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Heat up [Music] here. [Music] Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks
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for listening. I'm your host, Nick. And with me is a man that swears that fairies wear boots. He's seen it, he's
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seen it. He will tell us no lie. A man that only speak the truth. He's the captain. Thank you. Thank you. Thank
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you. It's good to be seen and it's good to see you. This week we are drinking Well,
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I've got to be honest. Just like the captain, I speak of the truth. I wanted to try something new. England has got so
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many great beer companies that I've heard of. And I was hoping to do so this week, but guess what? Somebody put an
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ocean between me and England. So, it makes it tough to try some of their more crafty, harder to get your hands on
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beers. I wanted to try Old Chimney's Good King Henry Cloud. There's a beer called Magic Rock that sounded
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fantastic. And I think that there's a brewery called Siren that has paired up with some of our great breweries here in
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the States like Evil Twin and Cigar City. But tonight, in the spirit of Halloween,
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[Music] We are drinking Jacko Traveler Pumpkin Chandandy. Jacko is a yam beer. You know
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why? Because you're always sitting around thinking about how great beer and yams go together, right? Garage grade.
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Let's go. Four out of five bottle caps. That's right. The yams have it. And Jacko is brought to us by some of our
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wonderful True Crime Garage Army friends. But more specifically, we have Mary in Akran,
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Ohio. She's a new listener. We have Sarah in Brooklyn. She's an old listener. I'm guessing that she's not
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old, but just a long time listener because we've we've only been around for like a year, so you can be a longtime
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listener without being elderly. Mhm. Uh we have Bruce from God knows where. Uh where are you, Bruce? And we have East
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Sussex, UK. And we have Duchella from Lake Villa, Illinois. She wants to get the captain extra special drunk. So,
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Captain, have you ever been extra special drunk? Yeah, it happens on a on a regular basis. Well, all right. You do
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that on your own time because we got a jam-packed show tonight. And thanks to everybody that donated, you can do so by
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while you're at true crimegar.com, click on the store page because guess what? We
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got some merch, right, Cap? Yeah, we got some new shirts. We like to do a different design every time. So, we
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don't like to repeat the designs. So, that's what kind of makes it fun. So, there's some people that will have all
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the designs. And you can't have all the designs unless you start buying now. All
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right, that's enough of the business. That's right. Gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer, and let's talk some
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true crime. [Music] [Music] The year is 1964 and in the United States of America, President Lyndon B. Johnson
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declares war on poverty. The Warren Commission reports their findings, stating that Lee Harvey
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Oswald was the lone gunman. Cashes Clay defeats Sunny Lon to become the heavyweight boxing champion of the
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world. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 is signed. Dr. Martin Luther King wins the Nobel Peace
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Prize. The first Ford Mustang hits the streets and amongst the popular films is the unforgettable Mary Poppins. The rock
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band The Rolling Stones released their debut record self-titled The Rolling Stones.
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The Beatles make an appearance on the Ed Solidan Show and they have 13 singles in
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the top 100. A little more than 75 years after Jack the Ripper. In the UK, they abolished the death penalty. In the
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streets of London, there were a string of murders that quickly became known as the London Nude murders. The suspect
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became known as Jack the Stripper. and Scotland Yard was about to unleash one of the largest manhunts London would
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ever see. And unfortunately, there would be victim after victim. How many total?
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Well, just like Jack the Ripper, the victim count is up for debate. This is True Crime Garage, and
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this is the case of the London nude murders. [Music] [Music] Okay. Almost everybody knows the story
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or at least has heard of Jack the Ripper. And of course, no one really knows who Jack the Ripper was. Mhm. Uh
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but few have heard of the killer that became known as Jack the Stripper. Uh, we're talking about the London nude
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murders. Well, you might know of the name Jack the Stripper. It's a there's a rock band called Jack the Stripper. And
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there was also a rock song by Black Sabbath, which was an instrumental tune called Jack the Stripper. And that's why
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on our intro when I introduced the captain there, I said Fairies Wear Boots. That's because on the album
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Paranoid, uh, the they pair those songs together. Jack the stripper slashf fairies wear boots which was one of my
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favorite Black Sabbath songs. So um but just like Jack the Strip I'm sorry just like Jack Senior Jack the Ripper. Jack
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the Stripper too is an unknown serial killer. Jack the Ripper is not just a clever name. Jack named himself in
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taunting letters to the police and to the public. And some have argued are those from the actual killer and others
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would suggest that they are simply a hoax for some sicko or from someone or someone's wishing to increase newspaper
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sales. But Jack the Ripper uh he didn't just kill, he ripped. He would rip his victims apart. Meaning he would cut the
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victims sometimes a lot. slitting the throat, cutting into the abdomen, uh, and actually removing body parts, you
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know, uterus, liver, the tip of one's nose, or clipping the ears. Now, Jack the Stripper, he did not cut his
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victims. He strangled them, and he did not rip them or remove any body parts. He left his strangled victims nude or
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pretty much fully exposed. This of course leading to the name of the unknown perpetrator, but the crimes in
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remain unsolved and it's unsolved murders of seven of London's working girls. Go ahead. So, let's go back a
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little bit. I mean, so the stripper part makes sense, but using Jack the Stripper
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is just because of the area that these crimes took place in. Mhm. Yep. And uh they would also be called the London
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Nude Murders as well as the Hammersmith murders. Our story starts in 1964, London, England. Um, now earlier I did
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say seven victims, but as you will see when we go through this that there is some debate regarding the actual number
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of victims here. Yeah, it seems like the consensus is that there's six confirmed
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victims and possibly another two, maybe even more. But so when you see this uh normally if you're looking up this case,
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you'll see six confirmed, possibly eight. During the years of 1964 and 1965, six women are found dead in or
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around the river tames. The first victim that we're going to talk about is Hannah
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Tailford. Uh she was 30 years old at the time of her death. Hannah was excluded from several schools when she was a
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young girl uh as she was pretty disruptive at school. When she was a teenager, she ran away to the big big
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city of London. Uh it was not long after her arrival that she started getting into more trouble. She was convicted a
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couple of times of for soliciting. Now, apparently she was quite desperate or just a terrible person because on one
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occasion she placed a classified ad in a local paper offering to sell her unborn
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baby to the highest bidder. Uh it has also been reported that Hannah had told some friends she was being paid to
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participate in bizarre orgies hosted by some of the more wellto-do Londoners. She was known to have been offered money
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to have sex on camera and it speculated that she and some she was in some stag films. Hannah also told a friend she had
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attended an orgy at the home of a French diplomat named Andre. Now, on one occasion, after having been paid, she
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was taken by a limousine to a house where a man in a gorilla costume had sex with her while a crowd of rich and
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wealthy onlookers cheered. Um, that's uh definitely strange. Yeah, that's, you know, usually when I throw a party, I
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turn on a football game and put out some guac and uh, you know, but no gorilla suit. Uh, now I normally have the
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gorilla suit, but it's not all the other stuff cuz gorilla suits are fun. We mention these things to show what kinds
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of ties she may have had and what kind of suspect pull the police could have been dealing with because on February
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2nd, 1964, her the body of 30-year-old Hannah Tail Ford was found by rowers on the
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tames shore near Hammersmith Bridge. Mhm. She was naked except for a pair of stockings and she had been strangled.
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Several of her teeth were missing and her underwear had been stuffed in her mouth. During the investigation, police
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interviewed hundreds of people who they knew to have had dealings with prostitutes, including an international
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soccer player and several members of the clergy. Two months later, this was April
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8th, Irene Lockwood, who was only 26 years of age, was found a few hundred yards upstream
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in the river Tames. Now, so that she's found very close to the first victim that we just discussed, Hannah Tailford.
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They were able to determine that Irene had been in the water for less than 48 hours. And like Hannah, she had been
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strangled with a legature, possibly a piece of her own clothing. She had been stripped before being placed in the
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water. Like Hannah, the police had some strange leads to follow. Things she may have known or things that she may have
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done could have played a big part in her murder. Only about a year before the young woman was found dead, one of her
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friends had been found beaten to death. This is Vicky Pender, and her body was found in her North London flat. Vicki
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had tried to blackmail some of her clients over photos she had taken of them. And I guess Irene Lockwood had
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some of her own tricks. Irene would take clients to a flat and she would insist that the man remove his pants and then
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leave them outside of the room before entering to have sex. When he would go into the room, someone would go through
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the man's pockets and steal any money or valuables that were found. Another trick
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that she did, this was very much like that from the Seinfeld episode where George met a woman and then they went to
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a hotel room and she handcuffed him to the bed and robbed him. Well, Irene, she would uh agree to go to a private room
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with a man and she would tie him up and then she would rob him, sometimes taking
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his clothes. Police suspected that these two murders may have been connected to two previous murders. These are the
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deaths of Elizabeth Fig, also known as Anne Phillips. Elizabeth's body was found in the early morning hours by
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officers on their regular beat on June 17th, 1959. She was kind of sitting up. She
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was like slumped against a tree and her dress was torn open exposing her body as
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well as, you know, easily visible scratches around her throat. Right. She had been strangled. I guess her
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boyfriend in the beginning was she he was a suspect early on. Her boyfriend was a boxer and was Elizabeth's pimp as
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well. He was known to have slapped Elizabeth around, but for some reason he was ruled out fairly quickly into the
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investigation. The other murder that was that of 22-year-old Gwyneth Reese. Ree was found about a mile from Elizabeth's
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body on the riverbank. Now, Gwennneth's body was found November 8th, 1963. But the weird thing here, she was last seen
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almost 6 months before. So, she's last seen getting So, she was missing for roughly six months. Yeah, she I'm sorry,
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six weeks before. I apologize, but yeah, no one had seen her in six weeks and then she turns up on the shore. It's
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still a long time. I mean, 6 months would be obviously a lot longer, but 6 weeks for nobody to see you. Um, again,
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as far as this profession goes, um, you're working mostly at night, so I I would assume that there'd be weeks out
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of time where that your normal crowd of people would not see you. Exactly. And this is only when she's reported to have
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been last seen. Who knows? Um, but she's last seen getting into a car with a man.
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Uh, this is way back in September of that year. Uh, this is at the end of September of ' 63. Police suspected
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strangulation to be the cause of her death, but this was never 100% determined to be the cause of death.
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Mhm. And this is why it should be one of the one of the victims that they don't confirm as one of the victims at uh of
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Jack the Stripper. Yeah. Elizabeth Elizabeth Fig uh murdered in 1959 and Gwyneth Reese murdered in 1963. Some
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debate that they are part of Jack the Strippers case and others say very similar. They do very similar. And then
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it looks to me with all these cases so far, it looks girls that have uh some sort of desperation. And then seems like
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a either one man or a group of males that have power, that have money and uh like to also humil humiliate, not just
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have sex with, but to do almost like I'm rich and I'm powerful. Let me take this
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to the extreme or just I'm in control of this situation. Uh so Gwyneth Reese, just like the other girls, uh again, it
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wasn't 100% determined that she was strangled, but strangulation was suspected. Uh she was found naked and
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she was missing some teeth. Like in Elizabeth's case, Gwyneth's pimp, now he is not not believed to have been her
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actual boyfriend, uh but her pimp was suspected. This is Cornelius Whitehead and he was a violent criminal with
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gangster ties, right? He was suspected of being violent with women as well. We don't know. And sometimes you'd see this
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as a way to teach the other women that are working for him like don't get out of line, right? He's he's running his
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little, you know, criminal business and this is how criminals behave. Well, yeah. And you're messing it up. So, you
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mess up, uh, you'll end up dead. And this is a warning to all the other girls that that instills fear and then they
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they're never going to leave. I couldn't find any record of him actually having been violent with her with Gwyneith. Um
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but we do know that she did say uh that she intended to leave him. I'm guessing you know not work for uh Cornelius
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Whitehead anymore. Uh but shortly, this happened just shortly before she disappeared and he was reportingly
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looking for her uh after she had disappeared. Mhm. Another possible lead. I was looking for his paycheck. Well,
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another possible lead here too was the abortion angle. Abortions were still illegal in the UK at this time. But much
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like we had discussed in the Black Dalia case, you could find someone an an illegal abortionist uh to carry out
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these things. And Gwyneith had already had she already had two children. Neither were living with her and relying
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on her for care at the time, which is probably a a very good thing. Surprise, surprise. And uh but she had some
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illegal procedures before. The summer before her disappearance, Gwyneth had become pregnant. And after her
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disappearance, some other prostitutes had said that she had been looking to contact an illegal abortionist. Well,
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also at this time it's 1964, birth control is probably a lot harder to get and probably more
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expensive. And I don't know what forms exactly what forms they would have had. So, it's probably limited as well. Uh,
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but right now, Captain, what we're seeing here is a couple things. Okay, so we got two cases that the police are
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saying are very much connected. We have two that they suspect could be part of this whole thing. Uh but what we can see
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by the lifestyles that these four women have led and the people that they have known and furthermore things that they
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had done to other people. I mean a couple of these girls had you know robbed people and uh you know done a
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couple things to humiliate their customers or blackmail people. Uh so we're already starting to see too many
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suspects. You know, we have four dead women all working the streets of London and we can immediately see an issue with
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the investigation of each of these cases. Yeah. But when you overstep your boundaries, I mean, when these uh
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clients are paying for kind of obscene, almost degrading types of actions, you know, it's, you know, it's one thing to
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go have sex in a room. It's another thing to go, hey, well, this guy's going to put on a monkey suit and we're going
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to have um a a crowd cheering it on. Now, look, if you're into that thing, that's that's on you. But I could see um
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being treated like this, being treated even less than that you expect to be treated that hey, I'm going to pay you
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back. You know, like you think you got one on over on me. Well, I've been stealing stuff from you or taking
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pictures that I shouldn't have been taking and uh I'm going to get mine. Yeah. And the the first off the obvious
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is the high-risk lifestyle of the profession. And you know that leads to this large suspect poll. And we're not
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talking about just an investigation into the deaths of all four of these women, whether they're connected or not. We
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could be talking about them even in an individual case. We could have a large suspect pool. Now, victim similarities.
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There are a bunch of similarities here. So far, all four women were 5'2 or less,
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so they're shorter women. All four had suffered an STD. Several of them had several missing teeth. Now, that may not
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be part of the actual crime. This could just This could just be the the part of the lifestyle. Yeah. Which is totally
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just simply point out how poor they were or unable to afford certain products or
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personal hygiene products. Well, and this is also the time where they wouldn't they wouldn't do implants or do
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crowns and stuff like that. They would just yank the tooth. Mhm. And three of the four women were pregnant and at
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least two of the pregnant women were trying to cancel the pregnancy. Irene had been taking pills to achieve this
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and she believed that they were working because she said that the the pills had made her tummy move. Oh, that's
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horrible. So, police were pretty convinced that they are dealing with the work of one killer who has gone out on
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four separate occasions and murdered a woman and stripping and dumping the bodies in or around the river. Mhm. Keep
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one thing in mind though here. Uh he may have been forcing the women to strip before strangling them or he could have
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been stripping them of their clothing afterward. Now, police would suspect that he's stripping them afterwards
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because yeah, it's a postmortem. They they are familiar with the prostitutes in the area and they say that the
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working girls in the area are mostly using vehicles to spend their time with the John's and most of them would not
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strip at all or they would not need to strip all the way for the act, right? Uh they were hike up the skirt. Yeah. They,
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you know, they could just remove whatever necessary clothing they could or lift something up or pull something
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down. Oh, by the way, if uh your kids should not be listening to this episode, so if your kids are listening to this
00:21:59
episode, please turn it off or let the state take your children. Anyways, but one thing they have figured
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out and one thing that they suspect is that they don't seem to see this killer as some kind of crazy maniac. Uh he
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doesn't seem to be out of control. Uh there are not really any known sightings of the killer having been with the women
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right before their death or the last time that they are seen but the killer seems to be in control of himself. Do
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you think it's uh the manner in which they're found? Do you think it's almost like planned if we do if if the body is
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found like this AB C and D that the police will assume that it's a mad man? I think that it would show I think what
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they're talking about here is that each victim seems to show almost identical an
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identical form of attack. Um where he is not, you know, it's not a it's not a stabbing one one time. It's not a
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strangulation one time. Somebody's not beat to death. It's it's seems to be the same attack over and over again where
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he's really he's really just it's an ends to a means almost like you know or means to an end I'm sorry where he it's
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just part of what he's doing right so this is how I kill somebody I I follow this plan and he's getting better at the
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plan as he goes along and what they mean by this too is that he would be very messy if he were a maniac you know if he
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if he was out of control out of his mind obviously this guy's a sicko But if he was not in control of himself, he
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probably would have been seen disposing of the bodies or seen with the women the
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last time they were seen. Yeah, I know that. But I'm just saying I wonder if the person that is committing these
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crimes going, "Oh, I'm going to rip up their clothes and do some things possibly postmortem. Is that for a
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motive to throw the cops off for some reason?" This is what Yeah. And that's one thing that I had wondered about as
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well and a good thing to bring up. You know, was he removing the clothing just to destroy it? you know, just so that
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there's less evidence or was it just something that he needed to do? Again, the police wanted to figure out, was he
00:24:06
forcing them to strip in advance or was this something he was doing afterwards? And so, now we're at four possible
00:24:13
victims of the total uh the eight possible total victims. So, this is a good time to take a beer break. And
00:24:21
we're back from the beer break. Cheers, my friends. Cheers. Let's talk about some of the additional police efforts
00:24:29
involved in the investigation in the London nude murders. So, police are going to start strategizing, which is
00:24:36
what you have to do, right? You have to figure out how are we going to find this
00:24:40
guy? How do we find the criminal? No duh. We have seen some patterns and some repeated behaviors and tendencies of the
00:24:46
person that you are hunting. So, what do you do? You're going to try to use those
00:24:50
repeated behaviors and tendencies to track him down and apprehend him. Or if you can't track him down, you must lay a
00:24:57
trap and try to lure him out of the shadows, right? And you know so little where a victim was last seen or who was
00:25:08
with that person, you know, so it's going to be hard to track this down, this guy down. So, Captain, let's start
00:25:14
setting some traps, right? The police hire additional officers. They increase their police force. And the new officers
00:25:23
are brought in with one simple purpose. They are to watch and patrol the river. We can't stop him from killing again.
00:25:32
But maybe what we can do is we can limit this to only one more victim. Right. Well, and they could also deter him
00:25:39
from, you know, he's probably patrolling the area himself. And so you start seeing more cops beefing up security,
00:25:47
you know, uh and and then you start thinking, well, is this the best place to to leave my next victim? And but if
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he does continue to do what he does, he should be returning to the river's edge with another body soon. And if you're
00:26:01
patrolling and watching the river, maybe you can catch him with a body in his arms. Yeah. or if these girls are, you
00:26:08
know, walking the street or maybe they even walk this river that maybe they'll see somebody leave with one of the the
00:26:16
victims. Mhm. Well, just as much as the police can set their trap and the and the killer again, he seems much in
00:26:23
control of himself and somewhat in control of this case. They zigged and now the killer is going to zag. He dumps
00:26:30
his next victim. He dumps the next body of his fifth victim in an alleyway. This
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is away from the river. April 24th, 1964. This is only about two weeks after the finding of the fourth dead woman,
00:26:43
Irene Lockwood. So on April 24th, Helen Bartholomew, she's only 20 years old. Uh
00:26:51
she was found dumped in an alleyway, which is a little younger than the other victims. Mhm. She was nude and signs of
00:26:58
strangulation or exfixiation were present. Helen was a short street worker. who had suffered an STD. Again,
00:27:06
we see the same pattern and but again, it's 1964, so there's less um options for pregnancies and and and contra
00:27:18
contraceptives, but there is also probably less health care as far as uh sexually transmitted diseases go as
00:27:25
well. Mhm. And Helen, she was known to have frequented or worked some of the same areas, including some pubs,
00:27:31
underground clubs, and drinking dens as some of the other girls. Police find some forensics at this crime scene,
00:27:39
though. They find microscopic specks of a different of different colored paints on Helen's skin. Analysis of the paint
00:27:48
reveals that it was identical to paint used in an automatic paint spray. uh when they spray paint into cars or onto
00:27:57
furniture or any type of metal work, it's identical to that kind of paint. So, police have their first lead and now
00:28:04
they will employ a call to action. This was unusual, especially for the time. Scotland Yard made a public appeal for
00:28:12
prostitutes to come forward and they were promised absolute secrecy. And of course, they were reminded too that this
00:28:20
was in the prostitute's best interest as they may be the only source of information that the police could have.
00:28:27
Right. Well, and they're also people that are being targeted. They're also in the most danger of being hunted by this
00:28:33
monster. Yeah. He he's not at this point, he's not hunting anybody that doesn't work in that industry. there the
00:28:40
police statement saying uh police are fearful if information is not forthcoming by other prostitutes that
00:28:48
other prostitutes will be killed. They were particularly interested in interviewing anyone that had been made
00:28:54
to strip and then was assaulted afterwards. Right. Within the first two days uh their efforts they they see some
00:29:02
reward for their efforts. They have over 40 female prostitutes come forward and over 20 men came forward to speak with
00:29:09
police. So, the response was good. They also start logging the plate numbers of cars that they see out after dark. Mhm.
00:29:18
They also have female officers walking the streets. They are disguised as prostitutes. Some of them armed with
00:29:24
tape recorders, you know, so if they get into a situation, they can they can record anything that goes down, which is
00:29:30
interesting for 1964. And the prostitutes were arming themselves as well. You know, they they were carrying
00:29:36
knives or some kind of weapon when they would go out for the night. And if if I were a prostitute, I would just arm
00:29:41
myself regardless of what's going on. But that's that's just me. Uh July 14th, the body of Mary Fleming is found in a
00:29:49
sitting type position at the entrance of a garage. This is in an area that is now
00:29:55
being heavily patrolled by the officers. This seems like something he would have
00:30:00
only done as a necessity to me. Or he's trying to taunt the police, which they they believe that at the time that, you
00:30:08
know, we're we're watching this area and he just puts one in our backyard. But they Well, yeah, I believe
00:30:14
that too because like like we were talking about, they beef up security on the river. So now the guy is going,
00:30:20
"Well, I can't dump him here." So then he dumps in the alleyway. That's fine. But he chances are he has his body. It's
00:30:28
in the car. He goes down to the river and he sees patrol men and he's like, "Oh shit." Takes her in the car, drives
00:30:34
somewhere else, dumps her there. Now he's on the lookout for more security. And as he sees more police officers
00:30:41
patrolling the area, and I'm sure he has some knowledge of what's going on because he's hearing from other
00:30:46
prostitutes, he's probably hearing from other John's. He's he's hearing from all
00:30:50
these people what's going on. And he's listening to the news. Yeah. and the news is is the big thing at the time.
00:30:55
And so now, yeah, it's it's it's a total move of I'm going to put it right in your back pocket and you can't stop me.
00:31:04
Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely a taunt. But the police, they will get lucky again here because Mary's body contained the
00:31:10
same paint evidence that was discovered uh earlier. You know, this this paint evidence is on her body. Yeah. is but
00:31:18
now are we assuming like you said this is some kind of spray paint which um so maybe automobile worker or furniture
00:31:27
worker or something of that nature. So we think it's a laborer. Yeah. And this is pretty much confirming their sus
00:31:34
suspicions that they got what they believe to being you know they were believing all along that these cases or
00:31:42
most of them are in fact linked. Right. Yeah. I I don't like the fact that they dismissed the two, but uh we we'll
00:31:50
continue down the path. Now, on October 23rd, 1964, two prostitutes had been working together for their own safety.
00:31:59
They were going on these things together. Uh they were approached by two cars, each with a driver. Uh this is
00:32:07
where the two of them split up, each of them going in one of the vehicles. Mhm. Kim Taylor reported to the police that
00:32:14
her friend Francis Brown got into either a Ford Zephr or Zodiac and she had not been seen since. She had not seen her
00:32:24
friends since she got in that car. Weird coincidence with the Zodiac, but so but
00:32:28
now here's what we're starting to see. We're starting to see things loosen up and work more towards the police fa
00:32:35
favor because we've already said, hey, we've made this call out to the people working the streets and said, you know,
00:32:41
you're sworn to secrecy. We'll keep your information. You're not going to get in
00:32:46
any trouble by coming forward. This is the only way that they have a chance at catching this guy. Well, and then the
00:32:51
obvious chance is him just completely messing up. But this guy seems like somebody that's in control. So now they
00:32:57
have the paint evidence and now they believe they have what could be a description of a vehicle. The body of
00:33:04
Francis Brown, she was the girl that went with the with the other car in the Ford Zephr or Zodiac. Now you said there
00:33:10
was a driver. So there's a driver of each car. Correct. Like I just wanted I wanted it to be clear that it wasn't two
00:33:16
guys pulling up in one car. It was uh two two separate vehicles pulled up to talk to both of the girls. Not like a
00:33:23
professional driver. Correct. It wasn't like a one person, right? There's one person in the car. Okay. Exactly. The
00:33:29
body of Francis Brown, the girl that went in the car in the the Ford Zephr or Zodiac. Uh she was found one month later
00:33:36
on November 25th. Uh she is found on a side street. Again, a this victim is a short prostitute, an STD carrier, and
00:33:46
paint spots are again found on her body. Now, Taylor, her friend Kim Taylor, tries to provide a description of the
00:33:53
man to police. They use what's called an identicate uh to put together a description of a roundfaced man of
00:34:01
medium height and a sturdy build. Um, this description doesn't provide them anything other than they're able to
00:34:09
release this general description to the public. Yeah, they don't do composite sketch at this time. No, this the I
00:34:17
think the way that the identicate works is that they show you like a shape of some eyes and they say does this look
00:34:22
like his eyes and you say yes, yes, you know, yes or no and then they put those down. Then they show you a shape of a
00:34:28
nose and you go through there and then at the end they put them all together and this is what your guy looks like or
00:34:34
somewhat. Well, the sketch of this guy, if you've seen it, or you know, the the probably the most popular sketch of Jack
00:34:40
the Stripper, he kind of looks like uh like a little more handsome version of of the Goonies of the the the crazy guy
00:34:50
from the Goonies. Yeah. Uh sloth. Okay. Yeah. With a little more hair, too. Yeah, he has Yeah, he definitely has
00:34:56
hair. But that's what I'll post that on Instagram if anybody wants to check it out. Okay. So, what do we have on this
00:35:02
guy so far? We have a general description of his appearance. We have a vehicle which was the Ford Zephr or
00:35:08
Zodiac. Uh we can also surmise that he is probably dumping the bodies in the early morning hours. Here's the problem
00:35:15
with this whole theory though is she was gone for a month and a half. So this is
00:35:21
just the last known sighting we Right. I mean she could have actually went missing two weeks after this. But it
00:35:28
sounds to me like this Kim Taylor was friends with Francis Brown. If they had already made plans that they're going to
00:35:34
go out and work together, you know, one would assume that Kim Taylor was probably going to go out and work
00:35:39
another night and she would look for her friend to go out with her again. Right.
00:35:43
So she would see her before the the month and a half. Okay. Exactly. And she's come forward. I agree with you.
00:35:48
She's come forward to police before her friend's body is even found. Again though, let's go back to uh the thinking
00:35:56
that we're on here, right? That that we might be able to figure out that he's probably dumping the bodies in the early
00:36:02
morning hours. And this holds a little bit of weight here, Captain, because when Mary Fleming's body was found,
00:36:08
right? Several of the people that lived in near in the nearby area had reported hearing a car reversing down the street
00:36:17
just minutes before the body was found. The body was found by a chauffeur driver
00:36:22
at about 500 a.m. Yeah. And what's interesting here is, I mean, yeah, it's 2016. So, so we're not used to this
00:36:29
lifestyle. What we're used to is 24 hours a day. Everything's open. You can go get Taco Bell at Taco Bell at what
00:36:37
12:00 on a weekday, sometimes later. Fourth meal. Fourth. Yeah. And so this is 1964. This is 1964 and
00:36:47
1965. This is back in the day where once it was dinner time, once the street lights came on, the the activities
00:36:55
normally died down more. Now, this is London, so this is, you know, their version of like New York City, city that
00:37:02
never sleeps. But it still was like that. You know, people had to work the next day. People would shut down
00:37:08
earlier. So, you're looking at a window from like, you know, 9:00 p.m. to the following day about 6 a.m. where
00:37:17
everything becomes very, very calm. And so, if you hear a car at 2:00, 3:00 in the morning, you're going to remember
00:37:24
it. You're going to take notice of this. Yeah. And I hope, you know what? I hope
00:37:28
that the the chauffeur driver was fully vetted and figured out whether he had any kind of involvement at all. Um, but
00:37:34
that's a whole another story. Now, the other thing going on here is they noticed that after this killer heated
00:37:41
up, the last few murders that he had committed, they were no longer than 3 months apart. So, by January of 1965,
00:37:49
the police were really thinking that we are going to find another body any day now. Well, something may have thrown the
00:37:56
killer off of his game because this time it was almost four months. You know, we
00:38:01
we see a little bit of a a waiting period here. It wasn't until February 16th of 1965 that the naked body of
00:38:08
28-year-old Bridey O'Hare was found behind a storage shed. This is just less than a mile from where they found the
00:38:17
last victim. Mary Fleming had been found. And of course, she is found again with the same paint specs on her. So, if
00:38:26
you can't find your killer, you need to find where the paint is located or coming from. Right. Yeah. They had been
00:38:32
searching for the paint location for months. In fact, they had searched over a 24 square mile for the origin of the
00:38:41
paint. It was after the discovery of Bridey O'Hare's body that they were able to find a matching paint
00:38:49
sample. This was beneath a covered transformer. And they find this very near where Bridey's body was found. So
00:38:57
this transformer is near well it's opposite a paint spray shop that is located here in estates. They also
00:39:05
figure out that bridey had been mummified and this would have taken a heat source to occur. So again the
00:39:12
transformer here it meets all of this criteria right puts off some heat. Yeah the transformer would have heated up the
00:39:18
body. So, someone was keeping Bry's body there and had done so for some time and
00:39:25
probably the other bodies as well. And they find a paint sample, not this paint, you know, this paint could have
00:39:33
got there any number of ways. Right. Right. But I'm wondering if if this wasn't simply downwind, you know, if the
00:39:40
transformer was just downwind of the of the paint shop, uh, where specks or flexs of the paint would would travel
00:39:47
and get airborne. And I wonder if they just got airborne and traveled a short distance to the transformer and did the
00:39:53
killer even know that the paint was on the bodies until he, you know, heard it from police. Yeah. And the thing is is
00:40:00
this again this is the ' 60s so we don't have all these ventilation systems and and all these things to catch all these
00:40:07
particles with inside a warehouse. So it'd be more likely that you know cars parked outside this building would have
00:40:14
paint specks on it. Um people possibly even walking by would get paint specks on them. So So we got a couple things to
00:40:22
consider here. Are are the paint specks getting onto the bodies because they're stored near the paint shop and and it's
00:40:29
just getting airborne and carrying down wind on them or is the killer bringing those paint samples to the body uh that
00:40:38
he's in that paint shop and bringing them there when he visits the body or goes to dump the body. Yeah. Or
00:40:44
depending on how he paints. I mean, maybe he doesn't use gloves, so he constantly has paint on his hands. Then
00:40:50
there would be a transfer process there. So, these are considered to be the six or eight murders that are involved in
00:40:57
this case, depending on who you talk to. Some say that all eight were involved. Some say that three or four were
00:41:03
involved. Only the ones with the paint were involved. To me, they just seem very connected. You know, it seems like
00:41:09
the motive motive was the same. They're they're found in similar locations. The strangulation is pretty much the same.
00:41:16
And it if there's any differences between the the eight, they're very small. And so it's not like, oh, we got
00:41:23
two that don't make any sense and then these other six make complete sense together cuz the, you know, towards the
00:41:31
end they're not being dumped by the river. Now you could say, well, that's because security beefed up. But again,
00:41:37
that is something that is different in every uh victim's story. Yeah. And sometimes with these killers, they
00:41:43
either get lazy or they get complacent. You know, they feel like, "Oh, well, I've done this before. I haven't got
00:41:49
caught. I don't need to go to all these extreme lengths to not get caught, you know, throw the body in the river or
00:41:55
carry it all the way to the river. Um, I'll just put it right here, you know, um because I can. Because I've gotten
00:42:02
away with it before, they're not going to catch me now." I think it's more likely that he knew the cops were
00:42:07
patrolling heavier and they beefed up security and and he had to find a different option. And one thing that we
00:42:12
alluded to earlier which which you will see if if you study these uh serial killers especially the ones that are
00:42:20
involved in uh taking of prostitutes and and getting high numbers of kills. M they're very involved in watching the
00:42:28
news, listening to the news, reading all the newspaper articles about their case
00:42:33
because they're they're playing a game, you know, they're they're trying to to not get caught, to do what they want to
00:42:38
do. Yeah. It's the extra bonus on top of what they're doing. Their plan is to kill these people for for whatever
00:42:44
reason, whatever their motive is. On top of that, all now this has become big news. I also think a lot of these people
00:42:51
I think if you look through history of a lot of these serial killers a lot of them are loners and so the fact that
00:42:57
they're getting attention even though it's uh for a negative reason they kind of get off on the attention. You're
00:43:04
exactly right. The attention they get off on that but they also get off on thinking they're smarter than the people
00:43:08
investigating them. They also get off on the fact of well I know something that nobody else knows. Look at all these
00:43:15
people that are interested in this thing. Look at all these people that are trying to figure out who I am and what
00:43:20
I'm doing. Well, and that some of that is the society's fault because we've done this thing where a serial killer um
00:43:29
you know has a high kill count and then we start saying words as genius or mastermind. It's really like well it's
00:43:37
it's it's definitely a lack of intelligence that you're going to kill somebody. like just that uh idea in
00:43:44
general I think would be a lack of intelligence. And then you look at situations like Silence of the Lambs or
00:43:50
something where then we even you know now we got this guy that's extreme genius and all by the way he was a
00:43:57
killer. Right. And actually that movie, even though it's one of my favorite movies, the bad thing about
00:44:02
that is when you talk to a lay person that doesn't really know much about true crime or know much about serial killers,
00:44:09
they seem to think that it requires a high level of intelligence to be somebody like that and to get away with
00:44:15
it for so long. When actually when you study it for a very long time, you will figure out that most of the killers are
00:44:22
of average intelligence. Some of them are above average, some of them are below. uh it does doesn't really hold
00:44:27
true. You don't have to be of superior intelligence to get away with this stuff. Sometimes it's just luck. Um and
00:44:34
sometimes it's just you know people people most of the people are good. Right. So when when somebody's not the
00:44:42
serial killers, right? But when somebody's doing some horrible stuff, we just we don't assume the bad. Usually we
00:44:48
assume the good. So we do become a little bit blind to some of the things that are going on around us because of
00:44:54
that because you know there's only a small population thank God that are that are bad evil people. So speaking of bad
00:45:01
evil people let's talk about some of the suspects in this case right. So earlier
00:45:06
on we had saw a couple of the boyfriends or pimps were suspected of those murders. Of course. Um, do you think
00:45:14
they were called pimps in 1964 or was that something that came later in the '7s? Uh, not only that, I
00:45:21
actually think that because it was uh, England that they were probably called something different. Uh, I think they
00:45:27
were called pounces or p I read the word and it didn't really it didn't really didn't register. It didn't register.
00:45:33
Well, any of our London listeners, just uh, send us a message. Tell us what the technical term is over in London. Uh,
00:45:41
They might use pimp now, but right, I think pimp is pretty universal now, right? Uh but anyway, so we had seen a
00:45:48
couple of the boyfriends and some of the pimps uh that were that were uh potential suspects and they were for
00:45:55
whatever reason once they were only considered when their case was an individual murder case, right? And once
00:46:03
the police figured out and started connecting these things and now we have a string of unsolved murders, a lot of
00:46:09
these boyfriends or pimps were no longer considered, right? Because there it would make no sense and there would be
00:46:16
no zero connection with the pimp to these other prostitutes. Yeah. Other than the fact that they are pimps and so
00:46:22
they are in the industry. Mhm. And but other than that, there were however a few more interesting suspects. Uh, so in
00:46:29
the case of Irene Lockwood, police had found a business card for a man that was simply named Kenny on the business card
00:46:37
accompanied by a phone number. And we'll give out that phone number right now. No, we we don't have that phone number.
00:46:42
It's 444. Yeah. 444. Well, of course, the phone number makes sense. Uh, it makes it very easy to find this Kenny
00:46:52
character, whether that's his real name or if it's a nickname. But when they do track down the man, it leads them to a
00:46:58
former soldier and his name is guess what? Kenneth Archabald. Okay, so we are cooking with gas, right?
00:47:06
He at first denies having ever known uh the victim, Irene Lockwood. And he says that uh the only way that she would have
00:47:16
got his card, his name, his number, uh they found this in Irene's apartment, right? Yeah. He says that she would have
00:47:24
had to have got this from a third party that she received it from somebody else which is very possible because you have
00:47:29
somebody that what you know some services that maybe he can offer and somebody says oh you call my buddy Ken
00:47:37
Ken and then here's his number and but then here's the thing later he's brought in again. He's brought in again at a
00:47:44
later date for questioning and this time they get an entirely different response.
00:47:48
All right. He kind of freaks out on him and he shouts out, "I killed her. I've got to tell somebody about it." What?
00:47:55
Yeah. I've killed her and I've got to tell somebody about All right. Lock him up. Lock him up. I mean, even if he
00:48:00
didn't kill her, if he felt the need to scream this, then then just lock him up.
00:48:05
Well, he says that the two of them had argued about money and that he had must have lost his temper and strangled her.
00:48:12
He said that he must have See, it seems like he's assuming he blacked out. Yeah,
00:48:18
I think uh Kenny's got quite the drinking problem. Um and so it sounds like he's a little unsure of what he's
00:48:25
done. Uh but he did say that he took off Irene's clothes and he put her in the river and he said that he took the
00:48:32
clothes home and he burned them. Uh this sounds promising, right? Right. We got we got a guy here. Yeah. Where's the
00:48:39
validity? There's probably some questioning as far as the validity to his story. So what happens is he does go
00:48:47
on trial and when he goes on trial he retracts his confession. Oh surprise surprise. And this of course screws
00:48:53
everything up because they have no evidence on him other than the confession. Now Kenneth Archabald is a
00:49:00
57year-old former soldier and once they lose the confession well they lose the case. And they also did state that and
00:49:09
and they didn't state exactly what it was, but they did state that they found some inconsistencies in his confession
00:49:15
anyway. Yeah. And I think part of this could be one the drinking problem and then possible uh PTSD as far as being a
00:49:24
soldier is concerned. Um we you know a lot of people are asking us what what the what the deal is with false
00:49:32
confessions and I don't think there is a real answer. I think some people get pressured and they just don't know what
00:49:37
to say. Um I I don't have a rhyme or reason uh that seems to come up over and over. It seems like there's vary and
00:49:46
different reasons, but more or less it's the pressure that they're being put under. I you know I spoke to a detective
00:49:53
about that one time and he told me that he you know he didn't have the ability to do it himself but he said that he
00:50:00
knew of a detective that that that he swore that if you spent a certain amount of time in a room with this detective in
00:50:07
in an interrogation and uh and you got nervous enough he could probably convince you that you had done something
00:50:14
that you didn't do right and I don't know the psychology behind that but uh that you know that's that's what he said
00:50:19
that's a nice little power to have. Yeah, it's like Jedi mind trick, right? Uh now, again, I couldn't find out
00:50:26
exactly why the police ruled him out, but again, there were inconsistencies in the confession. They lose the
00:50:32
confession, they lose the case, and it does sound like from the things that I've read that police were starting to
00:50:38
doubt Kenny's confession before he even retracted it. Well, good good on them for doubting it because we've seen in
00:50:45
case after case where you get a false confession and the cops never let go of that. Mhm. And then they constantly go
00:50:52
back to those we got this confession. Well, the confession doesn't make any sense at one and then two, when they
00:50:58
confess again, there's no logic between confession number one and number two, and they just never let it go. And that
00:51:05
really hinders finding the truth. Yeah. Well, the thing here too is, you know, it could be something as simple as he
00:51:10
got some dates wrong, right? Maybe he says, "Well, I killed her on this night or I killed her on this morning and
00:51:16
she's actually been seen walking around on that time or after that time." Right?
00:51:21
Um, and the other thing we got to keep in mind, too, is he's admitting to one of the deaths, right? And we have eight
00:51:29
total and the police are pretty certain that they are dealing with a serial offender. So, and the other thing too
00:51:35
with Kenneth's confession that that kind of throws a wrench in the whole thing is
00:51:40
there was another girl that was found dead. This girl was found dead, you know, right around the time he's
00:51:46
confessing to it. Uh this was Helen Beth Bethamy. Uh we had talked about her earlier. Uh she was one that they had
00:51:53
discovered with paint on her. So, uh he may not have had the opportunity to be part of her murder. They figure out that
00:52:01
he couldn't have been part of that murder and she's got the paint on her. So, we know that this this is connected
00:52:06
to all the other ones and the person that he suspected of killing has that same paint on her as well, right? The
00:52:12
one that he confessed to. And these police said it's there's a possibility that the paint is just getting onto
00:52:19
these girls for some other reason. It could be, but he would have to have taken his victim to the same location or
00:52:25
brought the same paint to the victim as this other killer is bringing to all the
00:52:29
other victims. So that the the you know the math there is blowing my mind right now. Um so these are other reasons why
00:52:37
he was probably ruled out and we'll talk about some other police tactics. And there was another confession, right? How
00:52:45
many confessions we got in this case? Oh, there's like 50. There's 50. Well, there's probably a lot of people too
00:52:50
that after the fact years and years later, just kind of like with the Black Dalia and Zodiac and stuff like that
00:52:56
where people come out and say, "My father, it was my father that did it cuz this was a pretty popular case." Yeah.
00:53:03
Well, uh, John D. Rose, and I probably got his name wrong, but, uh, he was the head of Scotland Yard's murder squad
00:53:11
back then, and he was in charge during this investigation. And after his retirement, he would go on to write a
00:53:18
book called Murder Was My Business. He had some he he had a cool nickname. All right. So they called him 4day Johnny
00:53:27
because when he was involved with cases, they were solved very quickly. In his book, this case is featured quite
00:53:34
extensively, which of course makes sense as it's one of the largest investigations, I mean probably even one
00:53:40
of the largest investigations of the 1960s. So John, 4day Johnny as we'll call him, he decides he's going to turn
00:53:46
up the heat, right? This is during the investigation. He knows his man is still out there and he's going to try to shake
00:53:52
the bushes and see what comes crawling out. So John states that Scotland Yard, this is to the public, they had a very
00:54:00
large list of suspects and after uncovering the latest evidence and further factchecking that they were able
00:54:08
to whittle down the list to three suspects and soon that would shrink to just one suspect. Well, yeah, but they
00:54:17
did this thing in this case where they would say, "Oh, we have now narrowed it down to 40. We narrowed it down to 20."
00:54:24
Then and they kept on getting smaller and and you know then the big one was we got it down to three. But a lot of
00:54:30
people think that this was all just horseshit anyways. Well, I mean come on. You and I, Captain, we've seen this
00:54:36
tactic. This was used in our lifetime. It was used by the Boulder, Colorado police in the investigation of the death
00:54:42
of John Benet Ramsay. Right. And of course, uh it's probably been used in many investigations where you just say,
00:54:49
"Yeah, we got this big list. Now it's down to three." Yeah. Pretty soon it's going to just be
00:54:54
you, buddy. Yeah. And if you turn up that heat, you're hoping that they make a mistake or they just get so scared
00:54:59
that they turn themselves in. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. He John was thinking that maybe somebody would come forward and confess
00:55:05
or that the perpetrator would panic and do something crazy or something to get himself caught. But regardless, the
00:55:12
murders did stop. John D. Rose, now he is the captain of the murder squad that we've been talking about. So now I'm the
00:55:20
captain. Let's talk about 5 years after the last murder. D. Rose is on a BBC television show. He's doing an interview
00:55:29
and in this interview he claims that he knew the identity of Jack the Stripper. Now, furthermore, he says that
00:55:37
detectives had been preparing to make an arrest in March of 1965 when news reached them that the suspect that they
00:55:46
were looking for had committed suicide. the he had gassed himself in a locked up
00:55:51
garage in southwest London. Now, he explained that the press and the television publicity that had been
00:55:58
orchestrated by the police, it was intended to frighten the suspect and to make him run. And he go on to say,
00:56:06
eventually it did have the effect that they desired because the killer became so frightened that he took his own life.
00:56:14
In his 1971 memoir, Murder Was My Business, Ford Day Johnny, he rep he he repeated his claim saying that the man
00:56:22
had left a suicide note explaining that he was unable to take the strain any longer. At the end of the suicide note,
00:56:30
Captain, he says, uh, if the police are looking for me or I'll do the police a favor, I'll be in the garage. He says
00:56:37
something to that extent. And that's where they find him. Well, first of all, he's not invited into this garage. They
00:56:42
find himself. He's gassed himself in the garage. Um, another author, Brian McDonald, he fleshed out the suspect
00:56:50
further in his 1974 book called Found Naked. A different suspect. No, this is the same suspect. We're talking about
00:56:57
the same guy. Okay. It's just he goes into a little more detail in his book. And his book's called Found Naked and
00:57:03
Dead. He nicknamed the murderer as Big John. and he described him as a respectable man in his 40s with a wife
00:57:09
and several children uh that had suffered a grim childhood in Scotland characterized by an extreme puritan
00:57:18
puritanism and frequent beatings uh at the hands of his parents. While this Big John was serving in World War II, he
00:57:27
developed a habit of using prostitutes and would often turn to violence when he drank and vet his feelings of
00:57:34
self-loathing, beating up the prostitutes. Right? This happens a lot of time uh with Catholics as well. And
00:57:40
after he got out of the war, he later joined the police force and eventually he was turned down. Hold on, let me just
00:57:47
say the self-loathing part of being a Catholic. Okay, so thank you. You're not the kill him part. You're a Catholic.
00:57:54
You can speak. You can speak for yourself. I can speak for my own experiences. So after he gets out of the war, this
00:58:00
this this standup citizen citizen who's beating up prostitutes decides that he's
00:58:06
going to join the police force. Uh eventually he is turned down for a promotion. He's seeking the rank of
00:58:13
detective. He's turned down and at this point he starts drinking again and he turns to the bottle and eventually he
00:58:19
quits working for the police. Eventually John he finds work as a security guard and he worked at the herin trading
00:58:28
estate where the bodies were believed to have been stored for some time. Now remember we talked about this this paint
00:58:35
spraying company. It was a part of this herin estate and he worked as a security
00:58:40
guard there. So I think this is so he's a failed cop, works out as a security guard. Yeah. But but both uh 4day Johnny
00:58:49
and uh the author McConnell, they did refuse to reveal Big John's true identity for the sake that they claimed
00:58:56
that the killer's living relatives who remain oblivious to his crimes of the, you know, he's a suspected killer and
00:59:04
and they they left they didn't want the the family to to Well, yeah. and logically become victims, right? And
00:59:11
logically, this makes sense. I mean, there's all this heat gets turned up on this guy. He's had um some failures in
00:59:18
his life. He has a lot of self-loathing. And as they think they're getting closer
00:59:23
to, you know, capturing this guy and identifying him, possibly not so much to save himself, but possibly to save his
00:59:30
family, his kids, and everything like that. Well, I'll just kill myself. If I kill myself, chances are well, one, I
00:59:38
won't be killing anymore. So, that could be part of the rel religious uh background into him where he is uh
00:59:45
remorseful. Um because of the drinking, maybe he feels like because of the drinking and because of uh my childhood
00:59:51
and everything, I can't stop this. I've become some kind of monster. And so to rid the world of me being a problem and
01:00:00
then to take away the burden on my family, I'll commit suicide. Mhm. So I think logically it it all lines up. It
01:00:08
does all line up. And I think those are all factors as well. Plus the thing is it looked to this guy, if this is the
01:00:15
right guy, it looks to me like they were zeroing in on him pretty well and that he was going to be caught. And again, if
01:00:22
if he has connections with police officers, he could still have uh personal relationships with them,
01:00:28
possibly drinking buddies that are police officers. So, he's hearing more first and firsthand information. Um,
01:00:35
this seems like the clear path. I mean, like you said, is they go by the name Big John or whatever, so no real name
01:00:43
there. My thought initially when reading all this stuff and looking into this case was there's a lot of connections as
01:00:51
far as the the sex scene and I'm going to call it the sex scene or the sex industry because it's not just
01:00:56
prostitutions but possibly uh sex movies and things of that nature but there's a
01:01:02
connection between that and people of power in London. And so there was a lot of uh rich men and powerful men using
01:01:12
the services of the prostitutes then leading for the the um opportunity that they could blackmail
01:01:21
the people of power. And so I I always assumed not always but the last week of looking into this case was that I would
01:01:31
be looking at somebody that was actually not connected to the prostitutes at all.
01:01:36
somebody similar to this Big John guy where he's possibly not using the prostitutes, but that he is hired by the
01:01:44
higherups to, hey, take care of these problems. These girls are these girls are trying to blackmail us or maybe
01:01:52
something got out of hand or they didn't pay them again. We're going to go to the
01:01:56
to the press and and so they're hiring somebody that's taking care of all these problems. Yeah. and and possibly with
01:02:05
the higher ups and the rich and powerful having connections with the police. Maybe that's why they never solved it
01:02:11
because it did just stop because they stopped hiring them. But also maybe the rich and powerful took proper measures
01:02:18
to stop doing this foolish the foolish behavior of like going above and beyond what you know just uh the sex act. You
01:02:26
know, I'll pay you for sex and and you be on your way. And so to me, there's something still there. Uh I'd have to
01:02:34
read these guys books to dive into that their theory more. Uh it just sounds very logical where they're coming from.
01:02:40
And again, it's not just one author looking into this. This is another author diving into it more. And one of
01:02:45
those authors being the captain of the murder squad at the time. And now, like you mentioned, there was a pretty big
01:02:53
sex scandal going on in London at the time, and it did have some ties to this case, but when I looked at when I looked
01:03:00
at this, and this is the only reason why we didn't discuss it more than what we will now, was I didn't see ties to every
01:03:07
every victim. Well, I mean, you know, the tie would be the sex industry, right? Right. I I get that. But I I only
01:03:14
saw one instance where somebody was reporting things or was willing to testify against somebody in court. Um,
01:03:22
you know, these other people could have had these other victims could have had some ties to to this same-sex scandal. I
01:03:29
think what I'm seeing here though is I'm going to go with the with the lead investigators opinion of of that at the
01:03:38
time for day Johnny. And exactly and and what we were pointing out here was all the extra steps and precautions and all
01:03:45
the extra effort that the police put into this search. While it at the end it didn't it didn't bring the killer
01:03:53
forward, it didn't bring the killer to justice. However, the the guy in charge firmly believes that their
01:04:00
tactics eventually leaded to led to their guy. Yeah. And and the the justice here was him taking his own life. So, if
01:04:08
you'd like to dive into this case more, you're going to hear about this uh big-time scandal in London called the
01:04:15
Proffumo Affair. And if you can just Google it, go down a couple different rabbit holes. It's also on the Wikipedia
01:04:23
page if you look for the London nude murders or if you look up Jack the Stripper. Dive into the Poffumo affair
01:04:31
if you like. We could have spent a whole hour or two talking just about that and
01:04:35
not got to any of these victims or sus other suspects uh for this case. And I think Yeah. There but there's definitely
01:04:41
when you're going down the rabbit hole, there's definitely stuff that you run into dead ends. Mhm. So yeah. And and I
01:04:47
think that there trying to make it bigger than what it even was at the time. And I think that, you know,
01:04:53
hearing our opinion, I think that this guy has uh there's more ties to him to this case than what you will find in the
01:05:00
the affair case. Recommended reading for this week, Captain. You want to read a good book? Why don't you check out the
01:05:06
ultimate Jack the Ripper Companion? You know, we couldn't do this case without picking a Jack the Ripper book. There
01:05:12
are a bazillion Jack the Ripper books out there. You could check out any of them. You could that you Google it and
01:05:18
your your mind will be blown. There will be hundreds of them. But in my opinion,
01:05:22
this one is one of the best, if not the best. I'm not going to claim to have read all of them. Uh, but the ultimate
01:05:29
Jack the Ripper companion. It's an illustrated encyclopedia. It's got a lot of good drawings and pictures in it.
01:05:35
Plus, it's a big thick book. It's written by Stuart P. Evans and Keith Skinner. Anybody that has read Jack the
01:05:42
Ripper books knows that I think that Keith Skinner, if there's a hundred Jack the Ripper books, Keith Skinner wrote or
01:05:48
or worked on half of them. So, you're getting your information from one of the best ripperologists out there out there.
01:05:56
And you can pick that up by going to our website that is trueimeg.com and click on the
01:06:01
recommended reading page. You'll see this book amongst a whole bunch of others and you just click on the Amazon
01:06:06
banner and buy your book that way. And what's great about this Amazon banner is you can actually buy anything. I
01:06:13
actually just purchased electric violin for my friend Jess. It's her birthday. Happy uh 21st. We'll say 21st uh
01:06:22
birthday. Uh but it's simple. You just click on it and then it just takes you to basically a blank page and then you
01:06:28
start your search and you have to sign in. But it gives a little kick back to the garage and keeps the lights on and
01:06:33
it costs you nothing extra. And for everything True Crime Garage, make sure you go to the website true crimegar.com.
01:06:39
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Crime Garage. And don't forget to pick up your brand new True Crime Garage T-shirts that just came out this week.
01:06:52
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01:06:58
and do that. And much love to you. Thanks for the support. And make sure you tell a friend. That's right. Be
01:07:03
good, be kind, and don't litter. [Music]