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hey weirdos I'm Ash and I'm Elena and this is [Music] morbid this is morbid and oh boy is it a
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doozy that I have for you today you always get this certain look in your eyes when you're about to really [ __ ] me
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up story just I have oh even Mikey is making a face he's like oh it's I mean Dave when
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we were talking about it was like why is this not its own like movie series like
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it's a wild tale oh no there's so much to it n and like a lot of mystery but it's just really really intense so okay
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you know I think you need to buckle up for it but uh hold on to your butts hold on to those butts but before we get into
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it I just want to say um we got to go on stage with pod Meats world it was the coolest thing I think we've ever gotten
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to do we got to hang out with tapanga Eric and Shan from Bo meets worlds Harley and [ __ ] Harley ker and
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they are just the nicest people I'm telling you you know that whole thing we say it all the time we're like oh you
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always get scared you're like don't meet your Heroes don't do it cuz they can disappoint you and like Meet Your Heroes
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I was I'm just always scared cuz I'm like I I just really hope this doesn't like you know just like blow up in our
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face I'm telling you guys it's uh Daniel official will fridell ryer strong and Danny mcnalty as Harley ker and I'm
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telling you they were the sweetest people truly I like I'm 37 years old you guys know how many times I reference
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like Sabrina the Teenage Witch boy means it's always those too yeah it's always those that just like I go right back to
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cuz they were literally my adolescence and walking into a room and seeing just the squad Sean Hunter Tanga and Eric
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yeah just sitting there you were you acted you acted cool thank you for saying that because inside of my body
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was a [ __ ] a fright see I know that because I know you but like if you didn't know you I don't think you could
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tell also they all give really good handshake they do they give a strong handshake and they look you in the eye
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yes papa always taught me you give a strong handshake cuz nobody likes a little fishy nobody likes a little
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Sloppy Fish hand I was so impressed by all their handshakes they're just really kind people they're hilarious so funny
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very like welcoming it was a lot of fun sitting on a couch next to Eric I was like I don't just unal what the [ __ ]
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happened here so invited us to ice cream he did i' I'm still not over any of this
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and we're going we're going and oh well if you're walking Sammy oh hey hey and also hey to your wife Sue because she
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was awesome she was so sweet but she had swag too I loved her outfit yeah they were great and it's like and so this is
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all also to say like the only reason we are able to do this stuff is cuz you guys listen to this show which is still
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wild uh thanks for that thank you a lot cuz like that was a really cool experience weirdos making dreams and I
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only had it because of you guys so appreciate and apprciate should we tell them how it made us feel on
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stage made us feel some type of way it made us feel like maybe we wanted to do a show like a HomeTown show a HomeTown
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show not a tour yeah I we will not tour I'm about to be a wetted woman uh and you have like 70 kids I have three but
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similar honestly it feels like three kids and two dogs equates to 70 children you know what correct do yes you were
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right the first time trust me I've been here uh but yeah I think we want to do a
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HomeTown show we got the bug next year so we'll let we'll keep you guys updated on that so yeah definitely next year at
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some point it was just really fun to have to sneeze to go out there I wanted to warn you so that I
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appreciate that I have to sneeze yeah it was just really fun but um thanks to pod meets worlds thanks to
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all of them and thanks to you guys and thanks to everybody that was an awesome experience and again you guys are the
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best you guys are the uh I'm going to ruin your life with this story so I'm sorry that that I'm taking you here you
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should get a shirt that says that I'm going to ruin your life with this story so I'm sorry cuz I the amount of times
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you've said that to me in my life even about like things that are that we don't talk about on the show you're like I got
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a story that's going to R life or I'm like I have a fact that's going to and if I have to know it you have to know it
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now like I do that to John daily did I ever tell you guys about the time that Elena looked at me and she goes the sun
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could have exploded 8 minutes ago and we wouldn't know yeah if the sun explodes we won't won't know for8 minutes and I'm
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not going to be alone in knowing that no now you all know that love you and you're also going to have to
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know about the horrific case of ocne okay uh this is an older one but I promise you it's not lacking in uh drama
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okay so the death of OC Sneed in East Orange New Jersey what's up New Jersey oh um it was an it was an undeniable
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track tragedy but her death was really only be the beginning of what would become one of the early 20th Century's
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truly most captivating crime stories oh man like it's pulled directly out of the
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pages of some kind of like classic southern gothic horror novel got a lot of elements and like any
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good Gothic Horror Story the trial that followed was also full of unbelievable twists and ended up culminating in a
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pretty shocking conclusion really yeah I feel like we've had a a few cases where
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there's been like gnarly trials lately yeah usually a lot of times the olds the older cases have some Wy trials yeah cuz
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I feel like different things were admissible back then and like they tried to get away with different kinds of [ __ ]
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[ __ ] exactly and they had to change laws and [ __ ] yeah yeah all right so let's
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first begin with OC who is OC sne tell me now like many aspects of this story OC's date of birth and several other you
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know details about her are kind of shrouded in a little bit of mystery the 1900s of it all yeah she was born in New
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York New York in September of 1885 I don't know exactly what date it was we couldn't find one a Virgo exactly we
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couldn't find one that we felt comfortable being like this is definitely her birthday uh her name was
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oana wardlaw Martin that's a really pretty name I know oana yeah uh she was the daughter of Caroline
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wardlaw and Colonel Robert Maxwell Martin who who was a very celebrated conet Confederate veteran of the
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American Civil War now from the perspective of his Confederate peers got to be clear about
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that let let's be clear Robert Martin was a war hero oh again remember perspective is everything uh he served
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in many key battles in the war war he was severely wounded while saving the life of General John Hunt Morgan but
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managed to survive and went on to lead the Confederate plot to burn New York City oh fun when their attempt to uh
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burn New York City ultimately failed yeah it didn't work out cuz uh I don't know if you guys know it but uh New York
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City's still there still standing um he led an unsuccessful attempt to kidnap Vice President Andrew Johnson wow he for
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that was eventually captured and imprisoned um and he was released from prison when the war ended and moved back
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to the South where he made and lost a fortune in the tobacco industry real interesting fell this one I guess
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so now it was during this post-war period that he met and married Caroline wardlaw now Roberts still had a fortune
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like he ended up he was never he was never in Dire Straits here um and Robert supervised the construction of a large
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mansion in Wilder Park Kentucky in the early 1880s tragedy struck because the family Mansion burned to the ground
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under suspicious circumstances that's ironic yeah I know the couple lived for a short amount of time in a much smaller
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house on the grounds of the Mansion but that quickly became a little unsustainable following the birth of the
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couple's first child okay so Robert relocated the family to New York City and Caroline gave birth to OSI oana in
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the fall of 1885 what a weird thing to like go live in the city that you plan to burn down yeah it's a little strange
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yes that is a little strange uh there was a brief period of success and calm for the family until about 1900 when
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tragedy struck again oh no that's when Robert's son died from brain fever intis oh uh that's what they used to call in
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sephtis um it he died after so he he has he had in sephtis and that's what he died from but it was after a
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particularly bad fall down the stairs in their home in New York do you think that
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could have had something to do with it people don't know what happened there okay can you also remind me what
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incilius is please um it's like inflammation of the brain oh okay so that's why they call it brain fever
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gotcha gotcha um like the fire that destroyed the family home in Kentucky before the circumstances under which you
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know the Robert's son died were somewhat suspicious okay I'm catching on to a theme here if you will what's more
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suspicious was the speed at which his father collected a payout from the 2200 ,000 life insurance policy damn and
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that's 20 when they could uh they could use money mhm they could have used money
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like it came in interesting timing yeah which it seems like insurance policies in this story come at man they just come
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at the right time dude insurance policies that's they're always on time they freak me out now that $22,000 life
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insurance policy now would be $700,000 holy [ __ ] sizable yeah I mean even just
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$22,000 like $700,000 that's on another level baby and it's like so there's a lot there now
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despite this and it all just went to plan despite this the insurance payout allowed the family to move to a much
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nicer home on Fifth Avenue actually imagine that 0 Fifth Avenue Silver Linings I guess yeah um unfortunately
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the excitement of the new home wouldn't last long before tragedy struck again because only a few months after moving
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in Neighbors heard a commotion coming from the Martin house and they ran over to see what was happening and found
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Robert had suffered a paralytic stroke and was being attended by a rather stern-looking Caroline his wife okay who
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immediately told her hysterical daughter OSI not to speak okay so was that like a stroke or
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was that something else you can't see me but I'm shrugging she's the shrug Emoji
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I don't know Robert did hold on for a little while and ended up living for a short period of time in very bad health
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and then finally ended up succumbing and dying on January 12th 1901 it's just weird that she told her daughter not to
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say anything cuz like what would she have to say if he was just having a stroke what would she have to say I
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wonder me as now following Robert's death Caroline packed up her daughter and moved them both back to her hometown
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of Murphreesboro Tennessee okay that's where Caroline's sister Virginia was actually in charge of the Murphreesboro
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Soul female college where Caroline's other sister she had two sisters Mary was a member of The Faculty cool so
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Virginia is the president of the school Mary run is part of the faculty Caroline
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hadn't let them know that she was coming but they took her in right away and they
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found her a job as the school's new bookkeeper so they're all working at this school together now it seems by all
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accounts that Virginia and Mary's existence at the school before this were fairly normal uh oh uh Su female college
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was touted as providing quote a traditional Southern education for women in cultural studies and social Grace oo
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social Grace now Virginia was named president of the school in 1892 and the school really thrived under her
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leadership and became very highly acclaimed she was well respected she ran the pro program with discipline with
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honor according to all who knew her at the time she was she was brought into this position because because of her the
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respect people had for her wow now Virginia had spent her adult life as what people called a spinster and
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focused on her responsibilities at school that was what she she really focused on AKA a boss [ __ ] yeah for now
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for now just gonna say I don't know anything I don't know what happens so yeah okay statement um and Mary had
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raised two sons and when they had grown and married she joined the faculty at school so everybody seemed like they had
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you know taken a good path okay again seem to be killing it then Caroline arrives okay Caroline seems to be the
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issue here the arrival of Caroline was like a weird reset button and no one really understood why like again
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everything seemed to be going pretty chill people said the sisters like Mary and Virginia could be like I just said
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Virginia you did uh I didn't mean to say that Virginia Virginia uh they seemed they were like a little strange but like
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okay but relatively you know they weren't like problematic or anything you know like they were just living you know
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existing okay but Mary in Virginia completely changed when Court Caroline showed up the three sisters began
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dressing in all black together what and wearing heavy Black Veils all the time what the [ __ ] just out of nowhere all of
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a sudden we're like yep COV like up and they were just like boom literally like a the [ __ ] and people were uh curious
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about this one might be more curious though was the very marked change in their behavior um once they were once
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known to keep very ordinary schedules they were you know a president of a female college and a part of the faculty
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after all it's not like they were doing these crazy things yeah but the sisters now had a habit of going out very late
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at night in the middle of the night and more disturbingly began entering students homes or rooms as they slept to
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just stand and stare at them no shut the [ __ ] up why this is not real this is real what the [ __ ] they would literally
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break into students rooms while they were sleeping and stand and stare at them for why I do not know what the [ __ ]
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there's some weird cult thing happening here something's going on because they also hired a driver to drop them off at
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Evergreen Cemetery every evening where they were said to carry on with strange rituals enchanting honestly [ __ ]
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metal as [ __ ] if you take the b& out of it yeah exactly that's what I said I was
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like up to this point like take the b& out of it and I'm like go off Queens like this is cool but man do they take
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it somewhere oh God and people saw them dancing around Graves and all manner of odd behavior and just like they would
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and later you'll see like the behavior gets even stranger they would like move people out of classrooms and into other
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classrooms and move them back and like they were just being weird it's never explained why they did this
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no what well and the thing is in 1904 the obvious and very dramatic and strange change in Mary and Virginia's
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Behavior was very unsettling to the students of Soul female college who had known them forever right as like pretty
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normal pretty normal and very disciplined and like you know respectful people yeah and one account said
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frightened students started to leave the school and it wasn't long before the school was in chaos and The Black
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Sisters as they were known to be called were asked to leave oh I mean yeah I I do understand why they were leave the
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the school was losing money left and right students were literally leaving the school because of their behavior
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because they're waking up in the middle of the night to nut ladies at the foot of their bed they're being beaned by the
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Supreme witch in her Coven in the middle of the night like that's a lot to handle there were also rumors that
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Caroline was maybe pocketing some money from the school okay allegedly now fortunately no she is not
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now fortunately the sister's great aunt oana polock who needed help at Montgomery female
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college in Virginia okay so she looked at this whole like them leaving in disgrace thing as like ah it's fine so
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she invited them all to join her she's like you're just cooky yeah it's okay they don't get you I love how Chic you
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are no when Virginia came to run the program it was like she fell back into her old ways her old ways of teaching
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her old ways of running things everything was great Virginia was back she was like oh I know I'm I'm kooky but
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like I'm back okay and it felt like okay the school is a boarding school in one program Des described it as the
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remarkable Purity and healthfulness of the atmosphere render the location peculiarly eligible for a seat of
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learning hot so I guess it's a great place to learn it sounds great but but Mary came after Virginia she joined the
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faculty and everything was still okay they seemed to fall back into their old things seems like Caroline's the common
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denominator here then Caroline joined I'm sorry all I can think of is the outcast song Caroline Caroline that's
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literally like she joins and it's like oh [ __ ] like [ __ ] and the thing is Caroline joined with osie her daughter
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okay and things [ __ ] up again what power did this woman have over her sisters I don't know she is the Supreme
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think she might be because apparently Caroline was in charge of administration she was put right in charge of
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administration that's and she messed with the curriculum immediately and this is when she began the strange behavior
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of like moving students from classroom to classroom like during the day for no reason just ripping them out of a
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classroom putting them in another then moving them back like she was just doing weird stuff and she would put like
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several padlocks on random doors what so it made people like very un unnerved and
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like unsettled cuz they're like what the [ __ ] behind that door and like why are
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there three pad locks on it what the [ __ ] and then they were doing the same peekaboo routine with sister with the
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sisters and the residance Halls they're breaking in yeah like doing the same like woo I'm just looking in on you what
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the [ __ ] ladies so everybody just fell back into the old like strange [ __ ] I
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need an answer you won't get one I need I require one I also kind of required one but I wasn't given one like why the
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[ __ ] did like history will not give me an answer God damn Caroline is OC's mom
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marrying Virginia's sister she's the problem gotcha it's her she's the problem she the problem Caroline uh so
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Caroline ended up visiting Mary's son John Sneed okay who was her nephew oh the look in your eye tells me we in
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danger oh God I'm so upset your weird face right now I'm so nervous Reports say she quote unquote caused trouble and
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quote unquote interfered in John's marriage that just means that she didn't like his
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wife and she said get out of here right totally nothing else happened right what
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happened here I don't know what does it mean what does it mean what does it mean
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there are even reports that John told the neighbors and I quote that he wouldn't let her wreck his
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home okay I don't know if you've ever heard of the term home wrecker I sure have I
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sure have I'm sorry what oh no there's a lot of uh when you read about this particular time in this in
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this story nothing's outwardly said but it's all said well because they didn't say
00:20:41
[ __ ] like that there it's it's she was so was she trying to wreck the home and
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he wouldn't let her so while she was she was interfering and you know while she was interfering and not wrecking her
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nephew's Home Gross um she was trying to convince him to come teach at Montgomery
00:20:58
female college in Virginia with all of them and leave his wife uhhuh and he refused at first he
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was like no yeah I'm not going to run away with my aunt stop I don't like it I'm not going to do that but she
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returned a couple of weeks later and uh interfered again and this time her uh interference convinced him to leave his
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[ __ ] wife Anna she a cosmo article come with her and he did he came with her and left Anna just abandoned her you
00:21:31
know what Anna was better off yeah apparently Anna had like struggled though I guess like she had some yeah
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too if my man's left me for his aunt yeah it really did a number so curiously though Jon became seriously injured on
00:21:46
the way back to Virginia oh no he fell or was pushed that's strange from the train as it approached Rowan Oak oh
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Rowan o he survived but weeks later he was found almost drowned in a sistern on the school's campus by his aunt Virginia
00:22:07
and his aunt Virginia was like oh don't worry he was checking the water supply for the school oops don't worry that he
00:22:12
fell in there and the lid went over and I'm the one who found him yeah don't worry about that he managed to survive
00:22:18
that how does Mary feel about all this isn't that her kid uh I don't think any of them are mother of the year I would
00:22:24
say uh but he managed to survive that and then one week later he was found on fire in his
00:22:34
bed what the [ __ ] is happening here this man was on fire in his bed he was doused
00:22:40
with kerosene oh my God but they claimed it was an accident and who found him who
00:22:46
found him uh Caroline of course was his aunts of course how do you accidentally douse someone in
00:22:53
kerosene you don't uh where are where are where are we is correct I don't I've quite literally never heard a tale such
00:23:04
as this it is this is for reals this is for real legend no the newspapers to back this up there's trials to back this
00:23:12
up I would also like to put this out here I had never heard of this case and then a one Mikey you found this was the
00:23:21
one to bring this up and I said holy [ __ ] yeah where the [ __ ] did you find this
00:23:29
in the depths of hell I to say he said in Hell In Hell in Hades what the [ __ ] it is a
00:23:39
tale that just keeps you guessing till the very end but I want answers I need concrete answers and unfortunately in
00:23:47
the beginning it's like wild and kooky and like it starts getting really dark and then it gets dark at the end so it's
00:23:53
like in the beginning you're like what is happening and then at the end you're like what the [ __ ] happened like you're
00:23:57
just like oh God keep going so yeah so keep going going so his aunts are the one who called that in now remember he
00:24:05
fell from a trained approaching Rowan Oak that Caroline was on weird he almost drowned in a sistern on campus where
00:24:13
Virginia found him coincidence and then he was lit on fire with kerosene in his bed and his aunts were the ones who
00:24:20
found him like Virginia and Caroline interesting that Mary's never around Mar's just like whoopsie now following
00:24:27
his death the sisters all three of them collected uh an insurance payout those [ __ ] love insurance which they had
00:24:34
taken out so strange now in 1906 around the time of John sneed's unexpected and very tragic death because he died after
00:24:44
the fire obviously sure did um Caroline paid a visit to his brother Fletcher her
00:24:50
other nephew stop I love the name Fletcher um he was still living in Tennessee he this is Mary's other son
00:24:57
her other NE neew Caroline explained that there would be some family property near Chattanooga that needed looking
00:25:04
after and asked whether Fletcher would be willing to pay a visit to the property okay but Fletcher's wife was
00:25:10
like I heard about you well and she was like okay but she was like I'm you can go but like I want to make sure we're in
00:25:16
constant contact yeah cuz I heard about this girl cuz I heard about what's happening here so about Auntie over here
00:25:22
she attempted to contact him on the phone a few weeks later and Caroline answered oh and told her no he can't
00:25:29
come to the phone right now and she was like what the [ __ ] do you mean he can't
00:25:31
come to the phone right now and she was like he died he's sick and he was she was like well I want to talk to him and
00:25:37
he she was like too sick to talk and he she was like the [ __ ] do you mean too sick to talk and she was like I don't
00:25:43
know [ __ ] and then she hung up the phone Direct quot that's literally like the transcript so she was like I don't
00:25:50
know about that so she contacts again and she's like how's he doing can I talk to him and she's like nah still can't
00:25:55
talk to him still too sick and then she's he's like you know what he'll he'll I'll send him home in a few weeks
00:26:00
when he's better a few weeks so in a few weeks had come and gone with no word from Fletcher call the police Fletcher's
00:26:08
wife set out for Chattanooga and was like said I'm coming I'm coming I'm coming for you baby oh my God now when
00:26:14
she arrived at the boarding house that he had supposedly been staying at the woman there was to told her that
00:26:21
Fletcher had indeed been there oh my go but she had but then he had been moved to another house
00:26:28
by Caroline Caroline loves moving people places moved her to another house him to
00:26:32
another house so Fletcher's wife follows she [ __ ] Sherlock Holmes it good for this girly she detective abber lines
00:26:40
this love it like she follows Caroline's Trail always a few steps behind but following her she's like I'm going to
00:26:48
find my husband but eventually she ran out of leads no and she couldn't find him without any information regarding
00:26:56
her husband's whereabouts about and seemingly no [ __ ] way to find him and he didn't exist anymore she had she was
00:27:02
granted a divorce cuz she was likeand she didn't involve the police I guess she was like there's nothing to really
00:27:09
CU she was just like I guess Caroline later was just like yeah he just left what and it's like no he didn't
00:27:16
what no he did not why is Caroline like this I do not know but she couldn't find
00:27:23
him because he was already on his way to rejoin the sisters in Virginia with Caroline he fell in love with
00:27:31
Auntie I don't know I don't know what's happening so deeply upset by this but she was convincing him now once there
00:27:38
Caroline began encouraging a romance between Fletcher and OC cousins her daughter they are first cousins oh
00:27:47
that's heinous that's illegal in many many places so let me just back back back it up go ahead she goes after
00:27:54
after interfering in her first nephew's marriage get convincing him bamboozling him into following her bamboozling she
00:28:05
tries to kill him twice [ __ ] and then eventually they succeed and light him on
00:28:09
fire in his bed collect that insurance payment she goes to the other nephew Mary's other son Mary's just letting
00:28:17
this all happen that's the thing I'm like Mary how many sons you got goes to her other son convinces him to come back
00:28:23
to the the Virginia with her yeah then ices out his wife pretends that Fletcher just up and was sick first of all too
00:28:31
sick to talk and then just abandoned her and who knows where he went and instead
00:28:36
she takes Fletcher back to the school in Virginia with her and then encourages OC
00:28:43
and Fletcher to get married first cousins and it seems as though like there was already something romantic
00:28:48
happening between Caroline and Fletcher there's something weird happening there what I don't know what like I don't know
00:28:54
I wasn't there this is real this is real life you know in Bluey when they go for
00:28:58
real life for real life that's how I feel I felt that the entire time I read this story I said for real life every 5
00:29:06
seconds and it is for real life [ __ ] like we need the bluey clip that says for real life do your kids have a toy
00:29:12
that says go find it for real life that's so that's happening so now she's encouraging osie and Fletcher to get
00:29:20
married she's like first cousins never heard of him so before the so then before long the two like and OC were
00:29:28
married in a secret ceremony because they had to make it secret they in Christianburg Virginia they had to make
00:29:35
it secret because they are first cousins I don't is there even anywhere that you
00:29:39
can marry your first cousin not sure but I don't want to go I'm not going there where it is remember that true life yes
00:29:45
oh my God anyway it's very upsetting it is people were already suspicious of this Trio of Wild Women this Trio of
00:29:53
incest in Wy Wy women and so when this happened they had to do it in secret because it was just really going to and
00:30:01
who know I'm like what was your endgame here but when the fir when they first arrived at the Montgomery female college
00:30:07
things at the school like I said had seemed stable and well managed yeah they were fine but just as it had been at Su
00:30:13
family college it didn't take long for Caroline's influence to cause even more problems well because they're still
00:30:19
going into the rooms and like doing all the things pad locking the doors not long after they arrived rumors began
00:30:25
spreading around town about like their weird Behavior about them holding midnight rituals in the cemeteries
00:30:32
around I mean there were even there was there were like rumors about like a quote unquote illegitimate baby that was
00:30:39
born at the school that disappeared what and they believed like something might have happened that those are rumors but
00:30:45
like these are the things people were talking about this is one of those things where it's like all the rumors
00:30:49
are true it's really scary oh my God within two years of their arriving there and all this crazy strange Behavior the
00:30:56
sisters again had started to frighten students yeah I would be frightened students were dropping out again cuz
00:31:02
they were like I'm not going to the like this is too well for [ __ ] this school by
00:31:05
1908 the school had to close they had to close they had to close why didn't anybody intervene before that I do not
00:31:13
know damn but having once again found themselves in dire Financial Straits they K yeah the sisters well first they
00:31:21
tried to sell off the school's minor assets okay like five pianos a church organ in Rosewood wardrobes make and the
00:31:29
school itself do they the thing there's no evidence to indicate that they had any
00:31:37
ownership the [ __ ] or the property sell it they're like do you have the deed they're like [ __ ] that
00:31:46
they they were like hey you want this building oh my God who are these women who raised these women are these
00:31:56
Lucifers children I think it's like a confidence thing if you just walk up to a building and you're like hey you want
00:32:05
this like they hired a real estate agent and everything it comes time to sign the
00:32:11
paperwork they're like what paperwork like what take the building give me the check take the building whatever sound
00:32:17
like weird Tommy hord Vibes it's so strange but they sold the school no a man named Sydney sh sheltman who
00:32:30
was so confused Sydney Sydney was so confused it's so wild he's like you own this place they're like no you do oh man
00:32:39
it's wild now when the school was abandoned cuz it was abandoned at the time even when he bought it it became a
00:32:45
popular spot for vandals and older Boys on marauding Expeditions now they tore through the halls and classrooms took
00:32:53
everything out of there like the whole place had been destroyed um in the mean me time the the sisters were like what
00:32:58
can we do next we can woo some older men into marriage that's true and get some money they weren't gaining any traction
00:33:06
on that front because uh they didn't have the loop they're they're a little strange I feel like their methods might
00:33:14
be weird love like guys love a little they love a you know what I'm saying that I feel like maybe they they were
00:33:22
approaching it the wrong way I guess can I look them up and like see what they look like I think so and you and I think
00:33:28
a lot of like the the rumors that were swirling about them were keeping people's distance away from them well in
00:33:34
the fact that you know um like any man in a 5 foot radius of them like weirdly got kerosene D all over them ex probably
00:33:40
didn't help so they had creditors growing impatient not being paid and they were going to be taking legal
00:33:47
action against them at this point so the sisters in Fletcher and oi began leaving
00:33:52
town anytime something like this would happen Okay so they went off in the direction of New York and they didn't
00:33:58
all go at once they went one after the other so not to arouse suspicions all righty now they were trying to put some
00:34:04
space so Fletcher and OSI were trying to put space between themselves and their aunts and her mother um so they settled
00:34:14
in East Orange New Jersey in 1908 and by some accounts they were happy I don't want to know about that is so pretty
00:34:21
though I know I I don't know what has happening It's upsetting oh my God this friend is should of
00:34:30
Caroline no this just sent me stop it that's why they weren't having luck with the men's
00:34:39
baby oh my God oh my God oh my God that's so terrifying oh my God oh my God this is a lot to unpack
00:34:51
I'm so upset um St Virginia is fine up until this point we've had some tragedies we've had some deaths that
00:34:59
have been very sad and like very scary correct but it's about to get real dark okay let me just like bre so we got it's
00:35:08
this is all wacky crazy but then it gets like oh like all of a sudden you're just
00:35:13
going to go oh and it gets like real so osie and Fletcher are living in Orange New Jersey New Jersey and the aunts are
00:35:21
still in the South yes they're and they're they're making their way to New York because they're trying to get away
00:35:26
from the creditors that are now after them okay okay but they're doing it like one after the other yeah got it and
00:35:31
again this is all up until this point this would just be a wacky cooky at times tragic story definitely but it
00:35:38
then now it's just like oh my man it's about to go down and it's it's still wacky like it's they are wacky humans
00:35:44
yeah you can't take that out of it but you can't take the wacky out of them but uh but unfortunately
00:35:51
so and again Fletcher and OC are first cousins um you don't have tell I'm going to keep reminding you that you don't
00:35:59
have to uh a few months later OC gave birth to a baby girl they named Mary after Fletcher's mom and and uh her aunt
00:36:08
yep but the child unfortunately died shortly after she was born that's really sad I'm sure there was some
00:36:13
complications and things only got worse when Virginia Mary and Caroline showed up at OC and Fletcher's doorstep in
00:36:19
early 1909 I would say we don't have anything for you they were out of money and they said hi we're here uh their
00:36:27
arrival reminded Fletcher of the last time the sisters had found themselves in financial trouble I don't know if you
00:36:34
can remember that time um it all it coincided with the mysterious and very brutal death of his brother John yes um
00:36:41
and an insurance payout came after that very conveniently for the sisters and you know what it solved all their
00:36:46
problems at the time sure did yeah so Fletcher saw this and said oh hi I'm getting out of here aunties and Mom and
00:36:55
said [ __ ] this and he fled the country to Canada no he didn't in March 1909 but
00:37:01
did he leave OC he left OC that's your wife cousin it was also that's your wife cousin you don't just abandon your wife
00:37:08
cousin that's your wife cousin you don't do that well what's sad is that OC had not had a chance to tell him that she
00:37:17
was pregnant again oh God now to she's abandoned by her husband at this point cousin cousin and left in the care of
00:37:28
three people who had always treated her like [ __ ] oh they weren't nice to her because they were never nice to her it's
00:37:34
a lot of people thought that they were jealous of her well she's her mother and her aunts were jealous of her I bet they
00:37:39
were um they had always kind of treated her like [ __ ] so her mental health began
00:37:44
to decline in the spring she's pregnant and her physical needs are increasing because of the pregnancy which makes it
00:37:50
even worse um and to make it even worse the sisters had taken OC out of the comfort of her home that she had with
00:37:57
Fletcher and brought her back to Brooklyn to live with them in some like sparsely furnished building oh and they
00:38:03
had they had like created their own space yeah and aware that they you know luckily they were aware that they locked
00:38:09
L lacked any knowledge of or resources to provide any basic level of care for a pregnant woman or really anyone else for
00:38:18
that matter because they are wild the sisters did call a doctor Dr William Pettit who started treating OC that
00:38:26
spring okay well that's good now OC does die obviously at the end of this that's
00:38:32
we talked about that in the beginning oh I literally forgot that so after her death later Dr Pettit would recall the
00:38:39
incredibly strange experience of arriving at the Sneed house that spring oh no now at the time only Virginia and
00:38:45
Mary were living in the house with osie not her mother Caroline sus but he said at the time a third woman who he
00:38:53
believed to be OC's mother would occasionally stop by and check on her yeah um he said all these women must
00:39:01
have slept on the floor for the only cot in the house on the second floor was occupied by the ailing niece okay and he
00:39:08
said aside from meager Furnishings in OC's room the house was pretty much empty of anything else damn which only
00:39:16
made everything even stranger right and you're like he's like you're bringing a baby into the F what are we going to do
00:39:21
with the baby and Dr Pettit also found the three sisters Behavior really strange and puding like what were they
00:39:27
doing after he initially evaluated OC who appeared very frail and very depressed oh pedit um diagnosed her as
00:39:35
suffering from General weakness the result of lack of nutrition and proper care and that's not good because she's
00:39:41
if she's male nurse and the baby is so what he had prescribed for her was fresh air a restorative diet and Medicine okay
00:39:49
he was like this will improve her but upon a follow-up visit he found that the women had made no effort to provide even
00:39:57
one of those things to her oh no when he asked why they hadn't made even the slightest effort to do any of his
00:40:03
recommendations one of the women he said said later he believed it was Virginia told the doctor they couldn't afford the
00:40:09
medicine due to all their money going to the high premiums they were paying an insurance what that doesn't even make
00:40:15
any sense so during this period OC was dealing with the emotional pain of losing her husband and also losing a
00:40:22
daughter yeah and the physical pain of a very difficult cult pregnancy of which she is malnourished and sick oh man and
00:40:31
also living with three women who are jealous of her and have been her whole life and have treated her like [ __ ]
00:40:36
that's a thing and it's for all of these reasons all those stressors that she's under that she probably this is why she
00:40:41
probably didn't have any idea that after Fletcher left the sisters had taken out
00:40:46
three life insurance policies on OC with Equitable life insurance Society each in
00:40:51
the amount of $7,500 how are they going to how did they get three out on on her nobody
00:40:58
double checked it damn I have no idea but it's wild now a few months later in late spring Dr petet became concerned
00:41:06
about OC's declining health and her ability to even give birth to a baby successfully she's so weak at this point
00:41:13
so Pettit was on hand to guide OSI through the process of giving birth to her baby in the home um and it was on
00:41:21
August 1st 1909 she gave birth to a baby boy who she named David poock need okay
00:41:27
um unfortunately the labor process was very difficult and the baby was born quote unquote sickly and when Pettit
00:41:34
told the two aunts that OSI actually might need a very risky postnatal operation that could prove fatal for her
00:41:41
oh no he said he was very surprised and very disgusted with how the women reacted he said they were fairly jumped
00:41:47
at the idea cuz they wanted her they wanted to cash in now despite David the little baby's poor health at the time of
00:41:55
his birth Dr pet and OC were both confident that with the right diet right care he would survive and eventually
00:42:02
Thrive that's great um but that would require the sisters to provide anything any support uhhuh that they clearly were
00:42:09
not capable of including spending money on the baby's care and instead over the objections of Pettit and DOI they quote
00:42:17
fed the baby condensed milk and other Foods at variance with those Dr pedit specified oh my God Weeks Later David
00:42:24
was still in poor health and was taking to St Christopher's Hospital by Virginia
00:42:28
and Mary who returned home a short time later to inform OSI that the baby had died oh though it would later be learned
00:42:38
that was a lie they just got and they had simply left David at St Christopher honestly in a horrible way that was
00:42:46
probably the best thing for that baby but so horrible that's like you just kidnapped
00:42:52
her baby yeah and then told her she it died like wow now in the the wake of what she believed was another child's
00:42:59
death yeah she's going to lose it declined mentally physically and at his insistence the sisters allowed pedit to
00:43:08
perform the postn natal surgery on OC uh but when he were attempted to return you
00:43:13
know a little time later to remove the stitches and do some after care cuz she managed to get through it wow the
00:43:19
sisters refused to let him inside the house but they did allow periodic visits from a nurse okay and just a week or so
00:43:27
later petett returned to the house when he learned that Virginia had dismissed the nurse wouldn't allow her back and
00:43:33
his attempts to reach the women went unanswered my God and it's like he I'm like can you involve the police like
00:43:41
yeah don't worry he does okay good um now cuz from the moment he had been summoned to treat her in the first place
00:43:48
he was very uncomfortable with those three women yeah and he said they made him feel very unwelcome each visit he
00:43:55
went to that house he was more and more unwelcome more unnerved and he said it wasn't just like bad attitudes and like
00:44:01
weird Behavior which they had comments that troubled him but he said the fact that the women were intentionally
00:44:06
treating OC poorly and seemed to care very little whether she lived or died and on one particular visit pedit
00:44:14
recalled Virginia showing him OC's will that's strange and in it OC had left the
00:44:21
majority of her stuff to her grandmother leaving aside one ,000 to pay pet it for
00:44:28
his services so she had put in her will I want him paid for what he's done for me just in case now the doctor was like
00:44:33
oh that's far too much for what I've provided like I you don't need to give me that much like and also she's alive
00:44:39
yeah um but more importantly he was like this is weird and suspicious that you're
00:44:42
showing me this like why do you have her will what are you doing I don't get it so he reported the treatment of OC and
00:44:49
this whole thing to the police good and later he recalled that officers quote made a routine inquiry and it leted
00:44:56
nowhere and this is also the police failed on an epic level here now it was his suspicions that led the doctor to
00:45:05
take Extreme Measures upon his last visit to the house so after knocking and ringing the bell several times and not
00:45:12
getting an answer Dr Pettit became concerned for safety and he went into the house through an open front window I
00:45:19
love this man I love this doctor this man's for the wind so he reached the girl's bedroom and he said he was
00:45:23
shocked to find her quote nearly star D with no food in the house despite her serious condition he said that OSI was
00:45:31
so happy to see him and said she wanted to talk to him about something important
00:45:36
Oh but before she could say anything one of the sisters came in the room and forced ped it out of the room I wish he
00:45:42
could have like rescued her and taken him with her right they said they were willing to Plate him by being like fine
00:45:48
we'll have food delivered to the house for wow like what the [ __ ] they were like you need to leave now and like
00:45:54
don't come back or work calling the police so he knew he was like OC's in danger like she's going to die so he
00:46:00
felt it I'm going to report it again so he reported it to the police again I was
00:46:04
like you need to [ __ ] do something about this seriously and he was so the police went Brooklyn Police checked on
00:46:09
the women found no evidence of anyone having committed a crime so they said there's nothing we can do what yeah
00:46:16
failures huge failures shame truly like they should be ashamed of themselves by fall of 1909 the sisters found eles
00:46:26
again needing money their regular position in life with creditors beginning to call on them regularly and
00:46:32
in late October the sisters were no longer able to hold these creditors off so they resorted to their typical
00:46:38
strategy you know picking up and moving before the creditors could find them and
00:46:42
get what they needed yeah now when he when the doctor uh learned that the Brooklyn Police had been unable to do
00:46:49
anything Dr Pettit returned to the home again himself to check on OC cuz he was going to go in there and he was like
00:46:55
like I don't know what I was going to do but I was going back myself cuz no one was doing anything he found it
00:47:00
completely abandoned oh no so he he didn't know where she went that's terrible and he was probably so so
00:47:06
worried now on November 29th 1909 only the next month uh police in East Orange New Jersey received a call from quote an
00:47:15
elderly woman with a Southern accent explaining that an accident had occurred at 89 North 14th Street and they needed
00:47:22
a coroner huh the assisant County physician Dr Herbert Simmons went three blocks to the address and he was greeted
00:47:31
at the door by Virginia who was dressed in the typical black attire with the Black Veil they're so weird and she led
00:47:38
him through the house and Simmons noted that the building seemed to have no heat
00:47:41
or furniture and appeared as though no one had lived there in a long time okay they
00:47:47
reached the bathroom and Virginia just points at the bathtub where he sees the nude emaciated body of OC laying beneath
00:47:56
just a few inches of water oh God now Simmons now this is the county physician Simmon Dr Simmons he scanned the scene
00:48:04
for any information that might be useful and found a pile of clothing with what appeared to be a very neatly written
00:48:11
suicide note attached to it the note said last year my little daughter died Others near and dear have gone before I
00:48:20
been prostrated with illness for a long time when you read this I will have committed suicide do not grieve me
00:48:26
Rejoice with me that death brings a blessed relief from pain and suffering greater than I can bear o
00:48:32
wmne doubt it now Virginia explained to the doctor that OC had lost her daughter
00:48:38
the previous year and her son had been placed in the hospital four months earlier and then she said she had also
00:48:43
become a widow seven months prior H Fletcher didn't die right right no not that we know of so Virginia told the man
00:48:54
that she shared the house on 14th Street with her niece giving the impression that it was just Virginia and osie yeah
00:49:00
uh and that they had recently moved in now as an agent of the coroner's office Dr Simmons had seen a lot of dead bodies
00:49:07
and he had seen a lot of scenes and he said something's not right here well the fact that she's emaciated is one thing
00:49:14
for one thing OC had been dead in the bathroom in the only bathroom in this place for at least 24 hours so
00:49:22
immediately that's sus Virginia saying she just discovered the the only bathroom for 24 hours there's
00:49:29
been a dead body in the bathroom and you didn't know and there was also the house
00:49:32
itself she's saying that they moved in weeks earlier but the house was virtually empty it appeared like no one
00:49:38
had been living there for years so he was very suspicious of your Virginia and he was like something's up here so
00:49:45
Simmons stopped at the nearest phone he could find and place to call to Sergeant
00:49:49
William O'Neal of the East Orange Police and explained everything that he found all his thoughts and noted all his
00:49:55
suspicions to them now knowing that Simmons was definitely not the type of man to jump to conclusions he was a
00:50:01
trustworthy guy he'd been to a lot of these scenes he wouldn't be bringing them out if he didn't need to Sergeant
00:50:08
O'Neal uh took this very seriously and immediately went to the house good now Sergeant O'Neal arrived at um the house
00:50:15
around 6:00 p.m. and Virginia opened the door and she demanded immediately to know what business he had there and
00:50:22
O'Neal explained that he had been ordered to inspect the premisis so Virginia reluctantly let him inside and
00:50:28
brought him to the bathroom and she's like there she is showed him M now after reading the note O'Neal asked Virginia
00:50:36
to show him the rest of the house starting with the attic MH so going room by room he was struck by how empty this
00:50:43
house felt and he said not just empty in the sense he's like it was empty there was nothing in there but he was like it
00:50:49
felt empty like there was a there was a palpable feeling to this house and in fact he said the only sign that
00:50:57
anyone actually lived there was found in what he assumed to be OC's former bedroom on a small table next to a cot
00:51:04
was a locket bearing the photo of a baby on one side and a lock of hair on the other that's so sad beside it was a
00:51:10
small strip of paper that read lock of David sneed's first hair August 1809 that's the saddest thing ever now
00:51:18
Virginia followed O'Neal quietly from room to room and she was using like a gas lamp like you if you just picture
00:51:25
this she's so scary wearing her full attire with the Black Veil he was probably like where the [ __ ] he was
00:51:31
proba this is a house of hores now there were a few pieces of broken furniture or
00:51:36
what maybe could have been personal items scattered about but it looked more like it was like long ago somebody had
00:51:41
lived there and when they'd finished going through the whole thing O'Neal began to question Virginia about why
00:51:47
they'd moved to East Orange and you know why she'd only noticed her niece was dead a few hours earlier when it's the
00:51:53
only bathroom in the [ __ ] house mhm so the woman was short with the sergeant and gave him very simple very direct
00:52:01
answers but also making it very clear that his presence was not [ __ ] wanted in that house now if Virginia thought
00:52:07
she could simply call the coroner be like hey sorry I have a dead body here can you go ahead and grab that and
00:52:15
thought she was just going to be done with the whole thing after that which she definitely did she must have been
00:52:20
pretty surprised when Sergeant O'Neal explained that she was going to have to come with him to the station to answer
00:52:26
Virginia went she grabbed a small bag some belongings and went out of the house now at the East Orange Police
00:52:33
Department she went through a whole interview and this time she was interviewed by police chief James Bell
00:52:39
now deell the entire this was all [ __ ] this was all suspicious well she's sitting there in her [ __ ] black veil
00:52:45
he said that Virginia seemed to have an answer for everything she had a quick answer for everything but it still
00:52:52
didn't explain what happened in the house she was cuz cuz he was like she herself was very poised very polished
00:52:59
but O'Neal had described them living in squalor right it just didn't match up and there was also the manner of the
00:53:07
whole thing like if they're claiming this is suicide how could OC had managed to hold herself underwater long enough
00:53:13
to drown herself especially in such a frail and fragile state and again your body is going to want to take yourself
00:53:20
and sit up yeah and she's not strong enough to keep herself underwat mhm so these are all unanswered questions
00:53:27
and they're nagging him so Belle booked Virginia as a material witness that evening and she was taken to ess6 county
00:53:33
jail rro now the following day November 30th an autopsy was performed on OC and it confirmed that the cause of death was
00:53:41
drowning but it also raised a few more questions right the medical examiner noted that OC was emaciated to the last
00:53:49
degree like that of a person suffering from starvation and she only weighed 80 pound at the time of her death oh it's
00:53:56
such a haunting picture to think of her being discovered in the bathtub in that state yeah and in that state
00:54:02
investigators wondered whether she again would have had the strength to do this but also had the strength to write a
00:54:08
clear and concise suicide note with a steady hand yeah it was very steady there was no shakiness to it that's
00:54:15
there's no way no while the coroner examined the body investigators with the East Orange Police started tracing the
00:54:22
two women's movements from the moment they arrived in the City a few weeks earlier right they managed to track down
00:54:27
a cab driver who' taken them from the St train station to the house but also took
00:54:32
Virginia to see a local doctor by the name of Charles Teeter when they interviewed Dr Teeter he said Virginia
00:54:39
had shown up at his house at a late hour on the evening of November thir 24th okay not long ago and asked that he
00:54:47
accompany her back to the house to provide a health certificate for OC a health certificate now Al Al though he
00:54:55
initially protested it was clear she wasn't going to take no for an answer so he agreed to go with her now at the
00:55:01
house the doctor examined DOI and noted that she was incredibly frail and appeared to have bronchitis but
00:55:07
otherwise he was like okay that's really all I have to say about her to B and O'Neal the request for the health
00:55:13
certificate for OC only made Virginia seem more suspicious and what is that I've never for like insurance reasons
00:55:20
okay it's just like like almost like a physical kind of yeah now in just a few days
00:55:25
their investigation had turned up several people who interacted with Virginia in and around East Orange and
00:55:31
always in the context of her asking questions about medical treatment and local doctors which seemed in keeping
00:55:38
with the situation at the house but when they checked the registers of local hotels in New York City they were
00:55:45
surprised to find that Virginia was staying in several of the city's fanciest hotels in recent months and had
00:55:51
been dining at high-end restaurants so there's like wait a second this woman is living in expensive
00:55:59
hotels and leaving this emaciated sick frail niece alone in in abandoned house place what the [ __ ] shut up cold broken
00:56:09
house in New Jersey and how is she even living in these expensive hotels with no
00:56:12
money because she was using the insurance money that she got before she's I'm sure she's scamming some [ __ ]
00:56:18
there's tons of fraud charges that come up wow eventually B and O'Neal's search Led them to a house in Brook that the
00:56:25
neighbors had taken to calling the house of mystery they my God it reminds me of
00:56:30
that Tik Tok you with your kids when they're like the ball of mystery my God uh they called this house
00:56:38
the house of mystery because the three women in black who occup occupied it were very strange and had a lot of
00:56:44
strange Behavior according to the neighbors on both sides of this house they'd often heard strange noises and
00:56:50
banging coming from the house all hours of the night what are they doing the windows had been blacked out stop stop
00:56:58
it and the yard was so overgrown that nobody could see inside like are they witches they're bad witches some some
00:57:06
[ __ ] is going down there darked witches dor sided not not sin white witches given Sinister Vibe like white magic
00:57:13
yeah like Sinister Vibe oh my God now once the investigators had located the janitor responsible for managing the
00:57:20
home cuz they used to have like certain you know like a super almost yeah yeah they got inside of it and they found
00:57:25
that this place was as Bleak and empty as the one in East Orange and they were about to leave but then they were
00:57:32
approached by a reporter from the New York World who'd been put on the story by one of his New Jersey peers was like
00:57:38
heard all about this cuz you knew this was going to get reported on the reporter is like wait a second why are
00:57:43
you guys leaving don't you notice those small spots of like what looks like blood on the floor by the door I love
00:57:51
like hey guys like hey investigators did you notice that so they follow the faint Trail through
00:57:57
the hall and up the stairs into one of the bedrooms but it just LED nowhere what meanwhile the reporter on the first
00:58:05
floor opened the oven in the kitchen and disc discovered a mass of yellow hair wrapped up in its Center were two
00:58:13
irregularly shaped bones one resembled a femur and the other resembled resembled
00:58:20
a skull and they were small what you could see they said you could see nose bones in the socket of an eye like
00:58:29
and like this is like a child skull it appeared to be what the [ __ ] and obviously this isn't OC because we have
00:58:36
her body now what the [ __ ] is going on so they asked the janitor they're like what the [ __ ] has been going on in this
00:58:42
like what's going on and the janitor explained that OC and her husband had moved into that house about a year and a
00:58:48
half earlier and then were joined remember yeah by the two older women always dressed in black
00:58:55
and a few months later a third woman who was also dressed in black came to live with them Caroline Caroline the janitor
00:59:02
didn't know much else but he did mention that OC's husband eventually left and the women were constantly behind on the
00:59:09
rent so when Fletcher left when they showed up was like no I'm not dying he left for Canada they moved into that
00:59:17
house and turned it into whatever [ __ ] cult [ __ ] while OC's living there they turned it into that okay and
00:59:24
then they ripped OC out of the house made her live in that abandoned place while they kept living in that house oh
00:59:30
so they didn't live in the house with OC in they were just keeping her in a house
00:59:34
by herself ailing and sick and unable to move and starving her oh and that that was the whole time that she was pregnant
00:59:42
yep and they said they and reports had said they had been starving OC essentially since she was born what like
00:59:50
that that girl had never been adequately taken care of what the [ __ ] yeah yep and so the janitor says when OC's
00:59:58
husband eventually left the women were always behind on the rent and then they would suddenly come into a large sum of
01:00:04
money right before they were about to be evicted what the [ __ ] so they were doing
01:00:07
some more [ __ ] yeah they were and who the [ __ ] is the skull in the oven well
01:00:11
the house in Brooklyn and the information given by the janitor eventually LED them to Dr Pettit my guy
01:00:18
who filled in a lot of the gaps here and petted explained that he had been on hand when OC gave birth to her second
01:00:24
child and from that point forward he said I just couldn't stop thinking about her I was I was so worried for her
01:00:30
safety my concerns grew and grew and he said at no time was I able to find out from Mrs Sneed anything about herself
01:00:38
meaning OC okay he had never found anything about OC out from herself well because they were always lingering he
01:00:44
said every time I asked a question one of the older women was always ready to give up an answer Mrs Sneed seemed
01:00:50
afraid to talk and he said he tried to follow up several times until one day he arrived at the house in Brooklyn and it
01:00:57
was abandoned which he was presumably when they moved OC to East Orange MH now Dr pettit's nurse uh Elizabeth Moog told
01:01:06
a similar story she said she'd been assigned to care for OC after the baby was born and the surgical procedure had
01:01:11
been performed yeah but she said it was so difficult to take care of her because
01:01:15
the sisters were constantly hovering over her she said whenever I went wherever I went one of them kept tagging
01:01:21
after me I was not alone with Mrs sne for single moment Mrs Sneed seemed afraid of someone or something oh that's
01:01:29
and just the air of like her being afraid being followed by these women and then you add on their appearance to it
01:01:35
and they're terrifying like Black Veils and all all the time just silently following you oh I hate it now B and
01:01:43
O'Neal explained that what they'd found at the house in Brooklyn and were like what the [ __ ] is do you have any idea
01:01:48
what that could be and asked you know for Pettit to come with him to look at it Pettit agreed
01:01:55
and it didn't take long before you know they figured out what was happen what happened there not what happened there
01:02:02
but what that was now according to Dr Pettit the stains in the hall he said he didn't think they were blood okay he
01:02:09
thought they were uh tobacco juice he said probably left by a careless worker oh okay he's like that's why there's no
01:02:15
like end with a crime scene yeah yeah yeah um the bones in the oven were bizarre but he said he didn't believe
01:02:22
they were human okay he thought they were animal bones but he said still don't know why they're in the oven yeah
01:02:28
and there's also like a massive hair that he was like I don't know what that is did he think it was human hair he he
01:02:32
couldn't tell he was like I don't know but he's like I think some of these are animals so I'm assuming they're animal
01:02:37
bones what the [ __ ] but so Dr pet tried to clear up some man some Mysteries and
01:02:42
did a couple but uh it didn't stop the New York world uh the New York world news uh publishing a ton of Sensational
01:02:51
stories about this I mean how do you not in this [ __ ] cas the Brooklyn house a
01:02:55
baby Farm which you know they didn't really have a lot to go on on that uh they did mention the occult overtones of
01:03:02
the whole thing and thanks to the information provided by Neighbors in Brooklyn and especially that of Dr
01:03:07
petett and his nurse a picture was beginning to emerge for the detectives it was clear that three women had been
01:03:13
abusing OC and by all accounts she seemed terrified of them but what they what they couldn't kind of figure out
01:03:20
was why they had done this right like they like this is this is like a long process and it didn't take them long to
01:03:28
figure out a motive during an interview with William fee a Brooklyn attorney it was revealed that the lawyer had been
01:03:35
recommended to Virginia by someone she'd met at church and she'd summoned him to
01:03:39
the house just a few months before OC's death I can't believe Virginia was at church yeah now according to fee
01:03:46
Virginia had wanted him to help OC write a new will this was before OC died mhm Virginia produced the old will completed
01:03:55
by OC just a few months earlier and explained they wanted to write a new one because the previous version didn't make
01:04:00
any provisions for OC's baby mhm now 's only like I think she was only 20 I want to say she was between 23 and
01:04:09
26 yeah and she also was told that her baby died which like that is why well fee thought that the explanation was
01:04:17
like whatever he's like okay that sure yeah uh but he did think it was strange that the details of the new will were
01:04:23
all being dictated by Virginia right not OC yeah now according to fee on that day
01:04:29
Virginia was in the company of Caroline OC's mother the girl appeared to be very
01:04:34
on the verge of death at the time and fee was really moved by the sad story that the sisters were spinning to him
01:04:42
right so he agreed to write the new will CU he thought that's she's dying yeah this is what he say this is her mother
01:04:48
and her aunts right now in the new will OC apparently declared that all her debts should be paid out of her estate
01:04:55
and that her son should be in uh should inherit $500 okay and that the rest was to be
01:05:00
left to her grandmother Martha that was her original thing yeah with new evidence in hand Chief Bell paid a visit
01:05:07
to Virginia in her cell at ex Essex County jail and interrogated her about the will Virginia flatly denied the
01:05:15
accusations of neglect and any insinuation that she would conspire to kill her niece for any inheritance I
01:05:21
mean but and Belle hoped that the woman would C back when presented with the evidence but he had underestimated how
01:05:29
how much she would uh he had underestimated her will yeah I will say and you will find out what I mean by
01:05:37
that in a minute okay uh he was just about to give up when O'Neal entered his office and presented him with documented
01:05:44
evidence and witness testimony confirming medical neglect and all evidence of Mal treatment uh Mal
01:05:51
treatment and malnourishment of OC yeah so all the evidence was there he didn't need the confession and he said Belle
01:06:00
said at first I believe Mrs Sneed attempted to take a bath was discovered in the tub by her murderer and held
01:06:06
underwater until drowned makes sense but after careful examination of the evidence which directly contradicted
01:06:12
Virginia's story he believed OC had never intended to take a bath but had instead been placed in the tub was too
01:06:19
weak to fight back and was held under a few inches of water by Virginia Jesus Christ until she drowned so she
01:06:26
literally carried her like dragged her into the bath and drowned her this is one of the most darkest oh based on the
01:06:32
information collected at this point Belle made the decision to charge Virginia with the murder of os Sneed
01:06:38
yeah rightfully so it sounds so the news of Virginia's arrest made readers go crazy all over the East Coast they had
01:06:44
been following All The Sensational stories coming out of here and honestly the the news of her behavior and the way
01:06:52
she dressed only made it even more maob of um and law enforcement were talking also about how strange and uncooperative
01:06:59
Virginia was being Police Commissioner sharp said in a statement to the Press I tried to question her but she blunt
01:07:06
bluntly told me that she saw no reason why she should answer my questions and in his assessment of Virginia sharp
01:07:12
described her as cool calm and resourceful and cunning now in an attempt to get back at
01:07:20
the negative portrayals of Virginia Mary sne the the other idiot here yeah granted an interview with several
01:07:28
reporters saying family Pride should be laid aside and the public should learn the truth about the sisters in
01:07:34
Black tell us Mary said in the hope of lightening lightening the burden of an innocent woman speaking of Virginia
01:07:42
doubt I will tell all I know but hardly she told said nothing she told nothing in fact she flat out refused to address
01:07:49
any questions regard regarding the family's Financial history and the the fact that Virginia had not only taken
01:07:56
three life insurance policies out on OC just before her death but had also had her will changed she wouldn't talk about
01:08:02
any of that instead Mary told some stupid sob story of family tragedy and Misfortune that more or less upheld the
01:08:09
lies the women had told osie including that her husband was almost certainly dead Fletcher which he's not he's just
01:08:16
that's Mary's son yeah as for OC's death Mary insisted that it was suicide motivated by profound loss and you know
01:08:24
her declining health I don't know about that now as news of the story spread people in New York New Jersey Virginia
01:08:30
and Tennessee came forward to tell their tales of the sisters a former student at
01:08:35
the Nashville female school where Mary was once employed described her as being quote regarded by all pupils as being
01:08:41
queer now queer meaning strange back then yeah um and in Christian verberg Virginia one resident described the
01:08:50
sisters as quote crazy eccentric and exceedingly smart exceedingly Smart in ties with all of
01:08:56
that is horrible now reporters followed every lead in the story and they began reporting on all the mysterious aspects
01:09:02
of the women's lives including all the things we had talked about before the weird standing over people's beds at
01:09:08
night the bnes the the cemetery things having one driver to bring them to the cemetery all the time I forgot that they
01:09:14
had a [ __ ] driver to bring them to the cemetery and so they started piecing together a story that included a large
01:09:20
amount of fraud very disturbing behavior and if you two suspicious deaths and a lot of insurance [ __ ] mhm there was the
01:09:27
tragic death of Caroline's first child after falling down a flight of stairs y the unexpected early death of Robert
01:09:34
Martin her husband Jon sneeds multiple brushes with Death Before Dying by being lit on fire in his bed I know did the
01:09:42
police ever like investigate that no they said in fact they could smell kerosene and nobody thought it was
01:09:47
suspicious what the fu they said it was an accident and then finally OC's drowning all of these things were
01:09:54
followed by large Insurance payouts that were received just in the nick of time to avoid Financial ruin right so in an
01:10:04
effort to combat the growing amount of strange stories in the Press Virginia's lawyer Franklin Fort presented the Press
01:10:11
with two unmailed letters that Virginia supposedly had written to family members
01:10:16
okay in each letter Virginia is expressing her deepest sympathies for the recent losses there were statements
01:10:22
like what what a flood tide of loving sympathy slows to you this beautiful Sabbath afternoon and I would love to
01:10:29
hold you dear head on my lap and run my fingers through your hair and so charm away brain worry brain worry brain worry
01:10:37
like people talk so wild back just like feeding her uh fort's intention was to demonstrate that Virginia was far from
01:10:45
this bizarre spinster she had been portrayed as the press and that no woman who writes such letters would commit
01:10:52
murder totally totally now despite you know what seemed like a rock solid way to
01:11:00
influence the press the public perception of Virginia for it simply couldn't hold back the constant
01:11:05
Sensational news coverage because uh she was weird wild uh moreover the more the
01:11:11
Press learned about the family through their investigations and the police the more began to look as though Virginia
01:11:18
was not the only one involved in all this yeah I'm also like where the [ __ ] is Caroline cuz Mary is out here talking
01:11:24
to the Press where's Caroline about her only child now dying so as the New Year rolls over the prosecutor's office had
01:11:31
begun to put together a theory as to the events leading up to and resulting in OC's death they believe that all four
01:11:38
women had been living in the house in Brooklyn when they concocted a scheme to kill OC and collect on the insurance
01:11:45
money yeah now according to the prosecutor one old woman hired the unfurnished house hired the unfurnished
01:11:52
house in East orange another took the poor girl there and a third planned her murder so they o they rented that house
01:12:00
in b in a East Orange brought OC there and left her there let her starve there for a while and planned her entire
01:12:07
murder and then told the police we are living here together even though they're not now by dividing up the tasks because
01:12:15
one of them hired the house one of them brought her there one of them planned the Murder by dividing up those tasks
01:12:21
the women had hoped to avoid suspicion yeah and I don't know why they would have gone through all the lengths when
01:12:30
they could like to bring her to East Orange when they could have just committed this crime in New York yeah I
01:12:35
don't know I wonder if they thought maybe like her traveling in such a frail state would just end up with her death
01:12:41
maybe you know but it's like even then it's like that would have been great for them oh yeah actually yeah you know like
01:12:49
that either way so it's like it just doesn't make like like why wouldn't you just like do it yeah like why' you bring
01:12:58
her somewhere else and like evolve another place and like no that's what I meant by that I
01:13:03
think oh you meant going from Brooklyn to East Orange sorry I I was thinking the other way around no you are correct
01:13:08
like that that is also a good point but even investigators now they're like I still don't get why they didn't just
01:13:13
like cuz you didn't really need anything to happen you had already done the starvation and the poor treatment and
01:13:20
the withholding medical treatment from her mhm at this point it's like it looks like what they did was they just dragged
01:13:27
her to a bathtub and drowned her they could have done that they could have done that all along but maybe the
01:13:32
financial thing was like heating up at that point maybe they were like okay like she's not going to die soon enough
01:13:38
from starvation so we need to speed this along but that's what I mean they could
01:13:41
have just drowned her in the house that they already had yeah like it doesn't make sense but what's also unknown to
01:13:49
investigators at this point was the whereabouts of like you were asking Caroline yeah like where is she they
01:13:54
believe she was obviously an active participant in her own daughter's death I mean yeah now despite her absence or
01:14:00
perhaps because of it the Press was able to paint a picture of Caroline as a kind
01:14:04
of ring leader among the sisters it sounds like she is because again they were quote unquote normal before until
01:14:11
her arrival the sister's lives seemed pretty functional odd a little bit but functional yeah I mean she was the
01:14:18
president of the school the other one worked there like but once Caroline entered the picture her manipulation
01:14:23
overbearing personality completely changed Virginia and Mary according to Luanne R the newspapers described
01:14:30
Caroline as an intelligent and highly emotional woman perhaps with mental illness who manipulated her family yeah
01:14:38
she was a hoarder she clung on to everything she owned rather than sell them even when she was financially
01:14:44
desperate and most importantly she lacked any real human connection even with the closest members of her family
01:14:51
her husband her son and her daughter she had no connection to them it sounds like
01:14:56
she has more of a connection to her sisters yeah and this was a strange little thing by mid December Caroline
01:15:02
had been located in New York City and she was registered at a hotel as Mrs mayck Mrs mayck now remember the case of
01:15:11
Florence maybrick yeah James mayb yeah who some people believe to be Jack the Ripper he's not get this Florence May's
01:15:21
daughter was named Carol wait what so Caroline our bad Caroline is living in New York City in a
01:15:32
hotel under the name Mrs mayck Florence mayri was married to James mayri and was
01:15:42
accused of poisoning him uhhuh her daughter's name was Caroline okay I don't know what the
01:15:49
connection is there but Mrs mayri is a strange name to pick yeah and and the fact that the Caroline
01:15:57
is going under Mrs maybrick and the real Mrs maybrick has a daughter named Caroline is a little strange that is and
01:16:06
it was like it was heavily reported even oh yeah like he people thought he was Jack the Ripper right what the [ __ ] and
01:16:14
it was like a big deal because they thought that Florence had murdered him right and sorry was that in the states
01:16:19
or no because they thought he was Jack the Ripper so that was in Europe and it was reported over here because okay yeah
01:16:25
sorry that was like a lot what yeah like it's just a weird I was like what is this and I tried to find any other
01:16:35
kind of connections there but I was like I couldn't find and though it's weird too is I
01:16:42
think it was a big deal the Florence mayri stuff because Florence mayri was from um
01:16:48
Alabama oh and they're from sou she from the south and it's like so that was is definitely reported over here because it
01:16:54
was like a an American woman you know um but yeah like that's [ __ ] a weird interconnection here that
01:17:03
I can't quite put my finger on but weird can very like coincidental yeah and it's
01:17:10
also if she did do that on purpose which to me it kind of sounds like she did that's that's a weird [ __ ] thing to
01:17:15
do on purpose because people are going to want to like you're you're trying to float below the radar but you're picking
01:17:21
that as a cover name yeah I don't know what it's very strange do you think she just thought it was like
01:17:27
funny yeah or like a like she just did it to be like I don't know cuz they love that spooky Persona they've got their
01:17:36
maybe it was just like their black dress with the Black Veil right so maybe it's
01:17:40
just part of the whole like it sounds very mental illness very strange you know like it sounds like she was there
01:17:45
there's definitely something well I when I saw Mrs maybrick I was like Mrs mayb and I was like oh Florence mayri James
01:17:50
mayri and I started thinking about it and then I was like huh and I was like wait Lawrence was from the United States
01:17:56
I was like wait she was from the south yeah wait a second and I started looking into it again like just being like
01:18:01
refreshing and then I was like holy [ __ ] her daughter's name was Caroline that's
01:18:06
too I feel like that's too weird to be a coincidence right I would I think yeah too many connections there but anyway
01:18:14
that was my little like Florence ended up getting out of jail eventually and then moving back to the states right she
01:18:20
ended up living like you know like a quaint life pretty quiet life yeah um interesting now Caroline was under
01:18:28
surveillance by New Jersey authorities until they had justification to arrest her we love a surveillance moment right
01:18:35
that that evidence finally came in the form of several letters written by Caroline that Chief Bell believed bore a
01:18:41
remarkable resemblance to the handwriting in OC suicide notes she wrote her child fake suicide note
01:18:49
finally by the end of December Mary sne and Caroline were taken into custody by New York authorities and held for the
01:18:56
murder of OSI wow on December 22nd a grand jury indicted all three women for first-degree murder um at this time
01:19:05
prosecutor Wilbur mot began drawing up the papers to have Mary and Caroline extradited to New Jersey to stand trial
01:19:12
the most compelling piece of evidence presented to the grand jury according to the Press was more than
01:19:17
50 quote unquote suicide notes discovered in Caroline Martin's New York hotel room so she kept writing them over
01:19:25
and over and over again pring what the [ __ ] that's her daughter her child I mean she was already starving her so I
01:19:33
don't know why I'm shocked but who that's [ __ ] now while all three women continued to be held in prison pending
01:19:40
trial investigators in East Orange kept turning up evidence in the case that strongly supported the theory that OC's
01:19:47
death was a murder in addition to the insurance policies taken out on her life and other evidence of cons iracy when uh
01:19:54
when he first searched the house Sergeant O'Neal had found a glass by the bathtub that contained a small amount of
01:20:00
liquid when the autopsy was conducted a small amount of that same liquid was discovered in OC's stomach now it took a
01:20:07
long time for the analysis to be completed but in mid January the results came back and found that that liquid was
01:20:14
morphine oh the discovery of the morphine answered the nagging question of how OC had managed to drown in such a
01:20:22
shallow amount of water right especially since the body would instinctively fight
01:20:27
to stay alive with this new so they had sedated her that's easy and that was probably how they even got her into the
01:20:33
bath in the first place now with this new evidence the prosecutor announced their belief that the women had been
01:20:37
administering the morphine for several days and that when she was put in the bathtub OSI was unconscious of what was
01:20:45
uring occurring which I guess is the only blessing here that she didn't know what was happening now they built their
01:20:53
case against the three sisters and the prosecutor announced the trial would begin April 1910 but things started to
01:20:59
fall apart because a ton of things delayed the trial first the sister's elderly mother died followed by the
01:21:06
unfortunate death of OC's son David at St Christopher's Hospital then in the spring it became clear to authorities
01:21:15
that Virginia's Health had started to take a turn for the worse and she's in custody right okay they discovered she
01:21:22
was star in herself what that is so like just maob yep in August the prosecutor announced it is feared Virginia Ward law
01:21:34
may not live to be brought to trial wow by the summer she had been removed from the House of Corrections and taken to a
01:21:40
hospital she was frequently unconscious required oxygen and a few days later on August 12th she had died from starvation
01:21:48
Jes she had starved herself to death in custody that is wild cuz that takes a long time yeah now prison officials had
01:21:57
tried to give her enough food like they were they were serving her food she just
01:22:01
wouldn't eat they said she had intentionally killed herself and they said quote having starved herself to
01:22:07
avoid being placed on trial wow now things became even more complicated a month later in late September when
01:22:14
Franklin Fort produced a document signed by two psychiatrists that declared Caroline Martin insane I mean we knew
01:22:22
that the defense argued this is a case of whether a woman should be confined in a jail or in an asylum Asylum we have
01:22:29
carefully considered all the details of the case and with the relatives of Mrs Martin and with the relatives of Mrs
01:22:35
Martin believe that she is not now in her right mind the request request for a new hearing on Caroline sanity
01:22:42
conflicted with the schedule for the acting judge so the case was transferred to another judge judge J1 e and
01:22:49
scheduled for early August now when it finally went underway Caroline's Behavior whether real or an act to
01:22:58
bolster this claim because people do believe it was did little to contradict the ways in which she'd been portrayed
01:23:05
in the Press at one point while a former representative from Ward Law College was
01:23:10
testifying um about how Caroline had negatively affected the school and its finances Caroline jumped out of her seat
01:23:17
and shouted I never said a thing he is telling and then was ordered to sit down by the courtroom yeah Caroline would
01:23:24
continue to have outbursts over and over she would challenge any and all testimony given and when Caroline's
01:23:30
brother Reverend Albert wardlaw was called To The Stand he testified that Caroline had always been controlling
01:23:37
manipulative and strange we heard that he said she directed both my school and daily life in New York oh uh he said of
01:23:45
his earlier experience with his sister that um he said that he told the court that around 1890 or 18 1991 he noticed a
01:23:54
marked change in his sister's Behavior huh she was irrational bizarre and very quick to anger and at one point she said
01:24:01
to him that she was quote equal to her Creator and called herself salvator what Albert word Law's
01:24:09
testimony was interrupted Again by Caroline outbursting and the judge had to call her recess now throughout the
01:24:17
trial Caroline was seen to lift her veil a lot cuz she was wearing her Veil mhm and basically she would like lift her
01:24:25
veil subtly during one of her outbursts to kind of evaluate the judge's reaction
01:24:31
gauging how far she could carry it or to act out like this is very clear that she's doing it on purpose like she would
01:24:39
look at him and be like and like see how far she could take it and after multiple
01:24:43
outbursts in the courtroom the sanity hearing finally concluded in late November and the judge concluded Mrs
01:24:49
Martin is sane within the meaning of of the statute competent to advise councel and assist in the preparation of Defense
01:24:57
that's the thing if like if you can sit there and jump up and out burst to everything and be like looking to see
01:25:02
how far you can take it then hello so without a formal Declaration of insanity to Shield her Caroline's lawyers
01:25:09
encouraged her to plead guilty to a lesser charge smart and on November 9th 1911 she pleaded no contest to a charge
01:25:16
of manslaughter but manslaughter when the plea agreement for manslaughter was read
01:25:20
in court she interrupted the prosecutor and said involuntary manslaughter please
01:25:25
sir you can't just change the charge that you're pleading to and the prosecutor raised his voice and said
01:25:32
manslaughter Madam so the exchange brought on another aggressive Outburst from Caroline but
01:25:39
the judge had had [ __ ] enough of this and was like we're going to get delayed again so he literally like yelled at
01:25:45
Caroline this is not the time for you to talk and she just slinked back in her chair oh man now Caroline Martin was
01:25:54
sentenced to 7 years in the State Penitentiary for women and began serving her term
01:26:00
February 8th 1911 7 years after a little more than a year in prison officials noted that
01:26:08
Caroline was doing very poorly and her mental health had declined considerably so in May 1912 she was declared insane
01:26:16
and transferred to the New Jersey state hospital for the insane to finish out her sentence okay on June 10th 1913 only
01:26:23
in the next year Caroline Martin died from heart disease at the age of 67 wow now because the law didn't allow for
01:26:32
co-conspirators to manslaughter right The Joint indictment of Caroline and Mary had to be severed as a result the
01:26:39
prosecutor had to drop the accessory charge against Mary sne and she was free to go she just walked with her husband
01:26:47
and one of her sons dead and Fletcher living in Canada Mary only option was to move to Colorado where she went to live
01:26:55
with a third son that no one knew about what the [ __ ] Mary resurfaced in 1930 when a number of diamonds were
01:27:03
discovered in an unclaimed bank vault in Murphy's bville Tennessee this would be
01:27:08
the way that this [ __ ] thing is now according to Mary quote Miss Virginia Ward law Virginia yeah her sister Miss
01:27:15
Virginia wardlaw's diamonds were lost or stolen from Su college and she believed
01:27:20
them to be the same diamonds found The Vault no as the only living Sister Mary claimed herself the heir to her sister's
01:27:28
estate those aren't hers and attempted to claim the diamonds no baby no it's unclear whether she was successful
01:27:34
really at the time she was known to be quote a church worker living in Oakland California Mary sne died in
01:27:43
1937 wow 1937 that's and that's the end of the story what the [ __ ] [ __ ] dude
01:27:51
that that is first of all one of the darkest tales that you've ever told and I shouldn't say Tales cuz it's true and
01:27:58
secondly what the [ __ ] [ __ ] what the [ __ ] [ __ ] is right holy [ __ ] that's
01:28:03
one of the strangest the fact that OC was wrapped up in this I know cuz it sounds like she was just like a sweet
01:28:10
girl and she just wanted like a happy normal life it pisses me off that Fletcher was like oh I'm not going to
01:28:15
die like let me get out of here it's like [ __ ] you flet take her with you yeah like Jesus like
01:28:20
she godamn like you got you you had to get married you agreed to get married yeah you must have loved her in some
01:28:25
capacity your first cousin get her out of there like Jesus if you're worried about these women and what they did to
01:28:31
your brother you should be worried about what's going to happen to your family member exactly you
01:28:37
know wow he just runs up to Canada I'm like nice Fletcher that's the thing it's like take her to Canada with you Jesus
01:28:42
Christ that feels very much like a Fletcher thing to do though I know you like that name but like it feels like a
01:28:47
Fletcher thing to do you're not wrong you know I think that's the guy's name and like something bar who like cheats
01:28:52
on his woman oh I think you might be right yeah I'm not going to name my kid Fletcher sorry D the Fletcher sorry D
01:28:58
the Fletch it's a cool name lie but I don't know something about it Fletch yeah wow so that is the story of
01:29:07
holy bananas the quote unquote black sisters because that's what they were called and the murder of os Sneed that I
01:29:16
can't I just can't even stop saying how Wild that was I've never heard anything like that took me out my friend for real
01:29:23
Mikey just like found that in the Mikey just found it was like you should look at this story and I was like are you
01:29:27
[ __ ] kidding me written all over how did I miss that I was like I've never came across this
01:29:33
that's wild crazy had a driver to [ __ ] you want to do that when we're old let's hire a driver drive us to the
01:29:39
graveyard we won't dance around like headstones though that's [ __ ] up no that's kind of disrespectful that's
01:29:44
super disrespectful he can drive us somewhere else I do love a graveyard though love to walk around a graveyard
01:29:49
let's dress an all black when we're older not murder anybody just get a four for four at one for fall I know going to
01:29:55
back there's a lot of souls happening today I had a weird Accent on my fall there fall earlier I said Insanity she
01:30:02
did I don't know I don't know well we hope you keep listening holy Fu we hope you keep it's weird but not so weird
01:30:09
that you hire a driver to bring you to the cemetery in the middle of the night and you dance around Graves and then you
01:30:12
like wake up in the middle of the night to people standing over your bed and not
01:30:16
so weird that you kill your own daughter by starvation and then write all the suicide notes for her because wow that's
01:30:20
like super [ __ ] up [Music]