this person may may be in a situation to to that Brandon thinks he
00:31:57
it's more important to answer the man than the than the dispatcher. >> No, I I don't think he's answering the
00:32:04
man, though, is what I'm saying. I think he's telling the dispatcher >> that's the first
00:32:08
>> because if he was answering that guy, he might have, you know, sometimes when
00:32:11
you're talking to somebody on the phone and somebody asks you a question, then you move the phone away.
00:32:16
>> Mhm. >> And so then then his volume would have got smaller. Uh it would have been
00:32:21
quieter. It doesn't get smaller. His answer is the same. That's the first guy. >> Yeah.
00:32:26
>> His the phone is the phone at that point is not moving away from his face. >> Yeah. Wherever it's at when he started
00:32:31
the the sentence, it's there the entire time. Mhm. >> Okay. The next line is going to be the
00:32:37
dispatcher. >> Do you need an ambulance? >> Do you need an ambulance? >> So, a lot of people talk. Okay. Again, I
00:32:47
haven't seen a lot of dissection of this. I And the gunshots. A lot of people talk about during the whole tape,
00:32:54
you can kind of hear these gunshots in the background. I some some of them that people claim are gunshots, they they
00:33:01
don't even register, you know, in the wave file. There's really no movement. And this one, I hear a gunshot at the
00:33:08
beginning. So, listen for that. >> Do you need an ambulance? >> Do you need an ambulance?
00:33:15
>> I'm going to just solo that. Just the part where I think I hear a gunshot. And
00:33:19
I'm going to just make it a little louder. But that's the second time that you think that you're hearing a similar
00:33:30
noise that you're describing as a possible gunshot. >> Yeah. And the first time that we, you
00:33:35
know, anytime that we pick a case, it's always about how do we present it and and can we bring anything to it, it's
00:33:42
just like, you know, the the the requests for John Benet Ramsay have kind of, you know, simmered down a little bit
00:33:49
because, uh, you know, the documentary did such a good job. What can we bring to that case? I don't know. Right. And
00:33:56
and there's a lot of other podcasts that cover this, you know, good friends of ours, you know.
00:34:01
>> Yeah. >> The Vanish covered it. >> Uh was really good episode. Generation Y. Those are great guys.
00:34:07
>> Both were fantastic episodes, by the way. Um but we really wanted to dive into just the 911 call because when you
00:34:16
and I looked into this case, we couldn't we couldn't tear ourselves away from the
00:34:20
911 call. I mean, that's I just I sat in my I sat in my car and listened to it a
00:34:25
dozen times at different speeds. And then when I got home, I I was convinced I couldn't hear it clear enough because
00:34:33
I was in my car and there was other noises going on. And so then I listened to it in in the basement at my house in
00:34:39
the quietest room that I could find. >> Yeah. And our like I like I was trying to say before, I was so rudely
00:34:45
interrupted. >> Oh, I'm sorry. Sorry about that. As much as I interrupt you, you you're
00:34:50
allowed. No, I was just trying to say that if we don't think we can bring anything to the case, we don't normally
00:34:55
cover it, right? You know, there's no point of us covering cases that have been covered so many times. But like you
00:35:00
said, you listen to a couple episodes, you kind of dive into what's happening. And
00:35:06
>> I stopped everybody's podcast and started listening to the audio clips over and over. And then I have the
00:35:12
ability to throw this into a recording program, kind of manipulate some of the fre frequencies. I can loop stuff. I can
00:35:19
slow it down. And I spent hours and hours. And there's definitely I don't know, four or five times that
00:35:29
there's possible gunshots. >> Well, let me ask you this because >> Okay, go ahead.
00:35:34
>> Let's not say gunshot, right? Let's just say that there is a bang >> that's happening. a little bit of a
00:35:40
distance from him >> and but it's loud enough to register on the phone. >> And to be clear, you're stating that
00:35:48
this is the second time in the recording that you've heard a similar noise, >> right?
00:35:54
>> And the first time it is more faint. It It seems to be quieter or further away
00:36:00
from him for whatever reason. Am I correct there? Because to me, this this one that you just pointed out, I hear it
00:36:07
a little more clearly than the first time. >> Right. Right. And you hear that initially, but then when I looped it, I
00:36:13
raised the volume, so it's going to be a little bit louder. But here's the thing
00:36:16
that you have to think about. If he's running away from the scene, and it depends on where the phone is facing cuz
00:36:23
we're going to look at the phone as a microphone, >> you know? So if the you know when I'm
00:36:28
talking here it sounds one way but if I start talking here you know it's it's whatever direction the the phone is
00:36:35
facing >> right now any chance. Okay it's not you're saying possible gunshot >> at least a bang
00:36:43
>> at least a bang. It doesn't to be honest with you to me it doesn't sound either
00:36:47
time it doesn't sound like a gunshot but it also is not clear enough for me to decide what it sounds like.
00:36:53
>> Well that's cuz you're not from the streets and I've I've heard one uh one theory that I liked was that somebody
00:37:01
described the noise that like a semitr might make. You know, sometimes when you hear a semi-truck going over a bridge,
00:37:09
uh, and you hear that clack clack, >> right, >> clack and and what what this person's
00:37:14
theory is is that you're hearing the semitr in the distance going over something and that's why he thinks it
00:37:22
gets louder because it's getting closer to where Brandon's phone is. >> That's very possible.
00:37:27
>> That's very possible. The the other thing I I wonder about though too is is this something could this be noise
00:37:35
that's being created because Brandon might be running you know he's stepping on brush or going through going through
00:37:44
uh you know rough terrain >> maybe. Yeah. But to me this sounds more like a hit.
00:37:50
>> But there's more than just the potential gunshot going on right there. >> Yeah. I think one of the things when
00:37:55
people are analyzing this stuff is they're not listening why she's talking and he's clearly saying something. So we
00:38:02
have this bang possible gunshot and when she starts talking he is saying something or somebody else is saying
00:38:09
something in the background. >> Do you need an ambulance? Do you need an ambulance?
00:38:16
>> Slow it down so we can hear it one more time. >> Do you need an ambulance? Do you need an ambulance?
00:38:27
>> Play it again. >> Do you need an ambulance? >> Do you need an amulet? >> So, right before she starts talking,
00:38:39
what I hear is a a clear >> Yeah. >> And that's coming from somebody that's very close to the phone. So, I hear a
00:38:48
or a And then in the background you hear that guy's hurt. >> Yeah, it does sound like it does sound
00:39:00
like someone is saying that guy's hurt. Let me ask you this because not >> that's gunshot or it sounds more to me
00:39:07
like that guy's hurt. >> Yeah. The thing is though, I want to ask you not so much what you're hearing, but
00:39:13
what you're seeing on the screen there, because there's certain there's certain levels here, and you can see certain,
00:39:20
you know, sizes on the screen, which kind of indicate to me how close or how loud something is according to the
00:39:28
microphone. >> Well, right. But the problem is that she's talking. Mhm. >> So, she is setting basically the bar of
00:39:35
how high the wave is going to be >> because it's kind of like, you know, water, right?
00:39:40
>> Okay. >> We got two streams of water. >> Mhm. >> Her stream is pushing more through, but
00:39:46
and there's still other water coming through. >> Gotcha. So, >> and so I can see how loud the the total
00:39:52
file is or how much total water is, but I can't find out how much how loud they are. So if that's Brandon talking
00:40:00
underneath or if it's somebody in the background talking it they're they're low enough that they're being basically
00:40:07
surrounded audio-wise by >> if it is Brandon talking his phone is not by his face at that point.
00:40:14
>> Okay. >> So let's just take a I'll loop that again. >> Do you need an ammo? Do you need an amulet?
00:40:28
Do you need an ambulance? >> Do you need an ambulance? >> If he is saying that guy's hurt,
00:40:37
>> right? >> He it it wouldn't come off to me as he's responding to the dispatcher. And this
00:40:44
is what this is what scares me. This is what is making me very angry sitting here listening to this. It makes me feel
00:40:54
the thing here is he I don't think he's responding to the dispatcher. And the problem I have with that is that he if
00:41:02
he's saying that guy's hurt to somebody else that's there, why is he speaking for them? The the the person must be so
00:41:10
hurt or unconscious or something that they they cannot respond themselves. And the scary thing here to me is if he's
00:41:19
saying that guy is hurt and whoever he's talking to, he's not afraid of, >> right?
00:41:25
>> So then let's just hypothetically state trooper pulls some guys over. He's walking it onto it. [ __ ] starts getting
00:41:34
crazy. He starts running, right? >> Maybe there's two state troopers, right? one, you know, to chase him into the
00:41:41
woods and then all of a sudden he's with this may, like I said, maybe he chased down one of the guys, but the guy was
00:41:47
already hurt for whatever reason. This state trooper or somebody, you know, somebody that he's not a afraid to talk
00:41:55
to comes up to him and he says, "That guy's hurt." >> And then and that's pretty much it. And
00:42:03
so at that point, what if the state trooper or whoever takes his phone? >> I I feel like here that that the person
00:42:12
that he's talking about that he's saying that guy's hurt that whomever he's responding to that that he doesn't
00:42:19
identify that guy that's hurt as being with the person he's responding to. That's just that's just kind of my
00:42:28
>> gut feeling there. um where I think if you saw two people in similar uniforms,
00:42:33
you identify them as being together and you know I I would think he would say he's hurt. I you know I'm I'm really
00:42:41
maybe looking into this far too much but >> I kind of feel like that guy's hurt kind
00:42:46
of he he's talking about someone that he doesn't identify to to be with the person he's responding to.
00:42:52
>> Well, let's play everything that we have up to this point in real time. 911 emergency.
00:42:59
>> Yes, I'm in the middle of the field. We're just pushing some guys over right here going toward Javelin on both sides.
00:43:05
My truck ran out of gas. There's one car here to the woods pretty hard. >> Okay, now run that by me.
00:43:12
>> We're not talking to him. I ran into him. >> Ah, you ran into him. Okay. >> Do you need an ambulance?
00:43:24
>> So, here's what I have so far, Captain. I have. Yes, I'm in the middle of a field. State trooper pulled some guys
00:43:31
over. They're out here going towards blank on both sides. My truck ran out of gas.
00:43:38
>> Mhm. >> There's one car here. The guy's chased him to the woods. Please hurry.
00:43:47
And then he's, you know, then he's interrupted the dispatcher and then he says, "And we're not talking to him. Not
00:43:53
till we ran into him. Just the first guy and we hear that faint to me what sounds
00:44:00
like that guy's hurt. >> Let's uh play the next clip. See if we can find anything odd there.
00:44:05
>> Yeah. No, I need the cops. >> Okay. >> Yeah. No, I need the cops. >> Okay. >> Now, I'm going to play this clip slowed
00:44:14
down twice and then I'm going to make it even slower twice. >> No, I need the cops.
00:44:22
No, I need the cops. No, I need the calls. Okay. No, I need the calls. >> Okay. >> Now, on this clip, there's a lot of
00:44:37
speculation that the first Yeah. is coming from another person. And like I said, I do believe that there's times on
00:44:44
this tape that there's somebody else talking uh on the phone other than uh Brand Brandon.
00:44:51
>> Mhm. So, but in this case, I actually don't hear it as being such. I actually
00:44:56
hear the yeah as being Brandon. If you look also at the waveforms, the the times that I think it's possibly
00:45:02
somebody else talking, the waveforms are a lot smaller. So, meaning it's also just quieter. This one is very
00:45:09
comparable. The yah is almost, you know, it's just a slight it's a hair off of what the no, I need the cops is.
00:45:18
>> Yeah. And I think the situation here is that he's I think he's correcting himself again because I think he is
00:45:26
anticipating that she's going to say we're going to send the cops or you know the police are on their way. Um and it
00:45:33
it's almost like because he doesn't know that she hasn't understood what he has said,
00:45:38
>> right? I think he thinks she knows what he's saying. >> Yeah. That Yeah. And he he's he's
00:45:44
rethinking it. Yeah. No, I need the cops. >> Mhm. Here's the next line, and it's
00:45:49
pretty much just the dispatcher. >> Is anybody hurt? >> Hello. >> I'm going to play this whole end clip um
00:46:01
slowed down and the and the whole length so you'll hear the whole thing. >> Is anybody hurt?
00:46:20
Hello. Hello. Hello. Now, what I'm going to do is actually take the in between parts where she's
00:46:41
not talking. I'm going to make those a little louder. >> Mhm. >> Is anybody hurt?
00:46:58
>> Hello. Hello. Hello. >> I just listening to this like this, it gives me the heebiejibbies.
00:47:20
>> Yeah. So, here's what I think I'm hearing there from, you know, with once we remove the dispatcher. It almost
00:47:27
sounds to me like um like a quick inhale and then an exhale and then >> there's some clicks happening there. And
00:47:36
that could be the phone in the pocket. That could just be having the phone down by its side.
00:47:44
I the the tough thing here for me is there's never a time or or never a time that I can find where there's a spike.
00:47:54
>> Mhm. >> So, it doesn't seem like Brandon dropped the phone. >> No. >> You would think that you'd hear kind of
00:48:01
a rattle or something. Uh and and you you really don't. Do you hear like a there's a portion there towards the last
00:48:10
time that she says hello. There's a portion there that it almost sounds like there's a a droning noise or like a fan
00:48:17
or something. Well, Mike, well, it's it's slowed down. But some of my other thought is when you speed that section
00:48:24
up, it kind of sounds like kind of like a click click and then you get this almost like a car's driving by.
00:48:31
>> Right. That's what I I hear like a like a motorcycle or car. >> Yeah. or or a truck or something.
00:48:38
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't know. It's a >> It's creepy. No. >> But you also think you might hear
00:48:43
someone talking. >> I think I can hear somebody talking before the last Hello. I can hear uh
00:48:49
human. And I need to spend more time on that section. Uh, I mean I can try to The
00:48:58
problem is sometimes when you take these clips, you can take a very small clip and you can normalize it and that just
00:49:04
basically boosts the overall gain. Uh, that again makes it more distorted. >> But um, I would I would really like to
00:49:13
take this in with guys I went to school with that that don't really know much about the case at all
00:49:21
>> and have fresh ears listen to it and and in an actual studio. I mean, we we're in
00:49:26
our garage and we have some studio like quality. >> Mhm. >> But nothing like they have. Um,
00:49:34
>> do you think that do you think that if what I think I'm hearing is the inhale
00:49:38
exhale, do you >> that's possibly coming from the the dispatcher as well. >> Okay. And
00:49:46
Okay. >> So, basically uh after listening and dissecting all this, we come to the
00:49:51
conclusion that we know less really than when we started. Well, but here's the thing. I'm looking over what I wrote
00:49:57
down. Um, do you mind if I go through it one more time? >> Go. Yeah. >> Okay. So, I'm going to try to do a um
00:50:05
>> Well, he he's saying that uh people because he can tell that my brain hurts from all this editing.
00:50:12
>> Yes. I'm in the middle of a field. State trooper pulled some guys over. They're
00:50:16
out here going towards Gavlin on both sides. My truck ran out of gas. There's one car here. Guys chased him to the
00:50:23
woods. Please hurry. And we're not talking to him. Not till we ran into him. Just the first guy. That guy's
00:50:31
hurt. Yeah. No, I need the cops. >> Yeah. >> The thing here is, and this is what, you
00:50:38
know, just reviewing what I wrote down, and I'm not saying that I'm right, but but the thing that
00:50:43
>> that's just your guestimation. >> This is my guess after looking at it. But the the line that doesn't make any
00:50:49
sense, let's say to me when I read through this, >> all of the lines seem to work together
00:50:56
in a way. The line that doesn't really make any sense is that one in the middle and we're not talking to him.
00:51:03
>> That that one just doesn't seem to really fit really anything else. And and what I mean is like cuz the next line is
00:51:10
not till we ran into him. according to me that yes, those lines go together. But what I'm saying here is we ran into
00:51:16
him kind of goes with with what story you think you're hearing in the beginning where we're not talking to
00:51:22
him. Doesn't really doesn't really seem to make sense with any of the other stuff here. I mean, there's a lot that
00:51:28
doesn't make sense. And again, the the the issue here is that if he had no, you know, prior drug use, then
00:51:39
people wouldn't jump to that. they jump to maybe he's intoxicated. And I think people start getting that embedded in
00:51:45
their head subconsciously when they keep slowing down the tape. >> He sounds intoxicated. So therefore,
00:51:51
he's intoxicated. When it's played at normal speed, I do not hear an intoxicated guy. I hear a guy
00:51:57
>> that is scared. I hear a guy that uh is, you know, you know, his adrenaline is
00:52:03
racing. >> Mhm. >> And and it's and it's weird. And then the problem with all this is that he the
00:52:12
brother gets a call >> saying, "Hey, I'm down the road and uh and and I think we have evidence from
00:52:20
the 911 tape that he's moving." >> Yeah. >> So he's moving. So that, you know, statement lines up and then he says that
00:52:28
he's bleeding. >> Yeah. >> So did he get hit by somebody? And the thing is, you know, I've heard people
00:52:34
say that at the end of that tape that that they hear someone saying, "Help me." Uh, I don't hear that anywhere. Um,
00:52:42
I don't even hear what sounds like anybody close to the phone saying talking to into the phone,
00:52:48
>> right? >> Um, the thing here though too is, you know, because some people say, "Well,
00:52:52
that was Brandon's last words." It couldn't have been because we know that he later then called his brother. Um,
00:52:59
you know, so one thing though too, Captain, is we we definitely have a situation here with whatever's going
00:53:05
down is not doesn't sound to me like it's going down around his vehicle around Brandon's truck. It sounds to me
00:53:12
like he's in another location. Like he's already started walking and distanced himself from that truck. Did Did he Did
00:53:21
somebody pick him up and offer to help and then they ran into somebody? Not till we ran into him. You know, did they
00:53:28
run into somebody's vehicle? Uh, you know, the the first call goes out to to Kyle at 12:38. The 911 call is at 1250.
00:53:38
Now, I wouldn't think he would have gotten too far on foot. >> The most, maybe a mile.
00:53:43
>> Yeah, let's let's say a mile. Um, and then but we have the Kyle saying he didn't get to the officer until 110. So
00:53:53
now we have 20 minutes go by where where Brandon is reaching out to the brother again
00:54:00
>> after the 911 call. So >> So yeah, again another mile down the road, maybe more.
00:54:07
>> Yeah, but you would think that whatever whatever it sounds like he's trying to
00:54:12
describe sounds like a pretty chaotic scene to me. If if what I think he's trying to describe is going down, to me
00:54:19
it would have had to have happened more than a mile away from his truck. I think
00:54:22
that that Kyle or the deputy would have seen some kind of commotion or heard something at some point.
00:54:31
>> Mhm. Yeah. I don't It's I mean that's why it's this crazy mystery. It's um I don't know if we'll ever know.
00:54:43
>> I'm really frustrated. I'm I I'll I'll I'll type this up and leave it on our uh
00:54:48
on our blog to, you know, to to play what I to write down what I think I heard. >> Yeah, I'm I'm freaking exhausted. So, uh
00:54:56
final thoughts, right? >> Yeah. The final thoughts, if I'm going by what I think I hear, there's him,
00:55:02
there's a state trooper, there's two guys, at least two guys. He may have gotten a car with somebody before he
00:55:10
enter, you know, came across these state trooper and the other guys. >> Um, I think that he's saying that the
00:55:18
state trooper got chased into the woods by these guys. Um, the problem I have with that story is you think you would
00:55:25
have that that's a newsworthy story. That's not something that just happens and and it's never reported. I mean,
00:55:32
state troopers call for backup if if able. uh if a state trooper is missing or goes down.
00:55:39
>> Yeah. Again, it's depends on how you go with it. Was was he being chased or was
00:55:44
he chasing somebody? >> And and I Yeah, I I think it comes down to you either you either believe that
00:55:51
he's on drugs and this is all just fictitious in his head or he's not on drugs and what he's saying is actually
00:55:59
true. >> Yeah. I there there was a report of his cell phone uh pinging near the Colorado
00:56:06
River. Um but I want to be but this is also only like I don't know like three or four miles from his vehicle. The
00:56:15
problem here is that what they have stated is as far as the technology goes is that those pings can be off by
00:56:23
anywhere from a mile and a half to three miles. >> Right? So therefore that I I don't think
00:56:30
that can tell you anything what the where that ping is. >> Yeah. My final thoughts on this are is
00:56:36
kind of simple. I mean I think what he's saying um makes sense with the evidence
00:56:40
that's shown on the tape. >> And I also believe that there's going to be technology and probably some people
00:56:47
out there that have better tools and better skills than I have that could probably uncover some of the things I
00:56:53
can't. And I think that uh like I said, there's a bunch of evidence I think on the tape to kind of coincide with what
00:57:03
he's saying. So, you know, it's it's a tough one and my thoughts and prayers go out to uh his family and his friends and
00:57:12
and I'm going to try to do more diving in and I think it was kind of a interesting experiment to kind of dive
00:57:21
into these this audio clips as as much as we have. Well, you were absolutely able to point out some things to me that
00:57:28
I wasn't able to hear on my own. Um, and and I didn't hear them because you pointed them out to me. I heard them
00:57:35
because you enhanced it and you brought it up to a level or slowed it to a level
00:57:40
that I could hear things that I was missing before. >> And I appreciate you pointing those out
00:57:46
to all of us and and taking the time and and really editing this thing and dissecting it and chopping it up as much
00:57:53
as you did. It was it was a lot of work for you. >> All right, let's get out of here because
00:57:57
it is Taco Tuesday. So, do we have recommended reading for the week? We do. And it is Dark Ambition, the shocking
00:58:03
crimes of Dylan Millard and Mark Schmidt by Anne Brockhurst. Uh this is the true
00:58:10
story of a happy young father with a promising future who listed his pickup truck for sale online. He goes on a test
00:58:17
drive with two strangers and he never returns. Uh this is the story of that man's strange disappearance in May of
00:58:24
2013, which captured headlines across the country and took over social media. Now, when the two men were eventually
00:58:32
arrested and charged with that murder, the mystery only deepens because the these were people of means. They they
00:58:41
they had money. There was no reason to steal this man's truck. It almost looks like a thrill target. And both of these
00:58:48
men are also facing other murder charges, which we will see those trials pan out in the future.
00:58:54
>> Pretty interesting. >> Yeah. So that's Dark Ambition, the shocking crimes of Dylan Millard and
00:58:59
Mark Schmidt. And you can pick that up by going to true crimegar.com and click on the recommended page. And you can get
00:59:06
anything through Amazon. All of our microphones, our mic cables, our preamps, our speakers, pretty much
00:59:12
everything that we got for the garage to do the show came from Amazon. And they give us a little kickback with no charge
00:59:18
to you. And a big huge wet sloppy kiss to all of our listeners. Without you guys, this wouldn't be possible. We hope
00:59:26
you found this uh episode interesting and please share our thoughts uh or share. So, yeah, let me share share your
00:59:34
thoughts with us on the website. And much love to everybody out there. Until next time, be good, be kind, and don't
00:59:41
litter. Heat. Heat.