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hey weirdos I'm Elena I'm Ash and this is [Music] morbid woo it is morbid yeah it's super morbid
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because um it's part two right yeah it's part two of Alvin and Judy Neely two [ __ ]
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monstrosities yeah this is it's a rough one I hope you guys were how you doing after part one yeah you okay I know it's
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just like this one there's not a large you know body count here but my goodness the one the victims are just first like
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to have them be children yeah and the way they do it is just like nothing it really bothered me did they go after
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another teenager child in this one um no okay but it's it's another young woman who is it's bad I mean it's sad all the
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way around to yeah it really is so when we last left you um police had found Lisa Milan's body
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13-year-old Lisa milikin yeah who was lured away from a mall when she was on an outing with a group from a home for
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neglect and abandoned girls that's so terrible and she was held for a manner I think it I
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believe it was four days that right because they were going to different motels and everything she was repeatedly
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sexually abused she was I mean she was held there who knows what else happened right and she was eventually uh injected
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with basically dishwashing products cleaning products by Judy Neely six times and then thrown into a canyon
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after being in shot in the chest did they know were they able to determine when she had been injecting her with the
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cleaning products they believe it was when she was tied to the tree outside and she didn't die right away so she was
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shot in the chest and thrown over the canyon my God yeah it's horrific it's like Unthinkable truly um
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so that's where we left you which is a pretty horrible note to leave you on um in investigators really did do their due
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diligence in this they were trying their hardest they were going after every lead
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when we talked to you in part one all the Departments are working together right now which is great and it's going
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to help them stop this quicker but unfortunately not quick enough for someone else to die okay uh so on the
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afternoon of October 3rd Diane Bobo was on her way to work at a Hardy restaurant in Rome um
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unfortunately she ran out of gas near the Thornwood school and and it was like this whole ordeal she went through where
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it was like she ran out of gas and then she tried to push the car and then she like ended up stalling in the middle of
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like this intersection she had to push the truck off the road just like going through bad morning and she called her
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husband from a pay phone and then she sat on the curb and just waited for him to come she was like you know I I gave
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it my all this thing is not starting so I need help so while she's waiting she's
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by herself she's just waiting on the curb and Diane was approached by a young woman she'd never seen before Judith uh
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she later so as Diane was later able to describe this so Diane is going to be okay um she would later describe this
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young woman as wearing clothes quote that looked too big for her and appeared as if she' hadd been wearing them for
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several days so basically Judy always looks foul when she walks up to people which I think is by Design as well as
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just by nature is she trying to look like destitute I think she's trying to look desperate for help she's trying cuz
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she looks younger she is younger so she's trying to walk up looking like somebody that's in real trouble your
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somebody will basically praying on the goodness of others yeah that's always good um and the girl said to her don't I
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know you aren't you Patricia Alexander and Diane was like I am not Patricia nor am I Alexander I am neither of those
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things um and she was like I was just hoping that she would just go away like I didn't want I had a [ __ ] start to my
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day she's like I I'm not Patricia Alexander please go away off but this girl kept looking at her and she kept
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talking to her and Diane was like can you please [ __ ] go away like I'm just waiting for my like I don't want to doal
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with this yeah and she told Diane that she had been out riding around and she was kind of lonely so she thought maybe
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Diane wanted to go for a drive with her what and Diane was like on no Planet would I want to do that and by no
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situation would I want to do that but she said also she just seemed off something about her she said her vibes
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were horrific well somebody's asking you like you know I'm just bored I wanted to
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go for a drive with someone run the [ __ ] other way get out of there she said The Vibes are just we dirty and
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then she looked over at the girl's car and she saw a child in the car because remember Judy has children oh [ __ ] I
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literally forgot that I was like why does she have a child yep and she said but this girl was telling me she was
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alone and she's lonely lonely but there's a kid in the car and she was very and Diane was like listen no I'm
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good and she was like I you know my car just broke down I got to go to work I'm not driving around with you and my
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husband is coming so like piss off and so Judy was like well no I can give you a ride to work like why don't she's get
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in my car I'll give you a ride to work and Diane was like listen are you trying so hard I just called my husband he's on
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his way and the girl got even more persistent and was like get in my car you should get in my car oh and Diane
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was like no and she finally got super firm with her and was like no [ __ ] like leave my presence I don't want to deal
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with this and finally the girl walked away and went back to her car and she drove off and Diane she drove off right
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as Diane's husband pulled up on his motorcycle thank goodness wow good timing so later that evening John
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Hancock and his 22-year-old girlfriend Janice Chapman were walking home after visiting shanice's mother they're
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walking on the side of the road when a brown car pulls up next to them no thank you the young woman driving the car told
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the couple she was new in town she didn't know anyone and she wondered if they wanted to drive around with her for
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a while I just sorry that immediately makes me think of John molan I'm new right it does I'm new in town uh John
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initially was like no thank you like bye and told the driver that they didn't actually need a ride it's fine like
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we're good cuz she was like it looks like you need a ride like I'll bring you where you need to go like we can just
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you know we'll be friends no but he looked at his girlfriend and Janice wanted to go like it was clear so the
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thing is Janice had struggled to make friends she had a lot of social issues in general so JN thought that this was
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like going to help he was like I just didn't want to discourage her if she was actually looking to like connect with
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another human being yeah he was just trying not to like you know burst bub you know all that burst her bubble her
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yum you know that's all I got so they got in the car oh no now almost immediately after getting in the car
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they noticed something was off something was off about the car something was off
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about the driver the whole situation and so the driver told had told JN and Janice again that she was new in town
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and didn't know anybody mhm but after they pull away she starts talking to a man over CB radio oh and even like that
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alone is just so creepy you get in a car with with a stranger and then they start
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talking to someone over CB radio that that's like so again we say this all the time but something that would happen in
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a movie and you be like H too much yeah and it's like this happen What do you do
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you're already in the car at this point so it's like and something about CB radio man ever since Joy Ride yeah Joy
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Ride has really and obviously Joy Ride had not come out yet so but they hadn't been driving for long when they crossed
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over into I think it's chatuga County chatuga yeah okay and the girl pulled over to the side of the road beside a
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very large very very densely forested area oh no and before he could even ask cuz he's like what the [ __ ] is going on
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before he can even ask why the hell are we stopping and pulling over next to uh a forest yeah the girl turns to JN and
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points a gun at him oh no she demands that he get out of the car and by then another car had pulled up and a large
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man got out oh my God I think we know who these two are and John was so confused had no idea what to do he
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doesn't know if this girl is going to shoot Janice shoot him shoot both of them shoot herself he doesn't know what
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the hell is happening he's like she looked serious like this was not a bluff right and so he did as he was told and
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he got in the other car he he was like I didn't know what else to do I I didn't want to put anybody in danger who knows
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what you would do in that situation so both cars drive around the area together for hours so JN is now in Alvin's car in
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Alvin's car and now she Janice is in Judy car they're driving around for hours hours until arriving at an
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isolated area John was told to get out of the car he was in once he was out of the car the girl got out of the other
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car uh and forced Jon into the woods a little ways then without warning she shot him in the back oh my God and just
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left him for dead and walked back to the car and drove off with Janet inside Janice inside oh my God just walked him
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into the Woods shot him in the back and left him there and thought he had died yep but clearly the way you're telling
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the story he did not no and it was not it wasn't very light in the woods like there was no natural light coming in and
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it was already getting dark and so Judy couldn't really see where she had shot JN okay she just assumed that whatever
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she had done there it would be enough to at least prevent him from making it out
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of the woods and that eventually he would just die cuz he wouldn't be able to find his way out of the woods cuz
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it's dark but the bullet had actually gone through his right shoulder oh my God and it had lodged in his scapula oh
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which is a very painful injury but it's not disabling okay well that's great so not that's not great but but like it's
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great that he was able to like just play for a minute play dead and then get up exactly because not long after the car
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pulled away he was able to make his way out of the woods and he flagged down a truck driver who picked him up and drove
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him to Floyd County Medical Center and and emergency room attendance were able to get the bullet out of his scapula and
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he was discharged around 4:30 a.m. just an hour and a half after arriving at the
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hospital and he talked to a sheriff's deputy immediately the way this man just got shot finds his way out of the woods
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hitchhikes to the hospital gets a bullet removed from his shoulder and after like
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what an hour and a half they're like okay bye you can leave now we'll we'll Bild your insurance then he's like cool
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I'll go to the Sheriff's Office I guess man lived a whole last life in a matter of a few hours a whole lifetime oh my
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and and he's sitting there wondering what the [ __ ] is going on with he doesn't know where Janice is wife or
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girlfriend his girlfriend girlfriend and so later that morning a sheriff's deputy
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and an agent from the Georgia Bureau of Investigation the gbi uh they visited JN
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at home to take his statement and at first they were skeptical about what they heard he was shot y'all the reason being
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that Jon had a very flat affect and very like monotone way of talking well CU he's just gone [ __ ] through it thank
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you today we would look at that and go well he's in shock disassociated yeah like and also today I think we look at
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it a lot more we've said this in a few other cases as everyone reacts differently to situations and some
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people aren't going to react the way that you want them to and that doesn't mean that they're not feeling the
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feeling it just means that they're not portraying the feeling you want them to I'm sure like his his lack of emotion
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combined with his like non-life-threatening ISS uh injury the way that he I'm sure it was all kinds of
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stuff it all just went hand in hand but it just never like occurred to anyone at
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first that like maybe he just talks like this normally and maybe's just telling the truth uh to investigators it seemed
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like he was very casual about having been shot and his girlfriend having been abducted um and there were other parts
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of the story that stuck them as a little strange at first like the couple had gotten into the car really easily mhm
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and like they and they were like you didn't try to overpower the driver at any time any point like you know she had
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a gun they were asking questions which they should ask of course obviously because we have seen also cases where
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someone pretends that they are a victim and they are actually part of the whole thing so it's like I totally get why
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they were they were doubling down on what they had to say but like you can look at it both ways but regard and
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again regardless of what they were suspecting hear about JN it did appear as though Janice uh Chapman had been
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abducted so that had really happened so the case was opened and investigation began okay good and it was which I like
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that they weren't going to allow them being slightly suspicious of John's story to stop them from immediately
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looking for Janice right so it was not lost either on the press or the investigators that Janice had been taken
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just a few days after Lisa Milan's body was found in the canyon yeah so detectives were like it feels like this
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is more than coincidental like these are two young women there's another young woman involved in the abduction story
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like it feels and that doesn't happen all the time and when Rome police played the recordings of the calls to 911 for
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John the ones that they had gotten from uh the bombing and the shooting all the previous cases uh he confirmed that the
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voice of the caller was very similar to that of the woman who abducted Janice wow um so Rome Police Captain Mike
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Ragland told reporters there are a couple of similarities but for every similarity there's a discrepancy so he's
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just like keeping his you know he's he's keeping on the ball here which I think is good totally now because we're always
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also like hammering on anybody who goes in with like a preconceived narrative or
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just jumps on a narrative and won't look any other way so I think it's it's safe
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to say they were going about it in the right way now in the days that followed the search for Janice Chapman grew
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exponentially in size in scope I mean things were starting to puzzle together now and by then Diane Bobo our girl who
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had who her truck had broken down and who Judy tried to abduct but she just she was like Don't Talk To Me I'm having
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a bad day she had reported her weird interaction good um and she and she said you know this sounds very similar to the
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conversation John Hancock told police about and he and Jen you know he and Jenice had a very similar interaction
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with a very similar looking girl so it's like this doesn't just happen and the linkage was further confirmed a day
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later when a Rome woman called police to report that her 13-year-old daughter had
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been approached by a young woman who tried to lure her into a car oh no so they were trying to go on like a spree
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absolutely and the girl's description of the driver and the car matched the same
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one given by Dan Bobo and John Hancock oh no so we're we're really going here now yeah and there were other
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similarities too like the 38 yeah like let's go like come on there was the 38 caliber caliber bullet that was pulled
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from John Hancock's shoulder was a match for the ones in the Lisa milikan case I
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didn't even think of of that possibility so they were able to now put these together and now they're looking at John
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too and being like sorry sorry so it didn't take long before the voice on the 911 recordings about Lisa Milligan was
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recognized as being very similar to the voice of the person who placed the calls
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to kend dly and Linda dare several weeks before all this and it was confirmed by
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dulian Adair in police interviews that this is the same voice and to investigators it was pretty clear that
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there was at least two people that were terrorizing the Rome community and now they're kidnapping and trying to murder
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young women in some cases succeeding like this has escalated quite quickly but the thing was it's like they all
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seemed similar and they had similarities but they were random as [ __ ] they well
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that's the thing like the calling and threatening to bomb somebody's house or actually going through it throwing bomb
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at someone's house [ __ ] shooting into someone's house a a man and a woman and then killing abducting and killing a
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13-year-old girl right attempting to do it to other women of varying ages but like younger I guess and then abducting
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a 22-year-old girl and shooting her adult boyfriend it's all it's all very just like Willy fuckingly it's like you
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can't figure out that and the worst part about this was like they have all these
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connective similarities like they can pull this thread through all of them and go yeah we we know this is the same
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person but we cannot predict what they're going to do next no who there no predicting and that's like terrifying
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absolutely so although they had like we just said very little evidence to go on detectives did believe that their
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suspects or at least you know the young woman were probably from out of state okay they also believe that there was a
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real connection to the Rome Youth Development Center yes definitely because and they were like we can't
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figure it totally out but there got to be something so they decided which was smart to comb through the records there
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looking for anyone who matched the composite sketches that they were able to put together from the various
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Witnesses who had had this woman approach them um and they decided to cross reference that those ones with
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anyone on that list who was out of state okay and after tons of detailed research
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and work like real work they were able to track down everyone on the list and verify their Alibis wow except for one
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Judith neie Judith neie oh what a [ __ ] so as Rome police detective Kenneth K read through Judy's file he began seeing
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you know some circumstantial and anecdotal things that at least in his mind linked Neely to the crimes
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committed around Rome he was like you know what I could see this okay she had first been arrested for committing a
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robbery at the same location Lisa milikin disappeared from oh I didn't even put two and two together on that
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the couple was arrested near the area where Lisa's body was discovered for that uh robbery robbery and she appeared
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to be committing crimes with a man yep and so a few days later on October 12th John Hancock picked Judy's photo out of
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a photo lineup and said she was definitely the woman who shot him and later that day Diane Bobo and the
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13-year-old girl who Judy had attempted to abduct in Rome also identified Judy's
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photo from a lineup as being the woman who tried to lure them into her car this is my favorite part of the whole story
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when it all just starts coming together it's like the what we say in the rewatcher it's the third act Montage oh
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it is cuz it's just coming the Scooby game unites and just gets all the evidence together so based on the
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identif ifications arrest warrants were issued for the arrest of Judy Neely let's go and as luck would have it
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investigators didn't have to look too hard for their suspects because 3 days late earlier on October 9th Judy was
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arrested in Murphreesboro Tennessee for passing bad checks are you kidding me so
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she had already been arrested wow and that's a add that to the list Nows unable to make bond she sat in the r
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rsford County Jail in a Cell where she was repeatedly visited by a man who seemed very anxious every time he came
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to speak with her imagine that so rsford County spokesperson Lil Butner told reporters the officers here got
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suspicious because the man had been in so many times in a few days later Tennessee authorities arrested Alvin
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Neely for not the murders yet or the abductions but as him being an accomplice to her Larsen scheme that she
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was doing so they were able to get him on that smart on the morning of October 14th 1982 detectives sat down to try to
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pull all the pieces together but the problem was they still didn't know where Janice was I was just about to ask
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where's Janice and all of this and at this point it's not looking good no because now one of them is in jail and
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then the other's visiting it's like where's Janice right so after all of this when they sat down with Alvin they
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realized uh he was a little sniveling coward cuz remember Alvin is a failure yeah in in all ways that one be a
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failure um he was a [ __ ] worm and K said he was just a complete wimp not too bright more or less a slob he just
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didn't fit the picture at all and right then I thought there must be something real strange in all of this and he was
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even more surprised when Alvin told him he wanted to talk about the crimes but then he said I didn't do no murder I
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ain't never killed nobody and I was like well I think by what you just said I think you said you've killed people cuz
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I don't know if those double negatives all add up to a positive but if you ain't never then you did then you did
00:22:04
cuz it means you didn't never so you did so you did exactly so sounds to me like
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you just admitted to murder my friend correct uh so Alvin's lawyer William Burton came to the police station and
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they all sat down for a formal interview with Alvin Neely and according to Alvin
00:22:20
he had been with his twins remember his children that's so upsetting on the night of October 3rd and he got a call
00:22:27
on the CB from his wife Judy told him she'd picked up two people and she could and she referred to these people as John
00:22:34
and k k k is Janice's middle name oh okay and she said she wanted him to meet them uhhuh now once he drove out to meet
00:22:44
them they all got and by the way he brought his children okay once they all got out of their cars and exchanged
00:22:51
introductions John got in Alvin's car and Kay got back in and he was referring to as K yeah into Judy's car with the
00:22:57
kid kids and they all drove around for a little while wait sorry so the kids are
00:23:02
with who at this point are now with Judy and and Jan okay Jan poor Janice is probably like what the [ __ ] is going on
00:23:09
and they're driving around looking for he said for a place to buy alcohol uhhuh and after they've been driving around
00:23:15
for a while Jon needed to pee so Alvin pulled over and let the man out totally also driving around for over an hour
00:23:23
trying to find somewhere to buy liquor we live in America there are liquor [ __ ] everywhere exactly uh but once
00:23:31
John had peed he said he started walking down the roadway away from the Cars so seeing JN walking away Judy got out of
00:23:39
her car and started to walk after him so Alvin said he went to check on the children of course what the doting
00:23:45
father of course we want to make sure that everybody knows that get a life and so yeah went to go check on the children
00:23:52
in the other car which is when he noticed that Janice was handcuffed to the seat oh just happened to to notice
00:23:58
that in the car with the children oh by the way and he said quote she was just sitting there in the dark she was real
00:24:04
quiet she didn't seem to worry about worried about nothing um I doubt that I doubt that
00:24:10
highly um after he loaded the kids back into his car these poor kids are just getting shuffled around in the middle of
00:24:16
their parents just abducting people and we don't I mean they're probably like toddlers at this point I don't even know
00:24:22
at this point how old they were yeah I think they were young yeah so Elvin yelled after John and Judy telling them
00:24:28
to hurry up but only Judy came back he said but you didn't know what happened there was no plan there you know didn't
00:24:35
hear a gunshot or anything yeah and from there they just went back to the motel room where Judy told Alvin she had shot
00:24:40
John oh yeah once they were back at the motel room Judy began now Judy began mocking Janice and making fun of the way
00:24:49
she spoke oh I really hate that uh but he said Janice didn't seem really bothered by it I think she was probably
00:24:55
just trying to stay Teri and in shock stay alive the next morning Alvin claimed that Judy and Janice left the
00:25:01
motel to drive around for a while eventually meeting up with Alvin at a local Dairy Queen and Alvin said to
00:25:08
investigators quote she was out of control I was afraid she might shoot me this time she's a dangerous person
00:25:14
talking about Judy right and he said she firebombed that house in Rome oh [ __ ]
00:25:20
and he said that Judy and Janis left the Dairy Queen together and when Judy came
00:25:24
back alone she told him she had shot the girl and left her body along a rural Back Road oh he then drove he then Drew
00:25:31
up a map for investigators and he signed it oh wow yeah now they later learned this story was at least partially true
00:25:40
yeah but somewhat the next day October 15th Janice Chapman's body was discovered alongside a Royal Road in
00:25:47
Haywood Valley she had one bullet wound in her back and two in her chest that's so sad Rome police chief Joe Cleveland
00:25:54
told reporters we don't really have a motive there was no robbery in involved wow so they just killed her to
00:26:00
kill her for no reason whatsoever and I love that Alvin just wasted no [ __ ] time pinning all the murders on his wife
00:26:08
every single one he is the most sniveling little worm I've ever seen like she is a piece of absolute [ __ ]
00:26:16
garbage yeah the two of them she just showed me a picture of them I'm like oh I know they're just so [ __ ] foul
00:26:23
together they really are um they're posing in front of a Confederate flag here yeah EX
00:26:28
disgusting yeah but he called William Burton and asked if he could also represent Judy so he's throwing Judy
00:26:35
under the bus what and then trying to get her now unfortunately Judy hadn't asked for an attorney so when Burton
00:26:44
arrived at the station investigators refused to let him see her until she asked yeah and so in the meantime Judy
00:26:51
was crafting a defense pretty similar to her husband's which is she was claiming
00:26:56
it was Alvin who had killed Lisa and Janice Chapman so now they're just ring on each other of course I was they're
00:27:01
like Myra and Ian my thoughts immediately just it's us against the world and then they get arrested and
00:27:08
they're like [ __ ] that person they did everything I hate them girl I it's like
00:27:12
you're love URS I am scrolling through pictures right now and I am just yeah flabbergasted it just makes sense it
00:27:19
does now according to Judy she had never been in trouble with the law until she met Alvin and she had only engaged in
00:27:25
criminal activity because of Alvin like we've seen your rap sheet more yeah and what's sad is that Judy had a beginning
00:27:31
to life that was rough she seemed to be triumphing in the be like in school and it's like she did really give into her
00:27:40
dark side that was clearly always there had to have been uh the detective showed
00:27:45
her a picture of Lisa milikin who Judy acknowledged as having met at the Riverbend Mall a few weeks earlier but
00:27:51
she said I noticed her because she looked like Joanie Cunningham who is a character from Happy Days oh if if you
00:27:57
look up Lisa milikin she's adorable she does remind me she is like a Happy Days character she's just
00:28:03
beautiful now ultimately Judy made two statements to investigators in Alabama and Georgia uh she acknowledged
00:28:11
participating in the attacks on the YDC the youth uh you know yeah the YDC employees and the kidnapping and murder
00:28:20
of Lisa milikin and Janice Chapman so she acknowledged participating in these okay but she claimed she had only
00:28:27
participated in the crimes because she was quote under the control of her husband who had physically and sexually
00:28:34
abused her okay now here's the thing he is a piece of [ __ ] [ __ ] absolutely he
00:28:41
is a monster he has a noted and proven history of being physically and sexually abusive to the women the girls I was
00:28:51
going to say young girls he's so that can all be true absolutely that doesn't take your doesn't mean you your
00:28:59
involvement away you did it and also I'm doesn't take it away it's like so your life is just terrible all around all of
00:29:07
it is and it's like I don't I there's there's so much mess here yeah you know that like all of these things can be
00:29:15
true at once that's that's exactly that Judy is a Judy's a [ __ ] monster she she had monstrosity inside of her and
00:29:24
she's a predator she's a predator and it's like so she it she has that inside of her absolutely and Alvin is a [ __ ]
00:29:33
monster and doesn't even hide his monstrosity it's just right out in the open he beats the [ __ ] out of people
00:29:38
he's supposed to loveh he threatens to kill his own children like he's a piece of absolute [ __ ] garbage it sounds
00:29:46
like so is she neither of them knew how to love what they are so it's absolutely
00:29:51
it's very real to believe that all of this is true at once I I do that she had this inside of of her and that she
00:29:58
deserves to be punished for it and that he also was in control of her and physically and sexually assaulted her to
00:30:04
gain control I believe it I believe all of it yep so according to Judy Alvin had
00:30:09
demanded that she find girls and young women for him to sexually assault and that she only agreed to help because
00:30:16
quote she was willing to do anything to avoid further abuse okay I believe that up to a point exactly it's like nope you
00:30:23
did enjoyed it you did it you literally inserted products into somebody's body yeah it's like I don't feel bad about
00:30:31
that part like you're I don't feel bad about who you are on the inside like you clearly let it out this whole thing
00:30:37
that's why this case is so [ __ ] up cuz it's just like it is hard to see any of
00:30:43
the any good or any kind of positive anywhere here layers and layers of [ __ ] upd nasty [ __ ] horrible rage abuse
00:30:55
trauma lousy with sadness the more investigators spoke to both of them Alvin and Judy the more convinced
00:31:02
they became that like what we were saying neither one of them was telling the full truth no and that's how we are
00:31:08
kind of saying it here all of these things can be true and they cannot be true at all so just days after Alvin was
00:31:15
trying to completely blame Judy for all the murders he'd come up with a new explanation he said there were seven
00:31:22
other victims and according to Alvin he and Judy were quote recruiter and enforcers and this is a quote in a
00:31:30
prostitution ring but not all of the slangs were connected to prostitution and that was a quote by the way okay so
00:31:37
now he's trying to say that he's working for this ring and he's an enforcer and a
00:31:41
recruiter along with Judy and that this all has to do with that uhhuh now based on his statements to police Alvin did
00:31:49
seem to have some details about the murders of young women that had happened around the state that they hadn't
00:31:53
connected to them okay but it was wasn't super clear whether that was because he
00:31:59
was involved in them or he could have just read about it in the paper it was in the news like the things he had
00:32:04
weren't things he couldn't have gotten in the media he said or the bu uh Georgia Bureau of Investigations
00:32:12
director Phil Peters told the press all I can tell you is we're checking it out there's a lot of misinformation floating
00:32:18
around about it but we have agents talking to them and we're just trying to evaluate find out exactly what we have
00:32:24
to do to separate the facts from the fiction this must have been really hard I can't even imagine they seem like two
00:32:31
[ __ ] liars and it's like they're lying about each other and for each other so it's like this is just it's a
00:32:37
mess yeah now while Alvin is spinning crazy stories at this point about like these you know criminal rings and other
00:32:47
conspiracies he's going off the deep end yeah Judy remained mostly quiet in her jail St she cell she kind of stuck to
00:32:53
her story that she was just a victim of Alvin okay and that was it she wasn't going away from it well that was
00:33:00
probably her best case scenario it truly was now to most investigators and among
00:33:04
people in the media Judy's explanation was you know as good as any other it they saw who Alvin was so it wasn't
00:33:12
completely out of the well look at the time possibility they got together when she's how old he has done this
00:33:17
previously like they're seeing everything we've talked about but detective KES who was the one who had
00:33:24
spoken to both of them and had spent a lot of time talking to Judy he said I don't know about that okay after hearing
00:33:32
what Judy had to say about everything K said quote she's mad because she had to serve a little time it's revenge against
00:33:39
the system so he's saying she had to serve time in the Rome youth um you know the juvenile detention center there
00:33:48
which is what those first attacks were after MH he's saying she was pissed that she had to do that maybe something
00:33:55
happened there she snapped who knows none of us know nobody's claiming something did or didn't happen she's
00:34:02
claiming something happened we have no proof either way yep something could have happened there but either way she's
00:34:07
pissed about her time there yeah and he's saying this is totally against the system and so investigators really
00:34:15
started to this Theory more and they were starting to look more into it they started speaking more and more with Judy
00:34:22
trying to get a little more out of her and in an interview with Alabama district attorney Richard um I think
00:34:27
it's a igu I believe it is I'm sorry Richard uh Judy explained that she liked Lisa and didn't want to hurt her and in
00:34:35
fact she claimed she only killed Lisa because she didn't want to get caught and go back to YDC and what about the
00:34:41
cleaning products thank you and here's the thing that they believe they believe that she was first it was revenge
00:34:47
against the people who worked there she was going to that whole story that you know the firebomb the shooting and then
00:34:54
they had this whole list they were going to go through they were going to [ __ ] up
00:34:57
everybody who worked there that wronged her I think that was real and I don't know what the reason for it was whether
00:35:03
it was based off of abuse or not but it certainly could have been yeah and what they think now is that she started going
00:35:11
after like people that were similar to her in that position like young girls she started like they started together
00:35:18
going after [ __ ] terrible it doesn't make any sense that's that like let's abuse people but nothing about this is
00:35:25
rational in any way it's yeah may have even been like subconscious that she was doing that
00:35:31
yeah you know they don't know they just think this is her being pissed about something that happened to her or that
00:35:37
she didn't she was pissed she had a due time at all okay I I mean I can see it it makes sense now on October 28th the
00:35:43
deal County grand jury was convened to hear the case against Judy for the murder of Lisa milikin uh they
00:35:49
deliberated less than one day before returning an indictment and in the three count indictment she was accused of not
00:35:56
only killing Lisa but also of kidnapping and sexual abuse of a minor wow uh if she was prosecuted to the fullest extent
00:36:03
and found guilty she was going to face the death penalty in Alabama wow uh even so her court appointed lawyer Bob French
00:36:11
was convinced that she had only participated in anything out of fear and he was quote dedicated to a not- guilty
00:36:18
verdict and I say good luck yeah also like of course you are that's your job now the problem facing Alvin and Judy's
00:36:25
lawyers was that neither of them denied kidnapping and killing Lisa and Janice they both admitted that they were both
00:36:32
there around that Elvin was also an idiot so when he he would try to create elaborate stories and lies to save
00:36:38
himself he always ended up actually creating traps for himself to just Gump into um I mean at good yeah so this is a
00:36:48
trigger warning for this next part because I'm just going to say something about the Lisa milikin thing and it's
00:36:53
pretty horrific it's sexual abuse related so I just want to let you guys know that that's coming it's just for a
00:36:58
second so you can skip forward really quick if you want to okay um for example during an interview with gbi agents
00:37:07
Alvin repeatedly denied raping Lisa milikin uh but when agents looked at him and said well how the [ __ ] then did she
00:37:15
have seen found inside of her if you did not rape her and Alvin said he he just kept denying but then he turned it into
00:37:24
an outrageous lie oh God according to Alvin he said and this is horrific he said Lisa was handcuffed to the bed in
00:37:32
the motel room when Judy masturbated him into a Dixie cup and then poured it into
00:37:39
Lisa that was his explanation I actually don't know what to say about that instead of just like you're caught
00:37:53
you're caught you got caught there's no it is black and white it is you are caught red-handed and you come up with
00:38:01
the most wild and just disgusting foul and complex explanation for something that is black and white
00:38:13
like there's no that's on another level stupid this [ __ ] worm was oh that's so heinous and again that
00:38:26
was his way of still saying well Judy was part of that uh-huh and it's like just admit that you're a [ __ ] pig
00:38:34
that you're a predatory [ __ ] pig and you've done this your whole damn life that's so did like you disgusting Pig
00:38:43
the fact that his brain would even make that up is so in incomprehensible investigators first of all must have
00:38:52
been sitting there horrified but also sitting there and just being like are you [ __ ] kidding me how dumb do you
00:38:59
think are who do you think you are talking to and again with each new lie he just got himself more and more
00:39:08
Tangled in his own [ __ ] guilt yeah and it's every time he would more or less just admit his guilt again exactly
00:39:16
and over the course of the investigation his story changed repeatedly first it was all Judy's idea because she was
00:39:22
crazy and dangerous then he claimed they were enforcers in this ring and then that whole thing fell apart so we
00:39:28
started blaming Judy again and telling detective she was bisexual and it was her idea to kidnap and rape the girls
00:39:35
okay so now he's saying that like this is her idea and she wanted she's by so that's why it's like Alvin just
00:39:42
literally let it go get so [ __ ] like it's just you're so dumb just admit it I hate when people like when they're
00:39:50
backed into a corner like that and they just keep going cuz I'm like liars like that when you are literally holding
00:39:56
something in front of them and being like look and they're like no that's so infuriating maddening like so
00:40:03
infuriating like that was like my ex-boyfriend when I held up like proof of his cheating like a literal physical
00:40:10
piece of proof and he was like no misprint and it's like are you like he told me a movie theater misprinted a
00:40:17
ticket a movie theater misprinted a ticket yeah like those kind of people would you will hold a piece of evidence
00:40:25
that is disputable in front of them and they will lie their way out of it I have
00:40:29
shown someone a text that they sent from their phone and they sat there and told
00:40:34
me that they didn't send it yeah when I had proof that they did people who lie like that are scary they just will lie
00:40:43
it's just like they they don't care they will never come out with the truth and that is Elvin the scary thing is you
00:40:50
start to wonder if they do believe it with the just [ __ ] like conviction with Li the oomph and the oomph with
00:40:58
which they deny that the truth with how they'll defend themselves y it's really scary it's in it's intense like really
00:41:08
scary when faced with that it's unlike anything you could possibly ever explain I listened to my ex if he's listening
00:41:15
right now [ __ ] you honestly not even I'm like enjoy story time because you definitely remember this listen to him
00:41:24
in the bathroom talk have a full conversation with another girl full conversation making plans listen to the
00:41:31
whole heard her voice could hear the entire thing heard him like like talking back oh yeah having a full conversation
00:41:38
yep and then he came out and I said you what the [ __ ] I just listen to that entire thing I know you were talking to
00:41:44
a girl and he said I was listening to a voicemail that's unbelievable and and then you feel crazy oh yeah cuz I was
00:41:51
like oh obviously I'm crazy that's the other thing they will make these people do the wildest Tales you'll be like that
00:41:59
probably happens yeah you're like oh I'm the crazy like I'm being very like I'm losing it I'm being wild for even like I
00:42:05
need to check myself before I and that's what Alvin I think that's also why he surrounds himself with younger people
00:42:14
they're easier he likes to control and he obviously likes to have that manipulation tactic under his belt
00:42:20
that's what he uses and he's disgusting he's sitting here trying to pull it on seasoned [ __ ] investigators like the
00:42:28
Georgia Bureau of Investigations and he's sitting there trying to pull that [ __ ] that would be like you you want to
00:42:35
pull it on like a 19-year-old girl who thinks they're in love with you yeah it's probably going to work like oops I
00:42:42
I know this but you try to pull it on some people who have been through some [ __ ] no no no it's not going to work
00:42:49
they've seen like the worst of the worst of course so it's just for him to pull out the Judy bisexual
00:42:56
and it's her idea to kidnap so she's by so they so she wants to kidnap and rape girls that's the other thing obvious
00:43:02
conclusion I know what you're trying to say here sir because this was what this was the 70s yeah it's like the in the
00:43:08
early 80s or late 70s like this terrible thing of bisexuality they just want to M
00:43:14
abduct and rape young women it's like no I think you have actually proven that you do that so good try it's kind of
00:43:20
youro but you're both gross uh so in Judy's case Bob French her court appointed lawyer yes was having a
00:43:27
similar problem because in one interview after another Judy confessed to participating in the assaults on the YDC
00:43:34
workers and the kidnapping and murders of Lisa and Janice so again similar issue because like they've admitted it
00:43:41
so what's the case and faced with two capital murder cases he filed a motion in early December to have Judy tried as
00:43:48
a juvenile he acknowledged that his motion was pretty unlikely to be approved like because of what like how
00:43:55
bad it was was yeah the crime um he said we would be remiss in our duties if we hadn't asked for the youthful offender
00:44:01
status such since she is a juvenile uhhuh uh but I seriously doubt it will be granted considering the magnitude of
00:44:08
the crime the fact that she's still a [ __ ] Juvenile and this is her Ren and how many [ __ ] kids does she have does
00:44:15
she just have the two yeah I mean at this point she has three I think three yeah wow I think at least two wow yeah
00:44:22
so French's motion for youthful offender status was was denied denied uh it was denied and on March 7th 1983 her trial
00:44:30
for the murder of Lisa milikin began in D County and after two days of jury selection opening arguments began with
00:44:38
uh Richard I think it's I igu I believe okay um arguing on behalf of the state now Richard told the jury of Lisa
00:44:48
milikin heroing 4day ordeal oh God uh where she endured torture multiple rapes and then was injected Ed with costic
00:44:57
chemicals and then shot and thrown off a cliff by Judy NE wow like it doesn't get
00:45:04
more heinous no absolutely not Judy did this not because they were claiming Judy
00:45:11
did this not because she was under duress or because she was being violently abused and controlled by her
00:45:16
husband she did it because she wanted to yeah and personally that's what I believe I believe she was being
00:45:22
violently abused by her husband and I believe she wanted to do this yeah I believe both those things are
00:45:28
true and like detective K's he contended that after a brief incarceration for the
00:45:34
robbery at the mall where she was in that Juvenile Detention Center she had developed an anger and disdain for
00:45:40
society and humanity and she wanted to seek revenge which she took out on girls she perceived to be like her yeah that's
00:45:48
wild yeah now in her defense Bob French told the jury you know a different a different side of the story
00:45:56
in his version of events Judy was quote beaten and brainwashed into procuring 13-year-old Lisa Anne mikin as a quote
00:46:04
unquote sex partner which I was like you mean rape victim yeah [ __ ] for her husband um and then she just followed
00:46:12
his instructions and killing the girl and pushing her body into Li Little River Canyon which is wild to me that
00:46:18
like Judy's like oh I did it like she's not even blaming it on Al like she's not
00:46:23
even being like Alvin killed her he's like oh she's like oh no I killed her right and they're having to be like yeah
00:46:28
she just did it because he told her to and it's like I think there's more to it than that according to French quote
00:46:34
every move every action every thought for carrying out this heinous event was planned calculated and instigated by
00:46:40
Alvin Neely who had been violently controlling her actions since the day they met and began a relationship when
00:46:46
she was only 15 years old again I think it's all true it's just and I think she wanted to do it it's wild to me that all
00:46:54
of this happened in the span of like a a couple of years yeah now in support of his defense of what was then known as
00:47:01
battered woman syndrome referred to um he offered testimony from Judy's clinical psychiatric examinations that
00:47:09
had concluded that Judy quote probably fits The Battered Women's syndrome to the most severe extent that the
00:47:16
psychiatrist had seen wow this is why I do believe all of these things can be true um the psychiatrist also noted that
00:47:24
Alvin's mental state was substituted for Judy's own resulting in a situation where Judy quote had no intents of her
00:47:31
own so French told the Jerry Judy was reduced to a robot by this man who saw himself as an extension of Clyde Barrow
00:47:39
and his woman as Bonnie Parker oh who knows I don't know all I know is they're both terrible that's the thing
00:47:49
it doesn't matter what they think or who they see yeah I think it's all true at the
00:47:54
same time and I think you don't do that kind of thing you don't inject someone with cleaning
00:48:00
fluids six times and then shoot them in the chest unless you want to do that mhm
00:48:04
so the district attorney acknowledged that Judy absolutely may have been influenced by her husband and you know
00:48:10
what maybe she wouldn't have acted violently without his urging maybe she would have held it all in but she was
00:48:17
still responsible for her actions that she did do the hypothetical maybe she wouldn't have doesn't really have
00:48:24
bearing on any when Lisa and Janice are lying dead in the ground MH so they said her plea Was
00:48:31
Not Guilty by reason of insanity um and even if it had been such a plea does not include abnormal
00:48:38
behavior manifested by repeated criminal or antisocial acts and what has happened
00:48:43
here is Criminal antisocial and of the highest degree so after two weeks of very
00:48:49
graphic testimony a lot of evidence the jury deliberated for less than 4 hours and returned a verdict of guilty hell
00:48:57
yeah the Circuit Court jury recommended a sentence of life in prison without the
00:49:01
possibility of parole which I think is very fair um French her uh lawyer said Judy is in pretty bad bad shape and he
00:49:09
referred to her as a basket case okay again a quote yes of course um under Alabama Alabama Alabama that's the
00:49:17
fancy way to say Alabama Alabama under Alabama Law the judge actually has the right to accept or reject the jury's
00:49:25
recommend Commendation for ascendance oh that's interesting so although they recommended life without parole he had
00:49:30
the total authority to say yes or no to that wow and when Judy returned for sentencing on October on April 18th 1983
00:49:38
dcal County circuit court judge Randall Cole actually chose not to accept it huh
00:49:45
and he sentenced Judy to death [ __ ] he said by any standards acceptable to a civilized society this
00:49:54
crime was heinous atrocious and cruel agreed and asked by the judge if she had anything to say on her own behalf Judy
00:50:01
said I didn't have any feelings I had no thoughts or feelings except to do what I
00:50:06
was told there's nothing I can do to change the past I can keep things from happening again I can help battered
00:50:12
wives and that's what I want to do now I don't know if it was really love or fright from being so scared of him or
00:50:19
dependency one of my biggest pet peeves in murder trials is when the person says
00:50:26
I can't change the past we know because you know what everybody [ __ ] knows that particularly your victim's families
00:50:35
know that save your breath and they are living with that thought every day that we can't change the past so we don't
00:50:41
need to hear from you I can't change we know that [ __ ] we know you can't even do basic algebra so we're not worried
00:50:47
about you changing the [ __ ] path that's redundant thank you Judy what we're worried about is you a caged
00:50:55
[ __ ] an animal being let out into society and doing this all over again well and the thing that pisses me off
00:51:00
beyond that is when they sit there and say their plans for the future when they took away two people's plans for the
00:51:07
future like that's great that you want to do that did you happen to ask either of those two girls what they plan to do
00:51:13
with their Futures precisely you it's like she's sitting there being like your children's lives are going to
00:51:23
be gone so that I can become this wonderful face of you know this cause and you know what they they died for me
00:51:35
yeah to change lives and it's like wow like okay I was a family member sitting in that courtroom I don't know how
00:51:43
people do it I really don't know how they do it I have so much respect for the people to go through that I don't
00:51:48
think I could do it absolutely not I don't think I have the willpower I think like anybody who is able to sit there
00:51:55
and control themselves I think like you deserve a standing ovation 100 you're a you're a higher vibrating human myself
00:52:05
absolutely now hoping to avoid another trial and another potential death penalty for her case in Georgia for
00:52:13
kidnapping and murdering Janice oh Judy agreed to plead guilty to the charge of kidnapping and agreed to testify against
00:52:20
Alvin in exchange for the state of Georgia agreeing not to pursue murder charges or the death penalty wow now
00:52:28
again she was already sentenced to die in Alabama so authorities in Georgia were like I think it's fine if we agree
00:52:34
to this plead like she's sentenced to die and she's going to testify against Alvin which is basically just a win for
00:52:40
them there's no really win for her there precisely so having been indicted in March for the murder of Janice Chapman
00:52:47
Alvin was indicted a second time on May 10th 1983 for the murder of Lisa milikin
00:52:52
good now seeing how Judy's trial had ended and the fact that uh she was definitely going to testify against him
00:52:58
in the Chapman case Alvin agreed to plead guilty in Georgia to charges of kidnapping with bodily harm and murder
00:53:05
and in exchange the state was agreeing to not pursue the death penalty interesting so I think this is
00:53:12
good he was sentenced to life in prison okay which I think is great agree take it and he began serving his sentence at
00:53:20
bosk State Prison in Hardwick Georgia so like bye Alin see you [ __ ] never I don't think it's fair that she got death
00:53:29
and he didn't they did the same crimes uh well you'll feel better um so after she was sentenced she became the
00:53:35
youngest woman ever sentenced to death in the United States yeah cuz I just looked I tried to figure out her age I
00:53:41
think she was born in 1965 so she was either I think she was 17 when she was in trial 17 years old and was sentenced
00:53:48
to the death penalty for murder that's wild and she was sent to Julia Tutwiler prison for women to waight execution
00:53:56
death row now immediately though obviously Judy's lawyers filed an appeal on her behalf and they argued that her
00:54:02
Miranda rights had been violated following her arrest because Law Enforcement Officers failed to inform
00:54:08
her that an attorney had been called to the jail by her husband because remember
00:54:12
Alvin does that his own well Alvin so the whole thing was as a result her lawyers argued that the statements she
00:54:20
made during those early interviews were inadmissible and she deserved a new trial the justices disagreed because
00:54:26
they said Judy had repeatedly stated that she didn't need or want a lawyer right so and she had continued speaking
00:54:35
freely with investigators so she had said out loud I don't need and I don't want a lawyer okay so that negates all
00:54:42
that exactly and in their decision they upheld the lower Court's conviction and the justices wrote even if Mrs ne's
00:54:49
confessions were inadmissible because of a violation of her fifth or sixth amendment right to council any error and
00:54:55
the admission of those confessions were cured by her own testimony at trial right so they were like even if that had
00:55:02
happened she testified at trial and said she did it right so like we don't need those early confessions actually CU she
00:55:08
just said it in the court play his day so after more than a decade on death row wow Judy's sentence was commuted to life
00:55:16
in prison by Governor fob James who cited the jury's original sentencing recommendation as the reason to commute
00:55:22
it so 10 years on death row is 27 and gets commuted to life in prison that is my age right now yep I can't imagine
00:55:32
like yeah but she's such a [ __ ] monster yeah and they so they did this because they said that original jury had
00:55:39
wanted life in prison without parole so they are allowed to go back and commute that sentence back to that which like I
00:55:46
don't know I don't know how I feel that I got to look further into that like I don't want to spout out an opinion
00:55:52
without being fully researched my initial thought is like huh but I think in this case it's a huh cuz it's like
00:55:59
what the [ __ ] but I guess it could be beneficial in other cases if maybe the judge handed out like a ridiculously
00:56:06
unfair sentence yeah and I think I I'm also moving my opinion on the death penalty so much that I I think I'm also
00:56:14
just like I honestly life without parole I'm like that works for me yeah and I guess in my opinion it's like what's the
00:56:20
point of having the jury if the judge can just do whatever the [ __ ] they want yeah that's true you know but like
00:56:25
what's the point of the judge if the jury gets the final say yeah you know all kind of is convoluted yeah it really
00:56:33
is but either way following this whole thing the Alabama legislature passed legislation in 2003 to prevent Judy
00:56:41
becoming eligible for parole but then changes in the law in 2018 undid that legislation I was going
00:56:50
to say making her eligible as of 2023 yeah and May 2023 the state parole board deliberated for less than an hour and
00:56:59
denied her parole I saw that as of today she's still in Julia Julia Tutwiler prison for women she is serving out a
00:57:06
life sentence but she will be eligible for consideration for perole again in 2028 wow and she's only I think she's 58
00:57:13
right now 58 or 59 yeah so so she could very well still be alive then the thing is I from what I looked up I think even
00:57:23
if she got parole she would have to go serve in Georgia oh cuz I think she like I think
00:57:30
she will still have to serve a life sentence in Jo so I don't think it will even matter interesting I'll I'll look
00:57:36
it up again and I'll make sure to update it on the next episode okay but I'm fairly certain that I guess that makes
00:57:43
from what I read she will have to continue serving another sentence in another place even executive kind of
00:57:49
thing because they gave her the plea of taking death penalty off the table but they gave her okay so yeah so I think
00:57:55
she'll get parole and then immediately have to go to Georgia and start serving a life sentence so so like why why even
00:58:01
give her parole just don't it's kind of a waste of everybody's time Alvin Neely in case you were wondering because you
00:58:07
were like he didn't get death he did uh he didn't he got death in the end uh he served roughly 20 years of his life
00:58:14
sentence at State Prison and then he died in October 2st on October 21st 2005 from complications following surgery oh
00:58:24
well yeah bye so it is quite a story mhm and they are quite a pair yeah they both
00:58:35
belong to be locked away and have the the key thrown away yeah they sure do I don't think there's any hope for
00:58:42
somebody that can inject another person with Drano and and dish soap a child I don't think a 13-year-old child I just
00:58:51
simply don't think yeah I don't see you get past that but but you know here we are wow what a horrific case yeah I
00:58:59
would really love something paranormal for the next episode uh but I personally am working on like a old timey one ooh
00:59:08
so sorry to some sorry to some but yay to others yeah exactly and then I mean we're going to be coming up in the next
00:59:16
few weeks we're going to be hitting you with some like pretty gnarly cases so yeah just be prepared for that we'll
00:59:21
have a little smattering of spooky in there too just to like cleanse your palette in between but don't worry
00:59:27
because there's there's some rough ones coming yeah you know we got to move away
00:59:31
from the Most Wonderful Time of the Year Halloween exactly except it still hasn't
00:59:36
happened yet no technically weird yeah but anyway we hope you keep listening and we hope you keep it weird but not
00:59:45
this weird cuz I don't know about [Music] that [Music]