00:00:00
This is exactly right. Isn't some far off concept? It's already here. Next starts now.
00:00:33
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selling a persona of confidence and care, patients trusted him. He wore cowboy boots in the operating room
00:00:45
and became sought after by patients. He promised to heal them. Instead, he left a trail of broken bodies.
00:00:51
This is a story of greed, betrayal, and a fight for justice. Listen to Dr. Death the Cowboy wherever you get your podcasts
00:00:58
or binge the entire series right now only with Audible. Goodbye. The best parts of summer aren't just places, they're feelings.
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00:01:28
My favorite murder Hello and welcome to My Favorite Murder. We have an announcement to make.
00:01:47
We are so excited to tell you we're going to take a break for the summer. We're going to go on a small vacation.
00:01:54
After five years. Yes, an actual vacation. We appreciate your support in advance.
00:02:02
It is much needed. We've been podcasting through a pandemic, and we're done doing that for a little while.
00:02:11
So we're going to take a summer vacation. Yeah, you guys have been actually telling us to do this through thick and thin.
00:02:18
You guys have been like, take a break. So we hope you have a great summer. We're going to take a little time to ourselves and we will see you back here pretty soon.
00:02:27
And until that time, stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Goodbye. What's up, Detroit?
00:02:40
Yay! Holy shit. Did everybody come? That's crazy. Mitt and murderinos. Wow. Yay!
00:02:56
My God! This is the first place anyone ever gave us red flags, right? The original red flag.
00:03:10
So smart. Because now we demand them. And if we don't get them, we're real mean about it.
00:03:17
There was a lady that we met at the meet and greet, and she came through with one that was, like, really nice felt or something and hand-stitched, and I fucking grabbed it out of her hand.
00:03:27
And she was like, I'm not giving that to you. I just brought it. I made her give it to me.
00:03:34
I made her give it to me. I forced her into it. Oh, this is the most beautiful theater we've ever done.
00:03:41
This is historic. Some might say historic. Yeah. You know you're up for a treat when you walk backstage
00:03:52
and there's just a giant photo of Liza Minnelli back there. Oh, shit. Yeah. It's on.
00:03:57
It's scrappening. That's why we have to get that song and dance done. Damn it. We keep talking about it, but really.
00:04:04
Right now there should be a spotlight. We've got like this. Tear our dumb dresses off.
00:04:11
Just wearing weird kick pants. what if we tear our dresses off and you're wearing this dress under that
00:04:17
and I'm wearing this dress under that and it just keeps going on and on for three hours
00:04:23
we should not be working out these ideas in front of the audience shit they will not be surprised
00:04:29
take a note of those yeah please cut that out Stephen! Stephen! this is Stephen's flag
00:04:38
because it's green like a dinosaur Oh my god, there's fucking ushers in actual suits
00:04:48
Or did they just come dressed like that? He might be an audience member, I don't know
00:04:55
Then he pulls his suit off and he has half my dress and half your dress on Sorry, I forgot
00:05:00
That's what's read in the news High five Yeah Yes! That's what I got into this business for
00:05:11
yes interactive theater okay we'll put this we'll put this in steven's file that we forget backstage no he's not here tonight though sorry you guys
00:05:25
we know he's done us he's been he's been texting we know he's been texting us today though from
00:05:33
uh niagara falls he found yeah there's a there's a margaritaville in niagara falls that steven
00:05:39
and found, I'm not kidding, it was like 11.30 this morning when he was like, guys, there's a Margaritaville.
00:05:47
And then I think he got drunk and started texting us because it was like, did they have poutine here?
00:05:53
And you like you in Canada Stephen Of course they have poutine Stephen It not in Canada What Yes it is Niagara Falls One side of it is
00:06:05
It's both. Oh, fucking thank God. I was like, they're about to kill me. They're about to kill me live on stage.
00:06:14
Did you hear me? I'm going to have to jump on that guy's back and get out of here.
00:06:19
Emergency exit style. I said Stephen was like they should no Stephen said I'm going to get really drunk
00:06:27
and then go over the falls in a barrel and I said if that Margaritaville doesn't serve their drinks and barrels
00:06:33
they're doing something wrong wouldn't you drink so many more yes like Moscow mules
00:06:39
a little barrel with like a lady in it come on I love that and if you swallow the lady it's good luck
00:06:46
and you start to hallucinate and shit. Because the lady's made of acid? That's right.
00:06:55
And then he sent us a photo of him in front of Niagara Falls and I said, oh, I hope you put a tarp
00:07:04
on your mustache, which I thought was hilarious but neither of them reacted to it.
00:07:08
Don't you hate that? At that point I was like, I don't feel like talking to Stephen anymore.
00:07:14
And I don't have to. I pay him. Just kidding. I actually really have to every day.
00:07:22
Oh, this is my favorite murder of the podcast. Hi. Thank you. This is Karen Kilgarib.
00:07:31
Thank you. This is Georgia Hardstar. You may recognize her. That's Eminem, everybody.
00:07:38
Eminem is here. Marshall Mathers just arrived front row. He pulls off his dress and what's underneath it?
00:07:47
Kim Basinger. Yeah. Oh, right. I get it. His drug-addled mother from the film 8 Mile.
00:07:55
I got it. Keep up. Keep up. It was a deep cut. But I'm there with you. 100%. Oh, this, you might know this already,
00:08:04
but we have an official announcement for the podcast. Going forward, SSDGM now stands for...
00:08:15
Did you hear? It's a major change. It's a major change. You got to get with it. Get hip to God.
00:08:25
And high five the Lord. This is one of the best stories we've ever heard. A woman is walking.
00:08:35
I can't remember. I want to say the airport, but that's where we were. And so that's how my brain works.
00:08:40
They were all right next to me when it happened. She sees a woman with an SSD GM shirt.
00:08:46
So she runs up and goes, are you a murderino? As you're supposed to do. You just scream it.
00:08:51
As you all well know. And the woman is like, I don't know. The post said she looked at me like I had 45 heads.
00:09:02
And then the woman tells her, I don't know what you're talking about. My daughter said that this stood for stay saved, do God's mission.
00:09:14
Best daughter ever. Who is that girl? Who is she? She's our new best friend. We must find her.
00:09:21
She's replacing Steven. She's a super genius. Oh, my God. Lying to your mother is my favorite party trick.
00:09:29
It's so good. There's something in that, too, where it's like, Mom, I need to borrow the car.
00:09:40
Yeah. You said you wanted to borrow one of my shirts. That part doesn't work yet, but I'm going to make it work.
00:09:45
Yeah. And then, but the justification is she had to use Christ to trick her mother into wearing one of our shirts.
00:09:56
It's a good little, like, do you ever do things like when you're a kid that they'll never know about?
00:10:01
And it's just like a fuck you to your parents. Like I was setting the table once and I like, I think I licked my mom's fork and then put it on.
00:10:09
Well, now you. Yeah. There you go. A burst of power. Just for you. You take that power.
00:10:15
if you can. That's right. I drove the car when I was 12. That's what I did. I just,
00:10:21
my parents went away for the weekend and my sister started crying. She's like, you can't do it. And
00:10:26
I'm like, I'm going to do it. Then I drove the Volvo like half a block and only then realized,
00:10:34
oh, I have to figure out how to turn it around and get it back to the house. I have that dream all the time where I can't steer a car. It's just exactly like that.
00:10:43
Yeah, I lived it. It's so intense in real life. Tell us about your outfit. Oh. If you feel like it.
00:10:52
Oh, this? This old thing sponsored by Land's End. I bought this dress. Well, first I'll tell you this.
00:11:04
I thought I'd be responsible and finally go replace the Spanx tights I've been wearing for what seems like 10 years.
00:11:12
My tour tights, I like to call them. Just wash them and throw them in the drawer.
00:11:16
Keep on pulling them out over and over. At least you wash them, though. Well, that's a key element.
00:11:21
But I finally was like, I need to get new ones. And I'll get a new body shaper. While in there, I'll just go and clean out the Spanx aisle.
00:11:32
That's what I get to do. That's my power. And what I ended up doing is kind of not paying attention.
00:11:40
I think I was texting you at the time and doing other stuff, not really focusing.
00:11:45
And what I ended up doing was getting these, what do they call it? They look like the shorts that those weird bicyclists wear on the weekend.
00:11:52
That's what I have under this dress. They go like from here to here But then they also kind of rolling down but they pushed a lot of my back fat up So I have uh I have back cleavage right now
00:12:09
Yeah. It feels wut woo great. Thank you. But the, uh, one thing that's saving me is of course,
00:12:18
this dress has pockets. So we can't, Oh! Sorry. I tried to give you a flag to put on your...
00:12:27
I'm so sorry. Okay, keep going. Thank you. Thanks. I just let my back cleavage. Thank you.
00:12:41
The thing to do when you're really self-conscious about something backstage and then you get freaked out about it
00:12:46
is to directly point it out in front of an entire fucking... I wanted to say it before we said, what's up, Detroit?
00:12:52
But Georgia was like, can you just hold on that for four minutes? Okay, we're going to start with back cleavage.
00:13:00
Can we go into that my boobs aren't big enough for this vintage dress? And some vintage woman, old woman, I don't know, woman from the past.
00:13:09
Really filled this thing out. She's dead. She's dead for sure. Okay. But here it is.
00:13:14
A little bit like a clown, like a circus tent. I love it. I know, I love it too.
00:13:18
It reminds me of Mary Tyler Moore. It's really good. Yes. Oh, I think you need to feature, though, the most important thing you've brought here to Detroit.
00:13:30
Oh, my peeling sunburn? Yes. Thank you. It's in the peeling phase. The hotel, the lotion that they have at the hotel, my legs laughed at it and kicked it out of the room.
00:13:42
Oh. This isn't going to do anything. Your sunburn bullied the lotion? Wow. Yeah, it's pretty.
00:13:47
tell them what else about our hotel. Oh. This is real. I actually, and this is how I found that,
00:14:02
because I was like, what if I went to the gym? Oh. What if I did that? And I was like, you can't.
00:14:08
I could. No one knows me here. I could put my hair in a top knot and go to the fucking gym
00:14:15
like one of those people. So I was like entertaining that idea. So I took out the little book and I'm going through the amenities.
00:14:23
I'm not finding a gym. And at one point I think they don't have one. I'm like, that's so fucking badass Detroit.
00:14:29
Just to not offer a gym in any ways. Very. Take a walk around the block. Yeah. Live your fucking life.
00:14:39
As I'm going through page by page, I find that this particular hotel offers a podcast studio
00:14:48
We've hit peak hipster what the fuck Then I'm like I'm gonna call down the front desk and be like do you have to get a room to use the podcast studio?
00:15:01
Or could I roll in from the other side of town and just start my Buggin dinosaur podcast if I wanted to like what are the rules and regulations? How big is it?
00:15:13
Is it just a Zoom with a mic in the corner of where the printer is? Some guy's on a hotel computer while you're trying to podcast.
00:15:23
Sure. He's like, this is the business center. Sorry. It's a podcast studio. Anyway, Temptation Island this season is insane.
00:15:37
Should we sit down? Do you want to? Sure. We might as well. This is a nice chair.
00:15:44
All right. Oh, it's cushy. Yeah. I might take this back to the podcast studio tonight.
00:15:51
What do you think they have there to sit on? Oh, beanbags. You know it's being loud, crunchy beanbags.
00:15:57
Beanbags. Great for podcasting. This spank is really doing something here. I can feel it.
00:16:05
I can feel it. Oh, do you want to talk? Do we still do that? Yeah. What's up balcony? We respect you
00:16:18
Glad I said that Thank you. Thanks for being here and thanks for climbing all those stairs
00:16:26
Good people There's some of you in here tonight who have brought others We'll just call them others
00:16:37
against their will. I think one of those people is probably Vince's sister's husband.
00:16:42
Yeah. I can imagine. Your brother-in-law? Yes. I'll do the family math on that one.
00:16:52
Yeah, there are people in this room, as many of us know, who have no idea what's going on right now.
00:16:57
They're just like, well, there's two girls with flags who are proud of pockets. We don't know.
00:17:03
We're not sure. They're texting other people. What the fuck? How much money did they pay for this?
00:17:11
And, you know, when you read it in the newspaper, we've had some misunderstandings in the past, by the way.
00:17:17
Some of our favorites are people thinking it's a murder mystery play. It's not. No, it isn't.
00:17:26
The two old ladies are, I don't know, middle-aged. I'm not sure what their age was.
00:17:33
Some women in Texas who thought that it was the sequel to The Phantom of the Opera?
00:17:41
It kind of is. No, it is. Yeah. You're going to find out what happens tonight. They have a baby and they move to the suburbs.
00:17:52
He never takes that mask off. What if he takes the mask off and underneath? No I won do that anymore He takes the mask off and both of our dresses are underneath it So anyway it a true crime comedy podcast And for people who don listen to the podcast and don know us or know our personalities
00:18:08
some people get very offended by that concept because murder, there's one of them.
00:18:15
Murder is the worst thing that can happen to a human being or a human being's family.
00:18:20
And comedy doesn't seem to have any place in that. But if you listen to the podcast, you know that those things actually run parallel to each other because that's the way George and I interact with each other.
00:18:31
But we also love to talk about this horror show of our world in the in the area of true crime.
00:18:38
So essentially, all I'm trying to say is if you find that concept offensive, you can get the fuck out right now.
00:18:49
Give us a chance, brother-in-law. Give us a chance. Walk out in 20 minutes. Pretend you're going to get a beer.
00:19:00
Go hang out with Vince backstage. I respect that if you Irish could buy us during this show.
00:19:05
I would love it. That's my whole jam. Leaving places inappropriately. Whoa. Okay.
00:19:13
Do you go first or do I go first? I believe it's me. I think so too. But we just have to get these flags just right.
00:19:19
Look at this. I know. It's fancy. It's like a race car control. We had that shipped in from the 80s.
00:19:27
Okay. While the world watches the stars at the FIFA World Cup this summer, Hyundai has its eyes on the next generation of talent.
00:19:36
The future soccer stars who are already turning heads at age 14. Making plays that end up on everyone's feed,
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scoring from angles that don't make sense, rewriting record books that barely had time to gather dust.
00:19:47
Because Next doesn't wait for an invitation, and Hyundai doesn't either. Hyundai has always moved the future within reach.
00:19:53
Hyundai did it by making advanced safety standard on every vehicle. Hyundai did it by engineering EVs with ultra fast charging capability.
00:20:00
And Hyundai continues doing it every day. From robotics that change how people live to young athletes changing the game,
00:20:06
the future isn't some far off concept. It's already here. Next starts now. Hyundai, an official partner of FIFA.
00:20:13
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00:21:10
Terms and conditions apply. See pandora.net for more details. Goodbye. Goodbye. The story I'm going to tell everybody tonight happened a long, long, long, long time ago.
00:21:22
It's the murder in the Rattle Run Methodist Church. What did you guys do? Never heard of it.
00:21:32
Not one fucking person has heard of it. And there's a bunch of pissed off Methodists in here right now.
00:21:38
They're just like, uh-uh, uh-uh. I mean, when are they not, though? Let's be honest.
00:21:42
I don't know a single Methodist. Oh, you've got to meet Methodists. They're hilarious.
00:21:48
Is it down here? All right. So this is where we're talking about. Is this a... Where is it on the...
00:21:55
I don't know. I don't do the mitten thing. It's none of my business. I'm from California.
00:22:02
It looks like this. Pontiac's over here somewhere. All right. Anyhow. The city Rattle Run.
00:22:15
Rattle Run? Yeah. Okay. Yeah? Yeah. It doesn't exist anymore. Okay, great. It was really just a very tiny town.
00:22:24
Okay. But there is an unincorporated community in the western part of St. Clair Township called Rattle Run.
00:22:33
All 6,423 citizens of St. Clair are here tonight. Let's hear it. For the township of St. Clair.
00:22:45
I actually looked on St. Clair's website. Oh, they have a website? They sure do.
00:22:49
It's great. All the pictures are from a Christmas party they had at some point. Oh, my God.
00:22:55
And then there was a picture of their Santa Claus and Mrs. Claus. And it looked so much like the real Santa Claus that I started going,
00:23:03
that would be amazing if the real Santa Claus just lived in Michigan. No one would ever catch him.
00:23:10
He looks like everybody else. It's the last place. He looks like everybody else in that room where they took the picture.
00:23:17
Yeah. It's amazing. I was just like, this is like, I can't figure out if this is a mystery comedy movie I'm going to write or a historical biopic.
00:23:27
Either way, get ready. Get ready. What am I talking about? I hate going first. Okay.
00:23:35
You really got to kick it open. uh rattle run is listed in alan naldrett's book lost towns of eastern michigan
00:23:43
there's a whole fucking book jesus guys yeah you lose your towns all the time so many towns lost
00:23:49
in this state it's tragic when it's like when it's here it's like is it but i don't know if
00:23:53
it's up here or it's here it just kind of it floats yeah floats away it's a pity
00:24:01
To the UP. Did anyone carpool here from the UP tonight? Thank you. Thank you. Did anyone bring us any venison from the UP?
00:24:17
I like to do local jokes. Local jokes get you local work. That's the old saying in stand-up comedy.
00:24:24
Thank you. heading up to the UP after this to do a week at some casino. Okay. Okay.
00:24:35
I'm really starting now, I swear to God. I wish you wouldn't. Keep going. Rattle Run was given their first
00:24:43
post office, or their only post office, in 1876. It closed in 1907. Wait, it opened in 1976?
00:24:51
No, it sure didn't. It closed in 19... Girl, 1876. Got it. Did I say 19? Probably not.
00:24:58
Okay. I heard it, though. You heard it. That's right. So they couldn't handle a post office.
00:25:08
Something to take into consideration as I tell you this story. Two years later, after the post office was officially taken away from them by the government,
00:25:16
what did stay open was the Rattle Run Methodist Church. Oh, looks like a church.
00:25:26
Looks like Amityville horror. The church. The church. This church was presided over by the Right Reverend John H. Carmichael.
00:25:41
Let's see if I did this in the right order. There he is. Oh, is he on a dollar bill?
00:25:45
Oh, God, it's a H. It looks like a, oh, it's a playing card. You know how the Methodists like to have playing cards of other reverends?
00:25:53
Of all your favorite reverends around? Seeking gamble with them? Eastern Michigan?
00:25:59
They're great for gambling. It's called Lost Cities of Eastern Michigan Card Game.
00:26:08
That was a bad improvisation. All right. The Reverend Carmichael moved from Nebraska to St. Clair County in 1899.
00:26:17
and after he moves there, he does so well in the community that 10 years later, by 1906,
00:26:25
he's the pastor at three nearby Methodist churches. Are you allowed to do that? In Glorious Bastard style.
00:26:31
Three Methodist churches. I guess so. It was like his car dealership, but God. The churches were in Rattle Run, Adair, and China.
00:26:47
Did someone just stab that girl in the leg? She's China's proudest citizen. Biggest communist.
00:27:03
Okay. The Reverend John Carmichael lives in Adair with his wife and their three children.
00:27:12
Adair? Who cares? There she is. There she is. Mrs. John H. Carmichael doesn't have a first name.
00:27:23
That's how they did it back then. It's actually John is her first name. For real.
00:27:28
John John? John. They called her Johnny, and then him. Reverend. The Rev. Reverend Run.
00:27:38
Okay. So, let's get down to this. On the morning of January 5th, 1909, the 56-year-old Reverend Carmichael tells his wife, John,
00:27:52
that he has to go down to the church in Rattle Run to arrange some revival services.
00:27:59
So he's got, you know, buckets of water. I don't know. Reviving people? He's waterboarding people at the church.
00:28:09
Why? That seems against God. she watches her husband ride away from their home in his horse and buggy and she has no idea
00:28:19
that she will never see him again and perhaps even more frightening she has no idea
00:28:26
that she does not have a first name okay cut to a couple hours later a guy named Myron Brown is waiting in the cold outside so that
00:28:39
church that you saw is actually sitting at a crossroads in the creepiest way possible.
00:28:45
It's in the corner of this plot of land and then Rattle Run Road is here. And then some other road,
00:28:52
I can't remember the name of is over here. Sure. And there's a guy standing there waiting to meet
00:28:57
the devil, I would imagine, which is what you do at a crossroads. He's waiting and waiting and
00:29:03
waiting, but it's freezing cold again. It's January. So he decides he's going to go into
00:29:07
the church and warm up while he waits. And as he approaches the church, he sees that both church
00:29:16
doors are just kind of flapping open. And he's like, that's weird. That's creepy. And feels
00:29:21
creepy. Yeah. Remember the church picture. Oh, I should say this. Billy Jensen, our friend Billy
00:29:28
Jensen is the person who suggested this murder. Cool. Yeah. But I got most of the really good
00:29:35
information on a website called Kevin McQueen Stories, K-E-V-E-N McQueen Stories.
00:29:42
This person wrote out this story, and I was like, it's going to be so hard not to steal
00:29:47
every line, but it's so well written. And the whole website, Kevin McQueen Stories, is like weird, old, historical, creepy shit.
00:29:54
So definitely go there and check it out OK so this man Myron Brown is waiting at the crossroads to try to play the guitar better
00:30:05
vis-a-vis the devil. And so he goes inside. I said that part all right. Oh, other versions of this story say that it's the church caretaker who walked up on the church and found it.
00:30:18
I like that one better. What if we say Myron Brown was the caretaker? Okay. We just combine every story.
00:30:24
like some websites do. Okay. Either way, we'll never know. Like Mrs. Carmichael's first name,
00:30:32
we'll never know what really happened. Okay. So he goes inside and he sees that most of the church
00:30:42
is covered in blood. Oh, no. Yes. Wait, is it always like that? No, no, no, no. I've never been in a Methodist church before.
00:30:51
Oh, yeah, I should have explained this to you. These aren't blood sacrifice people at all.
00:30:56
Fuck, that's creepy as shit. Yeah. So it's splattered everywhere. There's a bloody trail of footsteps up the aisle.
00:31:06
Don't follow them. Don't go up there. Toward the pulpit. The church organ had been splintered from what looked like repeated blows from an axe.
00:31:18
There were also pools of blood in the back behind all the pews. and there were wood burning stoves in the back of the church
00:31:26
and then there was one to the house left of the pulpit in the front of the church.
00:31:33
And if you're a theater person, you know what I'm talking about. And there's a terrible smell.
00:31:40
Yeah, I bet. Right? Both wood burning stoves are lit and burning. I know what's going to happen.
00:31:47
Poor Myron. He's standing there like, what? I just wanted to learn to play the guitar.
00:31:52
Yeah. That's all I... And then the devil walked in and was like, What the fuck? This sucks.
00:31:58
I would never do this. Even I think this is too much. Especially for Methodists.
00:32:05
Okay. So Myron sends for Sheriff Wagonsell, who is in Port Huron. You guys have the best sheriffs.
00:32:19
How did he send for him? We're not sure. It is four hours away walking. Okay. So I imagine that he flagged down a very small child and said, you have to go do it.
00:32:33
Yeah. Stop bailing hay or whatever manual labor job you have, eight-year-old, and go run to Port Huron and get the sheriff.
00:32:41
Then run back and continue bailing six more hours on that job. someone's got to get cornbread on the table
00:32:50
or whatever they used to eat in 1909 okay I also wrote maybe he attached a message to a falcon's foot
00:32:58
I waste so much time when I'm supposed to be actually telling that's why I never know what the date is
00:33:05
or how to pronounce fucking anything because I'm like what is this okay Either way, the sheriff comes.
00:33:18
Okay. At some point. That's what Sheriff Wagonsell was like. He would show up. So they begin to investigate the scene.
00:33:27
And they follow what are very bizarre and seemingly misshapen footprints up that aisle and to that wood-burning stove that's burning.
00:33:36
They throw some water in on the fire. and the first thing they find is a hatchet head
00:33:41
with no, the arm of the hatchet is burned but the hatchet head is in there. And then they find a big old piece of human skull.
00:33:51
As well as, as well as, as well as part of a torso, a jawbone, some false teeth,
00:34:02
and a stick pin. Oh no. This is in a church, inside a church. there is another part of the torso and other parts of the body in that back wood-burning stove.
00:34:18
Now, the sheriff's told that the right reverend, John H. Carmichael, I am calling him that.
00:34:23
I don't know if that's what you're supposed to call him, but I think I heard it somewhere.
00:34:26
So I'm calling him the right reverend. He's nowhere to be found. and both the caretaker or Myron and the sheriff are really afraid that that's who is in these fires.
00:34:39
Yes. Right? What? It is, right? Well, it's right. Okay. So the caretaker notices that all the oil lamps in the church, they had normally been kind of low,
00:34:52
and recently the reverend had told him you need to fill up all these oil lamps, which he had done in the past, in the recent past, like the last couple days.
00:35:00
And he looks around and sees that they're once again really low. And they realize that whoever was in there took all the oil in the oil lamps,
00:35:10
threw it on the fire so that they could actually cremate the body parts that were in each.
00:35:15
So it was someone who knew what they were doing. Yeah. They also bail out. For some reason, this creeps me out the most.
00:35:23
They bail out the well that's in the front of the church to see if they can find any clues.
00:35:29
That means they drained it, right? Yeah. Can you drain a well? No, you just pull that bucket up like 500 times.
00:35:36
They got the kid when he came back from Port Huron. They were like, here's job number two.
00:35:42
Do you want an apple for Christmas or not? They didn't find any clues in there, but there was a girl in a nightgown with long black hair waiting.
00:35:54
Just waiting They left her They left her It was fine Okay so of course murder inside a church is a huge story not to mention the added detail of this well and very well reverend
00:36:08
who's now missing and possibly dead. It's all over the newspapers. There's a $500 reward put up
00:36:14
to find the reverend. Um, and the next day, the citizens of a dare, is that what you're supposed
00:36:21
say? They don't even know. Someone in the front row just goes, I don't know. It really
00:36:30
is just like a conversation between the two of us, isn't it? Those citizens noticed that
00:36:37
Reverend Carmichael is not the only person missing. Another local man named Gideon Browning
00:36:42
also cannot be located. Browning is known as a carpenter, a sailor, and a roustabout.
00:36:48
Oh, dear. He's super fun. Right? He could climb up things and he wears a very blousey shirt.
00:36:57
The Reverend had recently hired him to do some carpentry and remodeling inside the church,
00:37:02
and so now everyone's like, suspect number one. So when police go to talk to the Browning family, they find out that from Browning's nephew
00:37:11
that he had overheard Reverend Carmichael promise Gideon Browning another job, one where he wouldn't have to do anything but, quote, stand around and smoke cigars.
00:37:22
And they find out from the Reverend's daughter that actually what that means is her father had written a manuscript for a book called The Devil and His Works.
00:37:33
And he decided he was going to have Gideon Browning be his book agent. I'm not buying it.
00:37:40
I mean, it seems odd. Yeah. Roust about Carpenter. Sure. High-powered book agent.
00:37:49
In Port Huron. Now, here's the fun surprise. When they go to talk to the Reverend John H. Carmichael's wife,
00:37:58
she tells them, or they get it out of her, it's a dirty book. It's bawdy and lusty.
00:38:06
Oh, my God. And dirty. What is it? The perfect Revan? What was he called? The right Reverend.
00:38:12
The right Reverend. The right Reverend. Is wrong. He is damn wrong. So they talked to Carmichael's wife.
00:38:19
I wrote Jane Doe Carmichael, who complains that her husband has written actually a couple what she calls trashy novels.
00:38:28
And she told the sheriff, I saw some of his manuscripts once, a few sheets. I don't remember what they said, but I felt called on him to tell him that he should not write such things.
00:38:39
She loved it. She fucking loved it. The old prune. Okay. Now, several witnesses come forward and tell the sheriff they saw Gideon Browning in the reverence company at the train depot the morning of the murders.
00:38:56
So apparently Gideon Browning boarded the train to Port Huron and then came back later that day.
00:39:03
But he didn't take the train home to Adair. He instead got off at Hickey. Oh, you know, Hickey.
00:39:10
Oh, you've got to. and he inquired of two men which way to the Rattle Run Church
00:39:16
while he was there, telling each of them that he had an appointment to meet someone there.
00:39:21
I've got an appointment. You know when you're asking directions, so you tell the people exactly what you're doing
00:39:26
in the place that you're asking directions to? Do you know the way to the gas station?
00:39:30
I'm going to go ahead and get some unleaded. Probably $30 worth. I'm going to want to buy Snickers.
00:39:36
This time I'm not going to do it. People just walk away from your car. So at this point, I don't know how this actually happened chronologically,
00:39:50
but I would put it here if it was a movie, so I'm going to now. Someone had the presence of mind to show the stick pin to Mrs. Browning
00:39:59
and ask her if she recognized it, and she did. That was her husband's stick pin, and her husband had false teeth.
00:40:07
It was her husband in the wood-burning stove. It was Gideon. It was Gideon Browning.
00:40:13
And now everyone's like, the fucking reverend did it? And then someone says, well, that would make sense.
00:40:20
Because the reverend has something wrong with his gait, like his leg. And when he walks, one of his feet turns out.
00:40:29
So that's why the path up to the wood-burning stove, the steps looked all fucked up.
00:40:33
So he didn't think this thing out at all. No. He didn't go get his fake wooden foot and walk it along like a cane, like I would have.
00:40:46
Okay. So suddenly, instead of getting him right and killing him, the sheriff realizes, okay, I wrote that twice.
00:40:56
The next day, they find the minister's horse tied to a tree in Pine River, 20 miles from the church,
00:41:03
and on the way to the Grand Trunk Tunnel Depot, like an abandoned car, but eating grass instead.
00:41:13
So the police interview a ticketing agent at the depot, and he tells them that a bearded man in a large fur coat
00:41:20
had bought a ticket to Chicago at 5 a.m. on Wednesday morning, but when they show that agent a picture of the reverend,
00:41:27
he can't positively identify him. But now the story is out. I think, I don't know if this picture order is right.
00:41:33
Oh, that's Gideon Browning and his wife. Okay. Hi. Roused about and his side piece.
00:41:43
You can tell what a big fucking deal it was to get your picture taken back then.
00:41:48
Oh, if I could only tell them about selfies. I think it's there. Oh, okay. Here we go.
00:41:55
Oh wait don read that in the newspaper they actually drew the crime scene I love this picture so much You probably balcony can you see this
00:42:09
They're like, you mean the little black lines on the white square? They basically showed the path of the footsteps going up the aisle toward the pulpit,
00:42:20
and up at top left is where the woodboarding stove is. obviously this is the church
00:42:25
and then there's the haunted well okay um let's see that's a picture of the blood
00:42:34
stains behind the pews yes that's fucked up let's see what this says okay oh that's the crossroads
00:42:46
that was I was supposed to put that earlier got it this is hurting my neck Can I tell you something?
00:42:55
You know why? Because when I was in the hotel earlier, I took a shower, and I wrapped my head in the towel, my wet hair,
00:43:00
and the towel was so heavy, I creaked my neck out. Because I'm 100. We might need to start taking pills of some time.
00:43:12
Okay, don't look at that. Okay. Okay. Sorry. now where the fuck is that I missed one
00:43:25
oh wait it's back here hold on you told us not to look at it I know now you get to look at it
00:43:32
so the press goes fucking batshit when they find out that the reverend is the person missing
00:43:39
and they're basically suggesting that it's a blood sacrifice that all the things
00:43:45
that we were joking about earlier, they put in the paper like, this could be it, guys.
00:43:50
Yeah. You might want to check your neighbors. I bet it is. Dude. I mean. Horse clue.
00:43:58
Oh, the story's out. Reports. Guys, stay with me. Reports start coming in from all over
00:44:07
saying the Reverend has been seen in Indiana, Chicago, and Wisconsin, but none of those were verified.
00:44:12
So sorry, none were verified. And that's when Mrs. Carmichael reveals to the press that her husband's sister was an inmate in the West Virginia insane asylum.
00:44:26
Now, did she tell that to the press or was the press lurking under her window one night?
00:44:32
Like, that doesn't seem like something anyone would share. Did she tell the cops, right?
00:44:37
Oh, that says she told the press. Yeah, but I wrote that. And you know that's not true if it's from me.
00:44:42
Okay. And basically, it's just seeding doubt. The press is seeding doubt in the entire community that the reverend of three major, major Methodist churches in the area, they don't know who this guy is.
00:44:57
Okay, so on Saturday, January 9th, a man checks into a boarding house in Carthage, Illinois.
00:45:03
It's a woman named Miranda Hughes' boarding house. Oh, sure. So apparently, if you marry a reverend, you disappear.
00:45:09
But if you run a boarding house, they know your first and fucking last name. And it'll be in every newspaper.
00:45:14
Just if anyone's thinking of career change. So the man gives the name John Elder, saying that he's in town because he's planning to build a woodworking factory nearby.
00:45:27
And on the morning of January 11th, Miranda offers to make this man breakfast. He says, no, thank you.
00:45:35
He goes upstairs. He writes one letter to the sheriff. and one which is 10 pages long and then a letter to his wife.
00:45:44
He goes back downstairs and he tells Miranda that he's going into the woodworking area.
00:45:53
But what he does actually is go out into her shed, take out a pocket knife and slit his throat.
00:45:59
Fuck. The problem is it's January. The wound isn't bad enough for him to die from immediately.
00:46:05
so he lays there and then dies of exposure. Oh, man. Again, let's plan ahead. So now this is the craziest thing.
00:46:18
When they get this confession letter, it's his version of everything. And it does turn out that Reverend Carmichael did have some serious untreated mental illness
00:46:31
because he believed that Gideon Browning had hypnotic control over him. In the letter, he describes how Gideon Browning kept showing up everywhere that he was
00:46:42
and lording over him and making him feel small and acting proud. It's the weirdest, like the way he writes it out.
00:46:53
At one point, he's out in the barn and he says that Browning showed up in the manure hole
00:46:59
and began telling him that he had to do what he said. So in this, he says that basically Gideon Browning told him that he was going to get married,
00:47:10
that he was separated from his wife. He wanted to get married, and he was meeting the reverend in the church.
00:47:17
And then when they met in the church, Browning said, he started laughing and said,
00:47:23
I'm not getting married, and I control you. I have you under my hypnosis. lift your arm and then in the letter he's saying and then I lifted my arm against my will and then
00:47:34
put it back down and he's basically describing this man like kind of nonsensically doing all
00:47:41
this crazy shit um so one of the quotes was when he set his eyes upon me in the queerest sort of
00:47:48
look uh something like the look of a snake's eyes I felt his influence tightening his grip on my mind
00:47:55
So he's basically going through what is probably a psychotic break, but blaming it on Gideon Browning, who's just the carpenter who's there to fix the church, essentially.
00:48:06
So in the letter, he also describes the attack. And he says, by this time, so he's basically after the hypnosis part.
00:48:16
By this time, I was so alarmed that I was in a cold sweat. I then leaned over to see if anyone might be on the road when he began to laugh again.
00:48:24
And I saw that he was holding a weapon of some sort up his sleeve. How? Instantly, I made a grab for it and got the hatchet from him
00:48:32
and asked him what he meant to do with it. And he said, I'll show you. And from his overcoat pocket, he drew out a knife in each hand.
00:48:41
Samurai style. Oh, shit. Fuck, this is some samurai shit. This has turned into a fucking Quentin Tarantino movie all of a sudden.
00:48:47
This is Kill the Revlon Bill Carmichael. He came at me striking with both hands while I backed across the church,
00:48:56
down the side aisle and across the front, but I did not dare turn about to open the door.
00:49:01
Then I threw the hatchet and struck him, and he fell. Just in one. Shit. Then I turned to open the door
00:49:11
when he grabbed me by the leg and threw me down where my hands came upon the hatchet.
00:49:16
There was a desperate struggle in which I used the hatchet until he laid quiet. I cannot tell all what happened after that.
00:49:24
I was wild to dispose of the body. I was in a horrible terror. So I began pulling off his garments that I might drag the body away somewhere and hide it.
00:49:33
Then when my eyes fell upon one of those knives, I flew into a rage and began to cut him.
00:49:40
And then he woke and grabbed me. Then for a while, I used that hatchet until I was sure he was dead.
00:49:48
E. So, anyway. So, obviously, Miranda calls the police. They come and they look through his room.
00:50:04
And the reverend, they find hypodermic needles in his belongings. And they find needle marks on his arms.
00:50:11
And apparently he's, among other things, and possibly this was part of the mental illness,
00:50:16
he was a morphine addict. So that could have been the hallucinatory idea of like,
00:50:21
someone's controlling me and they're meeting me everywhere I go. For sure. Three days after Reverend Carmichael's suicide,
00:50:27
four Detroit physicians performed an autopsy on his body and found that the preacher had suffered from several brain abnormalities.
00:50:35
Gideon Browning's widow, who lived in Auburn, New York, stated for the record that her husband had no occult powers
00:50:40
and had not been studying hypnotism. Yeah, right. Of course that's what she'd say.
00:50:46
Of course she'd say that. You saw her. She's got a first name and everything. You saw her in that dress.
00:50:52
Yeah. The New York Times found the case interesting enough to note editorially that it is impossible to hypnotize someone against his will.
00:51:00
Thank you. Just so people knew. And impossible to make a hypnotized person do something that he would not ordinarily do.
00:51:07
at the Rattle Run Methodist Church, the wood burning stove was replaced. You got to hope.
00:51:17
Right? And the pews were replaced and the walls were redecorated is the word they used.
00:51:24
Let's give it a new theme and make it a little cheerier in here. Flower wallpaper?
00:51:30
Anything. Anything but blood. We'll go more of a blue. But then, and we can get back to this picture.
00:51:40
Oh, no. It's horrible. There, 28 years later, they knocked down that church because everybody stopped going to it.
00:51:54
A lot of people blamed Polish Lutheran farmers for moving into the area and taking away that Methodist business.
00:52:03
But we all know it was the Unitarians. Come on. And that, I'm so sorry to tell you, is the story of the rattle-run Methodist church.
00:52:12
But. Amazing. The reverend did it. I thought the reverend was going to end up like having stolen his identity and later date out of town,
00:52:27
hoping that they would think he's, I don't know. I planned it more than he did. Please write it down.
00:52:32
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00:54:44
Oh, thank you. Don't. That's what I'm doing. I'm doing. I thought that was my last one.
00:54:52
That's okay. I'm doing the murder of Tina Bigger. Here, let me show her to you. This is Tina.
00:55:00
Sweet baby angel. Okay. 1995, everyone. Tina Bigger, she's 23 years old. She's an honor student majoring in psychology at Oakland University.
00:55:13
The screaming... Banshees. Right. That's right. it's in a suburb outside of Detroit
00:55:22
called Farmington or Farmington Hills I couldn't figure they're saying no, Farmington
00:55:32
what about Farmington Meadows? no we hate that one that's where the mall is and I get a lot of information from
00:55:42
Forensic Files episode a City Confidential episode I fucking love that thing In the sleepy bird of Farmington.
00:55:50
I think I deleted how they explained what Farmington was, but it was like if Detroit is an angry car zipping through the speeding,
00:55:59
then Farmington is a vintage bicycle ride. It was seriously the most insane thing, and I don't know why I took it out.
00:56:06
Nothing better. City Confidential is number one. That's right. Okay, so she's the eldest of five, and she's born in South Dakota,
00:56:17
to a military family. Her dad is a Coast Guard commander, her mother's a nurse, and of course
00:56:22
the family moves around a ton because that's what happens when you're in the Coast Guard,
00:56:26
apparently. I've never done it. I don't know. But she's super close with her family, of course.
00:56:31
That's what happens. And everyone says she's a, her siblings say she's a great big sister.
00:56:36
And so she goes to Oakland University for psychology. She lives with her boyfriend,
00:56:40
Todd, in an upscale apartment in Farmington, upscale neighborhood. Who cares? I mean, okay.
00:56:50
So they'd been there for a few years before they moved in together, and he helped her get a part-time job as a waitress
00:56:55
to put herself through school at Rochester Chop House, which is like an after-party there.
00:57:04
She's a super popular waitress. They say she always earns the highest tips because people like her immediately,
00:57:11
that she could wait on anybody, and they would not just like her, but the restaurant do,
00:57:15
and they keep coming back for it. And so she's paying it right through school, but money is tight.
00:57:19
She maxes out her credit cards. Shit's rough. Todd is a student at the University of Michigan.
00:57:32
He and Tina, we're not doing this today, guys. I have to hear it in my own home all the time.
00:57:41
He and Tina, he and Tina. Hey, Tina. Huh? What did you say? He and Tina. Todd and Tina.
00:57:47
He. Oh, God, sorry. I'm so sorry. I thought you were saying what the name of the mascot was.
00:57:53
Oh, no. I skipped that one. Do you want to do it? No. The Fighting Farmingtons? Great. Great.
00:58:01
So Todd and Tina, they're on again, off again for years. Friends say they're affectionate, but their relationship is tumultuous.
00:58:10
And the year before, it's Tina's fall semester of her junior year in September 1994,
00:58:17
Tina had gotten this crazy big opportunity at her college, only eight students got it,
00:58:22
to assist her psychology professor in a research project that was about AIDS awareness.
00:58:28
It was funded by the CDC, and the whole point was to interview sex workers who worked on the street
00:58:34
and those who were then incarcerated. at a detention center near Detroit. So basically, they would go in, they would interview the sex workers
00:58:43
and find out their knowledge about STD and AIDS, and then they would track them afterwards
00:58:49
and follow up on the retention of their information, etc. Friends say that she got really committed to the project
00:58:58
and that she became close with the sex workers. She was just a kind person who really enjoyed her work.
00:59:04
So she then proposes her honors project of her own entitled Survey of Sexual History and Health Practices Among Women Employed as Escorts.
00:59:15
So she wanted to go from the sex workers who worked on the street to actual escorts and see what was this fucking story.
00:59:24
But her school professors were like, we're not going to send you out there to do that.
00:59:29
That's a no. Okay, so there's where we are, et cetera. On August 23, 1995, Todd leaves for work that morning.
00:59:38
He leaves Tina at home asleep, but when he gets home, she's gone. But all of her car is gone, but all of her personal belongings are gone,
00:59:47
including her glasses, which she needs to see, obviously. So Todd's wondering where the hell she is.
00:59:55
Where could she be He calls the chop house and is like is Tina there And they like what are you talking about She quit four months earlier Yeah Okay And he like
01:00:06
what are you talking about? She washes and irons her waitress outfit all the time. Oh man. And goes
01:00:12
to work every day. Maybe not every day, but all the time. What the fuck? This is weird. So Todd
01:00:18
waits for her. She doesn't come home. And then he calls Tina's father, Bill, who comes into town
01:00:23
to help look for Tina. They do some digging of their own. It's weird. They call the police.
01:00:29
And police discover that Tina had been planning to move out of the apartment with Todd that they shared.
01:00:36
So that made them suspicious of him. But spoiler alert, it wasn't him. OK. Police also learned that Tina had found evidence recently
01:00:47
that Todd had cheated on her when he discovered the worst of all things, a suggestive greeting card.
01:00:53
in this drawer with the most unimaginative affair in the world. Back when you just wanted to go ahead and put it
01:01:05
down on paper that you were cheating. Not on paper. You want to go into a fucking Hallmark. Go to the
01:01:10
I'm having an affair aisle. Yeah, really. With the one behind the beads. Right. Back in the
01:01:16
corner. The adult cards. That's right. Actually, I'm having a recovered memory of walking home from school one time and we found a bunch of, well, it was like garbage in a
01:01:28
ditch. And we loved garbage. We were like little raccoons. And we would just go through that garbage.
01:01:37
But one of the things I saw laying there was so stupid. It was basically a guy in a bathtub.
01:01:43
And it was like, I use dial soap because dial spelled backwards means happiness.
01:01:51
What? Which is laid, like getting laid. Oh. And I didn't know that term because I was like eight.
01:01:59
So I was like racking my brain. I was just like, what could this be? I was titillated to a point, and then I just couldn't go any further.
01:02:10
Wow. Well, you're not supposed to understand dad jokes at eight, I think. Greeting card jokes.
01:02:16
Oy vey. So I'm slightly, sorry. Tina found the evidence that Todd was having the affair?
01:02:21
Tina had found that evidence in the past year, and so they were planning on moving.
01:02:25
She was going to move out. They were still going to date, but then she didn't come home.
01:02:32
And people said that Todd and Tina fought all the time, blah, blah, blah. You're supposed to be suspicious that he did it,
01:02:37
but I already told you he didn't. We're past that part in City Confidential. Right.
01:02:42
Yes. I mean, clearly I wrote this. Okay. Okay, so Todd is baffled. He doesn't understand where the hell she went,
01:02:51
so he starts searching the apartment for clues, and he finds a duffel bag he's never seen before.
01:02:56
Opens that fucking shit up, and inside are condoms, thigh-high stockings, lingerie, lube, credit card slips,
01:03:03
and envelopes addressed to the L.A. escort service with the name Crystal on the upper corner.
01:03:11
And so he calls the escort service. they're like, we don't know anyone named Tina Bigger, but we do know who Crystal is.
01:03:19
And it turns out that it's Tina. He's like, we actually have six Crystals here. Crystal C or Crystal R?
01:03:25
Crystal B or D or L? Crystal with two Ys or Crystal with one Y? Crystal with three Ys.
01:03:31
Everyone here's on Crystal, so we don't know which Crystal is which. It's the 90s.
01:03:38
Everyone's on Crystal. Okay. So, fucking shit. It turns out that way back when she was interviewing the sex workers that were locked up,
01:03:50
they were like, honey, you're so hot, and since you're smart, you'd be really good in this business.
01:03:55
And she was probably curious. It's so hard to tell exactly what happened, obviously, because she can't tell it herself.
01:04:03
But she had eventually, in late 1994, begun working at the Grosse Pointe Escort Service called Classical Elegance.
01:04:13
with a rose at the end of it. With a tiny crystal at the bottom. Just like, in case you weren't sure what it was,
01:04:20
just the name crystal was listed at the bottom. And listen, for you little babies, there was no internet,
01:04:25
there was no Craigslist back then, and escort services that you found in the paper, right?
01:04:29
Really the way that you would discreetly meet up with someone. It was like the free weekly paper,
01:04:35
and there would be like, do you want pot? You have to sign up for a medical trial.
01:04:43
And be injected with weird drugs. And everyone's like, we know that's a cop. It's like a sting.
01:04:48
We're not falling for it. So then business was slow at classical elegance with a crystal.
01:04:55
So she went to L.A. Dreams and another, which is like L.A. Dreams. That's so sad.
01:05:00
If you've been there, you know that it's not a good dream. That dream is traffic and rejection.
01:05:06
Yeah. Dream on. It's mostly like Inland Empire nightmares. Dream on. And the other one was called Calendar Girls, which is a little better.
01:05:16
That's for the really old ladies? I saw that movie. All those ladies were 75. And so those two were run by two different sisters.
01:05:26
Their name was Debbie and Donna. I'm not going to say their last name because whatever.
01:05:31
We don't want to. These are good women. I mean it. I'm not being. Okay. Let me tell you why.
01:05:35
Okay. Because. So. Stop being so defensive. Why am I telling the story ahead of time constantly?
01:05:41
So Tina became a really popular escort there. She booked as many as 50 appointments between May and August.
01:05:49
At one point, she earned as much as $250 per appointment, which in today money is actually Oh wow Which inflation man that shit crazy To her bosses of course Donna our friends Donna and Debbie
01:06:06
they said that she was anomaly because of her wholesome appearance and modest dress.
01:06:12
You know, she's just a college student trying to make some extra money. And when they asked her why she became an escort, Tina said,
01:06:20
Todd, this is my way of paying him back without him knowing it. I know. Oh, just break up.
01:06:27
Okay. Despite her success, though, it's school's her top priority. She's still getting great grades and doing really well in school,
01:06:35
and she goes home all the time to visit her family, so no one has any idea of her life like that until she disappears.
01:06:44
So then, when looking into what the fuck's going on, they find out that two weeks before her disappearance on August 11, 1995,
01:06:53
Tina had booked an appointment through LA Dreams with a 42-year-old dude named Ken Tranchita.
01:07:01
And he says he's a wealthy businessman. Sure. I think I have a photo of him. Here he is.
01:07:10
Right. Was that Rob Riggle? That's who's going to play him. Do you know his cousin was my Uber driver in Hawaii?
01:07:24
Oh, Rob Riggles' cousin? Very weird. Did you say prove it? Text him right now, prove it.
01:07:31
I didn't. Okay, so this dude, Ken, like Tina, he was raised a devout Catholic from a large family.
01:07:41
But now he's a drifter and a petty con who can't get a shit together. Between menial jobs, he sponges off his relatives.
01:07:49
His stepfather said about him, and this is what you want your stepfather to say about you,
01:07:53
he was a great con man. He made everyone feel sorry for him. Stepdads. So he had grown up in Southfield, and between 1981, where nobody lives anymore,
01:08:09
and between 1981 and 1993, he had been convicted of at least seven petty offenses,
01:08:15
ranging from credit card theft to parole violation, and in total had spent five years and five months in prison,
01:08:22
on again, off again, relationship with prison. With prison. Yeah. So he's, of course, not a wealthy businessman like Tina thinks,
01:08:30
but he's currently working at a car wash where not many wealthy businessmen work.
01:08:36
But at least they have that great theme song. records from the escort services reveal that he had requested
01:08:45
Tina's services many times in the first two weeks of meeting their first meeting takes place
01:08:51
at the Bluebird Motel which I'm sure is great super nice, five stars five stars twelve days before her disappearance
01:09:00
so when he meets her he tells her that she's the most beautiful woman in the world
01:09:04
and then he calls up the escort service and is like, I bought her a ring like he's already obsessed with her.
01:09:11
So according to him, they started to meet after that first session without the agency knowing,
01:09:19
and she stops charging him as if they're in love. But that's what he fucking says,
01:09:23
and I don't buy it for a minute. It's the thing of when you're nice to someone who's crazy
01:09:28
and they think that means they're in love with you, but really you're paying them to be nice to you, literally?
01:09:34
It's just crazy. he says that they're planning on moving into a new apartment together
01:09:40
and that they find a love letter from Ken and Tina's personal items it reads dear Tina my heart is yours for you to keep
01:09:51
your love will lift me off my feet oh wait this is going to be a rhyming one that's what you think and then this next line comes
01:10:01
and blows it out of the water You came to me. Your love is so willing. I know it's worth all our waiting.
01:10:08
So no. Sorry to disappoint you. So police go to Ken's apartment and they notice the name Crystal and some artwork on the fridge.
01:10:19
And they find out that a local car dealer said he saw Tina with Ken and they were looking at cars together right before her disappearance.
01:10:27
And Ken had said he was going to help her and give her like 11 grand for a new car.
01:10:32
And then they ended up fighting at the car dealership a couple days before she disappeared.
01:10:38
So up until that point, she may have really believed he was a rich businessman, like he said?
01:10:43
So for two and a half weeks after Tina's disappearance, Todd, her boyfriend, and Tina's dad, Bill,
01:10:51
they searched for her. And from phone bills, it's clear that she was deeply involved with escort services.
01:10:57
and let's see, so then Bill, the dad, Mr. Coast Guard, he calls Debbie of the Calendar Girls, one of the sisters,
01:11:06
and he's like, I need your help. And even though they were risking incriminating themselves,
01:11:11
both sisters were like, fuck it, yes, we'll help you. You know, they cared for Tina.
01:11:16
So they give him, like, all the information about Ken and shit. And so it seems like Ken had dropped out of sight at this time,
01:11:25
But on August 31st, he leaves a message with Debbie, who now is fucking looking for him.
01:11:31
And it's traced to a bowling alley where in Farmington Hills, police find him. They question him on and off for nine hours, and he denies any knowledge of her disappearance.
01:11:44
He says that he drove her to the airport for a flight to Ohio, where she was meeting a client.
01:11:50
Oh. But So many people want to cheer for Ohio And they know They know inappropriate. Just do it.
01:12:04
Oh, and then people hate Ohio. You guys. You know what's really weird about this and the University of Michigan
01:12:12
melee is that when you don't give a shit about sports or college, you don't know what the fuck people are cheering about.
01:12:19
It's just noises. Yeah. Why are you mad at them? It's just a college. You guys be friends.
01:12:25
Yeah. And we're all just trying to get an education over here. Okay. I didn't know, you know, the team for Los Angeles, the football team that were just in the...
01:12:40
The Rams? I didn't know where they were from. I asked Vince, oh, and where are they from?
01:12:46
Oh, oh, God. Los Angeles. I need to try to give a shit once in a while. They questioned him for nine hours. He denies any knowledge.
01:12:55
He says he flew her to, he drove her to the flight. Here's her fucking car keys in his pocket.
01:13:02
Because he says that she left her car with him for safekeeping while she was away in Ohio.
01:13:11
Yeah, for real. Every one of every single one. Green flags. So police get her car, find her car.
01:13:21
They search through it. The trunk's like full of, you know, you're a college student, you just throw shit in the trunk.
01:13:27
They don't know. There's nothing to be seen here, officer. And they find paperwork from the escort service,
01:13:37
and they find out that she had had contact with people that are living out of the state and out of the country,
01:13:41
so they're like, well, maybe she did fucking later days somewhere. But police use cadaver dogs to search the area near Ken's home.
01:13:49
They can't find anything, and so they have to release Ken from custody. So fucking Bill Bigger, the dad, is such a badass motherfucker.
01:13:59
He is so pissed off. He goes to Ken's friend's trailer where he's staying and questions him throughout the night relentlessly,
01:14:07
the fucking dude who's suspected of killing his daughter. It's crazy. Yeah, this guy's a badass.
01:14:14
But to no avail, although they say at one point he had to go in the other room and throw up
01:14:19
because he was so freaked out about talking about it. How fucking annoying. Okay.
01:14:23
A couple of weeks later, no other leads. Police are like, you know what, let's look through that car a little bit more.
01:14:31
Like, let's move something to one side and look underneath things. Which they hadn't done.
01:14:37
Okay. What they thought were coffee stains. It's not coffee stains. Let me look.
01:14:43
Let me look and show you. That's not coffee. Oh, no. That spilled coffee in her trunk?
01:14:50
It's blood. and they pick up the fucking mat and it's a pool of her blood in the trunk of her car.
01:14:58
And DNA confirms that it belongs to Tina. Because of the amount of blood, police upgrade the case from a missing person to a homicide.
01:15:08
Ken's a prime suspect, obviously, but he's fucking gotten out of there. And then a month after Tina's disappearance,
01:15:16
the cops get a tip. And it had been cold. that they had no idea where she was. Ken's own fucking brother suggests that the police search
01:15:25
a deserted home once owned by their aunt in Southfield. I think I have a photo of it.
01:15:31
No, I don't. Just picture the Methodist church, but with less windows. For real?
01:15:39
It's like super abandoned creepy style. He's like, go look over there. And so they did.
01:15:47
and the house is just 10 miles from Tina's apartment and there they find the badly decomposed body
01:15:53
of a young woman in the woods behind the house and of course dental records show that it's Tina.
01:16:00
But because of the rate of decomposition they can't tell the exact cause of death
01:16:04
but they do know that whatever it was started in her neck so they think it's strangulation.
01:16:11
So meanwhile they're like, oh shit, we need to find Ken. So he spotted, so in Forensic Files, they call it a rundown neighborhood in downtown Detroit,
01:16:20
which I'm guessing now is like really nice and some of you probably live there. So it's called the Cass Corridor. Is that right?
01:16:31
And then they showed what the apartment building where he was, and I could tell it's a nice neighborhood because there was a Whole Foods there.
01:16:37
I looked on the map. And it's in the Nottingham apartment. So if you live in there, congratulations.
01:16:45
It used to be a terrible neighborhood. As police close in on him, Ken does like a bullshit attempt at killing himself.
01:16:52
He slits his wrist and takes some pills, but he thankfully survives. And after hours of interrogation, he says that he and Tina had had an argument about money
01:17:02
and they struggled and the old fucking bullshit she fell and hit her head story But the x to Tina head show no sign of any trauma at all So they like you fucking lying So then he confesses that he said he fucking said
01:17:19
Tina was just so miserable in those last days that I decided, that I made a decision to end it for her and put her out of her misery.
01:17:26
No. Yeah. He accepts a plea bargain and pleads guilty to second degree murder. and of course Tina's family don't want to accept that
01:17:35
but they also don't want what you guys know would fucking happen if they go to trial which is that the defense attorney would
01:17:41
make it seem like a relationship no, would make it seem like slut shame Tina basically
01:17:47
and drag out all the shit she's been going through and her parents didn't want that to happen to her
01:17:52
so they accepted begrudgingly the plea bargain and at a sentencing trial this is him
01:18:00
he says to the fucking family I miss Tina just like you guys do prosecutors believe that when Tina
01:18:13
found out that Ken had lied to her about having money they fought and Ken strangled her
01:18:17
so on September 27th the funeral is held for Tina in Acme, Michigan her casket is carried to the church
01:18:27
by six white gloved coast guardsmen And so after, let's see, he's found guilty. Ken's found guilty, of course.
01:18:37
Two weeks after his sentencing, our friends Debbie and Donna of Calendar Girls and shit.
01:18:43
LA Dreams. LA Dreams and Calendar Girls. They're fucking arrested for solicitation.
01:18:48
So they knew that if they said, yes, we'll help you, and admitted that they did this,
01:18:53
that it's possible it's going to happen, and they did it anyways, which is pretty insane.
01:18:59
Yeah. They're sentenced to probation, and they say they have no regrets about cooperating.
01:19:06
Debbie said, for the sake of the bigger family, I would do everything all over again.
01:19:11
Yeah. Tina's father, Bill, refused to concede publicly that Tina was doing anything other than research.
01:19:19
And he said, my daughter is not on trial here. This is about the son of a bitch who killed her.
01:19:23
Yeah. Yeah. And Ken's sentenced to the maximum penalty in Michigan, which is life in prison, where he still is today.
01:19:33
Yes. Good. Yeah. Wow. Crazy. Jesus. I know. It's so frustrating. It feels like it was like 50 years ago.
01:19:46
Yeah. In that way where it's just like. Archaic. There's so much to risk if you're a sex worker and then somebody actually fucking hurts you.
01:19:54
Yeah. It's insane. Ridiculous. It's time for a hometown murder. Hey. Thank you. Hey.
01:20:04
I really... Oh, look who it is. It's your hometown boy. Hometown boy. Tell us what you told.
01:20:14
Remember the party stores? We found out that party stores... Party stores. All right.
01:20:19
Where you buy Mylar balloons. You guys want to hit a party store after this? Yeah.
01:20:25
Get a few 40s? All right. Okay, thanks. All right. You guys have to listen to these rules.
01:20:33
It's really important that you listen to the rules. Because the rules have been made for a reason.
01:20:42
We're just trying to get good stories up here that we can all enjoy in a sober, cleanly told manner.
01:20:51
We don't want you to embarrass yourself or your family. And we don't want to be bored.
01:20:57
Who does, really, at the end of the day? Keep it tight. Don't be so drunk you can't tell your own story.
01:21:06
Keep it local. Michigan, definitely. Detroit, ideally. Somewhere on here. Yeah, keep it in the mitten, please.
01:21:16
And also, I guess that's it. Everyone hates you, I think, is the other one. Okay, should I do it?
01:21:23
Yeah, do it, and do it quick. Okay, can I get light? And don't just do, don't do the wine thing, don't do whatever's flashing in front of you.
01:21:30
Just feel something with your heart. You can do it. You got it. Can I get the light?
01:21:37
Ah, this is so scary. It's harder than it looks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Come over this away.
01:21:44
Yeah, you have to walk this away. Around the front. One and two. Faster. It's very scary doing that, guys.
01:22:01
Hi. Tara, hi. Guys, it's Tara. Tara, where are you from? OMG. Where are you from I from the west side in Muskegon What your hometown
01:22:26
Okay. So about 20 years ago, I worked in a factory. Where's the factory? In Grand Haven, Michigan.
01:22:39
What did you guys make at that factory? We, plastic parts for the car industry? Sure.
01:22:47
Oh, the one that goes under the hood? We appreciate it. So I worked in this factory, and I went to work one night,
01:23:00
and a co-worker who was close in age to me didn't show up for work. So the next night, we worked third shift,
01:23:08
So the next night, I got up. I was late for work. I saw something on the news about a murder.
01:23:18
But I didn't pay attention because I was late for work. So I go to work, and everyone is very upset.
01:23:26
And I don't know why until they tell me. And it's very upsetting because I knew this person.
01:23:36
What was their name? April. Yeah. What was really sad is her mom worked there as well.
01:23:56
She was the manager. Okay. So, anyways, that night, it was very upsetting because we did find out that April was murdered.
01:24:19
And what happened was she was murdered. It was Thanksgiving time, and she went to her boyfriend's for Thanksgiving dinner.
01:24:31
And her boyfriend's brother, for whatever reason, decided to murder his family. Oh, my God.
01:24:43
And he murdered his brother, his mother, his father, April, and his grandfather,
01:24:56
and her mother, because she didn't show up to work. they called her as an emergency contact
01:25:03
and she went to the scene and interrupted the murderer Seth Parvaki while they were trying to
01:25:14
whatever they were doing they were trying to hide the bodies they were panicking
01:25:19
anyways Seth Parvaki was caught and he was convicted along with his friend and then
01:25:35
I believe in 2015 he attempted to escape the prison that he was in and he was shot and killed
01:25:43
oh wow and that's my hometown oh wow thank you Tara, Tara, Tara, Tara. Yeah. That's what it's like.
01:26:16
Fuck, man. That's the reality of these fucking stories. Yeah. And this reality of life.
01:26:24
Really fucking horrible things happen to people. and they're people. It's the people around us.
01:26:32
It's the people that you look at every single day. Everybody has a story, maybe not as fucking awful as that story,
01:26:38
but everybody has a fucking awful story. And it's a very good thing to keep in mind
01:26:43
when you're going out into the world because it's very easy to think everybody has your story
01:26:49
instead of a story like that. So what's beautiful about this community and the things that you guys are doing with each other
01:26:58
is that you're all coming together with this empathy and this understanding about the worst, shittiest parts of life
01:27:06
and how the only thing that can help us through those things are each other. That's it.
01:27:16
I mean, you can drink and you can get high and you can do a bunch of other shit,
01:27:22
But at the end of the day you still going to have to deal with the horrible stuff And so it very very amazing We just got together because we wanted to talk about things that we were like holy fucking shit can you believe that happened
01:27:37
And it made us feel better with our anxiety by telling someone else that story that kept us up
01:27:42
at night. Right. But then out of that grew this thing where all these people wanted to listen
01:27:49
and feel those feelings and empathize and emote because that's really what it's all about.
01:27:55
That's just really what it's all about at the end of the day. Thank you guys for creating this fucking incredible community.
01:28:05
We're so honored to be a part of it, to be up here on stage. You guys are incredible.
01:28:11
And I just have one more thing. Sorry. I found out today that a comedian that I love very much died.
01:28:24
Brody Stevens died. It's terrible. I've known him for a really long time. He really, really suffered with his mental illness.
01:28:38
But he also fought with it. And he also was in it with it constantly. if you go home and watch his comedy
01:28:46
he's really miraculously hilarious like comedy that is coming from a place that like is
01:28:54
somewhere else and he part of the reason he can do what he does on stage is because he has that mental illness
01:29:02
it's part of the personality and he made it kind of work for him and that's also
01:29:08
that's a big part of art it's not about being perfect it's about being incredibly fucked up.
01:29:16
And so I was texting with my friends who know him also and love him also and one of my friends told me
01:29:25
that Brody Stevens' grandfather used to run the Fox Theater. So crazy. We missed you, Brody.
01:29:34
You were one of a kind. Sorry. I just wanted to say that because it seemed very fateful that that would be
01:29:45
what was going on tonight. Anyway, we love you guys, and we're thrilled to be here with you.
01:29:52
Thank you so much, you guys. Thank you. This really is the pinnacle of comedy performance,
01:30:02
for me anyway, coming up as a stand-up. Shows like this, I never thought I was going to be able to do them.
01:30:07
So the fact that you've given me this gift and giving us both this gift, will never be able to thank you enough.
01:30:14
Nope, never. Do us a favor and stay saved. I'm just kidding. Stay sexy. And don't get saved.
01:30:28
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