00:00:00
Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences.
00:00:06
Listener discretion is advised. She's a little hundred pound girl and you're a killer dude.
00:00:16
Fuck you. No, fuck you. No, fuck you. What are you gonna do? Ask me in 30 years when you're halfway through your sentence if you're a killer.
00:00:24
we made it all the way to season 10 and the end of 2023 a year that i thought was for sure going
00:00:33
to kill me on a show called sword and scale that proves that the worst monsters are real
00:00:54
Well, like I said, it's been a hell of a year and not in a good way. We started out in a complete mess.
00:01:05
The site was broken. The app was broken. We worked really hard to fix it. We're going to launch a new app, a new website very soon in 2024.
00:01:16
We're going to take a short break because I'm going to crack if I don't. And, you know, we'll be back really, really soon.
00:01:24
as soon as we can with some major surprises for you. I think you're going to love them.
00:01:48
Starting a business sounds exciting until you actually do it. Then suddenly you're the product guy, the website guy, the shipping department, the marketing department, customer service, all of it.
00:01:59
And if you're anything like me when I started, you're thinking, am I doing this right?
00:02:04
Is anyone going to actually care? That's where Shopify makes a lot of sense. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world, including 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S.
00:02:17
They give you hundreds of ready-to-use templates so you can build a clean, professional online store that actually looks like your brand.
00:02:24
And once you're up and running, Shopify has tools for inventory, payments, analytics, returns, and international shipping all in one place.
00:02:33
They even have AI tools to help you write product descriptions, improve page headlines, and enhance product photography.
00:02:40
Plus, easy email and social media campaigns to help customers actually find you.
00:02:46
It's time to turn those what-ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 a month trial today at shopify.com slash sword and scale.
00:02:59
Go to shopify.com slash sword and scale. That's shopify.com slash sword and scale.
00:03:07
Cha-ching. When a murderer is committed, people usually want to know why. And oftentimes, that answer makes sense to us.
00:03:32
We all know what it's like to be jealous, angry, or want something we can't have.
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When a person kills for money or revenge, we get it. We don't necessarily condone it, kind of like that Chris Rock joke, but it makes sense in some way.
00:03:52
The motivations are, on some level, relatable. But every once in a while, a murderer comes along with a motivation that is not quite so relatable, not quite so easy to understand.
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They aren't driven by anger or jealousy. They don't seek revenge or wealth. Instead, they are driven by something much more frightening.
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All they want is to experience the planning and the crime itself. All they're really after is the thrill of the kill.
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In November of 2014, on the morning after Thanksgiving, A young med school student was fast asleep in his bed at the River Ranch Apartments in River Oaks, Texas, which is about a 10-minute drive from Fort Worth.
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As the student was sleeping off his turkey dinner from the night before, he was suddenly awakened by a scream that apparently had come from the apartment above his own.
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Do you remember doing anything after 6 o'clock? What awakes you next? It was just the scream upstairs.
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So at 7.30, you heard screaming? I was laying in bed, and it wasn't, I wouldn't call this a blood-curdling, high-pitched,
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top, loud, you know, I wouldn't describe the scream like that. It's more of a scream slash, like, yell.
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That's why, and then that woke me up. So I'm sitting there looking at the ceiling, and I'm racking my brain thinking,
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okay, what the heck is going on up there? Like, do I need to go up there? Like, my first thought was she woke herself up from a nightmare.
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And then I heard the real loud pound on the ground. After hearing the scream followed by a loud thud, this young man contemplated what to do next.
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Eventually, he decided to get out of bed and inspect his apartment. After he did, he found that everything seemed fine.
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So I get up from bed I go out and look around our apartment The cat just sleeping on the couch like nothing out of the ordinary And I thinking okay maybe I should go up there we having a heart attack seizure something like that
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I could save her or something. I look out the window, and that's when I told you I saw that black car leaving.
00:06:11
Ten minutes after that, my carbon monoxide started going off. And that alarm is so different than a smoke alarm.
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It's so much louder. So anything that I didn't hear anything after that, the alarm just turns out everything.
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The carbon monoxide alarm in the apartment started blaring. Soon after, the fire suppression sprinkler system activated, so the young man called 911.
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4705? Yeah. Stay with me. I'll get someone in there. The River Ranch apartment complex is a two-story quadplex
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that only consists of four separate dwellings. Even so, the med school student wasn't the only person affected by the assumed fire
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that had broken out in the apartment above him. Not long after this initial 911 call was placed,
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more emergency calls were transferred to the Fort Worth Police Department. Hello?
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Ma'am, this is the Fort Worth Police. You're calling 911. Do you have an emergency?
00:07:30
Yeah, the apartment's on fire, but it's up here. Okay, is it River River? Yeah, yeah.
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Okay, we have a call right now. Are you in one of the apartments that's on fire?
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I just got out. Okay, you just got out? Okay. Yeah, I think there's somebody in there, but I can't.
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You think there's somebody in there? Yeah. Okay. Eventually, emergency responders and Fort Worth firefighters arrived on the scene.
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They found that one of the second floor apartments was on fire, and they quickly began working to extinguish the flames.
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Meanwhile, a crowd of onlookers began gathering around the complex, and news of the fire quickly reached friends and family members of the River Ranch apartment residents.
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Fort Felicen 581, what's the address you're calling about? I'm actually calling in regards to a fire that you guys are working this morning.
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I'm not sure the exact address. It's my sister's address. One of her co-workers had called to tell me that her partner had caught on fire
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and that they aren't releasing any information to anybody. But we're all out of town for Thanksgiving.
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So we're trying to figure out how we can get information on if she's okay. Okay, what I'm going to do, you said it was your sister, right?
00:08:45
That's correct. Ashley Harris is your name. 31-year-old Ashley Harris lived with her golden retriever at the River Ranch Apartments
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and worked full-time as an assistant manager at American Eagle at the nearby Hewland Mall.
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Can you describe her duties as an assistant manager? Well, her department responsibility, because she was trying to get into store management,
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She had just taken over visuals a few months back, which required her hours sometimes to be a little longer, like later evenings, doing visual changes.
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And other job duties would be just running our sales floor during business hours.
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She was really big into loss prevention. That was her track. She wanted to eventually end up with our loss prevention department.
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So she would help me out with a lot of operational things. That's actually what she was strongest at was just making sure that everybody was trained on procedures
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and make sure that everybody was aware of what was going on in the store. As an assistant manager at American Eagle, Ashley Harris worked long hours
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and was paying her dues in hopes of eventually being promoted. Ashley wanted to be a loss prevention specialist.
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If you're not familiar, many retailers employ these specialists to safeguard the company's assets and prevent or minimize theft.
00:10:10
So Ashley was working her way toward the position that she ultimately wanted. She regularly posted videos of herself on social media while she was at work.
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I'm extremely tired, and this right here is not even helping. Look at my eyes. It's horrible.
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For anyone who has ever had a retail job, unfortunately, raising my hand, you can probably relate to how demanding and tiresome that kind of job can be.
00:10:42
It was JCPenney for me, in case you're wondering. Despite the long hours and demands of her job, Ashley maintained a good attitude and a healthy personal life.
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Again, Ashley lived at the River Ranch apartments, and she lived there with her beloved golden retriever, Nala.
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Sadly, in 2014, on the morning after Thanksgiving, a large fire broke out inside Ashley's apartment.
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Fort Worth firefighters were eventually called to the scene and as they worked to extinguish the blaze
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many onlookers and concerned friends of Ashley watched as flames and black smoke billowed
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out of Ashley's apartment as many of these onlookers anxiously waited for news of Ashley's well-being
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a few of them were questioned by police she works with American Eagle right here at the mall
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American Eagle over at the mall Okay. She went to work. She had to work on Friday, Larry.
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Uh-huh. She got home around 3.30. About 3.30? Yeah, because I was here. All right.
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I was here. I was coming back to work. I was coming up and now. Okay. And she got here and she said she was going to bed She had to wake up at 11 Uh And then I fell asleep for a little bit woke up and then I went in there and I told her I was leaving and she said she gone to bed she had to wake up at 11 And then I fell asleep for a little bit woke up and then I went in there and I told her I was leaving and I left and I went home
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What time was that? At 4.40 when I left here. 4.40 when you left here? 4.40 when I left.
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Was there anybody else in there with her? No. What? It was just her, huh? Family time.
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But you were with her until then you left. Then I left and went home. I texted her when I made it home, and I didn't see the response.
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Among the onlookers was a young woman that was well acquainted with Ashley. In fact, she and Ashley had been on a few dates together.
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Her name was Alexis Torres. And Alexis claimed that she was with Ashley just a few hours before the fire broke out.
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I first met Ashley about a year, year and a half ago. And, you know, we were just, you know, like I guess Facebook friends at first.
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We started really getting close, started hanging out just about every day. She became one of my really, you know, best friends, and then we started dating.
00:13:01
As is usually the case for retail workers, Ashley Harris had to work on Thanksgiving.
00:13:08
In what has become the American custom, many retailers open their stores on Thanksgiving evening
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as an extension of, and an early start to, Black Friday. You're all consumers, I don't have to tell you that it's the biggest single shopping day in the United States every year.
00:13:25
And kind of sets the tone for the whole Christmas shopping season. On this particular Thanksgiving day, Ashley was expected to work an especially long overnight shift at her American Eagle store at the nearby Hewland Mall.
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Ashley was having to work for Black Friday. So we had Thanksgiving at Tracy and Carrie's house, which is another friend of ours.
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We had Thanksgiving around, I believe it was about 2 o'clock. She left because she had to be at work, and she asked me to take care of Nala, her dog.
00:14:02
While Ashley was at work, Alexis looked after her dog. Early the next morning at around 3 a.m., an exhausted Ashley returned to her apartment.
00:14:12
Was Ashley still wearing the same clothes that she went to work in? Yeah, she was still wearing her same work clothes.
00:14:18
Can you describe those? She had on a red shirt. I don't remember what it said, but all of her employees were wearing it.
00:14:27
She had on jeans and her boots. She still had her keys. Where did you see the keys anywhere?
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She still had them on her belt loop. It was a pretty big clip. She always was putting it around her belt loop.
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According to Alexis, after Ashley came home, she and Alexis spent some time together before Alexis said goodbye and left the apartment.
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And we talked for about an hour, hour and a half. And I left her apartment at 340.
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I mean, not 340, I'm sorry, 440 a.m. She walked me out. I opened the door, the front door.
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I closed it and I heard her lock the door behind me. And I texted her at 4.53 and I told her I was home.
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And I didn't get a response. And just to clarify, I know I had asked you this before, but just so we can put it on the record,
00:15:21
was there anybody that Ashley ever talked about having problems with or that would want to harm Ashley?
00:15:28
No. By all accounts, Ashley Harris was an extremely well-liked, caring, and personable young woman.
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She had a lot of close friends, many of whom described her as having a magnetic personality.
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People liked to be around Ashley. Even people that only briefly interacted with her could easily recognize the overwhelming positivity that Ashley carried herself with.
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She was extremely nice, extremely just positive. It was only for a couple seconds. We were walking our dogs.
00:16:00
And I just felt just her positive energy. As the police investigated the fire at Ashley's apartment, one of the people they spoke to was her boss at American Eagle.
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Not unlike Ashley's friends and acquaintances, her boss had only good things to say about Ashley and couldn't imagine that anyone would want to hurt her.
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What kind of employee was Ashley? Fantastic. Ashley just, you know, tried to be as cordial to everybody as possible.
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You couldn't ask for a more positive person. The associates all just kind of attached themselves to her.
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She was like the mother of the store. She was my right-hand person. I depended on her for so much.
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Do you know if Ashley was having problems or trouble with anyone? No, that's what we're all beating ourselves up over.
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We just don't get it. Like, she didn't have an enemy in the world. Despite what everyone was saying about Ashley,
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the chaos at her apartment suggested that she must have had at least one enemy. Tragically, as Fort Worth firefighters were working to extinguish the blaze,
00:17:08
they found a body among the flames. It was female. She was lying face down. And it was obvious that the fire didn't kill her.
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Ashley Harris had been murdered. And an apartment fire has turned into a potential murder mystery in southwest Fort Worth.
00:17:31
On Friday, we told you about this. Firefighters discovered the body of a young woman inside her burning apartment unit along Keen Ranch Road.
00:17:38
But investigators quickly determined the fire was not the cause of her death. Arrest warrant affidavits say Harris was found with her ankles bound with gray duct tape.
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Her hands were also bound with gray duct tape behind her back. and that her body was partially burned.
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In the early morning hours of Black Friday someone or multiple people broke into Ashley Harris apartment and attacked her
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They bound her arms and feet with duct tape. They pistol-whipped her and strangled her to death.
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Then, they set her apartment on fire and fled. Interestingly, as police processed the scene, they determined that the only thing missing from the apartment was Ashley's work key.
00:18:29
For detectives, this was bizarre. Why would someone only steal a set of keys to American Eagle?
00:18:38
Was that all they wanted? What the detectives didn't know is that the person behind all this mayhem had a plan.
00:18:47
and part of that plan was to murder Ashley Harris. But another part of the plan included gaining access to the store where Ashley worked.
00:19:00
Ultimately, it was those missing keys that would help explain why someone wanted to commit this brutal crime
00:19:08
and why a well-liked young woman that seemingly had no enemies was viciously attacked and murdered.
00:19:17
Starting a business sounds exciting until you actually do it. Then suddenly you're the product guy,
00:19:36
the website guy, the shipping department, the marketing department, customer service, all of it.
00:19:42
And if you're anything like me when I started, you're thinking, am I doing this right?
00:19:46
is anyone going to actually care? That's where Shopify makes a lot of sense. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world,
00:19:56
including 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. They give you hundreds of ready-to-use templates
00:20:01
so you can build a clean, professional online store that actually looks like your brand.
00:20:07
And once you're up and running, Shopify has tools for inventory, payments, analytics, returns, and international shipping all in one place.
00:20:15
They even have AI tools to help you write product descriptions, improve page headlines, and enhance product photography.
00:20:23
Plus, easy email and social media campaigns to help customers actually find you.
00:20:28
It's time to turn those what-ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 a month trial today at shopify.com slash swordandscale.
00:20:41
Go to shopify.com slash swordandscale. That's shopify.com slash sword and scale.
00:20:49
Cha-ching. in november of 2014 fort worth firefighters were called to a fire at the river ranch apartments in
00:21:15
River Oaks, Texas. Inside one of the apartments, firefighters found the dead body of 31-year-old
00:21:21
Ashley Harris. Soon after, Fort Worth homicide detectives were called in to investigate,
00:21:28
and they quickly determined that Ashley had been murdered. Ashley's hands and feet were bound with
00:21:35
duct tape, and she had multiple lacerations and wounds all over her body. A medical examiner
00:21:43
later determined that Ashley must have been dead before the fire started because her aorta blood
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tested negative for carbon monoxide. The medical examiner also found that Ashley's eyes reflected
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strangulation. The cause of death was asphyxia and blunt force trauma to the head. There was no doubt
00:22:04
that this was a homicide. As for the fire, an arson investigator determined that rubbing alcohol
00:22:12
was used as an accelerant, and the fire had multiple points of origin, including Ashley's bed, her closet, and her body.
00:22:22
In other words, someone viciously beat and murdered Ashley, poured alcohol all over her body and her belongings,
00:22:29
and then set the apartment on fire before fleeing the scene. Thankfully, Ashley's dog survived.
00:22:38
I knew you were all going to worry about that, so I, you know, made sure to tell you.
00:22:42
Anyway, the pup was eventually adopted by Ashley's parents and he's doing fine. During the subsequent investigation, though, homicide detectives interviewed several people,
00:22:55
one of which happened to be a former police officer that lived in the same apartment complex as Ashley.
00:23:03
Later on, maybe around 7-ish or so, you told me... 7, 7.05, I come back out in a vacated spot.
00:23:11
It was a car that I didn't recognize. So between 7 and 7.05, you see a car in the spot next to Ashley's
00:23:18
that you recognize is not belonging to that complex. Correct. Not a car that I had seen before.
00:23:24
And can you describe what you saw? What I believe to be a black Infinity. And did you see anybody coming or going from that vehicle?
00:23:33
No, sir. Okay. So when you left for work at 720, you said the car, you meant the black infinity was still parked next to Ashley's truck?
00:23:42
Yes, sir. According to Ashley's neighbor, his typical morning routine included smoking a cigarette on his apartment's front balcony.
00:23:52
On the morning of the murder and before the fire broke out, this neighbor noticed a black car parked next to Ashley's truck.
00:24:00
It was a car that he did not recognize as usually being parked there. Don't you just love neighbors?
00:24:07
At the same time, Ashley's other neighbor, the young man that lived below her, noticed a black car leaving the complex just before his carbon monoxide alarm went off.
00:24:19
I look out the window, and that's when I told you I saw that black car leaving. Ten minutes after that, my carbon monoxide started going off,
00:24:26
and that alarm is so different than a smoke alarm. It's so much louder. So anything that I didn't hear anything after that,
00:24:32
I thought one of them just turns out everything. At this point in the investigation,
00:24:37
the cops had gathered a lot of information very quickly. They were trying to put all the pieces together.
00:24:44
But the one thing they knew right away was that they needed to find that black Infinity and its driver.
00:24:52
Somehow, the news of that car spread among Ashley's friends and coworkers. and it prompted Ashley's boss to approach detectives.
00:25:02
Now, from your understanding, what kind of car did Carter drive? I was told that it was a black, it's like a little black sports car.
00:25:11
Two-door, four-door? I believe it was two-door. I never saw it in person, just that picture that you forwarded over to yourself.
00:25:18
Now, when you approached us that day, how did you put two and two together? Because somebody, one of her friends, somebody had mentioned it,
00:25:27
the black car and as soon as she said it, Yasmin and I looked at each other and we were like,
00:25:32
is that Carter? Like Ashley Harris, 28-year-old Carter Cervantes was also an assistant manager
00:25:39
at American Eagle. Both women had worked at the same store and Carter happened to own and drive a
00:25:47
two-door black Infiniti. On the morning after the murder, the lead homicide detective on this case
00:25:54
decided to visit Carter's apartment, and when he arrived there, he found a black infinity
00:26:00
parked in the driveway. Rather than approach the home and knock on the door, the detective
00:26:06
decided to sit, wait, and watch. After a few hours, he saw Carter leave her apartment and
00:26:14
walk toward her car. But Carter wasn't alone. With her was a young black man that looked
00:26:23
to be around 18 or 19 years old. The detective watched as the young man got into the driver's
00:26:30
seat of the Infinity while Carter sat in the passenger seat. The couple drove off and the
00:26:37
detective followed until they arrived at the Hewlin Mall, the same Hewlin Mall where Ashley Harris
00:26:44
used to work. The detective continued watching as Carter stepped out of the passenger seat and
00:26:50
walked into the mall. Meanwhile, the young driver sat and waited in the parking lot.
00:26:58
At this point, it was around 8 a.m., and the doors to the mall were open, but many of the
00:27:04
stores inside were still closed. So, the detective decided to follow Carter into the mall as he
00:27:11
called upon another detective to put eyes on the young driver. Unfortunately, the detective in the
00:27:17
mall lost sight of Carter and was unable to find out where she went or why. The other detective,
00:27:24
however, decided to approach the Infinity and question the driver, who identified himself as
00:27:31
David Mallory. David explained that he had driven his girlfriend to the mall so she could pick up
00:27:38
some documents from her job at Aeropostale. Of course, that's not really where she worked, is it?
00:27:46
This struck detectives as strange because he knew that Carter didn't work there.
00:27:52
What a dumb lie. Some people are really bad at it. When the detective asked David for his driver's license, he explained that he didn't have one,
00:28:02
which prompted the detective to arrest him. David was then taken to the police station and questioned.
00:28:10
What did you guys do for Thanksgiving? We cooked. Stayed in, watched movies. What did you guys have for Thanksgiving?
00:28:20
A whole bunch of shit. I don't know. You don't have to? Yeah, yeah. Did you bring me to Castro, Techie?
00:28:27
You haven't got that friend number? No. Did you guys ever leave for dessert or anything in the house?
00:28:33
Mm-mm. So you didn't leave it all Thursday? No. In questioning David, detectives learned that he was Carter's live-in boyfriend.
00:28:41
And according to him, he and Carter spent their Thanksgiving at home together. He explained that all they did was cook, eat, watch movies, and sleep.
00:28:53
At this point, David had already garnered some suspicion from detectives, because when he was first approached at the mall, he presumably lied about where Carter worked.
00:29:04
So this morning, you guys get up. What's going on? What are you guys talking about? What are you doing?
00:29:08
I just get up and I took her to the mall. She said she needed some papers or something.
00:29:15
She would be in and out. She left her phone. I was waiting in the parking lot. Okay. What time is the mall open?
00:29:23
I'm not sure. She was going there to pick up paperwork? Pick up papers? I believe she said to pick up some papers.
00:29:30
Where at? I'm not sure. Does she work there or what? She said that she was going to pick up some papers.
00:29:39
Did you ask where? What paper? I mean, I wasn't too concerned about it. Detectives seemed to believe that whatever was supposed to happen at the mall that morning
00:29:49
had been orchestrated by David's girlfriend. They also seemed to believe that David knew all about her plan and they wanted him to tell them what the plan was We know that you know she doesn work at our hostel
00:30:05
Okay, you lied about that. Is there a reason why you're lying to us about where she works?
00:30:10
And I thought maybe I got confused or something. You know she hasn't worked since she left American.
00:30:15
She hasn't worked for two months. So here's the deal, man, is that you've got to be honest with us about what was going on this morning.
00:30:24
So what were you really in there at the mall do? That's what she told me. I was just telling her to get some papers.
00:30:31
She said she'd be in and out. David maintained his story and claimed that all he had done that morning was drive his girlfriend to the mall.
00:30:40
At the same time, David had some questions of his own. From his perspective, it was obvious that something more was going on here.
00:30:49
When someone is arrested for driving without a license, they aren't typically questioned by multiple detectives, much less homicide detectives.
00:31:19
just bullshitting me for about 15 seconds. Do you wanna let me know what's going on?
00:31:23
Because I mean, I would really like to know why I'm in this. That's why you're here?
00:31:26
I'm gonna tell you. You need to watch, I mean, we're not the ones that are bullshitting here.
00:31:32
You didn't intend to, I mean, you don't go through this length of investment. Okay, you're the smart guy.
00:31:36
You tell us why we're here. I don't know why the fuck we're here. Well, obviously you think you're smarter than us.
00:31:41
You tell us why you're here. You do this to all your people who, we do this to a lot of people.
00:31:45
For no driver's license. That's again, no. I don't. But you are a smart guy. You have figured it out.
00:31:52
You know what? I did want to talk to you. I did have an investigation going that I'm not going to be 100% honest with you.
00:31:59
I am not going to show you my cards. I'm not sure, but I know that. Hey, hold on.
00:32:03
Hold on. You asked me. You're hiding something. Yeah, I just told you. I'm not hiding.
00:32:07
I'm telling you. I'm not going to show you my cards. One tool that I have to talk to you is to arrest you for an offense that we see you commit,
00:32:15
which is what we did. That's why you're under arrest. I'm going to tell you quite honestly, 100% what I think is happening here is a woman is taking you down a bad path.
00:32:26
The detectives traded questions and accusations with David. But by the end of their conversation, neither side gave more than an inch.
00:32:36
David never admitted to anything, and he was eventually booked, taken before a judge, and jailed for driving without a license.
00:32:44
meanwhile the cops had also tracked down carter and brought her in for questioning as well
00:32:51
interestingly they found carter in the laundry area of her apartment complex which meant that
00:32:58
after david dropped her off at the mall carter must have made the long walk back to her home
00:33:04
so whatever carter had done that morning in the mall remained a mystery at least for the time being
00:33:12
Carter Carol Cervantes. Yes, sir. I know you mentioned David is your boyfriend. How long have you guys been together?
00:33:21
About a year and a half. How did you guys meet? We worked together at American Eagle, briefly.
00:33:26
28-year-old Carter Cervantes originally worked as an assistant manager at an American Eagle store in Amarillo, Texas,
00:33:34
which is about 400 miles north of Fort Worth. It was in Amarillo that Carter met
00:33:41
and began dating her co-worker, David Mallory. When the district manager became aware of that situation,
00:33:48
he gave Carter a choice. She would either resign or be transferred to another store.
00:33:54
Carter chose the latter. So how did you end up in Fort Worth? I had a job opportunity with American Eagle Outfitters
00:34:02
that brought me here. From Amarillo or Lubbock? From Amarillo. I worked with the company for about eight years.
00:34:09
It was maybe about seven, seven and a half and some change. And I was the store manager for them in Amarillo,
00:34:17
and they transferred me down here to work at Hewlin Wall. Are you still there? No, I'm not.
00:34:23
Before Carter made the move from Amarillo to Fort Worth, she called the American Eagle store manager in Fort Worth
00:34:29
and spoke to both him and Ashley Harris. But it's not like she was transferred here because she had ties to Fort Worth.
00:34:37
No, no, no, she didn't know anybody here. Matter of fact, whenever she was going to move here, she had called and talked to me and to Ashley and asked, like, what's an area that, you know, would be close to the store but kind of central?
00:34:51
And Ashley, I think, is the one that actually mentioned the Benbrook area. Carter made her way to Fort Worth and soon began working at American Eagle at the Hewlin Mall.
00:35:04
While there, things didn't go well for her. Carter struggled to get along with many of her new co-workers, which happened to include Ashley Harris.
00:35:16
Can you describe the relationship between Ashley and Carter? They never clicked. I mean, Carter never clicked with anybody in the store, from my understanding, except for the associates.
00:35:25
But again, Carter kept everybody at arm's length. She didn't, you know, Carter ever went over to her apartment to hang out or anything like that?
00:35:34
You didn't? Carter and Ashley were both assistant managers, but they were pretty much also completely opposite people.
00:35:43
They had conflicting personalities and approached their positions at American Eagle in different ways, if that makes sense.
00:35:50
While Ashley was an upbeat and exceptionally personable worker Carter usually kept to herself and maintained a matter attitude during her shifts Meanwhile back in Amarillo David Mallory stopped showing up for work and was eventually fired from his American Eagle store
00:36:10
David's name was placed on the company's Do Not Hire list, and he soon moved to Fort Worth, where he reunited with Carter.
00:36:19
Once there, Carter used her position as an assistant manager to falsify some paperwork
00:36:25
and hired David to once again work alongside her at the Hewlin Mall American Eagle.
00:36:33
Unsurprisingly, both Carter and David were eventually fired, but not for the reasons you may think.
00:36:41
I was put on a suspended leave of absence the week before, and then they decided to let me go on September 1st.
00:36:48
There was a robbery at Hewland Mall, and I had closed the night before. They determined that I had left the store and secured, so they let me go.
00:36:58
Was that case ever solved? No. Did you ever speak to detectives about that case?
00:37:02
No, it was never questioned, and I did not leave the store. I actually filed for unemployment and filed the company.
00:37:09
So where are you currently working? I'm not currently working. If you ask Carter why she was fired from American Eagle, she will tell you that she was accused of leaving her store unsecure.
00:37:21
But if you ask her boss, you'll get a more detailed explanation. I got a call one day while I was at church on a Sunday morning.
00:37:31
Our deposit from the night before had been stolen. So I went to the store. We had video inside of our store.
00:37:37
What had happened is the night before, she was scheduled, I believe, a 2 to 10 to be the closing manager to close down our registers.
00:37:50
And then Carter was scheduled to work, I believe, a 3 to midnight or a 4 to midnight.
00:37:56
Three months before Ashley Harris was murdered, in August of 2014, there was a robbery at the Hewland Mall American Eagle.
00:38:06
On the night of that robbery, Ashley Harris had done a shift change with Carter.
00:38:11
And during that brief time that they were working together, Carter did something unusual.
00:38:17
Carter, around 7 or 7.30 that night, told Ashley that she was going to take the trash out.
00:38:24
And Ashley thought it was strange. It's something that Carter, you know, Carter was very hands-off.
00:38:29
She didn't, a lot of that stuff was beneath her. So either way, she took the trash out and left the back door unlocked.
00:38:37
A few hours later, Carter and a couple of other employees finished up their shift, closed the store, and left.
00:38:45
So that night, I believe at 5 or 10 minutes after 12, you can see on the camera, Carter and her team leave the building,
00:38:54
locked down the front gate, and they leave. At about 1.15 in the morning, you see on the camera a black male walk in from my back door onto my sales floor.
00:39:05
He's wearing like a black hoodie or a dark hoodie, pulled up over his head, wearing gloves.
00:39:12
He walks over into my cash and wrap area and bends down. He walks directly to the safe, bends down, puts a key in, unlocks it, and takes the deposit.
00:39:24
It was a little over $18,000 deposit, and then takes that same path back out. A masked thief, dressed in black, casually walked through the unlocked back door,
00:39:35
reached into the store safe, and left with about $18,000. Needless to say, it was highly suspicious that this thief somehow knew that the back door was unlocked.
00:39:48
At the same time, this thief seemed to know exactly where to go to get the money.
00:39:54
These retail workers sure are smart. A week went by after we were doing our investigation,
00:39:58
and I was told to contact Carter and terminate her employment for policy violation for leaving the store unsecured.
00:40:06
And then as far as the theft, it was put in the hands of Fort Worth PD to kind of go from there.
00:40:13
We were going to press charges, assuming that it was moved forward on their end.
00:40:19
Okay. After the robbery, Carter was let go. It was assumed that she planned the robbery.
00:40:27
But aside from firing her and handing the investigation over to the police, there wasn't much else that American Eagle could do.
00:40:35
At that point, nobody at the store knew that Carter was dating David Mallory. But that didn't stop Ashley Harris from putting two and two together.
00:40:45
As soon as I walked in that Sunday morning and Ashley hits the play button, she goes, that's David Mallory.
00:40:51
I said, OK, so what about that? Do you know that's David Mallory? She goes, it's the way he's walking, the way he carries himself, how skinny he is.
00:40:59
That's David Mallory, like without a doubt. In watching the surveillance footage, Ashley could easily tell that the mass thief was David Mallory.
00:41:09
His mannerisms in lanky frame gave him away. Even so, the managers at American Eagle were never able to question David about the theft
00:41:19
because after it happened, David just for some reason never came back to work. So, so curious.
00:41:28
So, so, so curious. Somehow he suspiciously just disappeared. Weird. And after that incident with the theft, was David ever put back on the schedule?
00:41:41
Was he fired? Carter? We, our policy is that they have to have three consecutive no call, no shows. So I put him
00:41:49
on the schedule for three consecutive shifts and he never picked a schedule up, never showed up.
00:41:53
So he was terminated So that was shortly after the death Did he ever come back No sir Okay Ashley Harris believed that Carter planned the robbery and David carried it out
00:42:06
And given that David never came back to work, her assumption was all but confirmed.
00:42:11
Even so, the police investigation into this theft dragged on for months. David and Carter were never even questioned by police about it.
00:42:21
Carter took it very hard when she was terminated. like she was not going to go down without a fight.
00:42:26
But she took it extremely hard. But she also knows that Ashley is the one that called and turned her in.
00:42:32
Given the nature of Carter's departure from American Eagle and her response to being fired,
00:42:38
it wasn't unreasonable to suggest that Carter may have had an axe to grind with both the store itself and the very recently murdered Ashley Harris.
00:42:50
When Carter was brought in for questioning the detectives, were already highly suspicious of her.
00:42:56
And as she was interviewed, Carter didn't do herself any favors to sway those suspicions.
00:43:01
In fact, she really only made things worse. At one point during the interview, detectives briefly left the room,
00:43:09
but not before offering Carter something to eat or drink. Are you good with Cheez-Its or do you want something else?
00:43:16
Oh, no, I'm fine. I don't need anything. Do you want a bottle of water? I guess so, yeah.
00:43:20
Okay. All right. We will be right back. Carter accepted a bottle of water from one of the detectives who left the room after handing it to her.
00:43:33
Carter opened the bottle and took a sip. She then went for another sip but abruptly stopped before taking it.
00:43:41
Then a look washed over her face that can only be described as, oh shit. What have I done?
00:43:52
Carter then put the water bottle on a nearby table. She grabbed the tissue from a nearby tissue box and used it to wipe down the water bottle.
00:44:04
Huh? What was she doing? Wiping away fingerprints from the water bottle? Wiping DNA, maybe?
00:44:13
What'd you guys do for Thanksgiving? We were here for Thanksgiving. It was just me and him.
00:44:18
So did y'all go to dinner or did you go to... I actually cooked. I made turkey and there was stuffing and mashed potatoes and green bean casserole.
00:44:29
Did anybody join you for dinner? No, it was just the two of us. What time did you guys have dinner?
00:44:34
We actually ate all day. I made it as a lunch and we had rented movies on Wednesday night.
00:44:41
That's Wednesday when you watch this? No, Wednesday we rented those movies so we could stay in all day on Thursday and watch movies and eat.
00:44:48
And like David, Carter explained that she and David were at home on Thanksgiving.
00:44:55
She claimed that they cooked, ate, watched movies, and slept. She also explained that on the following day, she and David briefly left Carter's apartment to check on some Black Friday sales before returning home later the same evening.
00:45:10
Naturally, Carter never mentioned anything about going to Ashley's apartment, committing murder, and setting the place on fire.
00:45:18
Okay, so this morning, what time did you guys get up? I woke up about, I don't know, I guess it was about 7.30 and talked to him for a little while and then I kind of fell back asleep.
00:45:29
Okay, and then what time did you wake up? I woke up about 9.15, 9.30. I put the laundry in and then I was waiting for the office to open when I saw your detective.
00:45:41
Okay. Carter told detectives that on the morning that David got arrested in the mall parking lot, she never left her apartment complex.
00:45:48
she claimed that when she got out of bed david was just gone and she didn't know where he went
00:45:55
what carter didn't know was that the detective she was telling the story to had watched her
00:46:01
leave the apartment that morning and drive to the mall with david i don't know how i can put this to
00:46:08
you but i'm going to stress to you that you need to be completely honest with me because to this
00:46:14
point, you have not been 100% with me. Okay? Okay. And I'm telling you that you're in a bad position right now.
00:46:22
Because we know what's going on. We know what has happened over the last few days.
00:46:26
Okay? Okay. And we knew what was going to happen. Okay? Okay. Before revealing what he knew,
00:46:33
the detective gave Carter one last chance to revise her story. But she never did. Carter
00:46:40
stuck to her easily disprovable lies. All right, so let's start with this morning.
00:46:46
Okay. All right? This morning. Okay, what time do you get up? About 7.30, 7.45. And then what happens then?
00:46:53
And then we talked and I went back to sleep. When I woke up, he wasn't there. I know that's a lie.
00:47:00
No, it's not. You know why I know it's a lie? Why do you know it's a lie? Because I saw you come out of your apartment and get in the passenger seat of that car
00:47:08
and I saw him drive out of there. That's why I know it's a lie. You're lying to me.
00:47:13
I'm sorry. You were in that vehicle. I'm sorry. I saw you exit that vehicle. I saw you get in that vehicle, and I saw you exit that vehicle.
00:47:21
All I've done today is take the laundry. Okay, well, we're going to start over by what happened today.
00:47:25
I'm sorry. I did not do anything this morning. Okay, I know you didn't do anything this morning.
00:47:30
Except for go take the laundry and go check my e-mail. You're lying to me. You are lying 100%.
00:47:36
How did it happen? Now you're making yourself seem like you're just a terrible person.
00:47:42
You're a liar that doesn't give a damn about your life. No, not at all. Why can't you just be completely honest?
00:47:47
I am being completely honest. Do you understand what he's saying? He was there. Okay.
00:47:54
He watched you. He followed you. He don't stop. Okay. He saw it. His own eyes. It's not what someone told us. It's what he saw with his own eyes.
00:48:05
When you can't be honest about the little things, when we get to the big things, nothing matters.
00:48:11
Despite what the detective had seen, Carter maintained her story. For whatever reason, she did not want to place herself at the mall.
00:48:23
And the cops wanted to know why. What exactly were Carter and David planning to do that morning?
00:48:30
I don't know what you know what a you know what DNA is right you have a problem with me getting a sample of your DNA yes I would have a problem with that do I
00:48:39
need an attorney what am I being you're not under arrest what what a buccal swab I just like to do buccal swab inside your mouth and get a sample of
00:48:47
your DNA no would you be willing for us to consent a search of your residence no
00:48:53
is there a reason yes because I have rights and I'm an American citizen and just because you're the police doesn't make you the Gestapo.
00:49:01
Again, Carter had not done herself any favors. She had presented herself as an uncooperative liar.
00:49:09
And for detectives, that meant she must have been guilty of something. Whatever that something was involved the murder of Ashley Harris,
00:49:20
the Hewlin Mall, and probably American Eagle. For a time, several questions lingered over this case.
00:49:30
Who killed Ashley Harris? Why did they do it? And what exactly did Carter and David originally plan to do at the mall on the morning after the murder?
00:49:42
The cops already had the assumption that Carter was a terrible person and a criminal.
00:49:49
But as they began answering those big questions in this case, it became clear that Carter was much more sinister and sociopathic than anyone could have ever suspected.
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00:51:44
On November 28, 2014, the dead body of 31-year-old Ashley Harris was discovered inside her apartment.
00:51:52
Ashley had been beaten and strangled to death and her killer or killers set her apartment on fire before fleeing the scene
00:52:02
One witness saw a black two-door infinity leaving the apartment complex just before the fire set off smoke alarms and the building's sprinkler system
00:52:13
Fort Worth police quickly learned that Ashley's former co-worker, 28-year-old Carter Cervantes
00:52:20
owned a black infinity. Within a day of Ashley being murdered, Carter was questioned by homicide detectives,
00:52:29
as was her 19-year-old live-in boyfriend, David Mallory. Carter and David had both worked alongside Ashley Harris
00:52:37
at American Eagle at the nearby Hewlin Mall. But Carter and David were both fired
00:52:43
after $18,000 was suddenly stolen from the store. It was presumed by the store's management staff, which included Ashley Harris, that Carter planned the robbery and David carried it out.
00:52:58
Three months after the robbery, Ashley Harris was found dead in her apartment. 31-year-old Ashley Harris was murdered Friday, November 28th.
00:53:09
Police say because she turned in two co-workers for stealing almost $20,000 from the American Eagle store where they all worked.
00:53:16
Well, Steve, Ashley Harris's neighbors at her apartment complex were awakened on that morning by fire and even water from sprinklers leaking down through the ceiling of their apartments.
00:53:29
Police say that they were eventually led back to Harris's co-workers who were suspected in that theft back in August.
00:53:37
But they weren't arrested for the murder until this weekend. During their initial police interviews, neither David nor Carter admitted to any wrongdoing.
00:53:46
They didn't come clean about the robbery, and they certainly didn't come clean about the murder.
00:53:52
A few more weeks went by which allowed police to gather more evidence Eventually David and Carter were both arrested and charged with capital murder After these arrests were made David was given another opportunity to speak to detectives
00:54:10
And during this second interview, David got a taste of the overwhelming evidence
00:54:15
that cops had on both him and Carter. And although your phone was locked, we were able to get into Carter's phone,
00:54:22
the one we recovered from the car the day that we got her. So we've got a lot of stuff on her, and we've been able to make sense of a lot of it.
00:54:30
And I know there was a lot of communication between you and her. There was some planning.
00:54:34
At one time in Abilene, when you were working up there, she wanted to basically hit a lick over at the American Eagle there.
00:54:40
Some of the most damning evidence that the cops found came from David and Carter's cell phones.
00:54:47
In reviewing their text messages, detectives learned that before robbing the Fort Worth American Eagle store,
00:54:54
Carter and David plan to, quote, hit a lick in Abilene, Texas. For those of you that aren't career criminals, the term hit a lick means basically to steal a lot of money from a very easy target.
00:55:10
There was some extensive surveillance done by her watching one specific manager and her car.
00:55:17
The plan was basically to disable her car and then continue with what she wanted to do.
00:55:24
And there's no doubt in our mind that you were aware of that because when we get your phone, all the corresponding text messages are there.
00:55:32
Based on Carter and David's texts, it was apparent that they had followed and surveilled an American Eagle store manager in the Abilene Mall parking lot.
00:55:41
They planned to disable the store manager's car, incapacitate her, and steal her work keys.
00:55:49
The end goal was to break into the American Eagle store and rob it. We've also got pictures, which are pretty damaging mostly to her, about what she was
00:56:02
up to and what she was planning to do. And David, I think Detective Peyton and I are both thinking that she was a mastermind
00:56:10
behind this thing, and that's been our position the entire time that we've been investigating
00:56:14
this case, that she was a mastermind. She's a person that likes to manipulate people.
00:56:19
She's a sociopath. She likes to lie. And she's going to stick to her lies. Given that Carter seemed to be the mastermind of this criminal duo,
00:56:29
detectives were hoping that they could get David to flip. What they truly wanted was details about what happened inside Ashley Harris's apartment
00:56:39
on the night that she was murdered. Let's start with the Abilene situation. Explain to us what was going on with that whole Abilene planning.
00:56:50
I don't know, man. She don't want to work. She kept trying to get me to quit my job and trying to go hit a link with it.
00:56:57
So tell me what her plan was. She didn't really just, like, disclose everything to me.
00:57:03
She just really told me that she wanted to hit Abilene. For the majority of this interview, David tried to maintain as much plausible deniability as possible,
00:57:14
which wasn't easy given everything the cops found on his cell phone so what was the plan how how was
00:57:22
she going to get the keys from the girl she never told you come on baby you gotta be honest man man
00:57:28
i'm asking you because i already know do you remember ever going into hewland or to the
00:57:33
abilene mall and kind of scoping out the american eagle for you ever remember going in or snapping
00:57:38
pictures of the manager's schedules. There's a reason why you're taking this picture.
00:57:47
That's what I'm getting at, David. I didn't take that. She took that. She showed it to me.
00:57:53
She sent it to you on your phone? She sent it to you by text? She sent it from my phone to her phone.
00:57:59
It's stuff like this, David, that this is stuff you need to be upfront about. I mean, this is something you would have remembered.
00:58:06
Despite the pretty clear-cut evidence, David maintained that when it came to any criminal activity, Carter was doing her own thing.
00:58:16
David claimed that he just kind of watched from the background, didn't help with any of the planning, and wasn't privy to any of the details.
00:58:27
So explain to me exactly how it was supposed to go down in Abilene. There wasn't really just like the set plan.
00:58:32
I mean, she said she wanted to get the keys. I mean, that was the plan. She wanted to get the keys.
00:58:38
From one of the managers? Yeah. Okay. Were you guys going to follow her away? She never said.
00:58:45
She just kept saying that she was going to get the keys. But then you mentioned something about a tire earlier.
00:58:49
Yeah. I mean, she said, well, maybe I can pop her tire and she would just be in the parking lot.
00:58:56
Carter and David plan to attack an unsuspecting woman in a parking lot and steal her work keys.
00:59:04
They exchanged text messages as they surveilled the woman and discussed each move as they went along.
00:59:11
But in the end, David convinced Carter to abandon this plan. This is from her to you. Do you think she parked to walk out of the movie theater doors?
00:59:22
You respond, yeah, she did. And then you respond, she's not too far from where we'll park.
00:59:29
And then she says she has a purse. And then you respond. so that's most likely where they would be.
00:59:35
Then she asks you, which side is it on? And then you respond, I like it. It all just doesn't seem feasible.
00:59:42
You're there. You're watching. You're talking to Carter about what's about to happen.
00:59:48
But then you kind of try to back out and say this doesn't seem feasible, which kind of goes back to what we're thinking.
00:59:53
You the smarter guy in this whole situation She trying to make you do this But when you sitting here trying to lie to us about what really happened it doesn make sense to us David Eventually David explained that Carter had filled his head with fantasies
01:00:08
According to him, Carter wanted the two of them to become cross-country bandits.
01:00:13
They could plan and commit robberies in one state and then move right on to the next.
01:00:18
America was their oyster and they were going to be the next Bonnie and Clyde and fuck man I'm 19
01:00:28
who doesn't want all that money I mean fuck I come from the hood man I've never seen $10,000 in my life
01:00:34
she said I quit my job and I could go help her scope out wherever the hell she wanted to go
01:00:42
she said we can go anywhere she said I have this car and it has low miles we can go anywhere
01:00:46
We can go anywhere we have 50 states that we can choose from. She wanted to be Bonnie and Clyde.
01:00:53
So she just continued, continued to continue. Like, just kept agging and agging and agging.
01:00:57
Like, you need to come on, you need to come on, you need to come on. You need to hit the flicker, you need to come hit a liquid, you need to hit a liquid, you need to quit your job.
01:01:04
David and Carter abandoned their plan to rob American Eagle in Abilene. But they followed through with their plan to rob the American Eagle in Fort Worth
01:01:14
and walked away with $18,000. This ultimately led to both of them getting fired,
01:01:23
but David and Carter weren't finished with the Fort Worth location. After losing their jobs, they came up with a plan to hit the store again,
01:01:33
and that plan involved the person that identified them as thieves, Ashley Harris.
01:01:40
But if you had Ashley's keys, you could get in back doors? No, no, no. I mean, like we entered through the front door, through the gate.
01:01:49
We just raised it up a couple feet, go underneath it. And Ashley had keys to that gate?
01:01:53
Correct. Okay. Yes, sir. So if I had Ashley's keys, I could get in there, and I could also get in the deposit box?
01:02:01
Absolutely. In the early morning hours of November 28, 2014, Ashley Harris returned to her apartment after working a long and tiresome Black Friday shift at American Eagle.
01:02:15
Detectives theorized that shortly after arriving home Carter Cervantes and David Mallory forced their way into Ashley's apartment and attacked her.
01:02:25
They bound her feet and hands with duct tape, pistol whipped her, and strangled her to death.
01:02:33
Then they stole her work keys and set her apartment on fire before fleeing the scene.
01:02:39
The next morning, Carter and David drove to the Hewlin Mall, and they planned to use Ashley's keys to break into American Eagle and rob the store before it opened.
01:02:50
Surveillance cameras captured a masked woman trying to unlock the store's front gate.
01:02:57
That woman was, quite obviously, Carter. What Carter and David didn't realize is that a homicide detective had followed them to the mall,
01:03:07
and Ashley's keys were completely useless. Cervantes and Mallory had been fired from their jobs at American Eagle Outfitters at Hewland Mall
01:03:16
after they were suspected of stealing nearly $18,000 from the store safe in August.
01:03:22
Harris had identified the pair as the suspects. The police documents say Cervantes and Mallory planned to go back to American Eagle to take $40,000 to $50,000 in Black Friday shopping sales.
01:03:34
But they needed the keys from Harris. The day after Harris was killed, Cervantes was seen on mall security video, police saying she appears to be trying to unlock the gate.
01:03:45
What Cervantes and Mallory didn't know, the locks had already been changed. The evidence that police had gathered in this case was overwhelming.
01:03:56
That's what happens when nitwits commit crimes. Lots of evidence. Despite this, David maintained that he had never been to Ashley's apartment
01:04:09
and that he had nothing to do with the murder. Wasn't me, said David. He also claimed that on the morning after the murder, when he dropped Carter off at the mall, he didn't know what Carter was planning to do.
01:04:46
there she was there okay well we know that's not the case you knew what she went to the mall that
01:04:50
day that you took over there to do that was part of her plan you knew she had the keys okay maybe
01:04:56
you don't want any part of it you know what you said i'll drive you and that's your thing
01:04:59
she got to be honest about that i had no knowledge about her having these keys you're making a huge
01:05:05
mistake how i'm not telling us what we're asking you're not telling us the truth you're not filling
01:05:11
in those pieces for us. And you're going to put me in the mix with her. I'm trying to, man. I know
01:05:16
what the fuck you're trying to do. David, I'm trying to identify what you did, man. I didn't do
01:05:20
shit. That's what the fuck I'm trying to tell you, man. At the very minimum, we know that you were
01:05:24
there, that you drove her there. We know that for a fact. To where? To the location where this
01:05:29
happened. To the mall? Yes. Y'all got me. Y'all got me. And the night before. No, no, hell no.
01:05:37
Oh, you're saying that's a lie. Yeah, that is a lie. Okay. Detectives knew, or at least strongly
01:05:42
suspected, that David went to Ashley's apartment with Carter and helped commit the murder.
01:05:49
But no matter how hard they pressed him David simply wouldn give it up What did she tell you say to you or show you reference the death of Ashley Nothing man I had no idea nobody got killed man
01:06:06
If I had knew somebody got killed, man, I wouldn't have helped her, man. I swear to God.
01:06:09
So you're saying if you had known somebody gotten killed, you would not have helped her?
01:06:14
Hell no! There's no way she could have done this by herself, man. She was 100 pounds at the most.
01:06:20
the way that that scene looked, there's absolutely no way she would have done this by herself.
01:06:26
I can admit, man, I've done some bad things in my life, man, but I've never, ever murdered somebody,
01:06:33
bro. Imagine this. You're sitting in a police interrogation room and a homicide detective is
01:06:40
accusing you of a murder that you didn't commit. Would you just sit there and meekly say,
01:06:47
I've never murdered somebody bro I get that everyone reacts to situations differently
01:06:52
but let's just say if that were me and I were innocent of course I'd be innocent
01:06:57
I wouldn't murder anyone but let's just say that were me I wouldn't be that casual
01:07:03
in fact my inner Hispanic would probably be coming out and I'd be screaming at the detective
01:07:09
telling him that they have the wrong man they made a mistake demanding a lawyer immediately
01:07:16
before anything else comes out of my mouth, in fact. In any case, these particular detectives kept pushing David and dumb David
01:07:26
eventually offered to give them more information in exchange for a deal. Basically, David was willing to tell the truth, finally.
01:07:36
If, and only if, he could get something out of it, that is. I need a guarantee, man, that y'all aren't going to railroad me like her.
01:07:44
I need a guarantee. And what kind of guarantee you have? I don't know, man. A document.
01:07:50
I need something. We don't do that here. This ain't the time for documents. The documents is when we tell the DA's office that we want to use you.
01:07:58
That's when the documents start coming in. Y'all ain't going to do that, man. I know y'all ain't going to do that.
01:08:02
What are you talking about railroad? How are we going to railroad? Y'all are trying to...
01:08:05
David, we're trying to ask you what she did. This is a fucking capital case. We're asking you what she did.
01:08:09
This is a capital case, man. I understand that. I'm glad that that's finally sunk in your head if that's what this is.
01:08:14
Again, the evidence in this case was overwhelming. Not only did detectives not have the authority to offer David any deals, but quite frankly, they didn't need to offer him any deals.
01:08:29
They had him dead to right. Not really sure what that expression means. I just, I've heard it said before.
01:08:36
So there it is, dead to right. Not sure if I even said it the right way. but besides that the purpose of this interview was really just to make the case even stronger and
01:08:47
to more specifically determine what carter and david did on the morning of ashley's murder
01:08:54
okay tell us what you did because we know that the very minimum you drove her there you may not
01:08:59
gone in and did what you did to this girl or she did what they did to this girl but the very minimum
01:09:04
you drove and there's a difference somebody just drives and somebody actually goes in and does it
01:09:08
I didn't even drive there. I don't know where this took place. Did she drive and you just stay in the car
01:09:14
and you were supposed to like honk or something if something happened? No. Okay.
01:09:18
But you were at least there. I wasn't there. I'm telling you, Dave, you're not just doing this
01:09:22
for yourself, man. You gotta do this for other people. Man, I can't tell you. I told you the lies that I told you
01:09:30
and I told you the truth about them. The people that matter, the jury, there's gonna be people that are made aware
01:09:36
of this interview. And I want those people to know this truth. The only reason not to tell the truth about all this
01:09:47
is if you're a killer. If you are a cold-blooded, thieving, stealing killer, then stick to it, because you have nothing else.
01:09:59
There is nothing redeemable about you. That is the only reason to stick to the lies,
01:10:05
Because you can't swallow the pill of being a killer. You're big enough to do it, but you're not big enough to admit to it.
01:10:13
And that makes you nothing. That makes you unredeemable. That makes you a liar. That makes you a capital murder actor.
01:10:25
After three hours of interrogation, detectives determined that they weren't going to get anything else from David.
01:10:33
He was sticking to his guns and unwilling to admit that he took part in Ashley's murder.
01:10:40
So detectives called it quits, but not before getting in a few more well-deserved jabs.
01:10:48
And let me tell you something. If we were sitting in different chairs and you were accusing me of it,
01:10:55
I'd be standing up, screaming, yelling, stark raving mad if I was innocent. You have never been that.
01:11:01
You never will be that Because you're guilty of killing Ashley Harris Fuck you No, fuck you
01:11:09
You want to talk to me? What are you going to do? Huh? Because I'm going to walk out of here
01:11:16
And that's all you got When I confront you with the truth And get in your face like a man
01:11:24
Because you're 19 now and you're a man And when I confront you with the truth All you can say is fuck you
01:11:29
That doesn't hurt me dude because that doesn't affect me. That's a kid's answer.
01:11:34
That is the way of an ignorant child who has nothing else. Everything I tell you is a lie.
01:11:41
You've been confronted with your actions. You've been confronted with your deeds.
01:11:47
I terminated your actions. Shut your bitch's ass up. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done.
01:11:53
I'm done. You ain't gonna sit here and call me. That's the real David. You got me fucked up.
01:11:59
That's the one I'm done. Let's see, right there. That's the one I wanted to see.
01:12:04
I'm done, man. It had nothing to do with Carter. You're the thug from the hood who killed her.
01:12:10
She's a little 100-pound girl, and you're a killer, dude. I'm not no killer. Oh, yeah.
01:12:16
Ask me in 30 years when you're halfway through your sentence if you're a killer.
01:12:20
Take me to the county. Yeah. You're going. David made his choice. He was not going to cooperate with police, and this interview came to an end.
01:12:31
But not before one of the detectives made a prediction. Unless we know exactly what you did that comes out of your mouth,
01:12:38
I'm not talking about Carter telling us, because I guarantee you, the sooner or later she'll want to be sitting right here.
01:12:43
She may not get the opportunity, but I can guarantee you that she's going to try.
01:12:47
And we don't want her telling your story. This is your story. Like I told you the first time, you cannot afford for somebody to tell your story.
01:12:53
because I can guarantee you that she's going to make you the bad guy. She's going to say it was David's plan.
01:12:58
He's the one that hated this girl. He's the one that needed money. She's going to put it all on you, David.
01:13:03
I'm telling you, man. But surprisingly, detectives turned out to be completely right.
01:13:09
In May of 2016, Carter Cervantes took her case to trial. She testified in her own defense,
01:13:16
and her story was one that we have heard many times before. I was very afraid of him.
01:13:29
I thought he was going to kill me. According to Carter, David was violent, sexually abusive, and controlling.
01:13:39
Yes, of course, she's going to claim these things after she's caught red-handed, as always.
01:13:46
She claimed that their relationship had devolved to the point where Carter was in fear for her life
01:13:53
and that David had threatened to kill her on multiple occasions. So, naturally, Carter had no choice but to do exactly what David told her to do.
01:14:06
How many times have we heard that before? He was telling me what to drink, what to eat.
01:14:13
and he made me have sex with him. While on the witness stand, Carter also claimed that in order to keep her in line,
01:14:26
David enlisted the help of two of his friends to rape Carter. Somebody pushed me down right when I got into the apartment,
01:14:35
took off my sweatpants and pulled them down to my ankles and they raped me. Were you okay?
01:14:46
Yeah. I was screaming. Carter spun quite a tale and was clearly hoping to garner some sympathy from her jury.
01:14:58
It all sort of reminds me of a certain Aquaman actress. When prosecutors were given the chance to cross-examine Carter,
01:15:08
one of the things they asked her about involved her police interview. They wanted to know why Carter had wiped down the water bottle that the police had given her.
01:15:19
Carter response was just as surprising as it was unbelievable Carter claimed get this that she wasn trying to wipe away DNA or fingerprints No no no no that silly
01:15:34
She was just trying to wipe away the overwhelming smell of semen. Because the water bottle reminded her of being raped by David's friends.
01:15:47
I swear to, I swear to, I swear to, I can't make this up. I didn't know how to sell myself. It's just water. It's just water. It's nothing. But I can still smell it.
01:15:59
As for the morning of the murder, Carter's story wasn't all that different from David's.
01:16:05
According to Carter, the murder must have been carried out entirely by David while she was asleep at home.
01:16:12
The next day, David drove Carter to the Hewland Mall, gave her Ashley's work keys, pointed a gun at her, and demanded that Carter use those keys to rob the American Eagle store.
01:16:24
He gave me some gloves, told me to put them on, and then he handed me a pair, a set of American Eagle keys.
01:16:33
And he said, go in and open the gate, bring me that fat-ass deposit. I shook my head that I wasn't going to do it.
01:16:43
And he said, you don't understand. There's somebody sitting outside your parents' house right now.
01:16:49
If you don't go in, I'm going to kill them, and then I'm going to kill you. During Carter's trial, a lot of details about this case were revealed.
01:16:58
For starters, when police searched Carter's car, they found a semi-automatic pistol with Ashley Harris' DNA on it.
01:17:07
The prosecution theorized that this gun was initially used to gain Ashley's compliance when David and Carter broke into her apartment, and was later used to pistol whip her, which explains the bruising and abrasions on Ashley's body.
01:17:24
Also, Carter had clearly surveilled Ashley's apartment during the weeks leading up to the murder,
01:17:30
as there were several photos on her phone of Ashley's apartment complex, Ashley's truck, and the stairwell leading up to Ashley's front door.
01:17:42
Just a quick pro tip if you're thinking of murdering someone, don't take pictures of their apartment beforehand.
01:17:50
I know some of you are dumber than most, but, you know, there it is. There's a tip for you.
01:17:58
That one's for you. Prosecutors also revealed that this wasn't a situation of a robbery that incidentally turned into a deadly homicide.
01:18:09
No, this was a murder. The murder of Ashley Harris was always part of the plan. Also found on Carter's phone were text messages with David that included map coordinates.
01:18:24
These coordinates led police to a shallow grave in a deserted area of Abilene, Texas, about 100 miles away from Ashley's apartment.
01:18:35
Police also recovered a sales receipt and surveillance footage of Carter purchasing gloves, a tarp, and two shovels.
01:18:43
I mean you might as well just walk into the police station with the evidence at this point if you that dumb The prosecution theorized that Carter planned to abduct Ashley steal her work keys murder her and then bury Ashley in that shallow grave
01:19:01
For whatever reason, and much like the rest of Carter's plan, things didn't really play out as intended.
01:19:09
Instead of driving Ashley to her intended burial site, Carter and David must have decided to leave her body in the apartment and burn the place down.
01:19:18
Of course, no thought or consideration was given to any of the other occupants of the apartment complex.
01:19:28
The thought that more people could be injured or killed didn't even cross their minds.
01:19:35
As for David, he also took his case to trial and maintained the same story that he told detectives.
01:19:44
His lawyers argued that if Carter did go over to Ashley's apartment and murder her,
01:19:49
David knew nothing about it. In the end, both Carter and David were unsuccessful in convincing their respective juries
01:19:57
that their partner was solely responsible for the killing. They were both convicted of murder and sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole.
01:20:09
In Carter's case, the jury deliberated for only two hours. Which came as no surprise, because frankly, Carter was a shitty criminal.
01:20:19
As for her motivation, things aren't as simple as they may seem. Yeah, Carter had an axe to grind.
01:20:28
She was angry that Ashley accused her of robbing American Eagle. She was angry that she got fired.
01:20:34
And yes, Carter wanted to steal a lot of money. But all of those things were just peripheral.
01:20:42
Carter's criminal acts were driven by something much more complicated. I can tell you that she is, do you know the word narcissistic?
01:20:50
I think she's one of the most narcissistic people I've ever come across. Just looking at her pictures and stuff on her phone.
01:21:00
Her world revolves around her. Her world is all about her. Have you ever seen her do something for someone else?
01:21:06
When detectives investigated this case, it didn't take them long to understand Carter Cervantes.
01:21:15
She obviously lacked empathy and remorse. And she had complete disregard for the law.
01:21:25
The woman was a textbook sociopath. And when it comes to killers like her, the easily understood motivations for murder, like anger, revenge, or greed, don't really apply.
01:21:40
You see, Carter Cervantes is what is commonly referred to as a thrill killer. She wasn't seeking victory over Ashley or revenge against American Eagle.
01:21:54
What truly motivated Carter was something much more terrifying to the average human being here on Earth.
01:22:06
What truly motivated Carter was the agony of her past defeats. And like most thrill killers and sociopaths the only satisfaction that Carter could find was planning out and carrying out her crimes Any money or retribution that she gained as a result was just a bonus for her
01:22:31
A cherry on top, if you will. Two years after the murder of Ashley Harris, Carter took her case to trial and tried to lie her way out of trouble.
01:22:44
She demonstrated that she had not changed and will likely never change. She knew every step of the way that what she was doing was wrong, and she didn't care.
01:22:58
She didn't care about the life she took or the people she hurt. And her only regret was that she got caught.
01:23:13
Well, it's hard not to get a little sentimental at the end of the year, but I do want to say that I love you guys.
01:23:29
I know it's hard to hear that from another adult that you've never met through a telephonic computer device.
01:23:37
But I mean it. You guys have changed my life so much for the better. And you've affected the lives of countless others who work on this show every day, try to bring you the content that you appreciate.
01:23:53
Try to do it in a respectful and responsible way. All of us here at Sword and Scale and especially I appreciate you so much.
01:24:06
you guys who are still here actually see through the bullshit you actually see what's happening
01:24:15
you see that authenticity is no longer valued that people value fake fucks politician like
01:24:23
fake fucks that'll tell them everything they want to hear and that's not me that'll never be me
01:24:29
i just tell the truth because that's all that i know how to do so if you're still here with us in
01:24:35
2024. Thank you. And stay safe. Hi, Mike. My name is Dominique and I'm in Houston. And I just listened
01:24:44
to Plus episode 153 and it pissed me off. I consider myself to be pretty liberal, but I'm over
01:24:52
all of these new ass diagnoses for mental health disorders. Give me a damn break. Okay. This is
01:25:01
what happens when you breed an entire generation of athletes that get participation trophies because
01:25:08
they showed up now they don't know how to take rejection and when they get told no now you gotta
01:25:14
stab someone this is dumb but that's all great podcast that our listeners since like day three
01:25:21
it's amazing keep doing what you're doing and everybody else can kick it off Outro Music