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hey weirdos I'm Ash and I'm Elena and this is [Music] morid it is the conclusion
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to HH hes goodness that wasn't as epic as I thought it would sound I thought you
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sounded epic that's why I said oh my goodness yeah we're finally at the conclusion here it's a doozy but don't
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worry CU in the end this man gets what's coming to him hell [ __ ] yeah he does gets what's coming to him so when we
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we're going to get right into it cuz this is a long one and I'm ready to go [ __ ] off about Jack the Ripper and
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the dear boss letter again so let's go let's let's go down that path all over again go right down that path again so
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I'm just going to catch you up really quick so this man has now killed Benjamin pitel and his
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kids all them at least three of his kids he's definitely going to kill the lady he has sent their mother slfe around the
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nation in Canada on a wild goose chase thinking her husband is alive all the while detective Gary from the insurance
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company he defrauded with the murder of his supposed friend and business part partner has hired the Pinkerton
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detective agency to help track him they are hot on his tail now and he has left Canada and come back to the States
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they're going in where they are looking for him I'm not sure why he made that move but like glad he did yeah that was
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stupid I'm really excited for the Pinkerton of it all I also really like saying Pinkerton Pinkerton you know yeah
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I know but before we get into this whole thing we are going to quickly touch upon
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why people think he's Jack the Ripper oh my goodness we're going to get that right out of the way right up front so
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we can dive back into the story and finish it off with his execution because that's proper of course you that's the
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way we do it it's the proper This Is How We Do It dos dos is house so let's talk about the theories
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about him being Jack the Ripper let us they mostly so he has um an ancestor named Jeff mudget remember his name is
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her Herman Webster mudget how could I forget uh Jeff is like his great great great great grandson you know like one
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of those I'm not exact removed or something yeah and he firmly believes that HH Holmes is Jack H well you are
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you're all over me right now I'm sorry I love you firmly believes that AJ Jes is Jack
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the Ripper they are the same person he the the grandson yeah the great great great great grandson um he I mean he
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he's a former attorney like he's a credible human like so far I have not seen him I have not seen anything about
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him doing like anything you know nefarious bad or nefarious where you'd be like why are we believing this man um
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but you know I don't know if I agree I'm not here to say for sure because I don't
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know you don't know we don't know he doesn't know and I and I commend him for nobody knows there you go she literally
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put up a finger to make me stop talking to say that I want you all to know that uh she said oh wait I didn't want the
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moment to pass sometimes I I don't put up a finger to stop you and the moment passes yeah you know I get it yeah now
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he presented a ton of evidence uh he did a TED Talk in Vancouver I think it was [ __ ] he presented a bunch of exhibits a
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lot of them are pretty interesting um that's as far as I think they are as interesting one of the things he
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presented was a letter confirmed to be written by HH Holmes to his lawyer and it was near 19 or 1888 and he was
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talking about how much he wanted to go to London okay so he expressed interest in going to London I too have done the
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same yeah there is that now there's also the fact that Scotland Yard believed according to witness reports that Jack
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the Ripper was about 5'7 you know somewhere in his late 20s early mid-30s they believed he was a doctor you know a
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very average build Holmes was exactly 5'7 he was technically a doctor though you know yeah I feel like 57 is also
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like kind of on the shorter side yeah I think it's just like it's all pretty like you know average like nothing
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stands out to me it's like oh that's him also I know that like I witness accounts
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are you know a thing they're tough and I know that's really all we have to go on
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in the Jack the Ripper case for these kind of things for what he looks like no surveillance unfort everyone needs to
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remember and I hammered this idea in when we did the Jack the Ripper case there was no
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lights when I say there was no lights in White Chapel I mean there was no lights
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I mean go outside stand in the middle of the forest that's probably kind of as dark as as it was it was probably darker
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so like I don't know if we can really look at like oh that man was 5' s like I don't know well that's also just so
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that's such a specific measurement very if you could say like oh he was like I'm
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5'6 so he was between my height and like 5'9 I'd say yeah like you know and even
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that I'm like 5'9 I don't know what someone who 5'9 looks like no but you know what some well um no never mind I'm
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dumb like JN is like 63 6'4 I only compare things in in Heights of John like I literally will look at somebody
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I'll be like well they're almost close to John's height so they're probably around like that's the only way I can
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distinguish anything I do that exact same thing in my own home I was measuring an area to put like a a raised
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bed and in my head I said that's probably two jobs I do the same that's amazing and
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for height I'm always like that's about one and a half jobs I do that all the time whenever people
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in the in the six feet apart times one John apart one John apart that's that's literally what I would do I like could
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John lay between me and that person I'm good if they can't I better move back it
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reminds me of in Gilmore Girls when uh I can bring it back there all the time always either that or Sabrina when Logan
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is talking about like measuring distance through Crow pogs cuz that's like a Yale
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thing it's like this many Crow pogs to this thing I'm like this many Js shut up Logan so yeah you know there's
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that so like sure again presented in a way where it says you know you put them all together and what do you got you put
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them all together and they all say 5' seven they say about this age they say about this height range this weight
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wears like whatever he was a doctor and then you say hey HH Holmes happens to be
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5 foot7 and of that average child weight and all that must be him you know what I'll give it to you it's there that that
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is true so I will absolutely say that you can't really sure I mean a lot of other people are too but like sure HH
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Holmes is uh Scotland Yard also put together and he really laid his hat on this one and a lot of people really lay
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their hats on this one um Scotland Yard put together a composite of all 13 credible and corroborated eyewitness
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accounts of Jack the Ripper and what he looked like but again no lights and again no lights uh they put it into one
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photo like composited it into one human that photo first of all when I look at it I'm like I don't know about that I
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don't know about that when you showed it to me I I wasn't there in 18 I'm not there but I I too don't know about that
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you you said in one of these that like people have 1800s faces like old time me faces that was not an old timey face
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that man is from 2013 at the earliest it just did not speak to me but besides that because obviously you would look at
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that and say well who gives a [ __ ] what you think this is reality right so that
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photo when compared to HH Holmes's photo people think it's a great comparison okay and to which I say nah what because
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I don't think it's a good comparison at all in my opinion um the lip bothers me a lot he has a very full bottom lip AJ
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tomes' bottom lip was notably Fuller in fact it was something people talked about with him it was a distinguishing
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characteristic to him that his bottom lip was a full bot bottom lip filler Queen filler Queen HH choles but Jack
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the Ripper that composite photo of what he's supposed to looked like he has no lips and he certainly doesn't have a
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full bottom lip and I'm telling you if we are if we are close enough and we are able to describe enough to say he is 5
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fo s he is of this age he of this weight he has a mustache he has high cheekbones they would have seen that
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full lip that would have been one of the things you would have heard in many of the descriptions was he had a full lip
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and also wouldn't you think didn't he have like a special thing with his eyes AJ CH he had stubid Miss but that
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wouldn't I don't think that would have really been relevant especially in the darkness back then because alra bid
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misses is you can't uh really focus on someone oh okay okay it's like um it's really just a focusing thing got like
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one eye might drift a little bit okay um so I don't know if anybody would have been close enough to him to see that
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beside until they and they would have been dead yeah that makes sense but again and the other thing is that Holmes
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had a very weak ass jawline yeah sucked like no jawline to be found at least in the photos that I've seen yeah shave
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that beard and you're done for shave that and it's no good but the composite has a pretty strong jawline and it's
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like that seems to be a and he has very high cheekbones I guess you could say holes does too but like again they're
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not very I don't really I wouldn't sit there and be like wow look at those cheekbones you know I think he kind of
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looks a little bit like a Bassin Hound he does a little bit a little droopy um and then there's the medical knowledge
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thing we all know that medical knowledge is a hot debate when it comes to Jack the Ripper some people believe
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wholeheartedly he had to have been a doctor or at least in the medical field other people believe by no means is that
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even something we should be looking at and then there are other people who sit in the middle and they say I don't know
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it could be that or he could have been a a butcher at the time because they had similar knowledge that's you that is me
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um I'm on the side like I said I sit in that middle area but I would lean more towards he had at least some medical
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knowledge but Theory surrounding homes being one and the same with Jack say that maybe Jack's crimes were actually
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the beginning of Holmes's murderous career and he evolved into the homes that we know now I don't understand this
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on any level and I've read a lot of these theories about this particular like issue here that like he must have
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started as Jack the Ripper and then evolved into homes I don't get that like Jack was very
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methodical from the jump was he Reckless sometimes yeah absolutely but he always
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seemed to have a plan well that's what I was going to say even in his recklessness it's it was still slightly
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organized yeah like it was Reckless the way he went about it but there was a plan in place and it's like he had he
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like escalated as he went so to think this would have been homes's Beginnings make absolutely no sense to me it makes
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sense to go the other way way around that right because Jack's murders were [ __ ] horrific like they you don't
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start there and then end on poisoning people with gas no you would think that you would like work your way up to yeah
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it doesn't make any sense to me and then people talk about the traveling like it
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was pretty you know people could travel by boat pretty easily back then if you had the money to do it you find the ship
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manifest I cannot find the ship manifest exist there are ship manifests allegedly
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they are cited a lot but I can't find them that say a man named Holmes traveled from the US to London during
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the time period that Jack was active this was also during the time period in 1988 early 1989 where you can't find
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evidence of homes in Chicago or in the United States so that is an interesting things little hairy is weird that you
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can't find a lot of evidence or a lot of stuff going on about him during that time in the United States I will give
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that Credence at least but at the same time he was always running around everywhere so he could have even been in
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Canada that's the things and he could have been using one of his like hund like his 40 aliases you know what I mean
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exactly that they just actually didn't pick up on Holmes was also a very common name at the time that's probably why
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Holmes chose it I think it still is so he could blend in with others be confused with others and that would
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allow him to get by with all his schemes but the fact that there was a homes on a
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ship to London while very compelling when you put it next to other things or if you want you know you're looking for
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confirmation bias and you you want to confirm your theory I understand that's compelling I'm not throwing it away by
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any means but I just don't think it proves anything really yeah I think it proves that there was a homes on that
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ship but there was a lot of homes this so be any homes again the time period intriguing very intriguing the fact that
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we can't find a lot about homes during that this small period of time intriguing but whatever and now we're
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going to get to the thing that pisses me off the most uh one of the things that a
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lot of people use um and Jeff mudget uses and again I'm not like Jeff mudget might be 100% right I am not saying he
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is wrong I'm just saying I don't personally agree with this especially this one piece of the puzzle uh they
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people like to look at the dear boss letter the Jack the Ripper dear boss letter
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and handwriting analysis said that this letter was likely written by an American
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because boss was not a um heavily used term slang term in England at the time it was used but it was used more on
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America I was going to say maybe they just went abroad and thought they were fancy when they got back to London they
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were like boss ex and they think it was written by the same person who wrote things that belonged to homes they
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compared some of the handwriting analysis again I saw the comparisons I'm not wowed by the comp comparisons no
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when you showed them to me I I wasn't either but they claimed that the handwriting analysis said that it was
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like a 97% match or something wild if it is that's fascinating but I'm my eyes don't work right it's also cive and a
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lot of people at that time period learned how to write cursive in a very similar manner yeah that's the thing now
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I'm going to read you cuz we cuz I think we need to take a little trip back to the dear boss letter for a second cuz I
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have a lot of reasons why this doesn't make sense that it was a CHS okay so the dear boss letter was this I'll read it
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to you dear boss I keep on hearing the police have caught me but they won't fix me just yet I I've laughed when they
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look so clever and talk about being on the right track that joke about leather apron gives me real fits I'm down on
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hores and shant quit ripping them till I do get buckled Grand work the last job was I gave the lady no time to squeal
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how can they catch me now I love my work and want to start again you will soon hear of me with my funny little games I
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save some the proper red stuff in a ginger beer bottle over the last job to write with but it went thick Like Glue
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and I can't use it red ink is fit enough I hope haha the next job I do I shall clip the lady's ears off and send to the
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police officers just for Jolly wouldn't you keep this letter till I do a bit more work then give it out straight my
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knife is nice and sharp I want to get to work right away if I get a chance good luck Yours Truly Jack the Ripper don't
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mind me giving the trade name wasn't good enough to post this before I got all the red ink off my hands curse it no
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luck yet they say I'm a doctor now haha so many things uh so many things yeah I went over in the Jack the Ripper
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episodes about how this is not Jack the Ripper I when you were saying it I was like wait a second cuz I thought that we
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had determined it was not yeah it's not this is not Jack the Ripper this is the like you know going from like the my
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last job my funny little game the tones don't match and then the whole blood thing the whole blood thing I'm going to
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get to that don't worry but that's it's and him giving himself the nickname it's
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just like no no so the dear boss letter when you first hear it it could feel real on
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first glance and I get that I thought it was real on first glance be especially because of the ear thing the ear thing
00:17:23
it was so this letter was turned into police on September 29th which was our before the double event and the murder
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of Katherine edos who had their ear clipped off but the central news agency claims they received the letter on
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September 27th and waited until the day of the murders to turn it into police so
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there's conflicting ideas about when this letter actually came in if it came in on the day that it happened the day
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or days before the dates are a little muddy there and I don't think we can trust them and another thing George Sims
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was a journalist who wrote a weekly uh column and was heavily into the investigation of the White Chapel
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murders and he said the dear boss letter and postcard were sent to a news agency
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and not a paper like not a newspaper and not the cops a news agency sells stories
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to papers and news outlets it's a hub like that's where you spread the story or the news to other
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sources MH wouldn't someone just send the letter directly to the paper or the actual investigators why would they
00:18:29
choose a news agency Who would know to even do that mm I can tell you who someone who a news agency and he wrote
00:18:36
George Sims wrote the fact that the self- postcard proclaimed assassin sent this imitation blood besmeared
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communication to the central news opens up a wide field for Theory how many among you my dear readers would have hit
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upon the idea of the central news as a receptacle for your confidence you might have sent your joke to the telegraph the
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times any morning or any evening paper but I will lay long odds that it would never have occurred to communicate with
00:19:01
a press agency curious is it not that this Maniac makes his communication to an agency which serves the entire press
00:19:08
it is an idea which might occur to a press man perhaps and even then it would probably only occur to someone connected
00:19:15
with the editorial Department of a newspaper someone who knew what the central news was and the place it filled
00:19:21
in its business of news Supply this proceeding on Jack's part part betrays an inner knowledge of the newspaper
00:19:28
world which is certainly surprising everything therefore points to the fact that the jist is professionally
00:19:34
connected with the press and if he is telling the truth and not fooling us then we brought are brought face to face
00:19:40
with the fact that the White Chapel murders have been committed by a practical journalist perhaps even a real
00:19:45
life editor which is absurd and at that I think I will leave it so he's like nah
00:19:51
by it's a very very valid point that is this 100% betrayed somebody with an inner idea of how the press and news
00:20:00
work and honestly in White Chapel especially at the time the lay person did not know that that was not something
00:20:06
that people were just going to know on the streets that postcard was also talking like it was sent before the
00:20:13
double event like I said but it was actually postmarked over 24 hours after it was done yeah so the ear thing it was
00:20:21
postmarked after that happened could have already known so it seems like whoever sent it tried to make it look
00:20:26
like it was before but that post mark betrays it mhm and again the dates are all confusing so that postmark is the
00:20:33
only real thing you can go off of and if you look at it it's after the double event fake news now also the coagulated
00:20:41
blood in the ginger bottle that's the whole thing that I'm like goes up my butt this is a medically minded person
00:20:48
HH Holmes is a medically minded person the real killer would not be shocked that blood coagulated in a ginger bottle
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and it would obviously that would would be coagulated by the time you sat down to write that stupid [ __ ] letter if
00:21:01
you were keeping it from there it would be jelly in minutes and the real killer would know that and Holmes would also
00:21:08
know that regardless of his knowledge of medicine he did graduate from medical school he's done a [ __ ] ton of stuff he
00:21:14
knows what blood does he's seen it it's stupid so this letter WR in in in conclusion this is Fu stupid I just
00:21:23
broke for a second you you sure did in in in conion we just had to slap her real quick and she was like whoop okay
00:21:29
I'm back so his fake surprise and being like Oh I had to switch the red ink like
00:21:35
that's just over the top and dumb yeah like it's just not real one if we're claiming this is really Jack the Ripper
00:21:41
it doesn't even line up even if we don't know who that is we know he knows he's going to know what blood does he've seen
00:21:48
blood coagulate in front of him probably so it's really not shocking and then if
00:21:53
you're claiming this guy is HH Holmes who even wrote this letter that doesn't make sense and then if you're saying
00:21:59
that HH Holmes is Jack the Ripper and that this letter is real I'm sorry I cannot get behind that it's a it's a
00:22:07
girl by moment It's a Girl by moment for me and then the last thing that makes me
00:22:12
crazy is if HH Holmes was in fact the committer of the White Chapel murders he was Jack the [ __ ]
00:22:22
Ripper when that guy got ex when he was he had an execution date he knew he was gone I am I am headed off I'm Shuffling
00:22:31
off this Mortal coil I know this he started being wild like that man started telling tall tales and started being
00:22:40
like I have killed 4,000 people like he was just that's crazy all he wanted was to see in the papers what a [ __ ]
00:22:47
fiend he was and how he was a monster and he'll go down in history and B he [ __ ] loved it cuz he knew he was
00:22:53
going to die anyway so he wanted his legacy to be that he was a [ __ ] fiend and then he would about it and pull it
00:22:59
back if he was Jack the Ripper you think he would have just neglected to put that
00:23:06
in there like you think he would have just like like come on I don't see it like he would have omitted the [ __ ]
00:23:13
White Chapel murders out of his legacy me thinks not I don't think so I think he would have been like guys you think
00:23:20
this was wild you should extradite me over to London cuz I did some [ __ ] there
00:23:26
I think he would just be like let's go and he would have been able to live longer yeah and he would have been able
00:23:29
to talk about it more he would have [ __ ] loved to talk about you think he would have done all that and then not
00:23:36
talked about it no no no it's just not realistic girl bye it's just not realistic I don't see it so I wish you
00:23:45
had a gavel if you believe we have something that can sounds like a gavel right did that hurt though no it didn't
00:23:53
uh but so if you believe that they are one in the same I support your your uh freedom of thought Al says you're wrong
00:24:02
uh but you're wrong and I'm right that's the way it is just Capricorn things so there's that I'm wrong you're right and
00:24:10
that's it I don't think people are going to think I'm such an [ __ ] um what's you I was gonna say
00:24:18
breaking news Elena is an [ __ ] uh so let's get back to uh Herman Webster mudget get it
00:24:26
yeah so I just had to get through that we had to talk about it it was the elephant in the the room all that good
00:24:32
stuff he's not Jack the Ripper so let's talk about him as he is so this man has now again killed a bunch of people he's
00:24:39
come back from Canada we got the detectives on his Trail and staying in Canada definitely would have been a
00:24:45
better idea yeah um since neither the the Pinkerton agents or detective Gary from Fidelity mutual why will it never
00:24:53
not be funny cuz every time I hear Ronnie and Ben goooo tell about Gary from below deck
00:24:59
see and I just love detective Gary from Fidelity mutual it's it is the equivalent to Jake from sa F really is
00:25:07
what are you wearing Gary from Fidelity mutual well the thing is the Pinkerton agents and detective Gary neither one of
00:25:13
them had Authority in Canada oh that's so he he might not have even been extradited like I'm sure Canada like we
00:25:21
know Canada and they would have been like girl we'll help you out like Canada's kind but like you don't know
00:25:27
that would have been pretty [ __ ] ballsy yeah but the agents did make their way up there because they knew
00:25:33
Canada was kind and that they could get them on their side they said I'm coming up but this time the uh the agents
00:25:40
arrived in Toronto and Holmes and Georgiana had already left and were on their way to meet Carrie pitel in
00:25:46
ogdenburg New York where they had told her for the hundredth time she would be meeting her husband ha that and the and
00:25:55
I'm what I'm assuming is the end of her life that's all she heard it's she was I the amount of times that she was
00:26:02
shuffled somewhere and then told her husband would be there and then they were like yeah just kidding kills me I
00:26:08
know it's so sad but when Holmes and Georgiana arrived in New York he immediately let Carrie know uhoh this is
00:26:16
too small of a town for us to arrange a meeting and he said everyone is attending to everyone's business here so
00:26:21
he said my God you can go to Burlington Vermont that's where he'll be oh I [ __ ] love Burlington Vermont yeah and
00:26:26
he said he said there you can Ben it's a nice place it is but you're not going to
00:26:31
see Ben he has shuffled her everywhere she's come from Canada down to New York again and he's like Vermont and that
00:26:38
also shows like how in love with her husband she was that she was willing to go all these places cuz you would think
00:26:43
at some point she'd be like what the [ __ ] The Jig Is up but the love for her husband clearly kept her going and she
00:26:49
thinks that her kids might be with him too so she's just like all hope right now Holmes at this point had written a
00:26:55
letter to his um brother in New Hampshire oh right saying that he had had amnesia for eight years the eight
00:27:03
years since they had seen him I forgot about that like oops I just forgot everything and I would love to come back
00:27:09
home and you know just see all the things that I haven't seen it's like the episode of Full House where Michelle
00:27:16
falls off the horse yes that was a very intense episode true but somewhere between Canada and where he ends up in
00:27:21
Boston later we'll see he had heard yep he had heard that he was being tailed I just pulled on my ear uh to be like he
00:27:29
had heard it felt like softball something but I was like he heard with his ears I was like is that
00:27:36
where he does have like pretty gnarly ears but he heard with those big ears that he was being tailed for murder in
00:27:43
Chicago that's people had figured [ __ ] out but he didn't know by who he didn't
00:27:48
know the pinkertons were involved and he didn't know detective Gary was involved
00:27:51
and he didn't know when he just heard this rumor so in the week that followed Holmes continued this whole [ __ ] he
00:27:59
told Carrie Benjamin's husband or wife and Desi their 16-year-old daughter because now there's Desi the 16-year-old
00:28:07
daughter and Wharton is like a baby those are the only two left right the other three have been murdered by Holmes
00:28:13
um so she he tells Carrie and Desi their 16-year-old daughter that Benjamin was alive and well and is now oh no he's up
00:28:20
in Montreal again told them he's back in Canada I don't even know what I would [ __ ] do
00:28:26
at that point I I think I would are exactly losing it and they said that he so she he claimed that he went back up
00:28:32
there because he didn't feel it was safe to be in the US he thought he was going
00:28:35
to get caught so he was like waiting to reunite with his family and then he told
00:28:39
them you won't even know him he has a new set of teeth and is all fixed up nice so you won't know him at all he's
00:28:45
very anxious to see you he's such an evil [ __ ] so [ __ ] like no one really knows why he was continuing the scheme
00:28:53
at this point cuz he was enjoying it he'd already claimed the money for the insurance payout and he killed the three
00:28:59
pitel children so there was really no reason to continue this he could have just abandoned her and left like other
00:29:05
than she she did know a lot that's true but he would have been like who's going to believe you like what they've already
00:29:10
paid out the insurance thing like it's I truly believe he was just having a lot of fun emotionally torturing this family
00:29:18
that's so [ __ ] I believe you yeah now on November 5th I believe you on November 5th Holmes left Carrie pitel in
00:29:25
Burlington and he took $1,000 from George Gana his wife and he traveled to gilmon New Hampshire where he was from
00:29:33
where CLA is where his son Robert is now remember that he had sent the letter to
00:29:38
his brother um and he said so when he did this he told Georgiana that he needed the ,000 because he was traveling
00:29:46
to Kingston for a business meeting with an Associate from Chicago so he's just lying all over the place like a rug and
00:29:53
he said it was going to be silly boring stuff you know it would be better if Georgiana stayed behind yeah of course
00:29:58
you should definitely stay behind just hang tight so off he goes and apparently everyone must have bought the Amnesia
00:30:03
story right like right off the bat according to the Boston Globe Clara showered her long-lost husband in kisses
00:30:11
thrilled to have discovered him to be alive oh my God now when I read that I said yeah huh like do we do we remember
00:30:19
how she would walk around that place with black eyes like are we she really that psyched to see this [ __ ] right
00:30:24
now according to Adam Selzer those newspaper accounts were probably very embellished fake [ __ ] meaning Clara and
00:30:31
Holmes had not seen each other in like forever and the last time they had seen each other he was violent and he was
00:30:37
shitty and neglectful of their children child and her and then there was like some other communication where he wrote
00:30:43
to her and wanted full custody exactly he treated her like [ __ ] mhm so I doubt
00:30:48
she was immediately just like oh my God yes she was probably like [ __ ] so it's
00:30:52
much more likely that he gave them a very selective rundown of what he'd been doing in the years that he bit away he
00:30:59
definitely explained the bigamy as Amnesia related having you know I forgot that I was married oh my God so he told
00:31:05
them he was married again yeah he was like oops I got married again they were like excuse me and according to Holmes
00:31:10
it was only in the last two or so months that something had happened to cause his
00:31:14
memory to come back so that's why he wanted to return to his life as Herman Webster mudget totally now it's funny
00:31:21
because he speaks about this time very strangely for him when he wrote about it okay it's like emotion filled
00:31:28
strangely um about his return to New Hampshire he said here many changes had taken place even my initials that have
00:31:36
been deeply cut into one of the large Elm trees that grow so slowly had become obliterated this touched me deeply
00:31:43
seeming so much in keeping with what had been in reality had what had in reality occurred
00:31:48
to the name itself so he's saying like my name had been obliterated in reality and it was obliterated on that tree and
00:31:56
like that's a very like deep that is like this [ __ ] is getting nostalgic yeah it's like an
00:32:00
introspective way of speaking about it which is not very of him I would say or at least he usually does it falsely and
00:32:07
that seemed a little more real like I who I was and like I'm like but then you just continue to it's very weird no one
00:32:15
get could stop at that point I think yeah no one gets this though I don't get it he probably doesn't get it that much
00:32:22
maybe I think there is like something about going home you know like I think that made him introspective must have
00:32:28
and what's weird though too is no one knows why he really went back to New Hampshire do you think he loved his
00:32:34
parents I don't know or like it's not love but like whatever he felt don't know I really don't know I couldn't put
00:32:41
my finger on anything because nothing makes sense for him the only thing I can think of is that he like you were saying
00:32:46
he knows the the detectives are hot on his Trail for murder maybe he did just want to go home and say like have have a
00:32:54
couple more memories with his parents and Clara see that's [ __ ] weird or like he knew they were on his tail and
00:33:01
so he went back there and he was fully ready to become Herman Webster mudget again right and he was like maybe if I
00:33:09
leave Holmes behind I leave all these other aliases behind I leave Howard behind all this I'm Herman Webster
00:33:16
mudget I am my birth name like you know maybe that maybe this will keep me safe like they won't be able to track me and
00:33:23
if I convince everyone that I had Amnesia that nothing's happened in the eight years and we just start a new
00:33:29
right that maybe like I'll be able to avoid all this because maybe he was even planning on like the Amnesia story
00:33:35
selling it to himself over time truly you know yeah but then so we I said that and we said that and we're like that
00:33:42
makes a little sense we be say but he didn't stay long he left after only two days maybe he just couldn't take it on a
00:33:51
train for Boston no get out of here exactly but I'm like what were you doing like what was
00:33:58
was the plan that initially and you were like this isn't going to work maybe maybe like maybe you saw that [ __ ]
00:34:03
tree and you were like oh [ __ ] yeah change things maybe it gave him like maybe he was very introspective in that
00:34:08
moment he's like the name has been obliterated on the tree I can never come back to Herman Webster mudget so I just
00:34:14
need to like go forth I really am gone I really am HH ches the only thing I could
00:34:20
also think of so another thing like his child his first born was a son mhm and that was like [ __ ] huge
00:34:29
the day that so maybe he was like I must see my son one more time yeah I don't know cuz then remember he also wanted
00:34:36
the custody and we were like why did he want custody of his son like that doesn't make any sense it's very strange
00:34:40
I don't know it's very strange now before leaving New Hampshire after those two days Holmes sent a telegram to
00:34:46
Georgiana in New York you know his wife yeah telling her to meet him in Boston so before he even left he was already
00:34:54
like I'm out of here uh they met at a train station on November 13 and from there they checked into the Adams House
00:35:00
as Mr and Mrs hm Howell so he's right back to his own old [ __ ] the next day he checked them into a boarding
00:35:07
house in Boston because he was planning to stay longer now meanwhile unbeknown to homes detective Gary and the
00:35:13
Pinkerton followed him from New Hampshire to Boston once there they went straight to the Boston PD and spoke to
00:35:21
them about setting out to arrest homes for the Philadelphia insurance fraud unfortunately the Boston police Chief at
00:35:28
the time felt that the warrant from Philadelphia was not like super strong and he said I could probably get him but
00:35:34
I'm not going to be able to hold him with this okay so he was sicking ahead he was so Gary was like I got you and he
00:35:40
scrambled and got a second warrant from for Fort Worth Texas the one where Holmes was wanted for being a horse
00:35:47
thief and horse thevery is a big deal so this would strengthen the case to hold him in Boston I guess they could have
00:35:54
also tried to get a warrant from Chicago for the arson too but they didn't need to you would think that they would want
00:35:59
to I know November 17th 1894 Holmes left the boarding house to go for a nice little morning walk how'd that turn out
00:36:06
because he was so [ __ ] egotistical that he assumed that there was no way he was being tracked in Boston with his big
00:36:11
old mustache like everybody knows exactly you are [ __ ] what a Dumis and also if you were on the run and you had
00:36:16
committed all of those things don't you think the first [ __ ] thing You' do is shave your [ __ ] stupid mustache you
00:36:21
think that but he knew he knew under that there was nothing good I mean there usually isn't but while walking he was
00:36:29
suddenly and very quickly surrounded by three inspectors from the Boston police and one Pinkerton agent freeze
00:36:35
[ __ ] and they told him he was coming down to speak to them at the station I love it now at first Holmes
00:36:40
was like oh what what are you talking about acting shocked and very confused I've had Amnesia and he tried to talk
00:36:45
his way out of it like he always does but he quickly gave in when they were like we're not going away [ __ ] now
00:36:51
remember he had heard that he was being tailed and he had heard he was being tailed for murder in Chicago so at some
00:36:58
point he was like I I was figuring I was going to get caught at some point but he
00:37:04
assumed it was for murder and instead they're arresting him with a warrant for horse thievery so
00:37:11
when he goes to the station he's confronted by um another agent from Fidelity mutual named uh Forest Perry
00:37:19
see that's better Forest Perry from Fidelity mutual yeah it makes sense he confronts him for faking the death of
00:37:25
Benjamin pitel and he was like like oh good yeah absolutely so he like I'm technically not up for murder okay so he
00:37:33
just confessed he was like okay so he said quote um went to Philadelphia with pitel rented the house on callow Hill
00:37:41
Street and fitted it up with for both a bachelor's headquarters and a business office then stated that he went on to
00:37:47
New York where he met an old medical friend of his through him he obtained a body which would answer in every
00:37:53
description that of BF pitel the preparation of the body by burning one side with Benzene or other ignitable
00:38:00
fluid followed and the old clay pipe was placed dangerously near it so as to suggest a terrific explosion so he
00:38:07
admitted everything except for murdering Benjamin pitel he said oh no no we put a
00:38:12
a person there in his place but that person was already dead we're just we're just frauding Insurance that's all like
00:38:18
no murders here we just knew of a dead body locally yeah and he also said he was part of a band of conspirators that
00:38:24
included Benjamin himself and Carrie pitel and which I mean he kind of was and in
00:38:31
his first confession to Deputy superintendent hansum of the Boston police and John Cornish of the Pinkerton
00:38:37
detective agency he claimed that Benjamin pitel was still very much alive he said quote well I last saw him in
00:38:44
Detroit in the neighborhood of three weeks ago and he said he accompanied the children for a short time and then was
00:38:50
to hand them over to their father in Cincinnati that was the plan MH but when they got there he said pel had started
00:38:56
drinking heavily again and he just wasn't comfortable leaving the children with him wow this man wow this man who
00:39:05
had gassed those children to death this man is claiming their father who he murdered was such a was such an
00:39:15
alcoholic that he didn't feel comfortable leaving those children with him wow and he gassed those girls in a
00:39:21
trunk wow yeah and poisoned he lied about it yeah he poisoned them so a he said he had some discussions
00:39:30
with Benjamin and then he said he and Benjamin quote compromised there so he took one of them and I took the other
00:39:37
two to Chicago because I had business there you can have one I think you can handle one in your drunken super just
00:39:43
one just the boy but I'll take the others and he said thinking that it would not call anyone's attention so
00:39:47
quick if he traveled with the boy alone as if there were three what sense thank you for saying the exact like what yeah
00:39:54
exactly holes probably Ed his confession would like pretty much answer all the lingering questions they had I mean he
00:40:03
he did the thing that really stupid murderers do where he prepares an answer for every single question that could
00:40:09
come up but it's so hyper prepared and rehears that you're like that's not possibly have all these answers right
00:40:15
but he thought it was going to make up you know people are going to Now understand his International and
00:40:20
Interstate travels like all that but I think he finally overestimated his abilities to [ __ ] around and not find
00:40:27
out because within a day of his confession they' moved a fresh body in a trunk from
00:40:32
New York to Philadelphia and the coroner pointed out that the body in the apartment had been laid out flat which
00:40:38
would have been which wouldn't have been possible if the man had been dead for some time so they did a little
00:40:43
experiment yeah they did where they said okay so you brought that body from here
00:40:47
to here in a trunk you said that body that was supposed to be Benjamin pel's like double okay how'd you lay it flat
00:40:55
how'd you do that like that doesn't make any sense and that's just such a classic
00:40:59
like well I thought I was smarter and they also said they said first of all it wouldn't have laid flat if it was in
00:41:05
like any position and they said definitely not if it was in a trunk for a long period of time right and they
00:41:10
said it would have shown marks of where it had been doubled up uhhuh so no such marks were on the body and holm's
00:41:17
confession didn't hold up under any of this of course he couldn't explain any of this of course not yeah so
00:41:23
investigators immediately said that b the body found was really that of P C and not of someone else so the claim of
00:41:31
such a like this was truly a like gruesome insurance fraud scheme even if you take away the murder like it's just
00:41:38
gruesome no matter what so headlines were going crazy and within days it was blowing up all over the place after just
00:41:45
two days of being arrested in Boston Pinkerton agents arrested Carrie pitel in Burlington Vermont she was probably
00:41:51
like what the [ __ ] and then she was just there waiting for Benjamin of course yeah she was brought to Boston and she
00:41:58
was interrogated by hansam and Cornish the P the Boston cop and the Pinkerton detective and she wasn't super
00:42:06
forthcoming unfortunately well she was probably scared she sure was like you said she was involved in a scheme and
00:42:12
she was trying to protect her husband who she still believed was alive so she lied and denied any knowledge of a fraud
00:42:19
scheme which only made her look more complic than she complicit than she even was in reality based on all this and
00:42:27
Holmes's confession detectives confirmed that they believed quote the missing man
00:42:32
Benjamin pitel is dead and that he met his death at the hands of homes so although she may have had some knowledge
00:42:39
of the scheme to defraud the insurance company detectives were pretty sure pretty quick that Carrie pitel didn't
00:42:47
play a part in the actual crime okay um they said she probably only knew of the Swindle after her husband was supposed
00:42:54
to be dead Y and police were pretty confident that she definitely wasn't directly involved in it she hadn't had
00:42:59
her hands in it but they said there is someone else who seems to have their hands in this jeepa how the lawyer oh my
00:43:06
God I forgot about jeepta that nefarious unscrupulous lawyer is it jeepta how or Jeep dah how no it's jeepa
00:43:16
how gotcha um he was arrested at his home in St Louis St Louis um on November 20th and the warrant charged him with
00:43:24
being a fugitive from Justice wolf he released a statement saying I do not believe that a fraud has been committed
00:43:31
I believe the body identified by pel's 15-year-old daughter was that of her father the marks of identification were
00:43:37
perfect as to how pelm his death I cannot say but if a fraud has been committed I'm anxious to have it
00:43:44
investigated liar liar pants on fire and his immediately arson was another charge
00:43:49
because his pants lit right on fire yep um on November 19th a Philadelphia Grand
00:43:54
jurry indicted Holmes and how for cons iracy to cheat and defraud the Fidelity mutual company you don't want to be
00:44:00
doing that the indictment also added a third conspirator onto it Charles A pitel who's that again who that is is no
00:44:12
one investigators made an oopsie who that is is no one and Charles aitel girl has no
00:44:21
name it's just one of Benjamin's aliases so so they didn't realize that yet and they literally indicted a dead man's
00:44:29
Alias for his own murder wolf.com I just love who that is is no one so there's that there's the that of it all so
00:44:41
there's that the following day they were extradited to Philadelphia to stand trial so Holmes killed Benjamin pitel so
00:44:48
that meant correct he couldn't have left the three missing children with their father no so now the question became
00:44:56
where the kid where the [ __ ] are Alice Nelly and Howard pitel yeah so the missing pitel
00:45:02
children are definitely like top priority right now but now they're also looking into like the Nationwide crime
00:45:08
spree like an international crime spree that was shocking them at this point in Chicago a bunch of people came forward
00:45:16
and identified Holmes as a man they'd once known by many other names before he had run out on them before paying for
00:45:24
anything that he had put on credit and in Texas people stly suddenly started connecting their loved ones Minnie and
00:45:31
Nanny Williams with this man and were stressing the [ __ ] out they they were like something terrible has happened
00:45:38
here and in the time since she' gone missing several private detectives were sent from CH Texas to Chicago in search
00:45:45
of Nanny Williams Because her trunk had sat unclaimed at the Wells Fargo office for months and then was returned to her
00:45:53
aunt so in Texas which shocked them all and none of them could get a hold of her
00:45:58
the Chicago Tribune reported it is certain Nanny Williams did come to Chicago but whether she was murdered is
00:46:04
a point that can only be cleared up when her sister Minnie is brought to light by
00:46:09
the time SES reached Philadelphia on the 21st of November he started talking about mini too because they were
00:46:15
bringing her up right according to the Philadelphia police detective Thomas Crawford one of the uh somebody who was
00:46:22
transporting homes from Boston to Philadelphia talk he said he talked a lot I was just going to say imagine
00:46:29
being that guy oh my God and you just have to hear him he's told the bizarre story about um Nanny Williams like how
00:46:36
she had died he told like several different stories about that and under hypnosis Crawford this police detective
00:46:44
relayed the story that he had heard from homes oh that's crazy yeah he said he went to CH Chicago with his first wife
00:46:51
and there fell in with a young typewriter named Minnie Williams for whom he secured furnished apartment
00:46:57
the girl was often visited by her elder sister the younger however was jealous of Holmes and one day knocked her on the
00:47:03
head and killed her when Holmes returned and found the dead body in the rooms he
00:47:08
took it and put it in a trunk together with a lot of stones and sank it in the lake the younger sister having property
00:47:14
in Texas he and pel took the property off her hands and furnished her with money to go to Europe where she is now
00:47:21
nope so again claiming that Minnie was jealous of Nanny and and homes killed Nanny and a jealous rage by beating her
00:47:28
over the head with a stool leaving her in the bed then helped holes put her in the trunk sink her to the bottom of the
00:47:35
lake and then he she signed over the deed to the Texas properties to homes in pitel and then they gave her a little
00:47:42
money and off she went to Europe to live out the rest of her days that's what he's claiming the story he spun about
00:47:48
Millie Minnie killing her sister at a jealous rage just like was not anything anybody was going to believe it wasn't
00:47:54
hdden with anyone which is good cuz that's also so [ __ ] that he killed the both of them and was like the young one
00:48:00
was just jealous of the older one so he she beat her with a stool and this was also further cemented in by the hordes
00:48:05
of people who after he was arrested wanted to tell reporters about their interactions with homes many of them had
00:48:13
met holes and Minnie Williams in Chicago but the problem was that they both they
00:48:17
were known as different names and in some cases the women they thought was Minnie Williams was actually Georgiana
00:48:25
yolks oh [ __ ] but he was like introducing her saying this is Minnie and she was like yeah it's me Minnie he
00:48:32
also had another known associate named Kate derky who he didn't kill and he would it was also her sometimes that he
00:48:39
would say was mini the [ __ ] and and these women were just like yep it's me that's the thing like what now
00:48:45
eventually enough stories had come forward to allow investigators to conclude that Minnie was also missing
00:48:51
and had in fact not been seen by anyone since she was last spotted with her sister in Chicago in mid December
00:48:58
1893 now in the year that followed after this Holmes's story about Minnie and Nanny Williams changed a billion times
00:49:05
he never told the same story twice in some they're both alive they're both dead many had gone into hiding after
00:49:12
killing her sister but then sometimes he would say I'd only told that story for fun because this Crawford guy was super
00:49:19
gullible and I wanted to see if he'd he'd believe it but regardless of what he would say it was always that mini
00:49:26
killed her sister then fled to Chicago and he hadn't seen her since that was what he would like go back to always so
00:49:33
stupid so Holmes spent the winter of 1895 in jail and journalists were talking to anyone who had even come in
00:49:41
slight contact with him in his travels meanwhile detective Frank guire from the Philadelphia police had set out from
00:49:50
Philadelphia to track his movements before his arrest so that they could figure out maybe where they missing pit
00:49:56
cell children along his path by then investigators had learned a ton more about homes and they learned that he had
00:50:04
what like dozens and dozens of aliases at the time that he had moved from one hotel to the other to a boarding house
00:50:10
to renting house like they were learning all this [ __ ] as it's happening I'm just
00:50:14
picturing them connecting the red lines and just having the wall become a red line yes literally and now with all of
00:50:21
this they're trying to find these kids and it's becoming so complicated that it must have been so frustrating
00:50:27
and just like imagine how desperate they felt yes and Guy began retracing Holmes's steps and he's checking in with
00:50:34
every hotel along the way every boarding house every Alias he's falling up on just trying to find these kids must been
00:50:42
exhausting everyone now Holmes was no help and his stories were becoming more and more inconsistent they were changing
00:50:50
he would just lie he would pull it back but then in his possession they found a small tin and that small tin had a bunch
00:50:59
of letters that the children had written their mother Carrie pitel oh no and she
00:51:05
had written them too and he had never sent them and he had never given them her letters and using the dates and
00:51:12
locations reference in the letters guire was able to trace a pretty accurate route of homes his travels with the kids
00:51:20
from Indianapolis to Canada holy [ __ ] so they used those letters from the kids um
00:51:26
and in a town outside Cincinnati they talked to a bunch of like shopkeepers and they showed them a photograph of the
00:51:33
man identified as homes and they were like yep we know that guy and then they said he was traveling in the company of
00:51:39
a young boy who was later identified as Howard pitel got him well and also a hotel clerk in
00:51:46
Cincinnati identified hommes as the man who checked in with two girls but he didn't remember seeing a boy but
00:51:53
remember he killed Howard first MH in each new location guy would hear another story homes would
00:51:59
arrive with children rented a house or apartment for a really short period of time and then he would leave and go to
00:52:04
another one this story finally changed in July 1895 because guire traveled all the way
00:52:11
up to Toronto following the trail now he worked with the Toronto police force and
00:52:17
he uh they helped him Trace holes' steps all along the city along the way he got
00:52:22
more and more positive identifications from eyewitnesses um people would see homes Georgiana and
00:52:29
Nelly and Alice from hotel managers at the Walker house um where they said the girls were staying the Palmer House
00:52:36
where he stayed with Georgiana and through this investigation he finally learned that Holmes had in expressed
00:52:43
interest in buying or renting a house in several of the locations he was in in Toronto yep so he went around to every
00:52:51
real estate agent that he found in the area [ __ ] and like just asked if they Rec elected ever renting a house about
00:52:58
that time to a man who maybe only stayed there a few days and who represented that he wanted this house for his
00:53:05
widowed sister because that's the story he was hearing but the fact that he would only need it for a few days would
00:53:10
be so memorable exactly so after doing this only for a couple of days he finally found an agent who rented a
00:53:17
house on the outskirts of Toronto to a man who only stayed there for a little bit and matched the description so guire
00:53:24
and the Toronto detectives arrived at at this house and now an older couple was living there with their adult son oh God
00:53:31
so the detectives were like hey uh we have reason to believe that two young girls were murdered in this house and
00:53:37
their bodies might be buried somewhere on the property can we like look do you mind if we look God you imagine not
00:53:43
[ __ ] knock on your door well apparently the owners weren't like crazy shocked they go that accounts for that
00:53:48
pile of loose dirt under the main building you didn't want to call anybody about that Jesus Christ so the couple's
00:53:54
older son helped them and they got under the house and began digging but the space was really small and it was really
00:54:02
difficult to move around in so it was slow this process and eventually they had to stop because investigators
00:54:09
determined it was not a house rented by HH homes what so there was just some random loose dirt in their
00:54:17
house no that was not Co [ __ ] you now while guy was retracing Holmes's who whoa thr your pupsy across the room
00:54:28
chica I just said my Psy sliding across the desk you were playing like air hockey with it all the time I went to go
00:54:34
like move it cuz I thought it was falling off and then I almost made it fall off so you launched it so I
00:54:39
launched it into the sun now while guy was retracing all the movements in Canada Holmes was on trial in
00:54:47
Philadelphia for conspiring to defraud the Fidelity mutual life Association of $10,000 by producing a dead body and
00:54:54
representing it to be the corpse of Benjamin fpip so that that's what he's on to type all that uh Holmes plad
00:55:00
guilty to the fraud charges but when asked he said he would refuse to say to the district attorney or Philadelphia
00:55:07
investigators where those children were he was not going to tell them of course so they took him to County Prison now
00:55:14
several days went by guire is still up in Canada talking to every real estate agent ever and finally comes across
00:55:23
another one several days later and it was for a house on Vincent Street rented by a name matching and you might
00:55:31
remember that street I remember Vincent Street and the man who rented it matched
00:55:35
Holmes's description so on the morning of July 15th guire and his associates arrive at the house they speak to the
00:55:42
next door neighbor and the next door neighbor says yeah I saw Holmes's picture in the papers and he was
00:55:48
definitely the one who rented this house for his widowed sister mhm and the neighbor also said yeah I didn't get a
00:55:54
good look at the girls but he definitely had two girls with him I could and he said I won't identify them as the two
00:56:00
girls cuz I didn't get a good enough look but he said ah also before he left town like shortly before he asked me to
00:56:06
borrow a a shovel oh I forgot about that guy was like okay cool and so he went to
00:56:12
the owner of the house the one who rented it to homes and they positively identified homes as the man who' rented
00:56:18
it and they said by all means search that house no problem here so guy and the other detectives went into the
00:56:24
basement and it didn't take long before they found a spot of ground in the southwest corner of the room that was
00:56:31
definitely recently Disturbed they began digging like pretty easily it was moving
00:56:36
away and guy said and after going down about one foot a horrible stench arose so they were convinced this is it so guy
00:56:44
began digging with his hands like ripping out dirt and they were able to unearth a tomb they said the deeper we
00:56:51
dug the more horrible the odor became and when we reached the depth of 3 feet we discovered what appeared to be the
00:56:57
bone of the forearm of a human being thank god with the help of The Undertaker the local Undertaker BD
00:57:04
Humphrey BD Humphrey the local Undertaker he should be yeah absolutely no other career path I will not question
00:57:10
that ever BD Humphrey for life ever um guire and the detectives were able to unearth the two bodies in the basement
00:57:18
they were very decomposed and were actually a little bit injured from being exed as well cuz it was not like a a
00:57:24
very put together ex Exum but I'm glad that they were able to be located so that they could actually be
00:57:30
put to rest and they were able to be um put into two separate coffins which is good they weren't just dumped in one
00:57:36
thing that's good um yeah it's really sad but um with the B so badly decomposed that's going to be a problem
00:57:44
but enough that they were able to put two and two together um the children's remains were taken to the morg for
00:57:50
examination and guire sent um a telegram to the district attorney Grant letting him know that he should definitely
00:57:58
proceed with murder murder charges against HH holes yikes unfortunately the remains of Howard pitel the third child
00:58:05
were never discovered oh and people believe that he was probably scattered or buried on the property where he was
00:58:11
actually murdered oh that's terrible now after the bodies of Alice and Nelly were
00:58:16
uncovered Holmes's guilty plea in the fraud case became kind of a problem because the girls had been killed in
00:58:22
Canada so homes would need to be extradited to Toronto in order to stand trial for the murders and once he'd
00:58:29
learned of the discovery Holmes claimed he was traveling at the time that the girls were killed and he couldn't have
00:58:35
possibly done it which Georgiana verified I don't really like her yeah I'm not a fan now instead Holmes said
00:58:44
the pitel children were killed by a man named Hatch is that your Alter Ego he described this man as a mythical sort of
00:58:52
person and I'm like I'm sure he was mythical because he doesn't exist um in a very disreputable character Mr hatch
00:58:59
was apparently a friend of many Williams according to him isn't everybody and he'd reluctantly given the girls to this
00:59:06
man during a stop in Buffalo you wouldn't leave them with their father but you gave them to a random dis
00:59:11
reputable mythical man named Hatch yeah and he had instructed hatch to take them
00:59:17
with Minnie to Europe everybody's just hanging out in Europe going to Europe totally see he is
00:59:23
obsessed with Europe I will say that uh when superintendent of police Lyndon heard this statement he replied that man
00:59:30
Holmes is the most infernal liar I have ever been brought in contact with his willingness to plead guilty to the
00:59:36
charge of conspiracy led us to think that something must be back of the case so the discovery of the two bodies
00:59:43
pretty much confirmed to all the news outlets and the public that HH Holmes was definitely a multiple murderer at
00:59:49
the time it was not known as a serial killer MH within days of that Discovery newspapers went wild around the country
00:59:58
in Chicago investigators and citizens started digging around the rubble of the castle because remember it had burned
01:00:05
not all the way down but part of it had but they were thinking they would find bones of victims and they were going to
01:00:11
try to attack [ __ ] Chicago was looking for evidence of Minnie and Nanny's remains at the C at the castle and on
01:00:18
July 19th two detectives who were looking through the ashes that were technically used to be the basement um
01:00:26
they found an old stove and when they looked in the Firebox of the stove they discovered a quantity of charged um
01:00:32
charred human remains and a Watch chain forly owned and worn by many Williams wow so he had burned their bodies in the
01:00:41
stove that's terrible at the time of the whole crime spree and the arrest and all
01:00:46
that newspapers like especially like the Metropolitan papers were not held to like very high standards yeah I could
01:00:55
see that um there was a lot of competition among them they wanted to be the one with the most readers so this
01:01:01
would definitely lead to some leaning towards like tabloid kind of reporting um and they were a little bit more
01:01:07
willing to exaggerate and fabricate you know what's sad so many still around today do the same thing like how often
01:01:14
do you find fake [ __ ] when you're researching and you're like why does no other article say that yeah it's like
01:01:19
what now Holmes knew this and he almost was kind of like eager to play along with it of course he would give
01:01:26
outrageous statements contradictory statements like things that would like make him like the most bloodthirsty
01:01:34
ruthless killer leaving bodies all across the country like that's another reason why I don't think he would have
01:01:40
left out that he was Jack the Ripper I think this would have been the time he would have been like by the way you know
01:01:45
those crazy murders in White Chapel yeah seems like a big part to skip but a lot
01:01:49
of papers did operate the way they should on fact um but they would definitely still kind of like
01:01:55
sensationalize the whole thing cuzz how can you not when Julia and pearl Connor's disappearances were connected
01:02:01
to homes finally in the summer of 8 1895 the Chicago Chronicle had this to say have two more victims of murder been
01:02:09
added to the long list to Holmes's credit Mrs LL Connor and her daughter are now supposed to have been killed by
01:02:15
the swindler Holmes is said to have coerced the woman to deceive her husband and to Aid his General schemes of V
01:02:20
villainy Mrs Connor then lived with Holmes but they quarreled frequently and she threatened to expose him she
01:02:27
disappeared in the fall of 1893 with her daughter and friends believe that they have been removed by homes where the
01:02:32
woman could not possibly appear against him it's so factual but it's just the way they presented is very Sensational
01:02:39
yeah cuz like we don't know why he did it like we don't know that she threatened to expose him we don't know
01:02:45
any of that you added that in as like drama and how like how would you even prove that why would you write that if
01:02:51
you can't prove it like because it just sounds more like but meanwhile investigators in Philadelphia Toronto
01:02:58
and Chicago and every other city that Holmes had been spending a ton of time in they were connecting the dots between
01:03:05
unsolved crimes in their cities and this guy yep slowly unraveling this whole complex crime spree that he had been on
01:03:13
for eight years at this point it's [ __ ] wild soon there was a connection made between Holmes and emilene
01:03:20
srand um and they were able to attribute her disappearance to him investigators reporters had also been digging into
01:03:27
Holmes's personal history and that's where they learned about his fascination with dissection and chemistry and
01:03:34
obviously those personality traits added with the crimes it's a recipe for just a
01:03:40
wild Tale Now Holmes was indicted in early September 1895 for the murder of Benjamin pitel he entered a plea of not
01:03:49
guilty and when the judge asked how will you be tried Holmes said by God in my country which meant he want at a jury
01:03:56
trial mhm uh in the time between the indictment and the trial Holmes took a lot of advantage of the public he
01:04:04
manipulated the hell out of people I can see that in early October he published his own supposed autobiography entitled
01:04:11
Holmes's Own Story queue up Ashley Simpson exactly the book was an alleged chronological history of Holmes's life
01:04:20
all the way to incarceration it was just bizarre all the way through some of it's real for
01:04:25
sure do you think he was losing it at the end no I don't think he was losing it I think he was very much together I
01:04:31
think he was just a [ __ ] up human being I think he was enjoying it this is all he wanted was to be something right
01:04:37
now the trial began October 28th and from the start it was pretty clear that Holmes's defense attorneys were uh out
01:04:44
of their league in fact although they had previously agreed to the trial date set
01:04:50
by the judge when the day came his Council made quote one of the most desperate fights for postponement ever
01:04:57
witnessed in a criminal trial holy [ __ ] like I really have plans that day I can't do it I can't move my
01:05:05
meeting please screaming give me a r check damn it and it got so outrageous I guess that the judge apparently
01:05:13
threatens sanctions against the lawyers he said if they leave the court they will be punished as lawyers are punished
01:05:20
for Disobedience said cancel your [ __ ] plans we're doing a trial they weren't able to uh withdraw the case for
01:05:27
that day but they didn't technically have to participate either and they didn't oh no they just sat quietly and
01:05:35
let Holmes basically act as his own defense attorney they literally sat in the room and were
01:05:41
like I don't know what to say they were like we don't really know how to defend this man so uh if the real Slim Shady
01:05:47
would please stand up you know what that guy said sanctions that's the only reason I'm here so I'm just going to sit
01:05:54
here now in his opening statement district attorney George Graham laid out his case and he told the jury quote he
01:06:01
would prove that Holmes had killed each of the four pels who were not alive to be called as Witnesses and that he had
01:06:07
tried to kill the rest of them too he presented a very strong case he used a lot of witness testimony and anyone
01:06:15
surviving in the family those who had seen homes with Benjamin and the children before they all disappeared
01:06:21
they all came up to say something Holmes on the other hand just kind of like made
01:06:26
outrageous claims about the prosecutor attempting to prevent him from seeing his quote unquote wife Georgiana yeah it
01:06:34
was all very prevented performative it was not helpful for him at all Eugene Smith the man who'd gone to the patent
01:06:42
laboratory that day to speak about his inventions and ended up finding pel's body he was called to testify and on the
01:06:50
stands on the stand Holmes grilled him about Benjamin pel's drinking habits and other subjects that he couldn't know
01:06:58
anything about like he he didn't know him he's like I just know I had a patent he was so he sitting there grilling him
01:07:04
being like well he's a drinker you know that and he's like I literally don't know that I don't know this man I
01:07:09
thought his last name was Perry so like no I did not know this man I didn't actually even know his name and he's
01:07:14
asking him all these details and he's like my guy I don't know this man all I know of him is the couple of
01:07:19
conversations I would have with him and he was not drunk so like I cannot confirm that got nothing for you then
01:07:26
Holmes just demanded that all the witnesses be removed from the courtroom and the judge was like happen overruled
01:07:34
like he was literally just like uh no no so on the third day Holmes's second confession was read aloud for the jury
01:07:41
because remember he has like 85 and in this one he claimed that the body was Benjamin pitel but Benjamin pitel had
01:07:49
died as the result of suicide the confession was followed by what was likely the most damning testimony of the
01:07:56
trial it was given by Carrie and Desi pitel oh that must have been horrific she positively identified homes as the
01:08:04
man who conspired with her husband and dragged her around the nation in search of her children and she spent hours on
01:08:12
the stand and it was just like heartbreaking she identified the unsent letters found as being from her kids the
01:08:20
New York Harold reported quote her appearance spoke of deep poverty it was as if all her motion emotions were dead
01:08:26
she seemed incapable of suffering or feeling anym when she looked at homes she seemed not to even see him like she
01:08:33
was just I mean she had been through it at that point and then to have all those
01:08:38
[ __ ] letters to read when she lost all children I can't even fathom that and all of the letters were just like
01:08:45
why aren't you writing to us like and she's like they thought I wasn't writing to them that's like to know that they
01:08:50
were in Poison them against me at the end right they died thinking I wasn't I didn't care about them that poor woman I
01:08:56
don't know how she went on after she was a very powerful witness for the prosecution um and when they put her
01:09:03
against homes it definitely helped out as well after several days of testimony and tons of crazy media reports the
01:09:12
things that made holes such a successful criminal like such a successful killer and conman and frauder his ability to
01:09:20
lie confidently have no remorse and just so unbelievable amounts of chaos everywhere he went they were kind of
01:09:28
taking a toll on the jury like the jury was feeling it I could see that he had told so many versions of the same story
01:09:35
and he had made such a complicated and incoherent set of stories and lies that they were kind of just like uh at the
01:09:43
end of it like they don't even know what to think it must have been so hard to follow yeah so in the end they were much
01:09:48
more inclined to believe the prosecution than they were to believe his [ __ ] they were like I don't even know what to
01:09:53
do with this a like clean from beginning to end and they were like you're just bizarre I no like but you've confused me
01:09:59
and he probably seemed like a madman at that point oh yeah and on the final day of the case Graham presented his closing
01:10:06
arguments and he just wrapped up the evidence and all the testimony and Holmes in his defense attor or his whole
01:10:12
team they just had the same weak arguments you know the mysterious Strangers Like hatch taking the children
01:10:18
to Europe and Benjamin pitel committing suicide all of this was supposed to put in reasonable dep
01:10:26
it wasn't necessarily painting homes as innocent it was really just putting Reasonable Doubt and it wasn't even good
01:10:31
reasonable doubt they were just like I don't know I still think he's shitty so judges are supposed to remain pretty
01:10:37
impartial but how' that go but this judge pretty much let his opinion be known at the end I feel like they all
01:10:43
kind of do at the end yeah and he sent the jury out saying this I will say that it is such a remarkable story that it
01:10:50
proves the truth of the old saying that truth is Stranger Than Fiction for if the story which Mrs pitel told upon the
01:10:57
stand be true and there seems to be no reason to doubt it no novel that was ever written contains a story as
01:11:03
thrilling is that which was told here upon the stand concerning the manner in which this man lured her AC around the
01:11:09
country in a deceptive and fruitless hunt after her dead husband which is like awful at the end he should have
01:11:16
literally been like wait wa wait he should have Dro G you are now to dismiss right get out of here go go on
01:11:24
get go on so the jury returned to the courtroom at 900 p.m. that evening I know I said p.m. that evening that's
01:11:31
annoying uh I wasn't even going to yell at 9.m um I was just like they'd be working over time um this is what's
01:11:39
funny so they returned a verdict guilty yes and it was later learned that they spent all night in that jury room like
01:11:47
the The Liberation room they didn't come out until 9 p.m. but the jury actually had made their decision like right away
01:11:54
they walked they were like we're all thinking it and they were all like hell yeah and then they were like but you
01:11:59
know what we just needed to like keep up appearances and we also wanted to eat dinner n hours so we sat in there and
01:12:05
pretended it was this big long thing but they all knew damn they were just having
01:12:10
a pizza party he just had a pizza potty uh after the trial a lot of them said when they were asked by reporters what
01:12:17
convinced them of his guilt he said that he just seemed to know too much about how to kill a man with chloroform
01:12:23
that'll do it and it's like yeah yeah yeah I would say so now when this was read out loud Holmes was shocked well
01:12:30
because he's a narcissist he had spent his whole life conning manipulating lying and getting away with it and now
01:12:38
he's done done flaw on November 30th he went back to the courtroom for the sentencing phase and his defense
01:12:44
attorneys attempted to argue for a new trial date again that is that the only thing they argued for yeah they said
01:12:50
that Holmes had to act as his own defense for much of the trial and He was largely unpr prepared and it's like
01:12:57
that's you also were largely unprepared and judge Arnold overruled and he said it is not within the power of persons
01:13:04
accused to say when they will be willing to when they will be willing to be tried
01:13:09
or to defeat a trial by dilor dilatory motions and practices such as were resorted to in this case so he's like
01:13:17
[ __ ] off he's like I'm not giving you time to make a better case for yourself and so he said so he literally looked at
01:13:23
them went no and then he looked at home homes and said you will be hanged by the
01:13:27
neck until dead so bye uh Holmes's defense lawyers obviously went about the appeal process and they said they will
01:13:36
go to the highest court if necessary and then they said this is literally my favorite thing they said I shall enter
01:13:43
at once upon the preparation of papers for an appeal when I shall have them ready it is impossible to tell but no
01:13:49
time will be lost I love that like I will get those papers done to stop you from being killed I will do it at some
01:13:57
time but I cannot say when don't worry though I'm going to do it at some point hang tight no pun intended I will get
01:14:05
there I don't know when don't hold me to it like it's literally just like what that's like me a phone call you can't
01:14:12
say like next week like just give something don't overcommit they were literally like we are going to set about
01:14:19
at once doing that but I don't know when I'll finish so I think they were air signs think they they were like oh Works
01:14:27
yucky that door open I don't want a deadline no and they were like well your client's going to be hang though and
01:14:33
they were like I hope we get there in time but no I will not commit to that I kind of love it like wow don't ever
01:14:40
commit to anything no so the appeal did go through it finally came on February 3rd um and George Graham and Holmes's
01:14:48
defense team were in the S Supreme Court of Pennsylvania I'm surprised they were
01:14:52
like yeah we'll entertain this they made it so H's defense argued that a lot of the testimony used to convict Holmes and
01:14:59
this is quite a stretch I was like wow you guys did do your homework they pull musle they said that it came from his
01:15:06
wife Georgiana yoke which would make it privileged testimony that shouldn't have
01:15:12
been admissible in court but I I bet they found a couple rols this was very overruled by judge Arnold who said on
01:15:18
the ground that a prior marriage nullified the union between Holmes and yoke it wouldn't it does not not
01:15:25
privileged because they're not husband and wife I also love that he was like a prior Union I'm like how about several
01:15:29
prior unions it's just like o yeah you tried guess that bigamy came back to bite you my guy like that didn't help
01:15:37
does and after hearing arguments on both sides the court cided with the prosecution and said that Georgiana
01:15:43
quote did say that she had gone through a marriage ceremony with this man but she does not say that she is his wife
01:15:49
she merely says that she was imposed upon you know what I think she was was she was imposed she remains to be
01:15:56
imposed upon yeah girl so the Supreme Court decided to uphold the conviction of course and the death sentence and he
01:16:04
had no other appeals and a date of May 7th 1896 was set for his execution D in the meantime Holmes was now going um
01:16:13
away from the whole I Didn't Do It thing and he's now just enthusiastically embracing his villain role he's like you
01:16:21
know what I've officially entered my villain ARA he sure has and between his conviction and execution he
01:16:27
confessed to a ton of crimes including at least 100 more murders uh but not the Jack the Ripper ones he would he would
01:16:34
scale it I thank you that's the thing he's throwing that [ __ ] up to like 200 and something but he's not going to
01:16:41
include the White Chapel Noah no it doesn't make sense he later would scale it back but then he'd pump it up again
01:16:48
scale it back so you don't know just depending on like the direction of the wind and I guess a confession was
01:16:54
Commission mentioned by the Hurst Corporation in April 1896 titled the most awful story of modern times told by
01:17:01
the fiend in human shape I don't know if I would want to hear the most awful story told by the fiend who wrote it
01:17:07
that's a really good way of describing an [ __ ] though a fiend in human shape I I do like that I like that um he gave
01:17:15
detailed accounts in this confession of the murders of Julia and pearl Connor emiline srand Minnie and Nanny Williams
01:17:21
the whole pitel family um and then he added 18 more murders onto that which everybody was like oh [ __ ] okay he
01:17:28
really did that but unfortunately those other 18 are questionable because uh at least two of the people he claimed to
01:17:35
have murdered Kate derky and Robert leok they were still alive they were found to
01:17:39
be alive stop it and fine stop it so I knew it so this [ __ ] he was saying the murdered people are still
01:17:46
alive he was definitely going to claim the Jack the Ripper RS if it had ever been planted in his head hundo I tell
01:17:53
you right now if somebody came to him during this [ __ ] and said hey did you hear about that Jack the Ripper
01:17:59
murderers what do you think about it nobody knows who did it he would have been like that was me he would have
01:18:03
literally been like it me everybody he just didn't nobody planted that seed in his head yeah but Holmes was apparently
01:18:10
paid $7,500 for that confession and the [ __ ] was he going to do with the money he got sentenced to
01:18:17
hang girl you literally just said my next sentence Oh [ __ ] that was perfect no don't be sorry that was like right
01:18:24
here like that's why I was like thank you you literally just said exactly what I was going to we been doing that I
01:18:29
think that happened in one of the last episodes too or maybe the rewatcher that's been happening a lot lately it
01:18:33
has cuz literally my next thing was going to be why he chose to do that I don't know he was scheduled to die in a
01:18:39
month so I don't know what that money would have done for him but maybe it was kind of just like a [ __ ] you like here's
01:18:44
this money you can't spend yeah like okay I guess I'll just take it but then did georgana get it I don't think so cuz
01:18:50
she's not his real wife damn I hope I hope um what's the first one CLA Clara I hope she got it CL and
01:18:56
there's also Mera with Lucy Chicago they split it I hope like I hope it was like
01:19:02
the end of The Other Woman and they all went on vacation together they all went on vacation together I know um so the
01:19:09
other thing is Holmes is like very over the toop about his remorse in these confessions like he does show like very
01:19:17
theatrical remorse you know like laughable in a way so he might have been trying to salvage some kind of
01:19:25
empathetic reaction you know what I mean like I don't know okay I don't think so
01:19:29
though I think he just liked doing it yeah just like for the drama but on the morning of May 7th 1896 wait a second is
01:19:36
that today oh my God is it is that today today the 7th it's the eth oh okay and weird and weird and weird because I have
01:19:46
my next case that I'm covering May 7th uh plays a date in my case and I was like oh weird like I'm writing that a
01:19:52
couple days before ooh that's weird I literally wrote in my notes like weird I'm writing this a couple days before I
01:19:57
was writing this end part yesterday on and I didn't even realize that's weird that's really weird that's so [ __ ]
01:20:04
weird oh [ __ ] so it was like however many years from yesterday that yeah cuz I was writing my thing on May 6th and
01:20:12
the the May 7th thing came up and I was like oh [ __ ] tomorrow wow that's weird
01:20:16
weird tourist season is creepy chil I think it's tourist season anyway well on the morning of May 7th 1896 he was Tak
01:20:24
taken from his cell at the county prison and he was led to the Gallows goodbye he
01:20:29
denied denied denied now having killed Benjamin pitel and the children and he insisted he only ever killed two women
01:20:36
lies and I love that he's just like guys I just killed a couple women let's calm
01:20:40
down here up do we really think that this is necessary I just killed some women remove this tie from my neck it
01:20:46
was just a couple of broads just a couple of bronze everybody like oh my God uh when asked if he had anything to
01:20:52
say before he was going to hang oh what did this idiot said he said gentlemen of
01:20:57
course I have very few words to say in fact I would make no statement at this time except that by not speaking I would
01:21:04
appear to acquas in life and my execution I only want to say that the extent of my wrongdoings in taking human
01:21:10
life consisted in the deaths of two women they having died at my hands as a result of criminal operations I wish to
01:21:17
also State however so that there will be no misunderstanding Hereafter I am not guilty of taking the life of any of the
01:21:23
pitel family the three children or father Benjamin fitel of whose death I am now convicted and for which I am
01:21:30
today to be hanged that is all he ended that [ __ ] with that is all I would have been like that is
01:21:39
all no wrong that's all he he Miranda priestle it yep that's all that's all and then the hood was placed over his
01:21:47
head and the lever was pulled at 1012 a.m. the door open he dropped 5T oops that was to break his neck did not do
01:21:57
that oh karma's a [ __ ] huh Adam Seltzer writes there were contortions for a minute the body spun the legs Swang as
01:22:04
though he was trying to break the Rope the fingers opened and closed two Spectators fainted after a few minutes
01:22:11
the body settled [ __ ] ultimately 15 minutes would pass before the physician felt comfortable declaring him dead
01:22:19
wowza and then he wasn't cut down for another 15 minutes so he stayed in that new for 30 minutes
01:22:25
yep uh pretty gross and when he was removed from The Gallows they immediately put him into a coffin that
01:22:31
coffin was placed in cement which then had more cement poured over on top of it and it was placed in a vault at Holy
01:22:39
Cross Cemetery just outside of Philadelphia city limits why the [ __ ] would they bury him in Holy Cross
01:22:44
Cemetery it was his request for the cement to be poured over his coffin as well because he was worried that it
01:22:50
would be desecrated or things stolen after he was interred which I say oh the irony I think that's how you use that
01:22:59
word cuz he was 100% constantly stealing from the dead and using dead bodies and
01:23:06
desecrating Graves and [ __ ] up like and he's like I don't want that like he's literally like I know how this
01:23:12
works I don't want to be [ __ ] [ __ ] and they had to do it I can't believe he was buried in a [ __ ] Church Cemetery
01:23:17
yeah I'd be like he's the actual devil yeah before he was executed Carrie pel's lawyer Thomas fake I think it is um he
01:23:26
thought that when he died that he would leave a portion of his assets to the pitel family because he he was like I
01:23:33
thought he was going to leave Benjamin's stuff to her it's betting on a lot well
01:23:37
that's what I was like you think this man that killed several people including three of her children was like you know
01:23:43
what maybe I should leave for I'm like Thomas you ever play craps cuz I don't I I don't know if you'd be great
01:23:52
Thomas I don't think you should like crap you shouldn't enter a casino Thomas don't you a betting man you are not well
01:24:00
I'm feeling lucky today yeah like so once his body was placed in the vault the report the uh lawyer found out and
01:24:08
told the reporters I've been given to understand that Holmes died intestate which means died without a will in place
01:24:15
oh right although I did believe that he would leave a will devising the one-third interest in whatever estate he
01:24:20
had to Mrs pitel I fear now that he did not make provision for the Widow of the man he yesterday denied killing and
01:24:27
unless he had given instructions to his attorney as to the matter of restitution
01:24:31
I will have to proceed upon different lines which also just proves to you right there he's claiming he didn't kill
01:24:36
Benjamin and that he never would have hurt those kids and that he loves the pitel family why didn't he leave the
01:24:41
money to her yeah exactly so he frauded her that's like come on even in death yeah it's like no come on SO a few years
01:24:49
after his execution Georgiana yoke married a man by the name of Chapman and just kind of f it away I bet she did uh
01:24:56
yeah just whoop bye you know what though I I was saying things like oh I don't know about her but he was beating Clara
01:25:02
I'm sure he beating her as well and I should have thought of that no but it's I mean it's all very convoluted and you
01:25:08
don't know what's going on here but I exactly there was probably a lot of factors involved in here and that's why
01:25:13
I say you know what Georgiana bye yeah go live go live the rest of the life see you never just by go exist right uh
01:25:22
murder murder homes oh God I would change my last name in the beginning she was kind of like just backing his claims
01:25:30
of Innocence because I'm sure she didn't want to believe it and again was probably scared of him and after he died
01:25:35
she went back to teaching primary school in Minnesota uh she eventually became the principal of more than 33
01:25:41
unorganized schools which I'm not sure what that means Lucy the daughter followed in her mother's footsteps and
01:25:48
then together later the two of them became Red Cross supporters and volunteers during the first World War
01:25:54
hell yeah so good for them that's awesome after his arrest Clara mudget I love it we got like Clara
01:26:01
mudget homes Georgiana yeah and then Georgiana didn't get it so Clara mudget actually was able to avoid actually
01:26:10
speaking to the press or anything and lived out the rest of her life in Tilton and their son Robert left New Hampshire
01:26:16
and eventually became city manager of Orlando Florida until he died in 1956 wow yeah
01:26:24
not that long ago well it was but but like not in the grand scheme of things um and investigators and reporters have
01:26:31
always tried to link him to more crimes like you know unsolved murders more frauds cases all that they haven't
01:26:38
really been able to connect anything really like hard to him I feel like we can though I feel like we can I feel
01:26:47
like it's going to come we're going to hit more I feel like we don't know the extent of what he's done I could see
01:26:52
that I really feel that way I'm much more interested in the Jack the Ripper case and finding that out but I think
01:26:58
that this is also a very interesting one and I think if people really give it it's due diligence I think we could
01:27:04
learn more probably um but um in August of 1896 way back then the Murder Castle mysteriously caught fire again and it
01:27:13
burned to the ground interesting yep so it's gone and I think now there's like a
01:27:20
post office on its uh where it was before like park there or something I think it's a post office so I think it's
01:27:26
just like an innocuous post office sitting there the post office is the worst it is so it kind of like you know
01:27:32
what the Vibes are not great so there's that I wonder if there's any reports of it being haunted at all that was
01:27:39
actually the next thing I wanted to look into and I think I might look into it a
01:27:43
little bit to just be like yeah just be like a fun little like look back on it to see if anybody has any things about
01:27:49
it um but that is the tale of HH h Herman Webster mudget and now good job I'm going to
01:28:00
sleep 9 night good night Dam that was crazy shout out to you shout out to Dave yeah that was a complex shout out to Mya
01:28:09
and Clara shout out to them oofy shout out to them and poor Minnie and Nanny Williams I know and all the PO all of
01:28:18
them it's just really sad Pearl yeah feel bad for Carrie feel bad for everybody that [ __ ] is gone now I know
01:28:24
I wonder what ever happened to Carrie yeah I know didn't find anything she probably just she was probably get me
01:28:29
the hell out of here oh God but wow that was terrible in conclusion he is not Jack the Ripper that's wild um yeah so
01:28:40
you guys have been wanting that one for uh five years I'd say and I've been waiting for the time I just knew it was
01:28:45
going to be a a real deep dive so I wanted to give it the time it required yeah he was from New Hampshire right
01:28:52
yeah my um next case that is occurring is also in New Hampshire W that's weird weird and I didn't plan for that yeah
01:28:59
that's really weird and it's also kind of fun that he was caught in Boston cuz I was like bye [ __ ] I don't love that
01:29:04
our city was like that's true that's true I just don't like that he had his feet on my ground but and it was also
01:29:11
our city who was like that sounds great to arrest him I'm so I'm like fully down
01:29:16
with that but you're going to have to get me another warrant so I can keep that [ __ ] so we can extradite his ass
01:29:21
Boston just saying Boston was like M do your job okay be Town well as always folks we hope you
01:29:30
keep listening and we hope you keep it we but not so weird that you're like Elena and you have to revisit the dear
01:29:36
boss letter for another time and then you also have to cover this in five parts because wow she's so crazy guys
01:29:41
I'm probably going to revisit it again with some other case she says probably but she means
01:29:46
definitely [Music] forever Jessie and the Rippers yeah waa full circle bye-bye [Music]