Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 47: Live at the Bell House | My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

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Goodbye. Hello and welcome to Rewind with Karen in Georgia. It's Wednesday, which can only mean one thing.

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We're recapping our old shows with all new commentary, updates and insights. And today we're recapping episode 47, which we named at the time Live at the Bell House.

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Can you guess where we were and what was happening at this moment? I bet you can't guess.

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This episode came out on December 15th, 2016. Of course, the fifth anniversary of Impractical Joker's premiere.

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You know that. We were forever changed. All right. So let's listen to the intro of episode 47, where we are live at the Bell House.

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Hi. Hi. Hi. Hi. Hi, everybody. Hi, guys. This is our conference about global warming.

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It's not the problem you think it is. No. Murder. We're going to tell you. Don't worry about the.

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ice sheet disappearing. No, no, no. It's going to be better. You're going to die

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so much sooner than that happens. Who cares? The fastest dying. Guys. Oh, my God.

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The Bell House. Finally. It's so cool. We're finally, like, we've been planning this.

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We've been thinking about it. We've been talking about it. We've been talking to each other

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and to Andrew here at the Bell House about it. And here we are. We booked this gig ourselves.

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Thank you. We didn't know. And so we did it. Yeah, we were like, it doesn't matter.

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We should do probably a small intimate venue. We're really excited about this. We have a guest, a murderino storyer.

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I think next time we should ask for, like, wireless Janet Jackson mics so we can just really roam the stage as we clearly want.

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Yeah. Do some black cat before we actually sit down. Can I get some murder in my mind?

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Anything. I would just want to show everybody, I don't know if you know, but we were at Sephora earlier.

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Oh. Can you see that? Hence all the makeup on my face. I have so much lipstick on right now.

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This is the closest I could get to the Crown Elizabeth lip color. Thank you very much.

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Thank you. Oh my God, I'm not going to tell you. Wow. I fucking hate that. I mean...

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It's mine. The fucking audacity? No, I'm kidding. You're sweet. I love you. Are you B-onkers or what?

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That's my friend Millie saying, B-onkers. Hi, Millie. We actually were in Sephora, a very crowded Brooklyn Sephora.

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and I was squatted down putting every color of lip and eye thing I could on my face.

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I saw it. And Georgia had immediately broken off from me and begun to get a makeover.

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Oh, no. Oh, stop it. And at one point I crossed an aisle and there was just a woman doing this

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and Georgia's just standing there getting her face brushed. I actually kind of hated it because I was like, what color matches me?

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and I want you to hand it to me. I don't want you to use your fucking brushes that you've done

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every fucking person in the world for the past fucking 24 hours. I'm like, maybe put some alcohol on it

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and I'm like, I just was like, I'm breaking out as we speak. You pulled it off well.

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I thought you were really enjoying yourself. I just didn't want to hurt her feelings

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but I wanted to be like, don't fucking touch me with that fucking brush. Well, yeah,

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at Sephora, there's going to be a germ issue for sure. But also, you know what I don't like

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is like they ask if they can help you and I do want a very specific kind of help.

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Yeah. But I don't want... They always try to get you to let them do your fit. It like no I just want to know the exact number of the taupe lip line That what I talking about I wanted that too She was like well first take your makeup off and then come over here No Fuck Get out of here

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I know, I know. I was like, just put it on top, dude. Like, that's what I'm going to do.

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Anyways. So you broke off to have that happen to you. I was off by myself squatting.

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Like a fucking weirdo. And then I hear, you know, like when you're in a public place,

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I don't know if you're like me. In a public place, if I hear someone go like, blah blah blah blah i never think it's to me and she turned and gave me the she did one of these

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of like don't fucking you know like she didn't know it was i was talking about her no i just

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don't i don't like shouting and and the girl goes oh she just gave us a dirty look the girl who had

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been like i'm a huge fan of the podcast and i was like fuck you i'm looking at eyeshadow right now

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but i just thought it was a teen shouting in a public place and i wanted to show them that that's

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not allowed and instead it was a girl who worked at sephora even better a girl who worked at sephora

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who liked our podcast and like how do you know who we are in person she because of our lip colors

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she knows our shit it's crap it was super fun after i stopped being super bitchy to her

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i was just at dinner down the street and these two sweet girls at a table like they weren't even

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obnoxious they were like hey we're gonna go see your show in a minute and i was like thank you

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now they're fucking obnoxious everyone's here everyone's watching it's because i sugared them

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up because i bought them fucking chocolate cake and the waitress was like what the fuck is wrong

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with you i was like send them some cake and i'm like do you know them that's so hollywood of you

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big time again i'll send you cake i can afford eight dollar cake yeah eat it eat that cake

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eat the cake that's not a mic that's a beer eat her cake eat the cake she sends to you

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guys anyhow anyhow we gotta go live show corner oh Karen it's fine it's fine you have a lifesaver

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this is just a mint in case I get worried later on it's weird gotta have that shit with you

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we should have asked for some kind of a break break point up there like what i was thinking

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private a private shelf sneeze area they couldn't see through so we could have all our secrets uh

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what if we have a fucking frame photo of steven and the cats up here is that weird could you

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imagine how great this christmas would be sorry he actually is babysitting the cats i feel like

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every time we do a live show when he's babysitting the cats, it's like how it should be.

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That's right. Him away and us here. Yeah. We are drinking in all the glory and him doing the work like Cinderella.

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Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Yes, Damon. I'm going to start calling him Steve from now on. Because he's such a like,

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if there's anywhere in the world he belongs, it's like Brooklyn. He's got the like,

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he's got the like uneven hair and a tiny borderline Hitler mustache where I'm like,

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that could be problematic if you lived anywhere else. He's such a Steven, so calling him Steve

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would be such a fucking insult. It's like, Steve. Fucking jean jacket much, Steve?

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Pick me up in your dad's truck, Steve. Oh, what an angel. Oh, anyway. Danny Huzel.

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It started snowing in New York. That's... Thanks, you guys. I had better hair earlier,

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but then the snow came. I have really cute coats that don't do anything. Georgia, when I met Georgia today,

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This is the first time we met. We met, and we really get along. I met her on the street corner,

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and she is wearing the thinnest, I think it's a coat that Jane Fonda wore in clute.

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Like, it's just a very thin, body-shaping, taupe-colored coat. It's like, where in the world is Carmen Sandiego coat?

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Right? Yes, but with a smaller, lapel. Yeah. And I was like, are you dying in that coat?

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What are you doing? No. She doesn't give a fuck, you guys. No, I do give a fuck. I just act like

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I don't. Oh. That's the secret to not giving a fuck. Oh, okay. You just feel it deep down inside?

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Yeah. What if we were already getting the light? End it now. You guys fucking cut. You guys end

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on a high note. That's kind of low. And bye. We just kind of updated you on our day.

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Bye. And then we're gonna leave. Oh, oh, I went to a bar on Friday night called the Vince.

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Where's Vince? What's it called? He's not even fucking here. Oh, my God, he left your own show.

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My fucking husband. You have to get divorced. That's a bar. What? No. Madera's. Thank you.

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I don't know. That is not her husband. So I was at this bar. I think it was like in Cobble Hill.

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And it was like a kind of a divy bar called Madera's. And like we end up sitting like talking to locals, which is like only a thing you do in Brooklyn.

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It was like the coolest people. And like the fucking old timer, like alcoholic dude who's so cool was into fucking serial killers.

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And then this like couple comes in and you can tell that they've been there a lot, but they're like cool and young.

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And he was a fucking criminal defense attorney. What? Cute little baby with like dimples.

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And his fucking girlfriend, who was like so cute, like this cute little hipster was a fucking, she was a forensic, what is, auditor?

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A what? A forensic auditor. She fucking... She audits shit, and then she's like...

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She does taxes for dead people? What? No, she does taxes. I wanna do that. And then she's like, you're going to jail, you fucking bad man.

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Oh, no. So a company like this guy doing something wrong and she comes in there and does the books And I like badass Like chicks are good at math Fuck you We not But like fuck you Yeah yeah yeah And so we just out there No I mean Fuck you

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What are Roman numerals? I don't know. No one knows. So we just like, it was just like the best.

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And they were, they were so cool. What is forensic about auditing though? Well, forensic just means it's, it's law.

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So it's, it's when like, I know. I wanted there to be like a bone in a file or something.

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It's like, what? Is this part of his spine? One heart plus one lung and six cabins equals eight things.

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You're going to jail, motherfucker. No, it's just like, I mean, I felt bad for her.

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She just had to sit in a room and, you know, like, with her calculator. That seems fun.

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Don't feel bad for her. They were, but it was just like, it was such a fucking, it was so great.

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You just got to have a real human experience. Yeah, with people who were obsessed with fucking deathy things.

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God bless. I know. I mean, that's us, right, everybody? Yeah. And you, and you, and you.

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We have murders here. And then we have a third person to present a murder, so we should bring her out now.

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Let's bring her out. She is our very good friend. You may have seen her on Girl Code.

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You may have seen her stand up all over the nation. You may have already pre-ordered her book.

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Oh, that's right. It's called Wedalicious. An unfiltered guide to being a bride.

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I've done that. Have you guys been a bride? It's fucking terrifying and awful. What?

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I was just thinking about when I was and I failed miserably soon after. Terrible and awful.

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Yeah. Yeah. Hey, you guys. Why is that sad? Here's Jamie Lee. Jamie Lee, everybody.

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Love you. Love you. Love you too. Oh, love you too, girl. Oh, my God. So phony. Let's sit down.

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This is getting weird. Oh, my God. Hi. Hi. Am I not supposed to be in the middle?

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Is this... Should our guests be in the middle? This is aggressive, this microphone.

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Okay. I'm going to angle that on down. It's a little bit in our faces. Let me go ahead and...

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Okay. Anyways. I just bopped mine and it didn't move because that's not how mics work.

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Does this feel kind of like we're at South by Southwest? On a panel. Giving a panel about how CDs don't exist anymore.

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Guys, I brought you a gift. What? Yeah. Stop it. This is for both of you. What is that?

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You'll see. It's a kitten. What is a kitten? That's actually not far off. So because Elvis, he can't travel.

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He's at home because cats don't travel well. I got you an Elvis understudy to bring with you on the road.

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Let's see it. It's Patsy the podcast alpaca. Isn't she fluffy? Isn't she an alpaca?

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Patsy. Do you know why she's named Patsy? No, why? Patsy JonBenet Ramsey? Fuck yeah.

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Or Mom Benet Ranzi. Mom Benet Ranzi. Mom Benet Ranzi. So you pack her with you and she'll bring you lots of luck and also get fur all over your clothes.

00:15:24

Well, I'll pack her in our suitcases. Yeah. Over we go. Oh, my God. I'm sorry. Bye.

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Bye. Look at her fur. It's just like dashing in the light. It's like the snow outside.

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Dashing through the snow. I'd just like to tell a quick anecdote about when... And so Jamie Lee and I sometimes take our dogs to the same dog park in Los Angeles.

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And we ran into each other there. And she was asking me about this date. And this was a couple months ago.

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Yes. And said, because she was going to be in New York at the same time. And she was like, what?

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When is it? Because I don't want to go to that show. And I go, why don't you be the guest?

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And she goes, oh, my God. Like that. I wish I could explain. Sorry, that was really hard.

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But I wish I could explain her fucking One Direction reaction when I asked her to be the guest.

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It was the sweetest thing of all time. But then you texted me and you were like, hey, is it cool if Jamie's the guest?

00:16:24

I know. Because I already told her she's the guest. And I was like, of course. No, no, you were like, hey, how about Jamie Lee is the guest?

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I'm like, yes. And I'm like, good, because I already told her she's the guest. Yeah, I already asked her.

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Yeah, it was, thank fucking God. What if I was like, no. And here you are. Is this right?

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I think super high oh this feels good should we do it let's get underneath it that's very Tom

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yes I don't know what I don't know how we and what are we even everyone listen oh yeah I like it up there

00:17:05

everyone listening at home is like what is happening right now listeners at home

00:17:09

you're missing nothing There's a lot of mic work going on. So who goes first in this situation?

00:17:18

Let's make the guests go first. No, not fucking me. You go first. I don't know what I'm doing.

00:17:22

Go first. Really? I told you, they're so nice. Like, right? Are you? No, I will.

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Okay, guys. Are you going to be mad? Am I going to be? Are you mad right now? I'm like, no.

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And then afterwards, I'm like, Karen, can I talk to you for a minute? Can I talk to you in that really small bathroom back there?

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Should we do one of us and then Jamie and then the other one? I would love that.

00:17:53

Sure. Okay. Yeah clearly I would love that Just to get in the zone you know Gotta warm up Did you just rock paper scissors Yeah I don know who goes first Are you fucking super I go first

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No, no, no. I was just trying to think of who went first last night. Does anyone know who went first?

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I was like, thank you, thank you. My God. Oh, okay. Guys. Can we get the notes? Last week's notes, please?

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Who's the secretary of this club? Could you read the minutes back, please? Because...

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That's what I meant. You're not paying attention. this is something that we could have figured out while we were at sephora why would we do that

00:18:28

no any other time that we've been here for the past 20 how charming was that so when we just

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like didn't know it's like we don't even think about it the torso killer anyone move the alpaca i don't give a fuck what you can see shut your mouth

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Oh, no. Really? Do you not know how to be in public? You don't get to talk. No talking.

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And now when I meet you afterwards, I'm going to get in your fucking face. Oh, no.

00:19:03

Patsy fell over. Patsy died. When Karen is angry, Patsy falls over when Karen needs you to stop fucking talking.

00:19:11

Ask Patsy if she wants a cookie. It's going to be so disappointing, and I'm going to get super sad.

00:19:16

No, no. She'll say something. just ask her yeah patsy you want a cookie yes now i miss my cat she's a lot more eloquent than your cat i'm sorry yes it's my cheat day

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i'm not doing carbs right now but i'll make an exception for you girls thanks patsy's really high class she's a little emo but we're working through it

00:19:38

And we're back. Hi, I love Patsy the alpaca. That's just... I mean, it's always great to bring some props.

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Yeah, and it's classy to bring a gift to the hosts. Always. Jamie Lee, classy lady.

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We also, I think it's really funny, I'm still talking about the lipstick from The Crown.

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I know. It won't go away. I didn't realize how much of a theme there was until we started doing these.

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or do I have some sort of obsessive compulsive disorder? I mean, what in the hell? And then I

00:20:14

just pull out my makeup drawer and there's 1000 lipsticks inside or it's like, yeah.

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Do you do that? We're like, I love this color you get home and you have three of them already.

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I can't stop. Oh my God. Especially now that we're on video. It's like, well, where is the lipstick that's going to bring it all home for me?

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Totally. Like this is the one that's going to be like, and like, should I try orange lipstick?

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like I know it's old fashioned, but like the old grandmas had orange, like straight up orange

00:20:38

lipstick. I've been kind of like, Oh yeah. Get into that. They're rocking out coral. Yes. I feel

00:20:43

coral lipstick. Very Florida in the sixties. All right. I'll try it. Just for anybody that gets

00:20:48

upset or worried that heckler that I yelled at was totally fine. We laughed about it after we

00:20:53

took pictures. It was all good. I think that's like the beginning of the Karen. I hope Karen

00:20:59

yells at me from the audience, period. Like, I think that made people want, I know they do,

00:21:04

they want you to yell at them. That's like their dream in the audience. Well, here's the thing.

00:21:07

When you are at a live show and somebody else decides this is, I'm in this too, the rest of the audience hates it, but they can't do anything about it. So at least it stand up long

00:21:17

enough to know that if you just kind of take it in hand and are mean, then everyone else is like,

00:21:22

great, we'll all do that then. Right. And we'll all not do that. Right. But over the years we

00:21:28

learn it's like you have to do it in a nicer way yeah it was just like my thing was podcast audiences

00:21:34

were so weird compared to what i was used to in stand-up because we didn't know what we were doing

00:21:38

like as an audience member is totally new kind totally new unless you were like you know you

00:21:44

went to fucking ira glass's like beautiful you know an npr thing that was fancy and so there

00:21:51

probably were no hecklers i would love it if there were hecklers in an npr ira glass he's

00:21:56

interviewing someone about something really sensitive. Wait, wait, don't tell me. And someone

00:22:00

just keeps yelling the answers. Yeah. Oh, what? Paula Poundstone, I saw you do stand up. Oh,

00:22:08

sorry. I'm used to my favorite murder live shows. I didn't know what this was. I thought this was like a stream of consciousness shouting match that we all agreed to pay for. But

00:22:16

no, I guess I'm wrong. I thought I was the main character, but it turns out. No. Another thing to

00:22:22

remember not just criticizing the audience for being new, but this was the show where I was the

00:22:28

tour agent. So I booked, I called, the bell house was like, said, okay, we have a podcast. Can we

00:22:35

come and do it there? They're like, sure. They're expecting 80 to a hundred people to come. Then

00:22:42

when we announce it, they start getting calls and they sell out in three minutes. And it was the

00:22:47

beginning of us starting to understand what was actually happening in reality, as opposed to what

00:22:52

was happening in George's apartment. Right. And the people at the bell house were like, what did

00:22:57

you do? What is this? Like, we are overrun. And we were just like, oh, my God, I'm so sorry.

00:23:02

Yeah, that was wild. I think after this, we finally let our tour agent book shows from then

00:23:08

on because it was like... Our touring agent came to us and was like, heard about the bell house.

00:23:12

Please. Yeah. Yeah. Please let me... I've actually got a plan. I was like, no, I'll be the touring agent. Karen's got it. She knows someone at the bell house. Okay.

00:23:21

But Karen's going to go back to all the places where she bombed doing stand-up comedy and see if they remember her name.

00:23:30

And then that will be our tour. Sounds great, Karen. I mean, I didn't know any better.

00:23:35

Like, you know, when have I booked a fucking show before? Who knows? I mean, it was a fun idea.

00:23:39

We were like, hey, we should do this live since it's going well. That was the energy behind it.

00:23:45

All right. Let's get into the story because this is a big one. And this is just crazy awful.

00:23:50

And there are multiple updates, which I want to hear about. So let's listen to Karen's story about the torso killer.

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00:26:07

Goodbye. Can I please talk about the torso killer? He's your fucking killer. And I want to tell you about him.

00:26:20

So there's a man named Richard Francis Cottingham, and he did a little work in the 80s here in the New York City metropolitan area

00:26:29

that I don't know if anybody knows about. I actually had never heard of him, and someone else, like in passing,

00:26:36

a friend of mine was like, have you ever heard of the torso killer? And I got all up in their face like, that's Cleveland, that's not going to help me.

00:26:43

And then they're like, no, no, no, New York City had their own torso killer. And I was like, well, God bless America.

00:26:51

And this took place primarily in 1980. And so I looked up on a website what was happening in 1980 that was different than 2016.

00:27:03

And so I'll just list a couple things just to paint the picture, just to set it up for you.

00:27:09

Georgia was born. In 1980? Yeah. Oh, girl, you look good. Oh, I'm not supposed to?

00:27:17

thank you that was a straight compliment thank you Karen is using Patsy as a music stand

00:27:28

Patsy was used for years and years by John Ramsey oh yes I don't know anything can happen at the bell house

00:27:39

could you imagine if John Ramsey walked on stage that's our surprise guess is fucking John Ramsey.

00:27:48

John Ramsey's here to tell his side of the story. Fucking flip the table. Fuck, dude.

00:27:54

The torso killer. Fuck. Go, go, go, go, go, go, go. In 1980, in New York, but also everywhere else,

00:28:02

did you know there was no answering machines? Like, they had invented them and corporate,

00:28:08

corporations would use them and, like, rich people had them, but they weren't actually

00:28:11

mass marketed until 1984. Aww. Isn't that precious? So cute. So if you wanted to call somebody and they weren't home,

00:28:21

the phone would just ring and ring and ring. All right. Also, there are pay phones everywhere,

00:28:29

and they weren't as dirty as they are now. Here in New York, this subway was insanely scary.

00:28:35

Oh, yeah. They used tokens, and everybody had a knife. uh i believe studio 54 was peaking it was about to close but it was like peaking just to the point

00:28:50

where it was like all the people who still thought cocaine was good for you were having a great time

00:28:55

and then like new year's eve and it was like january 1st 81 and they were just like

00:29:01

everybody's gonna die yeah um you could smoke anywhere you could smoke inside of an operating

00:29:08

room it was the best there were a shit ton of mimes oh no all right we're good that mine was just so pissed off that he fucking that mime threw down his drink and fucking storm

00:29:26

but silently he didn't yell he was just like drink how dare you talk about the quantity of mimes.

00:29:35

Now there's just me. And of course, there was graffiti everywhere and there was litter everywhere.

00:29:42

And also there was a ton of murder. Just a shit ton. Yes, congratulations. So there was a man named Richard Francis Cottingham.

00:29:52

And he was 31 years old at this time He was a computer operator and a valued employee of the Blue Cross Blue Shield in New York That not a plug We getting paid a shit ton of money by Blue Cross Blue Shield

00:30:07

To not talk about that. He was married with three children and he also raped, sodomized, killed and mutilated six sex workers in New York and New Jersey.

00:30:19

Congratulations. What a fun guy. Yeah. That was great storytelling. It's a sassy good time.

00:30:26

So I read this article by a guy named Peter Vronsky, and it seemed like he was a writer,

00:30:31

but when he tells it, I mean, like, it's a great article, so obviously he's a talented writer,

00:30:38

but he was talking about, at the time, he used to run film from Montreal, get it developed in New York City,

00:30:45

and then take it back. And you can't just, like, send, they don't ever ship, like, movie, film like that.

00:30:50

You have to have a guy do it so that nothing happens to the film. So he would come down with the film and he would get a stipend to get a hotel room for the night and then go back.

00:31:00

But of course, he was like a young punk. So he didn't want to spend his money on a hotel room.

00:31:06

So he would save the money and like he would go to art openings and eat cheese and drink wine and then and then get a hotel room in a really, really seedy hotel.

00:31:17

And so this one time he did it, the film took longer than they expected. So he ended up getting kind of stuck in Hell's Kitchen.

00:31:26

Wait, back then? No. Yeah, right? No thanks. It was a hotel on 10th Avenue in Hell's Kitchen.

00:31:36

And he was standing at the elevator one day. And it was taking forever. And he was getting kind of irritated.

00:31:43

And when it finally opened, there was just like this super bland guy who came out of the elevator holding a bag.

00:31:50

and the... What? Why then? Because something's going to happen. I can tell something's going to happen.

00:31:57

Got it, got it. He comes out of the elevator and his bag touches Peter Vronsky on the leg.

00:32:06

But then the guy moves on. He said he looked a little bit sweaty, like he'd just been doing something.

00:32:11

But other than that, he was kind of vague and then he left. So Peter Vronsky goes up to the floor

00:32:15

where his hotel room is going to be to check out just how horrible his stay is going to be

00:32:20

because he knows it's going to be bad. And when he gets up there, there are little pieces of like burned material in the air

00:32:28

and he can smell smoke. It smells like someone burnt hair or something. So, right?

00:32:34

Yeah. So as he's walking down the hallway to get to his room, he now starts to see smoke in the hallway

00:32:44

and the smell is starting to get really bad and you start to realize it's the smell of death.

00:32:49

This is not just a normal fire. There's a dead body somewhere. And then right then the fire alarms go off.

00:32:57

And what happened? I just got chills. I'm just very invested. Keep going. He goes back downstairs and a room was on fire.

00:33:10

And when the firemen went in, they found two bodies, one on each of the single beds.

00:33:17

And when one of the firemen picked the body up and pulled it out into the hallway...

00:33:21

Don't do that. ...to do CPR on it, no head, no hands. Oh! What did you think was going to happen?

00:33:32

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Ew. Oh, no. Wait, sorry, did you say no head, no hands? Is that what you said?

00:33:40

Yes, no head, no hands. No fucking dental records, no fucking fingerprints. That's right.

00:33:45

So he, a couple years later, when Richard Cottyham gets caught and his picture is on the news,

00:33:53

Peter Vronsky sees his picture and goes, that's the guy that passed me when he came out of the elevator.

00:33:59

With a bag? With a bag with heads in it. Fuck! And hands. Fuck! Anyway, Merry Christmas.

00:34:06

Oh my God. Was it a nice bag? Was it to me? What's the large brown bag? What's the large brown bag thing?

00:34:16

From Bloomingdale's? Bloomingdale's. Oh, yeah. Big brown bag. Big brown bag. Was it LeSportzak?

00:34:22

Was it Goodwill? Guys, I'm about to talk about the dead body. Please go. Okay, sorry.

00:34:30

Those missing parts were never found. But their clothes, there was two sex workers

00:34:37

whose clothes were found neatly folded and put into the bathtub along with their fancy boots.

00:34:45

Weird. And there was very little blood on the beds. So they don't, and there was very little blood in the room.

00:34:54

So they don't understand, they don't understand the method at that point of what happened, where it happened,

00:35:00

because it didn't seem possible that he could have gotten all of that taken care of in the room.

00:35:03

Also, how did he kill one person and then the other person doesn't make enough noise

00:35:09

that somebody knows what's going on. Again, they're in Hell's Kitchen. So through x-rays,

00:35:18

they identify Dita Godzari, who is a 23-year-old sex worker from New Jersey, who is the mother of a four-month-old baby.

00:35:25

Oh, no. Yeah. And the other victim was in her late teens, and she has never been identified to this day.

00:35:31

Oh, honey. Oh, my God. So. What the fuck was that look? So six months later, six months later at the Seville Hotel on 29th Street near Madison, he kills a 25 year old

00:35:49

named Jean Rayner And it was the same exact thing where they go in they find the dead body And this time it gonna be bad He cut off her breasts and put them on the headboard

00:36:05

before he lit the room on fire. So now we're going to cut to the Hasbroke Heights Quality Inn.

00:36:14

You guys have been there. The irony of Quality Inn. Anytime the word quality is in the title, it's stark opposite.

00:36:23

It's like good enough in. Yeah. it's called bed bugs yeah so the maid is vacuuming

00:36:31

as they are wont to do and when she goes to vacuum under the bed it hits something

00:36:37

no and when she lifts up the mattress it is the disfigured corpse of 19 year old Valerie Street

00:36:46

who is also a sex worker yeah so essentially the our boy Richard Coddington uh what what he would do is pick up sex workers uh and he would

00:37:03

oftentimes he would give him a date rape drug and um they would wake up in the hotel with the tape

00:37:11

on their mouth and he and um handcuffed with their hands behind their back and um and then basically

00:37:18

he would torture them for hours at a time and they were at these horrible hotels where people

00:37:23

would be screaming and no one was doing anything. That's the craziest thing. That is.

00:37:28

Well, I mean, until he put the tape over their mouths. But he must have, like the planning,

00:37:33

the planning of it must have been that they drugged them long enough and then covered it.

00:37:38

You mind your business in those fucking hotels, right? That's exactly right. You don't want to point fingers

00:37:43

when the three are pointing back at you. Do you remember the movie Big when Tom Hanks becomes big

00:37:47

and he goes and stays in the hotel for the first time and he gets like super scared and sad?

00:37:51

It was like Times Square. I always think it's totally Times Square. You're 12 and crying.

00:37:56

And you're 12. But you're also a man. You're a man boy. Okay. So his next victim was a, not a prostitute, a sex worker.

00:38:08

Sorry, I keep saying prostitute in this article. It was a 26-year-old radiologist named Marianne Carr.

00:38:13

And they think that he knew her in real life, in his weird other life in New Jersey.

00:38:22

And she had basically died the same way, and she was found, like, up against a chain-link fence,

00:38:28

so it was all kind of the same thing, but it turned out she was just a nurse and a regular person in her town.

00:38:36

Like, how would he have found her and known her if he didn't already know her? Right.

00:38:40

Right? Yes. Shut up! He wouldn't have, is what I'm saying. So then, basically, the way he gets caught,

00:38:49

Sorry, I should have left Sephora earlier and organized this part better. I can't find the thing.

00:38:57

Oh, it's on this. The way he gets caught is... Wait for it? He takes a girl back to the same quality inn in Hasbro Heights

00:39:14

where the body was found under the bed. and um but this time he there were reports of a woman screaming finally someone was paying

00:39:23

attention together and uh they when the cops come in there's a man trying to calmly walk out as if

00:39:32

he doesn't yeah look i'm just here at the quality and chilling just on vacay the quality in i just

00:39:39

like to come over here and just think just get my thoughts together at the qi they have free wi-fi

00:39:45

Wi-Fi's not a thing yet. What are you talking about? It's not a thing. So basically the cops get him,

00:39:53

and then when they go into the room, they find a girl handcuffed, hysterical, and she's been tortured for a long time,

00:39:59

but there's finally a survivor that can tell everybody, this fucking motherfucker that you think is some normal guy

00:40:05

that works at Blue Shield Blue Cross is actually this insane serial killer. Wow.

00:40:12

So when they search Cottingham's home, they find a trophy room containing personal effects

00:40:18

from several of the murdered sex workers. And he had actually been arrested twice in the early 70s

00:40:28

that nobody knew about that. That would never come up. And so, yeah, he had personal things that connected him.

00:40:34

There was no way it couldn't have been him. We'll cut to the chase. In May of 1981, he was convicted on 15 felony counts

00:40:41

related to the murder of Valerie Street. And he drew a sentence of 173 to 197 years in prison.

00:40:50

And then a year later, he was convicted on second-degree murder charges for Marianne Carr.

00:40:55

And that added another 20 years to his life. Dude. That is how sentencing is fucking done.

00:41:04

Yeah. Sorry, I was just reading the last paragraph. Yep, it sure is. Oh. It totally...

00:41:13

Oh, there was just this list of, this is what he was indicted on. This is what the person read in court.

00:41:22

Kidnapping, attempted murder, aggravated assault, aggravated assault with a deadly weapon,

00:41:27

aggravated sexual assault while armed, aggravated sexual assault while armed. Oh, the first one was rape.

00:41:32

The second one was sodomy, aggravated a sexual assault while armed. That was fellatio.

00:41:37

Possession of a weapon, possession of controlled dangerous substances, secobarbital and amobarbital,

00:41:43

or 2-in-all, and possession of controlled dangerous substance diazepam or Valium.

00:41:49

In other words, he was the total package. Wow. That Richard Cottingham the torso killer Yay

00:42:06

Okay, we're back. Karen. We are back. Want to give us some updates? Such a horrible, I mean, obviously.

00:42:13

It's just redundant. This is a true crime podcast. When you describe one story as being horrible and violent,

00:42:20

then you just have another story that's horrible and violent. Right. Unless you're taking a left turn.

00:42:24

on our podcast. How many times have we said, this is one of the worst? Like, how many one of the worst can there be? A lot. Every time. It's always like,

00:42:34

these stories have extreme violence. It's like, yeah, it's a true crime podcast. But this serial

00:42:39

killer in particular, it is so cold and calculated and repetitive and insanely violent. It's just

00:42:46

like. Yeah. And the victims are so young and just vulnerable. And yeah. So Richard Cottingham,

00:42:52

the torso killer, remains in prison, and he continues to confess to his crimes. So in 2022,

00:42:59

he confessed to an additional five murders. Those victims were Diane Cusick, 23, Mary Beth Hines,

00:43:06

21, Laverne Moy, 23, Sheila Hyman, 33, Emerita Rosado Nieves, who was 18. And those are just more

00:43:16

horrible murders. So he's been found guilty of 17 murders, but he claims to have killed

00:43:21

at least 100 women. It's just, he's an animal. It's insanity. That's one of those ones where like some of them,

00:43:28

those killers were brag and like inflate their numbers. But if he's continuing to confess

00:43:32

and has like five that he can be confirmed to, it's kind of seems believable. Yes.

00:43:38

I mean, there's no reason not to believe. Totally. It's not the oddest tool situation

00:43:43

where they're just doing it to get out of jail. Totally. Okay. Now we're going to get into Georgia's story

00:43:47

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00:45:50

Goodbye. Jamie, do you want to go? I would feel weird going last. Do you want to go last?

00:45:58

Sure. Okay. Is that okay? Because I don't want to like, I don't want to like wrap it up.

00:46:03

Like, cause, and then Georgia goes. So let's have Jamie go last. Okay. Is that cool?

00:46:08

Do it. Yeah. We cool. Okay. Totally. Okay. All right. And so, okay. I really, I really, this murder's really fucked up, but I got really scared that someone in here knows the victim.

00:46:18

So I apologize. I just apologize constantly. That's basically what I do. Okay. So, Annette St. Ghan.

00:46:30

Anyone? Anyone? Anyone? No. Okay, good. Like they're going to say. I mean, yeah.

00:46:34

Oh, yeah, that's my aunt. Okay, so Emmett was born in Boston, and in 2003, she enrolled in the John Jay College of Criminal Justice, which is a SUNY college in Manhattan.

00:46:48

They couldn't come up with anything more than John Jay Criminal Justice College.

00:46:53

I don't know who he is. John Jay Criminal Justice College. His name is my name, too.

00:47:00

That's nobody's name. Let's name a college. So she was going to pursue, basically she's one of us.

00:47:07

She was going to pursue a master's degree in criminal justice. So like immediately we want to have a drink with her and fucking hang out with her.

00:47:13

Right. She was one of the top 5% of her class and she was supposed to graduate in May 2006.

00:47:19

And so in February 2006, she goes to celebrate her birthday with her friend Claire.

00:47:25

They go out, they're at a nightclub. It's always a friend, Claire. Claire. Claire.

00:47:30

Oh God. Everyone's friend is named Claire. I'm not saying her last name on purpose

00:47:32

because I feel fucking bad for this girl. Poor Claire. I really do. I'm definitely a piece of shit for saying that.

00:47:37

She's fucking tried. So, 3.30, which by the way, this fucking 4 a.m. shit, like you can stay out till 4 a.m.

00:47:42

In New York? Fuck, no. What the fuck? That is a terrible idea. It is kind of around the witching hour.

00:47:50

You've got to be careful. Like, stay as far away from dawn as possible. You know what I mean?

00:47:56

Part until 11.45 and go home. Great, great. But, you know, she's a baby. So they go to a nightclub to celebrate her birthday.

00:48:06

And then Claire's like, let's get the fuck out of here. I called a cab. And then Emette's like, I'm staying out.

00:48:12

And they're like, I'm going to burp. Hold on. Then Emette, no, no. Those are loyal fans.

00:48:21

They're like, let it out, Georgia. Do you. It's terrible. I don't want this to be me.

00:48:27

It also sounded like a, kind of like a car, if somebody wrote out a cartoon burp, where it's like,

00:48:32

Like Tim the Tool Man Taylor. That's me. So, like, fucking Claire's like, get in the fucking cab.

00:48:42

And Emet's like, no, bitch, I'm staying out. And, like, she stays out. We've all done it.

00:48:45

We've all done it. You always listen to Claire. And at 3.50, Claire calls her and is like, are you okay?

00:48:51

and Emmett's like, I am going to this bar called The Falls. It's at 4 a.m. You do?

00:49:00

You know this one? I heard. That was a good stage whisper. Okay. So the next evening,

00:49:08

they're like, where the fuck is Emmett? Like, she's fucking missing a shit. And so someone,

00:49:14

an anonymous caller, calls the Brooklyn police and is like, I saw a fucking dead woman's body.

00:49:20

Yeah. Does anyone know where Fountain Street and Spring Creek Park is? Nope. That was a vague whoop.

00:49:30

And it turns out that it's fucking Emmett St. Guillen. Okay, you guys, this sucks.

00:49:37

She's nude and wrapped in a comforter. Her fucking fingernails are broken, showing that she fought as fuck, which, like, get it, girl.

00:49:46

Hands and feet tied. Oh, sock in her fucking mouth. hair has been cut off. Yeah.

00:49:54

Yes. Beaten, sexually assaulted. That was Vidal Sassoon. How dare. She's like, what kind of cut?

00:50:02

The Rachel? In that whole list, she's upset about the hair. Can I go on about how she was fucking murdered?

00:50:10

Yeah, I know. I know. This is the whole problem. And she died of asphyxiation and I don't even want to tell you

00:50:16

about the fact that it was because she had packing tape wrapped around her poor sweet face.

00:50:22

According to the forensic psychologist, the forensic psychologist said that the killer

00:50:27

tried to dehumanize her completely. When you hide someone's face, it means that you don't want to see them as a human being.

00:50:32

You want to pretend there's just an object. And haircutting too, I think, is part of that, right?

00:50:36

Where it's like, it's something aggressively male to cut a woman's hair, which sounds so stupid,

00:50:42

but like, I think when you're a fucking murderer, it's true. Yes, no? Yeah. Thoughts, feelings?

00:50:46

Well, it's also a weird thing Because it's like, he's like, I want to murder humans.

00:50:50

But like, I don't want to murder a human. It's like, what? Make your mind. Yeah.

00:50:54

Fucking shifty weirdo. I want to murder humans, but I also like to cut hair. Okay, so the last time that Emmett had been seen,

00:51:05

she was with one of the bouncers at this bar called The Falls. And this bartender had been asked to escort her out of this bar before closing.

00:51:14

and then another bouncer saw her talking to her in front of the bar. So the dude, the fucking,

00:51:24

the bouncer was an ex-con, had spent more than 12 years in prison for drug possession and robbery

00:51:29

and he was on parole, which means he shouldn't have gotten a fucking job, but they didn't do any background checks on him.

00:51:35

He wasn't a licensed security guard. Staying out past curfew was a parole violation.

00:51:41

Like he shouldn't have fucking been hired. Okay, but the dude who owned the fucking bar,

00:51:47

whose name was Dorian, he didn't want, he said that he had never, he didn't see her, he didn't know who she was,

00:51:56

and later admitted that he knew who she was, and he said he didn't want to get involved

00:52:00

because years earlier, his father's bar had suffered poor publicity and lawsuits after a patron was murdered.

00:52:08

A different bar, guess what fucking bar it is? Guess what fucking murder is? The one uptown, the Upper East Side one?

00:52:14

The fucking preppy murders. The fucking preppy murders. What? What the fuck are the chances?

00:52:22

Sorry. The guy that owns the Falls, his father owned Dorian's... Red Hand, right?

00:52:31

Red Hand. Dorian's Red Hand, right? Which we've covered. They're just yelling all kinds of stuff.

00:52:37

If you've listened to this for a little bit. I've been to that bar. Have you really?

00:52:40

I have. I was very sad there. It sounds sad. Preppy guys don't hit on me. Anyways, it's my own struggle.

00:52:45

Let's go back to the girl who died. You should be glad about not getting hit on at that fucking bar.

00:52:50

Okay, so the owner is the fucking same dude. Yeah, crazy, right? So the dude, the fucking, the bouncer, whose name now, okay, I'm going to say his name is Daryl Littlejohn.

00:53:02

his basement apartment is searched in Queens and carpet fibers are found that match her

00:53:11

on the adhesive tape, blood and skin matching. Little John's DNA are found on the plastic ties

00:53:18

and also from a snow brush found next to the body. So like, I don't know how he bled.

00:53:25

I heard something about like a nosebleed, but I'm like, why would you get a fucking nosebleed?

00:53:30

Like, I don't understand how that happens. Yeah, you're like a murderer, but you're also like kind of a geek.

00:53:35

You're like, no. Who knows? Or cokehead. She scratched the shit out of your face.

00:53:40

Oh, cokehead actually makes sense. Oh, yeah, it does make way more sense. If you're a bouncer, I'm so sorry, bouncers, but especially like in 2006, you're a fucking cokehead.

00:53:46

Careful, careful. Hey. Okay, so, whoa, whoa, whoa. A bunch of old shits found on the DNA.

00:53:54

It fucking matches as fuck And then additional evidence and they like ping the fucking towers which is like the new DNA I feel like

00:54:05

You know what I'm saying? And then traces of GHB were found in her system, which is not a punk band.

00:54:13

It's a date rape drug. So the fucking bar owner says, like, I don't know, I didn't see her.

00:54:19

And then he later says he didn't want to get involved. and, but a bunch of people were like,

00:54:25

he has ties, his family has ties to Rudy Giuliani. So a lot of people are like, this is actually the killer,

00:54:33

but he's got it covered up. And he was being framed, and the other dude was being framed

00:54:37

to protect Rudy Giuliani's family. He was like running for shit at the time. Okay, so, don't say what.

00:54:44

It makes me feel like I'm fucking up. Don't say what. Okay, so. We can hear every word you say.

00:54:49

Okay, all right. they had gotten poor publicity after the fucking Dorian's red hand

00:54:55

and then okay so he okay so finally Dorian admits what he saw that night and ready for a fucking piece of shit? Okay

00:55:07

he says there was a young lady sitting at the bar who didn't want to leave. I told her it was time

00:55:14

to leave and she said I'll leave when I'm finished with my drink says fucking in that

00:55:18

which is like yes girl and And then he says, either finish it or I'm going to pour it out.

00:55:23

And so she finishes it. Then he says, she was just getting up to leave. And I told Little John, Daryl Little John, to escort her out.

00:55:33

Which is like, call a fucking cab. You've never done any fucking background check on this dude.

00:55:38

Like, you don't know who this person is. And you're sending her out in the fucking world as a drunk person.

00:55:42

Well, it's the bouncer, though. So then they're just like, send him out with a bouncer.

00:55:45

Yeah. I mean, I would trust a bouncer. I would ask a bouncer to walk me to my car.

00:55:49

Yeah, that's what sucks about it. They're not drinking. They're fucking big and nice.

00:55:54

They've got broad shoulders. They're very cool. Trustworthy shoulders. They're fucking low-key individuals that sit on stools.

00:56:01

Yeah, like they don't want to be there. They have a little flashlight. They're like a bunch of drunk dickheads that they have to fucking do.

00:56:08

Yeah. Yes, I get it. So the other bouncer named Tim said that Emmett was slurring her words

00:56:16

and that she had been slumped over at the bar, but then he was just like, bye, and like walked in the other direction.

00:56:21

Like he just left them. And then Dorian said that he saw them, he saw Emmett and Little John fighting outside.

00:56:30

Okay, so he gets arrested. He gets fucking charged with all this shit. And then his defense attorney says that Dorian,

00:56:38

the fucking bar owner, might've been the real killer and that maybe Little John was fucking bringing women

00:56:43

back to the club to like, as a thing, but like clearly not. oh so they like float a conspiracy

00:56:49

yeah because that doesn't seem unlikely the other things I've heard about Dorian's red hand

00:56:56

yeah but he also said he told police that he had been banged up after a quarrel with his girlfriend

00:57:01

a couple days after her body was found it's like why are you beat up right that's the first thing you look for

00:57:08

okay so they never investigated him okay so the bar closes liquor license, and little John is sentenced to 25 years

00:57:21

to life in prison. Okay, so the judge says, not one of these people spared a thought to the wisdom

00:57:31

of sending an intoxicated young woman out into the deserted streets of Manhattan

00:57:35

at 4 a.m. If only one of them had the common decency to call a cab, taxi, we might not have, we might not

00:57:43

be here in this courtroom, which is like so fucking true right like you yeah you're responsible at that point it is true

00:57:52

it's super true it's very very true true true true if you're gonna own a bar and not take

00:57:58

responsibility for a fucking alone woman slumped at a bar and just send her out well that and the

00:58:05

other thing is that it's that thing of like being over served or did you drink too much like if you

00:58:09

go to a bar, you have to be careful. And I think, I mean, it's just that thing of like, you can't

00:58:15

just trust the bouncer. You can't just trust that other people will take care of you. It'd be nice,

00:58:21

but it might not happen. And whether or not the bouncer just walks her out and lets her leave,

00:58:26

like he might not be a murderer, but he also, the bar owner, the bartender should be aware of that

00:58:32

she's being at least somewhat taken care of. And yeah, she could be fucking drugged. And we don't

00:58:36

know that like it's so easy these days watch your drinks you guys you know also the funny thing is

00:58:41

like and these days then you're super drunk and they watch you get into an uber which is a car

00:58:46

that a stranger is driving like who knows who that fucking guy is it's just organized hitchhiking

00:58:52

oh my god oh that was great it's true where is this female only uber we've been promised

00:59:00

i keep hearing about it and i fucking want it did you make that up no it's a thing

00:59:05

there's like a new, it's supposed to be like women driving women only. And like,

00:59:11

or like if you're a woman and you're with a dude, it's okay, but you have to be a woman.

00:59:15

Like, and it's women drivers. Good night. Huh. Okay. I'm not on, I need to get on that email chain.

00:59:20

Well, you don't need to be because it's not, I've heard about it for two years and it's not happening.

00:59:23

Oh, okay. But it should be. All right. So let that dream go. Let it go. Let it go.

00:59:27

You're going to get, we're going to get, okay. So then while he's being fucking arrested and tried,

00:59:34

another woman comes forward. because she sees his fucking face on TV and is like, that's the dude who fucking

00:59:39

dressed like a police officer, handcuffed me and fucking sexually assaulted me. They linked the DNA.

00:59:46

It was him. He was a fucking repeat sex assault. A serial rapist? Yep, there you go.

00:59:54

Thank you. Another fucking woman like that dude fucking did that to me And then and she said that this other woman said that he wrapped her face up almost

01:00:05

exactly like he did to this poor fucking baby girl in that. Okay. So the good news is that in 2007, New York enacted a law requiring security cameras at

01:00:18

the entrances and exits of all the 200 nightclubs that held a cabaret license, which is so charming.

01:00:28

Just like jazz hands. If you're doing jazz hands, you got to get that camera. Using a stool as a prop.

01:00:34

It almost makes you think that they have clean bathrooms and you fucking know they don't.

01:00:39

You can't call it a cabaret and it's like graffiti bathrooms with no fucking thing.

01:00:44

my parents my parents owned a rock club and um they had something in dallas texas where i grew up

01:00:51

and uh they had a thing called a dance hall license and i always thought it was so funny

01:00:56

to call it a dance hall because it's like you a fucking guar you know like literally like spraying

01:01:02

like fake semen and blood on the audience and it's like we've got a dance hall it's like no

01:01:07

come on down to the dance hall it's a semen hangout and then sorry to say semen hangout

01:01:14

No, we have to say it once every episode or they just, it doesn't happen. So they have to have fucking videos and the club owners agree to have voluntary guidelines.

01:01:28

So they scan all of the identifications like they know who comes in and out. And they have to screen them for fucking weapons, which has never happened to me in my life.

01:01:36

Has that happened to you? I get patted down all the time. Yeah. I really do. And they also have to provide more care in dealing with intoxicated female patrons who are alone, which is great.

01:01:49

And then Boston did the same thing. And then also John Jay College of Criminal Justice.

01:01:54

They started an Emmett St. Guillaume scholarship for second-year students at the college.

01:02:01

and yeah. And then they've also created a spirit of a Met Foundation intended to support

01:02:09

education for underprivileged children. And then that motherfucker, Daryl Little John, is in jail forever.

01:02:14

Thank fuck. Prison forever. Thank fucking God. That was nice. That was a good ending. Thank you.

01:02:20

That was a real upending. That's the shitty Little John. Not the fun one that says, yeah.

01:02:27

Little John. Isn't that what he does? Am I getting it? Is that right? it's not that one it's not that one okay we're back georgia are there updates to this case

01:02:41

this case just really hits you because we've all been in situations like that i think every woman

01:02:46

who was in the bell house that night has experienced a similar situation where sure you know i'm really

01:02:53

glad they changed a lot to be like you need to look out for drunk women and like can't just kick

01:02:58

them out of your bar. That's just not how you do it. So there are no case updates. However,

01:03:03

just a little note that rapper Lil Jon has continued to thrive since 2016. That's right. Don't worry about Lil Jon. He's fine.

01:03:12

Right. And this is a three-story episode. How exciting is that? And also how ill-planned. What were we doing? Why would we? Yeah, everybody bring a story and

01:03:22

we'll have a three-hour show. And then Jamie totally defied us by just saying, I'm not doing a New York murder.

01:03:29

Goodbye. She's like, I'm doing my favorite. The end. Okay. So now it's time for our guest,

01:03:34

Jamie Lee story about Dee Dee Blanchard. Okay, guys. All right, man. Here we go.

01:03:42

I know. Thank you guys. I really appreciate the support. It's a lot of press. You know, it's a lot of press.

01:03:47

Yeah. Got these two experts. Yeah. It sounded sarcastic. It was a hundred percent not.

01:03:53

But you both told me that I should do, you're like, oh, we're doing a show in New York, so maybe do a New York murder.

01:04:00

And I didn't. I just straight up was like, no. I do what I want. I do what I want.

01:04:08

I'm Jamie Lee. It's loose. I thought about the title of the podcast, Is My Favorite Murder?

01:04:12

And I was like, oh, I'm going to be on it. So I want to do what is legitimately right now my very favorite murder.

01:04:17

So without further ado, this is the murder of Dede Blanchard. Yeah. Yeah. Hey. Okay.

01:04:27

So good. Oh, man. It gets so good. Okay. So on June 14th, 2015, in Springfield, Missouri, 48-year-old Dede was found dead in her home, covered in stab wounds.

01:04:41

Why? How? Who would do such a thing? I will let you know very shortly. Okay, so here's the deal.

01:04:49

Dee Dee Blanchard, she was described as a quote-unquote large, affable-looking person,

01:04:57

which she reinforced by dressing in bright, cheerful colors. This is a real fun detail.

01:05:04

Do you ever think about, I think my greatest fear is to find out how people describe me.

01:05:11

I never, ever want to know. I don't care. But God forbid, God for fucking bid. large, affable, bright, cheery colors.

01:05:20

I mean, if I heard that about myself, I'd be like, oh, please just murder me because I don't want to know that detail.

01:05:27

Someone once told me in junior high, they said I had mousy brown hair and it changed my fucking hair.

01:05:34

Right. Hence the fucking bob. You can't have mousy hair when you have a fucking bob.

01:05:38

What is mousy? I don't understand that descriptor. What does that even mean? Well, the bitch who told me that someone said that

01:05:44

clearly was a fucking cunt. Is what that means. That's what it means. That's what it means.

01:05:53

Here another horrifying detail She had curly brown hair She liked to hold back with ribbons Oh this is never good Like cheer squad Yeah like she at the Ren Faire

01:06:06

Just woven throughout her braid crown. Eating a turkey leg. Okay. She could, so Dee Dee could make friends quickly

01:06:19

and inspire deep devotion in people. She did not have a job, but instead served as a full-time caretaker for her daughter Gypsy Rose who was her

01:06:30

disabled teenage daughter so she didn't have a job she was just a caretaker for Gypsy Rose

01:06:36

I'm busy that's what she said I would just like to say that when I was little my grandmother who

01:06:41

apparently was a flapper um uh used to if we like I was kind of a nudist when I was young so I'd like

01:06:48

get out of the bathtub and I would just run around the house I thought it was really funny and it

01:06:51

Everyone would yell and chase me, and it was a good way to get attention. And my grandmother, any time I did something like that,

01:06:57

my grandmother would go, look at you, it's Gypsy Rose Lee, because she was a famous stripper.

01:07:01

Yes, she was a 1920s vaudeville star turned stripper. And she was also the inspiration for the Broadway show Gypsy.

01:07:11

Fun fact. Dee Dee didn't even know that. She just liked the name Gypsy Rose. No.

01:07:20

she didn't even know that she's like oh my stripper daughter no she didn't even know

01:07:25

she didn't even know she just was like those words go together well so that's like naming your

01:07:32

daughter like tawny on the pole i mean like that's a that's a stripper name on the pole is a really

01:07:38

beautiful that is a gorgeous little name on the pole on the pole okay so that's dd blanchard our

01:07:46

murder victim. Her daughter, Gypsy Rose, let me tell you a little bit about her. She was small,

01:07:53

frail, and pale for a 19-year-old. She wore big glasses, was confined to a wheelchair,

01:08:01

had a feeding tube, no hair, was missing several teeth, and spoke with a childlike voice.

01:08:08

Okay, I know. Hold on. So if you asked Dee Dee what was wrong with her daughter, she would list

01:08:14

off lots of ailments uh chromosomal chromosomal that is a word chromosomal defects muscular

01:08:22

muscular I don't know what that means but okay um chromosomal defects muscular dystrophy epilepsy

01:08:31

eye problems and also gypsy had leukemia as a toddler okay so many things dd dd said that

01:08:40

Gypsy had, quote unquote, the mind of a seven-year-old, and that's why she was homeschooled

01:08:45

for her whole life, because she would not thrive in a normal public school setting.

01:08:49

I mean, that's all of us. Am I wrong? Yeah. I know. I'm like, who's well-adjusted?

01:08:54

Who thrives at public school? No one. So they were in Springfield, Missouri, and like everyone

01:09:02

else around them in the neighborhood, Dee Dee and Gypsy's house had been built by Habitat for

01:09:06

humanity um it had amenities for gypsy such as a ramp up to the door a jacuzzi tub to help with

01:09:13

gypsy's muscles and um this is a weird detail since gypsy was too sick to ever go out dd would

01:09:21

project movies on the side of the house for other people in the neighborhood to come and see and then

01:09:26

she would charge a small fee because she was like it's cheaper than a multiplex and uh and then those

01:09:34

that the proceeds would go to Gypsy's treatments. She charged a small fee for the movie,

01:09:41

but the popcorn was still $14. She's like, it's still $5 Dasani. I hope that's okay.

01:09:48

It's very worth it. It's very delicious water. Can I pay for that jacuzzi? Because that sounds fucking nice.

01:09:53

Yeah. So, okay. So, Dee Dee had told one of the neighbors, a woman named Amy, I'm sorry, guys.

01:10:01

I'm like, can't speak. Okay. A woman named Amy Pinneger, that she and Gypsy moved from Louisiana to Springfield, Missouri, because back in Louisiana, Gypsy's grandfather would put cigarettes out on her.

01:10:16

And that Gypsy's dad was no longer in the picture because he was an alcoholic disaster.

01:10:22

So all of the neighbors felt terrible for them, totally sympathized, empathized, loved them,

01:10:27

and thought they were like the sweetest people they had ever met and wanted to do anything they could to help the family.

01:10:33

Which is why... Red flag. On June 14th, 2015, it was such a shock when a post went up

01:10:41

under Dee Dee and Gypsy's shared Facebook account. What? I mean, what do we do? What do we do?

01:10:47

We're sharing Facebook? Fuck. No. Disgusting. Get your own. Red flags. Get your goddamn own.

01:10:56

I mean, problems. Yeah. Serious ones. Okay, so a post went up on the Facebook that was very alarming.

01:11:03

It said, the bitch is dead in all caps. Okay? Okay, so then friends. Bitch, bitch.

01:11:10

Okay. Friends began to comment, obviously. They were like, we've never heard you talk like that, gypsy.

01:11:16

I guess they just assumed it's gypsy. They're like, we've never heard you talk like that.

01:11:19

Oh, my God, you must have been hacked. maybe we should call the police as comments flooded the page another post went up okay it said and i

01:11:28

quote i fucking slashed that fat pig and raped her sweet innocent daughter her scream was so

01:11:36

fucking loud lol anyway so the police got a search warrant and they went in the house and

01:11:42

they found dd blanchard face down on her bed covered in stab wounds and concluded that she

01:11:47

you've been dead for several days. And Gypsy was missing, okay? And all of the neighbors thought Gypsy was likely dead too

01:11:54

because without the care of her mother, how could she even function? Like she's so dependent on her mother's care.

01:12:00

There's no way that she could survive on her own. Okay. But then, remember our friend Amy Penninger, the neighbor?

01:12:09

Well, her daughter, Aaliyah, had some info. She was like a big sister to Gypsy, but unfortunately they were rarely alone together

01:12:17

as Gypsy's mother was always by her side and very overprotective. So when Gypsy wanted to have real talk

01:12:25

and confide in Aaliyah, it was through a secret Facebook account under the name Emma Rose.

01:12:31

And Aaliyah told the cops that Gypsy had met a guy named Nicholas Godejohn on a Christian singles site.

01:12:41

Quality men. I'm kidding. You probably are. There's so many things I want to talk about.

01:12:48

Oh, I know. This case is so loaded. This is an insanely problematic episode. Just every direction is problematic.

01:12:55

Okay, so she met Nicholas Godejohn on a crystal, sorry guys on a crystal mess site i had like half a red bull vodka and i'm like

01:13:03

okay on a christian single site she had been communicating with him for two years and was

01:13:11

totally in love with him okay so the police put a trace on those facebook posts and the ip address

01:13:16

linked to nicholas go to john's house in wisconsin the police went there and it was a quick surrender

01:13:23

Nicholas came out of the house and Gypsy walked out after him. Not wheeled out, but walked out.

01:13:30

It's a miracle. What the so many fucks? It's a Christmas miracle. It's a Christian dating site miracle.

01:13:39

Miracle. Oh, plenty of fish. But those fish don't have feed because evolution ain't real.

01:13:47

It's not real. Okay. All right, so it turned out, guys, that in fact Gypsy hadn't used a wheelchair

01:13:57

from the moment she left her house a few days earlier. She didn't need a fucking wheelchair.

01:14:03

She could walk just fine. There was nothing wrong with her muscles, and she had no medication or oxygen tank.

01:14:10

She's fine. Her head had simply been shaved all of her life to make her appear ill.

01:14:15

It was all a fraud, she told the police. All of it. Every last bit, her mother had made her do it.

01:14:21

Didi Blanchard had Munchausen by Proxy. Oh, yes. Everyone's favorite thing. A classic, classic Disney.

01:14:29

Just how Munchausen did my best. I wrote here, Munchausen by Proxy is the cheaper clothing line by designer Proxy.

01:14:40

Proxy is at Barney's. Munchausen is at Kohl's. she's cracking up at her own hilarious joke wait this is why we this is why she was like

01:14:54

can we have jamie leon i was like fuck yeah we can have jamie leon's a guest so you put on this shirt and you're like i don't know i feel kind of

01:15:01

the shirt is poisoning you slowly i feel like i want to hurt my baby when i wear this shirt

01:15:08

It's making me feel crazy. Does everyone know what Munch has in my proxies? Okay.

01:15:17

For anyone who is listening, just a quick sentence. MBP is a mental health problem in which a caregiver makes up

01:15:23

or causes illness in a person under his or her care. And it is a form of child abuse or elder abuse.

01:15:32

Okay. So the couple posted to Facebook because Gypsy felt guilty and she wanted the police to find her mother's body sooner.

01:15:42

Gypsy was in the closet while Nicholas was stabbing her and Gypsy also reportedly tried to clean up some of the blood

01:15:49

with baby wipes after the killing. The clean-upping of the blood is what I was going to say.

01:15:55

Yes. It's such a weird, like you're going to kill someone, why would you, like cleaning it up is such a personal thing, right?

01:16:00

Yeah. Like that means you're caretaking. Yes, and also with baby wipes, that's just...

01:16:05

Oh yeah, so inefficient. And also it's stupid. I mean, it's just stupid. It's stupid.

01:16:11

It's stupid. I mean, come on. We all know Bronnie is the quicker. That was a plug.

01:16:16

Jamie Lee, she'll be at the stress factory in October. I don't know why that makes me laugh.

01:16:23

Okay. Right. So, okay. So, sentencing. Nick Godajon is still awaiting a trial, but Gypsy pled guilty to second-degree murder

01:16:35

as Nick is the one who did the stabbing. Did he admit to that Do we know if he like yeah Yeah he did No he did He admitted to it yeah And she is eligible for parole in seven years And here she

01:16:50

Rolls out, then stands up. Oh my God! My favorite Munchausm. Oh my God. Oh my God!

01:17:01

She's like Gene Wilder in Willy Wonka. She just like does a flip. She's like, just fucking with ya.

01:17:08

Sing. I have a chocolate fountain. So, okay. So just to clue you guys in, Gypsy had been texting with Nicholas for years.

01:17:20

They had been communicating through this, like, secret account. And the crazy thing is Nick had no history of violence.

01:17:27

The only thing he did have on his record was he was caught masturbating in McDonald's in 2013.

01:17:33

We all do. It's no big deal. But I mean, I get it. Those fries make me horny, too.

01:17:37

That's never been caught. That's the only difference. I'm sorry, you know, when the McRib comes back...

01:17:42

Oh, wait, go ahead, go ahead. It's a reason to celebrate the McRib. Actually, I just want to say, I don't know if he was masturbating,

01:17:47

but he was definitely watching porn at McDonald's. Sorry, what's this? That's very different.

01:17:54

It's almost worse to me. Yeah, you're not jerking off. You're just like, this is my chosen entertainment.

01:18:01

It's like, finish the job, Nick. Anyways, so how did Didi scam everybody for so long?

01:18:08

It's pretty interesting. People are stupid. Yeah, I mean, seriously. Didi did work for a little bit as a nurse's aide,

01:18:14

so she had a knack for remembering medical terminology and spitting it back. Not only did she fool doctors, though,

01:18:20

she also fooled charities. They got free flights from a volunteer. Volunteer. Fuck.

01:18:26

Volunteer. What is happening to my mouth and my brain? No, this is normal. This is called my favorite.

01:18:31

This is how we do it. A volunteer pilots organization. they also stayed at a lodge for cancer patients and i don't know what that is ronald mcdonald i

01:18:38

don't know um it's like a lodge um and then also got free trips to disney world oh here's where it

01:18:45

gets fucking real dark guys um the abuse that gypsy uh incurred over her life um here are some

01:18:53

of the things her mother made her do her mother had her salivary glands injected with botox then

01:18:59

removed them because her mother complained that she drooled too much. She also had her eyes operated

01:19:05

on because of quote-unquote weakness. She had a feeding tube implanted. And the reason that she

01:19:10

was missing teeth was because her mother made her take seizure medication and it made her teeth fall

01:19:15

out. That she didn't need. She didn't need anything. She's perfectly healthy. So there were two

01:19:20

instances, well there was probably more than two instances, but there were two that I researched of

01:19:26

doctors being like what's going on here but then nothing came to fruition um which is very sad in

01:19:31

2007 a pediatric neurologist named dr flasterstein asked gypsy to stand up and she did with no

01:19:38

problem and then he told dd like oh she should be walking but then he didn't report it as abuse but

01:19:43

he was suspicious and now he's apparently like very mad at himself for never reporting it because

01:19:48

he was kind of on you flaster scene he says every night yeah he can't look himself in the he was

01:19:53

the flustered scene um flustered flustered okay stop talking jamie but keep talking

01:19:58

okay uh in 2009 someone made an anonymous call to the springfield police department to do a

01:20:06

quote-unquote wellness check on gypsy where the police said oh so the police went to the house

01:20:11

and uh they spoke to dd and they're like why are there so many different names and addresses for

01:20:17

you and Gypsy because they, Dee Dee would frequently change her first name, her last name.

01:20:23

I think it was like, I read something where it was like, sometimes she'd be like Claudine and

01:20:27

then she'd be like Dee and then she was Dee Dee. Like she was always kind of making these small

01:20:30

tweaks to her first and last name. I feel like that call was coming from inside the house. Yeah.

01:20:35

And Dee Dee said that the reason she did that was because she was trying to avoid an abusive

01:20:41

ex-husband. More on that in just a minute. Dee Dee changed her. Oh, I already said that. Okay, cool.

01:20:48

So this is what else is fucking crazy. So when Gypsy went to prison, she told the police she was

01:20:54

only 19, but she was actually 23. Yeah, okay. So she didn't know her own age because of her mother's

01:21:00

disgusting brainwashing. Okay, also Gypsy's father, his name's Rod. Rod was not a

01:21:08

psycho-alcoholic deadbeat. He always sent $1,200 a month in child support for Gypsy.

01:21:15

And visited on occasion. He had his own family and he still was like in touch with them

01:21:19

and trying to help them. I didn write this down so I just want to say for corrections corner there might be some corrections um yeah but uh so rod uh impregnated dd when he was only i believe 17 years old and she was like 24

01:21:34

so he just he was just like i like don't love you i'm sorry and i'm sorry i got you pregnant and

01:21:41

like it was just kind of this mistake and then they ended up breaking up and then she ended up

01:21:45

having the baby and like he moved on and had his own family but he still was like paying for her

01:21:50

Like he wasn't not assuming responsibility. I don't fully know the ins and outs of Rod and the relationship with the family,

01:21:56

but I do know that financially he was paying what he needed to pay. Wow. Cool. So this is where it gets, this is actually how it kind of becomes,

01:22:08

there's a sort of a nice ending to this story. Oh, that's fun. Yeah, I mean, relatively speaking, don't cream your pants, hold on.

01:22:17

so gypsy i know i've never said that out loud and i just did now um it's first time for everything

01:22:24

um so gypsy in prison is actually uh she claims that she is feeling freer than she ever did

01:22:31

under her mother's care and dude you're not fucking in a wheelchair for fixes yeah your

01:22:36

mom's not standing behind you all the time yeah right so uh michelle dean is a journalist and she

01:22:43

wrote this really amazing article about this story for BuzzFeed and she went to visit Gypsy in prison

01:22:49

and said that she speaks beautifully. She is very eloquent. She is not quote-unquote slow in the

01:22:56

least and this was a quote from, well I guess Gypsy told this to Michelle. Michelle said she

01:23:02

wants people to know that this wasn't a situation where a girl killed her mom to be with her

01:23:07

boyfriend. This was a situation of a girl trying to escape abuse. In prison, she's hoping to

01:23:13

join all sorts of programs and to help people. She wants to write a book to help

01:23:17

others in her situation. It's called Orange is the New Black. Yeah. And then this is the last

01:23:23

quote from Gypsy. I think she, referring to Dee Dee, her mom, I think she would have been the perfect mom for someone that was

01:23:29

actually sick, but I'm not sick. There's that big difference. Can I just tell you one last thing?

01:23:37

Please do. So I just started looking. I tried to find YouTube clips of different neighbors and stuff being outraged.

01:23:44

And one woman had one of those Nancy Grace-level thick accents where she's like, oh, my God.

01:23:52

She literally, because all the neighbors were so blindsided. They were like, whoa, what's happening?

01:23:57

She's not sick? I thought this girl was sick. And one of the girls goes, her name is not Blanchard.

01:24:03

It's Blanchard. She added the E. She just wants her movie night money back, I feel like.

01:24:12

Yeah, that's right. That's a woman who paid too much for the neighborhood movie.

01:24:17

That's hilarious. That was great, Jamie. Awesome. Thanks, guys. She nailed that shit.

01:24:23

One more time for Jamie Lee, everybody. I love you. I love you. You guys, you know what we're going to say now.

01:24:32

Stay sexy. Don't get murdered. Thank you. Okay, we're back. And of course, you know this story well at this point.

01:24:51

We all do. Yeah. So here we'll give updates together. Gypsy Rose served eight years in prison.

01:24:58

She was released in December of 2023. And then she went on a media tour sharing her experience

01:25:03

with the world. There's been backlash for her social media presence. It's a whole conversation

01:25:09

that, of course, everybody on every side of the true crime audience has an opinion about.

01:25:14

Gypsy ended up deleting her social media accounts at the recommendation of her parole officer,

01:25:19

which I think is good for everyone. If you could please listen to your parole officer

01:25:22

and just get off the internet. If you're going to listen to anyone, don't let it be the internet. Let it be your parole

01:25:30

officer unless your parole officer is an influencer. Oh, God. Could you imagine?

01:25:34

No. I think we're all rooting for her to live a nice, happy life, right? That's kind of the

01:25:39

consensus. And she is living a much quieter life. And on December 28th, 2024, which is the

01:25:44

anniversary of her prison release, Gypsy welcomed her daughter, Aurora, her first child with her

01:25:50

boyfriend, Ken Urker. So congratulations to her. Nice. Also, the writer who wrote the BuzzFeed

01:25:56

article about gypsy roses a woman named michelle dean and since that reporting she became the co

01:26:03

creator producer and the writer of the first season of who lose the act which is the Patricia Arquette as Dee Dee Blanchard Joey King as Gypsy limited series So that very cool

01:26:14

So awesome. We'd love to hear that. That show was so good. Patricia Arquette, are you fucking kidding me? Like the greatest legend. Congratulations or great job, Michelle.

01:26:24

Yeah. Great job. You killed it. And then let's see this episode. Oh, so now we can talk about

01:26:29

what we would name it if we could even think of a better name than Live at the Bell House.

01:26:33

I don't know. I mean, it just says everything you need to know. But if we were naming it today

01:26:39

based on something from the episode, perhaps we'd call it. I think this is something that you have

01:26:43

always loved. Wireless Janet Jackson mics. Obsessed. It's your dream. My favorite thing.

01:26:49

You know, a lot of people have vision boards and they have like houses and, you know, France. Not

01:26:55

me. I just have Janet Jackson from the control tour. That's someday. What if this is all 90s

01:27:02

electronics and like there's a fucking there's a disc man and there's a fucking headphone and what

01:27:08

else is there a mood ring for some yep there's a really short black jean jacket we're doing this

01:27:14

oh also i say at the end which is so perfect it's like talking about that the dawning awareness of

01:27:21

what we're doing and how we're doing it is i actually say at the end of this show this show

01:27:25

is so problematic which is really funny you know i think it's because we're we were slowly doing it

01:27:31

front of people and realizing that the reactions were so different than not having any in your

01:27:37

or Steven in the apartment, you know? Yes. That there is, yeah, there's actually like, this sounds like something, you know, I talk

01:27:45

about with my sister all the time. It's like the way we grew up, especially me, the youngest in a seventies family where latchkey

01:27:51

kids and no one was paying attention. I just never thought I was being heard ever.

01:27:56

I never thought I was being listened to. What I said didn't matter. What I did didn't matter.

01:28:00

They could say whatever you wanted. You can say, and who's going to pay attention?

01:28:03

And then you get into who's paying attention. They're like, whatever, where you're like, oh, that's not what we're trying to do.

01:28:09

Well, maybe that's why you just started stand-up comedy. So fucking you could be under a spotlight and people would listen to you.

01:28:15

Finally. Finally. It worked. You did it. And we did it. Yay. Thank you guys. We did it.

01:28:20

You did it too. Thank you guys for listening to this episode of Rewind. We appreciate you.

01:28:25

Yes, we do. And stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Goodbye. Goodbye. Elvis, do you want a cookie?

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My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgi

Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 47: Live at the Bell House

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