00:00:06
Hey weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is [Music] Morbid. This is morbid. And it is humid
00:00:26
and swampy outside. Like it's [ __ ] Florida or some [ __ ] Oh, we haven't even been outside today, though. Yeah,
00:00:32
but I was told by reputable sources. Yeah, but I know. Meaning my husband texted me and
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said it's like Florida outside. It's humid. No, he's a very reputable source. Well, the problem it wasn't even [ __ ]
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humid in Florida when we were there. So, now we're back home and we have to deal
00:00:50
with humidity. And guess what? Not good for my hair. Yeah, I don't like it. Not good for my hair that I blow dried this
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goddamn morning. One thing I am excited though. Thanks for caring. I don't I don't
00:01:03
[Laughter] You guys know I don't love summer. Um but I'm decided to get into it this year
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because the summer and slasher summer. I'm trying to get in that vibe. It's gonna be fun and I'm excited for that.
00:01:16
So that I'm trying to like get in a different um state of mind for summer cuz this is usually the time of the year
00:01:23
when I say [ __ ] it. I need fall more than I need oxygen. Wow. And it hurts. I want it so bad. Like I'm there now. Like
00:01:31
it's hurting me. I'm in pain right now. Literally May second. Yeah. That's that's my favorite response is whenever
00:01:39
I say that somebody just goes checks calendar. It's this date. And I say no, I know that. That's what hurts is that
00:01:47
it's not October. She's going to square up right now. She said that is always the response. She said, "I know what the
00:01:54
[ __ ] date is. Put your [ __ ] arms up." It's always the response. I say, "Wow, I really want fall." And people
00:02:02
are like, "It's May 3rd." And I'm like, "I know. If it wasn't May 3rd, I wouldn't be missing fall. I would be in
00:02:09
fall." I think that I think we're going to have to noise regulate this episode because we screaming. We scream it.
00:02:15
Listen, I like summer. I'm ready for my birthday, which is in 1 month. We're not
00:02:19
even in Gemini season yet. So, I'm excited for summer. And you can feel how you feel and I can feel how I feel and
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we can still run a successful podcast together. Just so you know, it's May second. It is. I know. Do you know?
00:02:33
Listen, I was being mature. I was being mature. I was being mature right there. And you weren't. Maybe that's why
00:02:38
Nicholas has a problem with you. Oh, we got to talk about that, guys. So, this is a fake fight, by the It is. I think
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we opened up a few episodes fighting. Yeah. And I feel like that's going to start a whole thing where I'm going to
00:02:50
be chased with pitchforks. Maybe they'll chase me. No, I can't run. So, don't do
00:02:55
that. I I won't run. I I will not run. So, no. This is totally fake. We're We're
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totally fine. Jokes. Uh we we're in a silly goofy mood. Help me. Shut the [ __ ]
00:03:07
up. Just shut the [ __ ] up. Uh, but no, on a lighter note, but no, on a little bit of a scary note,
00:03:15
actually, Alena has a problem with a poltergeist. Okay, so here we are. Um, maybe not. This is a spooky episode. Uh,
00:03:23
we didn't we started out with a theme and then we said, "Are you okay?" Oh, see, he's trying to make it right. Maybe
00:03:30
he asked me if I was okay because I mean that that's like a ghost lyric. I like that. Maybe that maybe that's falling to
00:03:39
you. I think Nicholas mother mother. Okay, we're back. Me and Nicholas are back. He heard me starting to talk about
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it and he was like, "I'm sorry. I hurt you. I'm sorry. I'm not He's He's responding." Uh, okay, Nicholas. I'm
00:03:53
sorry. I'm I'm going to talk about our fight, but we're fine. We're totally cool now. Uh, okay. Wait. Going back. If
00:04:00
you guys watched or listened to Listener Tales episode 666, we had a special guest, Nicholas, on it's the Ghost Tube
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app. We're gonna have him. We're gonna put it up whenever we do spooky episodes. Yeah, just spooky episodes or
00:04:12
maybe when we feel like it. Yeah. You guys seem to like it though. It was fun. He doesn't interrupt that much. Um and
00:04:18
when he does, it's very pertinent information. So, uh we named him Nicholas because he named himself
00:04:23
Nicholas. That's how that works. We said, "What's your name?" And he said, "Nicholas." And we said, "Okay,
00:04:28
Nicholas." Uh Nicholas and I were broies the last time. I felt a deep connection
00:04:32
to him. So, we started off this episode and I was like I was like, "Nicholas, what's going on?" And he said he was
00:04:37
struggling and I was like oh no. And I said tell me your wos Nicholas. And he responded you. And I said whoa. This is
00:04:44
our first fight and this is okay. I thought maybe his woes are you because like he lives here and he's because he
00:04:53
can't like he can't love you because you're not even on the same plane and you're married. Oh my god. I'm telling
00:04:59
John. I think that's me and Nicholas's dynamic. I think cuz he just he you're his forbidden love. He heard that I
00:05:05
misunderstood here. Although he did call you mother. So yeah, that's weird. Uh maybe he thinks you're an icon. It's
00:05:12
okay. He thinks Yeah, he's like mother. I'm lost. I'm lost. He's lost. She's lost. See, he
00:05:19
said no. He said I don't even know how I feel. Possessed. What did he say? Possessed. I'd like to not be
00:05:25
personally. Nicholas, we're okay. Um we're okay now. Nicholas, we understand each other. Nicholas, I get it. Okay.
00:05:33
Yeah, it's complicated on Facebook. Some people don't understand our snark. Okay.
00:05:38
But this is how we do. That's right, mother. So, Nicholas is gonna be is going to be around and Nicholas will
00:05:46
chime in when he feels like he has something to say, when he sees fit. Um, and again, we were going to make this
00:05:52
like a themed spooky episode, but then we just got crazy with it. And Ash chose a cemetery, I chose an institution, like
00:06:01
an asylum, and we're just going with that. So there's no real theme except spooky. This is [ __ ] spooky. So
00:06:08
Nicholas is the theme. He's the common thread. Nicholas serving Nicholas. Serving Nicholas mother. So very much.
00:06:18
Very much. He just Oh my god. Wow. He's a king. Nicholas for life. He said serving Nicholas very much. Okay. I
00:06:26
think Nicholas is a gay icon. Personally personally on the season of All Star. I'm obsessed with Nicholas.
00:06:33
Maybe. Oh my god, did he say maybe? [ __ ] we have a full-blown relationship with a gay paranormal icon. Get on our
00:06:42
goddamn level. I have literally upset. I've never been I've quite frankly never been happier.
00:06:51
He said, "Maybe catch me on RuPaul's Drag Race season 17." I love you. Wow. Oh my goodness. Nicholas, you bring joy.
00:07:01
Wow. Okay, I don't even know how to follow that up, but I don't think you can. Episode done. Bye. Thanks for
00:07:06
listening. So, I found this uh so I was searching for spooky places. I didn't know what I wanted to do. At first, I
00:07:13
was looking for cemeteries. That's how this did lead me here cuz Ash had found a cemetery she wanted to do, and I was
00:07:19
like, "All right, I will find a cemetery." So, the reason I found this is it's it's an old asylum. I'm going to
00:07:25
get into all the all the nitty-gritty. It's really horrible, so buckle in. Uh, but there is a cemetery on the site of
00:07:34
this place, but it's like a mass grave. Oh. So, it's technically a cemetery, but
00:07:39
that's what led me to this. And then when I found out the history water, you need some. I'm empty on water. Actually,
00:07:45
are you asking? So, when I got further into like the history of this, that's when I was like, I have to. I'm
00:07:51
literally about to take a sip of your water because you told me to just yeed down to her water bottle. He said,
00:07:58
hydrate. She said, "Okay, as you wish." Yeah. As you wish, Nicholas. So, I'm going. And then as I
00:08:06
got into like the, you know, the background of this place and it's like it's just horrifying history. I found
00:08:12
that Sam and Colby had gone to this place and explored it. So, I watched that video cuz I wanted to see what that
00:08:19
was about, and they experienced something crazy there. So, I I urge you to go look up their their video about
00:08:25
it. Um, but yeah, it's a very scary place. It was a very scary history. And again, this is going to be a little
00:08:33
upsetting at times. This is not It's a It's like an institution, so that's not great. Mine will palette cleanse a bit.
00:08:40
Yeah. So, this is Forest Haven Asylum. It was opened in 1925. It was opened under a much more offensive, but very of
00:08:49
the time name. M um it was the so part of that was um the district training school for something that I will not say
00:09:01
now. Uh it was named Forest Haven Asylum in 1963. That's better. That's when they
00:09:06
I mean still pretty shitty, but uh yeah, and somehow it got shittier after that.
00:09:10
So I don't know how that happened, but it was intended initially to to treat children and young adults and more. It
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was a really bad hotel. Uh it they were treating children and young adults in Laurel, Maryland and it was serving the
00:09:24
people of the District Columbia as well. Like they it had a big range. Um it was
00:09:30
going to be taking in people who were deemed mentally ill at the time, like severely mentally ill, but later it went
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way far out of those parameters. uh far enough to bring in kids and young adults
00:09:43
that were just deemed not quote unquote normal by society or were just people that did
00:09:52
nobody wanted to deal with anymore. That's horrible. There was also times when people were taken from their
00:09:58
families against their family's will and put into this place. Yeah. How did that
00:10:01
happen? It was really bad. It it I mean there was a time and we'll get to it that an orphanage closed nearby and 20
00:10:09
orphans were just written down in documentation as being mentally ill to be put into this place cuz they didn't
00:10:15
have anywhere else to put them. Holy [ __ ] So completely, you know, uh like just like average kids happen to be
00:10:24
orphans, don't have any illnesses to that we could see. We're just put in this place to be forgotten about.
00:10:32
Yeah. So, this is huge. This place is gigantic. It has 30 structures. It covers 250 acres. Damn. It's kind of in
00:10:40
the middle of nowhere in a forest. Like, it's definitely pushed off, which a lot
00:10:45
of these places usually were. Yeah. Uh on the entryway into the main building, and it's still there, there's a bronze
00:10:52
plaque that says, "Yet while I live, let me not live in vain." Which is chilling
00:10:58
because all of them did. Yeah. like they did not follow that, right? At the height of its operation, it had over a
00:11:04
thousand patients, which they were referring to as inmates at the time. Way overcrowded. Way overcrowded. When it
00:11:13
initially opened in the 20s, and this is what's wild, it was it was initially created as like a progressive farm
00:11:19
colony style thing. Like they had opened it as an institution, but what they wanted to do was make it more like a
00:11:26
wellness thing. They wanted to actually help these kids and these young adults like grow and thrive and like nourish
00:11:32
them therapy. Yeah. Like truly make it like a wellness thing. In the beginning, they were learning life skills, farm
00:11:38
skills. They were like doing work and training for certain things and having like a real feeling of being part of a
00:11:44
community. They were providing for the community as well with the farming stuff. So like they were they were given
00:11:49
purpose. Like yeah, everything there was supposed to be like super chill. There was a lot there too in the beginning.
00:11:55
There was basketball courts, a baseball field. They would publish the scores of the baseball games in the papers
00:12:01
sometimes at first. Oh, that's cool. So, initially this was like great and it was
00:12:07
being like held up as like this great place like great stories were coming out. I mean, they had theaters there,
00:12:12
they had a gym, they had all kinds of things to keep the patients busy and active and their minds working. How did
00:12:17
it all go together? Everything was calm and nurturing. Well, in the 1960s, the funding started to be pulled
00:12:25
back. And once the funding got pulled back, the asylum was suffering. They started to take in people outside of the
00:12:31
way outside of the parameters. Mostly, like I said, without their family's consent. Some of them were like
00:12:36
basically kidnapped. Like people with epilepsy were put here. People with just hearing problems. What? Uh people with
00:12:44
tuberculosis. Oh my god. kids, the kids from the orphanages without any known disabilities. According to Ghost
00:12:52
Adventures in the 70s, there was a lawsuit about this. Uh, but I'll get into these lawsuits too because they
00:12:58
were wild. But like nothing fixed anything even these lawsuits. Yeah, it is pretty plausible. But like they
00:13:05
didn't fix anything. Mistress Wednesday. Okay. Whoa. Your leg, honey. I'm sorry.
00:13:14
Why? He said mistress. Mistress Wednesday, your leg. You better put your legs back up. Mine are exposed. God
00:13:21
damn. Well, that that's your man. That's your polter man. I think there might be
00:13:26
two in there. Two manses. Uh so yeah, they kept on taking patients. Um you know, like I said, of all different
00:13:35
kinds, like people who didn't wouldn't necessarily be quote unquote institutionalized. Sure. Um, and you
00:13:42
know, now the recreation programs were being cut. Like it wasn't this nurturing farming community anymore that they were
00:13:49
learning things. It became crazy overcrowded. Um, they were not being monitored monitored. They were not being
00:13:56
stimulated in any way, shape or form. They would just leave them to just like wander around doing nothing. Monster.
00:14:03
That is like me. I do like you. They are monsters. Uh they would end up being like sexually assaulted, physically
00:14:12
assaulted by staff, by other patients. Like it was a literal it was a hell house. Like it is called a hell house.
00:14:20
Yeah. It's awful. And the only attention these patients were receiving at this point like they were being totally
00:14:26
neglected. And if they did get attention, it was abuse. That's all it was. That's all the attention that they
00:14:32
were getting. And so staff was also being replaced with completely unqualified people. uh they were
00:14:38
allowing doctors with suspended licenses to continue working there. Meaning the state of Maryland had deemed these
00:14:44
people not suitable to practice medicine anymore and yeah what I agree yeah it's
00:14:52
nuts. Nicholas gets it. Uh again they were the abuse was widespread and it was awful. Uh aspiration pneumonia was a
00:15:02
leading cause of death there. Oh. uh which happens when and especially in this kind of environment when feeding
00:15:07
procedures are basically not being followed safely uh safely. They would force-feed patients. They would feed
00:15:14
people laying down often times. Oh my god. They would use improper feeding tubes. Like they in fact the laying down
00:15:21
while feeding was like a thing. Like they were constantly being fed while laying flat on their back. So stupid.
00:15:28
Yeah, that is stupid. Nicholas, this is wild how he's like legitimately responding. He's really kind of freaking
00:15:34
me out. Yeah, that is stupid. But no, like it's also just [ __ ] like diabolical. You don't need to do that.
00:15:40
It's senseless. And it's like how is nobody training them to do a better job like to learn feeding procedures that
00:15:48
would cost money. Yeah, exactly. Now, deaths from neglect and torture were just skyrocketing at this point. There
00:15:55
was also punishments like they would be, you know, thrown into rooms by themselves and left there for days. They
00:16:00
would be hit with bats. They would end up with missing teeth. They would be hit with belts. Like horrible [ __ ] Horrible
00:16:07
[ __ ] Um, Mayor Vincent Gray, the director of the DC Department of Human Services at the time. Were there human
00:16:15
services at the time? Well, he said he was forever haunted by the place and the sites that were seen even from the
00:16:21
outside there. So, he said the place was inhumane. It was a very negative experience. And he told the Washington
00:16:27
Washington Examiner his most vivid memory of the place was seeing, and this is very upsetting just so everyone
00:16:33
knows, was seeing nude residents paraded outdoors to be hosed down by staff members. Oh my god, you have to be
00:16:41
demonic to do to somebody. You have to be demonic. So, a Washington Post article, um, there was a quote in there
00:16:48
that said, "Workers here because of frustration and lack of help tend to abuse residents. Of all of our
00:16:54
residents, I'd add some 400 don't belong here. Yeah, that's that's difficult. It
00:16:59
is difficult. That's not frustration or lack of help, though. That's lack of humanity. Exactly. You can't claim over
00:17:05
stimulation and frustration like control yourself. Right. Uh in many incidents, the facility is contributing to the
00:17:12
handicap. So they're saying like a lot of times these people aren't coming in here with any issues, but they are
00:17:19
creating issues while they're here. Medical experiments were happening. They were putting them naked in freezing cold
00:17:25
baths. What the [ __ ] Um, which often caused the deaths. Some death certificates would say quiet. Uh, some
00:17:31
death certificates would say they died from burns. Oh. Which is awful. Uh, tons of patients
00:17:37
were crowded into padded rooms together and left for days with no food, nowhere to sit, nothing to do. Um, they also
00:17:44
used um they utilized like adult cribs where they would strap them in there and they wouldn't be able to leave. That's
00:17:50
really sad. There was also a morg in the basement obviously because these places
00:17:53
have to have one. That makes sense. But this one was like one that they could like expedite. If someone died, they
00:17:59
would just rush them on down there and scoot them out to get buried with no one looking. Yeah. Uh and they were buried
00:18:05
in unmarked graves in a big field right on the property. Mass graves. Like tons. That
00:18:13
is so [ __ ] up. Nothing. And it's very creepy now because if you look at like aerial shots of this place or if you go
00:18:21
there, which by the way, you can't legally go there. You have to get permission to go there now. It's like a
00:18:26
government area and it's uh patrolled by security guards. Okay. And it's also like highly dangerous. If you watch the
00:18:32
Sam and Colby video, they literally had to like dodge security guards. Like don't do that. Yeah.
00:18:39
But like they it's you'll get in big trouble now. So I don't want to send anyone there. But if you were to get
00:18:45
permission to be on these grounds, you would see um that there's depressions in the field that's the cemetery um where
00:18:51
these people were buried side by side like hundreds of them. It's so difficult. It's weird you keep saying
00:18:57
that. I know. And they're all like side by side in rows and it's like erosion is
00:19:02
happening so it's starting to show where the graves are. It's very spooky. uh a woman named Tina Simmons from the Laurel
00:19:10
Historical Society. Uh she worked in genealogy. She has done a ton of research naming these people, like
00:19:16
finding out who these people were. Oh, good for her. Finding their graves. And she had found 16 individuals that like
00:19:24
um there's a monument to these people that was finally erected. Uh but she found 16 people who are not listed on
00:19:32
that monument that like weren't listed. So they don't know who they are. You do the monument, right? Yeah. like there I
00:19:37
have no idea. Um but she found deaths um cuz she found all these death certificates for these people. These
00:19:44
deaths in this institution range from 3 hours old. So somebody 3 hours old Oh wow. to 65 years old. What the [ __ ] And
00:19:54
the 3 hours old ones they said those are very nefarious because that means somebody either entered in pregnant
00:20:01
which was rare or something happened in there that they became pregnant. Uh-huh.
00:20:06
And it's like that's scary. That's like there was so much sexual abuse in here. Um if you are looking it up sometimes
00:20:13
this cemetery, this makeshift cemetery is called the District Training School Cemetery. Uh the first recorded death
00:20:19
here. Um but and it was recorded according to the Laurel Historical Society was 1928. So 3 years after they
00:20:26
opened. Uh in 1950, this is just an interesting one that I found in a newspaper. Uh, two boys, Arthur Swan,
00:20:34
who was 16 years old, and Raymond Thorne, who was 17, escaped from the institution after stealing a rifle from
00:20:41
an employese's locker. Damn. They left for a night, and then Arthur returned the next day without Raymond. Huh. The
00:20:49
director said he wasn't super concerned when they ran off because especially Arthur was a quote regular absconder, so
00:20:56
he would he would escape a lot. Okay. When Arthur came back, he started teasing and hinting that he quote knew
00:21:02
where there was a dead body. Oh. They ignored this for a while, but then they called the authorities finally when he
00:21:08
started like really ramping these things up, and they were able to locate the murdered body of Raymond Thorne, who he
00:21:15
had run away with. He had killed him with the rifle, left the rifle on top of him, and just like dumped him in the
00:21:21
woods. Yeah. Now again in the early 50 uh 50s Geraldine Griggs who was a 15-year-old
00:21:28
patient at the institution was paralyzed. She had gone in paralyzed. She will touch you.
00:21:35
I don't like that. That one wasn't good. No, Nicholas. I didn't like that one. Nicholas, stop it. Take step back. That
00:21:43
one was upsetting. Yeah. Um this one is horrifying because this this nurse never
00:21:50
really faced charges for this. Oh, what'd she do? Um, she was 15 years old. She was paralyzed. She drowned in a
00:21:56
bathtub. Uh, so a nurse, Elsie Stanbach, put her in the tub and then left her alone to take care of another patient.
00:22:03
And Geraldine drowned. She's paralyzed. You can't leave. What are you doing putting a paralyzed young girl in a tub
00:22:11
and leaving her there? Oh my god. If something happens, she can't move to get herself above the water. What are you
00:22:18
doing? This should be pretty common sense. Uh, charges were brought, but they were dropped and she resigned. But
00:22:25
like, LC girl, that kind of [ __ ] was pretty regular. In 1970, and this is really awful, just to tell you, um, a
00:22:34
young 8-year-old girl named Joy Evans was sent here because she required 24-hour care, and her parents had to
00:22:40
work and couldn't provide it. Her mother, Betty, said when she was first sent there, she almost immediately
00:22:45
started seeing issues happening. She would find injuries on Joy like chipped teeth to scratches, lacerations, bruises
00:22:52
all over her. Get her out. One horrific thing was that Joyy's back, she said, was raw because she would be strapped to
00:22:58
a rubber sheet and her back was raw from urine burns cuz they would just leave her there to lay in it. How do you do
00:23:05
that to anybody, let alone an 8-year-old? And she The thing is, her parents couldn't get her out of there
00:23:11
because sometimes once you would institutionalize someone, they like wouldn't give them back to you. What?
00:23:16
Yeah. And also like they still couldn't do the 24-hour care. Uh she died there as a as a teenager of aspiration,
00:23:25
meaning she was fed improperly lying down and choked to death. That's horrific. Yeah. Betty, the mother, wrote
00:23:32
in an affidavit, "Dogwood, the cottage where Joy lived, was a veritable snake pit. I once witnessed a nurse open the
00:23:38
cottage door only to find 80 half-clad screaming women come running to the door. The nurse quickly closed it.
00:23:47
Say Nicholas. You just said Nicholas again. That's weird. No, that's crazy. That was like two, three weeks ago. That
00:23:55
was did that episode. Yeah, that's really weird. So they she just shut the door on like they all came running
00:24:01
towards the door to try to get out and she just closed the door and walked away like just like I'm not dealing with
00:24:06
that. Oh my god. And a mother later said once committed to Forest Haven, the only
00:24:12
way out is to die. Oh, that's chilling. In the mid70s, this is when the families
00:24:18
filed a class action lawsuit against the institution for how they were treating their children and family members. And
00:24:23
the lawsuit said Forest Haven, intended as a facility for treatment, education, and training, subjects residents to
00:24:30
physical or sexual abuse, provides virtually no treatment, has no training program, and neglects basic medical
00:24:37
care, to say the least. The Department of Justice got involved, and more court cases came in, but things just got worse
00:24:42
for a bit. The lawsuit stated at one point staff members locked dozens of residents naked except for adult diapers
00:24:50
in rooms stripped of furniture other than wooden benches. Like why? You have to be like an actual monster to do that.
00:25:00
Like you literally have to find some kind of something out of that. You do. Like you really have to be you that's
00:25:05
not even being like you have to either be entirely detached from humanity which means you are a monster. Yep. or you
00:25:13
have to find some kind of enjoyment out of it. Both ends are just the worst kind
00:25:17
of person. Now, as it went into the 80s, there was way more deaths occurring very
00:25:23
rapidly in succession, and they were really tragic deaths. They would strap, you know, patients to beds and just
00:25:28
leave them to die at times. Finally, in 1991, the institution shuttered. Can't believe it was open that long. Yeah. And
00:25:37
it was like during these like after the lawsuit in the 70s, it was like they slowly started moving patients into
00:25:44
different group homes because there that was their solution was like we got to shut this place down but we can't just
00:25:49
like once everyone out at traumatized cuz there's over a thousand patients in there. So they were doing it slowly and
00:25:54
it's like at the end there was like 15 residents left in there and they were just being complete. I mean that would
00:26:02
be perfect under normal circumstances cuz you shouldn't have that many people, right? But they were being neglected
00:26:07
too, right? Because everything was just like whatever, let's forget about it. Now, in the 80s is when the families of
00:26:15
those who died funded that like big stone memorial marker that I told you about. Yeah. And it had
00:26:21
391 names of children's and children and adults who died there. Wow. And this area is called the garden of eternal
00:26:28
rest. Now, um, if you were to go there now after getting permission to go there, uh, everything is left behind. I
00:26:37
mean, suitcases, toys, clothing, paperwork, medical devices, equipment. That's so it's all there. There photos
00:26:43
of people, of kids in the facility. Oh, a ton of shoes, like baby shoes. Oh, kids shoes, slippers,
00:26:53
high heels, like all kinds of shoes. It's very stressful. Um, again, it is patrolled by guards. Um, apparently it's
00:27:00
all very dense woods around it. You have to do like hiking through it. And then you just like come upon it. Like
00:27:06
everyone says it's like all woods, all woods, all woods. And then you like come to this point where it just appears like
00:27:12
it's like a jump scare. That's scary. Yeah, that is scary. Now, of course, with a history like this, it's going to
00:27:19
have hauntings. I mean, yeah. I mean, it's be rife with hauntings. It is. There's a there's crazy. I mean, you you
00:27:27
go in here supposedly a lot of people hear screaming and groaning like people like people say legit people crying and
00:27:35
begging for help out of rooms and when they go and this place is completely experiment
00:27:40
experiment. What the [ __ ] That's literally Yeah. was happening because of these they would do
00:27:47
medical experiments on these people and they're all and that's why they were screaming. You can hear that [ __ ]
00:27:53
People hear gurnies being pushed down the wall, like the squeaking of gurnies. Something about I literally just got
00:27:58
goosebumps from that. Yep. People People often hear the um the morg door cuz the
00:28:04
morg's in the basement obviously. They hear the morg door slam. Oh, and when they like no one else is in there, just
00:28:10
residual hauntings. And uh they one of the things people really talk about is just the intense feeling of dread in
00:28:18
that place. People say it's like sadness is something you can touch in there. Like it is so depressing in this place.
00:28:25
Like sadness has permeated every part of this place. It's not the kind of place I
00:28:29
would want to investigate. It looks scary. I want to now I want to like hear from people who have investigated this
00:28:34
people. I want to talk to them. Yeah. I want to know like what the feeling was here. Now a lot of people report feeling
00:28:41
someone with very cold hands grab them or just touch them in the hallways, which also like you always think of like
00:28:47
doctors having cold hands. Like that's like a thing. Yes. And it just makes me think of like doctors and cold hands. I
00:28:53
don't like I don't like that. There's a clinical smell like a antiseptic kind of
00:28:58
smell that will sometimes happen. Like a hospital. Yeah. Like a very hospital type s or that like musty hospital
00:29:04
smell, you know, like Yeah. Um EVPs from this place go crazy. I mean it's like there you look them up. Go ahead look on
00:29:11
YouTube and all that. There's tons of EVPs. Um Charm City Paranormal is one in particular. They did a really good I've
00:29:18
never I haven't like watched any of their other videos so I know nothing about them. Uh but I do know this one
00:29:24
video I watched was very well put together and they did like a very deep dive on the history and stuff which
00:29:31
makes me think that they like really care about these places they go to. Yeah, of course. Um, so they visited
00:29:36
this place and when they were there they caught like crazy EVPs and there were like voices when they'd walk through
00:29:42
hallways of things like um one was I wanted you to find me Michael. Oh. And one of them was please take John. Oh.
00:29:50
Which makes me think of like somebody bringing their family member in and saying like please take him. Yeah. Which
00:29:56
like like I just got full chills from that. But Nicholas, I don't know what you think, but uh that that freaked me
00:30:03
out. And it's I've I highly recommend looking up those kind of like investigations that people have done
00:30:08
here. Yeah. Look up the Sam and Colby one and look up the Charm City Paranormal one. Those are the ones I I
00:30:15
took a peek at. Damn. Um but yeah, it's a wild just knowing that there is a makeshift graveyard, mass grave on site
00:30:25
that they have proven like it is 100% there. This is not like rumor. This isn't one of those things that they're
00:30:30
like, "They think there's bodies." Nope. They know there's bodies there. Uh they're all listed out. And on the the
00:30:36
marker, they are listed in the order of when they died and they're listed in the
00:30:42
order of where they are buried. How do they know? Um they were able to go through and I guess they had like um
00:30:50
some of them have markers but they're like buried in the ground and they're just like a a little marker with like a
00:30:56
number on it or like an initial or something. Don't leave me. Oh, said don't leave me. He said don't leave me.
00:31:04
Oh yeah, Nicholas. I was just thinking it's sad that they had to stay there. Like it's sad that they couldn't
00:31:09
obviously there's way too many bodies to exume and that's like a whole Oh, it's awful. the whole thing. It's awful to
00:31:15
think about. It's just sad that they're stuck there. Yeah. Like that's their resting place is this awful nightmare
00:31:21
and like the building where all that stuff happened to them is right there. Yeah. It makes me want to cry. It is.
00:31:26
It's awful. Very sad. I know. I'm sorry. It was just It was one of those that I looked at and I was like, I have to tell
00:31:31
this story cuz this is a horrific story and it's one that I'd never heard of. Thank goodness it closed. [ __ ] that
00:31:38
place. Yeah. It always closed. 1991 it was officially closed. open for like 70 years. Yeah. And it's it's really sad to
00:31:46
think about like the people's intention who got together and wanted to make that
00:31:51
a great place and like had the the baseball games and had, you know, let's let's teach people how to farm and give
00:31:57
back to the community. Like it started with such pure intentions. That's the thing. It seemed like they really wanted
00:32:02
that place to be like a place where people could thrive and get better. It just shows you when you take away
00:32:06
funding from things that matter. Yeah. Things get real [ __ ] up. It's true. which is so sad. I hate that. But yeah,
00:32:13
that is Forest Haven Asylum. Damn. Well, I'm taking us back to Massachusetts. Cool. Bring us here. We're going to
00:32:21
Lester. Lester. Lester. In Lester, Mass. There is a Quaker cemetery that dates all the way back to the 1700s. Wo.
00:32:30
Officially, the cemetery is known as Friend Cemetery. And still to this day, it's actually run by the local Quaker
00:32:36
community who are now called Worcester Friends Meeting. Worcester. Worusta, but to many, it's better known
00:32:43
as Spider Gates Cemetery. I knew I'd heard of this one. Spider Gates Cemetery. And it's said not only to be
00:32:50
haunted as [ __ ] but also to be the eighth gate to hell. Oh [ __ ] Ghost to Hades. Apparently, the other seven are
00:33:01
at uh various locations spread throughout the country. I don't know where they are. Oh, I want to know where
00:33:06
that is. Uh, but this here cemetery is kind of like the final boss. Oh [ __ ] Yeah. Once you're once you get to this
00:33:13
one, eighth. Boom. Hell. You're on your way. Yeah. I don't understand. Yeah. Why
00:33:20
you would want that? Yeah. I don't know, right? That's I mean Yeah. I mean, maybe like shit's tough.
00:33:26
You're curious. Yeah. Well, first things first, the cemetery got its nickname, Spider Gates, if you can imagine, from
00:33:33
its gates. From the gates. Yeah. The design that repeats through each panel was actually designed to be sunrays done
00:33:40
in kind of like an art deco style, but people think that they look like spiders more than anything else. And I kind of
00:33:45
agree if you look up a picture. Yeah, I think so, too. Um, unfortunately though,
00:33:50
the original gates aren't actually even there anymore because they got stolen. Oh [ __ ] Which is fake as [ __ ] Who
00:33:56
would steal those? Me. No, I would I don't steal things. But like I don't want those. I don't want those. They're
00:34:02
gorge. They are. But like, but don't steal. They're a cemetery gate. Exactly. Hollow ground. That's hallowed ground.
00:34:08
That's [ __ ] up. You don't steal from Yeah. You can't do that. Well, and the thing that sucks even more is that when
00:34:12
they got replaced, people vandalized them and graffitied them so often that the Lester Historical Society said,
00:34:18
"Okay, fine. You don't get them anymore and now they're safely storing the gates. Um, they had them removed in I
00:34:24
think it was back in 2022." I was just going to say it was it must have been recent. It was. Yeah. Um, but they've
00:34:30
been working out a plan on how to properly display the gates somewhere else most likely. As they should. Yeah.
00:34:35
So, they're working on something uh like a big project right now that's supposed
00:34:38
to be done in spring of this year. And then I think that's their next project is figuring out the gates. Figuring out
00:34:44
those [ __ ] gates. Just in case you were worried. But anyway, I was worried. When you first walk into the cemetery,
00:34:49
this is really sad. There's an oak tree off to the side. And legend has it that a young boy hanged himself on that tree
00:34:57
back in the 40s. Ooh. And for a while, people said that if you visited the cemetery, you would still see a line of
00:35:03
rope hanging from the tree, which is like [ __ ] But people who have visited recently say they don't see the rope
00:35:10
anymore. Um, but people do claim to hear voices in that particular area and see shadows. Damn. Yeah, that's scary. Now,
00:35:18
in the center there's a whole section. You're welcome. You said that's scary. Nicholas said you're welcome. Thanks,
00:35:24
bro. In the center there's a whole section of land that just never grows grass. Oh,
00:35:31
those are always the scary things. Like what what the [ __ ] up there, Kyle? Why? Why, Kyle? What's going on? Well,
00:35:37
apparently the old Quaker meeting house used to stand on this exact area. Which is interesting. But now it's just
00:35:43
surrounded by four posts made from stone and like a ton of large trees. Ooh. Which like maybe it has something to do
00:35:51
with the trees like blocking the sun. I don't know. I think that's pretty [ __ ] scary. I think that's scary.
00:35:56
Plenty of places have trees that are blocking. It's true. And they still grow grass. It's true. This place, not so
00:36:01
much. Not so much. Um, but like I said, people call it the altar, and they say it's a place where some seriously
00:36:07
nefarious people have come throughout the years to perform satanic sacrifices and
00:36:15
rituals. You know, my personal favorite legend uh connected to this cemetery is that of Marmaduke Earl. Let's go. Which
00:36:24
I'm probably going to name my future child. Let's go. Mr. Earl, if you're nasty, was buried all the way back in
00:36:31
1839. Damn. Legend has it that if you find his grave at midnight on the dot, circle it 10 times, then say aloud,
00:36:40
"Mama Duke, speak to me." And then you press your ear to his tombstone, he will speak to you. Oh, no. I don't know what
00:36:48
he says. Because every account I I saw, they said they didn't hear anything, but
00:36:54
people have said they have, but they won't say what Marmma told them. I'm not kid. I'm not going to lie. I
00:37:01
that I want to know what he has to say. I do as well. I desperately want to know
00:37:05
what he has to say. Well, you're not alone, girlfriend, because people do this so often that the area around his
00:37:11
grave also has no grass. Yeah, cuz it's just like trampled down. Yeah, it's literally trampled down. Um, there's
00:37:17
also a river on the property that a lot of people think is the river Sticks. Of course, of course. That river comes
00:37:25
from Greek mythology if you didn't know. And actually, it's very interesting. Oh,
00:37:29
I love this like tale. It's cool. Sticks is not just a river, but a goddess. Get
00:37:35
you a girl who could do both. Be a river and a goddess. Hello. She was the daughter of Ocean Oianis and was said to
00:37:42
be given onetenth of his water. And that water became a portal to hell to Hades.
00:37:49
To Hades. So that river being on this property pretty much lends itself to the fact that people think it's a portal or
00:37:55
gate to hell. Let's go really see what you did there. Hell yeah. It's [ __ ] metal. A lot of people who visit
00:38:01
Spidergate Cemetery will leave coins in or near the river to pay another figure from Greek mythology, Kaon, who it's
00:38:09
like kind of fair if you're nasty as well. Oh yeah, he's the fairyman. Yeah, I love that tale. I think Greek
00:38:14
mythology is cool. Greek mythology is super cool. We spent a lot of time on it in um like seventh grade and I remember
00:38:21
just getting like interested in this book. It's fascinating. It is. Um but so he's the fairyman who will guide you to
00:38:27
hell, but only if you give him a coin. He does not guide for free. No way. And if you show up with the intention of
00:38:32
heading to hell and you don't have payment, I don't recommend that personally because they say that if you
00:38:38
do that to the fairyman, he will [ __ ] you up and you will have to wander around the river. The shore river. The
00:38:44
river. The shore of the river. All of it. I'm all [ __ ] up right now. For over You didn't bring up a co for over a
00:38:52
hundred years. No, just wandering the shore of the river and the river. Shore. Wow. The shore river. No, that's I mean
00:38:59
I don't blame him because it's like he provides a service that you cannot provide yourself. Yeah. And it's not
00:39:04
like so don't expect him to do it for free. He can't contact a local lawyer. Yeah. So it's like come on. I just want
00:39:11
to say it's a little bit fake that Nicholas was like commenting a lot on your story but not on mine. I'm telling
00:39:16
you we are we have a connection. Yeah. I just wanted you to know that Nicholas. Okay. I'm feeling a little bit left out.
00:39:23
Are you sure you turned it back on? Nicholas, do you like me better? Oh, honey, put them up. Anyways, a woman
00:39:29
named April spoke with the Worcester Telegram and Gazette about an experience she had while poking around the
00:39:34
cemetery, and she told them, "I would definitely say the feel of the cemetery and surrounding area was spookier in the
00:39:40
evening compared with midday." Of course, April. She said, "Maybe it was because that time it was just my
00:39:46
daughter and me alone. Maybe it was the failing light. Lots of sounds in the woods. Both of us thought we saw another
00:39:52
cemeter another cemetery area down the path that leads to the river, but we didn't go down there. The next day, we
00:39:58
did walk the path and there was no second cemetery. Only a path in a river. I later read some lore for Spidergates
00:40:05
that says you will see a second cemetery once, but never again. That's cool. Isn't that [ __ ] rad? And that is
00:40:15
something that is reported on a lot. A ton of people say they go they will see like another cemetery in the distance,
00:40:21
but it's hard to get to and then they'll go back to be like, "Oh my god, no. I'm
00:40:25
like, I'm telling you, I saw that and it's not there." Oh, that's cool. I wonder what the significance of that is.
00:40:31
I think it's just like hellacious. It's just shenanigans. Yeah, it's just fun. It's just hellisha shenanigans, you
00:40:37
know? It's just like Hades being Hades. She also said that the second day they went back cuz I think she went back to
00:40:43
be like, "Am I going to see this again?" Yeah. Um, and when they were by the river, she said she swore she heard a
00:40:48
woman's voice. Which is another thing that's reported on a lot. A lot of people say that they
00:40:53
hear a woman's voice. And I couldn't find anything to substantiate this. It's really sad though. People say that a
00:41:00
woman was murdered in a cave nearby and dismembered. Oh [ __ ] Like way back when. But again, couldn't find anything
00:41:06
on it. Okay. But people do hear a woman screaming a lot. Damn. When they visit here. That's scary. Yeah. Um, and then
00:41:13
honorable mention goes to the mysterious rock formations that people will see with runes on them. That is so
00:41:19
Massachusetts. I can't even stand it. We love a rock wall. We love stones here. Stones. We just love rocks. Do you know
00:41:27
that I was literally thinking about putting a stone wall up in my like home like in my yard? Yeah, stones are our
00:41:33
thing. I like stones. It also affects the uh idiotic. Did he just say idiotic? I sure did. I
00:41:42
will not have this. I will not have this. He said that's stupid as [ __ ] He doesn't like stones. Okay. He didn't
00:41:50
like your idea. No, he doesn't like stones. Listen, I'm not going to be bullied and help. Yeah, you're going to
00:41:58
need it. So, Nicholas, I'm on your side. No, but um stones [ __ ] up. Like, isn't
00:42:04
it like the radon levels or something like that? Isn't that why the radon levels are so high in like
00:42:09
Massachusetts? Yeah, because we have like a lot of stone in the ground. Yeah, exactly. Stones. Stones. Um, honorable
00:42:15
mention also goes to the white ooze that visitors have seen emerging from random
00:42:20
spots in the earth. I don't like that. In the cemetery. I don't like that. It's pretty gross. And of course, the demon
00:42:25
creature said to be living in the surrounding forest. Failure. Yeah. Turn him off. Turn Why am I being
00:42:35
bullied? Like, let's just call me a failure. seen this [ __ ] during years. He literally has. Why are you being so mean
00:42:41
to Ash? Why being mean to me? Nicholas, don't be mean to Ash, okay? That won't that won't work. It won't endear you to
00:42:48
Elena. And I'm also going to have to like revisit this in therapy. Okay. Um, but anyway, don't make fun of anything
00:42:56
when I say this, Nicholas, because this is a listener tale that I found from one
00:42:59
of our good ass precious listeners, Nicholas. Nicholas. So, one of our listeners went here and had some crazy
00:43:07
experiences. Oh, girl. Okay. It says, "Hey, weirdos. I am so in love with your podcast. My name is D. You can use it."
00:43:14
Thanks, D. Hey, D. I'm a true crime enthusiast and I have to say out of all the podcasts I've listened to, yours is
00:43:19
by far the best. Oh, thanks. Thank you. You're beautiful. D says, "And I'm saying that with my whole chest, ass,
00:43:26
tits, everything." Thank you. I'm a fellow Mass Hole and I feel so connected when y'all talk about spooky references
00:43:32
or locations in Mass. However, there is one place I haven't heard you mention yet until now. I'm still catching up on
00:43:38
the pod, so if you have, please forgive me. You're forgiven. Spidergate Cemetery
00:43:43
uh was built in the 1700s, also known as the eighth gate to hell. This place is known to be haunted and has super weird
00:43:49
happenings. She shared some spooky facts, but I already told them, so um let me get to the story. D says, "I am a
00:43:56
full-out spooky [ __ ] all year round. I absolutely love fall. Yes, Halloween and
00:44:02
supernatural phenomena." I love you, D. We love you. I run into some demons back
00:44:07
in my day, but that's a story for another time. I feel you. What a casual sentence. Haven't we all? So, yeah. So,
00:44:12
here we go. I'm in my single hoe phase because a literal garbage human did me dirty. Oh, [ __ ] that. I found nudes of
00:44:18
another girl on his Nintendo DS. Shut the [ __ ] up. You dodged a [ __ ] bullet, my friend. Solid. Solid. That's
00:44:27
a See, Nicholas is like, "Yep, yep." I agree with you, Nicholas. Yes, you read that right. Pick up.
00:44:37
I am getting angry. I am getting angry. Nicholas, you can't make this [ __ ] up.
00:44:46
He's being so mean. You're friends with a bully. Your poltergeist mans is a bully.
00:44:52
Oh, all right. Yes, he read that right. Is having a bad day. Maybe. No, maybe he
00:44:56
meant stop. Like, that's crazy. Like, she found nudes on a DS. None. Yes, he read that right. Pixelated pictures of a
00:45:03
girl's bare ass on a [ __ ] DS. A grown ass man. So, yeah, I was done trying to find love and I hopped on Tinder. What
00:45:10
can I say? I was having a moment. That's where I met my date. We were supposed to
00:45:13
be a hookup, but eventually my hopeless romantic tendencies started to creep up.
00:45:17
But I fell for this guy. And the voice of that GTA character. Oh [ __ ] here we go again. I don't know that guy's voice.
00:45:23
I'm sorry. At this point, we've been dating for about a month and he knows how much I love spooky [ __ ] So, he
00:45:28
suggested we have a date at night in Spidergate Cemetery. Wow, that's a keeper. I know. I hope he was good to
00:45:34
you. Oh, just wait. Okay, y'all are probably thinking, "You dumb [ __ ] You just met this guy and you're letting him
00:45:39
take you to a cemetery in the woods." Meanwhile, I'm like, "Nailed it." Elena's like, "You should have gone."
00:45:44
Looking back, I realize how dangerous that was. But at the end of the story, it will make it all okay. I promise.
00:45:50
Okay. I didn't know much about spidergates, only that it was a haunted cemetery, but of course I agreed to go
00:45:55
there as any spooky [ __ ] would. Hell yeah. Keep in mind, it's super dark outside. 1:00 a.m. Oh, damn. The only
00:46:01
light came from the moon. We arrive at the trail that leads to spider gates. I had to use a flashlight on my phone to
00:46:06
see where we were stepping. We eventually reached the gates, and as soon as I saw them, I got goosebumps.
00:46:11
Goosebumps. My date opens them and gestures for me to walk in. It seemed like the moon shined the brightest
00:46:16
within the field of tombstones. Then he walked in and shut the gate behind him and told me, "You have to make sure the
00:46:22
gates are closed when you enter and when you leave so that the spirits don't escape." Oh, girls. I love that he knew
00:46:29
that. Yeah. He's just out here spitting knowledge about this cemetery. He's like, "Just so you know." He said, "From
00:46:33
one spooky [ __ ] to another." Yeah. He said, "Contain them." Yeah. He said, "Girls." I could feel poop knocking on
00:46:39
the back door. I was so [ __ ] scared. We both walked together toward the center of the cemetery where the grass
00:46:44
seemed to stop growing. Ooh, the altar. It was dead quiet. I could feel the wind
00:46:49
blowing, but I didn't hear trees rustling. Even as we walked, I could not hear our footsteps. It was such a
00:46:54
strange feeling. We stood in the center and looked up at the moon and stars. Not
00:46:58
going to lie, that [ __ ] was scary as [ __ ] but also super romantic at the time. Yeah. We stood in a quiet, please
00:47:03
go. What did he say? Please go. Please go. He doesn't want them to get hurt. He's like, "Leave." Yeah. We stood in
00:47:10
the quiet embrace for what seemed like an hour. As I was hugging him, I looked over his shoulder to the treeine and I
00:47:15
saw it. A foggy mist lingering among the trees resembling a human form. Oh, a [ __ ] has a stigmatism, so I didn't want
00:47:22
to react right away. I don't. I closed my eyes and opened them again, and the mist was gone. I brushed it off
00:47:28
considering I can't read the license plate of a car that's in front of me when I'm sitting in traffic. We let go
00:47:33
of each other and started walking around toward to look at the tombstones. My date is now on the other side of the
00:47:38
cemetery exploring. And as I bent down to read a name, I felt a hand go across my lower back softly. Oh. I jumped up
00:47:46
expecting to see my date, but he was still on the other side. Oh, goodbye. Lit. Literally. Goodbye. A shiver went down
00:47:55
my back, through my crack, and around the corner. I had never in my life been touched by a spirit, and it was the most
00:48:01
natural yet unnatural feeling ever. That's when I ran over to my date and told him what happened with the mist and
00:48:06
with the touch. He was so amused while I was just [ __ ] myself. So, we took one last walk around the tombstones and
00:48:12
decided it was time to leave. As we were heading toward the exit, I heard a scream coming from the forest. Oh. From
00:48:19
what sounded like a little girl. I looked at my date with eyes popping out of my head and said, "Did you [ __ ]
00:48:24
hear that?" And he looked at me dead in my eyes and chuckles, saying, "Stop trying to scare me. It's not going to
00:48:29
work." She said, "I swear on my life I just heard a girl scream." He got serious and promised me that he didn't
00:48:36
hear it, though. We both agreed it must have been some kind of spirit. If we had
00:48:39
both heard it, I would have called the police, obviously, because a girl screaming in the woods is cause for
00:48:43
concern. Yeah. As we left, I made sure those damn gates were shut. I said a small prayer to the spir so that the
00:48:50
spirits wouldn't stick to me and we were out. 5 years later, my date is now my husband. Oh, I knew it. I felt that in
00:48:58
my bones. I knew it cuz I read it. But I just knew it. Oh, I just knew it. It was
00:49:02
beautiful. I got pregnant on our honeymoon and my due date is December 2022. So, this was written like a while
00:49:07
ago. Oh my goodness. Congratulations. Um, to this day I talk about that experience with my husband and he still
00:49:14
laughs at how freaked out I got. But it's okay. I get him back with my constant jump scares and by hiding his
00:49:19
video game controller. Hope y'all enjoyed my story. I love it. Dgate Cemetery. I want to go to
00:49:28
Spidergate Cemetery. I do too because to talk to Marmadoo girl. Yeah, I need to.
00:49:33
And I need to hear what he has to say to me. I do too. Like I don't know. And I don't think I'll pay the furry men
00:49:37
because I'm not trying to go to hell. I'm not trying to go to hell right now. Right now. She said she just wanted to
00:49:43
clarifying. Iconic. Well, um, thanks Nicholas for joining us. Period. Thanks Elena's friend Nicholas. Thanks
00:49:57
Nicholas. Do you have anything any last comments that you want to leave everybody with? Nicholas, do you have
00:50:04
anything nice to say? Understand? Understand? Do you understand that I'm mad at you? I
00:50:12
do not understand. Do you have anything else you want to say? No. Okay. All right. We love you, Nicholas. Elena
00:50:19
loves you. I love you. I tolerate you. Oh, wow. He's being really mean to me. Mikey's face was like,
00:50:27
I'm I'm happy that he's here. It was a You had a rough day. I'm tolerant. You know, it was your first fight, too. It
00:50:33
was. Yeah. You know, went a little deeper. Yeah. Anyway, thanks for listening. We hope you keep listening
00:50:39
and we hope you keep it weird, but not so weird that you get bullied by a paranormal ghost. Thanks. Love you,
00:50:45
Nicholas. Stanic. You said static. Stanic. Stanic. What does that mean? Stanic. It's a surname.
00:50:56
Nicholas Stanic. Bad. What was bad? Tell me more. Nicholas, what is who's bad or
00:51:04
what's bad? Are you done telling us? Okay. All right. [Music]