00:00:00
This is Exactly Right. on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:00:36
When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.
00:00:44
I vowed I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves.
00:00:51
We always say that. Trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe.
00:00:58
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Will Ferrell's Big Money Players
00:01:09
and iHeart Podcast presents Soccer Moms. So I'm Leanne. Yeah. This is my best friend, Janet.
00:01:14
Hey. And we have been joined at the hip since high school. Absolutely. A redacted amount of years later,
00:01:20
we're still joined at the hip. Just a little bit bigger hips. This is a podcast.
00:01:23
We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey.
00:01:27
With all the snacks and drinks. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer? Oh, they had a BOGO.
00:01:33
Well, then you got them. Listen to Soccer Moms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:01:46
My favorite world. Hello! And welcome to My Favorite Murder. You guys, it's a very exciting day today on My Favorite Murder.
00:02:04
We have a very special, beloved guest. He rose to fame on his hilarious screaming game show, Billy on the Street.
00:02:10
And now he is starring in his very own groundbreaking gay romantic comedy, Bros, which he also co-wrote.
00:02:18
We're thrilled he's here, ladies and gentlemen. It is the legend, Billy Eichner.
00:02:22
Oh, hi, guys. Hi. Hi, thanks for being here. It's good to see you. You too. I've murdered many in my time.
00:02:29
Hey, confess, confess, confess. This is the place to do it. So right now you are on your press tour for Bros.
00:02:38
Yes, I'm in Phoenix, Arizona. And we had a screening of Bros, my new rom-com, here last night.
00:02:46
Before that, we were in San Francisco, where we had a really magical screening of it at the Castro Theater.
00:02:52
Oh, wow. Amazing. The historic place. And then before that, we had the world premiere of Bros at the Toronto International Film Festival.
00:03:02
Oh. So wait, how was that for you? Because I remember I follow you on Twitter, and somewhere at the beginning of quarantine,
00:03:11
basically this movie got paused as did all of life right we were supposed to start shooting bros
00:03:19
in early april 2020 we were deep into pre-production we were scouting locations and obviously we got shut down like everything else and then we really didn't know if the movie
00:03:31
would come back or if it would come back in the same way and then a year and a half later it came
00:03:38
back, thankfully. And we got to shoot it in New York last fall. It's one of those classic New
00:03:46
York-based romantic comedies, but about a gay couple and LGBTQ folks and a handful of straight
00:03:52
characters, but all played by LGBTQ actors. Nice. Love that. We're so thrilled. I mean, Toronto was
00:04:00
one of the great nights of my life. We were all walking on air. I obviously didn't make Bros Alone
00:04:06
is produced by Judd Apatow, who's made some of the funniest movies ever. Bridesmaids and 40-Year-Old Virgin
00:04:12
and Superbad and Trainwreck. And I wrote it with Nick Stoller, who's also made some of the funniest movies ever
00:04:18
for getting Serta Marshall and Neighbors. These guys really know how to make a really relatable, hilarious, heartfelt comedy,
00:04:25
but they've never made one about a gay couple or LGBTQ people. And that's where I came in.
00:04:31
Hey. You know a little bit about that? A little bit about being gay. I don't know much about anything else, but I know I'd like to be a gay man. I've been one forever. And it's old fashioned just to be gay now. We make fun of that at the movie, but I'm an old school gay man for better or worse.
00:04:50
Toronto was really wonderful. You know, to watch the movie in a movie theater, there just aren't that many comedies, especially R-rated adult comedies that get big releases in
00:05:03
movie theaters anymore. You know, most of the movies that get this type of release
00:05:07
are action movies or superhero movies or horror movies. And those are all great. But God, I love
00:05:12
to go to a movie theater and laugh with hundreds of other people. I think we've forgotten. I forgot
00:05:18
too during COVID, like how fun that is. And it was so exciting. You know, people laugh out loud
00:05:24
in this movie from beginning to end straight people, gay people, LGBTQ folks. And it's such
00:05:30
a fun experience, you know, to escape the world. We're in such a bleak world. So much to be angry
00:05:37
about so much anxiety. Social media is driving us all insane. We just wanted to make a hilarious
00:05:44
movie. You know, we want to make a movie that makes people feel good at the end and is uplifting
00:05:50
and that everyone can relate to. And it's about the good things in life. So what was that like sitting in that theater Like because that also a lot of pressure You know what I mean Like that it a world premiere and you want everyone to be laughing but like were there dips
00:06:05
Were there moments where you were like, is this going to work? I mean, like it must've been amazing.
00:06:09
Oh my God. I mean, I was so nervous, you know, and we have had test screenings, private test screenings of the movie for months now,
00:06:17
which is part of the process of making a major studio film. I mean, it's been tested in New York, Chicago, LA,
00:06:23
all over, multiplexes all over. You know, sometimes the audience is mostly straight.
00:06:28
Sometimes there are more LGBTQ folks there, sometimes less. And it gets, you know, we get,
00:06:33
we've had a lot of reactions to the movie already, but never a public screening.
00:06:38
We did an incredible screening for Pride Month that Mariah Carey hosted in June.
00:06:42
No big deal. No big deal. Oh my God. Yeah, Mariah is a huge Billy on the Street fan.
00:06:49
If you follow me, you know this. And she's truly one of the greatest people I know, like on camera, off camera.
00:06:56
She's so supportive. And so Bros being, you know, a gay rom-com with all LGBTQ actors, we wanted to do something
00:07:03
for Pride Month back in June, even though the movie doesn't open until September 30th
00:07:08
now. Right. So Mariah hosted a screening that, except for Mariah, was all people who work for LGBTQ
00:07:14
organizations to New York City. Wow. That was wonderful and very, very special. Nice.
00:07:19
So I've seen audiences of all kinds of audiences react to the movie, but having the first public
00:07:26
premiere where then people can actually go on Twitter and go online and talk about it and
00:07:31
it starts to get reviewed. I mean, that was obviously very nerve wracking, but I have to
00:07:36
say it was really thrilling. You know, it's just, like I said, I love romantic comedies, you know,
00:07:42
and people make fun of them and maybe they've gone out of style. They don't release many in
00:07:47
movie theaters anymore. It's something that has become a type of movie you watch at home alone,
00:07:52
or maybe with one or two other people. But I remember going to see When Harry Met Sally in
00:07:58
the theater and Pretty Woman and, you know, broadcast news and Moonstruck. And then as I
00:08:03
got older, Bridesmaids and all of these movies, and it was so fun to go laugh with other people.
00:08:08
Yeah. Yeah. That's really what we want people to experience with bros, gay, straight,
00:08:13
whoever you are, however you identify it, it's a movie about letting your guard down to fall in
00:08:18
love. And I think that's something everyone can relate to. Yeah. Well, you play the character
00:08:23
with the most romantic career, right? Sexiest. You know, podcasters are just dripping with sex
00:08:30
appeal. Yeah. Oh, hard. It's really hard. Yeah. We're on par with Mariah Carey in that way,
00:08:36
where it is glamour. It is sex. It is high level talent. Mariah Carey is sexy, but she's not as
00:08:42
sexy as a podcaster. That's what we always say. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. I play a podcaster.
00:08:49
Yeah. His name is Bobby Lieber. He's, it's one of these very sort of like 2022 era careers,
00:08:55
which you guys might be able to relate to as a podcast, but he's also a writer. He's written
00:09:00
books. He does public speaking. He's not the most famous person in the world and he's not an actor,
00:09:05
but he has a certain level of fame. He has a following. He's an LGBTQ historian.
00:09:11
He's very outspoken with his opinions about life and love as a queer person. And then towards the beginning of the movie, he gets a call to be on the board of the first
00:09:24
LGBTQ National History Museum in America, which allows us to have a lot of fun and actually
00:09:33
make some good points about LGBTQ history, but also poke fun at ourselves and our community,
00:09:38
which is something that I think is healthy to do. You know, it's not a sanctimonious movie.
00:09:43
It's a big, ballsy, Judd Apatow comedy. We poke fun at everyone, including ourselves.
00:09:49
And that's really fun. Yeah. In the trailer, the scenes, those scenes, because it's just a table full of all different kinds of gay people
00:09:58
trying to work out how you're going to do your business. And Jim Rash, of course, is hilarious.
00:10:04
Is he representing bi people? Yeah, Jim Rash is a bisexual guy. Don Marie Jones is an older lesbian woman.
00:10:12
Tia Madison is a trans woman. Miss Lawrence is a gender fluid person. Eve Lindley plays a young Gen Z trans woman.
00:10:21
And so everyone's representing different corners of the community. And all of those actors, you might know some of them.
00:10:28
For some of you, they might be fresh faces. I am telling you right now, those scenes bring the house down.
00:10:33
Hilarious. They're all so funny and in different ways. And we're all from different corners of the community.
00:10:39
And we're all fighting for the part of the community we represent to get more space in the music.
00:10:44
Right. Right. But we do it in a very fun, you know, satirical way, you know, because the last thing we want is to be overly serious about this.
00:10:52
Although, obviously, there are serious points to make about the erasure of LGBTQ history in textbooks and in schools and in our lives in general, which I think is really something we haven't thought about enough.
00:11:04
Right. Yeah. The fact that never straight people aren't taught LGBTQ history and LGBTQ folks were never taught about ourselves.
00:11:13
Yeah. You know, as I'm a Jewish person, you know, so growing up, going to public school in New York City, where there's a large Jewish population, we talked to a certain degree about at least, you know, certain elements of Jewish history.
00:11:26
I knew what the Holocaust was. I knew what Nazis were. I knew about Israel. We got Jewish holidays off in New York in public school because there are so many Jewish people there.
00:11:35
And, you know, it's not a nuanced look at Jewish history, but it was something. I knew something about where my family was in context of world history, and there was never an equivalent for LGBTQ history.
00:11:51
Right. I think people don't realize what that does to the world. It makes straight people kind of ignorant inherently about the fact that LGBTQ folks have been around since the beginning of civilization that we contributed so much to culture
00:12:06
Many historic figures have been LGBTQ, but it gets erased, you know? Leonardo da Vinci was most likely bisexual.
00:12:14
Michelangelo, you know, pharaohs in Egypt. You know, I mean, it goes on and on and on, and we're never taught about it.
00:12:20
And when it does come up, there are historians who deny it. They say you have no proof.
00:12:25
You know, there are rumors of Abraham Lincoln being gay or bi, which we deal with in a comedic way in the movie.
00:12:30
It's hilarious in the trailer. It's so funny. Exactly. And so we do have fun with it, but there are serious points to make about how we've been excluded from the historical narrative and what that does to people, both straight and LGBTQ.
00:12:44
But mostly we're there to make people laugh and have a good time. Yeah. I think that's a really great way to introduce it, too, to people is through humor.
00:12:50
obviously humor is such an incredible tool to open up a conversation so much more than like
00:12:57
on Twitter with pure anger and vitriol, you know, humor opens so many doors. It's such an angry world. I mean, especially on Twitter, my God,
00:13:06
the most vicious, irrational place lacking all the ones in context 24 seven. And that's,
00:13:13
and I look, and I spend a lot of time on Twitter for better or worse than on social media. It's
00:13:17
part of our lives. But what I loved about making Bros and the process of making it and also how it
00:13:23
turned out is that it is just a feel-good movie. It has more serious moments. It has some poignant
00:13:30
moments. But at the end of the day, it's there to remind people about the good things in life,
00:13:35
making each other laugh, love, romance, sex. We need that too, as much as we need vicious social
00:13:43
commentary and action movies and superheroes. Also, I think that idea where, as I was watching
00:13:49
the trailer, when you see the structure of like a Judd Apatow movie or Nick Stoller, there's a
00:13:56
formality to it. Watching you guys play within the construct of like a classic rom-com is so
00:14:01
satisfying because it's basically saying that we're not asking whether or not we get to be here.
00:14:07
We are here. It's been happening forever. This is not about permission. It's not about
00:14:13
anybody kind of like kneeling to anybody. It's literally like, come and actually be current with
00:14:19
what is going on in the world, which is that there are gay people. There are trans people.
00:14:23
None of these weird politicians that are trying to make it a thing you can ban. You can't ban it.
00:14:30
It is the world. It's who is around us. It's like banning the air and banning water.
00:14:36
Yeah. But it's like banning style. It's like banning fashion where it's like, you don't want to ban these things. It's a mistake to think that we are better off without
00:14:45
such a large section of humanity that brings so much to the table. It's ridiculous.
00:14:50
Exactly. I mean, it's so silly when you think about it, you know? And again, that's why I just
00:14:56
wanted to put a fun, joyful love story into the world about two guys falling in love, you know?
00:15:02
And it's such a fun experience. And what's funny is, you know, sometimes, obviously,
00:15:06
I want LGBTQ people, gay men to relate to it. Of course, I'm a gay man. That means a lot to me.
00:15:12
But sometimes the straight people in the audience love it even more than the gay folks, because for
00:15:17
them, it's very funny. But also at the same time, it's unlike anything they've ever seen in a movie
00:15:23
theater. And it's giving it's a really great mix of the elements of romantic comedies we all love.
00:15:30
you know, this is not trying to be an avant-garde indie movie. I love those movies. I've done a lot
00:15:36
of sort of under the radar, do it yourself, indie style comedy over the years, Billy on the Street,
00:15:41
Difficult People. I mean, that's who I am for most of my career so far, but this is a little
00:15:46
different. I mean, it does feature my comedic sensibility very heavily. If you like those shows,
00:15:51
I think you will like this, but I wanted to do something. I mean, I don't think it's a word to
00:15:57
say that elements of the movie are conventional. I was going to say traditional. Yeah, that's what
00:16:02
it feels like. Yeah. And it's a great mix of old and fresh. I love those Nora Ephron movies.
00:16:09
Yes. And I don't think they're guilty pleasures. Why should romantic comedies be considered
00:16:15
guilty pleasures and Batman not be considered guilty pleasures? Right. And you know why? It's because romantic comedies are mostly, the audience for them is usually
00:16:25
driven by women and gay men. So of course, the culture, society, the industry, entertainment
00:16:32
industry sees it as a guilty pleasure. Because it's not something straight men, although I think
00:16:36
a lot of straight men like Nick Stoller, like Judd Apatow actually do like romantic comedies,
00:16:41
but it's associated with being, you know, films for women and gay men. I mean, they used to call
00:16:47
them chick flicks, which is so insulting when you think about it, because these are just great
00:16:51
movies. Like Moonstruck is not a guilty pleasure. Fuck no. Oh my God. It's not a guilty pleasure.
00:16:59
You know, Bridesmaids, it's not a guilty pleasure. Like I hate when people describe it like that.
00:17:03
And, you know, I have to say Brokeback Mountain is a masterpiece. I've seen it once. Pretty Woman,
00:17:11
I've seen 50 times. So you tell me what I should feel guilty about because I love those movies and
00:17:18
I want more movies like that about gay people. And I think the straight audience loves it too,
00:17:22
because it's new. It's exciting. You know, you need to give people a fresh reason to leave their
00:17:28
house now. You know, you need to give people a good reason to leave their house. And Rose is
00:17:33
giving you, you know, the classic rom-com experience you love, but a very new take on it.
00:17:39
Yeah. Well, there's something so comforting about, for me, about a quote rom-com, which is really just
00:17:43
comedy with romance in it, which is life, you know, it's not that different than life.
00:17:49
It is kind of what everyone's trying to do in life, just like, but traditionally men aren't
00:17:54
supposed to have feelings So then that is supposed to be bad and guilty pleasure and And chick flicky And chick flicky which is you know I think we all gone to therapy enough at this point now where we starting to go like
00:18:06
okay, well, these, we can see that these are dodges and these are actually, we're reducing
00:18:10
things. Some people are reducing things to make themselves feel better. And we don't have to live
00:18:15
in that world. Like that's the beauty of being in 2022. We don't have to play by those rules anymore.
00:18:19
No one does. 100%. And Bros is actually about, in terms of the story, it's about two men who are 40 years
00:18:26
old, two gay men. They've been openly gay their whole lives, very sexually active.
00:18:31
There's no real shame around being gay. And yet, these two characters, Bobby and Aaron, played beautifully by my co-star, Luke McFarlane,
00:18:40
they both are men who pride themselves on not needing to be in a relationship, on not
00:18:47
needing to be codependent. they're judgmental of people who are in relationships. They kind of love the fact
00:18:53
that they're both emotionally unavailable. They have a sense of pride about that,
00:18:57
which I think a lot of people do. Yeah, for sure. Yes, I do. Right. There you go. But what happens when two people like that meet and fall in love?
00:19:06
How do they navigate that? There's a lot of comedy that can come from that. And also,
00:19:11
many poignant moments as well, because this relationship can't happen unless their guards
00:19:16
come down and they learn how to be vulnerable with each other physically, emotionally, in every way.
00:19:22
And I don't think that's just a story about gay men. I think that's a story about men in general
00:19:26
and women too. We're in a really weird age of being single. I've been mostly single for the
00:19:35
past 10, 15 years. And if anyone who's been single in the past 10 or 15 years in the age of dating
00:19:42
apps and texting and meeting people on Instagram and social media and all of that, it has given
00:19:49
people a way to be so passive aggressive with each other. With all the texting, you don't have
00:19:56
to pick up a phone and actually speak to the other person. So it's almost like the person you're
00:20:01
texting with or sexting with or whatever you are DMing with, it's almost like they don't exist.
00:20:05
You don't think about the emotional consequences of that person. So everyone's playing games with
00:20:10
each other. Everyone's looking to text with someone they might think is cute or something
00:20:16
like that in order to get a very short-term immediate burst of validation without thinking,
00:20:21
oh, wait, there's a person on the other end here who might think that this actually means something.
00:20:26
Yeah, right. And then it's like, it can't mean something. That's the big game is like, everyone's cooler
00:20:32
than thou. So it's just a bunch of people pretending they don't want to be vulnerable
00:20:37
while trying to be vulnerable. It's such a mindfuck. everyone's fronting, right? Everyone wants to be tough. Men, women, and we deal with this a lot
00:20:47
in a comedic way in bros. Like it takes these guys, you know, it's not an automatic meet cute
00:20:53
and then they're together. Like they play this cat and mouse game with each other. That is,
00:20:58
for me, came very much out of my real life where these types of conversations that mostly happen
00:21:04
via texting or DMing or on some sort of dating app, they'll drive you crazy because no one is willing to put themselves out there
00:21:13
and commit. The second they are, they sort of pull back. Yes. Your husband is not who you think he is.
00:21:20
Your body is not what you thought it was. Your identity is formed by a secret history.
00:21:26
I'm Dani Shapiro, and these are just a few of the stunning stories I'll be exploring on the 14th season of Family Secrets.
00:21:34
And just then, we felt the plane turn in the air. So much so that the bags that were under people's seats just kind of flew into the aisle.
00:21:43
Each week, we dive headfirst into the complex power of secrecy. How it shapes our identities and relationships.
00:21:50
And how it ultimately can reveal to us our truest selves. My daughter, she's pretending she doesn't know, but is trying to cook and feed me and keep me alive because I wasn't eating anything.
00:22:00
and me pretending like everything was fine. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move.
00:22:06
And he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off. And that was the last time I saw him.
00:22:10
Listen to Season 14 of Family Secrets on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:22:18
I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families.
00:22:27
Late one night, Bobby Gumpwright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything.
00:22:39
I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:22:49
This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security,
00:22:59
one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS
00:23:06
and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to The Sixth Bureau on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:23:17
I'll never forget learning about double texting. And the only reason I learned about it
00:23:26
is because I saw someone tweet about it. And suddenly, it was like, basically, if you send two texts in a row
00:23:32
without the other person responding, you're desperate and you're basically like,
00:23:35
you're all over them. And I was like, oh my God, I literally send like nine texts in a row
00:23:40
and I've never thought about it and I do not give a shit. But suddenly it's like, oh,
00:23:44
then people are interpreting that in a, it's almost like, especially being my age, where I'm dealing with all this stuff where half
00:23:52
of me is like, oh my God, I'm so humiliated. I don't know the rules. And the other half of me
00:23:56
is like, I have to get away from all of this because- How do you manage this world
00:24:01
where the rules literally change every 15 minutes? I know that. And literally what you're describing
00:24:06
literally happens in bros. I have some bros. We didn't get an early screener. No, no, no, no.
00:24:13
Me and my love interest, Aaron, you know, we go on a couple of dates, we hang out and then he just out of nowhere
00:24:19
stops responding to me out of nowhere, which I know literally everyone can relate to.
00:24:25
And Bobby, my character, thinks they've hit it off. and Aaron, at first it looks,
00:24:30
it feels like he thinks that too. And then out of nowhere, he gets scared or is having doubts,
00:24:36
stops responding. My character texts him 15 times in a row. Oh God. My character is 40 years old,
00:24:43
but has the experience in terms of intimate relationships of like a teenager because he's never wanted to commit.
00:24:49
And so now he finally, and this happened to me in real life. This is based on a guy I met in my mid thirties.
00:24:55
And I was like, definitely one of those people who's like, I don't need boyfriends. Everyone I know needs a girlfriend or needs a boyfriend.
00:25:01
My straight friends were all getting married and having kids. I was like, that's great for them.
00:25:05
I love them, but I don't need that. And then I met a guy out of nowhere in person, actually not
00:25:10
on an app. And I fell so hard and that had never happened to me as an adult. And I went insane.
00:25:18
It just got under my skin. You become obsessive because the feelings are so new and so powerful,
00:25:24
but the person's playing games with you and driving you crazy. And me and my love interest
00:25:30
in the movie, we do that to each other a lot until we eventually try to get over that part to actually
00:25:36
have a relationship, which gets complicated too. But yeah, like I said, it's about two gay guys,
00:25:42
but I think any person who's been single in the past 10 or 15 years will relate to a lot of this.
00:25:47
My rule has always been, if someone says they have a crazy ex, you need to ask yourself what
00:25:52
that person did to make their ex crazy because we've all been crazy. I have been the crazy ex
00:25:57
before because someone ghosted me or did whatever they did or was with someone else. We've all been
00:26:04
the crazy ex before. That is so true. How can you not be when, like, I think people, it's hard to
00:26:11
understand until it's happening to you how difficult vulnerability is for people. And most of us were
00:26:16
raised to avoid it, to like figure, cope and figure out a way to either be funny or intimidating
00:26:24
or really, really hot. Do something so that you don't have to sit there with your heart on your
00:26:29
sleeve. I mean, that's, that's kind of everybody. The question I wanted to ask though, oh God,
00:26:34
I could talk about this forever. I love this topic. This is why rom-coms are popular because
00:26:39
everybody relates to how difficult it is to find someone and be on the search. But I was going to
00:26:45
ask, did you have any say in the casting? Did you get to pick your onscreen lover?
00:26:50
I did. Yeah. I mean, I wasn't alone, but I'm an EP on the movie, an executive producer,
00:26:55
and I co-wrote it. And Nick Stoller actually brought the idea of doing the movie to me.
00:27:01
It didn't start with me. Oh, wow. Yeah. Which was interesting because Nick is, for better or worse, a straight man.
00:27:08
But a straight man I love and who loves romantic comedies as much as I do, You know, he made some great ones. And he came to me like in 2017 and we had worked together. I'd worked for him as an actor a couple of times. We'd never written together. And he said, I want my next movie to be a romantic comedy, but I think it would be cool if it was about a gay couple because we haven't had many of those. But he acknowledged he wasn't gay, which I knew.
00:27:33
so he said do you want to write it with me and if all goes well you can star in it and i'll direct
00:27:38
it and hopefully judd who he's worked with a lot will produce it and that's how it started
00:27:44
um which is interesting and then i took it and ran with it yes of course sure you know
00:27:50
but but yeah that's how it started i'm forgetting your question it was just with luke mcfarland
00:27:56
you did like did were you a fan had you seen him before when he got brought to the casting right
00:28:02
So I did get some say in the casting along with Nick and Judd and the studio. But we, Luke got the job the old-fashioned way,
00:28:09
and I don't mean the casting couch. It would be amazing if you're making like a groundbreaking gay movie,
00:28:18
but then you're just as disgusting as any Hollywood producer ever would be. There are plenty of disgusting gay people out there.
00:28:25
Let's be equitable. Representation, it's important. Disgusting is an equal opportunity.
00:28:31
situation. But we had a lot of wonderful actors read for the roles. The whole cast is openly
00:28:37
LGBTQ and all the main and supporting roles, except for a few very fun celebrity cameos from
00:28:42
some allies. But you'll have to watch the movie to find out. But yeah, we had so many great actors
00:28:49
read and romantic comedies, even if the script is good on paper, they live and die based on the
00:28:55
chemistry of the two leads. And interestingly, I did not know Luke McFarlane at all. Personally,
00:29:02
I knew who he was. He knew who I was, but we'd never spoken. We had no, I just didn't know the
00:29:08
guy. And he walked in and I read with all the actors, even at the initial auditions, because
00:29:14
I had to, you know, it's about that chemistry and seeing who I would click with. And maybe it was
00:29:21
because I didn't know Luke that well, but there was a little mystique there. There was a bit of an edge there
00:29:27
because we didn't know each other. This movie is a huge opportunity for me. And it's also a huge opportunity
00:29:33
for the person playing my love interest, you know? So you could kind of feel that in the room.
00:29:38
There was a little tension and there was a spark between us. Like we're very similar in certain ways.
00:29:46
He's a Juilliard trained actor. So we have that. I went to Northwestern. I was a theater major.
00:29:51
We both love theater. You know we love performing arts but he also a guy from like a small town in Canada And he drives a pickup truck and listens to country music And I don even have a driver license because I grew up in New York City and I
00:30:07
don't listen to that much country music. And so we're different in certain ways and we just
00:30:12
compliment each other. And it's one of those things that's hard to define, you know, but we
00:30:17
just get it off. I think we both really love each other as people and respect each other. And also
00:30:24
scare each other a little bit, which is exactly what these characters are experiencing when they
00:30:30
meet. They're both intimidating in different ways. My character is very outspoken, very opinionated,
00:30:36
not afraid to share those opinions. Luke's character is more stoic, but in a combination
00:30:43
of him being physically very beautiful. But not just that, being in a more understated way,
00:30:52
smart and willing to call me and my character out on our, on my shit from the beginning,
00:30:57
which a lot of people are sometimes scared to do because my character can be loud and
00:31:02
intimidating and all of that. So we give each other shit and we almost do that as a defense
00:31:06
mechanism at the beginning of the relationship. So Luke just understood the part and he's really
00:31:12
wonderful in the movie. He's so sweet. He brings so much to it with both characters. You, I think
00:31:17
you think you know who they're going to be on the outset. You know, in the first few scenes,
00:31:22
they're like, oh yeah, there's Billy being a version of the Billy we know. And there's like
00:31:27
the hot, boring guy that he's going to fall for. But I am telling you, it's so, it's much more than
00:31:32
that. And the whole story is about these guys, each choosing a different persona to present to
00:31:37
the world to be tough, you know, to protect themselves. It's like their armor. With me,
00:31:42
it's like comedy and jokes and being really tough. And with him, it's this beautiful exterior
00:31:49
and a six pack and all of that, you know, this sense of heightened masculinity that he walks
00:31:55
around with, that his character walks around with. But again, those guards both need to come down in
00:32:00
order for the relationship to work. And that's what you watch during the movie. Yeah. How fun to get a make out with someone like that. Right.
00:32:09
I mean, I think it must be amazing for him to make out with someone like me. I have four Emmy nominations.
00:32:15
Obviously. That goes without saying. He doesn't want to make out with a person who's lost four Emmys.
00:32:20
There's nothing. Only podcasting is better than that. That's true. I haven't lost four Emmys.
00:32:27
No, he's beautiful. But he's so much more than that. Like, he's such a great guy.
00:32:34
and he's very funny and sweet and endearing in a way, in a very different way than my type of funny is.
00:32:41
And it's a pleasure. He's wonderful. So you were shooting this movie on the streets of New York City,
00:32:47
just like you shot Billy on the street. Did you ever have those moments where you're like standing in front of the library
00:32:52
or whatever going, oh my God, 15 years ago, I was, you know, screaming up the street and yelling at somebody
00:32:58
for not knowing, not being able to name a woman. And suddenly now I'm shooting my own movie.
00:33:04
like? Yeah, that it definitely hit me. You know, I'm not someone who usually takes a lot of time
00:33:09
to appreciate things in general. I am a gay Jew from New York City. So there is that. But I did
00:33:19
force myself when we were shooting Bros. Seriously, we were shooting on the Upper West Side right near
00:33:24
Central Park. And, you know, one of the great things about Bros, look, there has been many gay
00:33:30
rom-coms over the years. There've been many great indie movies and there's so many great movies and
00:33:34
series that center around gay characters on streaming platforms. And those are all great.
00:33:39
I mean, Bros can only exist because of all those movies that came before us and like paved the way
00:33:46
for this. I loved all those movies. I saw many of them at the movie theater because I grew up in
00:33:50
New York and where those movies actually played in the movie theater. So I was very lucky.
00:33:55
Right. Exactly. But Bros is something a little different than that. You know, because it's from a major studio, we had a big budget and we could make the movie beautiful the way that Nora Ephron made her New York movies beautiful.
00:34:08
And the way that James L. Brooks in those early years with broadcast news and As Good As It Gets, movies like that.
00:34:14
You know, those movies are, they're shining, you know, they're gleaming. And that's part of the experience.
00:34:20
And I wanted to make a movie like that about a gay couple, you know. And we were shooting on the Upper West Side, right outside of Central Park.
00:34:28
And Luke and I are doing that witty banter rom-com thing. And I did take a moment where I said, wow, like this is all those movies that I grew up with.
00:34:37
You know, this is Moonstruck. And this is When Harry Met Sally. I'm not saying it's as good as those movies, but that's what we were striving for.
00:34:44
Work Girl, all those great New York romantic comedies. But it's about two gay guys.
00:34:49
and the whole cast is LGBTQ and so much of the crew behind the scenes was LGBTQ. And I did take
00:34:57
a moment to just appreciate that. Yeah. Try to just, you know, I'm always very grateful,
00:35:03
but usually, you know, you're working really hard. You get caught up in the chaos of the work and the
00:35:08
anxiety of it. But in that moment, I said, you know, you better take a moment to really appreciate
00:35:14
this because this doesn't happen every day. Well, I was going to pivot because we're speaking
00:35:20
of New York and the fact that you grew up there and this is, you know, being a true crime podcast,
00:35:25
you grew up in a very storied, true crime centric neighborhood. Were you aware of what was going on
00:35:33
in Queens around you at the time or before that? Or, you know, did your family talk about
00:35:38
all the storied stories that went on? Yeah. I mean, I remember, this is a little bit before my time,
00:35:45
but my parents were both native New Yorkers too. My parents met at a disco on Long Island
00:35:51
called The Jungle in 1976. Wow. Yeah Oh that right in the Son of Sam area I think they were dating in the Son of Sam era in New York City in the 70s So they would always talk about that
00:36:07
And my mom would talk about how scared she was to go out. And remember, obviously, no cell phones, no internet, no texting, no nothing.
00:36:18
You were going out alone. And they talked about that and lover's land and all that stuff.
00:36:23
and it was so freaky to me as a kid. I mean, freaky to me as an adult too. But I mean, that stuff really scares you as a kid,
00:36:31
you know? Yeah, horrifying. Well, we could talk about, actually we could switch over to,
00:36:36
you played Tex Watson in the American Horror Story Cults season. Do you follow true crime?
00:36:42
You're not a fan of it. No, I do follow true crime. I don't have a podcast about it.
00:36:49
You can. That was a very intense experience. You know, I played a couple of serial killers on American Horror Story on different seasons.
00:36:57
The first season I did was called Cult. It was literally about being in a cult of what became a cult of serial killers, essentially.
00:37:05
Yep. We were shooting people. We were stabbing people. We were putting staples in a guy's head.
00:37:10
We were amputating people. I got amputated at the end. Spoiler alert. Spoiler, yeah.
00:37:16
Sorry, all you amputation fans. You should have watched Cult of the movie. You had your chance.
00:37:21
But that, yeah, I mean, and then to recreate the Manson murders, which we did, was very, I mean, American Horror Story, you kind of have to get used to doing all kinds of crazy shit.
00:37:31
You're constantly murdering people in all kinds of horrifying ways. But you also, it's also your job, you know?
00:37:38
So, you know, you're kind of murdering people and then they call cut and then you're looking at each other and you're all like dripping with blood and you're like, when is lunch again?
00:37:45
and just sort of making jokes, even though what's happening around you, you're playing like a group of serial killer clowns.
00:37:53
Yeah. And trying to make small talk on set. But in order to do the job, right, to play those roles,
00:37:59
I mean, you really have to put yourself into the mind of someone who would get to the point
00:38:04
where they are rationalizing, murdering multiple people. Yeah. You know, that's your job as an actor in those roles.
00:38:11
And when we created the, when we recreated the Manson murders, you know, I'm there and yeah, it's fake and all, but I'm stabbing a very realistic looking pregnant woman to death, you know, and that's, it's, it's disturbing.
00:38:27
It's not fun. It's really, really disturbing. And you're usually shooting late at night. The production design on those shows is on such a high level that it all feels very real.
00:38:36
And not only, I mean, the real people who did it only had to do it once. I had to do it 50 times, different days.
00:38:44
I mean, who had it worse, really, when you think about it? That's right. No one was being, they weren't criticized as they were doing it.
00:38:51
And basically told, like, we need more from you. We need less from you. They just did.
00:38:55
Yeah. They weren't stabbing a pregnant lady and then hearing, oh, sorry, the camera didn't work.
00:39:00
Can you do it again? Reset. Yeah, reset. Your wig's falling off. Well, Tex Watson was, I think, just as evil and horrible as Manson.
00:39:09
Manson gets all this credit for being the evil mind of it. But Tex Watson- Tex did the killing.
00:39:16
Yes. Yeah. He enjoyed it. Absolutely. I mean, I agree with you. It's very fucked up.
00:39:22
And those shows are a real mind fuck. Yeah, they are. I bet. You know, on Cult, I killed more people on Cult than I killed people on the second season.
00:39:33
I did Apocalypse 2. that kind of had more of a fantastical sci-fi vibe. I did kill people on that, but not as many.
00:39:43
And it was mostly shooting. Like there's something about stabbing and stapling. Stapling.
00:39:50
Stapling is just, yeah. Who came up? Who comes up with that? You know what I mean?
00:39:54
The completely insane writers of American Horror Story. Those are the people you should talk to
00:39:58
because they have to come up with this shit like season after season for like multiple spinoffs.
00:40:03
It's like, all right, how do we amputate someone in a new way? Yeah. Oh my God. It just keeps happening.
00:40:09
Yeah, you do. You have to get yourself into the mind of a killer. Yeah. Like, you know, and that's, it is disturbing in that moment, you know, because you really
00:40:20
do have to, you have to think to yourself, okay, what would, acting is always about finding
00:40:26
how you as a person can relate to what the character is doing, no matter how insane it
00:40:31
is. So you always have to ask yourself, okay, in what scenario could I bring myself to the point where I was stabbing a person to death?
00:40:40
Yeah. Like you really have to ask yourself that. Right. And not that I ever would, but you have to go through those motions mentally.
00:40:50
You have to do that mental gymnastics to get you there. And then you have to do it over and over and over again.
00:40:55
Because like I said, some of these scenes you shoot for hours and hours and hours.
00:40:59
Yeah. And that's pretty fucked up. Like, I would leave sometimes and it would take us a minute to shake it off.
00:41:06
I bet. Yeah, I was going to say, when you were done shooting, all of it, did you have to go on,
00:41:12
you know, get away from people for a little while or just go readjust back to yourself?
00:41:17
Yeah, I mean, those shoots are very intense, those American Horror Story shows. They shoot a lot, a lot of footage,
00:41:25
and it's all very dark. takes a lot of energy, a lot of focus. Yeah, I mean, look, and especially I'm a comedy guy,
00:41:32
you know, like, and the cast makes it fun because the cast is so incredible. And I'm sure you guys know Leslie Grossman,
00:41:41
the hilarious Leslie Grossman. Oh yeah, the greatest. I got to do a lot of my stuff on Horror Story with her.
00:41:46
Nice. And, you know, we're mostly comedy people, me and Leslie. And Ryan Murphy and all his mad genius
00:41:52
sort of thought that was fun, that he would take two comedic people and turned them into serial killers Yeah But Leslie and I kept looking at at each other like we did God knows what to someone killing them in whatever way we were killing that person that day
00:42:06
We would just look at each other like they would call cut and we'd look at each other
00:42:09
and we're dripping with blood and the whole thing. And we would just be like, you know, we were supposed to be on the Goldbergs.
00:42:16
Like we were supposed to be on a nice sitcom on CBS, How I Met Your Mother. or something.
00:42:22
A little different. We weren't supposed to be raping and murdering each other. Well, maybe Bros is your answer to that.
00:42:29
It's like, after recording, you're going to, everyone needs to watch Bros on the cast and crew
00:42:33
just to feel a little bit better about what they're doing. There are no serial killers in Bros.
00:42:38
Yeah. Which on My Favorite Murder, you know, might actually be doing a disservice
00:42:42
to the box office. Yeah, that's right. You need that. It's a very, it's a big audience.
00:42:47
And you don't know those extras, they're living their own lives. You don't know.
00:42:50
We could have. That's true. Could have captured some people in the background that have questionable.
00:42:55
Hey, we shot in New York City and in parts of New Jersey, so you really never know.
00:43:00
Your husband is not who you think he is. Your body is not what you thought it was.
00:43:06
Your identity is formed by a secret history. I'm Dani Shapiro, and these are just a few of the stunning stories I'll be exploring on the 14th season of Family Secrets.
00:43:16
And just then, we felt the plane turn in the air. So much so that the bags that were under people's seats just kind of flew into the aisle.
00:43:26
Each week, we dive headfirst into the complex power of secrecy, how it shapes our identities and relationships,
00:43:33
and how it ultimately can reveal to us our truest selves. My daughter, she's pretending she doesn't know,
00:43:39
but is trying to cook and feed me and keep me alive because I wasn't eating anything.
00:43:43
And me pretending like everything was fine. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move.
00:43:48
and he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off and that was the last time I saw him.
00:43:54
Listen to Season 14 of Family Secrets on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:44:01
Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and iHeart Podcast presents Soccer Moms. So I'm Leanne.
00:44:06
Yeah. This is my best friend Janet. Hey. And we have been joined at the hip since high school.
00:44:10
Absolutely. A redacted amount of years later, we're still joined at the hip. Just a little bit bigger hips.
00:44:16
This is a podcast. We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey.
00:44:21
With all the snacks and drinks. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer? Oh, they had a BOGO.
00:44:27
Well, then you got them. Listen to Soccer Moms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:44:33
You know the famous author Roald Dahl. He thought up Willy Wonka and the BFG. But did you know he was a spy?
00:44:40
Neither did I. You can hear all about his wildlife story in the podcast, The Secret World of Roald Dahl.
00:44:47
All episodes are out now. Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been.
00:44:51
What? Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you, the guy was a spy. Binge all 10 episodes of The Secret World of Roald Dahl.
00:44:59
Now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you have a true crime case that kind of grabbed your attention and wouldn't let go?
00:45:09
like we all kind of have? I do. You know, I am a Hollywood guy. I like Hollywood and pop culture a lot.
00:45:16
And another movie that I've been developing intermittently over the last few years
00:45:21
is a biopic of the actor Paul Lind. Oh. Paul Lind, for those that don't know, was a very famous television actor
00:45:30
and personality in the 70s. He first came to fame on Broadway in the original cast of Bye Bye Birdie.
00:45:36
And then in the movie version, And he sang that song, kids, what the hell is wrong with these kids?
00:45:41
He's the original guy. And then he shot to national fame playing Uncle Arthur on Bewitched.
00:45:48
Right. Then became really rich and famous as the center square on the original version of Hollywood
00:45:56
squares in the 70s, which people may not remember. But in those days, first of all, there were only three networks.
00:46:02
So if you were on TV, you were being seen by tens of millions of people. every night. We were not in the fragmented culture that we are in now. And Hollywood Squares,
00:46:13
the original, I grew up with the syndicated version with Joan Rivers and Whoopi Goldberg,
00:46:17
but the original one, Paul Lind was the star and that was a top 10 show. It's hard to describe. You can go and watch it on YouTube. And the reason Paul was so unique is
00:46:28
because even though he was not out of the closet, which no one was in Hollywood in those days,
00:46:33
he was as out as you can be he projected a very flamboyant obviously most likely gay
00:46:41
comedic persona and not only that but a lot of the jokes he made on hollywood squares were double
00:46:47
entendres about being gay which you can go watch compilations of these on youtube and when you
00:46:52
think about the fact that he was doing this in the 70s it's really shocking he was pushing the
00:46:57
boundaries and especially on a very mainstream show that was you know being broadcast and watched by
00:47:02
millions of people, not only on the coasts, but all over the country, in the Midwest and the South.
00:47:07
I mean, Hollywood Squares was a huge hit. And for many people out there, you know, what they say is
00:47:12
that Paul Lind, whether they were willing to admit it or not, was probably the first and most
00:47:18
openly gay man that they ever let into their lives on the TV every week. And so he became very popular
00:47:26
as this very flamboyant, not openly gay, but most likely gay personality. And something happened
00:47:34
actually to him between Bewitched and Hollywood Squares. And Paul Linwood toured the country a lot,
00:47:42
was a very popular personality. He also had a lot of demons, major drinker, big time alcoholic,
00:47:49
a lot of substance abuse issues. He was a tortured guy. I've spoken to many people that know him.
00:47:54
I've spoken to Peter Marshall, the original host of Hollywood Squares, who's still alive in like 97 years.
00:48:00
years old. Wow. He was lovely and spoke to me on the phone about Paul. I spoke to Bruce Valanche,
00:48:07
the legendary comedy writer. Bruce, one of his first jobs was writing jokes for Paul.
00:48:12
Nice. Oh, wow. And so it's been fascinating to dive into it. A very complicated man. And then,
00:48:17
so Paul would travel the country a lot. And in his personal life, he was very openly gay.
00:48:23
And he loved to party, loved to go out. So one night he goes to San Francisco, staying at the very famous Drake Hotel, Sir Francis Drake Hotel. And he has a companion,
00:48:34
a younger man who was a struggling actor named James Davidson. Now, this is long before the
00:48:42
internet and all of that. And Paul died young. He died in the early 80s. He was like, you know,
00:48:46
in his mid 50s. So he never got to write the book about his life, you know. So a lot of this is
00:48:53
sort of conjecture. But James Davidson and Paul, at the very least, were good friends.
00:48:59
And there are rumors that they might have been more than friends. It might have been a sexual
00:49:04
relationship or sometimes sexual. No one's quite sure. But one night, they go out partying in San
00:49:10
Francisco. They both come back wasted, maybe high as well. And they go back to Paul Lynn's very fancy
00:49:17
hotel room at the Drake. And he was staying on a floor that was pretty high up. And James Davidson
00:49:23
is playing around on the terrace and he climbs onto the ledge and he says, Paul, look at this.
00:49:30
And he was fucked up and he was messing around. And Paul thought he was just being funny and doing
00:49:36
some sort of trick. And then James Davidson slips off the ledge. And then he somehow grasps on
00:49:44
and holds on and he's yelling for Paul, I'm slipping, I'm slipping, I'm slipping.
00:49:49
And there's all these people down below on the street, including some police officers who are watching this happen.
00:49:55
And it happens very quickly, obviously. And Paul runs over and is telling James to try.
00:50:00
Paul was not strong enough to pull James Davidson up and rescue him. And Paul's yelling at him to put his hands around his neck,
00:50:09
Paul's neck, because Paul could maybe pull him up that way. But James couldn't do it because if he let go,
00:50:13
he would fall and sure enough, James Davison slips and falls to his death. Guys on the street falling off of Paul Lynn's hotel room terrace, the balcony ledge, you know,
00:50:26
and guys on impact. Traumatic. And the police were there watching and they came up and, you know,
00:50:34
they interviewed Paul. And I think because Paul, because it was an open secret in Hollywood that
00:50:39
Paul was gay and a bit of a troublemaker, you know, he'd gotten arrested a few times over the
00:50:43
course of his life, not for murder, but for things like public intoxication or resisting arrest.
00:50:47
You know, he was a troubled guy. Yeah. Yeah. Drank a lot. And apparently, according to people
00:50:52
that knew him on one drink, Paul was really fun. And on two or three drinks, he was the meanest
00:50:58
person you've ever met and not really fun to be around. And so he wasn't known to be the nicest
00:51:04
person. And so rumors started circulating about Paul. And I'm sure the fact that he was gay and
00:51:10
that that was at the time considered a very seedy thing to be like something dark and disturbing,
00:51:17
that there were rumors circling that Paul must in some way be responsible for this guy's death.
00:51:23
Now they did an investigation and Paul was never charged. And the police said that this guy was
00:51:28
drunk and was like messing around on the ledge and fell off. And Paul was trying to save him. But
00:51:35
you know, I think it's something that really haunted Paul the rest of his life. And he always worried that, you know, just the rumors alone did damage to him because he perceived
00:51:47
to be a very troubled person anyway, regardless of what actually happened. And it's not a story
00:51:53
that I knew about until I started to research Paul. I mean, it's horrifying. It's like something
00:51:58
you would see in a movie that doesn't actually happen in real life. You know, a guy plummeting
00:52:03
to his death off the ledge of like a very famous actor's hotel. I've always been really fascinated
00:52:08
by that and about Paul in general. Wow. How sad that he died so young and couldn't, you know,
00:52:13
write a memoir and come out if, you know, in fact he was gay and actually live his life.
00:52:20
Well also just the idea that that was between Bewitched and Hollywood Square So then he went on to be even a bigger comedic presence with that on him On him That exactly right And I think he as boldly flamboyant as he was willing to be on
00:52:39
camera, that doesn't mean there was a lot of self-doubt there, especially in that era of
00:52:43
Hollywood. I think Paul always felt that it was a catch-22. He became rich and famous as a
00:52:49
personality because he was so flamboyant and people responded to it. And at the same time,
00:52:55
Hollywood saw that and said, you're a flamboyant gay guy and that's all you can do. And that's all
00:52:59
you're good for. So you're not going to star in movies and you're not going to play anything other
00:53:03
than that. That's what we're going to let you do. And you'll make a very nice living at it.
00:53:07
And you just be happy being that. And for many years in Hollywood, for all openly LGBTQ folks,
00:53:14
that was the situation. If you were lucky enough to even get that sort of a breakout
00:53:19
role, quote unquote, on TV, your options were still very limited. And that's why for so many
00:53:25
years, people didn't come out. People were often given one of two options if you were LGBTQ.
00:53:32
If you wanted the career of your dreams, stay in the closet, lead some weird Rock Hudson style
00:53:38
double life where the public thinks you're dating women, but secretly you're gay, which
00:53:43
I'm sure they rationalized it at the time as being fine and the only option, but that has to do a number on your soul and on your spirit, you know,
00:53:52
or be bold enough to come out and then be punished in terms of the opportunities you were going to get.
00:53:58
Yeah, play parts that make that you're the butt of the joke, you're always... I mean, to me, it feels like that's the Paul Lynde turn was that he was flamboyant to the point,
00:54:08
but he always had that bitter smile on his face of... There was a little bit of fuck you to his comedy that I really loved when I was a kid because it wasn't, oh, you're just the shopkeeper with his hands above his shoulders, but we're not going to talk about it.
00:54:25
It was that kind of thing of like, I'm going to make the joke on you guys. You are not going to make the joke on me, which I loved.
00:54:34
Yeah. And I'm going to be myself, but I'm going to be so funny and clever and surprising that you're going to laugh.
00:54:41
And that was very disarming in spite of the fact that he was pretty aggressive. Yeah.
00:54:46
Yeah. Right. And that was his secret weapon. You know, like I can be this gay, especially for that time.
00:54:53
But the joke is going to be so funny that you're going to be laughing too hard to make a big deal out of who I am.
00:55:00
Yeah. And yet I do think it did torture him a bit on the inside, not because he felt shame about being gay.
00:55:08
That's hard to say because he's not around anymore. but because he was an actor, you know, a very, Paul and I have all kinds of strange overlap.
00:55:15
He was a theater major at Northwestern, as was I. He was very tall and imposing.
00:55:22
I'm also very tall. Very imposing. Just so intimidating. Very intimidating. I'm very scary. Even on a, even in a Zoom.
00:55:31
My heart is racing. Yeah. This square, this square can't hold you. It just can't.
00:55:36
Yeah, no, I'm too big for Zoom. But, you know, I was very lucky. And I mean, Bros is the perfect example
00:55:46
because if I had been born when Paul was born, Hollywood Squares was probably the best I was going to do.
00:55:53
You know, and if I had presented that type of flamboyant persona, which I have on Billy on the Street and other things,
00:55:59
that's probably as good as it was going to get for me. And don't get me wrong. I love Billy on the Street.
00:56:03
I'm very grateful for it. People love it. I love it. But I'm an actor like Paul.
00:56:08
I went to Northwestern wanting to do other things and not have to do them while living my life in secret
00:56:14
or keeping something that's such a natural, obvious part of who I am a secret. So if Paul was around today, he'd be able to make Bros.
00:56:24
And it's just a matter of time being born too soon that he wasn't. And we do take some time in Bros to speak to that
00:56:32
because although it is a celebratory film and first and foremost, a comedy, you know, it's, it's, yes, it's, it's historic in a couple of
00:56:41
different ways. And it's the first this and the first that, but really you have to say,
00:56:47
you can only celebrate it You know you have to say why did it take so long Yes You know what about all the Paul Lins and Paul at least Paul was rich and famous He had a great life But what about the other Paul Lins out there who didn become Paul Lins There was you know well there was one Paul Lins you know so in that
00:57:04
he got very lucky based purely on talent and the audience loving him. But there were so many other
00:57:09
Paul Lins out there and not just cis men, all kinds of LGBTQ people who weren't able to get
00:57:17
the opportunities that we're getting now as LGBTQ folks in Hollywood, because the industry decided
00:57:22
to start welcoming us a handful of years ago. What about them? And why? Why did they not get
00:57:28
these opportunities based solely on the fact that their gender is this, or they sleep with this
00:57:32
person or that person? I mean, it's so insane when you think about it. And yet that was the truth
00:57:38
up until very recently. And so as much as Bros is a moment to celebrate, you also have to
00:57:45
acknowledge why it took so long and what it took to get us here. For sure. But I also think, you know, the thing that made me think of Billy is like,
00:57:53
when I first saw Billy on the street, and it was just you on the street, just kind of very
00:57:59
unapologetically being exactly who you are, where when you first start talking to people,
00:58:04
you're polite. It's like, Miss, can I ask you a question? And then whatever you decide you want to
00:58:11
however you want to react and it's all really honest and real and then you just run up the
00:58:16
street you just run away or give them a dollar or whatever there was this real assertion of self
00:58:23
on screen that I think was a huge part of why that show was so gigantically popular and truly beloved
00:58:30
is because there was no prologue about who oh this is a certain kind of show and this is a certain
00:58:36
kind of person. It literally is just like, here's a game show. Can you handle it? Catch up with me.
00:58:42
Goodbye. And it was amazing. It was beautiful. Thank you. That's very sweet of you. I mean,
00:58:47
yeah, I presented that persona in a very matter of fact way. And I just kept thinking,
00:58:54
and this factored into bros too, when it came to the sex scenes. We have some very funny sex
00:58:59
scenes in bros and they're mostly there for comedy the way they would be in any Judd Apatow movie.
00:59:04
you know they're explosively funny they get some of the biggest laughs in the movie and then we have
00:59:08
some that are more sweet and more romantic but when it came to talking about those scenes you know
00:59:13
any trepidation anyone would have I said if sasha baron cohen can roll around naked in a bed with a
00:59:20
guy for laughs and no one has a problem with it and everyone just talks about how funny it is then
00:59:25
why can't I yeah yeah yeah and we've seen so many funny sex scenes forgetting sarah marshall which
00:59:31
Nick Stoller made opens with this classic scene where Jason Segel is totally naked and his dicks
00:59:35
hanging out arguing with his girlfriend. I mean, it's hilarious. The Russell Brand sex scene in
00:59:39
that movie is hilarious. And these are part of the pun, like balls to the wall, you know,
00:59:45
no holds barred, like unapologetic scene. So I said, wait a second, now we're going to do a
00:59:50
Judd Apatow movie, but it's about two gay guys. So we're going to hold back. No way. And it,
00:59:56
and it makes it, I'm telling you, straight people are more thrilled by it than gay people. I think
01:00:01
for gay people, they're like, oh, wow, that's cool. Like we get a sexy now, a funny, a big,
01:00:05
funny sex scene in a, in a movie theater on a big screen, but straight people are like,
01:00:09
wow. Yeah. How come we've never seen this? Like, this is fun and new for us. We've seen the other
01:00:14
thing a million times. And so that we brought that unapologetic nature that you're very kind
01:00:21
for pointing out that I brought to Billy on the street and we tried to bring that to bros too.
01:00:26
And I, you know, I think that's important. Yeah, it is important. Definitely. And hilarious.
01:00:31
I mean, I just, I truly can't wait to see this movie. That's right. And I can't wait to see it in the theater.
01:00:35
Because I think that's, like, you're right. That experience of just having an experience like that
01:00:41
where many people in the audience are going to be having kind of awakening experiences or, like, realizations of newness
01:00:49
or why in 2022 is this, I mean, like, there's just so much to it aside from just the regular thing.
01:00:56
It's, congratulations. It's really cool. Thank you very much. I can't wait for you guys to see it.
01:01:01
Yeah, it's a party. You know, I've been to many screenings of the movie and it really feels like a party in there.
01:01:06
Hundreds of people laughing together and eating snacks and sitting in a dark theater.
01:01:11
I forgot what that's like. The big screen and having those laughs together is very different than laughing alone to your flat screen in your house As great as that is and it great And of course I do that a lot too You know that the world we live in but I am telling you
01:01:30
it is so fun. It is like being on a ride. You're laughing together. You're being moved together
01:01:34
as a group, straight people, LGBTQ people all in the same room together. It's a really special
01:01:41
experience. And I hope people go out there and support it because it's important to support
01:01:46
LGBTQ movies like this. We need straight people to get out there and support us opening weekend.
01:01:51
It opens September 30th. You know, there is this longstanding belief in Hollywood that gay movies
01:01:56
are for gay people unless they star straight movie stars, which this does not. So, you know,
01:02:03
and look, I love romantic comedies. I love great comedies. Gay people have been going to see rom-coms
01:02:10
about straight people, Julia Roberts and Richard Gere and, you know, Sandra Bullock and whoever
01:02:16
she's with in any particular movie and Meg Ryan and Tom Hanks. And I grew up loving those movies.
01:02:21
And I never looked at them and said, I can't relate to this. I'm gay. I always loved the
01:02:26
movies. And so, you know, this is an exciting moment for it to work in the reverse, you know,
01:02:31
for straight folks to go and say, hey, yeah, I see myself in this. Oh, but some of it actually
01:02:35
is very different. And some of it's the same. And this is new, in addition to being really funny.
01:02:41
So I hope people get out there and get out to the movie theaters. I know it's something we don't do
01:02:45
as much anymore, but I really want to send a message to people that funny is funny. And that
01:02:52
if you make a great movie that happens to be about gay people, that street people will show up too.
01:02:56
And the industry needs to see that. And also, I guarantee you a good time. I'm really proud of it.
01:03:01
Awesome. Amazing. Well, again, it comes out September 30th. We're all going to go
01:03:05
see it opening night together. Everyone listening. Bros. Bros. Yeah. Bros with an exclamation point.
01:03:12
That'll be the musical. You get to hold it up over your head. Bros. Exactly. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and talking to us podcasters
01:03:25
as a podcaster. Hot podcaster. Hot podcasting. That's what it's all about. Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.
01:03:34
Absolutely. It's been a pleasure. boom bye Elvis do you want a cookie this has been an exactly right production
01:03:48
our senior producers are Hannah Kyle Crichton and Natalie Wren our producers Alejandra Keck
01:03:54
this episode was engineered and mixed by John Bradley our researcher is Maren McGlashan
01:03:59
email your hometowns and fucking hoorays to myfavoritemurder at gmail.com Follow the show on Instagram and Facebook at MyFavoriteMurder and on Twitter at MyFaveMurder.
01:04:09
Goodbye! He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move. And he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off.
01:04:40
And that was the last time I saw him. Listen to season 14 of Family Secrets on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
01:04:48
When you feel uncomfortable, what do you put on? Biggie. You put on Biggie when you feel uncomfortable?
01:04:54
Because I want to get confident. This is DJ Hester Prynne's Music is Therapy, a weekly podcast from me, a DJ and licensed therapist.
01:05:01
It's Mental Health Month. Let's figure out what actually works. I didn't care about my life circumstance when I listened to that stuff.
01:05:07
It didn't matter to me. This isn't just a podcast. It's unconventional therapy for you every day.
01:05:13
Open your free iHeartRadio app, search DJ Hester Prince Music is Therapy, and start listening now.
01:05:18
If you live in L.A., you already spend about 89% of your life in a car. So we turned it into a podcast.
01:05:24
On Do You Need a Ride, we pick up our comedian friends, drive around Los Angeles, and discuss what's happening in the world around us.
01:05:31
Cars are very rude to bicyclists, but in this case, it's a bicyclist going out of his way to get in the way of traffic.
01:05:37
All you did was roll your window down. It's like a talk show, but going 30 miles an hour.
01:05:43
New episodes every Monday on the Exactly Right Network. Listen to Do You Need a Ride on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.