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00:02:05
That's right. Every Wednesday we recap our old episodes with all new commentary, updates and insights.
00:02:11
Today we're recapping episode 77, which we named Live at the Keswick Theater from our Philadelphia Live show.
00:02:17
This episode came out on July 13th, 2017. So let's listen to the intro of episode 77.
00:02:25
What up, Philly? Oh, whenever's good for you. I was pointing up there. There's nobody up there.
00:02:47
Hey. What's up, you guys? In the balcony. Ceiling. Wow. I was like, I think this is much bigger than it is.
00:02:55
No. It's still pretty big, though. It's still pretty big. It goes forever. Actually.
00:03:01
Yes. Yes. Wow. What? That was a good scream. It hits me, you know, when you walk on and people are all screaming at you at one time.
00:03:10
It's great. I started screaming, too, and it felt really good. You deserve it. I started screaming and nobody heard me.
00:03:16
And it was like, great. And I was like, what? You're like doing a fucking weird scream?
00:03:20
Yes. Yeah. To kind of a primal thing, right at the top of the show. Yeah. Yeah. I'm less nervous now.
00:03:27
Yeah. This is the last show of this fucking tour. You guys. For one second, I almost went, is it really?
00:03:42
So we're going to sacrifice one of you tonight. We decided it would be fun to end the tour with an actual murder.
00:03:51
Yeah. Yeah. chosen at random just like shirley jackson's lottery so don't worry everyone has a stone
00:03:59
if you don't have a stone in your house in your own hand you're the person we're killing that's
00:04:03
right we all throw the rocks at the person without a rock it's such a good plan it is it's like you're
00:04:10
like a you're kind of like a shirley jackson's lottery director in a way can we get uh yeah like
00:04:16
for the children do they ever have that in in elementary school that's what you'd like to do
00:04:22
always did you what kind of shoes did you bring well I brought these in more than the
00:04:30
first night and then said fuck that and more like aerosol slip-ons the next night and then I was like
00:04:35
this is the last show I should probably dress up and so I put fancy shoes on and fake eyelashes
00:04:40
on yeah thank you Georgia for carrying the weight and your dress we checked this the other night
00:04:51
the tag. Missy miss? Sophisticated miss. Take a walk in that outfit. Sophisticated miss.
00:05:03
Isn't she a sophisticated miss? Get on up here Karen Kilgariff and show them your
00:05:08
outfit. Thank you. Thank you so much. I brought high heels. I think I wore them the first night
00:05:21
on Friday night. And I was just like, I don't know. I like the slippers feel. Yeah.
00:05:26
I don't, you know what I mean? Well, this sucks. No, I totally get it. Should I take,
00:05:30
I'm taking these off now. Yeah. Whatever. You guys saw them. We're just like Alanis Morissette.
00:05:36
All barefoot and fucking, we don't give a chance. I'm hell. Do it. I, also these shoes
00:05:46
are my fanciest shoes, but they have, the bottoms, like there's just a nail. It's just a nail.
00:05:53
Like that the thing fell off years probably decades ago Probably And I just like well they tap shoes now Yeah Clickity click click click click click You should have done a little something
00:06:06
Shouldn't. Oh, shit. That's the next tour. There's going to be a very large choreographed dance component on the next tour.
00:06:13
You think we're kidding. We're not kidding. We're going to do tearaway outfits. And I would personally like to do some sort of a, we are a part of the Rhythm Nation breakdown.
00:06:23
Absolutely. Well, technically, any outfit is a tear-away outfit if you really put your heart into it.
00:06:28
Yeah. Yeah. So, end of the show. That's right. Tear all this shit away. Tear all this shit off.
00:06:34
I never want to wear this dress again, by the way. It smells like three hotels. And, yeah, it's not working for me.
00:06:45
What are your favorite memories from this tour again? Thank you for asking, Georgia.
00:06:49
Can I get a spotlight over here, please? Just from this weekend or the whole thing?
00:06:57
No, no, no, the whole thing. You guys, it's been going on for a really long time.
00:07:01
When did we start? February? We started in February. February. In Portland. No, Oakland.
00:07:10
Oakland. Oakland. Yes, Oakland. A box theater in Oakland. Oh, we were so young and innocent then.
00:07:16
I forgot my passport to go to Vancouver the next day. That's right. It started with some drama.
00:07:22
Yeah. And it's been fucking rock and roll ever since. It really has. We have a short video of our highlights to show you.
00:07:31
It's a montage, right? Directed by Wes Anderson. Everything's all centered up. I think I...
00:07:38
Steven, play it! Steven! He's not here. But I would say this. My favorite memory probably would be...
00:07:51
and you're gonna have to tell me where it happened okay yeah right i'll remember
00:07:56
indianapolis i think okay maybe milwaukee oh the the girl uh there was a girl who in the audience
00:08:03
threw up and then crawled up the aisle out of the theater that is you're fucking giving them an idea that's how karen will love me i mean yeah you gotta earn it
00:08:20
if you want it. I was like, that is a girl who's doing an impression of me when I was 24.
00:08:27
I fucking miss her. Last night, we had a girl who ended up doing the hometown murder,
00:08:31
but she tweeted at us and was like, I dated a murderer. And we were like, oh my gosh.
00:08:35
And she's like, in fact, I want to tell it so bad, I'm going to wait to get blackout drunk
00:08:39
until after the show. Yes. We were like, well, maybe we shouldn't pick her. Okay,
00:08:43
she changes her mind. But then Karen fucking voodoo just random picked a girl in the audience
00:08:48
and it was her. It turned out to be her. Do you understand what that felt like to me?
00:08:53
The power that I now know I wield. It was super weird because I have to say I do,
00:09:01
I like to do that kind of when you do the picking, where you're just like, we'll see, we'll see, we'll see.
00:09:06
But then there was just something where I was like, it's got to be this girl over here,
00:09:09
but we already had somebody who had written something out that was amazing. So she came up and did it,
00:09:15
and then we were like, we have time for one more. And then I was like, it's got to be you.
00:09:19
and Georgia had already written that girl's name down off of Twitter, written it on a piece of paper in case we forgot.
00:09:25
So the girl walks up and I said, what's your name? And she goes, Amanda. And then Georgia just holds the paper up with her name on it.
00:09:32
Like some fucking old-fashioned magic trick. Is this you? And she's like, what the fuck?
00:09:37
She's like, what the fuck? We were all creeped out. It was the best night. Let's do it again tonight, you guys.
00:09:44
Oh, we will. Oh, we will. Don't you hate it when you do something insane and wonderful like that?
00:09:50
Like when you turn to the right page, like the exact right page or like something crazy happens and coincidental
00:09:54
and your friend is like, that's cool. And you're like, no, you don't understand.
00:09:58
I picked her from the audience. No, no, it's cool. Yeah. So I gave you your, what?
00:10:03
I did the. You really did. Fucking new, man. That's exciting. You did it last night.
00:10:06
You did it tonight. Yep. I thought you were going to say your favorite thing was when the girl fucking ran on stage.
00:10:14
I don't like that. This is our domain. Let's not repeat that. It's kind of triggering.
00:10:23
We've talked so much shit about her, I don't think anyone would want to. No, we lost her.
00:10:30
What other things? I guess we went to Cracker Barrel. Mine's our always food. What did we eat?
00:10:35
Backstage, we just had some great Chinese food. Crab Rangoon. It's always my favorite part.
00:10:41
What kind of snacks do they have backstage? Crab Rangoon, we demand it. It's on our writer.
00:10:47
Vince knows. We don't have that. We're not going on stage. That's why we're 10 minutes late. 20 minutes late.
00:10:51
They had to go to Shrewsbury to get crab rangoon. Local jokes don't get local work? Okay. Fine.
00:11:00
I guess this is our last show. This is why. Yep. We went antiquing. Is it not called Shrewsbury? Am I saying it wrong?
00:11:10
Yeah, that was right. I'm saying, yeah, that was right. That's what you said earlier.
00:11:14
Yeah. I'm saying the same thing twice. Everyone here is like, we don't know what you're talking about.
00:11:21
We did go antiquing. Yeah. Lost our minds. Georgia, this is my favorite. Georgia's like, I have to get these books.
00:11:29
I want to get that mirror. And it's like all stuff you do not want to travel with.
00:11:33
She's just like, what about this old anvil? Let's buy that. And Vince was like, I don't know.
00:11:38
And I'm like, I'll make it fit. I will get it in there. I'll get it. And I did. I packed it today. I have a fucking shopping problem. Like for real. But it was so cheap. Like four bucks for this like, okay.
00:11:52
I have a problem You had to get it But it a fun problem You had no choice And then I do the like this is so cute but I don need it Who could I get this for Oh I have a friend who has it Okay Then you antique shopping for a friend who doesn probably want it Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Because it was the thing that made me
00:12:08
laugh was she was buying it. It was a really beautiful antique baby dress, but also that's
00:12:15
haunted. So why would you, why would you? That's a very good point. Lauren's going to be like,
00:12:23
Thank you. My daughter is haunted night top. Thanks for the possession, Georgia.
00:12:30
She was never the same again after that. Her head just keeps spinning around. Her voice got really deep.
00:12:37
Yeah. So thanks for the $9 child's dress. Oh my God, it's so cute. Yeah. What else?
00:12:47
You know, so many memories. So many great times. White Castle we did no more food
00:12:57
not White Castle oh fuck we didn't find a White Castle we never got to White Castle
00:13:00
I meant Cracker Barrel which is amazing it's just as good as you all said it would be
00:13:09
and then yesterday Vince was like I guess I don't want to go to the barbecue place
00:13:15
that Georgia wants to go to how about we go to Arby's that was a mistake he's standing right over there no i'm sorry oh he's like he's walking away
00:13:29
oh no he's driving the rental car away we now we have to take a train home fuck i liked arby's only because oh yeah there was a picture and vince actually i think put it
00:13:41
on instagram arby's now has a thing called the meat mountain you guys know about this
00:13:46
this is real wooing like they've had it i know i hope you have the meat mountain is an every rb
00:13:54
sandwich in in just two pieces of bread so it's just like turkey roast beef brisket a fried chicken
00:14:02
patty this this ham whatever and it's pork belly this tall was it yeah it's so there was a little
00:14:09
like like a cardboard poster on standing on the counter and as i was standing there looking to
00:14:15
seat I was going to get, I looked down, I was like, oh my God. And there was a guy doing the exact
00:14:19
same thing. He goes, oh my God, that scared me. Which is my favorite thing. Just a stranger
00:14:25
and I just start laughing our asses off at Arby's insane like they're trying to kill us.
00:14:31
They're trying to kill us. Heart attack mountain. For real. Hey. Happy Mother's Day to all the moms
00:14:38
out there. Happy Mother's Day. That's nice. We've got a couple mommies. Oh man, a pregnant
00:14:43
chick let us touch her belly. That sounds creepy. What I'm trying to say is we were after the show,
00:14:50
we were taking some photos with people and like, you know, you don't, I didn't say anything, but I
00:14:54
was like, there's her, I'm going to let her mention that she's pregnant because I don't say that.
00:14:58
She goes, well, can I pose with you guys touching my belly? And like, all I ever want is to touch
00:15:03
pregnant. Like when I see someone pregnant, I can't be like, sometimes like, I don't know why.
00:15:07
It's like so sweet to me. And like, finally someone asked me to do it instead of me going,
00:15:11
Can I have this word? It's one of the benefits of fame. That and really great Coke.
00:15:18
And when you combine them, oh my God. Next level high. Have you guys ever tried getting high when you're pregnant?
00:15:27
It is next level. All the mothers in the audience right now are like, I don't like this show.
00:15:34
I don't like what they're saying. I don't like what they stand for. No, they agree.
00:15:39
You think they're high as balls? My mom told me she had a glass of whiskey and a Tylenol every night when she was pregnant with me.
00:15:48
There I am now. Janet! I know. She's like, I was stressed. I had two other children.
00:15:55
What the fuck? And then she dropped my brother. Yeah. It's as if that's such a great combination.
00:16:05
Like in the 70s, everyone did Tylenol. I like the sound of that so much my mom used to always be like
00:16:13
people make such a big deal about pregnant women smoking I smoke with both of you
00:16:18
and I was like yeah I had really bad asthma and Laura's stupid so like how about it's not a good idea
00:16:25
we love our moms they did a great job wonderful families that we're both from what?
00:16:34
wonderful families do we have to stand right next to each other Sometimes we're in theaters so big that we literally cannot hear each other speaking on stage.
00:16:43
It's super, it's great for comedy. Do you think in Franklin, what's it called? Hamilton.
00:16:51
Oops. I flunked everything in high school. You just called it Franklin? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:16:58
That was not for laugh. But I bet they actually, in Hamilton, they do say what? Did I just pull out a huge clump of my own hair?
00:17:05
Yeah. Oh my god, I'm so stressed out. How did that happen? She's shedding. Jesus Christ.
00:17:13
I need to take vitamins. No more Arby's for me. She was on stage when the first symptom appeared.
00:17:24
What if that happened? Everyone remembers it was ominous. Oh my god. Oh well. Yep.
00:17:34
Fuck it. I'll bring you soup for whatever happens. Thank you. Thank you so much.
00:17:38
Oh, we got wished Happy Mother's Day too many times today. In like a, you're mothering age.
00:17:45
Yes. So congratulations, and we're both like, fuck, no. This is me looking at my phone all day long, people saying that.
00:17:54
Oh like when they tweet things and stuff Like Happy Mother Day to my mom To my mom I not your fucking mom Oh about us Wait what What are we talking about I meant like strangers like at the hotel
00:18:07
Oh, that's right. And I was just like, we're not. Thank you. I just said thank you, but you too.
00:18:12
Yeah. I'm like, can't you see from my really thick black eyeliner that I'm no one's mother?
00:18:18
Yeah. Maybe they thought Vince was our kid. Hair just falling. Hair falling out.
00:18:25
I only called your mother because your hair is falling out in clumps. Good point.
00:18:30
Good point. I posted a photo of my mom today. My friend texted me and was like, can I just fucking say I hate people who are like, post photos of their mom and like, love you so much.
00:18:39
Thank you for everything you've done to me. And she's like, they're not, their moms are never going to see it.
00:18:43
They're doing it for everyone else. Yeah. And I literally just said, I posted mine so everyone could see how hot my mom was when she was young.
00:18:49
And I just wrote, if it's not one thing, it's your mother, which my sister had done.
00:18:55
And I was just like, how fucking hot my mom is. And then so am I, because she was hot.
00:19:01
Yeah. That's why I did it. But then later you posted a picture of Ted Bundy and his mother, which I liked a lot.
00:19:08
Happy Mother's Day. I was looking for an Ed Gein moment. They don't pose with each other.
00:19:14
There was no Ed Gein. No, they weren't allowed to touch Ed and his mom. There's a lot of rules in that household.
00:19:20
Yeah. About mother touching. The skin bodies, there's a photo of. What's that? There's a skin bodies photo of that, but there's no mother and son.
00:19:29
Right. Anyhow. Anyways. Fire exits are on either side of the theater. Of course, straight back where you entered.
00:19:41
Drink in this part. It's the last time we're going to do it for a while. I've had a lot of coffee, I just realized.
00:19:47
And I'm talking like it. This is so sad. I know, but great. It's going to be super fun.
00:19:53
Let's not be sad yet since they paid money to come to a show. You came to see us happy.
00:20:01
Showface. Showface. Yeah, we're going to shine. Should we sit down for the last time of this tour?
00:20:12
Ooh. Ooh. Look at these haunted seats. Here? haunted. Yeah. Like a lady. Here's your
00:20:23
sweat towel. Oh, thank you. Great. I'm like dabbing sweat and then just like pulling hair. It's not hot in here,
00:20:34
Karen. Are you okay? Nope. I just, I went on vacation to Chernobyl, so. Do you know I would
00:20:44
totally go, I like want to go there? No, you can't. Yes, you can for like a limited amount of time.
00:20:50
They like time it. I'm not fucking kidding. They say time it like they give you a tour,
00:20:55
but it's like we're going to dip in for seven minutes and we're going to run away.
00:20:58
Yeah, and they're like, here's where it's at right now. Here's how many. Like you can go get a tour,
00:21:04
but they're like you're literally taking five years off your life. Yeah. And I'm like, who wants to live to be 85?
00:21:08
Fuck it. I don't care. I'd rather see Chernobyl. Cut it right down. Tell everyone in the rest of the time you went to Chernobyl.
00:21:16
I do hear there's interesting animals there. Right? Yes. The soil's all fucked up, so these things are like growing out.
00:21:24
I mean, like a rabbit with a face on the back of its head. I'm down for that. I'm crab rangoon in my teeth.
00:21:34
Crab rangoon. That's the word of the night. Should I go first? Oh, this is my favorite murder.
00:21:39
Oh, hi, everybody. Thank you for coming. To our live podcast. Thank you for being here.
00:21:48
Thank you for coming. We fucking love doing this. Yeah, it's so fun. You went first.
00:21:55
No, I went first last time, last night. Shall I go first? Right? Yeah. I believe so.
00:22:01
You guys wouldn't know. And we're back. We're back. I mean, on the heels of the end of our tour,
00:22:12
now we're doing a live show recap. What do you think 2017 end of the tour would have said to 2025?
00:22:18
Stop doing this immediately, please. Don't do it. It's not worth it. No, it's worth it.
00:22:24
It's too hard. You're so much younger than, God, I was fucking 37 then touring. Yeah.
00:22:31
And now I'm old. I mean, lots of time has passed. Yeah. A lot of time has passed.
00:22:36
Yeah. It's really funny. But I was laughing because the idea where, you know, at the beginning of that, there's like, of course, cheering and everything.
00:22:45
But then it like goes quiet a little bit. And then I tell everybody to drink it in.
00:22:49
And that idea where it's like we've basically manipulated our audience to be like, well, are you going to be as loud as the last city we ran?
00:22:56
I don't know. I love it. It's like there's no quiet moments anymore. My favorite other ones were like my ears actually hurt.
00:23:02
Yeah. There's a lot of those on this tour. Yeah. People really brought the screaming and applauding.
00:23:07
That's right. It was very nice. A lot of talk about outfits. A lot of outfit issues.
00:23:14
A lot of like clothing stuff. Yeah, I think so. This last tour, I wore vintage every show except for one, which meant I was uncomfortable in some way for every show.
00:23:26
Like everything just fit a little wrong when it's vintage. Yeah, yeah. But it's worth it, I guess.
00:23:32
I mean, if you're trying to do your thing, that's your adjustment. Yeah, you had some gowns this tour.
00:23:37
Well, yeah. I mean, like losing weight and being able to fit into things and feel good about fitting into things makes a huge difference.
00:23:45
And like many other things I was doing back then, it was just like everything was like trying to cope with this gigantic business that got dropped on our heads.
00:23:55
And so it was like, now you're on tour. Now you have to have outfits for tour. Now you're doing a show, but it's not a stand-up show like you're used to.
00:24:03
It's like a bigger deal and there's more happening. Yeah. It's just like all these adjustments.
00:24:07
And there's going to be pictures taken, so you better look fucking good. Right. I mean, that part of it where just like, that wasn't my world at all.
00:24:13
And suddenly it's like, hey, are you guys good with us posting these pictures? And it's like, no.
00:24:19
Like, yeah. All of that was a stressor for sure. Yeah. All right. Let's listen to Karen's story about Gary Heidnik.
00:24:30
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00:28:29
Goodbye. All right. Well, I picked a man who I've been reading about for several days.
00:28:39
there's a lot of things to read about him and none of them are good and his name is Gary Heidnik
00:28:46
do you know Gary Heidnik yeah they love him we always say at this point like this is where the ushers are like
00:28:59
holy fuck what's going on what is happening in there they were cheering for a serial killer
00:29:06
Jesus, we gotta get that acapella group back. This shit is weird. All right. Let me tell you a little something about Gary.
00:29:18
He was born in November of 1943. His parents divorced two years later. And then he and his brother went to live with their father and their new stepmother.
00:29:28
Of course, the father is a bum-out, alcoholic, abusive. I don't think he physically abused them, but he did the classic thing.
00:29:35
and Gary was a bed wetter, and so to teach Gary to stop wetting the bed, he took his sheets and put them out the window
00:29:43
so the whole neighborhood could see. Which also, Michael Landers' father did to him.
00:29:49
I know, I thought I heard that recently. Yeah, yeah. Little House on the Parry anyone No okay I the oldest person in the room Fine Fine Oh I told Georgia the other day we were telling childhood stories
00:30:07
I also wet the bed when I was a child. Oh yeah, we both did. It was lazy. No, it wasn't that. It wasn't that.
00:30:16
But I did it up until my mother, who was a psychiatric nurse, tricked me by one day handing me as I went to bed, she goes, oh, come here. The doctor gave me
00:30:27
something to give you. And she poured cranberry juice, like that much cranberry juice into a
00:30:31
little glass. And then she goes, drink this. It'll, it'll stop you from wetting the bed.
00:30:36
And it fucking did. Trick your fucking kids. All up here. She, she, she was a mind game mom.
00:30:43
For sure. She'd also very, very early on. Like when I was four, she'd go, I can always tell when you're lying
00:30:50
and then I believed her so I stopped lying to her because I was like well she's gonna know
00:30:55
because she can tell when I'm lying she was good well done Pat alright but also don't forget the smoking
00:31:08
no one's perfect okay so this is a this is a bit of information about gary heidnik that i really enjoy in the in the way that makes
00:31:24
me a terrible person um when he was a child he fell out of a tree and hit his head of course
00:31:32
classically but it also deformed his head this injury so then he was made fun of at school all
00:31:41
the time because he had a misshapen head it seems sad now but then when i tell you shit he did
00:31:47
You're not going to be sad anymore for Gary. I always try to stop my sympathy because I'm like,
00:31:53
but then he's going to kill a ton of people, and I'm going to be bummed I felt bad for him.
00:31:58
But also it's that thing of like, I mean, what? It was the 50s. How come you fall out of a tree and then your head just stays that way?
00:32:07
No doctors or anybody to help out? Just be like, okay. There you go, Gare. Stay low to the ground from now on.
00:32:17
Okay. So he ended up dropping out of school and joining the army where he trained as a medic and
00:32:27
he actually did very well in the army until he was transferred to West Germany and he didn't like
00:32:33
that assignment. So there he began to develop odd behavior and he was eventually diagnosed as having
00:32:41
a schizoid personality disorder and he was honorably discharged with full disability pension.
00:32:46
so this is like a thing that goes through his life where no one's actually sure if he was working the
00:32:52
system or if he actually uh had schizophrenia of some kind or some kind of mental illness
00:32:58
point to that head fucking shape and you you know your answer yeah that's true that could have been part of it yeah
00:33:06
and he's like they're like we don't know if you're crazy and he's like but did you see
00:33:12
it sticks out i'm sorry let me take my hat off there you go ah yes okay um so he comes back to philly and he decides to be a nurse
00:33:27
oh no uh-huh does he do bad things here um well yeah but not in the hospital okay um he it seems
00:33:36
like in the beginning he actually really wanted to be a nurse and help people he interned at
00:33:41
Philadelphia General Hospital for two years. That was in 1965. Give it up for Philadelphia
00:33:48
General Hospital. What a great place. In 1967, he saved up enough money from that disability
00:33:58
pension payout to buy his own house, and he rented out the bottom two floors. So he was,
00:34:05
you know, a bit of a businessman. He also started hanging out at the Elwynn Institute. Now, this is
00:34:11
a theme that goes through Gary Heidnik's life. And it's very disturbing because he goes into the
00:34:17
medical profession. He is a nurse. He actually later tried to study to be a psychiatric nurse,
00:34:23
but he had, he behaved so oddly and had such a bad attitude. He got kicked out of the program,
00:34:29
but he started to spend a lot of time at places that housed the mentally challenged.
00:34:36
So he was a predator from day one. Okay. But he was starting to, I guess, his behavior was affecting his work, whether it was a put-on or not.
00:34:56
So he ended up also getting fired from the university hospital where he had gotten a job.
00:35:02
In 1970, his mother, Ellen, committed suicide. and from there his behavior uh got even stranger and worse he in 1971 he took a trip to california
00:35:12
where he decided he needed to start his own church oh you know the natural path nurse minister yeah it's very clear um so uh when he came back to philly he started the united
00:35:30
Church of the Ministries of God. Nice long name. He was the ordained minister. He had about 50 parishioners
00:35:39
and most of them were patients that he had met at the Elwynn Institute. Oh, fill that room.
00:35:45
Yeah. However you can. Yeah. What? I mean... Was that bad? It wasn great but No I just meant I didn mean that in a I believe you I know what your intentions were
00:36:07
Okay, you know what I mean. And now I feel really self-conscious about having bare feet.
00:36:10
Look, it's the whole... I feel weird. Like, look at that barefooted bitch. Yeah.
00:36:17
Saying all the wrong words. Alright. Okay. yeah quick reminder we didn't do any of these things fucking gary did them okay yeah
00:36:29
in 1975 he opened a merrill lynch account in the church's name uh and he started investing in stocks
00:36:39
um oh no now i feel really weird socks stocks yeah oh socks i thought you said He was going to make that good sock money, baby.
00:36:56
Yeah. I was like, oh, he's crazy. And how fitting, because I was just, no. He's the guy that invented gold toe socks?
00:37:07
Oh, my God. Tube socks? That's Gary. All right. The ones with the little ball in the back?
00:37:17
No. He took $1,500. and he eventually parlayed it into a half a million dollars with good investments and,
00:37:29
I don't know, moxie. Okay, so he ends up buying himself a used Rolls Royce. He bought a Cadillac.
00:37:40
He got a customized van because he's a creepy old perv. And then he bought himself a new house.
00:37:47
um so during that same time um he also was in and out of mental hospitals and he was because he would
00:37:55
get in trouble with the police he would pull guns on people he's super aggressive a lot of weapons
00:38:00
charges and when they would interact with him they'd just be like 51 50 you're out of your mind
00:38:06
um okay so in 1978 he began this is gonna get problematic everybody in 1978 he begins dating a
00:38:16
mentally challenged woman named Angeline and they have a daughter together. So one day he decides
00:38:26
that they should go, oh sorry, her name is Angelique and they decide they need to go visit
00:38:30
Angelique's sister, Alberta, who is also mentally challenged and she lives in a home. So they go,
00:38:38
they visit her, they sign her out on a day pass and she never comes back. And so the staff goes
00:38:45
to investigate and eventually they find Alberta chained up in Gary's basement. Whoa. Yeah. So,
00:38:54
um, uh, she'd been raped and she had contracted gonorrhea from that. So he's charged and he's
00:39:03
sentenced to three to seven years in prison. That's it. Yeah. It's 1978. This was back when
00:39:09
rape was not that big of a deal. So in 1983, he's released from prison after serving four years and
00:39:17
four months. And he immediately signs up for a mail order bride service. Yeah, he's a romantic.
00:39:27
So he starts corresponding with a 22 year old Filipino woman named Betty Disto. And he tells
00:39:35
her, of course, I'm a minister. And I have my own church here in Philadelphia. And eventually,
00:39:43
in through these letters, he proposes to her and he convinces her to fly to Philadelphia
00:39:47
and marry him. And she does. And everything's great for a week. Oh, not long enough to sustain a relationship.
00:39:58
No, I feel like you need to build in more time, more than seven days. Yeah. But so it's what happens is Betty leaves the house one day.
00:40:09
And when she comes back, she finds Gary in bed with three women. And she freaks out and is like, what the fuck is going on?
00:40:17
And then he's like, get in here, you old nut. Get in here, Betty, you old stick in the mud.
00:40:25
And she's horrified, of course, and baffled. And so then that's when the mask comes off and he starts to beat her.
00:40:34
He becomes incredibly violent at all turns. And he basically just starts constantly bringing home sex workers and mentally challenged women to have sex with.
00:40:47
And she's just like, I'm in the fucking nightmare world and a different country.
00:40:51
And she doesn't know anybody but him and his friends. so she um eventually turns to the filipino community in philadelphia and is just like
00:41:00
can someone please help me because i'm like basically abandoned here with this lunatic
00:41:04
and so um the people that she meets there say you have to leave and you just have to leave and don't
00:41:11
come back and they kind of set up a plan for her and so she one day tells gary um uh well she tries
00:41:18
to confront him to say that she's had enough this is not the life that he had promised her
00:41:22
and he beats the shit out of her and rapes her. So four days after that, she says,
00:41:29
I'm going to go out shopping super quick. I'll be right back. And she fucking bails and doesn't come back.
00:41:33
Good for her. Yeah, right? And then she went into some Philadelphia, Filipino-American underground
00:41:44
and they fucking took care of her and he never saw her again. Fuck yeah. Pretty cool.
00:41:50
Good job. That's right. So remember that if you ever in trouble Okay two weeks later the cops come and pick up Gary for spousal rape for domestic abuse for indecent assault and for involuntary deviant sexual intercourse
00:42:07
Unfortunately, the parole period for the last sexual offenses that he had been in jail for
00:42:16
had ended the day before. Yes. So Betty doesn't show up in court to testify against him,
00:42:25
and so all the charges are dropped. Which is so insane that you're like, you're a victim,
00:42:31
and it's not going to happen unless you come and fucking reopen all the wounds you're working to get past.
00:42:37
Right. Like, can't they just use hearsay? No, I was always saying that. I was like, it doesn't work.
00:42:45
That's not going to work. No. Yeah, but it makes it so hard. Okay, so this is basically a turning point in Gary Heidnick's life
00:42:54
where her leaving him and the lack of control that he had over her for doing that kind of set him off in a major way.
00:43:04
So this is 1986. It's Thanksgiving, and he goes out to find a sex worker. And that same night, Josefina Rivera had gone out to try to make some money
00:43:15
so she could buy her family Thanksgiving dinner. And so she's out. It's raining.
00:43:21
It's a cold night. And a Cadillac pulls up and makes her an offer. She gets in, and it's Gary,
00:43:31
and he drives her to 3520 North Marshall Street. And when they pull into the driveway,
00:43:38
she sees the Rolls Royces, and she sees fancy cars, and she's like, this is probably,
00:43:41
I'm going to get everything done and get out. And so she feels hopeful. She's like, okay, this is going to be good, and I'm going to get my money and be able to get out of here.
00:43:51
So when they go up to his front door, he pulls out this really weird-looking key.
00:43:57
And what it is is half a key. And she asks him what the deal is. And he says, the other half of the key is already in the lock, so I am the only person that can open this door.
00:44:08
Because he's the only person that has the other half of the key. Oh, creepy. Right?
00:44:11
You're standing there, and you're just like, okay, well. okay, we'll see what happens.
00:44:19
So, yeah. So they go into his house. They go upstairs. They have sex. And when she is getting dressed again
00:44:29
and she thinks she's about to leave, he comes up from behind, starts choking her,
00:44:34
almost chokes her out. She's begging him to stop. And he says, fine, get down on your knees,
00:44:39
put your hands behind your back. So he handcuffs her wrists behind her back. and then he walks her down into his basement.
00:44:47
Yeah. I wish we had a picture. Sometimes we have visuals. I'm dying to see what he looks like.
00:44:54
Give me your arm so I can pinch it. There's a picture of this basement and it's not good.
00:45:02
It's not finished. It doesn't have any shelving. It's not swept. it's the creepiest fucking looking basement in the world there's a dirty mattress on the ground
00:45:15
and um there's some plywood uh the concrete on one side of the basement has been pulled up and
00:45:23
there's plywood on the ground so uh right so he and there's a bunch of exposed pipes and stuff he
00:45:29
um takes her and chains her to these exposed pipes he sits her on the mattress so she's
00:45:35
chained to these pipes behind her. Then he puts his head in her lap and goes to sleep.
00:45:42
Yeah. Can you imagine? This is not how I expected this to go, and it's almost creepier.
00:45:48
Yes. Yeah, because he's just chilling out. So she then, of course, eventually also kind of nods off.
00:45:56
When she wakes up, he's gone. She's still chained to the wall, and she looks around and she sees that the plywood has been moved
00:46:08
and there is a small pit in the center of the room. So Gary comes back with some crackers and water
00:46:17
and he explains he's got a plan. And his plan is that he's going to get 10 women pregnant
00:46:23
so he can start his own family. Oh my God. He leaves again. And Josefina realizes she's fucked.
00:46:32
This is crazy. This is bad. And she has to get out of there. So she starts working on her handcuffs.
00:46:37
And she somehow is able to loosen some kind of a tie that she has. I'm not exactly sure how.
00:46:44
But she basically is able to reach up and push open the basement window and lift herself up.
00:46:50
And she starts screaming out of it. And she screams and screams and screams. And nobody hears her.
00:46:57
No, I knew it. Except Gary. So Gary comes down and he unchains her from the wall.
00:47:05
And he says, you're not ever going to get out of here. So stop trying. And then he puts her in the pit.
00:47:13
And it's barely big enough to hold a person. She's all super smashed up in there.
00:47:18
And he puts the plywood on top of her. And then he puts bags of soil on top of the plywood.
00:47:23
So she's totally weighted down. And she's totally stuck in there. And then as he leaves the basement, he turns it on like the hard rock station and turns the radio all the way up.
00:47:34
So even if she screams, no one's going to be able to hear her over the music. Fuck.
00:47:38
Yes. All right. So she's down in there. And then when she wakes up, she wakes up to the sound of a woman speaking and the sound of chains.
00:47:50
And what's happened is Gary lets her out, and she stands up and she's all cramped up
00:47:56
from being down that fucking pit, and she sees that Gary's Gary has a half-naked, mentally challenged woman with him,
00:48:04
and he's basically brought another woman down into this basement. And he introduces them, because he is nothing if not a mannered person.
00:48:17
Oh, my God. Her name's Sandy, and he leaves. And so Sandy tells Josefina her name is Sandra Lindsay,
00:48:27
and that she met Gary at the Elwynn Institute. So when he was going there, he was basically going there
00:48:35
and meeting patients and making them believe that he was their friend and grooming them to basically eventually be molested by him
00:48:45
and convince them that he was their boyfriend so he could have complete control over them.
00:48:52
So they are chained to the wall together And the next morning, they're eating breakfast, which is crackers.
00:49:03
And they hear a knock at the front door of the house. And it turns out that Sandy's sister and her cousins are looking for her.
00:49:14
Because when she didn't come home the night before, they knew it was bad. And so they're out on the street.
00:49:20
They had found a friend of Sandy's named Tony that they knew she hung out with a lot.
00:49:26
And they went to Tony and they were like, who else do you know that Sandy knows?
00:49:30
And they were like, we know this guy named Gary. She's the first girl? Sorry. Sandy was the second girl.
00:49:36
Okay, got it. Josefina is the first girl. Got it. And Josefina is, well, you'll see.
00:49:40
She's in it the whole time. It's pretty amazing. So, Tony gives Sandy's cousins and sister Gary's address and they come and knock on the door.
00:49:52
But Gary just doesn't answer it. And then when they leave, he comes downstairs and he has Sandy write two letters to her mother saying, I'm fine.
00:50:03
I ran away. Don't worry about me. I'll get a hold of you later. So then he tells the girls that his plan is he's going to drive into New York and send the letters from New York.
00:50:12
So they see that the post mark is from New York and they believe that she ran away.
00:50:17
Well, of course, when Sandy's mother gets these letters, she's like, no, she's never written a letter like this in her life.
00:50:22
this is not this is there's something even more wrong here but they take it to the police and the
00:50:28
police will not listen they're like this is a runaway she's an adult it's fine don't you know
00:50:34
this is just somebody that didn't want to live with you anymore she's a runaway they can't get
00:50:38
the police to help um these are all also i guess i should say the all these people are black except
00:50:44
for gary heidnik um so i think that also probably had a big a big part of it uh was there this
00:50:51
outhanded dismissal of like, oh, well, don't worry about them. You know, they're doing what they want. A lot of people are accused of being
00:50:59
prostitutes when they're not or sex workers when they're not. Really, really shitty treatment. Okay, so
00:51:05
so all right, that was that whole page. I hand wrote this. She does that. Thanks.
00:51:17
Yeah, that's all I wanted. A little bit of credit for my handwriting. Okay, so now it's three days before Christmas, and Gary picks up a girl named Lisa Thomas as she's walking to her friend's house.
00:51:30
She's 19 years old. She is not a sex worker. She's not mentally challenged, but she is impressed by his car and his generosity.
00:51:39
He offers to take her to dinner. He's very sweet to her once she's in the car. She finds that he's very charming, and he tries to get her to go to Atlantic City with him, and she said,
00:51:50
I can't. I don't even have good clothes on. He pulls out a $50 bill and says, you can go buy some
00:51:55
new clothes right now. And so she gets caught up in, you know, this guy, you know, treating her so
00:52:01
well. And at one point he says, come back to my house. We'll drink some wine and watch movies.
00:52:06
So they do that. And while, while they're, she drinks a bunch of wine and falls asleep on his
00:52:11
couch. When she wakes up, he's raping her. When he finishes, she gets up and is putting her clothes
00:52:17
on and he does the thing where he strangles her from behind and gets her on her knees and then
00:52:23
handcuffs her so then he brings her down into the basement um and uh he takes the plywood and
00:52:31
lisa he he pulls the plywood off the pit and lisa sees that josephina and sandy are down in the pit
00:52:39
which i can't when i was reading that part i'm just like can you fucking imagine that like
00:52:43
there's people this basement's creepy enough and then it's like oh yeah you guys move there's
00:52:47
somebody else yeah there's there's a bunch of people down here and they haven't been able to
00:52:52
get out oh no all right 10 days later uh he comes home with deborah dudley now deborah dudley um
00:53:01
i believe is mentally challenged but she fights him the entire time she's there so she she starts
00:53:10
yeah so here's the thing though he has it so and he eventually starts manipulating all of them so
00:53:17
if deborah juddly is fighting with him he beats her and then he'll beat the other girls for her
00:53:22
having fought him so then they start trying to fight her to get her to stop fighting him because
00:53:28
everybody's getting beaten he takes a big like two by four and beats the shit out of all of them
00:53:33
and they have to watch it then he starts he makes them have sex with each other and he just stands
00:53:39
are in watches so it's just this degradation and this beating and mindfuck and mindfucking so that
00:53:45
they are all basically trying to get him um to treat them better and so it's that thing of uh
00:53:52
he he pick one to not beat and he be like i leave you with the stick i leaving you in charge if anyone misbehaves you beat them Then when he would come back if nobody had been beaten they all get beaten because somebody should have been beaten while he was
00:54:07
It's all that kind of shit. It's fucked up happening stuff down there. Some fucked up happening stuff is what it's called in the textbooks.
00:54:15
All right. so on two weeks later after that he brings 18 year old sex worker Jacqueline Haskins into the basement
00:54:26
and then on January 18th Sandra gets caught the second girl, she gets caught trying to move
00:54:36
the plywood off the pit he puts them in the pit all together so he's dug it out a little bit
00:54:42
it's getting bigger and bigger he comes down and digs it, makes them watch him dig it while they, you know, eat crackers or whatever. Sometimes he'll bring them really nice
00:54:50
food. Like, like he one day brings them just a huge Chinese food meal and champagne. So it's just
00:54:57
like, or it's just, or nothing. Um, you know, totally mindfucking them. So Sandra gets caught
00:55:03
trying to move the plywood off. And so Gary hangs her by the wrist and like one handcuff from the
00:55:11
ceiling pipe and um he he leaves her there for a couple days so the other girls are like she's
00:55:18
getting sick there's something wrong with her you have to take her down and he's like no she's faking
00:55:24
i'm not gonna fall for it he's of course getting increasingly paranoid um he believes they're all
00:55:29
plotting against him at all times he's constantly ready for them to try to attack him um and he did
00:55:36
this is super, super fucked up. He would do this thing where he would, when he thought that there was a chance
00:55:41
that they were plotting against him, he would chain them up and then he would try to shove
00:55:46
a screwdriver in their ears. Because he thought if they were deaf that they couldn't plan anything against them.
00:55:55
Oh, no. Should we take a quick break? I can sing some songs from Oliver if you want me to.
00:56:06
I was in it when I was 10. Do you know the words to the Franklin musical? Bet you don't. I do. Yeah, sing a little Franklin for us. Okay. Gary believes that Sandra is pregnant,
00:56:21
and that's why he is, I don't know, she gets sickly, she's lethargic, she has a fever,
00:56:30
she starts throwing up. He says the only reason she's throwing up is because she's pregnant.
00:56:34
Right. Eventually, she loses consciousness. When he comes back, the girls are like, you have to let her down.
00:56:41
And he lets her down, and she just drops to the ground, and he kicks her into the pit.
00:56:45
And so when he kicks her into the pit, all the other girls realize, now she's dead.
00:56:50
No! Yeah. This is so horrifying. It's really bad, right? Yeah. Now, that's the point, right?
00:56:57
Yeah. Okay. No, no. Nobody's surprised except for the one person who was like, my friend can't come.
00:57:03
Do you want to come? I've never heard of the podcast. Oh, come. Oh, also, my little cousin is here.
00:57:09
Yeah. And the rest of my family is really nice, normal people. And she's never heard the podcast.
00:57:15
And she's going to be like, Mom, Georgia's cousin. I think there's something wrong with Georgia.
00:57:21
Do you think she's going to tell on you? She's going to rat you out? Yeah. Yeah.
00:57:25
My friend Molly's here, and she brought her mom. Oh, my God. She had no idea what was going on.
00:57:32
Poor baby. sorry oh you know what i once did call uh jillian's mom when she was in high school and i was like
00:57:39
she's got some slutty pictures up on facebook you should say something to get back at me that's
00:57:44
right she's gonna fucking sorry jillian that was me but you're too young yeah for cleavage i like
00:57:52
that you knocked her out for that yeah yeah okay save it for college yeah Turn the page.
00:58:04
Sorry. No, no. I'm interrupting. Please don't be. I think we needed it. So basically, he takes the body upstairs.
00:58:14
And I mean, can we just... What? Can it get worse? Yes, it can. The girls are all down in the pit together.
00:58:21
I know. And then they hear a power saw. Oh! Oh! she didn't do it girl so in the next couple days they start to smell a terrible smell of course
00:58:38
not just them down in the basement but the whole fucking neighborhood and so the neighbors end up
00:58:44
calling the police and when a patrolman goes by the house nothing uh-huh he says oh i just burned
00:58:52
to roast and the patrolman's like well high five buddy I'll talk to you later and he leaves
00:58:58
yeah so um the paranoia is getting worse um uh Deborah Dudley is continuing to defy him so now
00:59:08
he goes into a whole new level where he's starting to um because they're all wearing chains and the
00:59:14
chains are connected to each other so he strips um uh an extension cord he strips off the insulation
00:59:21
and starts electrocuting the chains. Yeah. It gets really bad. And when the next time Debra Dudley defies him,
00:59:33
he takes her upstairs. And when she comes back down, she's scared out of her mind.
00:59:38
And the girls finally get her to say what is going on. And he took her up into the kitchen
00:59:43
and then he took a lid off the pot. No, no, no, no. She looked inside and Sandra's head was inside the pot.
00:59:50
No, no, no, no. No. No. Yes. We're doing this. Stay with me. Do not fucking leave me at this point We all agreed that we were doing this god damn it all right so eventually basically deborah dudley loses her shit and is like what the fuck you know whatever
01:00:09
and so he gets so mad at her because she's fighting him so hard he puts her in the pit and he puts
01:00:15
water in it and then he electrocutes her and he ends up killing her in that pit okay so now
01:00:21
Now, Josephina, who this whole time has been trying to make a plan, she keeps she the whole time she's like, OK, I'm going to stay on this guy's good side.
01:00:29
So when it would be the thing of like you get the stick and you have to beat the girls, she would play along with him just enough so that he would believe her because she was like, I have to win his trust.
01:00:40
That's the only way I'm going to get out of here. And anyone's going to get out of here because this guy's fucking out of his mind.
01:00:45
So she's trying to play him like the entire time that way. So once he kills the second girl, Deborah, she's like, okay, like I have to, you know, I have to really do something.
01:00:57
So she, she's really trying to like pretend that, you know, like play the wife part, really kiss his ass, really like, really act like she hates the girls and wants to do anything against them for him.
01:01:09
um so finally um she uh once debbie dies he makes josephina sign a paper that says
01:01:19
i killed um debbie i'm responsible for her death it makes her sign it and then once she signs that
01:01:25
he believes that he has her completely under control because if she goes to the police she's
01:01:30
the one that's going to get arrested for that crime come on so she's like sounds good to me
01:01:35
what a great plan Gary super smart I bet that's what's going to happen so she signs that paper and then
01:01:46
on March 24th she convinces him to let her leave and visit her family and in return for doing that she promises
01:01:54
that she'll bring him back a new girl and so he's like that sounds great plus I have the paper you
01:02:02
signed so this is a lock everything's awesome he drops her off at her apartment and says i'll wait for you at the gas
01:02:11
station she runs up into her apartment her boyfriend's sitting there she's been missing
01:02:16
for four fucking months months months she runs in she's screaming she's like i've been chained up in
01:02:23
a basement this fucking lunatic or whatever and the boyfriend's like you're crazy are you on drugs
01:02:28
shut up swear to god swear to god she couldn't look like nor like no she probably didn't look
01:02:33
great um but she she ends up showing him all of her scars and her where that like the huge wounds
01:02:41
where the chains have been and he's like oh shit i hope she broke up with him after what the fuck
01:02:46
or maybe their love got even deeper and stronger and he was like i'll never doubt you again baby
01:02:53
there we don't know what we do know is that he called the cops when the cops show up they're like
01:03:01
you're crazy and yelling and then she's like how about you take a look at these huge gouge marks
01:03:07
everywhere on my body and they were like holy shit and so they go to the gas station Gary's
01:03:13
just chilling out in his Cadillac waiting for his lady to come back and they arrest him and then
01:03:20
uh two officers go to the house yeah so of course they can't get into the magical front door
01:03:26
that did work he was right about that oh my god i mean it's kind of a great idea that i've never
01:03:33
thought about before fuck so just before 5 a.m on march 27th 1987 the police arrive at gary's house
01:03:43
they break down that front door and they go down into the basement just like josephina said they
01:03:48
needed to. And down in the basement, they find Jacqueline Askins. They find Lisa Thomas.
01:03:57
They're both naked and chained to the ceiling pipe. They free them. And then Lisa points
01:04:02
to the plywood. And, oh, sorry, there was an, I skipped a part. He had gotten another
01:04:07
girl, another sex worker named Agnes. Agnes was in the pit. So they pulled the plywood
01:04:12
off and she was down in the water in the pit. Then they go into the kitchen. stay out of the kitchen yeah i mean no they gotta go that's the thing you gotta go in the kitchen
01:04:23
i know um in the kitchen they find what looks like human ribs in the oven and when they open
01:04:31
the freezer they find a human forearm what yes so uh basically he's a he's arrested he is tried
01:04:41
and convicted on 18 charges two counts of first degree murder five counts of rape six counts of
01:04:48
kidnapping, four counts of aggravated assault. He tried to claim that Josephina was his accomplice.
01:04:56
And this amazing judge, I believe her name was Judge Abraham. When he tried to argue that his,
01:05:03
you have to read about this story. His defense lawyer is such a scumbag. Like everything he says
01:05:09
is the grossest thing you've ever read. And so one of his attempts at a defense was that it was
01:05:15
josephina's idea yeah and that he had tried josephina was his accomplice and the judge was
01:05:22
like because he was trying to plead insanity not guilty by reason of insanity and the judge was
01:05:26
like well then if you were smart enough to get an accomplice you're not insane and then they're
01:05:30
like oh no no then she's not okay oh my god forget that cancel that cancel that order cancel
01:05:38
So yeah, it's so insane. Oh, and then, so the final blow against the defense and by the prosecution, which is so amazing,
01:05:53
is they call Robert Kirkpatrick to the stand and that Gary Heidnik broker at Merrill Lynch What His sock broker Yep And they get that sock broker on the stand
01:06:07
And that guy says, he testifies that Gary was an astute investor who knew exactly what he was doing.
01:06:16
So there goes the insanity defense. Fuck yeah. That's right. He gets convicted. He's sentenced to death.
01:06:23
And on July 6, 1999, he's executed by lethal injection. And I mean, I kind of like this.
01:06:36
No one came to claim the body. They're like, no, thanks. And if any of that sounded familiar to you, Gary Heidnik's crimes and the basement scene
01:06:48
was the inspiration for Buffalo Bill in Silence of the Lambs. Shit! That's where that came from.
01:06:56
Ew, I just gave myself chills. That was weird. Isn't that crazy? Yes. As soon as you were like, yeah.
01:07:02
Basement pit, loud music, fucking... Mr. I got your dog. I'd fuck me. The whole nine yards.
01:07:12
Catherine Martin, you're safe! Remember? Mr. I got your dog! I don't want her! are we this isn't proper it's not it's not right anything we're doing no no so that's the story of
01:07:28
gary heidnik philadelphia that's your guy excellent excellent so awful so awful so bad
01:07:37
horrible disgusting well now that's my turn i'm gonna put my shoes back on first because i just feel creepy so oh you need some shoes feel creepy do you feel like
01:07:47
Do your feet feel hot with the eyes on your feet? Well, just knowing that these could easily go on WikiFeet, these photos, where there already are photos of my feet.
01:07:57
No. Yep. What? Yep. Do you guys know about WikiFeet? You know how if you put an actor or an actress, usually just an actress, an actress's name into Google,
01:08:06
if you put the name in, one of the things that will come up underneath it is that person's name.
01:08:12
So it's like, Debra Messing. one of the first things that will come up underneath
01:08:15
as a suggestion is Debra Messing feet. Oh no, I didn't know that. There's so many foot fetishists out there.
01:08:22
Well, there's a Wikipedia for feet and like any, if like Debra Messing was at the beach,
01:08:26
it'll just be like a close-up of the photo of her feet. And then they grade them and like,
01:08:31
they comment on them and like, great toes, like, or she needs a manicure, but otherwise I like her arch.
01:08:38
I'm fucking kidding you. Wow. So check that out when you get home. I better stay covered up for the rest of my life because I have Fred Flintstone feet like you would not believe.
01:08:50
I'm dying to look you up on that right now. Let's get it up on the... It simply cannot be.
01:08:59
Okay, we're back. Karen, any updates? There are some updates. So in that story, there were small but conflicting details about how Josefina escaped.
01:09:10
So it depends on what source you read. On Oxygen.com, it says that she managed to gain Heidnik's trust, and that led him to bringing her on errands and rewarding her with a phone call, which then they say she then used to call the police.
01:09:26
But then there's other outlets like People Magazine, you know, major outlets that say she escaped him and flagged down a police officer.
01:09:34
The Philadelphia Inquirer, meanwhile, kind of blends the two versions, saying she won his trust, was given 25 minutes of freedom to see her family, but then ran to a payphone as soon as he dropped her off for a visit.
01:09:47
And that's when she dialed 911. We see this happen all the time, though, in like there are outlets that get the information from other outlets trusting that source and when that original source was incorrect.
01:10:00
And it's all convoluted. And we are that source sometimes. That's right. Giving the incorrect information.
01:10:06
So survivors Jacqueline Askins, Lisa Thomas and Agnes Adams originally wanted to press charges against both Gary Heidnik and Josefina because they felt like Josefina had stepped into the role of the trusted captive and she didn't do anything to help them.
01:10:23
But the DA declined a prosecutor and explained Josefina was forced to participate in crimes under extreme duress and noting ultimately that she saved them.
01:10:35
Yeah. So those are the updates. I think it's like that's it's good context, too, in talking about that story, because that is what happens.
01:10:43
It's like she was a victim. Yeah. Just like the other victims. But then she was being played by this insane person.
01:10:50
Yeah. She had to play her own game. Right. To survive. Yeah. Horrible situation.
01:10:55
Yeah, definitely. Okay, now let's get into George's story about Edward Jindrick.
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01:14:28
All right. Well, my murder, there's only one person that gets murdered. So it's a little more lighthearted.
01:14:33
Okay. Nice. We'll end on an up note. Glad we're ending on this one. All right. This is the story of the only known case of homicide committed by an Amish man.
01:14:49
Edward Jindrich. Wait, say the second part again? Edward Jindrich. Oh. Edward Jewish?
01:14:57
Jindrich. Got it. Jindrich. And he's not Jewish. Okay. He's Amish. Amish. Amish.
01:15:05
He's an Amish man. Yeah. Okay. So picture an Amish guy. Okay. Kind of hot. Just saying.
01:15:13
Kind of a Viggo Mortensen in Witness situation? Did you see me pause up here? because I was like, you shouldn't say that.
01:15:20
Then I said it anyways. Got to. Okay, he is born on August 18th, 1963 in an Amish family from Rockdale Township,
01:15:29
Crawford County, Pennsylvania. He was said to have been somewhat of a rebel in the Amish way of life from an early age.
01:15:37
What? He chewed gum. I don't know. What's a rebel? He kicked his rock one time. He didn't work for three hours one day.
01:15:46
he put brown sugar on his oatmeal whoa Edward is rock and roll god I'm so into Edward
01:15:55
he wears his hat askew his family reasoned that and he was so he was a rebel he was kind of crazy like you know
01:16:06
wild and his family was like well if we get an unwaveringly faithful woman to marry him
01:16:13
she'll be a good influence and so they married him off. December 2nd, 1986, he's married to an Amish woman named Katie
01:16:22
and people in their community are like, Katie, don't do that. They were like, a bunch of people were like,
01:16:28
I don't fucking believe in this. Which is like, you have to get married. And they were still like...
01:16:34
Because they thought he was a creep? I think that they were worried, yes. They were apprehensive.
01:16:38
That's not my word. I don't say that. They had three kids. Danny, Enos, and Mary.
01:16:47
And he was starting to show signs of behavioral changes after the marriage, and they became
01:16:52
more and more noticeable by July of 88. He lost a ton of weight, became super depressed, and he spent a lot of time in the wood shop.
01:17:01
And he got more and more interested in the machinery of the Amish people, but also with
01:17:07
interacting with non-Amish people. Everyone's known as the English. Did you know that?
01:17:12
No. Like, everyone here is the English, unless you're Amish. Oh my God, is there someone Amish here?
01:17:19
They're like, my first day of Rumspringer, I'm going to go to a murder podcast. Someone, there's like a group of kids that are having the most awesome Rumspringer right now.
01:17:32
They're just fucking like, we're going to go from a barn to a murder podcast. And they were like, shit, she's reading me our only hometown murder.
01:17:40
Oh, that's what I was going to do. Okay. So while he was working in the woodshop meeting English people,
01:17:54
he befriended a non man named David Lindsay who told him that unless he renounced his Amish faith and became a born Christian which he was he would go to hell I dated one of those I swear to God
01:18:08
In college, the first guy I dated tricked me. We called him the secret born-again Christian
01:18:14
because he was in the theater department and he never talked about religion at all
01:18:17
until he and I started dating. And he was like, Karen, I just need you to say these seven words.
01:18:25
i was like i'm already catholic like i think jesus has got his eye on me i don't need your bullshit wow yeah did you dump him no he dumped me
01:18:37
man i would have made it my mission to corrupt him and then be like okay but bye
01:18:44
wish i could have i was like huh what the lord who do do do okay christian then oh and also that he would go to hell and that he was and that
01:18:59
led him to believe he was being confined and held captive by his wife katie so edward's mental state it continues to deteriorate he begins hallucinating and has
01:19:10
a psychotic break that scared his entire community i bet seriously starts ripping his hair out
01:19:17
claiming that it's on fire. His hair? His hair. That's what's happening with my hair.
01:19:23
Oh, we all forgot to mention your hair is on fire. Why wouldn't you tell me? Just a very small smoldering fire.
01:19:30
It didn't look that bad. We let it... I mean, it's kind of cute. We thought it was your look.
01:19:34
That's the new look. Smoldering. Fire. Sorry. Hair fires. Okay, so Katie found her husband in their bedroom,
01:19:46
spitting at the ceiling and mumbling to himself. And she was like... Sorry, isn't spitting at the ceiling spitting at yourself?
01:19:53
Yes. That is a good point, unless he was really good at spitting. Yeah, unless you go thing out the side.
01:20:03
No. No. Still wouldn't work. Okay. And at that point, she was like, that's it. Can't.
01:20:11
She couldn't. That was the fucking end limit. She's like, pull your hair that's on fire.
01:20:15
You're the devil. Yes. Spitting on the fucking ceiling. Get out. And then they do this thing that Amish people don't fucking do.
01:20:23
She's like, call 911. This is. Wow. She's like, I can't with this anymore. How do they do that?
01:20:29
They send a cow out into the street or something. Says call 911 on it. They light a candle, put it on a cow's back, push it into the road.
01:20:39
Send the 911 cow. This is fucked. We are screwed. I would say that we're going to get a lot of mean emails,
01:20:51
but no one's listening to this. I can't say shit to us. Oh, wow. I feel free for the first time on this podcast.
01:21:01
I feel so free. I can talk shit on whoever I want. Stephen, don't cut this. Stephen, leave it in and turn it up louder.
01:21:09
9-1-1 Amish people it was a big deal okay so he uh he so he's um also okay eventually uh so Edward gets treated at a psychiatric hospital in Jamestown New York
01:21:32
where he's diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic um and he's given medication of course and uh it
01:21:39
started to help his hallucinations. But when he got home, he was like, this is putting me in a zombie state.
01:21:45
And he didn't like it, so he did what everyone does at some point in their medication therapy.
01:21:51
He's like, I'm good, quit. You know? Don't do that. I mean, if you want to get off, just don't quit.
01:22:04
We're both doctors. We should have said that at the beginning of this. Oh, my God.
01:22:08
podcast. Yeah, we should have said it. Medical doctors. But his wife was encouraging him
01:22:14
to stop as well because she was a traditional Amish person and she, you know, wanted...
01:22:19
She just wanted things to be better. Yeah. Okay. But his state of mind continued to decrease.
01:22:25
He started saying he was the devil. And then in March 1933, Katie and Edward... What year? What did I say?
01:22:33
33? Nope. That isn't right. He went back in time. In the Amish time machine, which is a pile of hay.
01:22:42
That isn't right, and that's not what I wrote. Oh. It's 1993. Great. Okay. So Edward and Katie are having an argument,
01:22:58
and she starts getting worried about it and his temper, and she sends her six-year-old son to run and get help.
01:23:06
But the two younger kids stay behind. At that point, he runs and gets his uncle.
01:23:13
His uncle goes back to the house, and by then, Katie was long dead. Oh. It started that he punched Katie in the face, knocking her to the ground.
01:23:26
Then he beat her to death. Oh, my God. Sorry. um he had with his boots he stomped on her skull until it was left unrecognizable
01:23:39
and then it gets worse oh he removed so she's dead he removes all her internal organs
01:23:47
oh shit places them in a neat pile how karen calling bullshit on this is that no fucking way Show me a neat pile of large intestines I give you
01:24:06
That's bullshit. I'm sorry not to attack you. No, I fucking love it. No. I'm glad that you said that.
01:24:14
Okay. Because I hadn't thought of it. And as soon as you said it, I was like, oh yeah.
01:24:17
Oh. No. Someone just say that to make it seem even worse. Okay. So. And he did all this while his two young children were in the house.
01:24:28
No. No. And then he said for some reason later that for some reason he thought they could save her.
01:24:37
So he was trying to keep her organs in a clean pile to save her later. So he was just totally psychotic break, not in the real world in any way.
01:24:46
um so so they run and call 911 and they found the amts arrived and found a scene so horrific that
01:24:57
uh one of the amts immediately left to vomit oh yeah and uh edward was gone and so were the kids
01:25:04
but don't worry they found him later that day walking around country road with his kids
01:25:10
and the kids were fine. Edward's arrested. Pleads insanity. The defense argues that
01:25:16
Edward was affected by the fumes he inhaled accidentally in the workroom of the wood place.
01:25:22
The wood house. The workroom. I don't... What do you call it? The wood room. It doesn't sound right. The work wood.
01:25:30
The wood... Oh, the wood workroom. The woodworking room. The woodworking room. There it is.
01:25:37
Stephen. Steven speed that whole part up play the whole thing backwards Steven so they're saying like he
01:25:47
was in an unventilated room where they were using solvents all the time and he went out of his mind
01:25:53
because of that but it sounded like a lot of stuff was saying that before that he was
01:25:56
you know it was almost like the perfect storm yeah there was already stuff happening right okay
01:26:03
so the Amish community shuns him at this point which is like the severest sin is straying from the Amish ways
01:26:11
without repenting so he's punished with excommunication which is like fucking huge
01:26:15
while in prison Edward says he starts following a new religion and signs a document
01:26:20
saying he's an evangelical Christian so maybe he met your ex-boyfriend yeah he's probably good friends with him
01:26:26
so okay my dumb one week college boyfriend pops up from the sign i just need you to say seven words edward
01:26:38
i don't know where oh he's tried he's found guilty of inbound involuntary manslaughter but
01:26:47
mentally ill quote and he's sentenced to a term of two to five and a half years was this amish court
01:26:58
which means he was eligible for parole by 1995. He's denied his first bid, but he is granted his second.
01:27:11
So sorry, because it was not guilty by reason of insanity, then he only has to go.
01:27:16
But they don't put him in a mental hospital. They put him in a state correctional institute.
01:27:21
Okay. So I don't know. It doesn't sound like it. Maybe there's a mentally ill ward.
01:27:26
Let's pretend. Okay. So after five years in 98 he gets released, he's 34. He's released and after that force,
01:27:37
yeah, I mean mentally okay he moves into a mental health facility in Michigan and he
01:27:41
also lived in Indiana before returning to the Brownhill Amish community in February 2007.
01:27:47
And then then they put him in like a thing for mentally ill Amish people I guess there's like a
01:27:53
one room somewhere with all the... It's probably kind of fun. No, no, no, no, no, no.
01:27:59
They kill people. Sorry, he killed people. It's hard not to just try to imagine things about Amish people.
01:28:08
It's mysterious, and there's lots of barns. Yeah. Interesting. And it's hard on a podcast not to say the first thing that pops into your mind
01:28:17
and then regret it. Right. It's kind of what we do. Yeah. It's kind of our jam. You just roll the dice and hope you don't say anything stupid.
01:28:27
But it doesn't work. It's quiet when people are like, oh, I don't want to tell her she's saying exactly what she does.
01:28:36
Oh, no. I just don't want to say anything stupid. And everyone's like, uh, did you listen to the podcast?
01:28:41
You don't know where Delaware is. We all know. Oh, they're right over there. you don't know but 25 and a quarter are the same thing
01:28:56
hey we live we learn just like alanis morrisette said one time okay so he'd been out of prison for 18 years and he's living on his attorney's property in
01:29:10
cambridge springs pennsylvania which is like oh it's so like sweet yeah kind of you know yeah
01:29:16
Even though like the attorney was like, oh, I know he killed her, but he has nowhere to go.
01:29:21
He's mentally ill. So he's living there for about a year when at 44 years old, he goes out to the horse barn and in the morning and his husband and wife attorney are like, where is he?
01:29:33
And the wife goes, finds him. He hung himself. Yeah. I know. Wow. He had written, the only suicide note he left was a message in a, on top of a dust, in dust, on top of a bucket that read, forgive me please.
01:29:54
That so Amish He like I can use a pencil and paper I have to write on a bucket That part of the rules
01:30:07
Fuck. Yeah. So the attorney said his community completely deserted him. They shunned him.
01:30:13
They kept him from rejoining his family, which I guess the family, his immediate family,
01:30:17
did want to take care of him and take him back. And they wouldn't let him. They wouldn't let him take him back.
01:30:23
He was an awfully good person. and he could have helped his community a lot. I don't know about that one.
01:30:29
Hey, I mean, here's the thing. Listen. Look. It's a lot to learn. Listen. Look and listen.
01:30:36
Despite all that, he was allowed to be buried in an Amish cemetery with an Amish...
01:30:42
Headstone? Cemetery. No. Celebration? What do they call it? Funeral? Yeah, but like the organ...
01:30:50
You know what I mean? No, I don't. Okay. like an Amish burial like they said the prayers
01:30:56
are there prayers? I think so it's not what they're guessing oh it's called a butter churned
01:31:11
and the attorney said that that's all he would have wanted so it was the only as far as I could tell
01:31:20
at least at the time It was the only known case of a homicide committed by an Amish man.
01:31:25
I bet there's other ones and they just won't tell us about it. Fair enough. Right?
01:31:30
Yeah. That was amazing. That was Edward Gingrich. You got it. Thank you. The lights come up and there's just a row of hats in the back.
01:31:43
Oh, my God. We heard what you said about us. Oh, my God. I don't know. What's the accent?
01:31:49
That was weird. Oh, my God. That's not the accent. And it's called a ceremony, Georgia.
01:31:54
Oh, someone did yell ceremony. That's what I meant. Ceremony. Celebration. You had CE, right?
01:32:02
I did. I shouldn't keep drinking this coffee. Do it. Chug it. Chug it. Chug it. Cold.
01:32:11
All right, we're back. What are the updates for this story? Well, there's no case updates, but while Edward Gingerich is widely considered the first Amish
01:32:19
person to be convicted of homicide, it would be inaccurate to say he's the only known Amish person
01:32:24
to have committed murder. In 2009, an Amish man named Eli Weaver conspired with his mistress to
01:32:31
murder his wife, and he ultimately pleaded guilty to conspiracy to commit murder rather than a
01:32:35
homicide charge, but he played a central role in his wife's death. And since this episode was
01:32:40
recorded, there have been additional homicide cases involving Amish defendants. I mean, it makes
01:32:45
sense. It's like it's a closed culture. So any of those kinds of cases or things that have happened
01:32:51
nobody's really known about. Right. They keep it in their circle. But of course, you know,
01:32:57
people snap in any fucking culture. Yeah. Okay. We have two hometown stories from this show.
01:33:03
Listeners Alana and Andrew are going to tell us their hometowns now. Do we have time for a
01:33:11
I think we do. Do you think we can? Let's do it. To the one mom out here, this is when we ask one of your fellow audience members to come up and tell us their hometown murder.
01:33:25
Now, if you're Amish, we'd love to see you. That's for sure. What do you think? Wow, it goes back so far.
01:33:40
There's so many empty seats. Let's get that arm in the back on the right. Where?
01:33:46
Yeah, and there's somebody holding out two arms. Wait. Oh, that lady with the shoes and arms?
01:33:51
Yeah. Okay. Do you ever, when you see two empty seats, do you ever think, oh, what did they fight about on their way here and turn around?
01:34:00
I want you to want to do the dishes. We're going home. Man, they had a big fight.
01:34:09
Yep. That's so, like, intense. Dear Karen and Georgia, we broke up on the way. I hope you're happy.
01:34:17
Okay, Vince is going to come get you. Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't even tell you anything about it.
01:34:21
I don't know. There's two people. Uh-oh. I think you can both. Oh, my God. What if you both fist fight right now?
01:34:29
Last man standing or a woman. I feel like neither of you look crazy. So both of you go this way.
01:34:36
Go over to this young lady. Yeah, you have to walk down that way. And you have to slide your butt across people's laps.
01:34:43
Do it. This was a case of random gesturing into the audience gone wrong. That's right.
01:34:48
Not right. It's very hard to be accurate in this situation. Sometimes it goes. Can we get the lights down or they're going to freak out?
01:34:53
Yeah, we don't want to look at you. It's real scary to see all of you, especially you up there.
01:34:58
You guys are right. You guys are the scariest of all. Hi, guys. What the fuck? Hi.
01:35:02
What's your name? Andrew. Hi, Andrew. Huh. What are you doing on stage? Hi. Hi. What the fuck?
01:35:09
What are you putting? What? Was that the sound guy? What was that? There's just some dude wandering around back there.
01:35:21
Yes, it was the sound guy. Hi. What's your name? Bob. Don't be mad at me, Bob. Bob, Bob, Bob.
01:35:30
Thank you so much. Thank you. All right. Okay, girls first. Girls first. Girls first.
01:35:34
You stand back there. Oh, it is really bright up here. I know. What's your name?
01:35:39
My name is Alana. Hi, Alana. I'm here with my friend, Elena, and we actually... That's nuts.
01:35:44
We became friends because of this show. We like, probably the second time we talked to each other,
01:35:50
we told each other that we liked the show and bought tickets. Oh my God, I love it.
01:35:55
Very nice to be up here. I'm shaking a little bit, sorry. I actually took my hand.
01:36:00
shoes off to like wave so they're kind of wonky right now we're twins yeah just slide them back
01:36:05
on real fast just so you know you don't seem nervous so don't worry about it yeah good i see
01:36:09
the shake yeah yeah you got to seem well look me too though so my hometown murder is also it's like
01:36:17
a mixture between a um i survived yeah and a murder yeah it's good it's good it's one of the
01:36:25
babes those are opposites though well i'll trust you so um i'm from delaware oh yeah yeah yeah
01:36:34
born and raised i grew up in newark live in wilmington now so um all right thank you thank
01:36:40
you very much you're not nervous fake handshake no i'm just kidding no i work in politics so i'm
01:36:48
So do we. Yeah. Murder politics. So I grew up in a very suburban neighborhood in Newark, Delaware.
01:36:59
Home of the University of Delaware. Stop naming cities and tell the story. I like it.
01:37:06
I like it. It's good. We've got another story to hear. Sorry, pal. It's not that long.
01:37:13
So there was... was so the neighborhood that i grew up in very nice neighborhood like nothing happened kind of
01:37:22
just like a sleepy neighborhood we like played all the time outside and all that kind of shit so
01:37:26
um one day there was this woman in like the front of the neighborhood so like you could see the house
01:37:34
from the main road that was that would go by so um she was like out tending to her rose garden
01:37:40
That's important. And so she's like sitting there and I guess somebody drove by and he worked at the local Chrysler plant, which went out of business, which was a big deal for Noor.
01:37:53
And he saw what he liked. He, I wish I could show you a picture, but it's fine. Use your words. Use your words.
01:38:03
He drove to the front of the house, which was kind of like the side of the house because of the way that the neighborhood was set up.
01:38:15
And he like nobody knows. There was like a bus stop right there. Like it was a beautiful day.
01:38:21
Everybody was out. Nobody saw him. And he went into the house because nobody locked their doors.
01:38:27
It was the 90s. It was probably 98. I think I was four. So he went into the house and he waited for her to come in.
01:38:40
But she didn't come in first. Her husband came in and he shot him. Who shot who? Wait, who shot who?
01:38:47
Oh, the bad guy shot the husband. Oh, yeah. Why would the husband shoot the bad guy?
01:38:53
Wouldn't that defeat the purpose? Because he saw the bad guy in his house. That's like not even murder. That's like defense.
01:38:57
Don't fucking listen. you know just saying so um alana alana so i i guess the woman's name is debbie so debbie didn't
01:39:11
hear the gunshot i guess so after she was done tending to her roses she came in the house and
01:39:17
there was this man standing there and he fucking kidnapped her put her in the back of his car
01:39:22
and drove her to his house like five miles away and tied her up and just like repeatedly raped her
01:39:31
over the course of several days um and she was it i think it was your story yeah yeah she like
01:39:37
befriended him and like made her trust him and was like he would like go to work for the day
01:39:44
while this woman is just like tied up in his house because he's fucking horrible um and then he would
01:39:51
just come home and rape her. So one day before he went to work, she was like, you know what these ropes are like really hurting my wrists Do you think you could loosen them or something So he loosened them because he trusted her and she managed to like get out of the room that she was in because he was not as
01:40:08
smart as Gary. He did not keep her in the basement with chains. So she managed to call 911 and like,
01:40:19
I mean, they came and got her and everything was fine. She lived. So there was the I survived. Yes.
01:40:23
But the best part of the story is that, well, actually there are two really good parts.
01:40:27
my parents were in New Orleans at the time. And this was like national news. Like people were
01:40:32
talking about it in the neighborhood I grew up in was called Academy Hill. Um, and so they were
01:40:36
calling it Academy kill or murder Hill and in New Orleans. And my parents were like, Holy
01:40:42
fucking shit. I fucking live there. Um, so my grandparents had come to take care of us.
01:40:46
And I distinctly remember riding my tricycle like towards the house and my grandmother chasing after
01:40:52
me. Um, cause like at that point they still hadn't found the woman. And like, she's like,
01:40:57
There are fucking cops everywhere. So that was one good part. Another good part is like probably six years ago,
01:41:06
I was watching I Survived. It was the first time I ever watched it. And they like, in that show,
01:41:13
they kind of show you like a nice little clip rather than, and it's like, it's nice.
01:41:17
It's like a breeze flowing, right? So it's not cheesy or anything. And so they show this clip of these rose bushes
01:41:25
in front of the house. And I was like, why does that look so fucking familiar? And like the neighborhood I lived in,
01:41:33
there were only like three different houses and they just like made a billion of them.
01:41:37
So like I, it ended up being Debbie and it was really fucking creepy. And she actually has an episode of I Survived?
01:41:44
She has an episode of I Survived and it's really good. I don't remember which one it is.
01:41:47
It's been forever since I've watched it. That's amazing. Probably should have watched it before I did this,
01:41:51
but I did not think this was going to happen. You did good. Yeah. Thank you so much.
01:41:55
Good job. Thank you. It was really good. Well done. Nice to meet you too. Thanks for being here.
01:42:01
Go ahead and take that mic from her. Thank you. All right, you come over. Thank you. I'll take it.
01:42:06
I have to give it to Bob. Should I go down or can I stand here? Yeah, you can. Get in here.
01:42:11
With Andrew? Yeah. Yeah. Hi, Andrew. How's it going? Hi, thanks for being here. It's so surreal right now.
01:42:16
You have to go, isn't it? Why? You guys are real people. I know. Isn't that weird?
01:42:21
And I'm a trauma, too. Hi, guys. They're all watching us. Oh, man. Do you know any songs from Franklin?
01:42:30
You know what's funny? I had never heard of Hamilton. I'm a teacher, so all the other teachers are like,
01:42:34
you never heard of Hamilton? But you know now, right? Yeah. Okay. My story is actually about a co-worker that I had
01:42:42
at one of my first jobs. So, of course, a lot of you guys know in here the most wonderful place in the world,
01:42:49
Christmas tree shop. What is it? I'm from Connecticut, and they have a store called Christmas Tree Shop
01:43:00
and it just sells all the bullshit that you can't find anywhere else. Year round?
01:43:05
If you want a flamingo made out of old tin cans that's painted all nice. It's George's Dream Store.
01:43:10
It's right next to the dog food and right next to the gummy bears and right next to all this crazy shit.
01:43:14
Wow. What? Wait, why do they call it Christmas Tree Shop? Because it's a bunch of just random stuff.
01:43:19
They don't sell Christmas trees. They don't sell anything Christmas-y. They need to get their story straight.
01:43:23
Exactly. It's really weird. So there was a guy in the stock room named Zachary La Palooza.
01:43:31
I've been to his music festival. Sorry. Sorry. I'm very sorry about that. You grabbed it.
01:43:38
It was there and you grabbed it. Oh, yeah. It was when I was like 13 or 14. Actually, no, I had to be like 16 because there was no way I was working then.
01:43:45
So I was like, I was around 16 and he used to do stock room. He was like 26, 28.
01:43:50
He had like a bowl cut that made his head look exactly like a penis. Whoa! Exactly.
01:43:56
How, how? Like it was just like if he had like his haircut was just like Oh no You know what I mean Like perfectly like as though he had a penis bowl that they cut
01:44:10
You know what I mean? Yeah. I want to look like a. It was bad. It was bad. Yeah.
01:44:16
But he was a really quiet guy, really like mild man or whatever. Every time I used to come in, he used to be the one to open the door in the back.
01:44:22
So I used to walk in. Hey, what's up, Zach? And like go to work, whatever. But we had another manager named.
01:44:26
I think her name was Sean Treats. But apparently they had had some kind of problem where he fell off a ladder or did something or other.
01:44:33
She said that it was his fault. So he didn't get workman's comp and he got fired.
01:44:37
He flipped a shit. Came in the next day, was like, where the fuck is she? A guy that I had never known to be like angry.
01:44:46
He was really quiet. He just came in freaking out. You were there. No, I was not.
01:44:49
Yeah, no, no. By this time I had gotten fired for coming back late on my break. For what?
01:44:54
Christmas tree store is intense. Exactly. so so uh i found out later on that he freaked out whatever whatever um they had sent sean
01:45:04
to work at the uh christmas tree shop in rhode island it's like all the way across state lines
01:45:09
he found out that she was there yeah got a big fucking kitchen knife or something
01:45:14
drove all the way from connecticut to rhode island across state lines how far is that yeah
01:45:20
pretty far how many like an hour i'm horrible with with maps and stuff It was like an hour?
01:45:26
You guys were talking about where Delaware was? Two hours. And I was like, yeah.
01:45:29
I see two. I see two. Two hours. Yeah. I mean, pretty far. Okay. And so he drove across state lines, found out that she was working at this Christmas tree
01:45:38
shop, sat out front, waited for her to leave for the night, drove back to her house, and
01:45:43
then killed her in the house. Stabbed her something like 78 times. Whoa. Wow. Yeah.
01:45:49
At first it was like 45 times. And he was like, put her in the car, drove away with her.
01:45:54
Yeah. so he drove away with her in the car uh then apparently he was like 45 was not enough he
01:46:00
got out of the car stabbed her another like 30 times yeah and then took her body threw it in
01:46:06
like a ravine somewhere and threw a toilet on top of her yeah zach right like fucking zach yeah you
01:46:14
know yeah and so uh yeah that was he uh stabbed her 70 times threw her into whatever they found
01:46:20
her like a week and a half later yeah and he had no idea who it was but then they had uh blood
01:46:25
evidence that she like tried to fight him or something found blood evidence underneath her
01:46:29
uh her nails yeah yeah and realized that he was the one that got fired in connecticut
01:46:32
tied it all back together and went and found him so now he's doing life in rhode island wow
01:46:37
oh dang that was amazing wow that was pretty crazy that was a good one you think you kind of know someone good old christmas tree shop yeah you know what
01:46:50
you see that bowl cut you just walk the other way every time am i right all right thank you
01:46:55
thank you andrew that was awesome thank you so much thank you great thank you so much thanks
01:47:02
for being here thanks you guys thank you that was so cool fuck yeah yeah leave that for that
01:47:07
was our last hometown of this tour yeah best friends best friends brand new best friends
01:47:16
They'll be signing autographs in the lobby after this. And we're back. There are no updates for either of those hometown cases, just to keep everybody apprised.
01:47:31
Our researchers always look and see just in case there's a little something to tell you.
01:47:35
There ain't. No. So this episode was originally titled Live at the Keswick Theater.
01:47:40
If we were naming it today, based on some funny shit from the episode, maybe we'd call it sophisticated myths.
01:47:47
Come on. I love vintage tags almost as much as I love vintage clothing. Then they make you laugh.
01:47:52
Like, they're just so ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it's like time and place kind of thing.
01:47:57
It's like that little reveal. Sophisticated myths. It's so funny. Or we could call it old anvil which was my joke about you buying all the heaviest things that you wouldn want to travel with when you shop on the road And I still do that Yeah And then also Franklin Because I called Hamilton Franklin
01:48:15
That made me laugh so hard. Oh, my God. It just shows you how not into fucking musical theater I am.
01:48:22
Franklin. Also, at the time, I think it was just starting to be popular. So it's like it sounds even crazier today.
01:48:28
It's like calling it the Little Merman. Right, right. What's it called? Franklin?
01:48:33
Yeah, they should do a musical about Ben Franklin. Why isn't there one? I fucking gave the 2017.
01:48:38
I gave it basically on a platter. Poor man's copyright. We already said it on a podcast.
01:48:42
That's right. Our idea. All right. Well, thanks for listening, you guys. We're going to say goodbye from the Keswick Theater in 2017.
01:48:48
Goodbye. Bye. You guys. OK, we've had the best time on this tour. It has been so cool to be here with you in real life
01:49:00
and see that the bullshit we do in George's apartment actually matters to seemingly a shit ton of people.
01:49:08
It's such a huge compliment. It really is like... And every single fucking person we've met on this tour
01:49:17
has been cool and someone we would be friends with and hang out with and so fucking nice and awesome.
01:49:23
And we feel so lucky. Yeah, we talk about it all the time. Yeah, you're crying. we talk about all the time though
01:49:31
we keep saying that to men we're like can we just keep doing this we want to do this for a living
01:49:36
how could you not want to do this for fucking a living so thank you for you guys
01:49:41
being here buying tickets, supporting us is the reason we can even do it thank you so much Philadelphia
01:49:49
thank you so much you are an amazing crowd stay sexy and don't get it Bye, you guys. Thank you.
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