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hey Prime members you can listen to morbid early and add free on Amazon music download the app today
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in season three of the hit True Crime podcast cold I Dave Cauley investigate The Disappearance of a young mother
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Sheree Warren we'll try to find out if either of the two men in her life both with abusive pasts were responsible for
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her death listen to cold the search for Cherie on Amazon music or wherever you get your podcasts hey you weirdos I'm
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Elena I'm Ash and this is morbid [Music] [Music] thank you [Music] it's morbid in the afternoon we do it
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all day we do it in the morning we do it at night we do it in the afternoon and sometimes we do it at night night it's
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like night but different than later and sometimes morning morning but earlier but now it's just in the
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nice afternoon after we've had a salad it's actually 333 which is my good luck time oh look at that I don't know
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oh man an angel number I saw 222 and I saw 333 today oh I keep seeing four fours in my life yeah you love 444 yeah
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um I already told you this so it won't be new to you but I saw this Tick Tock guys and it was saying it was like
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you're at like a change in your life and I almost scrolled past but then I said I'm woo let me hear it I'm woo I'm blue
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tell me about it it said you're gonna start seeing repeating numbers I said check I see Angel numbers all the time
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even like not even times but like addresses like I'll drive past your house and I'm like oh [ __ ] five five
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five look at that um and then it said you're gonna start waking up in in the night between like
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three and four in the morning and then when you go and it said that and I was like okay I already do that literally
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every night I wake up at three um and then it said you're gonna start having these Vivid vivid dreams which in
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the morning like once you've gone back to sleep which has started happening to me I've told Elena about some of my
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crazy ass dreams this guy knew and he knew and I forget what happens after that it wasn't bad um but I mean I'm at
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like a point of Spiritual Awakening I guess oh look at you and it's funny because a lot of you guys actually have
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been messaging me seeing if I'm okay which we appreciate which I appreciate I'm totally fine we've had like some
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family stuff going on which like sucked but I don't want to really talk about it
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yeah that's why we had to we missed one listener tale last week I believe it was
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yeah yeah I was out of the office I had I had to attend some stuff yeah there was some stuff going on but everything's
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okay everything's cool everything's good and gravy but I I'm out of Spiritual Awakening in my life so that's fun that
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is fun yeah but you know oh my god do you know what we got to do I think it's two weeks from this week what so so in
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two weeks I was like we can go to the obituary show we can go to the obituary show yes I really am very excited about
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obituary obituary art um our show that's on our network with it's not our show it's Spencer Madison's show but they're
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on our more but no there are babies um they are going on a world tour like a straight up World Tour I've shared the
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and I know you have too is it a world tour is there like a a national tour well it's a Us store I
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thought it was like wait are they leaving the country no not yet anyway not yet I don't I'm not here to spoil
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I'm not gonna live it there yeah I'm not gonna clip their wings it's called manifestation look it up so they they
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currently right now are on a US tour sorry Europe um but we get to go to the Boston show
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we're gonna be there and if you're not there to support our friends are you even our friends are you even our
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friends oh my God that show's gonna be March 1st and I'm so [ __ ] stoked about it
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um March 3rd they're gonna be in New York City March 6th Washington DC March 8th I'm reading all of these to you just
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so you know Philadelphia the 29th they're gonna be in San Francisco California y'all whoa then they go to
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Portland March 31st and for the rest I'm not going to read all of them to you because that's actually a lot I started
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saying and then I was like maybe I shouldn't do that we're gonna link the rest of the show dates in our show notes
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and we will post them on Instagram but I think you guys should come see us at the Boston show hang out with us and see
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Spencer and Madison put on the Glorious show of ever be the beautiful goddesses that they are be supportive Geoff hell
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yeah or else because that show is so [ __ ] funny guys they're so good and they're like the most delightful people
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ever so it's support them yeah they're some of my favorites so yeah we'll put the link to their
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um all their upcoming shows and then where you can buy tickets in our show nuts indeed so come join us at the
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obituary show on the East Coast let's go let's [ __ ] go girls I am ready for that I can't wait I'm so excited uh you
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know what I'm not excited about though part two of Harvey part two of Harvey Club yeah I'm actually gonna need you to
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just like head right into this because you left on a [ __ ] Cliffhanger and a half I sure did I think when I left you
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guys we talked about the third victim which is Ruth Marcato um he's already killed two other women
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at this point he's attacked countless others I was gonna say it feels like so much more than that because he's just
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attacking everybody left and right like a big giant [ __ ] yeah it's pretty terrible and he's doing it in kind of
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the same wage time he's got a really like pretty consistent Mo he uses rope he strangles he brings them out to the
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LA desert clean photos claims he doesn't want to do it it's it's all ridiculous he's really annoying it's so crazy to me
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that he and I think I said this last time too but I'm saying it again saying it I'm saying it he says that he doesn't
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want to do this like oh I I sat there and I really struggled with myself but then he does the exact same thing every
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time so clearly you liked this you didn't do this thinking you were getting any different kind of result no he's a
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lying sack of [ __ ] it makes me angry like if like don't be a murderer step one but step two [ __ ] own your [ __ ]
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yeah own it he's definitely a lying sack of [ __ ] and we're gonna see at the end
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of this episode you're gonna get a little little Glimpse at him that you're like you're yeah like you don't feel
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anywhere no I don't think he whatsoever and what's even worse about this is this
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took place in like the late 50s and the LAPD for Ruth mercado's murder uh her photo didn't appear in the LAPD bulletin
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I said this at the end of the last episode just to recap you it didn't appear in there until two months after
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she had gone missing and the notes on it were May seek employment at nude modeling or as a stripper and mental
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condition poor it's like um who did you ask about that it's like I don't know I think the guy who did this his mental
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condition is poor yeah I would say some would say even worse than that and I think this was one of those things where
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they they looked at it like oh she's she was a stripper yeah and a nude model so
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who gives a [ __ ] it's like okay first of all I know that all you detectives have
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Playboy under your bed so I don't know what your issue is with nude models and second of all you're all going to strip
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clubs so what's your job and it's a job they are going to a job and they are making money exactly shut the [ __ ] up I
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don't under I hate how that just like played and I'm sure it still and we know still does play a part oh yes it's like
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who gives a [ __ ] what somebody does as a profession as long as they're not hurting themselves or someone else
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exactly and it's like who are you to say what is a valid profession and what isn't yeah like you could say that about
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anything like we're podcasters that doesn't sound like a valid profession like you know what I mean like I've had
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many people look at me like it's not a valid profession but we do it it's a job like it's how it pays our bills like
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that's it's like that's what a job is it's like you go you work you work hard you put your energy into it and it pays
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your bills right that's supposed to be what it is at least it's like it's so [ __ ] up it is I don't like it no it
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makes me mad so unfortunately we ended on another murder but we are going to enter into finally him getting caught
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and not because he was caught through like good old-fashioned beliefs work never this is the 50s isn't it nope he
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was caught because this bad bad [ __ ] Lorraine got away from me oh I like that name a lot yeah Lorraine really went for
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it I was gonna say I said this is the 50s and I forgot to mention the LAPD is on the game exactly so there's a lot
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working against this that is a lose-lose situation at this point in time at least and so after
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murdering Judy doll Shirley bridgeford and Ruth Mercado Harvey was almost immediately ready to kill again he was
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not like really amping up yeah he did not want to wait but he did let six months pass by he wanted to kill right
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again but he was he knew there was some heat on not necessarily on him but he didn't want to slip up yeah fortunately
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for us he does good now during everyone else exactly now during this time he got
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another job as a TV repairman a repairman because remember he did that in sing-sing prison like that was what
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he would make his money on on the side God I forgot that he went to sing so yeah you sure did he went to Sing Sing
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prison uh in but at this point he was kind of starting to lose it a bit and lose it in the sense that he could not
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stop thinking of abducting and killing women like he was obsessing over it like could he couldn't keep his Jin his mind
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in his normal everyday you know day job he obsessively was looking at photos of the women that he had killed that he had
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he kept in his little toolbox there he would spend hours just going through the trophies he had stolen from them like
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the shoes and the underwear the pieces of fabrics things from their purse like all he could think about was doing it
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again he obsessed over it I hate this this also shows you he doesn't have remorse no like this isn't a guy that's
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like oh no I did that I shouldn't have done that no he loves it that's why he kept that [ __ ] so he can relive it 100
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more reliving obsessing just like no he loves what he's doing you're not remorseful if you are just wanting to
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relive the situation like if you're remorseful you never want to think of that situation oh yeah so in late
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October of 1958 he was officially back on the hunt but he was so eager and so [ __ ] lazy
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that he didn't even bother to use another fake name he just went with Frank Johnson again which was the same
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one he used last time and up until this point he switched every time he's been switching and it's been working for him
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and he did the same photographer trick this time which you would think he would get out of that because he had once
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other one other time with Shirley bridgeford he did the Lonely Hearts thing right because he knew people were
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going to be looking at photographers now he's already killed again as a fake photographer named Frank Johnson and
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he's going right back to that so he's losing it he's he's getting too eager this Obsession this pathology is taking
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him over and he's making mistakes yeah so he took to the paper to look for his next victim and he ended up finding an
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ad for a modeling studio called the Diane Studio it was a modeling agency on Sunset Boulevard and it specialized in
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pinup modeling okay so on October 27th he showed up to the Diane studio and said he was Frank Johnson a professional
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magazine photographer and he needed models for a campaign it's really gross to me that he does it
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this way because it's like he's going to a place and he's just essentially purchasing women to murder yeah like
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he's paying like he's like I would like to hire a model I'm going to pay for that and then I'm just going to take her
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out to the desert and murder her torture her murder her yeah it's like that is so
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[ __ ] up that he is able to do that I know I didn't really think of it like that when you look at it as like yeah
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like the nuts and bolts of it yeah like strip everything else away this is him walking into a place saying hello hello
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I'd like to pay this much money for to have this girl come so I can take pictures and nobody knows and nobody
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under knows because that is a legitimate job and that is a legitimate transaction
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yeah it's like unfortunately it's the perfect way for him to do it truly it was the perfect way he was able to get
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any women that he wanted but then at the same time it's not the perfect way because you can't keep up with that for
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too long that's true you're gonna run out of places they're gonna start recognizing onto it and if you're using
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the same name like this idiot then they're really gonna start catching on but what is even more wild about this is
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exactly what we were just saying he had actually photographed Diane of the Diane
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Studio a few times she owns she owns the studio damn and she must have been you know I
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think she was probably in the beginning when I told you he first moved to LA yeah and he was trying to like work out
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how he would do all this and he was taking pictures with a practice person yeah I think he was she was probably in
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the beginning there and when he showed up on this day she recognized him uh oh but she had previously found him so
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creepy and did like off-putting she's like I'm not sending you one of my girls oh no unfortunately she didn't want to
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go with him oh no but she said she would find a model for him she did not want to turn away a paying
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customer so she threw him another really [ __ ] I promise you there will be another paying customer yeah if like if
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somebody gets both increase why would you ever sick them on another woman on another woman yeah that bummed me out
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when I read it I would never do that because obviously I don't think there was like a an intent you know what I
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mean obviously to be like a dick there but it's like but that's it what are you thinking of that like if you found this
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man creepy enough putting enough that you yourself will not pose for him right why would you put another one of your
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girls on them like I might say oh yeah like I'll find you another girl and then just not return but I just wouldn't
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right yeah I'd be like sorry no one wants to work with you no because you're weird maybe I don't know maybe 10 years
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ago my answer would have been different or something like yeah maybe she was young and just maybe he wasn't thinking
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yeah I don't know but it it gave me like oh I was like come on yeah that sucks especially because of what happens
00:14:34
[Music] decades before Anna delvey began scamming her way into High Society Christian Carl gerhart's writer was
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00:14:59
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listen ad free on the Amazon music or wundery app so she threw him another Model 28 year
00:15:30
old Lorraine vigil Lorraine had been working as a secretary when she came across the ad for the Diane modeling
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studio and she decided you know what I mean give it a try I want to make sure exactly some extra money she wanted to
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change up her her routine a little bit she was like you know what I'm just gonna spice it up well it's like a hobby
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and I'm a beautiful woman why not I'm gorgeous let's go girls and in fact Lorraine had only been with the agency
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for a few days when she got the call from Diane wow and she got the call a little after 9 p.m that night saying
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that there was a job for her and she would be and that Diane was going to be sending Frank Johnson by her apartment
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to pick her up within the hour okay this is all very shady I'm also like can we not have them picked up at therapy I
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know I'm like there should have been a better protocol here yeah like one place in the office yeah like they have to
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come to the studio yeah excuse me sorry I was a little horseback a little horse so she's getting ready and Diane calls
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her back as she's getting ready Diane says listen I know I'm sending you out with this guy
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I just want to warn you that he is quote sort of creepy and definitely not a pro
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photographer so be careful what the [ __ ] yeah if he's not even been a pro photographer then what are we doing here
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ma'am and that's and so I feel bad for Lorraine here because she's like I'm already getting ready she's only been
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here a few days she probably doesn't feel like she can refuse a client at this point and that's the thing so she's
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like okay and then she's like maybe because I'm new Diane's just being extra cautious and like
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overwhourning me kind of thing like she didn't really think much of it because she was like I'm new so maybe
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she's just being extra cautious also from a business standpoint why would you want to give one of your newest girls a
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bad experience right off the bat she's not going to come back and model for you exactly like that's just bad business it
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didn't I didn't really understand a lot of this thought process as Tatiana says choices yeah choices truly uh but
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you know she was like whatever so a little past 10 PM Harvey knocks on Lorraine's apartment door he says hello
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I am Frank Johnson I'm a magazine photographer and immediately she reminded him that
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Diane insists on getting the money up front ah well that's good good for Larry Lorraine she was like you should always
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get your money up front always get your money up front never wait because people
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will [ __ ] should they'll they'll [ __ ] it up yeah they'll [ __ ] with you people
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will [ __ ] with you if they are allowed to [ __ ] with you so don't let people [ __ ] with you they might even keep your
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money yeah they'll keep your money so like don't let them do that and this and Harvey tried to pull that [ __ ] so like
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it's true because if you don't get it up front they're gonna try to pull some [ __ ] and give you less yeah
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and like not to keep quoting people but to quote my good girl Riri [ __ ] but I have money there you go hey me
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what you owe me and Lorraine was like that's okay me what you owe me like you're not coming in this apartment
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you're not getting my services if you're not paying for them no I don't work for
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free mama so she they had agreed upon 22 dollars okay which again this is in the
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50s so they had agreed upon 22 he decided that he was going to give her ten dollars and then he did convince her
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that he will give her the rest later oh honey no yeah he won't unfortunately because people pleasing is a real thing
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and we've all been there yeah that you're in a situation where you feel like you can't argue she didn't argue
00:19:04
and she just said okay she accepted it and she accepted his promise that he was going to give the rest before the
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session and by the way it would have been like 275. so there you go it's gonna be like that's a good amount of
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money so he really he gave less than half of that yeah [ __ ] off which that's [ __ ] up so Lorraine was immediately
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put off by this Frank Johnson [ __ ] character I would have been put off by that [ __ ] too hell yeah and on top of
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being like weird about the money situation he smelled like cigarettes she said and he had bo ew which like I like
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I would I would have been it for me it's all Behavior yeah he is such an insult take a goddamn shower and she said he
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was every bit The Creep that Diane had mentioned I'm angry at times I'm a little angry at Diane as well but once
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they were in the car because they were going to be going to the studio the Diane Studio
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because that's the other thing I should say the reason that like he would come pick her up at the house is because a
00:20:03
lot of times especially in La at this time people didn't have cars oh okay so and it's not like you could call an Uber
00:20:09
and just go to the studio so a lot of times these photographers would drive them to the studio
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okay so it's kind of part of it so he was driving them to the studio and then Harvey all of a sudden on the way there
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said that there's a change of plans no there's not as we know when Harvey says there's a change of plans you don't
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listen to him but he says that there's a change of plans and that Diane had some other people
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coming into the studio so it was taken up so they would have to use his studio in Anaheim okay so Lorraine was like
00:20:43
ah right like she just kind of was reluctant but she was like ah all right whatever like who am I to argue with all
00:20:50
this this is probably the way things always go because that's the thing it's like when you're in when you're new to
00:20:56
something like that you're probably like is this just par for the course you know
00:21:00
like I am in La yeah because it's just how things go like people are going to give you less than what they owe you and
00:21:06
exactly they're going to change plans on the way to the studio and this is probably fine
00:21:12
so she was just like okay whatever but she did say every alarm Bell was ringing in her head yeah unfortunately the
00:21:21
benefit of hindsight is always easier but like trusting your gut is definitely a real thing but then also at that point
00:21:26
it's like what are you even gonna do what are you gonna do at that point like so all your only option at that point is
00:21:30
tuck and roll you got to think of a plan basically that's yeah but that would be
00:21:34
very stressful um and at the same time Harvey is attempting to kind of like ease her
00:21:40
anxiety like because he likes to get them comfortable yeah he likes to he doesn't want everybody screaming and
00:21:45
yelling remember it makes it easy the second a woman turns around and challenges him in any way
00:21:52
he please remember that's happened a few times like he cannot handle a woman turning around and surprising him with
00:22:00
any kind of no that's literally when he dips so but but these women don't know that so he so his whole thing is that he
00:22:07
likes to get them calm he likes to get them to trust him until he has that gun out and then he can really control you
00:22:13
but before that he's got to keep you docile he doesn't want you jumping at him so he's kind of just telling her
00:22:20
about this fictional job that he has come up with what they're going to be shooting how you know this is going to
00:22:26
be great she's so beautiful you could even make the cover you're that beaut like this magazine they're gonna love
00:22:31
you he is hyping her he's hyping her up and he's like you know what I think if these photos really make it then you are
00:22:37
definitely cover model material oh man so she's like oh this is great but then as they kept driving South toward the
00:22:43
desert they got on the Santa Ana freeway and Lorraine is suddenly not feeling us
00:22:49
at ease because she's starting to feel going because she said that quote he began driving at a tremendous speed oh
00:22:57
and then she said he would never answer my questions or even look at me oh he just stopped I've I've like heard that
00:23:04
in other cases when they just like will not answer you they just go into that zone oh God that would be so scary it
00:23:10
really is like a [ __ ] like animal putting on like yeah Hunter mode it truly is it's like they just click it
00:23:16
off it's like how wolves like a tick talk about wolves like they can like play with you and stuff but when that
00:23:22
animal Instinct kicks in it's like Snap there are different Beast it's so true and she said it was clear to her that
00:23:28
something bad was happening right now and she was really in full Panic especially when he pulled off the
00:23:34
freeway and onto the shoulder oh God and this is when he told her he had a flat tire and she was like I don't think you
00:23:40
have a flat tire but she was in full flight or fright mode so she was about to take off
00:23:46
running she was like I had a plan I was gonna bowl like as soon as he got out of
00:23:51
the car I was getting out of there but before she could he pulled out the gun oh my God and he said I'm an ex-con and
00:23:57
I'll kill you I don't give a darn if I go to the gas chamber which is not something you want to hear
00:24:03
nope and he tried to force her to get her hands behind her back so she he could tie them
00:24:09
but she shocked him she did something he was not expecting she just grabbed the barrel of the [ __ ] gun oh my
00:24:20
God it has screamed at him while trying to wrench the gun away from him what a brave girly he was
00:24:28
sure me as well shocked and he fought back grab the barrel of a gun like yeah she just she's like not today
00:24:36
[ __ ] I today is not the day and I'm not the one Barbie or Frank I should say oh my God yeah grabbed it she's
00:24:45
yelling he's yelling she's trying to wrench it out of his hands and he's yelling just do I what I tell you and
00:24:51
you won't get hurt which l-o [ __ ] not true I love that I it made me think of the uh Buffy episode
00:24:59
that we just watched on the rewatcher actually you guys gotta listen to that it's great but it's so much fun we love
00:25:05
doing that it's just like a really fun show yeah but there was an episode where like Angel is getting his ass kicked by
00:25:12
Kendra all over the place and gets like thrown into a cage and he's like in a cage on his back and he's like don't
00:25:18
make me hurt you and it's like my friends you are useless you are in no position to be telling me don't let make
00:25:25
me and it's the same thing with Harvey it's like don't make me hurt you like [ __ ] off I just grabbed the barrel of
00:25:31
this gun don't make me worried about you really at this point Don't Make Me Hurt
00:25:34
You exactly [ __ ] you little little man like get out of here so he grapples with
00:25:39
Lorraine and he's trying desperately to subdue her but she's fighting like hell hell yeah and during this whole fight
00:25:47
the gun goes off I was waiting for you to say that the bullet went through Lorraine's skirt and it grazed her thigh
00:25:53
oh and she said quote I'll never forget the Hideous sound of the bullet as it whined off into the night oh which I
00:26:00
also thought was like a very beautiful way of saying that is as it wind off it was like night it was like really scary
00:26:05
and terrifying but like beautiful at the same time yeah it's poetic she said she's very well spoken that way now even
00:26:12
Harvey was shocked by this because remember he doesn't like trouble and he doesn't like to he doesn't like to shoot
00:26:19
the gun he's using the gun to scare people he likes to use a rope yeah because he can take the Rope off he can
00:26:26
wipe everything down he doesn't leave a trace guns leave traces of people yeah sure so he's like that can be traced
00:26:33
back to me and apparently he was so shocked he just goes I shot you oh my God like I was like shocked and Lorraine
00:26:39
was like uh yeah but she wasn't gonna sit there and ponder that with him for a little while so she Twisted out of his
00:26:46
grasp because at this point he's grabbed her she twists out of there because she's like you're a little [ __ ] turd
00:26:51
of a man she twists out of there jumps up shot in the thigh by the way yeah and runs the [ __ ] out of there oh my gosh as
00:26:59
she's running she is tackled from behind like a [ __ ] football player by Harvey
00:27:05
coming out of his shocked stupor oh he tackled her down from behind luckily he had not made it to his killing ground
00:27:15
yet the desert where he feels comfortable taking his time and torturing women for [ __ ] hours like a
00:27:21
disgusting little maggot that he is they were on the side of the highway albeit in a pretty desolate area about like 200
00:27:29
feet off this the actual highway but it was a heavily traveled there I was gonna
00:27:33
say anybody could drive by at any moment exactly you know who did happen to come by like
00:27:39
you said at any moment highway patrolman Thomas Mulligan oh sh Thomas Mulligan he
00:27:45
knows what the [ __ ] is up yeah I have faith in Thomas Mulligan he happened to be on his way home after his shift oh
00:27:52
man he's like I thought I was done for the night and what's crazy is he didn't even see the two of them yet he just saw
00:27:59
Harvey's black Dodge on the side of the road I thought someone wasn't having car
00:28:02
trouble well the dome light was on and both doors were open oh [ __ ] so he looks
00:28:07
at it and he's like that's suspicious so he was like I'm gonna listen to my gut so he just went to investigate it and he
00:28:12
came upon Harvey and Lorraine engaged in like a violent struggle oh my God like I
00:28:18
had no idea that's what he was coming up on Harvey is such a scared little bunny
00:28:23
when he is confronted with any kind of authority so he stopped immediately when he saw the cop wow this allowed Lorraine
00:28:30
to jump up off the ground and literally just like Sprint at the patrolman and she's screaming he's trying to to kill
00:28:37
me he's trying to kill me later after Harvey had been arrested Mulligan described Harvey as having a quote
00:28:43
lunatic stare oh Jesus and he said it took quote three or four minutes to get a hold of himself because he was just
00:28:50
like out of it like that's scary yeah and he said a lunatic snare it's like what we always point to like in the
00:28:56
Bundy case when he like lose like he's cool calm and collected and corn and then and then loses it yep and you can
00:29:03
see so scary it is literally like a flick of a switch it is and what's crazy is later after talking about it Lorraine
00:29:11
actually said that she bit his wrist at one point and he cried out during that struggle like a little [ __ ] and yeah
00:29:18
the way she described it was I bit his wrist and he cried out then suddenly I found I had a gun in my hand I turned it
00:29:24
around and pointed it at him if I had known how to fire it I believe I could have killed him but he just stood there
00:29:30
and watched me and after a while the police came wow I'm glad that she didn't kill him yeah because I want him to
00:29:36
suffer in jail and serve time for everything that he's done to these women exactly including her and I don't want
00:29:42
her to have that on her head that she had to kill someone yeah because no matter who it is like that's a that's a
00:29:47
heavy load I imagine to take so it's like I don't want that on her no so Harvey was taken to the local sheriff's
00:29:54
station and he tried to explain that he had only been in California for a few months he had met that girl that night
00:30:01
and then he said he didn't have any plan to hurt her he was just trying to scare
00:30:06
her were they like what's with all the rope and the gun then and also like that's still [ __ ] up yeah like that's
00:30:13
still not allowed even if this was true which we know it's not I was just trying
00:30:18
to scare her is not a great excuse why though you were just trying to terrorize your community that's like you're trying
00:30:24
to terrorize this woman for no reason like what's wrong with you what the [ __ ]
00:30:27
is that about how is that a good excuse and detectives didn't believe the Harvey
00:30:31
story they were like yeah no uh fortunately they didn't so he was booked into the Orange County Jail that night
00:30:37
on charges of attempted rape and assault with a deadly weapon good [ __ ] so he said I love I'm only trying to scare her
00:30:44
and it's like okay well I'm only trying to scare you with a [ __ ] prison sentence you dick yeah how about that
00:30:49
can I scare you with that right can I scare you with the electric chair like that's pretty scary [ __ ] you
00:30:55
so this was good we finally have him yeah and now that he's in custody and he's being charged Harvey really tried
00:31:03
to minimize all the events I had a feeling that was gonna happen yeah he did he did so he minimized everything
00:31:10
but then he kind of essentially admitted that he was planning to sexually assault
00:31:14
Lorraine oh good but he was definitely not going to tell them that he was planning to murder her when he
00:31:20
definitely was uh at least not at first he wouldn't admit that he later does okay he said that he you know he was he
00:31:26
was just trying to assault her fellas like come on don't worry about it everybody like how I like just guys
00:31:31
being dude this guy's being dudes locker room talk the problem was Harvey was never as smart or as stealthy as
00:31:37
stealthy as he thought he was or wanted to be no any this whole story was so [ __ ] cobbled together he had a long
00:31:45
criminal history of attacking women that they now were privy to and detectives were beginning to get the feeling that
00:31:51
there was something much bigger happening here and not only just that he was planning to attack this woman and
00:31:58
assault her they were like he was definitely going to hurt her at the very least but we think he was going to try
00:32:03
to kill her right and now they're sitting there going I think he might have done this before
00:32:07
like I think there's going to be more here we should look into this thank gosh they had that feeling yeah and luckily
00:32:13
they sent an alert out to all the law enforcement agencies in the area and detectives in Las Vegas Los Angeles
00:32:19
thought you know what we have a few missing women and we should see if we can tie these to him that's a good
00:32:25
thought guys there you go maybe I'm glad you're thinking I like it and they sent
00:32:29
two detectives to Orange County to interview Harvey foreign [Music] so detectives from OC and La
00:32:48
interrogated Harvey separately for days they were hoping to crack him or just get him to slip up at all and finally
00:32:56
they were successful yes he agreed to take a polygraph test and according to reports quote the polygraph needle about
00:33:04
hit the ceiling when the administrator showed him a photograph of Ruth Mercado oh now this was all it took like he saw
00:33:13
that needle going like he watched it like he knew that he was and he goes he can't beat the machine I suppose you
00:33:19
found my toolbox you're just playing with me now but they hadn't found his toolbox they
00:33:25
had not found his toolbox why would you just I'm so happy he did like why would you just offer that up
00:33:32
this is a case where like IQ does not correlate with common sense well because it's like book smarts versus Street
00:33:42
smarts and also where it almost feels like he knew he had to be caught to stop yeah
00:33:52
like it's one of those things I don't think he wanted to stop but I think he knows one he doesn't want to go back to
00:33:59
prison no he did not like prison and two I think he knows like this just isn't gonna end like I might as well just give
00:34:06
it up because like just kill me instead I think he'd rather die than then go back to prison or any of that and I
00:34:13
think he's just so [ __ ] cocky yeah like I think it also has a lot to do with that
00:34:19
but like I said they have not found his toolbox yet which I'm also like you didn't find it because they searched his
00:34:26
apartment like you didn't find that so they the LAPD detectives went back to the
00:34:32
apartment to search again and in a more thorough search they found the toolbox I'm like you missed that the first time
00:34:38
so he hadn't said that they wouldn't have found it no and that's like I mean the like those are literally smoking
00:34:44
guns right there and it was hidden in the garage guys that's exactly where you find a toolbox like it's not like he
00:34:50
even put it like behind his air conditioner a la Dexter or something it's like you didn't really have to look
00:34:56
that far wow how did you miss that thank goodness yikes yeah and when they got the toolbox obviously they found 22
00:35:04
photos of Judy doll Shirley bridgeford and Ruth Mercado both alive and dead that's horrible and as well as all this
00:35:11
stuff all the trophies that he had taken from them now these photos we were just
00:35:16
talking about it they're really disturbing and it's not because they're graphic no they're
00:35:22
they're really not graphic but they are so graphic they're emotionally same time
00:35:27
well I saw Elena looking at an article and I was like are those the real photos and she was like unfortunately yeah
00:35:33
there's one and I'm not sure what um which women which woman it was but like she literally is crying that's Shirley
00:35:41
bridgeford that like you can it's moments before she gets killed horrific because these pictures the Shirley
00:35:48
bridgeford one she's in the desert she's on a blanket just like he said you know
00:35:52
you know how that night went we talked about it in part one she was not um she was not a model this was the
00:35:59
Lonely Hearts one yeah that he did she was the most out on a date right and so like there was no tying up going to be
00:36:06
happening in any sense of the word like for photos or anything like that and in the photos she's tied up on a blanket in
00:36:12
the middle of the desert gagged and she is crying I'm a personific to look at and I don't don't recommend you look at
00:36:19
it yeah no but please if you are looking at it like when I saw it I was like that's
00:36:25
someone's mom you also just like have someone Wonder daughter how [ __ ] how those photos get out there like why were
00:36:32
they just released that's so [ __ ] like I don't know why anybody would want to see that it's a
00:36:38
very disturbing one it really is it's all very disturbing one and this is Judy doll sitting on a chair tied up and
00:36:45
looking scared but I think that was during the sessions yeah but even but that's even scary too because you're
00:36:51
like it's right before yeah like it's right before that's those are her final moments I don't know her I like don't
00:36:58
have a connection to her other than this case I do I shouldn't see that like that's not for my eyes yeah it's one of
00:37:05
those things it's like I feel like my opinion on crime scene photos have shifted a lot yeah as we've gone through
00:37:13
this podcast I think honestly no I'm looking at so many I think it's like it's changed the way I view them and I
00:37:19
think I kind of look at looking at these I was like yeah I don't I don't think I'm supposed to see that I think it's a
00:37:24
little inhumane personally because I said to Elena I was like if that if I knew that article was out there and that
00:37:30
had happened to you like I had to literally put myself in that situation and I was like flicking through an
00:37:35
article and I saw like you yeah like crying on a blanket about to be I brutally strangled the one I couldn't
00:37:42
imagine being your family and seeing that and two I couldn't imagine being your family and knowing how many people
00:37:47
had clicked on that article and saw you like my like I'm gonna cry right here in
00:37:53
your final Moment Like that's that's not that's not Republican yeah consumption it really is a chain like a photo it
00:38:01
changed is on my view a lot a photo is a lot it is and I think it's because I don't know I don't know these ones
00:38:09
these ones changed a lot of my view because they're different they're different kind of crime scene photo they
00:38:15
are they're not of a dead body they're not of a graphic in the in the bloody or gory sense of the word but these ones
00:38:24
are like emotionally graphic they are and and I'm not used to that you know like that like seeing someone like
00:38:31
um I don't know it's just it's like these ones bum me out I don't think all crime scene photos bum me out yeah these
00:38:39
ones just like hit different you're just like oof like I think I don't know and they're taken by him and that I don't
00:38:46
know that's some like because crime scene photos in general are usually taken by police officers or crime scene
00:38:52
technicians obviously in like autopsy photos and all those those feel more clinical and a little more like a fish I
00:38:58
don't know well no and I think that's exactly what we're getting at here is that like these aren't clinical these
00:39:04
weren't to assess anything at the scene no these were for him these were for him
00:39:08
and now we're looking at them and not like we're not sitting there like staring at them but like if you read an
00:39:13
article about this it'll pop up you're probably gonna see one but yeah I think that's what it is I think it's that
00:39:19
they're they were taken by him yeah and then they're the finals that's upsetting
00:39:24
these women's lives yeah because I can just you look at the angle they're taking you're like he's just standing
00:39:28
over them it's just I don't know it's I didn't like It's upsetting I just want you guys to know that if you if you
00:39:34
stumble across them because you likely will if you look up this case they're kind of everywhere oh if you Google his
00:39:38
name it's like some of them are like in the first three and they look like they're not real but they're very real
00:39:43
yeah um but yeah it's definitely the the photographer that bothers me I don't like that we're looking at it through
00:39:50
his because we're looking at it through his eyes and I don't like that no uh but
00:39:54
yeah that's just the evolution of our view on crime scene photos um but the discovery of these photos and
00:40:00
the trophies that were in the toolbox that was all detectives needed to tie the three murders to Harvey yeah boom
00:40:07
here they are thank you for that box the pictures he knew it at this point so he
00:40:12
was like yep so it almost seemed again like he was detectives thought he seemed relieved to be caught
00:40:20
hmm I don't know if this has to do with some kind of like you know psychology here that he was
00:40:26
feeling like an urge that could not be tampered so he was feeling like I need to be stopped okay I don't know if I
00:40:35
agree with that from what I've read about him but like who am I I wasn't there well and there's so much weird
00:40:42
psychology that we just don't even know about when it comes to people killing people yeah especially serial killers
00:40:48
that I think it could be anything finally I think it does it was definitely clear that he was beginning
00:40:53
to lose lose it and he was beginning to lose his grasp on normal reality and being able
00:41:00
to play the two sides of his life which were I'm a TV repairman no I'm this and it's like I think he wasn't able to
00:41:07
straddle that line anymore and so I think because he was unable to control his urges anymore that was becoming an
00:41:13
issue and maybe that's why they saw it as him being relieved but I don't know um but now that he was safely in custody
00:41:20
he began telling to telling detectives just every detail about the murders and they said and this is why I kind of like
00:41:27
go back and forth he was almost boasting about how he'd found the women and lured
00:41:33
them to their death well what I was gonna say too actually and it's perfect that you just said that maybe he was
00:41:39
also like in a weird way excited that this was all gonna like he was finally gonna get his
00:41:44
big moment and finally he was gonna be seen by women across the world and that were going to be afraid of him yeah you
00:41:50
know maybe that was the reason I could definitely see that it was a relief of I'm Not Invisible anymore yeah
00:41:54
absolutely because he did mention before he wanted to do something different right and he wanted to be famous and
00:41:59
then here you go yup now the evidence in the toolbox according to him was kept so
00:42:05
that if he was ever caught he would be convicted um he said I quote I didn't have the
00:42:11
guts enough to give myself up I wanted to but I just couldn't this of course was a lie like I don't
00:42:18
believe that's a lie I he did not keep now that was according to him remember yeah he did not keep that toolbox just
00:42:25
to get convicted that's not what that was he wanted to try Harvey that was trophies that was you because you were
00:42:33
reliving them you wanted to open it you wanted to touch it you wanted to think about it you wanted to be back at that
00:42:38
place shut the [ __ ] up with this I wanted to be convicted I just didn't have the guts to determine shut up shut
00:42:44
up yeah just admit that you're a disgusting little worm person and that you like to open this toolbox and touch
00:42:52
all the things that you had taken from these women and look at these photographs of them in their last
00:42:56
moments and go back to that moment and go back to that moment just admit it you disgusting little worm yeah admit it but
00:43:02
he won't he's gonna sit there and pretend that he just wanted to get caught and this it's ridiculous
00:43:08
now Harvey was determined not to go back to prison he definitely didn't he immediately asked for the death penalty
00:43:15
he was like I don't want to I don't want a prison sentence okay uh it's not really about what you want right now
00:43:23
but cool so after the confession he agreed to take the detectives out to the desert into the crude grave sites of
00:43:31
Shirley and Ruth I'm glad to remember Judy was found and were they able to be like put to a final resting place they
00:43:37
were but when they did unearth The Remains the San Diego coroner Al Gallagher said that the remains were
00:43:43
quote little more than a bag of bones that's really which is very sad now on November 5th 1958 he was taken to
00:43:51
the San Diego County Sheriff's Office and he kept right on confessing but this time they recorded it so they have a
00:43:57
whole record of it he went through the details of each murder how he did it and he insisted he had two motives and this
00:44:05
is when he talks about this he said quote my primary motive I did want to take some pictures
00:44:11
which is like that's not a motive dude like that's not your gross nothing like you can take photos and not murder
00:44:17
people he said but aside from that I was interested in having sexual relations relations
00:44:23
wow so you were interested in raping exactly why don't you why don't you call it what it is because you can have
00:44:28
sexual relations if you build a relationship with somebody which like you should have taken a crack at that
00:44:33
but you never literally never did and that's what kills me it's like you're an idiot because it's like you you even
00:44:40
signed up for a lonely hearts thing you could have you went out with Shirley you
00:44:44
were on a date with her if you had liked her she seemed like a nice nice woman you could have gone on several dates and
00:44:52
you could have gotten to know each other and then she would have been comfortable
00:44:56
maybe becoming more intimate with you later that's how you do things he wanted what he wanted he wanted and he wanted
00:45:01
to take it exactly and it's like [ __ ] you stop calling it sexual relations that's not say you wanted to rape women
00:45:08
because you didn't want to have sex with them no because if you did you would have formulated a relationship and had
00:45:14
consensual sex with people yup but no you wanted to take it you wanted to rape exactly you disgusting a little worm but
00:45:21
he went into such a scary movie he's so disgusting he went into graphic detail he included his [ __ ] thoughts about
00:45:27
the how he thought some of the women enjoyed themselves with him that's so [ __ ] Beyond so foul so foul like wow
00:45:36
he said he didn't use a gun because it he didn't use a gun to kill them because it would be traced back to his gun and
00:45:42
he said strangling left less physical evidence I also don't necessarily think that's true I think I don't think so I
00:45:48
think he maybe discovered that along the way but I think no matter what the Rope
00:45:52
would have been involved somehow because it had been involved since he was three
00:45:54
years old ding ding ding that's literally my next thing he just it was a fetish yeah this was his fetish yeah a
00:46:03
dangerous one and like this was one that was like Beyond right and sure I'm sure
00:46:07
he realized like when he got that gun you know oh I probably shouldn't shoot this because it could be traced back to
00:46:12
me but that was the primary that wasn't the the exactly like the primary thing was he enjoyed using a rope that's how
00:46:20
that's how he likes to do it yeah that's like it's and you know what he had that
00:46:24
since like that pre-election since he was very young right obviously like you said I don't even think he he might not
00:46:31
have even recognized that that was what it was yeah but it that was what it was exactly it absolutely was but the
00:46:39
confession went on for hours until he had finally given every single detail of the crimes against the four women and
00:46:45
then he was returned to his cell where he was immediately put on suicide watch because he had made several comments
00:46:51
about potentially killing himself right now from the moment he was arrested San Diego and Los Angeles prosecutors
00:46:58
constantly had to worry about him taking his own life because he was constantly talking about it and
00:47:06
they were also worried about him making a pretty convincing bid for the insanity
00:47:10
defense yeah they were worried about that um and they didn't want him to possibly
00:47:15
win his freedom back no no no no no no no no so Ophelia actually prior to his arraignment Ophelia his mom visited him
00:47:24
in jail and on her way out of the jail she said to the Press talk to any of the people in the jail he is not Vicious
00:47:31
he's sick Ophelia don't say anything Ophelia I say so much less if that's what you're going to say he's not
00:47:41
vicious don't say anything so disrespectful to anyone who was related to one of those women who were
00:47:50
viciously attacked viciously raped and viciously murdered he spent on his own admission five to ten minutes strangling
00:47:59
them until there was no signs of life that in and of itself that little like that's not a little part of what he did
00:48:05
but that small piece of the full operation is vicious so vicious and he's a rapist exactly he's a rapist Ophelia
00:48:14
the entire operation abducting women is vicious like come on like I understand it's yourself or his mother and I
00:48:22
understand you wanting to say he is sick because in some sense he is sick and if
00:48:26
you want to just like sit around and say that to yourself to get by and make the
00:48:32
days go on by all means but don't put that into the public like where it's going to be like eaten up and don't
00:48:37
you'd report it on say he is not vicious no to the Press like don't say it that is just because he is that is minimizing
00:48:46
yeah like that's really [ __ ] such an insane level and don't say talk to any of the people in the jail I've said this
00:48:53
once I'll say it again Ophelia there's no women in that jail right he's in a jail with men right of course he's not
00:48:59
[ __ ] up in there why don't we talk to Lorraine and find out if he's vicious because she [ __ ] lived that you want
00:49:04
to ask her about it you want to look at the probably scar on her leg from when he shot her in the [ __ ] leg and he's
00:49:09
not vicious it's like come on man like girly girl I know I it's one of those things like I know you're his mother
00:49:16
yeah and I know that he's like yeah he is sick and I know this is a loss you know ins this is a tragedy for you as
00:49:22
well this is your child who has done this and I understand again saying he's sick yeah and I'm you know well you do
00:49:30
you whatever but just because he's not vicious that's like whoa dude like don't do that
00:49:37
[Music] so on November 8th 1958 a grand jury convened in the San Diego Courthouse
00:49:54
County Courthouse and he was indicted for the March 9th murder of Shirley Ann bridgeford and
00:49:59
July 24th murder of Ruth Mercado okay a few weeks later on November 21st he appeared before Judge John I think it's
00:50:07
hewicker in Department four of Superior Court he pled guilty and the sentencing was deferred until a later date but we
00:50:16
all knew that he was asking for the death penalty now again this was a death penalty case
00:50:22
that's what they were that was that was what was on the table so there was going
00:50:25
to be a lot of red tape Galore but in the meantime Ophelia just kept talking about Harvey
00:50:31
just being girl shy and not understanding how to be around one I don't think he's girl shy I think he's
00:50:36
raped several women at this point I don't really know if I would call that shy yeah and she was just ignoring the
00:50:42
assaults and robberies he had committed over the years just minimizing the straight up murder that he had committed
00:50:48
that's [ __ ] and Dr JP Hilton that first psychiatrist that evaluated Harvey when he was a child he actually wrote to
00:50:57
the probation officer and he said that yeah he did have trouble with women and said that he had become increasingly
00:51:03
aggressive towards females as he grew older so you know felia is trying to minimize and
00:51:09
this doctor's like uh yeah sure he does have trouble with women but that's making him aggressive towards them yeah
00:51:14
so they tried very hard to prove that he was simply mentally ill and not competent to stand trial but it wasn't
00:51:20
working okay good he was very clearly anti-social and very delusional yeah that is for sure but he was clear when
00:51:28
he was questioned you know that the before committing the murders he said that he was feeling some kind of way
00:51:36
about it right that alone is you saying I know what I was doing was wrong yeah but I went ahead and did it anyway
00:51:43
that's you saying I have a clear idea of what's right and wrong but I decided to
00:51:48
do it anyway and now I feel bad exactly like you he sold himself down the river even when he was lying so on December 15
00:51:55
1958 he appeared in the superior court for the sentencing and he definitely he told his lawyers do not
00:52:03
stop me from getting the death penalty but legally they had an obligation about some kind of Defense they couldn't just
00:52:09
be like sure so to make it harder to do that the prosecutor William Lowe he learned all about his criminal past you
00:52:18
know how dangerous he was to society when he was in New York how he was like the Phantom and like all that and they
00:52:25
presented a great case with all the confessions Witnesses they included testimony from Lorraine vigil in the end
00:52:32
he was found guilty of two counts of first-degree murder and again he wanted to be executed at the earliest possible
00:52:38
date but neither Harvey nor his attorney had anything to say when the verdict was
00:52:44
given they were like I'm not speaking because I don't want to be executed what are you going to say at that point
00:52:49
anyway like even I'm sorry but it's too but he's not even gonna say that judge hewicker actually had a lot to say
00:52:55
though I love when the judge has a lot to say yeah he had been sitting here he had listened to the entire entire thing
00:53:01
he heard the detailed descriptions of how he had murdered these women and after everything had gone down he said
00:53:07
this I know there are a lot of people people in high places that don't believe in capital punishment now if life
00:53:14
imprisonment in California meant life imprisonment that would be one thing life imprisonment in this state means
00:53:20
confinement for seven years or more and when I say more it depends on the past record of the defendant if a law could
00:53:27
be passed and placed in the Constitution so that each legislature couldn't come along and modify it if they made life
00:53:34
imprisonment life imprisonment without the possibility or of Pardon or parole that would be one thing but we don't
00:53:40
have that we will never have it and there are some crimes that are so revolting that in my opinion there is
00:53:47
only one penalty that can be imposed and that penalty is the death penalty yeah which I understand what he's saying
00:53:53
about the life imprisonment thing I do too because I mean we've said this a million times about we're gray yeah that
00:53:59
we're gray on the I'm leaning more towards against it but I I do get that that it's like yeah it would be nice if
00:54:06
life imprisonment was a thing for these [ __ ] but a lot of times that's not yeah even when you get sentenced to life
00:54:11
it's not even life exactly and so after this was said the clerk said Harvey Murray glattman you are have heretofore
00:54:18
been charged in an indictment by the grand jury of this County to which you have heretofore entered a plea of guilty
00:54:24
as to both counts and it is ordered that the death sentence be imposed Harvey was
00:54:30
sent to San Quentin prison in uh January 1959 he sat on death row but we know that's never the end because any death
00:54:37
penalty case triggers an automatic appeal to be heard from the Superior Court his was found was heard by the
00:54:44
Supreme Court of uh California on June 5th 1959. so he did appeal it's like an automatic appeal oh yeah here's an
00:54:52
automatic appeal they reviewed the evidence they found that there was no error in anything no they upheld
00:54:58
everything at 10 A.M on September 18 1959 he was led from his cell to the gas chamber at San Quentin he was seated
00:55:07
strapped into a chair at 10 03 am the cyanide tab was dropped releasing gas into the room he apparently according to
00:55:15
Witnesses started inhaling very deeply people think that that was probably the reason for and what happens in these
00:55:23
scenarios is you just kind of watched the pulse go sure and it plummeted he was pronounced dead at 10 12 a.m so from
00:55:32
1003 to 10 12 is how long it took that's not very long I don't know how long these those things normally take but I
00:55:39
was like whoa so that was the end of Harvey glattman bye but if you remember throughout the
00:55:47
second half of the if you remember I'm like if you remember throughout the second half of the 20th century I can't
00:55:53
remember that I think I do yeah California became a place of lots of serial killers right cray in the bright
00:55:59
bright many serial killers and a lot of times as we got later and later they got
00:56:04
those crazy you know monikers in the Press when we couldn't identify them and it kind of was like an epidemic like it
00:56:12
seemed like for a while but in 1958 when all this was going on nobody really could even conceive of a harvey glattman
00:56:21
you know like this this was a monster that we had not yet studied and not yet understood yeah not that we were going
00:56:28
to understand but obviously he eventually got a nickname like the glamor girl Slayer because
00:56:33
everybody always attributes a nickname to it but when it was going on he really it wasn't a huge story it was like it
00:56:41
was a big story but it wasn't what it would be now it wasn't sensationalized or what it would be in like the 70s or
00:56:46
the 80s you know like any of those but in April of 1954 after he had been released then this episode before he had
00:56:54
started this Killing Spree yeah it was after he had been released from sing-sing okay and before he'd moved
00:57:01
from California that little span of time yeah yeah there was a body discovered oh
00:57:06
[ __ ] in that span of time where he was out of prison not in California and this
00:57:10
body was discovered in Boulder Hills which is just a short drive from Denver if you remember he was living in
00:57:17
Colorado yeah so this was a nude body of a young woman this woman was a Jane Doe
00:57:22
for more than 50 years oh my God until 2008 when investigators in Colorado said that they were tentatively identifying
00:57:32
her as Catherine E ferrand Dyer which was a young woman who lived in a Denver boarding house not far from where Harvey
00:57:40
was staying with his parents oh [ __ ] now the investigation had been reported a
00:57:45
short time earlier after various exchanges of information on a public message board that linked this Jane Doe
00:57:52
to Harvey gladman people were starting to talk about it the reason was the timeline fit the
00:57:59
methods fit and a lot of The Facts of the case were fitting facts like Jane Doe had been hit by a car just shortly
00:58:05
before her death and the measurements of the vehicle were the exact match of Henry of Harvey's car at the time wow
00:58:12
and even more to add to that when you're like hit by a car like yeah because I'm
00:58:16
like what during his interrogation in Orange County detectives asked Harvey about his time in Colorado and he
00:58:24
explained that he had photographed some women in Colorado while in Denver and when detectives the detectives were
00:58:31
basically like are they dead or are they alive did you leave them alive he was like no they were mostly he's like I
00:58:36
think they were all alive and then he smirked and said unless they've been run over oh
00:58:43
yep oh sh unless they've been run over and this girl was hit by a car why would you
00:58:50
like why would he say that like and he smirked wow add to this the newly conducted
00:58:56
autopsy found that the young woman had been bound at the wrist and ankles in exactly the same way that he would bind
00:59:04
his other victims right and it's fits his Mo but obviously Harvey had been long dead by this time by the time she's
00:59:10
identified and it kind of seemed like they were never gonna connect the necessary dots but a year after Colorado
00:59:16
detectives first said that they identified this body that this is wild the real Catherine Dyer
00:59:24
was found alive in in Queensland Australia okay so they had falsely identified this
00:59:33
now apparently at this point care workers were preparing to move this woman they
00:59:38
knew as Barbara into an assisted living facility when they did that they came across a ton of items that belonged to
00:59:45
someone named Catherine Dyer they dug a little deeper and they learned that Barbara was in fact
00:59:51
Catherine Dyer she had disappeared from Colorado more than a half century earlier and they
00:59:58
were like what the [ __ ] is going on but she wouldn't talk about it like she didn't want to say why she had
01:00:02
disappeared she didn't want to say any of that so there was a press briefing on this story and Boulder detective uh
01:00:08
Steve Ainsworth said Catherine Dyer was quote quite a mysterious person even before she disappeared there is not a
01:00:15
lot known about her life I think for some reason she didn't want to be found okay now that's interesting so you're
01:00:21
like wow okay what's happening in and of itself now Ainsworth that detective he remained committed to identifying this
01:00:28
Boulder Falls Jane Doe and in June in the fall of 2019 or excuse me fall of 2009 through DNA technology he was able
01:00:38
to identify the remains as Dorothy gay Howard who was a 16 year old runaway from Phoenix Arizona 16. yep it was
01:00:47
actually in 2004 that historian historian Sylvia pettum took to the like she took some interest in this case yeah
01:00:54
Jane Doe and she asked if they could exhume the Jane Doe's body and she was able to get her like they
01:01:00
were able to do it like official permission to do it and then they were able to reconstruct what she looked like
01:01:05
and when they did that they published this reconstruction in an article um with like Sylvia's stuff about it and
01:01:13
it was seen by Dorothy's grand niece Michelle that's how she was found to be that because she was like that's Dorothy
01:01:20
like she had no other story about her and she got in touch with authorities gave her DNA they connected them and
01:01:28
were able to identify this Jane Doe that and so was she definitely murdered by Harvey they think now Ainsworth so
01:01:34
that's the problem so Ainsworth believes Dorothy had run away that's why she was
01:01:39
in Colorado she ran away from um her husband in Phoenix like a bad situation and had come to Denver to visit an aunt
01:01:46
and a week later she disappeared Without a Trace now they said around this time scores of
01:01:53
women and girls had banished around this time in Boulder Canyon the majority of which are unsolved wow officials truly
01:02:03
believe she is a victim of Harvey glattman and they have not been able to confirm it unless they got run over he
01:02:09
didn't say like he unless they got like he was talking about multiple people so maybe he changed his I would be willing
01:02:14
to bet that some of these women are some of his first kills wow I would be willing to bet that that's the thing
01:02:21
because even like the first one in California he did seem to know what he was doing and he did seem to have
01:02:28
confidence and that's the thing and like Tay and he like went right to her apartment even yeah Judy and dull
01:02:34
it seemed like he was pretty confident like you said like he I think you're right I think he had done
01:02:41
this before in some other capacity yeah and he found what worked wow because the fact that he drove her
01:02:49
out to the desert this guy drove like a hundred miles away right to the desert he had the blanket in his back in his
01:02:56
trunk he had the Rope he had it all set up he did the same thing for each one he
01:03:00
had done that and figured it out why did he did he did leave Colorado pretty abruptly that's what I was thinking why
01:03:07
did you leave right he had he really had no reason to go out to California he left because he figured he could do it
01:03:13
out there now wow and because he'd already been arrested in Cal in in Colorado and he had already photographed
01:03:19
women in Colorado right so he had already started that whole shtick so I got to start somewhere and it's like now
01:03:25
he knows if he goes to La he can get even more women even easier through that whole stick holy [ __ ] so he had
01:03:31
perfected his way I guarantee you I'm like let's DNA test these but like let's figure this out I need to like
01:03:37
nail this [ __ ] with more people because I want to know I know he's done more such a wild story
01:03:44
yeah I I know this story and like I knew most of it but I did not know about that
01:03:49
last piece that is another victim that could potentially many of that Art Is It just fits Too Perfect the fact that like
01:03:57
the fact she was hit by a car and it matched the measurements of his car the fact that she was bound in exactly the
01:04:03
same way she was very pretty and then he said that and then the fact that he said
01:04:07
he had photographed women in Colorado and he had left them alive unless they got hit by a car like are you [ __ ]
01:04:15
like why would you pull that out of your ass like why did he say that Holy he said that because he knows you're not
01:04:20
going to catch him [ __ ] Harvey glattman damn disgusting little worm boy bye [ __ ] bye Harvey wow
01:04:29
I feel like I need something like spooky after that I know oh I was crazy I need
01:04:35
some spooky I'll do a listener tail yeah we'll get a listener tail between there
01:04:39
perfect but then you're getting more Carnage so yeah stay tuned a rough one yeah so stay tuned I like a sad one it's
01:04:45
a very different murder case my next my next case that's unfortunate yeah yeah you know yeah but um yeah so we hope
01:04:54
that you keep listening and you'll hear all of that and we hope you keep it we weird but not so weird that you say that
01:05:01
you hope that someone didn't get hit by a car if you know full well that you hit
01:05:04
them with your car and also don't kill people bye [Music] hey Prime members you can listen to
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