00:00:06
hey weirdos I'm Elena I am Ash and this is morbid [Music] I'm just a [ __ ] boy in these intros
00:00:34
these days just a little [ __ ] boy you're a little tiny [ __ ] boy oh boy oh brother um what's what's
00:00:46
going on what's going on I had a calzone with Milky Way in it for lunch dessert for lunch dessert it was delightful yeah
00:00:55
it was you know what it was delightful and what was also delightful is that um although we've been having some like
00:01:02
weird Vibes we've talked to you guys about it a little bit Yeah like the doppelganger situation the TV Falling on
00:01:07
My Head slow motion falling on yeah just my stumacher moment your stacher moment
00:01:15
my my casual brain damage it's felt a little off and we we've all felt it and we've all just kind of like been like oh
00:01:22
like what what is this I don't like it and so we were like all right I'm going to clean this morning I'm going to
00:01:28
vacuum I'm going to like make sure everything's decluttered maybe that's part of it but then Mikey was like wait
00:01:34
a second our gal Rachel stavis Rachel who is like this amazing out of this world Exorcist
00:01:46
we had her on you remember she's amazing go listen to that episode if you haven't
00:01:49
cuz she's delightful she heard that we were like having some weird energy and weird Vibes and we kind of talked to her
00:01:54
about it a little bit and she sent us a lovely little care package yeah of items
00:02:00
that will help us kind of like cleanse the space and like make the energy a little better so Mikey lit some incense
00:02:07
and just was like you know what let's get Rachel Vibes in here yeah I'm not kidding
00:02:12
you something happened so true the energy in this room is different and I'm usually pretty skeptical about some of
00:02:20
this stuff like I'll end up being like I don't know like maybe it's just likeo I'm not kidding you it feels like
00:02:26
a totally different room cuz I was not here this morning when you guys did that and then when I walked in I was like
00:02:32
wait a second you like what's different here he light as [ __ ] in here yeah like
00:02:36
Mikey was like it feels like it feels still yeah it does feel still whereas before it felt very racing it felt
00:02:44
staticky yeah like everything was like it felt like snow on a TV screen like that it was like irritating all the time
00:02:51
and I felt like it was like something just didn't feel right so we just need to say like Rachel stavis man mhm I'm
00:02:58
telling you she knows knows her [ __ ] she's so [ __ ] cool follow on Tik Tok yeah follow her on all the things yeah
00:03:05
but she's magical and she did something so thanks Rachel thank you Rachel [ __ ] pal thanks a lot Rachel I'm
00:03:12
telling M I'll tell everybody we're telling everybody [ __ ] everybody I'm telling everybody
00:03:20
uh So speaking of you know British accents kind of I think it's Scottish that was Scottish but uh we're going to
00:03:26
be talking about Scotland Yard here so that works hey so we got an old timey murder let's
00:03:33
[ __ ] um this is one I had heard about before and some people may have heard about it is the murder of Julia Martha
00:03:41
Thomas um it's a wild one though and it's one we have not covered somehow oo which is shocking I'm shocked is it like
00:03:50
an 1800s e Vibe it is an 1800s e Vibe oh wow so this was dubbed later in the press the Richmond murder it captivated
00:04:00
londoners for months and the killer Kate Webster's trial and execution eventually
00:04:06
uh became something of a public spectacle you said Kate yes Kate a woman a woman and in Victoria era England very
00:04:15
few people even believed that a woman was capable of murder I believe that but one as vicious as this one and one that
00:04:23
um also involved a lot of uh abuse of a corpse I will say after they definitely didn't believe a woman could do that
00:04:33
okay yeah so given that and the absolute viciousness of the entire thing the Richmond murder remains one of London's
00:04:41
most notorious murders of the late 19th century yeah I'm trying to think of I like the the title itself like the
00:04:48
Richmond murder like makes me feel like I know it but you're talking about like a couple details and I'm not it's not
00:04:55
hitting you no maybe it will know maybe halfway through I'll scream if it does so let's talk about the victim first
00:05:01
Julia Martha Thomas so as is the case with a lot of these like Victorian era cases we don't have a ton of information
00:05:08
about Julia's life you know before she became a victim of this crime the 1800s of it all exactly but Julia Martha
00:05:15
Thomas was born in England Circa 1823 uh according to Elliot odonnell who we will link The Source in the show
00:05:23
notes uh she was well known by neighbors to be distincly eccentric I like that which is fun that is fun who doesn't
00:05:31
want to be known as distinctly eccentric yeah I really love that in a world full
00:05:38
of people who are not be distinctly eccentric distinctly eccentric especially back then too to be known as
00:05:45
that like hell yeah that's how you know you're doing it right I feel like we need merch that says especially back
00:05:49
then especially back then I feel like we say that a lot we do yeah just especially back then yeah um so she so
00:05:57
odonnell wrote that she was possessed of a remarkably excitable temperament frequently getting vexed and put out for
00:06:04
no apparent cause and she is still remembered as very much a tartar to her servants a tartar that doesn't sound
00:06:12
good it's it's not so in England tartter actually means someone who is domineering bossy irritable you know
00:06:20
it's not sauce not great it's not a compliment okay so again she was known people liked her who knew her it was
00:06:28
just the people who worked for her that were like not a great employer okay uh she was twice widowed oh that's sad um
00:06:34
and since the passing of her second husband in 1873 Julia lived in a small house um adjacent to a pub in Richmond
00:06:42
oh hell yeah which was a middle class neighborhood in Southwest London and she had spent most of her adult life as a
00:06:48
school teacher actually cool despite her reputation for high expectations and a pretty quirky character again she was
00:06:56
super well-liked by others she was never lonely after being widowed particularly
00:07:01
with the pub patrons next door like people liked her and also without a husband or when she retired didn't have
00:07:07
a job to attend to she began kind of indulging her interest in traveling and just going different places hell yeah
00:07:15
yeah like she never liked to stay in one place too long she loved to see other places she went by herself like she was
00:07:20
just yeah she loved it and it was later said that her friends and relatives would sometimes remain for weeks and
00:07:26
even months in complete ignorance of her whereabouts so she just wouldn't tell anyone either she would just off she
00:07:31
would go that's not great doesn't help later don't do that doesn't help uh kind of plays into Kate's favor a little bit
00:07:38
later but and at the time she's just like I'm taking off for a little while I've have no one to be responsible to
00:07:44
tied down me that does sound kind of fun right imagine just disappearing and like
00:07:48
nobody knows where you are but like you're just on vacay yeah you're just on vac like it's okay you're on vac it's
00:07:53
fine and Julie's like hell yeah I like that now outside of all this and her eccentricities Julia was remembered by
00:08:00
most for her commitment to appearances oh honey with uh quote fondness for dress and jewelry oh honey she made the
00:08:07
most of her modest means and was often seen wearing gold jewelry and rings as well as fine
00:08:13
clothes okay sister yeah that's this was not because she was wealthy she really wasn't wealthy yeah she wasn't like you
00:08:20
know the the poorest of the poor she wasn't the wealthiest of the wealthy she was like solid middle class at that time
00:08:26
she spent her money on good quality [ __ ] she did and odonnell actually refers to
00:08:32
it in the book as an OB obvious anxiety to be thought Gentile well you know no I'm just
00:08:40
kidding well you know she again she was solidly middle class but it was very important to her that she P be perceived
00:08:46
as highly respectable despite her Reliance on the income of like taking Lodgers in her house that kind of thing
00:08:53
she went out of her way to give the impression that she had wealth she had class dress for the job you want want
00:08:59
not the job you have exactly she just liked I I don't have to be rich to look rich is what she was saying you don't I
00:09:08
don't have to spend all that money to look rich I look rich Franny and it's like good job Julia exactly so although
00:09:15
she was gen generally thought of positively by her neighbors like we said and her friends and people who knew her
00:09:20
at the pub and all that she didn't go to the pub they just knew her from like yeah Julia's reputation as a demanding
00:09:26
employer with high standards made it a little difficult for her to find long-term domestic workers actually
00:09:33
records indicate that she hired a lot of servants over the years only one maid was known to have stayed employed by her
00:09:41
for any real length of time damn the rest of them just gone they just couldn't hack it yeah because of this
00:09:47
gnarly track record in January 1879 Julia found herself yet again looking for a new made and this is when her
00:09:55
friend Lucy loader mentioned hey I actually just recently came in cont contact with this young Irish woman
00:10:01
named Kate Webster not Kate and Kate Webster had done a few days labor for Lucy her friend there and was looking
00:10:08
for long-term employment in the area so she was like this seems perfect she was great for what I needed her for yeah 10
00:10:13
on 10 recommend there you go which like oops you should not have zero out of 10 looking back this is one of those things
00:10:19
where you like you like vouch for somebody and then you're like [ __ ] we have all been there so Kate
00:10:27
Webster was born actually C Lawler huh which should give you a little idea of like huh we have an
00:10:36
alias yeah we don't love that what's going on there what a fun last name Lawler Lawler that' be good in the group
00:10:42
chat she was born Circa 1849 in kilan County Wexford Northern Ireland okay from the moment of her
00:10:50
arrest later in life uh the authorities found it very difficult to verify a lot about what Webster told them of her
00:10:57
backstory and personal history mysterious squirly she was a liar a liar who lied mysterious squirly she was a
00:11:06
liar liar according to Kate she grew up in a Roman Catholic farming family and claimed to have married a sea captain by
00:11:14
the name of Webster while still in her teens and she said the couple had four kids where are they where they are the
00:11:21
world may never know well it's so easy to say that you married a sea captain cuz he ain't never going to be around
00:11:27
he's gone he's at Sea he's a sea where's where's your husband the sea captain at Sea on a boat [ __ ] he's in
00:11:35
the sea he's not a land Captain okay idiot so well sure could be true maybe maybe she married a CA Captain named
00:11:44
captain Webster who's to say had four kids Captain George glass but odonnell and many historians suggested it was
00:11:52
much more likely that she assumed the name Webster to evade the police and that it was just one of her numerous
00:11:58
aliases that she would have during her life she didn't have many of those fun so Webster's criminal career appears to
00:12:06
have started while she was in her teens actually when she claims to have been married to the sea captain named webst
00:12:11
[ __ ] she was arrested for Larsen and served a short prison sentence in her teens oh wow upon her release she left
00:12:18
Ireland and traveled to Liverpool where she just continued a life of crime uh particularly robbing lodging houses
00:12:25
which she became really good at oh God it was actually something like if she had a LinkedIn today she would be like
00:12:31
I'm actually skills robbing lodging houses 1815 to present killing it like she really knew how to rob a lodging
00:12:41
house wow and if she had just that's terrible but you wish she had just continued in that career path that she
00:12:47
was going to stay in a life of crime because what she does do is pretty [ __ ] awful it sounds like it but as a
00:12:53
woman especially at that time Kate was far less likely to be suspected or accused of crimes like that and her
00:13:01
remarkable confidence and her practice ability to lie like a rug liar made it her really good at being a thief like
00:13:09
she was the best thief in most cases Kate would just present herself at a boarding house and she would say hi I'm
00:13:16
interested in a room and they'd be like absolutely let me give you a tour she would be given a tour of the building
00:13:21
and then as soon as the landlord turn turned their back she would steal whatever she could Fantastico just shove
00:13:27
it in all her pett coats and that would be it she' just leave great yeah she' she got her tour and she'd just say oh
00:13:34
you know what actually I don't want to take this room and then she' just leave with all the [ __ ] and then they'd have
00:13:37
no record of her ever being there exactly cuz she's just taking the tour diabolical in the event that she
00:13:43
couldn't steal anything during the tour like if the landlord was like yeah keep an ey on Staring at her like I'm not
00:13:49
turning my back on you this isn't a visual podcast but Elena just like looked up stared at you yeah like like
00:13:55
put her face down and looked up with her eyes it was very intense that's what the
00:13:59
land lord would do uh but if she couldn't do that she would accept the room for like a day or two and just Rob
00:14:05
everything in the house and she would Rob the other Lodgers [ __ ] and then just
00:14:09
flee the house with all the [ __ ] I need to know more about Kate's childhood yeah
00:14:13
Kate wish I did Kate is a lot yeah and the scheme worked well for a while but eventually Kate was arrested again for
00:14:19
Larsen in 1867 and ended up being sentenced to four years in prison that's a long time in prison especially in
00:14:26
1800s prison yeah so while she was sentenced to four years in prison it looks like she might have only served a
00:14:32
little more than three overcrowding yeah you know and then when she made her way
00:14:36
up to London in ear um early 1871 [ __ ] didn't really change because years later after she was arrested for
00:14:44
uh the crime she will be arrested for Kate claimed that upon arriving in London she had every intention of
00:14:50
leaving her criminal ways behind her and making an honest living bet as the kids
00:14:55
would say indeed bet indeed but she even took up the first of several jobs as a domestic worker to just get on that
00:15:02
straight and narrow wow she had hope but it was during this period of her life that Kate would later claim that things
00:15:09
started to go wrong again oh it's crazy how like the world just works against you like that yeah she's like it wasn't
00:15:15
me wasn't me Rob everything just went wrong according to Kate she was working for a family in nodding Hill and while
00:15:21
she was there she right R she met a man who convinced her and apparently romance
00:15:27
this man convinced her to leave her lawyers and come work for him oh and she claimed I was induced by him to go live
00:15:35
with him at his house and he seduced me well there and I became in the family way with my little
00:15:41
boy where is he well he's around don't worry about that but Kate's version of events paints her entirely as a victim
00:15:49
of Seduction who after becoming pregnant was just thrown out of the house by the
00:15:54
boy's father oh poor Kate here's the thing that could have absolutely happened yeah probably 100% there's no
00:16:01
reason to believe that that couldn't happen but it's just that her history as a consumate liar and criminal makes a
00:16:09
lot of historians wonder whether it might have been a little more complicated than that perhaps cuz Kate
00:16:15
do be lying she do be but whatever the case Kate did give birth to a baby boy on April 19th 1874 so she was telling
00:16:24
the truth about that okay that's good and she ended up finding lodging in Kingston where she was was once again
00:16:29
passing herself off as that wife of that sea captain I don't know if he exists our elusive sea captain and she was
00:16:37
getting by on whatever food and small amounts of money were offered to her by neighbors all right yeah so at the same
00:16:44
time Kate was known to have been repeatedly visited by a man with the last name of strong o he's strong and he
00:16:51
was among other things rumored to have been the boy's father I thought you were going to say strong he was rumored to be
00:16:58
strong he was also thought to be possibly Kate's one-time partner in crime oh so
00:17:06
later in her statement to the police she claimed her return to crime was just purely out of NE necessity like she
00:17:12
didn't want to she alleged quote I became very impoverished forsaken by him and committed crimes for the purpose of
00:17:19
supporting myself and my child which is sad if that's the case absolutely and you can kind of see like yeah I could
00:17:25
see how that would be the case it wasn't but I don't know oh okay maybe I'm sure
00:17:30
it was part of the case yeah but you think she also she was also just a criminal yeah sometimes criminals come
00:17:36
criminal they are so by this time the authorities had definitely become aware of what they termed Kate's first
00:17:42
long-term Swindle oh um but unfortunately they also found out about her all of her aliases which were among
00:17:50
others web Webster Gibbs Gibbons and Lawler damn she's got a few she all of them and the details of this long con I
00:17:59
we could not find Dave searched high and low we can't find the details cuz obviously she wasn't running around
00:18:05
telling everybody and it was wicked long ago it was wicked I thought you were going to say and it was a wicked long
00:18:10
Kong I mean it was a long Kong it was wicked long ago say it wasn't Wicked it's true so but also so the criminal
00:18:18
activity did result in whatever she was doing to prepare for this long con or starting this long con yeah it did
00:18:25
result in a third arrest on 36 count of robbery so a few so a wicked long contest yeah and in May 1875 she was
00:18:39
sentenced to 18 months in prison wow for that Wicked long con that's not a wicked
00:18:44
long sentence exactly now Kate was released after serving her full sentence of 18 months but unfortunately it was a
00:18:51
short-lived freedom for her cuz after just a few months she was again arrested for robbery and sentenced to 12 months
00:18:57
in prison this time goody uh this time when she was released she went to live with her son's father who she was then
00:19:04
referring to as Mr Mitchell so everyone's SC aliases all righty um this was a man who lived in Teddington so I
00:19:12
don't know who Mr strong was but he wasn't the baby's dad or not how now this guy is so I don't know Okie do but
00:19:21
in the year that followed Kate managed to keep her criminal activities at least to a minimum Kate um but this was in
00:19:28
part because she started a romantic relationship with another local man oh and it was through this new relationship
00:19:34
that this is when Kate met Lucy loader who at the time employed the mother of Kate's then boyfriend the local man okay
00:19:42
so many key players exactly now when Julia complained that she was unable to find and keep good living help Lucy said
00:19:50
Kate great was Lucy loader who said Kate Webster and she said she had actually come to her attention Lucy's attention
00:19:57
through her own m Mrs Cree okay it was all very Colonel Mustard Miss Scarlet Professor Plum up in here yeah but she's
00:20:05
getting people to give her like a good yeah a good uh reference yeah exactly apparently she does good work so there's
00:20:12
that but Kate started her employment with Julia as a uh quote unquote General domestic worker in late January
00:20:20
1879 until the day she died Kate said that she had taken the job with Julia as a genuine attempt to make an honest
00:20:27
living she said she had no other no other motivations yeah but you know she do be lying like we said she she do be
00:20:36
lying Kate one thing about Kate is uh she stays lying she does stay lying forever and always she is pathological
00:20:42
at this point but odonnell claims that from the very first Kate seems to have inspired Mrs Thomas with
00:20:49
fear now although he doesn't offer any examples of this odonnell does heavily imply that Kate's um appear was a little
00:20:59
brutish came off real brutish I mean she's she's lived a thousand lives she has she very much has and the way they
00:21:06
describe it in the book is her wild Celtic blood and the memory of her free life in Wexford made her no doubt very
00:21:14
restless and bitterly resentful I mean you know us Celtic Women you know the wild Celtic blood um also didn't they
00:21:23
say that Julia like was pretty easily frightened or like didn't they say she was like easily
00:21:29
she was she was easily excitable so she was very like which I think they mean more so cuz it was more like a a
00:21:35
compliment when they say that like I think it was more like you could make her excited very EAS like you could you
00:21:39
could amp her up about stuff I thought it I thought it was more like a like oh she was she's easily excitable like
00:21:45
she's easily like you know sent off the edge which I think that could also be true because she was so tough with her
00:21:52
employees yeah um but all descriptions of Kate like physical descriptions they were given after her arrest so like
00:22:01
they're obviously biased by a pretty [ __ ] terrible crime that she committed but Julia's doctor described
00:22:07
Kate as quote an uncommonly tall powerful and ill-favored woman looking as if she belonged to the [ __ ] class oh
00:22:16
that's and I was like well damn I mean Kate's a piece of [ __ ] so it's like whatever but like damn yeah that that's
00:22:23
got to hurt it's pretty rough I wouldn't want to read that about myself but it is
00:22:27
speculated that Julia had taken on Kate with the hope of helping to reform her like she had heard that she had had some
00:22:32
troubles well she's a teacher too so she is she's a school teacher and apparently
00:22:36
Julia had done that for others in the past she had taken on some people that she that were having like a little bit
00:22:43
of a dark past not crazy dark but like some troubles not Kate dark not Kate dark but some troubles and she thought
00:22:49
you know what I'll give them something to do I'll give them a little money and hopefully it'll set them on the straight
00:22:54
and narrow so Julia was just like a good lady she sounds like it and in fact during the first week or so of the
00:22:59
arrangement Kate did her best to impress Julia and Julia did the same they were both being very kind to each other and
00:23:08
actually Julia in that first week lowered her unreasonable expectations a little bit and kind of let things slide
00:23:16
just to kind of ease Kate into the work but unfortunately it didn't take long for Kate's true character to reveal
00:23:22
itself and she soon became very lazy very disrespectful very aggressive and defiant she was gave you a chance yeah
00:23:31
and she's changing her ways of doing things for you so Kate later told investigators at first I thought her a
00:23:37
nice old lady and I hoped that I might be comfortable and happy with her but I found her very trying and she used to do
00:23:44
many things to annoy me during my work uh it's like is she annoying you actively like trying to or you just
00:23:51
easily annoy you're La yeah but according to Kate Julia would often check her work after she'd finished
00:23:58
clean cleaning and would point out spots that had not been cleaned correctly well
00:24:02
[ __ ] it's my house and that's your job that is the job man I don't know but Kate said this sort of conduct towards
00:24:09
me by Mrs Thomas made me feel an ill feeling towards her I which you know which also I'm like why don't we speak
00:24:16
like this anymore like what and this now would be like that [ __ ] made me really
00:24:21
[ __ ] angry but like back then it's like this made me have an ill feeling towards her it just feels so much more
00:24:31
like but Kate had also begun spending much of her time at a nearby pub because remember she lives right adjacent to the
00:24:38
P um it's called the hole in the wall which Julia strongly disapproved of I'm sure she did especially when it's
00:24:45
affecting Kate's work seemingly cuz Kate would come back like drunk and also spend a lot of her time there she would
00:24:51
show up late she wouldn't show up to things at all so [ __ ] that so Kate had made several attempts to straighten out
00:24:57
her life in the past at least like half-hearted attempts so there's no reason to doubt that she at least had
00:25:02
like partially intended to maybe live do an honest day's work here perhaps but I
00:25:08
don't think that was ever the full intention here um but it's it's definitely worth considering the fact
00:25:14
that Kate definitely saw in Julia Thomas that although she wasn't a wealthy woman
00:25:19
her commitment to the appearance of wealth and Status would have been a tempting thing for Kate and she has the
00:25:25
jewelry she has things worth stealing and remember Kate's a lifelong skilled Thief that's what she is so but if she
00:25:35
had been planning to steal anything from Julia it turned out that she wasn't given much of a chance to do so in the
00:25:41
beginning so at just one month after hiring Kate and bringing her into her home Julia actually gave her a notice of
00:25:48
dismissal so she didn't get a lot of time to steal anything because she was all over and it was really only a month
00:25:54
and then Julia was like you kind of suck at this so got to go got to go now whether or not Julia had actually
00:26:00
truly feared Kate which was what everybody believes um that's just like speculation it kind makes sense how
00:26:08
quick she let her go yeah but there is reason to believe that she did did have some fear of her after she gave her a
00:26:16
dismissal because who knows how Kate reacted to the dismissal and she could already see that she was very aggressive
00:26:21
and very defiant um rather than have Kate leave immediately upon giving notice which you could have done Julia
00:26:28
actually allowed her to stay for a few more days so she can make arrangements for future accommodations which that was
00:26:34
pretty big at Julia according to several members of Julia's church after she gave
00:26:39
Kate the notice of dismissal she asked several people in the congregation whether they would be willing to stay
00:26:44
with her at her home because she was scared oh and odonnell writes that um the way she put it she was scared of the
00:26:53
dark morose Savage eyed Kate [ __ ] yeah um and she was was scared that she would
00:26:59
exact some kind of Revenge like she so for her to think that she must said some [ __ ] yeah she said some [ __ ] now
00:27:05
eventually a young woman and her daughter actually agreed to stay with her and that kind of eased her anxiety a
00:27:10
little bit oh that's good and during this period it seems that Kate didn't act out in this while they were there at
00:27:18
least not so much that Julia feared her anymore and the presence of these other people in the house kind of like
00:27:24
emboldened Julia to continue to criticize Kate so that didn't help um like you already dismissed her but then
00:27:34
she also had a little bit of of a reason to do it because she had given Kate until February 28th to be out of the
00:27:40
house which was when the other Lodgers were planning to leave as well they were only staying as long as she was there um
00:27:47
so that would have been fine like there's other people in the house you're going to leave they're going to leave on
00:27:51
the same day everything will be fine yeah but when the deadline started approaching Kate had not found housing
00:27:57
she had not found other work and so she appealed to Julia can I stay a few days longer oh this would have left Kate and
00:28:04
Julia in the house alone together for a number of days she didn't want to appear
00:28:10
cruel though or uncharitable so Julia said sure So that Sunday February 28th Kate
00:28:17
had this is when she was supposed to be out of the house yeah Kate had gone out out to town in the morning but agreed to
00:28:23
be back in the afternoon so that Julia could go to church okay cuz she was obviously using something that Julia
00:28:29
needed to go to church yeah um in the previous weeks before this Kate had used this free time to visit her son who she
00:28:35
had actually left in the care of Mrs crease wonder where the kid was yeah Lucy loers made Mrs Cree that's who she
00:28:43
left her with but on this particular day instead of going to visit her son she went to the hole in the wall and she
00:28:49
ended up returning home late she was there drinking a lot according to Kate when she got home late and was clearly
00:28:55
drunk Julia quote became very agitated and left the house to go to church in that
00:29:01
state members of her church congregation did later confirm that Julia appeared very angry that day I mean and had
00:29:08
mentioned that she was late to the service because of Kate now Kate told several different versions of what
00:29:14
happened next that afternoon so it's difficult to know exactly which one is accurate but we can figure out ex pretty
00:29:20
much how it went down uh the evidence and testimony support this version of events okay when the service ended Julia
00:29:27
returned home in much the same agitated State than when she left and she went upstairs like just get out of my house
00:29:32
she's like get the [ __ ] out I'm done with you like please leave you're annoying when you want someone to leave
00:29:37
your house you just want them to leave and especially when it's someone that you have to be scared of and like
00:29:42
tiptoeing around right so she went upstairs Kate followed her upstairs and the two women began arguing and at this
00:29:49
point she Julia demanded you have to leave the [ __ ] house you have to get out yeah like I'm not living like this
00:29:56
anymore so Julia is just like get out of my house now Julia at this time I think
00:30:01
is in her early 50s oh okay just so you're aware of like you know obviously we're in the 1800s early 50s looks a
00:30:10
little different in the 1800s does now right so she was like you need to Julia was like you need to get
00:30:16
the hell out of the house I'm done with this like I've had you overstayed your welcome and she's so basically what what
00:30:21
Kate saw it as is you're ascending your offer for me to stay longer like how dare you and it's like well you're an
00:30:27
ass well it's like she gave that to you kind of out of like she kind of felt like obligation to do it yeah um and in
00:30:35
response Kate became very angry to this and became physically aggressive oh my God and pushed Julia and ended up
00:30:42
pushing her down the stairs oh [ __ ] and Kate told investigators she had a heavy
00:30:48
fall I felt that she was seriously injured and I became agitated at what had occurred lost all control of myself
00:30:55
and to prevent her screaming and getting me in trouble I caught her by the throat and in the
00:31:00
struggle she was choked and I threw her on the floor I love how she says she was
00:31:04
choked it's like no what you meant to say was I choked her it's like you are removing yourself from that like the
00:31:12
active participation role and like she was choked by what [ __ ] and it's like this lady fell down that you threw her
00:31:18
down the stairs she got hurt and then you were like oh I better kill her what the [ __ ] so I don't get in trouble what
00:31:23
do you mean you better kill her like why don't you just leave yeah what are you doing skip town what are you doing
00:31:28
killing her and like I threw her on the floor like Jesus that's horrible and remember Kate's a big lady yeah right
00:31:36
and Julia is not so she's using her like brute strength to throw her on the floor
00:31:41
and to choke her manually and she's much older like she's not yeah exactly she not able to really put up a fair fight
00:31:47
now later when she was later questioned Julia's landlord Mrs IES reported hearing quote a noise like the fall of a
00:31:54
heavy chair around the time the murder was believed to have been aded but otherwise no one heard anything else oh
00:32:00
wow now shocked by what she had just done because holy [ __ ] Kate moved quickly because she was like I have to
00:32:07
dispose of the body and clean up this mess because she had not only choked her out but she had thrown her down the
00:32:14
stairs and there was blood like she had hurt herself oh [ __ ] and she said I became entirely lost and without any
00:32:20
control over myself and looking on what had happened in the fear of being discovered I determined to do away with
00:32:25
the body as best as I could that's not out of control no that's not out of control that's perfectly in control yeah
00:32:31
you made very rational decisions for what you thought you were doing so she it gets worse she dragged Julia's body
00:32:39
into the kitchen and using a razor and a kitchen knife she quote stripped it cut
00:32:46
it up and threw it into a copper pot oh yep okay she had already started boiling water that day for the
00:32:55
washing and so she just threw all the the pieces into the boiling water but uh I don't know if anybody's
00:33:03
following but that's boiling flesh that's going to smell really bad mhm unable unable to tolerate the smell of
00:33:12
the boiling body parts Kate then just left the house and went back to the hole in the wall Pub where she spent several
00:33:19
hours drinking chatting with people hanging out hanging out while Julia's uh dismembered body is back at the house
00:33:27
and is boiling in a pot also like how big is this pot yeah well she didn't put all of her she put most of her in there
00:33:35
you'll find out what happens to the rest of her um so she went to the holand wall
00:33:40
drank you know had fun went back that night to clean up the rest of the blood because my goodness was that place
00:33:46
covered in blood um how is she not covered in blood oh well that's the other thing she started wearing um
00:33:53
Julia's clothing I was K she would have had to have changed she started wearing her clothing
00:33:58
and Mrs IES the landlordy and landlordy the landlordy you're going to say the landl
00:34:05
lordian I that's a better like title the land lordy hello I'm the land lordy it's
00:34:11
like when people say lordy lordy lordy land lordy lordy the landlordy lordy but Mrs IES the land lady and other
00:34:21
neighbors around did corroborate this whole thing because they said the neighborhood began to [ __ ] re that's
00:34:27
the thing it's not like just the house is going to smell this is a this is some old timey [ __ ] this is in the 1800s we
00:34:33
don't really have like good air quality anyways and this is a middle class neighborhood where everything is really
00:34:39
close together too and no and they don't have these like you know weather tested
00:34:44
window panes and [ __ ] that's going to like keep anything in it's like everything's just seeping out into
00:34:49
everywhere and so the whole neighborhood smelling Julia boiling in a pot now during the coroner inquest several weeks
00:34:56
later there were also claims made that Kate had quote fed the fat dripping to local children to eat and called it pigs
00:35:04
lard is that for real it's in the inquest no yes no yeah Kate's [ __ ] Kate's [ __ ] Kate's [ __ ] e now
00:35:16
when she returned to the house a few hours later Kate put the remaining body parts in a box but Julia's head and one
00:35:23
of her feet wouldn't fit in the box so she buried the head in a nearby empty lot oh and then threw the foot into a
00:35:30
garbage pile fantastic yeah a few days later after weighing the box down with some Stones she threw Julia's remains
00:35:37
into the temps oh um then returned to the house and was pretty confident like I think I just committed the Perfect
00:35:45
Crime I don't know about that sister this she was so confident she walked back to that house and was like well I'm
00:35:52
just going to live here for a while I'm just going to use her [ __ ] nobody's going to ask where Julia is everyone she
00:35:57
doesn't like you no but as previously stated Julia was a widow and had no children so her immediate absence
00:36:05
wouldn't have been like so noticed but also remember our girl Julia like to take off and not tell anyone on travel
00:36:13
part yeah she loved last minute travel she wouldn't tell her closest contact sometimes y so neighbors and friends had
00:36:19
become kind of accustomed to her just disappearing for periods of time really without warning damn so it really worked
00:36:26
in Kate's favor it gave her ample time to clean that crime scene without feeling even the slightest impetus to
00:36:33
flee she was like you know what no I work here as far as anybody's concerned me being in this house is totally fine
00:36:41
and if anyone asks I just say Julia's on vacation again and I'm keeping the house
00:36:45
even where PE like Julia had told people she was afraid of Kate yeah she could just be like oh well I you know like we
00:36:50
came to agreement we worked it out oh [ __ ] after disposing of Julia's remains in the temps Kate returned to the house
00:36:57
and started cleaning just to give the general appear appearance of normaly she didn't want to arouse any suspicions
00:37:03
after all and by dumping the remains in the river Kate believed she had gotten rid of any evidence that could prove a
00:37:09
murder had even occurred she was like those are never going to come back up the river will will eat them yeah that's
00:37:15
how they will never be seen again totally except one day later on March 5th a coal Porter traveling along the
00:37:24
road adjacent to the river just saw a box and it had resurfaced about five miles away from where she had dumped
00:37:31
this box that's the other thing girlfriend like I'm not saying do better cuz don't don't but like you threw it in
00:37:36
a box sometimes boxes float yeah well she waited it down oh she did she did think it was going to be weighted down
00:37:42
but like still [ __ ] happen it's a river yeah rivers flow they do things happen
00:37:47
they're known to yeah gently down the stream in fact well this guy saw this box and this was Julia's box this wasn't
00:37:53
some cardboard box that you just find this was Julia's like it was a fancier box almost like a trunk yeah like some
00:37:59
kind of nice box essentially so this guy saw this and he thought it might contain
00:38:04
something valuable cuz it was a nice looking box oh my God so he fished it out of the river and opened it to find
00:38:10
several body parts wrapped in brown paper not what he was looking for so he was like wow this isn't what I wanted so
00:38:16
he reported the discovery to the police and an investigation was Mount mounted to just figure out who this was yeah uh
00:38:23
according to the doctor who conducted the examination of the remains quote the mization of the corpse had uh mization
00:38:31
why do I keep adding isation onto things lately I not the word no it's not but you know what I know that you know that
00:38:38
we all know that do I know that cuz it didn't even hit me my brain knows that no I do know that too but it's
00:38:45
believable muiz what was the last thing I said oh I forgot there was another thing where I had isation of you did you
00:38:53
absolutely did what's going on I don't remember maybe I need a speech path you're in a place of Z that that you
00:38:59
know I'm I'm listening listening with my ears Speech Pathology here I come no sometimes when you're reading fast and
00:39:06
it's hard to yeah and sometimes you just want to make it fancy like mization sometimes you have a soul and you just
00:39:11
go into a completely different accent so don't worry about it don't worry about it perhaps we can go to the speech
00:39:15
pathologist together there you go I like it per chance a two for one yeah let's see if they got any
00:39:21
deal BOGO are you guys getting any BOGO sales they're like this is a real establishment please leave pleas ma'am
00:39:30
this is a Wendy we're like oh [ __ ] I'll take a spicy chicken nugget you got to fall for fall oh [ __ ]
00:39:38
I'll take a spicy chicken nugget is asan sucking oh man that's good that's good [ __ ] that's good [ __ ] so what the doctor
00:39:52
did say was not mutilation because he was a doctor and he was smart so he said the
00:39:58
mutilation that is the word of the corpse had certainly been done in an unskilled
00:40:04
manner you could say that yeah leading investigators to theorize that the cl the crime had been committed by someone
00:40:11
who had no experience in killing or dismemberment damn to go that far though and have never killed before is wild
00:40:18
like that's your first foray that's a lot that's something now other than the human remains inside there was really
00:40:25
nothing unique about the Box it was it was a nice box but that's really it and there was really no clues to where it
00:40:31
came from just popped out of the river so that left Scotland Yard investigators with very little to work with because of
00:40:40
this the Press began referring to the case initially as the Barn's mystery which that was the area where the box
00:40:46
was discovered and that's why they named it that okay a few days later the mystery deepened though when a severed
00:40:52
foot was found quote buried in a dung Heap in in twickingham oh that's so awful and I looked it up
00:41:00
Twickenham because I was like is it t i want to be that person is it tation Tanis maybe town uh but the doctor
00:41:08
examined the foot and concluded it was the missing limb from the body parts found in the temps oh wow still missing
00:41:15
a head though oh on March 16th the coroner's inquest was carried out to determine the cause of death but with
00:41:21
little information and no clues it was kind of impossible to come out with any final conclusions
00:41:27
in his testimony the examining doctor Dr Adams gave the dimensions of the dismembered body parts and I'm not sure
00:41:35
if he was okay to be quite honest because he incorrectly identified the victim as a woman of between 18 and 30
00:41:43
huh and she may have born children incorrect incorrect on both fronts all incorrect like are you okay sir I think
00:41:51
he probably just thought there was a strong chance that you know he's like she's a woman she's definitely a woman
00:41:57
probably had kids the 1800s she probably did most people that die are 18 to 30 when you 50-50 shot and you got wrong
00:42:04
all friends uh but after being assured by Scotland Yard detectives that without any additional information it was
00:42:12
unlikely the victim would be identified the inquest was unfortunately closed in late March cuz they were like we don't
00:42:18
really know how we're going to do anything with this cuz remember it's the 1800s they're like oops I guess that's
00:42:24
itop like that sucks but I guess we have nothing else so as the Barnes mystery unfolded several miles away Kate Webster
00:42:31
just kept living in Julia's house like I said wearing her clothes going about her
00:42:36
usual business and continuing to give the impression that everything was fine that's so [ __ ] that she just wearing
00:42:43
her clothes yeah that part I hate a lot yeah now during this period she claimed she got the idea to sell off Julia's
00:42:51
furniture and other valuables as a means of funding her Escape see that's that's
00:42:55
what makes me think yeah yeah she says it was suggested in my mind to sell all there was in the house and go away the
00:43:03
way this [ __ ] talks like she's not even there she's not even part of this whole
00:43:07
she was choked it was suggested in my mind when I something rude to somebody I'm be like oh my God I'm sorry my mind
00:43:13
just suggested like that was just suggested in my mind I apologize I have to take the suggestions not on me and
00:43:21
they have to come out my mouth but like I don't necessarily create them do you think she's talking like that because
00:43:25
she was trying to sound like perhaps insane or do you think she's just an [ __ ] I think she's just an [ __ ] to
00:43:30
be quite honest I'm also in a big place of perhaps today I don't know if you've noticed perhaps she's just an
00:43:35
[ __ ] um but to do all this cuz now she's got to sell all the furniture Kate contacted an associate she had committed
00:43:42
robbery with in the past hey old habit die hard you know and they made the two made arrangements with a local salesman
00:43:48
named John church and John Church was going to buy Julia's furniture and other belongings for sale great the thing was
00:43:56
John church was told that Kate was Julia and that she was selling her stuff because she was moving that's spooky
00:44:04
yeah great podcast that that is that is a great podcast now at the same time she
00:44:09
continued ordering items to be delivered to the house on Julia's tab to to try to
00:44:15
keep it going much to sell keep it going that she's alive like the whole thing now on March 18th Church arrived at
00:44:25
Julia's house with his horse and cart remove the furniture while Julia's absence hadn't been entirely out of the
00:44:31
ordinary as far as the neighbors were concerned seeing a stranger removing her furniture from the house when she wasn't
00:44:37
there that'll do it that was a little weird to them now somewhat suspicious Mrs IES are landlordy there landlord uh
00:44:45
she confronted John Church who explained that Mrs Thomas Mrs Julius Tom Julia Thomas had sold him the items but when
00:44:53
he described Thomas for Mrs IES little bit different he was describing Kate Webster so realizing she had been found
00:45:01
out Kate just took the [ __ ] off she just fled the house and went immediately to
00:45:06
the train station where she caught a train to Liverpool just jumped a train [ __ ] Julia's disappearance though was
00:45:13
quickly reported to police Now by The Neighbors um as was the suspicion that Kate had something to do with her
00:45:19
absence and she just St and vanished and she was like posing as her to sell her [ __ ] uh an investigator soon connected
00:45:26
The Remains disc covered in the temps with The Disappearance of Julia Thomas The Big Break came when detectives
00:45:32
managed to track down a local boy who claimed that a woman matching Kate's description had asked him for help
00:45:38
carrying a box to the river she asked a little boy to help her carry that [ __ ]
00:45:43
to the river yep wow which they concluded were was now the remains of Julia Thomas that's [ __ ] during a
00:45:49
search of Julia's home investigators discovered the copper pot at the back of the house that was quote covered with
00:45:56
fat with the and the coroner later explained that the reasons The Remains had been
00:46:02
preserved with quote a parchment like appearance was because of that like rendered fat yeah they also discovered
00:46:10
blood stains and other evidence all over the house that strongly suggested that a
00:46:15
violent murder had occur so she wasn't good at cleaning she was not Scotland Yard detectives couldn't yet prove that
00:46:21
Julia had been murdered by Kate but there was enough evidence to arrest Kate for robbery at least and warrant was put
00:46:27
out for her arrest though her whereabouts at this time no one knew right now under normal circumstances 19
00:46:34
century detectives would have had a very difficult time tracking a criminal who'd
00:46:40
flood the city particularly one who had a significant Head Start cuz again it's the 1800s yeah this isn't easy they're
00:46:47
not they're not just like oh follow their cell phone signal like it's literally like they're gone like we
00:46:53
don't know where they went right but she had a significant criminal history Kate
00:46:58
was very known to authorities in various places around England and Ireland and so
00:47:05
a constable in Wexford recognized her from a previous arrest and contacted Scotland Yard okay I know that [ __ ] I
00:47:13
know that [ __ ] and the Wexford Constable gave detectives from London the address of Kate's relatives in the
00:47:19
area and on March 29th she was arrested at her uncle's home in kilan and transported right on back to London see
00:47:26
you now on Monday morning March 31st Kate was brought before the magistrates in Richmond where she was charged with
00:47:32
the murder of Julia Martha Thomas as well as Larsen for the theft and attempted sale of Thomas's property now
00:47:40
at the time John Church was also charged with being a conspirator in the crime and for receiving stolen property those
00:47:49
charges would be eventually completely dropped that's good cuz it was determined he had absolutely nothing to
00:47:53
do with that yeah I mean she was posing as Julia at first though Kate tried to pin the blame of the murder on John
00:48:00
Church yeah that's not shocking no not at all she said I first got acquainted with him when I was living two or three
00:48:06
doors down from him she said he used to take me out to London into various public houses I met him again some
00:48:13
months ago and he came to my mistress's house one night the worst for drink so he came drunk and according to Kate it
00:48:20
was church who suggested they murder Julia for profit from selling her [ __ ] meanwhile he's like no no no I thought
00:48:28
that was Julia like I don't know her and he's like I'm a furniture buyer like why would I sell I to me
00:48:36
would I sell it to like I'm a furniture buyer like what the [ __ ] that doesn't make any sense and she quoted church as
00:48:42
allegedly saying we could have her things and go off to America together and enjoy it wow she really thought me
00:48:48
me thinks you had a crush on John church and your M you want to create this like
00:48:52
fantasy of him being like we run off to America together and John Church is like
00:48:57
help I don't even I thought she was Julia like what the [ __ ] and Kate went on to claim that church murdered Julia
00:49:04
Thomas himself oh my God and threatened to kill her as well if she spoke a word of the crime to anyone and you know
00:49:10
didn't pretend to be Julia exactly now in statements to both the police and the Press John Church denied literally
00:49:17
anything like I only recently met Kate Webster and I thought she was Julia Thomas like that I don't know her we
00:49:25
didn't hang out I didn't want to run off to America with her I don't even know her real name like according to John
00:49:31
Church the woman he now knew to be Kate Webster had been introduced to him only a couple of weeks earlier by a mutual
00:49:38
acquaintance and she claimed to have what she had said to him was that she had lost her husband a few years earlier
00:49:44
so she was literally cosplaying Julia Thomas saying I'm a widow oh [ __ ] I okay
00:49:50
okay and she was attempting to rent rooms in her home as a mean of means of income which is literally what Julia
00:49:57
Thomas was doing this is psychotic but she said she had been unsuccessful at keeping people like Lodgers so she
00:50:03
needed to sell her furniture okay that's what she was telling him and the two had
00:50:07
made an arrangement and the next time he saw her was just to pay for the goods and then he said and then I attempted to
00:50:14
pick up the items but then I was stopped by Mrs IES right what the [ __ ] is going
00:50:19
on like what is happening and he said only just think of the impudence and Audacity Of The Woman to come here
00:50:26
dressed up her silk dresses representing herself to be a lady in the Mistress of
00:50:30
the house and swindle me in this way and bring all the trouble on me that translates roughly into [ __ ]
00:50:37
this to like what is this [ __ ] [ __ ] like what what is this that translates into
00:50:43
this [ __ ] this [ __ ] that's what that translates into in 2024 but within a few
00:50:49
days of the arrest Kate had implicated yet another suspected conspirator named Henry Porter who had introduced her to
00:50:56
church for the sale of the furniture according to Kate Porter had also been in on the scheme and had even used his
00:51:02
young son Robert to help Kate dispose of the remains in the temps and Kate said church and Porter were with me at the
00:51:10
time I intend to tell the whole truth as I do not see why I should be blamed for
00:51:14
what church has done [ __ ] and remember she's a [ __ ] liar she lies about everything she's got big old issues but
00:51:22
fortunately for church several people testified as to having seen him at the bar the Rising Sun on the night of the
00:51:28
murder and similarly in her deposition Porter's wife Henry Porter's wife gave a detailed explanation of how the family
00:51:36
had come to know Kate and insisted that while her husband may have introduced Kate to John church for the sale of the
00:51:42
furniture he had no idea that the items were stolen or that Julia had been murdered they thought she was on
00:51:49
vacation right after several continuances and pre-trial hearings Kate finally went to trial at the Old Bailey
00:51:56
we've heard of that before y on July 22nd 1879 due to the extensive coverage of the case leading up to this trial and
00:52:05
just The Sensational details of the case the courtroom was well attended by curious onlookers there were additional
00:52:12
people outside the courthouse wanting to know what was going on and at the time Kate pleaded not guilty and continued to
00:52:18
say that the murder had been committed by others wow and in support of their argument Kate's lawyer Warner slay
00:52:25
pointed out that which we a sleigh and it reminds me of a Legally Blonde burner what like it's hard like it's hard he
00:52:33
pointed out that the crown had no physical evidence connecting Kate to the murder and whatever evidence they did
00:52:39
have was entirely circumstantial uh in fact slay argued there was no real evidence supporting
00:52:44
the theory that Julia Thomas had died by violence except for the fact that she was dismembered and her body was boiled
00:52:52
like my guy are you serious it's natural causes are you real what is your definition of natural causes natural
00:52:59
causes she just flew apart into a Boiling Pot of water to a copper pot it's crazy and then somehow ended up in
00:53:06
a river who are you sir word or slay yeah he did not get a law degree from Harvard and then he said and actually
00:53:12
there's no conclusive evidence that say the remains in the Box belong to Julie at all and it's like except that the
00:53:18
coroner said they did but okay also slay added that even if a murder had occurred
00:53:23
and that's a big if on his part what's all that baby who could ever believe that a young woman and the mother of a
00:53:33
child could have committed such an heinous act so he's standing in front of this courtroom being like yeah I know I
00:53:40
know that we have all this evidence circumstan or whatever but she's a woman a woman she's a mother a mother she
00:53:49
couldn't have done this no case closed get it out of here yikes and the prosecution on the other hand strongly
00:53:56
rejected Kate's claims of innocence and cited her very lengthy criminal repast and reputation for just general
00:54:03
unpleasantness they were like actually she quite sucks yeah they were like she's kind of a dick more importantly
00:54:09
the crown had evidence on their side they were like regardless of what you're saying there is evidence in one witness
00:54:15
after another the prosecutor Harry Poland put the pieces of the complicated story back together for the jury a
00:54:21
13-year-old girl who was a neighbor of Julia positively identified that special box in which the remains had been found
00:54:28
as one she had seen many times in Thomas's house a year earlier essentially putting to rest any
00:54:34
questions as to whether these remains were actually Julia's and also the coroner and examining doctor testified
00:54:41
that although they couldn't be certain without the head the remains matched those of the woman the age and size of
00:54:46
Julia Thomas so there it is so they got a different doctorine to be like actually no actually now although the
00:54:52
prosecution's case was kind of complicated in their closing remark Poland and the prosecution team laid out
00:54:58
it the case pretty simply after receiving a notice of termination Kate Webster had become pissed and murdered
00:55:04
her employer Julia Thomas there it is she told her to leave the testimony of several witnesses indicated that Kate
00:55:11
had been seen disposing of the remains in the temps and that following the Murder She was known to have sold
00:55:17
Thomas's belongings and wear her [ __ ] clothes it was true Poland acknowledged that the evidence was largely
00:55:24
circumstantial but common Common Sense dictated that if Kate had gone so far as to dispose of the body and get rid of
00:55:31
all the evidence of the crime she was likely the one to have committed the crime one could say and Poland reminded
00:55:37
the jury neither Porter nor Church were traced in any connection with Mrs Thomas's house till after the murder the
00:55:44
accused woman was undoubtedly there as a domestic servant so so after 7 Days of trial the jury found Kate Webster guilty
00:55:53
of the willful murder of Julia Thomas after after the verdict was read the magistrate asked Kate whether there was
00:55:59
any reason that a sentence of death should not be handed down to her and Kate insisted I am not guilty my lord of
00:56:05
the murder I've never done it and as I was taken into custody I was in a hurry I made a statement against Church
00:56:11
importer I am very sorry for doing so but I was told to do so they are quite innocent of anything of the sort and I
00:56:18
want them to be clear of it so now she's completely retracting all of her accusations against them but
00:56:27
still didn't do it yeah and she was told to say that I'm like by the police by was it another mind suggestion it I was
00:56:34
going to say it was suggested in her mind in her final statement Kate pretty much undermined her entire defense by
00:56:41
clearing Church importer of anything and instead she insisted the real killer now
00:56:47
was the father of her unborn child she was pregn she said yes I'm pregnant and they were like wow you
00:56:56
didn't bring that up until right now and she they were like what's his name and she was like I will not tell you that
00:57:01
and they were like you don't want to give us the name you just want to go to jail instead like you you don't want to
00:57:06
tell us who actually killed this L and she said nope and the magistrate though he had been very patient by this point
00:57:12
he clearly didn't believe [ __ ] all of this so he said after so many false statements which you have made it must
00:57:19
not be assumed as a matter of mere course that you are telling the truth now and with the trial over the
00:57:24
magistrate made it clear that his only course of action was to pass sentence and with that he sentenced Kate to be
00:57:30
hanged bye girl now it was later determined that Kate was not pregnant yeah she was not pregnant during any of
00:57:37
this she was probably just like last she was trying to get out of it um and her appeal which she filed several weeks
00:57:43
later was immediately rejected oh good on July 28th the night before she was executed Kate recanted all her previous
00:57:50
statements and made a full confession to the Murder She Wrote we had an argument
00:57:56
which ripened into a quarrel and in the height of my anger and rage I threw her from the top of the stairs to the ground
00:58:02
floor in her confession she insisted that she had intended for her job with Julia Thomas to be a new start for her
00:58:09
and her son and that she never intended to kill or Rob the woman she said I did not murder Mrs Thomas from any
00:58:16
premeditation I was enraged and in a passion and I cannot now recollect why I did it something did seize me at the
00:58:23
time so she's saying your own anger lost my [ __ ] yeah and I murdered this woman
00:58:29
not only threw her down the stairs and choked the life out of her toddled down the stairs after her and choked the life
00:58:37
out of her yeah and threw her onto the ground and then dismembered her used a razor and a kitchen
00:58:44
knife to dismember her boil her remains in a pot bury her head in an empty lot throw her foot into a trash pile and
00:58:55
then throw the rest in the temps and then wear her [ __ ] clothing and pretend to be her and give
00:59:02
the local children and she's like but I didn't like plan it everybody girly I did intend to just work and it's like
00:59:11
that's so nice that you intended to work seems as though it didn't work out way that's really nice but like you did some
00:59:17
[ __ ] o to the V girl in her final statement Kate said I am perfectly resigned to my fate and am full of
00:59:25
confidence in a happy eternity if I had a choice I would almost sooner die than return to a life full of misery
00:59:31
deception and wickedness and with her confession made and her conscience um allegedly cleared Kate Webster was
00:59:38
executed the following morning in the yard at Wandsworth prison and buried in an unmarked grave and the crowd
00:59:44
assembled outside the prison cheered hey now you may be wondering what happened to Julia's head did they
00:59:52
find it where is it they haven't found it yet well throw the the investigation and trial investigators were continually
00:59:59
vexed by that point they could not find her head Kate had claimed she buried it in a vacant lot but they were never able
01:00:07
to find it and they said they believed it was just irretrievably lost they couldn't like where it's not where she
01:00:13
says it is I don't know where it is and then one day in 2010 a skull was discovered by some
01:00:22
workers are you ready in the garden of BBC broadcaster and famous David attenburrow what in the garden of David
01:00:37
Attenborough they found a skull they sent it for forensic testing that skull was identified as the 130-year-old skull
01:00:48
of Julia Martha Thomas what that skull was the final missing piece of the mystery and with its
01:01:00
Discovery it is 100% sure that Kate Webster did this cuz she pointed them to where that is they just couldn't find it
01:01:08
what the [ __ ] in David aten bur's [ __ ] Garden they found Julia Martha Thomas' skull that's wild he's the guy
01:01:16
that does all those nature videos like under the sea the voice of an Angel yes yeah that David atenor that one that one
01:01:24
I'll never listen to one of the 2010 they found the final why and this is why I'm telling you there is always
01:01:35
hope to close a [ __ ] case totally 130 years later always there's never a time where you can say we will never find out
01:01:43
that's why I hold out hope for Jack the Ripper [ __ ] cuz I'm telling you that's
01:01:49
why there's always something there's always a chance I did not see it going that way no so it closed it out too it
01:01:56
put a nice pin in it that it said Kate Webster did this absolutely what she said was true it happened and that John
01:02:04
church and the othery and uh the other guy there Porter were not were not any part of this wow yeah that I'm shook
01:02:13
isn't that crazy that was a wild [ __ ] case yeah it's gnarly so that is what is
01:02:20
called the Richmond murder the murder of Julia Martha Thomas that's so sad she sounded like a really cool lady yeah she
01:02:28
didn't deserve what she got Kate sounded like a [ __ ] trip Kate is a trip not an enjoyable not at all and she really
01:02:35
[ __ ] herself at that point very much so you could had a nice cushy job here yeah and it's so creepy that she just
01:02:41
kept wearing her [ __ ] like what selling her stuff and Tak like ordering things
01:02:46
on her tab yeah what like what the [ __ ] and then she's like I didn't plan it it's like okay but you did some terrible
01:02:52
[ __ ] afterwards dude like just cuz you didn't planet do your job and if you throw somebody down the stairs you got
01:03:00
to call someone yeah don't throw people down the stairs don't obviously yeah so that's that's that well we hope you keep
01:03:09
listening and we hope you keep it weird but not so weird that you kill your employer and chop her up into little
01:03:17
pieces and then boil her on the stove and feed the fat to local children don't do that yuck
01:03:24
[Music] [Music] [Music] oh okay are you all right today the [ __ ] you're insane insane woman