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Taxes and fees extra. See full terms at mintmobile.com. hello and welcome to rewind with karen and george we're supposed to say that part together i don't
00:02:19
know we could oh we're doing it all over again we have not fixed a thing take 37 point of this
00:02:26
yeah show damn you people so obviously uh the whole point of this is we're going back in time
00:02:33
to revisit old episodes and um we of course now have all new commentary on our favorite moments
00:02:41
um things that we want to correct things that um you know case updates all that stuff and we'll
00:02:47
talk about everything that's changed along the way and reflect on the way things haven't changed.
00:02:52
Yeah. So gather up your favorite pet groomer and crabby barista and artisanal baker and gather
00:03:02
them around as we have a re-listening party. And we can all be day one listeners together.
00:03:07
Yay. We are rewinding back to episode four of My Favorite Murder that came out on February 11th,
00:03:15
2016. I mean, where were you on February 11th, 2016 before this podcast recording?
00:03:23
I don't know. I was, well, we were in my old apartment and I guess the notes here say that
00:03:30
I had just got new couches in my apartment. So apparently that's a conversation that we're having
00:03:34
there. And I remember them, there were these gray bouncy ones that I had just bought for like
00:03:40
Maybe $150 off the super pregnant woman off Craigslist. And I was like really proud of them.
00:03:48
They looked so grown up. Yeah, they were nice. They were really cool. And I think they didn't squeak like the other ones did.
00:03:55
Yeah, I think that's why I got them. That just reminded me, though, like I'm complaining about the couch squeaking,
00:04:01
but that was back in my era where I used to shake the microphone all the time. And so people literally, listeners were writing in and being like, you have to stop moving the microphone.
00:04:11
Because we didn't have stands. We were holding the microphone. Yeah, and like laying on couches.
00:04:16
One of my favorite facts that was found out about episode four is that this was not a weekly podcast at the time.
00:04:24
There was a 12-day gap between episode three and episode four. And it says in the notes someone wrote, do you remember why?
00:04:31
I mean, life. I had two jobs. You had two jobs. We kind of didn't know what we were doing. We also didn't know it mattered that much.
00:04:40
Yeah, no. The whole monetization element, the business part, none of that was in play.
00:04:48
No. At all. I remember once, like before this, I found out that someone I knew paid their rent with broadcasting and I was shocked to hear that.
00:04:58
Their rent was like $1,000 a month in their apartment. I was like, are you fucking kidding me? How? That's amazing.
00:05:04
Right. And I can say, in fact, there's a line I say in this podcast episode that says that I joke about how I can't write off these couches I just bought because podcasting is not a money making venture.
00:05:18
Everyone don't quit your job. And you said, you never know. A rare moment of optimism and positivity coming out of my mouth.
00:05:27
It totally is like, yeah, it's wild. So this was just love and then real jobs were actually happening too.
00:05:35
Yeah, we were making the time. We were trying. I was trying to do a Shonda Rhimes year of yes type of thing where I was just like, I don't like anything else in my life.
00:05:45
I better do something. Yeah. Oh, God. Yeah, I was really unhappy as well at the time.
00:05:50
It was rough. It was a weird, rough era. Yeah it definitely felt like a pivotal moment in that I needed to start something new that felt good that wasn about you know money making or anything like that
00:06:06
It was just about fun. Yes. And this was like a lifesaver for me in a lot of ways.
00:06:11
Aw. Well, me too, because my life was dark. It was dark shit. But also, yes, it was that kind of thing of like after we talked at that party and then had lunch, it was that kind of thing of like, yeah, I just want to talk about this and I don't want to feel bad for talking about it.
00:06:30
I want to talk to somebody that knows what I'm talking about so that we can go, oh, my God, whatever.
00:06:35
And like that alone, I think, that was a dot that had not been connected for most true crime listeners or true crime fans.
00:06:46
Yeah, it was very professional until these amateurs came around. Everybody had to keep it to themselves.
00:06:53
Yeah. And then suddenly it was the great unleashing of, yeah, we want to talk about this too.
00:06:59
Definitely. Oh, this was the first episode where we did Recommendations Corner. Oh, yeah.
00:07:04
Which is kind of great. It's not like we were like, oh, we have a big audience. We need to recommend some things.
00:07:09
We were like, hey, do what we say from day one. All right. So here is the intro from episode four.
00:07:16
that's karen i'm georgia that's georgia two girls one murder obsessed with true crime both of us
00:07:29
with bad things bad things happening we love it we want to know all about it so it'll never happen
00:07:34
to us and it turns out so do a lot of other people yeah because lots of people have been
00:07:39
telling us about how much they like it we've got we got a lot of emails from the last episodes of
00:07:45
people telling us their town murders, which I love. And it's like so exciting. And we haven't
00:07:49
read them yet because we want to surprise each other with it. Yes. But so many, I would look at
00:07:53
the first line in Gmail and it would say like these little things because I'm fucking curious
00:07:58
and I want to know what they say. But so many people are like, I didn't, I'm so, I was always
00:08:02
so embarrassed that this is a thing that I was into, which I'm like, what? I'm trying to talk
00:08:06
to everyone about it. I know. Well, that's how, that's how I felt when I was younger. Yeah. Like
00:08:10
that I was like crazy. Or people would think that you wanted to murder people. Right. Exactly.
00:08:15
And then the second I started doing stand-up and every other stand-up comic knew every serial killer backwards and forwards, I was like, oh, I get it.
00:08:21
I wonder what it is. Anxious people? Yeah. Probably. And it's so fascinating. Yeah.
00:08:31
It's like the worst of humanity. Yeah. I wonder if it's a little OCD-ish too, where you're like, I need to know everything about this now.
00:08:37
Yeah. And everything that's related to it. yeah please help help me prepare for when i run face to face right into john wayne gacy
00:08:47
because now you and i are gonna be able to fucking beat up any serial killer murderer
00:08:50
i found a new podcast not new it's really old but they talk about murderers and stuff a lot and
00:08:55
maybe i shouldn't plug it because then it's like go ahead no it's really good it's called
00:08:59
have you thinking sideways podcast no i've never heard of that it's like a girl and two dudes and
00:09:04
they just talk about like weird shit and a lot of it is murder it's great i like it i started
00:09:10
listening to Joe DeRosa and Pat Walsh's podcast, I'll See You in Hell. Oh my God. Which, because I
00:09:15
had to drive home from San Francisco yesterday, it was six hours. So I listened to many and it was
00:09:20
really hilarious. I recommend that. What do they talk about? They talk about horror movies? They put
00:09:23
on a horror movie, but then they just talk over it. You can't hear it or anything. They just tell
00:09:27
you what movie it is and they talk about it incidentally as they have conversations. It sounds
00:09:31
like it shouldn't work, but I bet it's fucking great. Well, it's so great because they both have
00:09:35
these insane comprehensive encyclopedic knowledge of movies so any tangent they go on they know
00:09:42
exactly who and what they're talking about which of course was a real sore spot for me yeah as I
00:09:48
anytime I bring up a subject I'm like you know that thing that happened that time hold on hold
00:09:53
on well you need like the right person to fill in the blank the blanks and you're just like oh
00:09:58
this is why I'm friends with you is because you you like I was just rambling and you were and you
00:10:03
filled it in and that's the best. That's what we do, right? It's totally what we do. Oh, I was
00:10:07
going to make you say the last part. I guess we're not good at that part. I do. Thank you.
00:10:16
I'm really excited audience because Georgia got new couches. And when I was listening to our first
00:10:22
episode, there's a sound in the background at the entire time. It's me squeaking on my couch.
00:10:29
like just constantly moving around. Oh, it was a leather couch. It was making me laugh so hard.
00:10:34
Oh God, I didn't even notice that. So that's, but no, it's all cleared up. I got these for podcasting.
00:10:39
So they don't make background noise in podcasting. Perfect podcasting couch. You can write them off.
00:10:44
Wait, not that I make any money on podcasting. This is not a money making venture, everyone.
00:10:49
Don't quit your job. You never know. You don't ever know. You don't ever know. You don't ever know.
00:10:54
Like getting murdered. Yep. Should we jump into it Or should we talk about making a murderer?
00:11:01
Have you been reading all the making a murderer theories? Well, the natural backlash has happened.
00:11:05
Yeah. Pretty sure he's guilty now. Are you? I'm pretty sure he's guilty now. Are you really?
00:11:12
Yes. I think that's very adult of you to be able to change positions. Yeah. Really.
00:11:20
Doesn't feel good. Well, look, here's the thing. This is the one thing I agree with.
00:11:26
In general, I think he's innocent. and I think very bad things are happening in that state.
00:11:31
I think people, there's a natural backlash when you get kind of spoon fed an answer,
00:11:35
not an answer, but like a villain. And like, here's really what happened. And they're leaving just enough pieces free
00:11:41
so you can put the mystery together yourself. And then everyone thinks they got it and they're on it.
00:11:46
So there's always the hot take of like, no, actually. Right, because everyone wants to know details.
00:11:51
Well, that's the problem is the people who are looking up details are like, oh this documentary was really one and you guys left so much shit out which makes me suspect of you and suspect of your conclusion
00:12:07
God, making a murderer was just as big of a thing. It was on par with the staircase.
00:12:13
Yeah. There was really, it was like boom, boom, boom with those HBO documentaries.
00:12:18
They were good. And then Serial, of course, like huge fucking shout out to the podcast.
00:12:22
Yes, serial, of course, where like, I just don't think that this would exist without it.
00:12:26
No, no, no. So that was going on. People were like suddenly realizing that there is a big interest in true crime.
00:12:33
So in episode four, I go first and tell a story that is truly still in my top five worst, most upsetting stories.
00:12:44
And there's a documentary called Cropsey that was made about this story that's amazing.
00:12:51
and please go watch it and rent it. I think we talk about it. The story, like this is one of those onion layer stories
00:12:58
where it just keeps, it starts bad and gets worse and then gets crazy. And then you're like, what are we even talking about?
00:13:04
Yeah, it's straight horror. It's like what horror stories are based on. Yes. Truly.
00:13:08
And the original, I mean, there's definitely documentaries about the exposure of Willowbrook Hospital.
00:13:16
Yes. And all of that, that story in and of itself. But then this wrinkle of the Staten Island local serial killer, child molester, like so horrifying.
00:13:28
And this is a person who had been arrested for attempted rape and he was driving a school bus.
00:13:37
Yeah, that's what it was like back then. Truly like just illogically bad. Yeah. So here is Karen telling you the story of Cropsey.
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00:15:51
Savings compared to renewal price void in Florida. Hey, Karen. Hey. What's your favorite murder?
00:15:58
Well, I thought it would be good that I would do a little damage control since on our last episode,
00:16:05
I was so sloppy and inaccurate talking about Cropsey. That was one of the ones where we were literally guessing what the name of the thing was I was trying to talk about.
00:16:15
Let everyone know that this is not an official report of anything that's happened.
00:16:20
We're not doctors. You're looking in the wrong place. We're not therapists. But the story has all of the elements of murder, you know, creeper, urban legend story.
00:16:33
Everything I love. It's got a mental hospital. It's got the woods. It's almost like that's too much if someone had written this thing.
00:16:41
Yeah. It's like you can pick one or the other, but you can't have a mental hospital in the woods.
00:16:45
It's crazy. I haven't seen it in so long. Tell me everything. Okay. So this is the story of Cropsey was an urban legend on Staten Island.
00:16:51
And it was, there was a hospital named Willowbrook and it is a hospital for mentally challenged children.
00:17:02
And they built it in say like the early forties. and uh it is on staten island in set in the woods and um it was a state institution and it was built
00:17:15
for 4 000 patients but by 1965 it had 6 000 children in it it was built for how many 4 000
00:17:22
so it was way over capacity and um and this was back when people used to dump their children so
00:17:30
And it didn't matter if they had Down syndrome or if they were very, very, you know, there was something really wrong with them.
00:17:37
Or they had like cerebral palsy. Yes. And they would just be like later days. Tons of cerebral palsy kids were completely intelligent and 100% there, just dumped.
00:17:46
And so what ended up happening was, of course, because it's like a state funded hospital.
00:17:51
So it over it over overflowing with patients That what I looking for I got it It good Go with it Understaffed overpopulated Overpopulated And so they end up
00:18:05
a reporter finally goes in. When we talked about it on the last episode, I said something really grandiose,
00:18:11
like Robert Kennedy shut it down. But Geraldo Rivera. Geraldo Rivera. So Kennedy saw it in the 68 and said,
00:18:21
this is a snake pit. This is a disgrace. and they started doing all these reviews.
00:18:25
And what had happened was all these children being in this close proximity, they found out it was like,
00:18:30
they were just in rooms naked, being hosed down, horrible. There was no lighting.
00:18:35
It was crazy. And a bunch of them started getting hepatitis. So then they had medical studies
00:18:39
where they were testing hepatitis on these children. Might as well do some fucking scientific testing.
00:18:44
Exactly. And they were basically giving them all hepatitis. They were getting it.
00:18:48
It was, so anyway, with all of this, these social workers finally went in there saw the conditions they got a reporter in there and
00:18:56
that's what led so a woman started writing exposés um for like a local newspaper and then that's how
00:19:04
geraldo got on the scene he worked as an investigative reporter for wabc in new york
00:19:10
so he went there and they did they did an exposé story that ended up winning a peabody because it
00:19:16
was so and they just kind of like they went when their doctors were gone and stuff right or the
00:19:20
doctors let them in that so uh i don't know about the geraldo part i don't know how he got in but
00:19:26
but the we talked about this before when you see the videotape and there is a documentary called
00:19:31
willowbrook like it's something like the great uh shame or something like something like that it's
00:19:38
um it gets mentioned a lot in all the research but um he basically went in and like the only
00:19:46
lighting was the light on the camera it's so like creepy it looks like uh like a american horror
00:19:52
story like asylum like totally just exactly what you think it's supposed to be like it would be
00:19:57
like 30 kids in a room naked sitting on the floor a cement floor rocking back and forth and then they
00:20:02
talked to one guy and he was like one of the patients and he's like i have cerebral palsy
00:20:07
and i am completely mentally functioning on 100 yeah and they yeah and i'm trapped in here right
00:20:12
nightmare okay so right so that alone is a nightmare that's willowbrook nightmare
00:20:16
geraldo being in it isn't great but it ends up they had it with all that and the expose they
00:20:23
passed legislation but you know about like um the rights of uh civil civil rights thing for
00:20:30
patients and stuff all this stuff well so then the urban legend pops up so they ended up closing
00:20:37
it in 1987, but they basically closed it in 72 or four. After this expose, they came out,
00:20:44
they shipped all of the patients to all different hospitals around and there was only like 200
00:20:47
patients left. So it was basically empty. And that's when the urban legend started where it was,
00:20:53
there's a mental patient that's still on the grounds because there's a tunnel system underneath
00:20:58
the hospital and he's living in the tunnels at night. He comes out and steals children.
00:21:02
That was the big thing on Staten Island in the 80s. Oh my God. How fucking terrifying to live in Staten Island.
00:21:09
Crazy, right? And so the high school kids, the big thing was go through the woods and get to the mental
00:21:14
hospital and like touch the wall of it or whatever. Absolutely not. And Cropsey's out there with you.
00:21:20
So, and there's a great documentary called Cropsey where they go into all this, they have
00:21:25
all the information that you need if you're fascinated because it's really good and fascinating.
00:21:29
So just imagine like parents in the 80s being like, you be good or crap, he's going to come get you.
00:21:34
Yeah. In Staten Island. You're like, well, actually, that could happen. So anyway, so now we're going to introduce a new character in this story.
00:21:40
Okay. And it's a man named Andre Rand. And he was, he's described in one of the pages that I read as a mentally incompetent convicted sex offender.
00:21:51
That's fun. So he's got it all. Yeah. And he was a janitor at Willowbrook from 1966 to 1966.
00:21:59
I feel like anyone you're going to hire to be a janitor there, you have to be like, no, you're fired because you're crazy, clearly.
00:22:05
Yes. So this guy gets the job in 66. Well, in 69, so he works there from 66 to 68.
00:22:14
In 69, he attempts to rape a nine-year-old girl. And just by chance, a cop car is driving by.
00:22:20
He takes a nine-year-old girl into his car and to an empty lot and takes off his clothes.
00:22:27
Her clothes are off. A cop car drives by. Sometimes life works well, you know? I mean, yeah, go on.
00:22:33
This is an upside. This is one upside in this hideous story. He gets sentenced to four years.
00:22:38
He only serves 10 months. You know, the classic scenario. I hate everything. This is why we have to do this podcast.
00:22:47
It's because our fucking penal system blows. Because we got to talk about it. We're going to affect change.
00:22:53
Oh, clearly. By laying on these couchs. I would have gotten 11 months if it was today because of us.
00:22:58
So he gets out And then That would be 69, 71 In 72, a nine-year-old girl named Alice Ferreira
00:23:07
Disappears off Staten Island Then in 1981 Nine years later A seven-year-old girl named Holly Ann Hughes
00:23:18
Goes missing And the eyewitnesses Saw her with Rand And she's never seen again And then in 1983, this is a real highlight for me.
00:23:31
He picks up 11 children from a YMCA in a school bus, takes them to White Castle,
00:23:37
and then drives them to Newark Airport for five hours. And when he gets back, he gets arrested for kidnapping.
00:23:45
Who the fuck is letting a guy who's been in prison for attempted rape drive a fucking bus of children?
00:23:50
A school bus. Come on, the 80s. He tries to rape a nine-year-old and then goes ahead and gets a job driving his school bus.
00:23:57
The 80s needs to go to prison for fucking... so this was back before we realized children were constantly in danger so in 83 an 11 year old
00:24:09
named tahease jackson disappears walking to the store uh and this is 12 days after rand is released
00:24:15
i bet he was buying cigarettes for his mom like i bet that's what you know yeah that's the 80s i
00:24:19
think that's what all of this is because staten island is not that big no and i think it's like
00:24:23
run down to the store for mommy and it's probably at one of the girls lived in a motel it's bad news
00:24:28
anyway. Okay. So that was 11 days after he got out of prison for the kidnapping? 12 days. 12 days.
00:24:35
He does that. And that's the same year he did the, oh, so he did the YMCA school bus trick and then
00:24:40
gets out of prison 12 days later, this kid goes missing. It's a girl. And then in 84,
00:24:49
a 22 year old guy who was a really low IQ goes missing. And then in 87, a girl named Jennifer
00:24:57
or Schweiger goes missing, and she has Down syndrome. And several eyewitnesses saw this guy, Andre Rand,
00:25:06
leading her by the hand toward the woods. I mean, that alone, there's your poster for the horror movie.
00:25:12
Fake. So they start searching for her, and after 35 days, they find her nude body in a shallow grave
00:25:22
on the Willowbrook property. And then a couple feet, you know several feet away Andre Rand has a
00:25:30
makeshift campsite he's been living on the Willowbrook grounds and the whole urban legend
00:25:36
is true and they eventually they charge him with kidnapping and first degree murder but they can't make
00:25:42
the murder stick for Jennifer Swigert no no no they get him for first degree kidnapping and then they bring
00:25:48
back and then once he's in jail for that he gets like 20 years then in 2004 they put him on trial for the Holly Hughes
00:25:56
disappearance and he's convicted of kidnapping and he gets, now he's set to get out in 2035
00:26:02
or something like that when he's 95. So he's in, he's in for good. They also linked him
00:26:08
to the disappearance of Ethel Atwell and the rape murder of Shin Lee who are both
00:26:12
Willowbrook aides. Oh my god, that sucks, man. He's a beast. And he's it's basically the most fascinating
00:26:20
story of that it all was true. what a bummer to go to work and then you get killed like don't go in the woods don't walk
00:26:27
to the store by yourself but you're like i'm just going to work just going to work just trying to
00:26:32
pay my rent oh fuck so that's that's crop safe that's a good murder i mean it's that's what's
00:26:38
good about is the it's the worst thing i've ever heard in my life you know that's the that's the
00:26:42
stats on this show is like what's the worst thing you've ever heard in your life i mean don't you
00:26:46
want to why hasn't anyone gone into the tunnels in that hospital and like dug around archaeology
00:26:52
logically and tried to find... Karen, 100th episode. Let's fucking do it. We get a school bus full of
00:26:58
11 children and drive them to Staten Island. Paypal us the money to get plane tickets to Staten Island and to not stay
00:27:04
on Staten Island because fuck that, we're staying in Manhattan. We gotta stay in Manhattan. We gotta see
00:27:08
Hamilton. Yeah. We gotta go to the shoe stores. Yeah. Then Cropsey. Then Cropsey. Yeah.
00:27:17
Oh, brother. I will not walk through those tunnels. My suggestion of our 100th episode, we take a walk through those Cropsey Hospital, obviously didn't happen.
00:27:34
We're aiming for episode 500 now. We're going to do episode 1000. Yeah, exactly.
00:27:39
Which means never. Yeah. The reason I covered this story in episode four is because in episode two, I tried to kind of tell you about it a little bit and did a bad job.
00:27:50
Which is the recurring theme, apparently, of my side of this podcast. Fix it. That's what this podcast is called.
00:27:58
Make up for that shit you did. Yeah. And back then we pick, I think in the very beginning, we pick stories.
00:28:05
I mean, for me and for this next story that I tell that has stuck with me for so long that I haven't been able to talk to anyone about.
00:28:14
And that's what's so fun about this podcast is I finally get to be like, can you believe this happened?
00:28:18
And then this happened because I've been keeping it to myself this whole time. Yes.
00:28:22
And it's been keeping me up all night and I can't stop thinking about it. So like this is a great way to get that to like exercise those demons.
00:28:31
Yeah, we almost I mean, totally. I did it that way, too, where I just went back and was like, where what are all the times that I have traumatized myself on Wikipedia?
00:28:40
Late night reading. And by myself going, oh, my God. Can you believe this? How is no one talking about this?
00:28:45
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that was really cathartic. Yeah. Cathartic. So as I said in the episode, Andre Rand was only ever convicted on kidnapping charges that involved two children, 12-year-old Jennifer Schweiger, whose shallow grave was found near Rand's campsite, and a missing seven-year-old girl named Holly Ann Hughes.
00:29:09
Turns out that Andre Rand is still alive in jail. He'll be eligible for parole in March of 2037 when he's 93.
00:29:20
But he's also connected to several unsolved cases. And I mentioned a few of them.
00:29:29
So 10-year-old Thais Jackson, 22-year-old Hank Coforio, 44-year-old Shin Lee, and 42-year-old Ethel Atwell.
00:29:38
But it is suspected Rand is linked to multiple other cases, including cases around the disappearances of multiple children on Staten Island.
00:29:51
Oh, my God. Horrifying. So horrifying. Okay so my story this week is the murder of Michelle Wallace My source was Forensic Files Season 9 Episode 4 where I saw this for the first time and just was so blown away
00:30:08
by the monster that perpetrated this crime. And it's just, it's stuck with me for so many years.
00:30:14
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00:32:35
Well, what's interesting about both of ours is that the murderer in question, still alive in
00:32:42
prison oh still alive how are these isn't it weird that this person it's like in your mind they're
00:32:46
like oh they did these awful things that long ago they're dead nope no live they had dinner tonight
00:32:51
they watched some tv they watched some tv you had a conversation with the guard perhaps they played
00:32:57
some bones probably play bones that what people do in prison i don't know what bones is it's
00:33:01
domino's oh i bet that yeah what do you think he had for dinner something gross chicken nuggets
00:33:06
yeah yeah dinner you guys that's better than what i've had for dinner and he's a monster
00:33:10
and he's a monster he's a monster speaking of monsters okay my favorite murder is that of michelle wallace michelle with one l and i remember seeing i love cold cases like that's
00:33:25
i love when murders get solved of course yeah but cold cases are my like passion and my dream
00:33:30
passion for people getting away with shit because it's just so curious i'm just so curious yeah but
00:33:37
I also like that the answer is never like satisfying. It's always like, that's just some
00:33:41
fucking janitor asshole did this to all these people. That's such a bummer. I want to be like
00:33:44
a monster or something. Okay. So, and I remember watching a cold hiss of this a long time ago and
00:33:51
two things that stuck out to me. Okay. She's a 25 year old photographer. This is 1974. She lives
00:33:57
in Chicago. She's like this free spirit photographer and she travels the world and
00:34:01
taking photos and taking odd jobs and stuff. And she goes to, in 1974, goes to Oregon,
00:34:10
spends a couple days in the Rocky Mountains, just taking some photos. I think I've seen this one.
00:34:14
Yeah. Is it a forensic files? I think there's a forensic files on it. She's leaving the Rocky Mountains
00:34:22
and she does the classic 1970s, I want to get murdered move. Do you know what that is?
00:34:28
Is it hitchhiking? It's fucking hitchhikers. She picks up hitchhikers. Oh, she picks them up.
00:34:33
She picks up two dudes. Oh, no. What? One girl alone picks up two dudes. What? 70s and 80s.
00:34:39
They're going to fucking prison. Yeah. What did they look like? I wondered that she was like, this is fine.
00:34:47
Yeah. I don't know. Was one really short or something? Short guys are strong. Don't pick up anyone.
00:34:52
And they're mad. And they're angry. Yeah. So we're going to get a lot of hate mail for this.
00:34:56
No, no, it's fine. I'm short. It's fine. Okay. So she drops one of them off at the bar.
00:35:01
this one dude and then of course she is never seen again um then the guy who she dropped off
00:35:10
a couple like finds out this girl's missing and he's like wait a second she dropped me off and
00:35:16
then the guy i was with who i barely knew said i'm gonna can you take me to my car actually
00:35:21
and the and the guy was like i didn't think he had a car so i thought that was strange
00:35:25
so they start looking his name is roy sorry the guy that got dropped off at the bar is the one
00:35:32
that says that yeah he's like okay i didn't think roy is his name had a car okay and he's like yo
00:35:37
why did you let her leave with him fuck you know like right there you could have fucking fixed anyways
00:35:41
um roy meelson me melanson melanson should have looked that up before Roy Melanson
00:35:50
he's a drifter and a convicted rapist but he got out after a very short time sure why keep him in this time now he knows to kill the person so they can ID him You know it like that how you do that That how you progress I having a panic attack
00:36:05
He's found with her driver's license, camping equipment, car keys, and pawn tickets for her camera.
00:36:13
And this is one of my favorite parts of why it stuck with me. And I can't fucking find this online now.
00:36:18
Some reason it's not up there anymore. They find the camera at the pawn shop. They develop the film.
00:36:24
It's all her photos in the Rocky Mountains. The very last photo is Roy sitting on a bed behind him laying down as a naked woman.
00:36:32
And it's not her. So he has her camera. You know, it's like, that's the proof. Yeah.
00:36:39
She's missing and you robbed her and you took a photo of yourself? You fucking idiot.
00:36:44
And I can't find that photo. I know it was in the forensic files or whatever. I totally remember this episode.
00:36:50
Yeah, because it's so freaky. So freaky. And then in 79, so what is that? Five, six years later, five years later, this is the other part that's really fucked up and
00:37:00
it stuck with me. They find just a scalp with two brown haired braids on it, like a scalp only.
00:37:09
Oh, where did they find it? Some hiker found it near where she had picked up the hitchhikers.
00:37:16
And then, so 12 years goes by, no body. this woman Kathy Young who becomes like the sheriff in town or I'm sure I'm saying that
00:37:27
incorrect she's not I'm sure she's much higher up uh she hires this this um company called
00:37:33
NecroSearch oh which I remember thinking at the time that's what I want to do I want to work there
00:37:38
for a living like I just want to I want to like the name alone yeah I just want to I want to follow
00:37:44
them like the Grateful Dead I'm going to be the receptionist at NecroSearch I can be like
00:37:48
necro search may help you what's your what's your emergency it's going crossbones but they like they
00:37:53
they like they have uncovered what they what they do is they find and they're really good at
00:37:59
uncovering clandestine grave sites so it's like you badass motherfuckers is that how do they have
00:38:07
like a they have like a website they have a farm where they like bury pigs dead pigs and kind of
00:38:15
understand the soil changes and like what, you know, what doesn't look right out in the nature?
00:38:23
What is man-made? What is placed there? These sorts of things. And like, what is the decomposition
00:38:27
of this pile of soil or dirt or like, you know, these kinds of things. What has been dug up in
00:38:34
the past 10 years even that's different from the soil next to it? Do animals scalp people and keep
00:38:39
the braids for themselves exactly stuff like that well here's what happened is they took her braids
00:38:45
and uh did some forensic analysis on them and found the uh leaves of a tree in that that was
00:38:54
in a certain area of that those mountains so they went there they spread out on that area where the
00:39:01
trees are day two fucking find her bones what was left of them wow i know these guys they've
00:39:08
uncovered over 200 and they've taken on over 235 cases. I don't know how many they've found,
00:39:16
but these are the good guys. Necro search. I love that. I know. I bet at a party we would
00:39:21
corner these people and I bet they get kicked out of parties a lot though. Oh my God. Yeah.
00:39:25
I would never leave a necro searcher alone. No. Can we get, can we have a request if anyone
00:39:29
knows a necro searcher to, I think they're in San Francisco to please have them be on the podcast.
00:39:33
I just think that's insanely fascinating. It's almost like having x-ray vision. Like you can look at a forest or a ditch and know what's wrong and what's off.
00:39:46
Absolutely. Well, the woman who found the bones was like, they were all searching for two days.
00:39:51
She goes off the trail to take a piss in the woods, which shouldn't be allowed if you're
00:39:56
looking for a set. Hey, she's still human. Yeah. and she looks and there's a ray of light flashing on a gold tooth she finds the skull
00:40:06
oh that's the that's the lord's work yeah and it was sorry this is where my christian part comes in
00:40:11
this is it i know not that before she dies and she when he no no no it doesn't belong there
00:40:19
well it's at the bottom of a ravine so like someone straight tossed person over.
00:40:25
Like didn't even didn't even bury her. Just threw her in. Tossed her over. So they
00:40:31
take Roy Melanson to trial. He is found guilty in 93. So she gets killed in 74 found guilty in 93.
00:40:43
Since then and I didn't know this until I started looking up to it he's been convicted for another murder
00:40:49
which happened 50 days before Michelle's murder in Napa in 1974. Yeah. Woman who was stabbed to death
00:40:57
at a bar she owned. And they found a cigarette butt that had his DNA on it. Put it through the fucking CODIS,
00:41:04
the most amazing thing in the world. Found his DNA match. Another woman in Louisiana
00:41:09
who fucking, it's gruesome. So he's done it multiple times. Yeah, at least twice
00:41:17
that they know of through DNA. But they're not taking the third one to trial because it's too expensive to do all these things for, which sucks for that family.
00:41:28
Yes. You know? But they know it's him. Yeah. Now they know it's him. But he's going to go to jail anyway.
00:41:34
So their rationale is he's there. Right. Which is why Napa took him to trial is because he can be eligible for parole, which I think is fucking hilarious for Michelle's murder in like the next 10 years.
00:41:46
Eligible for parole. So they convicted him to make sure that if that ever happens he has to be extradited to California Yeah it very strange the way the laws still work like that where it just kind of like oh and then we let him out again Right And then you know what He was real good inside so we let him out again
00:42:06
Yeah. We're like, well, at the trial, like one of the jurors sneezed wrong, so he's out.
00:42:12
Yeah. And we don't have enough money to try him again, and we think we're going to lose.
00:42:15
And we probably won't warn anybody just to keep it interesting. Nope. The good thing about all of this is that hitchhiking pretty much doesn't exist anymore.
00:42:23
Thank God. We've talked about this before. Like, I don't even understand. Like, I know it's like an innocent time and shit, but like, I don't think that's common
00:42:33
sense any time in your life. No. Any point in history. No. I mean, think of like if you were at a party with your friend's friends, you probably wouldn't
00:42:43
want to be in a car with any of those people. Yeah. And those are like cold. So imagine if it's just anybody driving down the street.
00:42:52
Have you ever hitchhiked? Is that negative of me? No. No. You don't want to be at a party with your friends?
00:42:57
No, I've never hitchhiked. I've never done anything like that. I think I have when I was a kid, but like with a friend.
00:43:04
And I think the person like, and it was like an Irvine where it's just like the safest place in the world.
00:43:08
But it was idiotic. And I think the person who picked us up like yelled at us. I did pick up two girls who were in junior high.
00:43:16
We were driving home. We were driving up to Petaluma from L.A., me and my ex. and we stopped at a gas station and there were two little girls that were, couldn't have been
00:43:25
more than 14 years old sitting at this gas station. It was two in the morning and they were, they were
00:43:30
trying to make phone calls. The whole time we were getting gas, I was watching them and they
00:43:35
were trying to make phone calls and they were doing this stuff. Two in the morning? Two in the morning
00:43:38
and I was watching them and the guy that worked there wasn't, seemed a little creepy. Yeah. And
00:43:44
he was kind of like coming out and looking at them and going back in and people would pull in
00:43:49
And I was just the whole time staring at them. And finally, when we went to leave, I was like, drive over there.
00:43:54
And we pulled up and I was like, do you guys need a ride home? And they were like, yep.
00:43:57
And immediately got in the car. And I was like, first of all, never get into a car with people.
00:44:02
And then secondly, did you go to Lou Sutton Grammar School? And they both went to my sister's grammar school.
00:44:08
And I got names and they kind of smelled. It was like, clearly they were from the bad side of town.
00:44:13
And they got like, they probably snuck out. Right. And then got stuck somewhere and then ended up at this gas station out by the freeway where I was like...
00:44:20
And it's not walkable. No. It's like five miles away from any neighborhood. And it's all farmland and shit.
00:44:26
Yeah. So we dropped them off and I was like, don't ever do this again. And they were like, and then bring them in and they will.
00:44:33
But... Where are they now? I wonder if they remember you. No, they both own that gas station.
00:44:41
Because of my setting them on their way. Yeah. Correctly. Good job. Thank you. Well, I just want to take a second to brag about something good I did for the community.
00:44:51
Do you mind? No, I love it. Thank you. What if they went home and killed their mom?
00:44:56
Can I turn this into a bummer real quick? They were the ones that were all along.
00:45:00
Yep. That's a good twist to rue. It is. Let's write a book. They went home and killed their mom.
00:45:07
Oh, I'm dead inside. is it satisfying to realize that you really have liked cold cases from the very beginning
00:45:19
you didn't just make that up at episode 85 i was really going after them i mean it's not a cold
00:45:24
case anymore thankfully yeah but it was a cold case for a very long time um and the way it got
00:45:31
solved is amazing so the book that i have since recommended a million times in this podcast called
00:45:36
No Stone Unturned by Steve Jackson talks extensively about this case because it's a
00:45:42
book about necrosearch and what a huge part of solving this case and finding evidence they were
00:45:49
for this story. And so for the updates, as I said in the initial episode, Roy Melanson was found
00:45:54
guilty of murdering Michelle Wallace in 1993, 19 years after Michelle's murder. And that's why we
00:46:00
do cold cases because they can still be solved. There's still time. And I mentioned in my initial
00:46:07
story that Melanson was convicted of two other murders, but I didn't give the victims names.
00:46:12
So in 2009 and 2010, DNA evidence connected Melanson with two other unsolved murders,
00:46:19
those of 51-year-old Anita Andrews in Napa, California, and 24-year-old Charlotte Sorwin
00:46:25
in Walker, Louisiana. And those cases are also talked about in No Stone Unturned.
00:46:30
And Melanson was only tried for the murder of Anita Andrews in 2011 and received an additional life imprisonment term.
00:46:37
And Melanson died on May 22, 2020 at the age of 83 in prison. And actually, which is, you know, part of it is law enforcement agencies are still trying to review cold cases around the country to connect Melanson to any of those cold cases I talk about all the time.
00:46:58
Right. That is a really creepy thing, too. Some of these serial killers and some of these murderers, they're interpreted by police as one-off, like rage killers or whatever, crimes of passion type of thing.
00:47:12
When they find out and uncover, no, this has been going on for a long time, and actually it's not just in this jurisdiction or this area, that really is the scariest reveal.
00:47:23
Yeah. Or it could be any cold case from anywhere in the country. Right. Okay, so here is our first listener hometown story.
00:47:31
So exciting. That is so exciting. E. Allen, the story's from E. Allen. Can you please comment and let us know if that's you? We need to give you all the credit and like send you merch and shit because...
00:47:42
Yeah, for real. Right? That's somebody who you came up with the idea of tell us your hometown.
00:47:47
I gave out my personal email address. gave out, no one said it. And then people actually responded,
00:47:56
and E. Allen is the person who was like, this is E. Allen. example of what we want people to be doing. Right. So you deserve all the credit. We need
00:48:04
to hook you up and shout you out. Yeah. And if you only want to remain E. Allen,
00:48:10
that's your business. That's fine, too. But E. Allen, let us know. Let us know. But E. Allen, I gave you my personal email address. So I feel like it's only for that
00:48:16
you give us your P.O. box so we can send you a Stay Sexy and Don't Get Murdered shirt.
00:48:20
E. Allen, I want your fucking phone number. I want to read one of our so at the end of the show we like to do your favorite or your town no
00:48:33
we do your town murder yeah so either we'll have a guest tell us a story or we're asking you guys
00:48:40
to send us uh your stories should we start at my favorite murder gmail I probably should sure let's
00:48:47
do it my favorite murder gmail and then there's also um there's also a facebook group so you can
00:48:55
start facebook page we call it facebook page group page i don't know what i said last time
00:49:01
you just called it plain old facebook page and it made me laugh really hard we have facebook page
00:49:07
we have facebook page uh called my favorite murder and you can tell your story on the front
00:49:11
pay on the front like tell everyone your shit and like you guys should like bond over it and stuff
00:49:15
I feel like I should also start a Twitter account. Maybe this is business that you guys want to hear about,
00:49:21
but I should because it seems like that's also a good way for people to. You're really good at that.
00:49:26
And it stresses me out to start from zero, like from zero followers. I'm really good at starting Twitter.
00:49:31
No, you're good at Twitter. Oh, thanks. It's my passion. I'm really bad at it. I started like a year ago because I hated it.
00:49:39
And I hate it now because I... It's a difficult exercise. eyes. It's just, it's, can you handle putting things out there and wanting something in return
00:49:49
and not getting it? No. Well, or can you? Cause you do it and then you get stuff.
00:49:55
It's true. I do get stuff out of it. Okay. Yeah. Start one. Let's do that. Okay. By this,
00:50:01
by this point that people are listening, it's going to be up anyways. Okay. We, I made a whole
00:50:06
file. Should we, let's see. All right. I'm just going to, I'm going to close my eyes and scroll
00:50:11
and pick one. Great. And if it sucks, then we'll delete it and start over. Okay.
00:50:15
Oh, my favorite murder, Adam Walsh case. Here we go. Oh, yeah. This is from E. Allen.
00:50:20
It's very fucking long. Ethan Allen, the furniture maker? Ethan Allen. Hello, Georgia. Big fan.
00:50:26
What a great podcast. My info relates to the Adam Walsh who was abducted in 81 from a mall
00:50:31
in Hollywood, Florida. In 1978, my dad had this great idea to move our family to Florida to get away from the brutal
00:50:37
cold of western Pennsylvania. is growing paranoia and black ice phobias that killed my social life. Oh, I thought he was going
00:50:44
to say killed my, um, we're not allowed to leave the house. Can I skip over shit? Is that due?
00:50:50
I think so. Okay. By 1980, I found my first job at the Hollywood mall in Woolworths working at the
00:50:55
snack bar, free pretzels and ice cream. But sadly the icing machine was always on the fritz.
00:51:00
The mall was close enough to our house that I could ride my bike to it in about 15 minutes.
00:51:04
I remember that it was an indoor mall with a lot of tropical plants, pastel colors, herds of seniors,
00:51:10
and totally 80s vibe. The location of Adam Walsh's abduction was the Sears department store at the
00:51:15
Hollywood Mall. Now, I wasn't working July 27th, 1981, the day when six-year-old Adam was abducted,
00:51:21
but the news coverage was nonstop beginning that evening. From what I remember, Adam's dad,
00:51:25
John Walsh, was the police top suspect to begin with. There was lots of silent and not silent
00:51:31
judgments from neighbors and community people being about him and his wife Reeve.
00:51:37
By the way, they're still married with new replacement kids, he says. Oh, no. Jesus.
00:51:42
That's the joke we made, though, right? Yeah. We made that about Jean-Venet. I think we opened the door on that.
00:51:48
Yeah. Right. Have some replacement kids. Yeah. Oh, right. Don't have one. Sounds pretty harsh, though, when you read it back.
00:51:53
Yeah. Okay. So here's the freaky part, he says. My mom worked locally and came home for lunch that day.
00:52:00
On her way back to work that afternoon when she had to drive right by the mall she remembers being tailgated towards the freeway The person eventually pulled around her to get by It was to the point of her getting a good look at the vehicle and thinking the person was really
00:52:12
in a big hurry. When the news of Adam's disappearance was on every local TV station,
00:52:16
the police begged anyone with info to call. A tip reported by a witness said they saw Adam being
00:52:20
pushed into a blue van by a blonde man when he was abducted. When we heard the info about the
00:52:26
blue van on the news, my mom started screaming that the blue van had been tailgating her that
00:52:30
day. I can remember how crazy and gross and creepy it felt. She ended up calling the police and
00:52:35
giving them the information. It's like a month later, they find Adam's head in a canal chopped
00:52:40
off with a machete in another part of Florida somewhere. A deviant felon, Otis Toole, too. Have
00:52:46
you fucking read about this, Mark Parker? Toole says he drove around with Adam's head in his car
00:52:50
for a few days before disposing of it. Toole confesses to killing Adam, but he told the police
00:52:53
he snatched him in his car, which was an old Cadillac. Let's see here. He totally checks every box in the Know Your Serial Killer study.
00:53:04
He then recanted his confession, but in 96, while dying in prison again, admitted to killing Adam.
00:53:08
However, there's no actual evidence to link Tool to Adam. So what about the blue van?
00:53:14
Is this what you're going to say? Yes, go ahead. So what about the blue van? In 2007, there was another investigation
00:53:19
and witnesses linking Jeffrey Dahmer to Adam Walsh's disappearance. Is this what you're going to say?
00:53:23
He was in Florida at the time and drove a blue van for work. Yeah. If you read that info on, if you read info on Dahmer, he didn't cut off victims' heads.
00:53:33
He did cut off victims' heads. He did. Often boys, but none as young as Adam. But Dahmer denied killing Adam.
00:53:38
Is Dahmer still alive? No. They killed him in jail. Good. The police and John Walsh believe that Tool was the killer of Adam.
00:53:46
Police closed the case. Yeah. Here's another thing. If he, is that done? Yeah. Because he was-
00:53:52
No, he says, Karen, you were hilarious on Twitter. And I loved your Mark Maron interview.
00:53:55
Oh, thanks. This was Ethan Allen. E. Allen. Yeah, E. Allen. And then he says, wait, Georgia, I don't really know your work.
00:54:03
I think you're cool. Thanks, E. Oh, nice. Yeah. Thanks, E. So I was reading all those, like the Jeffrey Dahmer thing came out of the blue.
00:54:15
I was like, what? Which is kind of amazing. But it didn't seem like that was his.
00:54:21
He's not a kid. yeah but cutting off a head and driving a blue van are so much closer than just to some guy being
00:54:26
like yeah i totally did yeah absolutely and blonde and like young and blonde and they they had a
00:54:31
really clear description but here's the thing um adam walsh both of his front teeth were missing
00:54:38
the day that he was there at the mall he's there the his picture i think it says baseball picture
00:54:44
that they used of like have you seen this boy had only been taken like a week or two before
00:54:49
and he has no front teeth. And the head that they found in the canal had one front tooth.
00:54:56
So there's... My whole body is shivering. A whole theory that the boy in the canal
00:55:02
was not Adam Wall. I'm sorry, I need a minute. I'm like literally gonna start crying right now.
00:55:06
Oh no, is it too... That is the most... Send us to my favorite murder. Send us your hometown stories.
00:55:13
We fucking love them. Yeah. It doesn't have to be a murder even, like crazy crimes, shit that happened.
00:55:18
Crime, something creepy, like a Cropsey story the woods oh and people who live near the woods
00:55:23
that have creepy woods yeah and then go to iTunes and review us and subscribe and do those things
00:55:31
that help us please rate review rate review subscribe yeah yeah please do that because like
00:55:37
you know two women hosting a podcast let's please let's beat the men making this feminist
00:55:44
out of nowhere are you gonna make it like you didn't believe in us like two women
00:55:48
hosting a podcast this thing's bullshit don't you guys want us to do well because we're two women
00:55:53
yeah Hillary do you hear us I'm making this feminist immediately don't kill women
00:55:59
it really is ultimately it's a feminist movement talking about murder we feminists is that all Anything else Yeah no Any final thoughts Don murder us
00:56:17
This really seems like a concern of yours. I do. I was just thinking, like, I don't want to talk about it
00:56:22
because I'm just going to convince someone to kill me by telling them why I think it's possible
00:56:25
and they should do it. I have to say, I feel ready. I've been prepared for so long.
00:56:30
That was Karen, by the way. I just want everyone to know that was Karen who said that.
00:56:35
Oh my God, I'm going to prepare my speech for what happens to the news. Like, I just didn't, we didn't know.
00:56:40
Here's your speech. She asked for it. Straight up, intentionally recorded it, set it into a microphone.
00:56:47
Oh. All right. Thanks for listening, guys. I'm really proud that we asked people to rate, review, and subscribe.
00:56:58
I mean, that's like, we're not about business in some ways, because this came out two weeks after the last podcast.
00:57:07
But, you know, we're right there. It wasn't about, we were not trying to get money.
00:57:11
We were trying to get on the comedy charts. Truly, that was, well, I was. I kind of like, I like to chart.
00:57:17
I gotta say it. You're a charter. Yeah. But I mean, it's like the idea of actually seeing yourself
00:57:23
on the Apple podcast website is a really big deal. It was thrilling. It still fucking is.
00:57:29
Yeah. I mean, it's so long ago that I created a Twitter account. And that Twitter account I actually ran for quite some time.
00:57:35
Yeah. Using our, you know, company name to tell people to shut up on Twitter. We were so bad at social media.
00:57:42
Very unprofessional. Oh, we were so bad. Here's the weird thing, too, about social media, I do want to say.
00:57:47
And I think a lot of people that have listened to this podcast see this and understand it.
00:57:51
the lens through which things go from a podcast out into social media and then change and morph
00:57:57
and become like this a thing of its own is such a trippy thing to be on the original side to be on
00:58:04
the outgoing side yeah because you watch and then you learn like oh yes of course yep now that you
00:58:11
say it like that you're completely right yeah at first it feels a little bit like who are these
00:58:17
people who are you yeah listening i don't yeah it comes out of nowhere well and it's hard to be
00:58:22
corrected it's hard to be wrong and most people hate it i do think that is a part of why people
00:58:28
ended up liking us because we weren't like we weren't lying or trying to say we didn't or any
00:58:34
of that shit we just feel like wow i feel terrible i didn't i didn't mean it that way and also just
00:58:40
that the combination of like us being conversational about a thing that people pretend is not
00:58:46
conversational but actually is right is i think we were writing that line and kind of just learning
00:58:52
um by mistake yeah as we went along you know it's good for uh good for personal development
00:59:01
to be like i i'll never forget one of the on the twitter page one of the early comments
00:59:08
some woman and she came on there a lot oh no and one of the first things she says is why these two
00:59:14
Oh, that's right. And it was like one of the times where I was like, oh, I should not be engaging with any of this.
00:59:21
I don't need to see it. Why these two? Why these two? Because we did. Because that's it.
00:59:26
Why aren't you saying that on a hate thread on Reddit instead of to us on our...
00:59:32
Yeah, we're the ones reading it. Dumbass. Fuck you, lady. Fuck you, lady. It's what you wanted to say at the time, but you fucking couldn't.
00:59:39
And now you can. Did you just splash water all over yourself? I did, yeah. I did.
00:59:43
Um, why these two? It's like, instead of saying that, go start your own fucking podcast.
00:59:50
I bet they did. I think that's part of it. I think that's, I think that's the, it's the downside of success, blah, blah, blah. It's like, you get, you get the disdain
01:00:01
that I personally felt so free to give out when I was in the same position. So I kind of like,
01:00:09
when that started happening at first I was like oh I don want to read this shit And I don want it to stick in my head But then I processed it for a little while and was like it actually a compliment It actually a sign that you doing well
01:00:22
That's true. And people are pissed about it. It's a negative version of what I have always said.
01:00:28
And I think what totally brought me to this podcast, which was like, why not us?
01:00:33
Yeah. You know? Yeah. Like, why these two chicks? Yeah. But why those? So let's fucking do it ourselves.
01:00:39
And also, you know, separate from that, we don't have to talk about that person anymore, but it is that kind of thing.
01:00:45
That's what's beautiful about podcasting. Yes. Is podcasting is the people's media where they get to say, oh, we like this.
01:00:53
We like this conversation. We like listening to these people. And it isn't some weird NBC presents.
01:00:58
Right. Here's your spoon-fed entertainment. Right. It's really not about that. It's about saying fuck in places where you normally couldn't even fit it and you're saying it.
01:01:10
Yeah. Which is why it's so important to rate, review and subscribe. Okay. So to end, we tell each other alternate title options.
01:01:19
If we hadn't done number puns, the actual name is Go Forth and Murder. That's kind of good.
01:01:24
Yeah. But it could be called, my favorite title is The 80s Need to Go to Prison,
01:01:31
which I said about your story that the 80s need to go to prison because just everything was wrong.
01:01:36
So true. I said this is the perfect podcasting couch would be perfect podcasting couch would be a good title.
01:01:43
That's a good one. Because you had just bought us a perfect podcasting couch. I had. I still haven't written that off in my taxes.
01:01:50
Call your tax guy. Oh, my God. And get that back. I wonder. Oh, my God. The pregnant lady I bought the couch from is like eight years old now.
01:02:00
Not the lady, the child. The child of the pregnant lady I bought the couch from is like eight.
01:02:07
That's crazy. Yeah. He's like a walking, talking human. Yeah. Don't blame that little baby for the stupid shit that baby said when he was zero years old.
01:02:18
It was a baby. He didn't know anyone was listening to him babble. Do what you want.
01:02:23
Blame who you want. We can't. We did it. It's already happened. It's already happened.
01:02:27
There's nothing we can do about it. that's the whole point of Rewind with Karen and Georgia.
01:02:31
That's right. It already happened. It happened. Look at it. Look at it. Look at it.
01:02:37
All right. Well, I guess we'll see you next week, next Wednesday. Yeah. When we do this again.
01:02:41
That's right. Thanks for listening, guys. Yeah. Thanks for joining us. Stay sexy.
01:02:44
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