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hey weirdos I'm Ash and I'm Elena and this is [Music] morbid and it is part two of the
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lipstick Killer part D part one was rough but then you got a little palette cleanser of our besties
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Karen and Sabrina not between Parts bye the way you said it last time made me think that no I me between the career
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girls and the lipstick Killers two girls one ghes well like I said bye so part one was rough yeah not easy
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to get through no that was that was one of the tougher ones I think that we've covered yeah and this is one that I
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think a lot of people have heard of if you if you've studied true crime or like read true crime books you know anything
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like that the lipstick killer you always like we said associate it with William hirin yes and I do wonder wonder if
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that's going to change today interesting and we talked a lot about you know the the police department beating up a
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grandpa that was horrible um and then realizing that oops that wasn't him maybe it's two guys like who
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knows who's to say after all that yeah and I think when we last left you they were in a true place of
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desperation they are not handling the public outcry and the pressure very well not at all and the
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Press is doing their part to really [ __ ] this case up further by not practicing
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responsible journalism in any shape of the word great yeah they're just exploitation and just lies and riing
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people up like it was bad was bad it sounds like it was awful and so things are not going great and then in late
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June 1946 at this point and this is in uh we're out of Chicago right now just cuz
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we're bringing someone into the fold oh okay um a jury in Phoenix Arizona found 42-year-old Richard Thomas y of quote
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unnatural sex acts and attempted rape of his 12-year-old daughter oh my God citing a guilty conscience and repeated
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nightmares Thomas suddenly admitted to Arizona detectives that he was responsible for killing six-year-old
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Suzanne degnan in Chicago earlier in the year okay according to Thomas he quote frequently had spells unac what he
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called spells accompanied by unnatural sexual urg and would often resort to theft and
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robbery in order to make quick money okay in early January Thomas was working at woodlon hospital in Chicago I was
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waiting for the Chicago Connection there it is and on the night of January 7th he
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told his supervisor he was sick and left work around 10: p.m. because quote he knew he had to Rob some money and he
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claims just had to he had to he claimed he picked the degnan house because quote
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it looked like I would find money and or jewels in there mhm now remember Jim Dean is an
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executive right so at first Thomas planned on using the painters ladder he'd taken from a yard down the street
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and even put it up against the house next to Suzanne's open window which they did find a ladder M when he remembered
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that he had several master keys for various types of locks and one happened to fit the lock on the lock on the
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degnan's front door H once inside he prowled around the open rooms until he entered Suzanne's room and found her
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sleeping so it is very possible that her mom did hear some dogs making noise if they had heard any of that exactly wow
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that they might have heard him prowling around right and he said when he walked into Suzanne's room quote I decided I
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could make a lot of money quick by kidnapping her Thomas said quote so I scribbled a note on some brown paper I
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had brought along to wipe away fingerprints okay all adding up so far according to Thomas Suzanne never woke
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up as he carried her out of the house and down the street and only began screaming once they were a few blocks
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away that's horrible now anyone with like young kids knows that's entirely possible oh yeah some kids I was not
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gifted enough to have those kind of children that you can bring from the car to the house while they sleep like they
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wake up immediately feel like most people aren't but honestly there is a lot I see a lot of my friends have kids
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that they can just take out of the car sound asleep and they will remain asleep until they put them in their bed like
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those kids kids are like deep Sleepers at times so this does make sense and it's horrific to think about now worried
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her screaming would alert someone Thomas said he put a bag over her head and covered her mouth until she stopped
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screaming now he was thinking he had inadvertently killed her at this point like
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by Thomas dropped her body into an open coal choot at the house on winth Street then slid down the Shute himself to gain
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access to the basement there he said he dismembered the body using the surgical tools he had brought with him now by
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that time the story of the dean kidnapping and murder had spread across the country MH and detectives in Arizona
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were very familiar with the case sensing that Thomas might be telling the truth here detectives in Arizona contacted
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their counterparts in Chicago who much to Arizona's surprise didn't seem enthusiastic or even all that interested
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in this confession what actually although Chicago chief of detectives Walter storms acknowledged quote there
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was enough in Thomas's story to Warrant a thorough investigation uh definitely he added that Thomas quote might be
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trying to get out of being sentenced in Arizona on the rape charge I think this would be a much worse
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charge you'd be facing death in Chicago for admitting to this correct this is very improbable yeah the brutality and
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cruelty of the degnan murder and dismemberment yeah kidnapping murder dismemberment had shocked and outraged I
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told you people were out for blood here they it had shocked and outraged people all over the country with many in
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Chicago specifically advocating for extrajudicial execution for the offender as soon as they were identified exactly
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so the idea that someone would voluntarily confess to the crime and wave extradition back to Illinois
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in order to avoid prosecution for a lesser charge that doesn't make sense at all and the other thing is I don't know
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obviously how much was put into the media and like the papers about all the different like uh details which a lot
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was like they they were the detectives were not good at keeping anything private but and so that makes sense but
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he does seem to have every single detail possible which again every single detail
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sounds like it was reported but it's all very specific he's also a piece of absolute [ __ ] garbage and he
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literally raped his own child ored to rap his own child like he's a literal monster so this is very I'm not I
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wouldn't put this past someone who can do that and he's in Chicago at the time like employed in Chicago not even just
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passing through exactly yeah I don't that yeah so what happens but so everybody was just kind of like what
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like how does this make sense that he wants to avoid the charge of rape by agreeing to confess to the murder and
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dismemberment of a six-year-old child who everyone is literally Out For Blood for the culprit of like what but the
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reason for storms his eagerness to minimize and ultimately ignore Thomas's confession became clear because there
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was then an announcement of an arrest in the degnan case Okay so right away you go oh you just didn't want the case that
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you probably manufactured to fall apart huh you zeroed in on someone now on the morning of June 26th just hours before
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detectives in Arizona contacted Chief storms for Thomas's confession so just hours before they got this confession oh
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no Neighbors near the Degan home spotted who they believed to be a Prowler leaving the home or leaving a home with
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some of the occupants belongings so somebody burglarized they alerted two police officers who immediately began
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pursuing this Prowler after cornering the suspect on a set of of stairs police tried to subdue the young man who fought
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back and almost managed to break free oh wow this next part is the only part of levity that you're going to hear in this
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case that you feel free to give it a little giggle because this is wholly cartoonish and it really happened oh God
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so he tried to break free when a neighbor intervened by dropping a heavy flower pot on his head and knocking him
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unconscious that's quite literally like out of a slapstick com from a window dropped a flower pot all three Stooges
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we love a Good Samaritan we love a Good Samaritan we love a comical Good Samaritan this is 100% true because he
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he actually got like very injured by this because unlike cartoons you don't just like see stars around your head be
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like don't birds you actually get like a traumatic head injury you could also probably die depending on how high up
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that was abely so no matter what like this particular little detail if you found yourself going that's
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okay happen again it's okay I want you to live in that place of levity for a while because you've earned it after
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listening to part one AB [ __ ] lutely now upon his arrest the suspect was taken to a nearby hospital to be treated
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for a traumatic brain injury there it is uh where he was eventually identified as
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William hirin okay William hirens at this time was 17 years old oh and he was a University of Chicago sophomore and
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the son of a police Sergeant interesting he did have a criminal record though Des his dad must
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have been [ __ ] piss yeah his son was like his dad was was like really dude now despite his young age cuz 17 that's
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young hirens had arrests for burglary dating back years wow he was a little thief he was a little [ __ ] and a little
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thief his first arrest in 1942 when he was just 13 years old Jesus someone was rebelling against that I think so now at
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the time hirens was arrested for burglarizing a neighbor's home and then accidentally causing a fire but
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following his arrest he confessed to at least 11 more burglaries in the neighborhood
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now another arrest followed a year later when hirn was caught sneaking out of a building after burglarizing several
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several of the apartments inside and officers discovered quote several of the keys in the boy's possession were traced
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to the apartments which had been looted in other North Side buildings so he was just like a he was a a burglar can I
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also just say he doesn't seem like a criminal mastermind he certainly does not he doesn't seem like he would just
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walk out of a building unsuspected exp inly because um he kind of hasn't so far he seems like a bumbling teenager who's
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an [ __ ] yes correct like I'm not taking that away from him he's a [ __ ] he goes into people's homes and
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steals her [ __ ] like he's a [ __ ] and it's like but so far I'm not seeing much
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that leads up to abducting a six-year-old taking her from her home strangling her and then dismembering her
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and either none of that and then anything that happened in the other two murders in the Browner Ross case no I'm
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not seeing this whole like you know a bread knife through a neck and stabbing somebody in the neck several times and
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in the face I'm not seeing it here no because people have to start somewhere absolutely but these burgies aren't even
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violent it doesn't sound like at least no I'm not here I the like they these ones in particular were not like armed
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robberies and stuff I they're [ __ ] up of course but just a weird weird I didn't see I don't I didn't see a
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17-year-old kid with a record of like burglary being responsible for this anything now like this although
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investigators were able to identify him from his fingerprints cuz obviously he had a criminal record yeah yeah the head
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injury from the flower pot had actually caused tyrants to like slip in and out of Consciousness so he wasn't able to
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make a statement at first damn um but detectives and some Physicians believed that at one point he was either faking
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or at least exaggerating his symptoms I'm sure uh which he kind of admits he was later like at first he was genuinely
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hurt but he keeps it going for a little while and you'll see why um it's never been made clear why hirin became a
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suspect in the Degan murder what much less the murders of Ross and brown nobody knows how he became a suspect
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there's really no clear reason he became a suspect what the suspicion of burglary
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and resisting arrest was sufficient cause to at least take his fingerprints which obviously were submitted to the
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FBI for analysis and compare comparison to the Brown and Degan case cuz those are the only ones that had even slight
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fingerprints things to compare to which they didn't even really have mhm despite
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not having received any results from that analysis Captain EMT Evans told reporters I'm convinced that the two
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prints brought out in this case were made by the same person what so let me make sure you guys understand
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this the dean case and the Brown case Francis Brown and Suzanne Deon there were like smudged like one
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fingerprint available was like barely anything and they had not received an analysis of these fingerprints he said
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comparison between the two and he said I'm convinced they are from the same people I'm not talking about Josephine
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Ross and Francis Brown I'm talking about Francis Brown and 6-year-old suan Suzanne degnan this man is saying that
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he is sure this is the same person that committed those two crimes in what world
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again we talked about this in part one in what world is suzan degnan's case related to Francis Brown and Josephine
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Ross I see Francis and Josephine being connected 100% two the same person agreed I do not
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think on any realm or plane of reality that they are connected to the Suzanne degnan case no and I just can't stop
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thinking about the man I'm sorry I forget his name the man that confessed he like he it sounds just perfect Thomas
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yeah Thomas it sounds perfect and I mean I know like Suzanne wasn't sexually assaulted in any way right not that I
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don't think they could tell okay that's awful because she was dismembered but either way like he he takes a baby out
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of her home like that's [ __ ] perverted and he also was accused of raping his daughter like there's a clear
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line there that connect some kind of pathology here that you should be taking a closer look at as an investigator it's
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the 40s but like come on people this is just human right like this is just me with eyes I just can't believe like I
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keep going back to the fact that they were just like oh okay yeah like call you back never yeah to that confession
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yeah they were just like oh cool uh we already have someone though we have the 17-year-old that bur 17-year-old that we
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literally have no evidence to claim that he has anything to do with any of these
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murders but we're just going to pin it on him I think and we're never going to tell you why no we're never going to
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like why even though this guy just confessed and was actually in Chicago and has a record that is very much on
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par with what has happened right like a perverted disgusting awful record awful record and then like again knows a lot
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of details of this case mhm I don't know I don't [ __ ] know dude so this Captain EMT Evans told reporters I'm
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convinced that the two prints brought out brought out in the case were made by the same person and we're like stop
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talking to reporters but curiously it wasn't police who even thought to check William Hon's Prince it was James Gavin
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a reporter for the Chicago Tribune who suggested hey why don't you check the prince against those found in the deant
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case okay let me be clear once again about that they arrested William hirin for prowling mhm they were like cool you
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have a record you're like a little [ __ ] you burglarize that was what he was going to be charged with burglary that
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was it rightfully so and then James Gavin a random a reporter for the Chicago Tri Chicago Tribune you got this
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that was not hard to say I don't know why it was sometimes it is it's the my brain's going faster than my M my mouth
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that's why cuz I'm just like cuz your thoughts are racing this this reporter looks at police and says do you think he
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murdered that six-year-old and the police are like oh my God brilliant let's go check his F
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and he was like and the police are like how could we ever connect him to that though and James Gavin a reporter for
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the Chicago Tribune says maybe you should compare the fingerprints like what and they were like holy [ __ ] that's
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great people say [ __ ] [ __ ] all the time of course they do espe like like especially reporters they come up with
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like random questions just to like make a story a little more salacious or you this get even better no I you kept
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saying that last time better because so James Gavin says heyo you should check those fingerprints against the ones
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found in the dean case and they were like holy [ __ ] that's such a cool idea and Captain Evans was like Wow awesome
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and he grabs another police sergeant in real time after this reporter was like you should check that they were like
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good call nailed it good call solid idea and then he grabs a police Sergeant they
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go into an exam room for 10 minutes no come back out and announce the prince match those in the Degan case
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wait just like two officers just went in the room and said like heyo how what that sounds like an SNL
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skit I'm not even joking that sounds annl skit that a reporter is like do you want to know how to do your job and the
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police were like that sounds so awesome let's give it a shot and then they just go into a room together and come out and
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we're like yeah everybody we found them and it's like what there was nothing leading you to this
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nothing and like again you're you you sorry my my thoughts are going way faster than my brain you were just
00:19:06
saying like these are like partial prints if that like they're [ __ ] up prins yeah and we don't have we didn't
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have nearly the technology to be 100% sure of that back then no we don't have the technology now for like to be 100%
00:19:20
on partial PRS no like and that's does this sound wild to you no don't you dare sit there AC cross from me and tell me
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it gets better does it sound wild because I will surprise you in the end with something about these fingerprints
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that you're that you're will you surprise me or will I just be like yeah that checks I'll hopefully I'll shock
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you because it's wild oh God now while detectives continue their attempts to get hirn to talk at this point because
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hens was like uh no like I'm not going to other officers searched his dorm room cuz remember he's a sophomore in college
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yeah where they found two medical kits containing a surgical in a scalpel set was he in medical school he was not okay
00:20:02
that's a little weird it was absolutely weird as well as other items recently stolen from nearby homes so they were
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also like was this just stolen yeah like were you trying to like sell this maybe
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like including war bonds amounting to $2,100 jewelry other items found in his room were several knives and guns
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recently reported missing around Chicago um and there was also and this is interesting and also show like who knows
00:20:27
what this is about they found a photo album of Nazi soldiers in guards which they didn't know was if it
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was stolen or if that was something he had or why he would have that what it was like [ __ ] disturbing [ __ ]
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disturbing like I said not a good guy yeah weird [ __ ] not a good guy bad dude but just as they had done with
00:20:49
Hector verberg last our grandfather they beat the [ __ ] out of him the local press
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made no attempt at objective reporting and seemed to go out of their way to a associate William hirin right away with
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the brutal murders despite a literal total lack of evidence not a shred not shocked reporters described him as being
00:21:09
quote built like a good football end having quote a hint of a sneer and claimed that quote it took four
00:21:16
policemen to bring him in and quoted one officer as saying they needed quote two
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straps to subdue him if you go ahead and Google William H no I already did and I said none of that
00:21:28
true this also directly contradicts their claims that he was unconscious when they brought him in yeah but okay I
00:21:38
guess but oky DOI archi why not he's not a big dude by any means he's pretty lanky yeah actually to be honest now
00:21:47
when hirn came into the hospital he was very confused and believed that he had been arrested for burglary mhm so he was
00:21:55
stunned when he realized that they suspected him of being a killer yeah and especially when they said that they were
00:22:02
suspecting him of being the killer of Suzanne degnan and William hirin had followed the story in the papers and he
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remembered how he Hector had claimed he was tortured by police for days in an effort to get him to confess terrified
00:22:16
so hirn later said about this time he said my best bet was to keep my eyes closed and my mouth shut if the police
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thought I was still unconscious maybe maybe seriously hurt they couldn't take me to the police station station
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handcuff me and hang me over the door by my arms as I had heard they had done to
00:22:32
Hector oh wow unfortunately hirens knew he couldn't keep pretending for much longer so that's that's why the police
00:22:39
and the investig and the doctors were like I think he was like exaggerating because he did keep it going for longer
00:22:44
because he just didn't want to talk I mean and so you know he knew he couldn't keep it going forever though especially
00:22:50
with each new Doctor Who was being like you're [ __ ] faking it like I know that you are awake yeah and so he
00:22:56
finally asked a nurse for a drink of water and that's when they alerted everyone to him being awake now locked
00:23:02
in an exam room one wave of detectives after another took their run at him uh they tried to get a confession out of
00:23:08
him so they could finally close the books on the deing case and at first investigators tried the usual tactics
00:23:15
you know they told him they had arrested his mother and quote put her in with the
00:23:18
prostitutes Jesus that's a quote of course and that they'd arrested his girlfriend Joanne and would keep
00:23:24
grilling her until he confessed and not let her go home and hour after hour he just sat silently waiting for his
00:23:31
parents to arrive because he's 17 M so so are they even actually legally allowed to be doing any of this and one
00:23:38
detective after another aggressively confronted him and they were shouting the details of Suzanne's murder at him
00:23:45
like God and so hirn had been arrested before obviously for burglary and [ __ ] yeah so and given his age he knew there
00:23:52
was only so much they could do to him before they had to let him go or turn him over to his parents technically a
00:23:58
minor in fact tyrn welcomed his parents arrival because he thought naively that they would come to his rescue and make
00:24:05
the whole thing go away he was like I just want to go home but a long time had passed and they still hadn't arrived and
00:24:11
he grew more anxious and like hours are going by and they're getting more and more aggressive and finally when one of
00:24:18
the detectives started telling him they'd matched his fingerprints to those found at the dean case the seriousness
00:24:24
of the situation started to sink in and he realized that they truly believed or they were going to intend to stick it on
00:24:32
him they truly believe that he killed Suzanne dnan what the [ __ ] now the more hirn resisted and longer he remained
00:24:38
silent the more aggressive and impatient the interrogators got until hirn heard one of them say something about ether
00:24:45
that's like an old like torture technique essentially and they said I can make this guy talk what what is it
00:24:54
should I Google it Google it it's like it's it was used in like um it's like it's almost part of like the uh like the
00:25:01
truth serum series of of drugs but it's not truth serum um but the way they would use it was to elicit confessions
00:25:11
um and he remembers one of the men say ain't none of them can keep still with this what and a moment later he smelled
00:25:19
The Ether CU ether is also used as an um anesthetic so uh he's he knew the smell
00:25:25
of ether because he had recognized it from a childhood surgery cuz they used to use ether okay um then one of the men
00:25:31
in the room lifted his hospital gown to expose his genitals no he had no idea what was happening and then he felt
00:25:38
several Drops Of The Ether hit his scrotum causing a feeling of intense cold followed by excruciating pain that
00:25:45
shot through his entire body it's a it's literally described as a volatile liquid
00:25:51
yeah now despite the physical and psychological torment he remained silent he did not confess holy [ __ ] he still
00:26:00
was thinking too that his parents were going to come get him where are his parents or at the very least he thought
00:26:05
the police would realized they made a mistake with the fingerprints that was what he alleged later yeah
00:26:11
now his parents were busy at home trying to deal with the horde of reporters who
00:26:17
had descended upon their house as soon as his identity was announced to the Press when hiren's mother Margaret first
00:26:24
heard the announcement on the radio her heart sank and she immediately was like I don't even know what we're going to be
00:26:30
able to do to fix this so she said after all his burglaries they would naturally
00:26:35
suspect bill it did not take too much imagination to to suggest the kinds of pressures the police could bring bring
00:26:41
to bear on a 17-year-old boy well they've already heard what they're doing to an elderly man the public the press
00:26:47
and the police wanted the case cleared up so anyone would do would do so long as the police could make their charges
00:26:53
stick under such circumstances I felt Bill wouldn't have much of a chance my God God now while detectives continued
00:27:00
their Relentless attempts to coers a confession cuz remember he has not confessed anything and also AKA torture
00:27:07
yeah officers tore apart the hiren's home looking for evidence Chicago detectives had finally gotten around to
00:27:14
talking to Richard Thomas the guy in Arizona who literally confessed and were quick to report that Thomas had actually
00:27:21
changed his story and recanted the whole confession yeah cuz now he hears another
00:27:25
[ __ ] guy he's going to take the fall for it now Thomas was claiming he had nothing to do with the kidnapping or
00:27:30
murder and then he goes oh you know what I actually only wrote The Ransom note for the actual
00:27:36
killer what he said this man asked a few days before the kidnapping if I wanted to go in on a snatch with him which is a
00:27:43
kidnapping sure when he refused cuz he was like I have a long criminal record I probably shouldn't snatch a kid you know
00:27:49
not for moral reasons just you know I don't want to get in trouble uh he said the man asked if Thomas would at least
00:27:55
write the ransom note who the no which Thomas agreed to do and he said later on that day the child was kidnapped and
00:28:01
killed and he said quote I saw the man washing blood off his hands in the bathroom which several families
00:28:08
used so to me that says don't ask me to write anything down because my handwriting is definitely going to match
00:28:16
that note cuz I definitely was there and definitely wrote that note but no I didn't have anything to do I didn't have
00:28:21
anything oops did I tell you that I that I actually committed the murder what I meant was I just wrote The Ransom note I
00:28:28
feel like that guy is a pretty good [ __ ] suspect like I don't who knows at the end of the day but he's at least
00:28:35
a terrible human being exactly and should be put away forever anyway now Chief Storm's resistance to Richard
00:28:42
Thomas's confession seemed odd to Arizona detectives cuz they were like Arizona's like what the [ __ ] is going on
00:28:48
trying to away yeah but that's because they didn't know investigators in Chicago had already arrested William
00:28:53
hirin and declared him the killer in the Degan case under those circumstances Thomas's confession would have been a
00:29:00
very serious complication to their Theory and one that could have undone their entire quote unquote
00:29:07
case it would have been easy for Chicago authorities to reject Thomas's confession as inaccurate when compared
00:29:13
to the facts of the case which they did claim but what they couldn't explain away so easily was that the handwriting
00:29:19
analysis in Phoenix had examined the ransom note in the dean case and compared it to Thomas's handwriting
00:29:26
declaring that there were un mistakable similarities between the documents and they were most likely written by the
00:29:32
same person girl what did I tell you thus Thomas's recanting and telling of a news story very conveniently solved the
00:29:40
problem and removed him as a suspect leaving only William hirens and they had no connection I'm
00:29:46
assuming no connection so William just found him on the street and said hey you want to write a note for me you want to
00:29:51
write a note now and this kid this 17-year-old kid's like I don't know I think I want to like kidnap a kid and
00:29:57
murder her do you want to do you want to do it with me never done that before but
00:30:02
I was just thinking of doing this today like no now in the days after his arrest
00:30:07
tyrn remained almost completely silent and refused to cooperate with investigators believing that if he
00:30:13
didn't say anything he couldn't get in trouble mhm so nevertheless detectives continued building their case against
00:30:19
him routinely releasing information to their press not always accurate information either of course of the
00:30:26
information that would eventually be touted irrefutable proof of his guilt none was more compelling or persuasive
00:30:32
than the supposed fingerprint evidence that tied hirens to the case they were saying this is irrefutable how I feel as
00:30:39
though it's refutable I feel like there's so much refute here I feel I feel refute in my bones I do I like oh I
00:30:46
someone's name is refute here like it's now when the degnan scene was processed the original suzan degnan scene was
00:30:52
processed FBI agents diso discovered two fingerprints on the front of the hastily
00:30:58
written Ransom note yeah because remember there was like that substance yeah which they photographed and
00:31:04
returned to the Chicago police after hiren's arrest the handwriting analysis for an excuse me analyst for the Chicago
00:31:11
Police Department Sergeant Thomas lafy reviewed the prints and declared them incomplete and quote impossible to
00:31:20
classify uhhuh much like we suspect complete and impossible to classify you cannot use these prints to class
00:31:27
classify anything also lafy compared the prints to those collected from like cuz he was
00:31:33
like what I have here just to shoot my shot and to like make sure I've crossed my teas and dotted my eyes he compared
00:31:41
those prints to those collected from all persons arrested between January and June of that year but found no matches
00:31:48
among them despite hiren's having been arrested in May mhm so he's he would have already had his fingerprints
00:31:55
compared to those yep but 3 days after hiren's arrest lafy told the press and his superiors that a print found on the
00:32:03
back of the ransom note was actually a match for William hirens how convenient wait Thomas laffy I thought that you
00:32:10
just said that it's impossible I got to go but now no it's like a full match like what a great
00:32:15
print that you guys just happen to miss the first time around that's so cool um that's so cool it's so great for you
00:32:22
guys like I love that you just keep falling into these like awesome things you're should play the lotto yeah it
00:32:27
would be made public that there was in fact no fingerprints on the back of the ransom note that was
00:32:34
a li cool he lied out of his lying [ __ ] face lied to penless on a random ass 17-year-old lied like again not
00:32:46
saying this 17-year-old is an awesome 17-year-old but but if he didn't kill a six-year-old then let's not pin it on a
00:32:52
man like yeah yeah I think that's a that's something you would think we could all agree on still it it was the
00:32:58
supposed fingerprint evidence that served as the basis for hiren's being the prime suspect and the evidence on
00:33:04
which his conviction would stand this fake fingerprint that doesn't exist it was also the fingerprints that
00:33:14
supposedly linked the brown and Degan cases together oh no detectives alleged that the fingerprints on the ransom note
00:33:23
were a match for the bloody fingerprint found on the door jam at the brown crime
00:33:27
seen that partialing one fingerprint and since the Ross and brown murders were believed to have been committed by the
00:33:34
same person investigators linked all three and tied them all to William hirens isn't that so convenient how that
00:33:41
all lined up for them the wildest thing to me is that in all of these cases nothing is missing nope nothing is
00:33:50
missing he's a he a known burglar and he didn't take anything from the scenes should say nothing is missing like 20
00:33:59
bucks was missing one of the first ones but of all the things Ste steal he steals like physical items like not just
00:34:06
like money so he can sell them like that's he's his [ __ ] his stick is stealing [ __ ]
00:34:13
from people's houses like come on and one of the main things especially in the brown and Ross case was it didn't appear
00:34:20
anything was really missing right like there was jewelry there was all kinds of stuff he didn't steal any of it and I'm
00:34:27
sorry but like Suzanne's case is not connected to these other two you can't I don't know what somebody could say to
00:34:34
convince me otherwise so while the District Attorney's office and higher ups at the Chicago Police Department
00:34:39
continued feeding information about supposedly irrefutable evidence to the Press which is very much refutable
00:34:45
detectives continued their assault on a still completely silent hirens he was still not confessing to it it's not like
00:34:51
he was giving them information I can't believe how long he held out when he wouldn't talk or refuse to give them the
00:34:56
answers they wanted detectives resorted to physical torture including having a nurse perform a spinal tap without
00:35:07
anesthesia whose idea was that which they claimed was being done to rule out brain
00:35:13
damage but they had them do a spinal tap without anesthesia just as physical torture oh
00:35:20
my God mhm they're like sadistic it's like really wild the [ __ ] was on this police force back then like yeah now
00:35:30
what the [ __ ] now on June 30th William hiren submitted to a polygraph examination which he
00:35:38
passed no however when the results were reported to the Press they were deemed futile and
00:35:45
inconclusive but he passed the test which again F trench coat but still but come on you have to remember too cuz
00:35:53
like as much as we say polygraphs are like you know what's going on with them they are
00:36:00
reacting to your body's physiological responses responses to certain questions so there's something to be taken from
00:36:08
them I think and obviously some people can beat them that's the thing I don't think 1year old is beating a polygraph
00:36:15
17-year-old kid who's up for murder I don't know how calm he is a 17-year-old kid who probably has a traumatic brain
00:36:21
injury and is up for murder that I don't think he committed I don't think he's going to be
00:36:26
able to control his [ __ ] that much I don't think so in order to to skew these results wow now when the polygraph exam
00:36:34
failed to produce the results they were hoping for the state's attorney William Tui agreed to play to pay psychiatrist
00:36:40
Dr Roy grinker a fee of $1,000 to administer sodium pentathol against hiren's wishes and
00:36:50
without consent of his parents illegal illegal that is truth illegal now in the news about the so
00:36:57
called Truth SE serum leaked to the Press State's Attorney Tui denied knowing anything about the drug or its
00:37:04
use in the hiren's case yeah cuz he'd lose his [ __ ] job otherwise he told reporters I don't know anything about
00:37:10
what those psychiatrists did I will neither confirm nor deny use of the drug because I do not know when they testify
00:37:16
coner concerning this in court when they say what they say is their testimony will be my opinion I do not know what
00:37:22
steps they took I genuinely hate people despite his repeated very clumsy denials
00:37:30
of knowing anything about the administration of the drug when he testified under oath in a 1952
00:37:37
postconviction review of the case Tui admitted that Not only was he fully aware so he lied out of his [ __ ] face
00:37:45
like most of these [ __ ] he was fully aware that they use the drug but he was in fact the one who'd ordered it and
00:37:54
authorized the payment to the doctor I have to go oop once again no it's so scary how Wild it's so scary
00:38:07
how people in positions of power could just get away with whatever the [ __ ] they want to and it can come out later
00:38:15
and have no [ __ ] bearing on anything no repercussions like it's it's mindblowing yeah what the [ __ ] he just
00:38:25
seems like I can't coner to die I have no idea and he's like he like oh I literally authorized yeah I literally
00:38:32
fully knew about that in fact I said to do it and oh [ __ ] I authorize the payment cuz I paid him off to do it oh
00:38:38
my God and these are the guys saying we closed the case you didn't close [ __ ] you didn't do [ __ ] this is the worst
00:38:49
[ __ ] I have ever heard it's like what you faked all of this [ __ ] and the worst
00:38:55
part is it's like whether William hiren's did it which I'm going to say he didn't do it I don't think he did it
00:39:00
dude whether he did or not though you didn't figure it out you didn't prove it if this man did this this 17-year-old
00:39:07
kid did this you did not prove he did no way in any way shape or form no way and
00:39:12
that's what's so frustrating is you didn't even have the [ __ ] G or the you couldn't even you don't even have
00:39:19
the skill set to prove that he did it if you really thought he did it you could prove it absolutely and you didn't even
00:39:25
try you just you [ __ ] it's you rigged this you rigged the game yes instead of winning it you rigged it like a [ __ ]
00:39:33
champion and coming out of there and saying hey everybody we caught the [ __ ] who did this you can sleep
00:39:39
soundly tonight you rigged the [ __ ] game cuz you're a little [ __ ] it's like that's such a cheap [ __ ] way and it's
00:39:47
like you said earlier I don't know if it was this part or part one but yes they had pressure on them but not for that
00:39:52
long no it's not like this was like this is within the same year and it's like if
00:39:56
you have pressure on you like I said I think in part one let it be a motivator be let it do it like the deli murder
00:40:01
case those those investigators yes at the very least they held [ __ ] close to the chest they Le [ __ ] that was that
00:40:10
everyone wanted to know details about that case we all did yeah and they were like I'm sorry you're not getting them
00:40:16
because we we don't want to give you details that are going to compromise this investigation because we're going
00:40:21
to do this [ __ ] right whether you're putting pressure on us or not because we want to do it and we want to close it
00:40:26
not just close it quote unquote and it's that's it's so frustrating so this asshole's remarkably
00:40:34
evasive statement to the Press about the use of the truth serum yes yes it represents one of the most important
00:40:40
aspects of the case against William hirin the case was incredibly suspiciously thin obviously
00:40:48
um but the best piece of evidence that they had was fingerprint evidence and this fingerprint evidence was apparently
00:40:55
a nine-point match for hirens what now the FBI and fingerprint experts consider a 12-point match the
00:41:05
bare minimum for compelling fingerprint evidence okay so this is a not compelling not 12 that's the bare
00:41:12
minimum 12 in fact the 9-point loop pattern that matched with William hirin would have also matched 65% of the
00:41:21
population 65% of the population 65% of the population that have a loop pattern on on their fingerprints are you
00:41:31
[ __ ] wait the other thing here is like spoiler alert anybody who knows this case this guy gets convicted yeah
00:41:37
how yeah in what [ __ ] world oh cuz it just keeps getting worse and never gets he never gets out out he died in prison
00:41:46
he was 83 when he died in prison yeah essentially to a certain extent our fingerprints kind of all look the same
00:41:53
obviously they only become unique when it comes to the finer details which is why a 12-point match is considered the
00:42:01
bare minimum otherwise the evidence against hirens was circumstantial at best and at worst purely speculative or
00:42:09
completely manufactured so this Sensational fingerprint evidence is literal garbage
00:42:17
garbage had they taken the case to a jury on its merits the state would have likely lost and the murders of Ross
00:42:24
Brown and Dean would remain unsolved today thus if Tui in the district attorney's
00:42:30
office wanted to close the books on those cases they needed to build a case for the public that convincingly
00:42:36
portrayed hirn as a vicious criminal which he wasn't now in the case against him the use and willing participation of
00:42:44
the press cannot be understated here no way they have [ __ ] blood on their hands and they should know it from the
00:42:52
moment he was arrested the police and other law enforcement officials leaked and explicitly gave information to the
00:42:59
press that while not claiming it to be irrefutable fact was were nonetheless stated with confidence and Authority so
00:43:07
that reporters could infer that it was the truth yeah that's why it was given to them with a lot of authority tui's
00:43:14
statement on the use of truth serum is characteristic of all the types of statements that were being given to the
00:43:19
Press on a regular basis here where some nefarious or Sensational detail or clue
00:43:25
is very Heaven heavily uh implied to be true mhm but it's also vague enough to be denied should it be proven false and
00:43:34
when they weren't publishing vague statements from law enforcement the Press were publishing their own stories
00:43:38
about hirin that emphasized his criminal record his size and uncooperative disposition and anything else that would
00:43:46
distract from the fact that he was a 17-year-old boy being held on suspicion of three crimes for which there was very
00:43:52
little if no evidence for him committing literally and for which doesn't make sense we're even connected in the first
00:43:59
place nope no one's even saying that no one's being like this doesn't even [ __ ] make sense that you're
00:44:04
connecting these three murders it makes no sense whatsoever so at one point a reporter for the Chicago Tribune even
00:44:12
manufactured a story about hirin confessing what he had never confessed but they they just made it up
00:44:23
story just printed it like it was fact the [ __ ] the end result was that regardless of how questionable the
00:44:31
physical evidence was any jury picked for a trial would enter that courtroom with a seriously negative impression
00:44:39
because this guy supposedly confessed but he never did he never confessed oh my God he never confessed to this point
00:44:48
he had not confessed they that was an outright manufactured [ __ ] story what the [ __ ] how did they get away with
00:44:57
that they all could just do whatever they wanted like everybody is just playing their own Fu game now on July
00:45:04
2nd William hirens was transferred from the hospital to the infirmary wing of the Cook County Jail where he spent
00:45:10
about a week recovering from the initial head injury and the injuries sustained during his interrogation and torture um
00:45:17
during which time investigators continued questioning him relentlessly after one week a defense attorney was
00:45:23
finally assigned to him though they wouldn't end up being much help for him while he was in the infirmary hiren's
00:45:29
Attorney John Coughlin was summoned to the DA's office where they were offered a deal this was the deal if William
00:45:36
hirens confessed publicly to all three murders the state would assure that there would be no death penalty and that
00:45:43
the penalty would be one life term all sentences running concurrently under this plea agreement hirens would be gone
00:45:51
would have gone to prison for life but on just one count of burglary because that
00:45:57
because he would confess to the three murders but only be charged for the crime that they initially brought him in
00:46:02
for which was burgy they wouldn't charge him for the murders like they like he wouldn't be convicted on those murders
00:46:08
he would be convicted on burglary which but get life what but that fact that he was only charged for burglary would be
00:46:19
incredibly beneficial for him for purposes of parole later yes so that was the deal you're not going to get the
00:46:26
death penalty admit to killing these three people so we can close our books and look good
00:46:30
which also right then in there proves to you that they didn't think he did this because had he done would have wanted to
00:46:36
put him to death yeah they would have wanted and they also would have wanted to at least get him [ __ ] convicted
00:46:40
they would have wanted those charges sticking 100% you're not going to send him to [ __ ] prison for burglary when
00:46:46
he murdered for three of the biggest murder cases that the entire nation is [ __ ] all over you for like you think
00:46:51
anyone's going to be happy about that like shut up what the [ __ ] the it just gets
00:46:58
more more inting so without speaking to his client first Coughlin agreed to get William to
00:47:06
accept the deal and confess reasoning that they stood no chance with chance with a jury and the result would
00:47:12
definitely be him getting a death sentence so a few weeks later a statement in a statement to the Press
00:47:19
Coughlin his attorney addressed the plea deal essentially claiming it was William's idea to accept the plea
00:47:27
it was not he was never informed of this and he also like I would think that his
00:47:31
parents would need to be informed if he was taking the deal too because he's a minor right and he was just never even
00:47:37
he wasn't informed of it what the [ __ ] what the [ __ ] he said quote for us to
00:47:43
Hazard his life on a plea of not guilty to the murder charges would be taking a risk with risk with no visible hope of
00:47:49
benefit to the defendant when he advised us to his guilt our course became clear
00:47:54
we have followed it in strict Conformity with the ethics of of our profession the
00:47:58
ethics of Ethics is nowhere in this case my friends there's no ethics in the Press
00:48:04
here and there's no ethics in the law enforcement here and there's no ethics in the law here none of you are ethical
00:48:10
none no one in this [ __ ] case ultimately it wasn't the torture it wasn't the constant questioning from the
00:48:17
police or even the defense attorneys agreeing to the ple plea deal without his consent that ended up breaking
00:48:22
William hirin it was the Chicago Tribune article falsely claiming he had already
00:48:27
confessed when the article ran on July 16th claiming that he had killed all three and robberies gone wrong no
00:48:36
remember those first two they were [ __ ] adamant that those were not robberies but now it worked for the
00:48:42
robber's gone wrong he washed the bodies robbery's gone wrong come on robbery's gone wrong
00:48:51
are [ __ ] messy yep you leave [ __ ] ton behind cuz it's a robbery gongying get
00:48:57
out of there that's not what these are and they knew it oh my God so the other papers followed suit they heard this
00:49:04
false confession that it was a robbery on the other papers just went sounds good we'll just run that whether it was
00:49:11
true or not and by the end of the day all of Chicago believed that he was the confessed killer Wow and his lawyer
00:49:18
wrote in a 2002 clemency appeal quote the concocted Chicago Tribune story broke hiren's will and spirit of course
00:49:26
it did so they were like this is what made him just go [ __ ] it like I'm never going to win any I'm I'm already even if
00:49:33
I leave here the entirety of Chicago thinks I confess to it what the I can't just stop saying what the [ __ ] now
00:49:41
certain that he was truly completely out of options he agreed to a plea deal in per their agreement prepared to go
00:49:48
before the state's attorney and the chief of police and confess to all three murders what hirn didn't know and
00:49:56
certainly never expected was that in an effort to celebrate their having caught the
00:50:03
killer no these these good old boys they did their they did their jobs and they caught the killer ash oh God you know I
00:50:11
don't know what the [ __ ] you're about to tell who we invited every person who'd
00:50:15
worked on the case and countless reporters and photographers to witness hiren's confess and he had no idea on
00:50:23
July 30th 1946 he stood up before the room shocked and was asked by Tui to quote
00:50:30
tell the truth about the murders but rather than live up to his end of the bargain after seeing that he responded
00:50:36
and said I don't know anything about them wow because he was like [ __ ] you dude like I'm not doing this outraged so
00:50:45
he didn't get his deal then so outraged that they'd been made to look bad in front of their precious
00:50:51
press yeah the District Attorney's Office rescinded their initial offer offer but offered to one more chance to
00:50:59
confess this time they took the concurrent sentences off the table and instead he would plead guilty to the
00:51:06
murder and receive three sentences to be served consecutively if he accepted the New
00:51:12
Deal William could expect to spend the rest of his life in prison but at the very least he would avoid the death
00:51:18
penalty okay so they were like those are your your options you go to prison for life three consecutive life sentences
00:51:26
and just say that you murdered all three of them and whatever you'll go for burglary this is like or you get the
00:51:31
death penalty because you know you're going to get it this is heartbreaking yeah I don't think he did this
00:51:40
I and after also yeah who the [ __ ] did this exactly they just walked around the
00:51:46
rest of their lives and what two different people two different depraved Disturbed people just walked around the
00:51:53
rest of their lives because let me tell you yeah those two First cases are connected second one no third one excuse
00:51:59
me no no exactly now after much discussion with his parents and his attorney who assured him a jury trial
00:52:07
was a bad idea which I think it was because everybody was tainted as [ __ ] they had already said that he confessed
00:52:13
right no even he didn't but they said he confessed so any jury walking in there had in their mind he confessed no matter
00:52:20
what William hirens accepted the plea agreement and this time there would be no going back so on August 6th 1946 he
00:52:28
publicly confessed to murdering Josephine Ross Francis Brown and Suzanne degnan during which he provided details
00:52:34
of the murders and in a statement to the Press Tui said he was willing to negotiate a plea deal for a confession
00:52:40
quote because of his desire to make certain not only in his own mind but also to the satisfaction of the public
00:52:47
that in hirens the state had had the Slayer of Suzanne Dean Miss Brown and Mrs Ross honestly go [ __ ] yourself
00:52:54
without the confession the state case he said this I would like to point out without the confession the state's case
00:53:03
Bas holy on circumstantial evidence was none too strong we need to go over that again he
00:53:13
they told William hirn you go to court for trial you're convicted and going to die because our case is air [ __ ]
00:53:21
tight we got fingerprints we got all this [ __ ] so you can do that and you're going to die
00:53:27
or you can take this plea deal and you can just go to prison for three consecutive life sentences but you won't
00:53:32
die and then they said and then after he did that they go psych if we went to trial we never would have got him
00:53:40
convicted CU we had [ __ ] literally just said that that kid was duped and duped and duped again they
00:53:51
had Chicago detectives had spent months touting the fingerprint and handwriting evidence they insisted proved tyron's
00:53:58
guilt and only after getting that confession that Tui was willing to that's when Tui was willing to
00:54:04
acknowledge that going forward with a jury trial was risky on their part not his Wow and his own [ __ ] dumb defense
00:54:15
attorney railroaded him right along with everybody else oh my God so as part of his plea deal hirin agreed to describe
00:54:23
in detail and even reenact the murders they made him do that on August 7th he spent more than eight hours describing
00:54:31
how and why he killed Dean Brown and Ross as well as several burglaries and other assaults as they traveled from one
00:54:38
crime scene to another hirens and representatives from the district and state attorney's offices were followed
00:54:44
by a huge audience of onlookers all hoping to hear some piece of the shocking story oh yeah um one of the
00:54:52
onlookers said he's not like he's not like he looks in his pictures he looks gruesome
00:54:57
he looks yeah because you think he's a convicted child killer and like woman killer now yeah throughout the course of
00:55:03
the reenactment State's attorney William Crowley asked one leading question after
00:55:08
another like quote you did get the knife in a burglary didn't you and isn't this the one you took out
00:55:14
of the Rodrick home like just here's all the information each time hirn would just
00:55:21
respond in whatever way was expected and they'd move on on September 4th 1946 hirn appeared in Circuit Court where
00:55:28
three psychiatrists told chief justice Harold Ward that he was quote legally sane but emotionally abnormal so it
00:55:35
ruled out an insan insanity claim and cleared the way for sentencing the following day hirn was back in court for
00:55:42
sentencing and the state's attorney called a long list of experts including investigators fingerprint experts
00:55:49
handwriting experts psychiatrist they all testified on the state's behalf unfortunately there's no documentary
00:55:56
evidence of their testimony huh because the court reporter died before he was able to type up his
00:56:04
notes like of natural causes like I have no idea y'all y'all regardless would Happ that was weird regardless of what
00:56:15
was said in court the outcome was as expected um hirin pleaded guilty and was sentenced to three three life sentences
00:56:22
with a minimum of 61 years served before he would even be considered for 61 Years sir before you're even
00:56:29
considered for Pearle oh my God now in the case of William hirin the facts and evidence have never really supported the
00:56:36
theory or conviction ever most familiar with the case agree now that given the similarities between the two murders
00:56:43
between the two of the murders it's likely Josephine Ross and Francis Brown were killed by the same person but given
00:56:50
the lack of any similarities between those cases and the Degan case it's pretty unlikely the three are connected
00:56:55
at all and only grouped together for the sake of closing all three at once those were the ones everyone was
00:57:01
mad about let's shove them together and close them all at once I just can't believe people bought that yeah as for
00:57:08
the evidence cuz remember I told you I had some more stuff about that the fingerprint you thought I had already
00:57:13
told you about the fingerprints so hirn doesn't even remotely match the description of the
00:57:19
suspicious individuals that people would see in all three cases no nor did he possess the knowledge or experience
00:57:24
believed to be held by someone who dismembered Suzanne degnan uhhuh in fact none of the evidence collected in any of
00:57:31
the cases could be conclusively traced back to him at all years later during his many appeals a team of experts
00:57:37
reviewed the evidence and came to the following significant conclusions one despite what the Press
00:57:44
reported the handwriting in the dean Ransom note was not a match for hirens though it bore great similarity to
00:57:50
Richard Thomas' handwriting yep two also the handwriting on the wall at the brown
00:57:55
crime scene didn't match iron nor was it a match for the handwriting on the D and
00:58:00
Ransom note so those are two different people several members of the review team believe that that message on the
00:58:08
wall was likely written by one of the reporters at the scene in order to make the story more Sensational no and I
00:58:18
believe it no dude because now that you say that a reporter's the one that found it alone
00:58:27
in a room and he's like guys you got to come in here and this entire [ __ ] case is
00:58:35
known as the liptick murders and the lipstick killer what a what a fun way to get a fun nickname out of it that you
00:58:42
can publish who the [ __ ] is that depraved right Humanity where is it let me know
00:58:50
exactly oh my God I no I need one second just hold me a moment hold on one moment
00:58:58
because I'm really trying to process here go ahead what the going back to the fingerprint found on the ransom note was
00:59:07
only a ninepoint match for hirin meaning it also matched 65% of the population with a looped pattern which again is
00:59:15
genuinely the most insane thing I've ever heard then the fingerprint found at the brown crime scene that was
00:59:21
supposedly a match for hirn was determined to actually be a rolled fingerprint like those taken for a
00:59:28
police fingerprint card and was not at all similar to the types of fingerprints naturally left behind at a crime scene
00:59:36
right the implication here is someone was sent back to that crime scene to plant the fingerprint to connect the
00:59:43
cases because otherwise they would have never been connected there was no way without that fingerprint that they were
00:59:50
able to connect those cases they needed that fingerprint otherwise there was no conceivable way to connect these cases
01:00:00
in any [ __ ] world how did but for them to go here we have a fingerprint that's at Dean case and Brown case oh my
01:00:08
God they're all connect and isn't this so convenient because we know that the Francis Brown and the Josephine Ross
01:00:15
murders were definitely by the same person so if there was a fingerprint at the Brown case that's also at the dean
01:00:20
case well then that person must have killed Josephine Ross too oh my God we just found the killer of all three of
01:00:25
these people oh my God that's why it came out as a rolled fingerprint because it wasn't
01:00:32
left there naturally that doesn't you don't just like roll up on a scene and just left to right onto the
01:00:40
door and finally no wait I'm sorry no no actually just a sec somebody was tasked
01:00:48
with that job and then went to bed that night and just said like yeah [ __ ] that's my job yeah like they're like I
01:00:55
guess I guess that child murderer can just keep roaming around we get that we get that William hiren's off
01:01:05
the streets so that's good this makes me want to cry like how do you how do you not think that way like that you just
01:01:12
[ __ ] up three murder cases and pinned them on some random [ __ ] kid like sure not the best kid in the whole world
01:01:19
but a child murderer and now like a crazed lunatic killer are just Tes women and murders them in their homes are not
01:01:28
facing any kind of walking free like maybe not walking free two well not anymore but there were two murderers in
01:01:37
this case that got away with it right two two different ones and I mean maybe not walking free because I think that
01:01:45
Richard Thompson oh yeah Richard Thomas Richard Thomas he it does feel like he's
01:01:50
regardless of what was going on there like he should be in jail anyways I mean again 40s but and finally analysis of
01:01:57
hiren's confessions quote revealed numerous inconsistencies between the confessions and the known facts of the
01:02:04
crimes and he was frequently wrong about basic facts of the cases including locations times related events like same
01:02:13
exact thing like and no one gave a [ __ ] and it was just fine and despite all this question an in
01:02:20
Wild amount of questionable evidence in hiren's case the official position of the state of illino
01:02:26
was and remains that William hirens murdered Josephine Ross Francis Brown and Suzanne Dean in 1954 hirens appealed
01:02:36
his sentence on numerous grounds ranging from illegal search and seizure to fa false arrest and abuse and it was shot
01:02:43
down from by the Supreme Court who concluded quote the finding of the criminal court against petitioner on the
01:02:49
issue is adequately supported by the evidence what evidence not though still in their summary the court acknowledged
01:02:57
that quote it may be conceded that the circumstances under which the crimes were committed the opinions of
01:03:03
examinated examining psychiatrists the involuntary disclosure of petitioner while under the influence of sodian
01:03:09
pental and other matters in evidence indicate the presence presence of an abnormality rendering him unable to
01:03:15
control his conduct and might well have Justified a finding that he was not re legally responsible for the acts at the
01:03:21
time they were committed but the mere fact that Council failed to advise their client to defend on such grounds does
01:03:26
not amount to a denial of due process but a lot of other things do amount to it other appe appeals were filed in the
01:03:33
years that followed but none were successful and in 1995 hirens filed his final appeal which resulted in the
01:03:40
appell court upholding the previous ruling and noting litigation has a beginning and of necessity an end the
01:03:46
end for William hiren's has long since passed as far as those claims are concerned so they were like we don't
01:03:53
want to hear it anymore oh my after serving 61 years of his sentence hirens came up for parole
01:04:00
in July 2007 he told the Chicago Tribune I figure I'll be getting out this year no
01:04:07
it's a bad thing on the reputation of Illinois that they lock people up forever yeah it is in his previous bids
01:04:13
for parole hirens had been denied in large part because he wouldn't admit to what he didn't do because he didn't do
01:04:21
it and unfortunately this time would be no different he said One Parole Board member said the words I still haven't
01:04:28
heard from Bill hirens are I ask for forgiveness for my crimes so they wouldn't parole him because he wouldn't
01:04:35
admit to doing it a second time or a third time really it turned out that that would be William hen's last attempt
01:04:41
at parole because on March 5th 2012 he was found unresponsive in his cell at the Dixon Correctional Center and was
01:04:49
transported to the University of Illinois medical center where he was pronounced dead from complications from
01:04:54
diabetes he was 83 years old and Justice was not served I am without I'm without words
01:05:05
that's the one of the most corrupt cases I've ever heard of in my life that man spent are you ready 66 years in prison
01:05:15
for three crimes that I am fully willing to say he did not commit I do not believe he committed those crimes I do
01:05:22
not believe he committed those crimes years his entire life mhm 17 years old died at
01:05:32
83 I'm like I'm Shell Shocked right now like absolutely Shell Shocked it's just like wow the and like OB like obviously
01:05:41
that's not the first time or unfortunately the last time that will ever happen but the egregious it is
01:05:48
egregious and it's just like I I just can't rationalize it in my brain that people can do this to other people and
01:05:55
yeah for just to close a c to quote unquote close a case and it makes me angry that it's like you didn't catch
01:06:01
the person who snatched a baby out of her bed and dismembered her or Brut put that person away you didn't catch the
01:06:10
person who broke into two women's apartments and brutalized them and left them in strange unsettling awful brutal
01:06:20
positions for their family members and like the cleaning woman to find those people get out Scott free and
01:06:29
then you just went around planting evidence at different scenes like that's wild there's not words there are there
01:06:37
are not words wow yeah W I'm like I'm so upset right now I'm genuinely so upset it's a very rough one I just can't
01:06:47
believe that man spent 66 years of his [ __ ] life in prison that's the thing and whoever did
01:06:55
was probably just laughing all the way around town that's the thing and who like who knows I'm sure they went I
01:07:02
don't think a person like that just stops murdering people yeah how many other people were murdered that's the
01:07:07
thing I'm like okay and honestly I kind of want to I want to go back in the records and see after this were there
01:07:15
anything else that was even slightly like these right or like did he see that somebody else got it pinned on him and
01:07:21
so he changed hiso or maybe moved somewhere moved somewhere else and started doing it like I want to look
01:07:26
into that and just like there was no other suspects ever ever and they just and they brought William hirens in with
01:07:34
nothing connected to these cases just a burglary and it's like dude and then listen that's such a [ __ ] cautionary
01:07:40
tale that's why you don't get your yourself wrapped up in bad [ __ ] because more bad [ __ ] follows like don't take
01:07:48
that path like I'm not saying he did that to himself you don't want to be in the wrong [ __ ] place at the wrong
01:07:54
time yeah cuz that was wrong wrong wrong lifestyle choice at the at the right time for the police exactly is what it
01:08:02
was like it was they saw their chance and they took it I'm so shook right now I want to I'm going to go donate money
01:08:08
to the Innocence Project by it was wild it really is a wild wild SK I thought forever that William hirens was the
01:08:15
lipsti killer because I never really looked into the case that far and it's just I can't believe there's not more
01:08:20
information out there about I don't think he is if you start googling like look through you'll see a lot of people
01:08:26
suddenly realized a lot of things about the case and were like oh [ __ ] like it
01:08:31
was just like holy [ __ ] way too late yeah it's so sad that there was no activist at the time that was able to
01:08:37
help him in any way I know to even try because now and everything was so corrupt then you know what I mean like
01:08:42
it was just like like if this was happening he would absolutely be like help be getting like some kind of
01:08:49
representation and like you look and it's like the the detectives are all wearing like the the detective hats you
01:08:56
know like they're all like it's it's the classic like very corrupt very different
01:09:01
way of doing things back then that like everything just gets swept into the rug holy this one moved me to like a place I
01:09:09
feel like I've never been moved it's a wild one it is and again not saying William hirens was like you know this
01:09:15
Bastion of like you know moral superiority or something like that like he was not you know he was also 17 so
01:09:21
you hope he would be able to turn [ __ ] around if he was given the chance who knows his [ __ ] brain wasn't even
01:09:27
developed yet but it's like I don't think he was a murderer no I really don't no and I think that's really where
01:09:33
it lies I don't think he was a murderer I don't think he did this no wow and that's unfortunate wow all right well um
01:09:40
we hope you keep listening and we hope you keep it weird but never so weird as any of this because my freaking God all
01:09:49
of this was absolutely the weirdest [ __ ] [ __ ] I've ever heard in my life I'm real stressed and I'm glad that this
01:09:55
is out [Music] yeah