00:00:06
hey weirdos I'm Elina and I'm Ash and
00:00:10
this is
00:00:11
[Music]
00:00:22
morbid it do be sorry I had to swallow
00:00:25
like spit before I said that cute
00:00:27
apologetic I am
00:00:31
okay okay Dr
00:00:33
Seuss
00:00:35
apolog oh yeah y did you just hear that
00:00:39
I just said
00:00:41
yada instead of
00:00:43
Yoda oh I got to go
00:00:46
y baby yada my boy yada my boy yada yada
00:00:49
y That's yada yada yada I like that I
00:00:52
feel Delirious today yeah we didn't get
00:00:54
a lot of sleep last night in my house
00:00:56
I'm not really sure why like nothing
00:00:58
happened that upset anyone to their
00:01:01
degree of not being able to sleep just a
00:01:03
restless night restless night for
00:01:05
everyone I hate that not for me yeah it
00:01:07
was like Mass hysteria in my house I
00:01:09
don't know what happened damn I mean you
00:01:10
have kids that's just like life with
00:01:12
children every day I last night had a
00:01:14
terrifying moment that like nothing
00:01:16
became of it but it's pretty
00:01:19
underwhelming but I'm trying to let me
00:01:22
let me talk about it I'm trying to I'm
00:01:24
trying to sleep with the TV off because
00:01:27
all my life science my entire life I
00:01:29
have slept with the TV on and it's like
00:01:31
not great for you and I do notice a
00:01:33
better sleep with it off M um so yeah
00:01:36
I've been trying to do that but before I
00:01:38
went to sleep not last night even the
00:01:40
other night I saw this Tik Tok from the
00:01:43
appalachin mountains of the and it's I
00:01:45
don't know like who knows what's real
00:01:46
and what's not anymore this will do it
00:01:49
this will [ __ ] do it yeah this will
00:01:50
do it as soon as you said the appalachin
00:01:52
Tik Tok I said uhoh yeah have you ever
00:01:54
seen you guys out there cuz I already
00:01:56
talked to Elena about this and I
00:01:57
confirmed I have have you ever seen
00:01:59
those vide where people are like oh my
00:02:01
God just sitting in my bedroom and like
00:02:03
I see these creatures in my backyard
00:02:04
staring at me and it's like these like
00:02:07
[ __ ]
00:02:09
terrifying almost like dementor but like
00:02:12
scarier looking things with like long
00:02:14
black hair and like white night gown
00:02:17
sort of or like maybe just like white
00:02:19
skin like Abyss skin sort of Abyss skin
00:02:23
Abyss skin a bisc you know I like that
00:02:25
just floating and like in a basket but a
00:02:28
bisc it's just like that but like just
00:02:30
staring at you like they're gonna pretty
00:02:32
much kill you yeah so I got one of like
00:02:35
a couple of those Tik toks and [ __ ]
00:02:37
Drew it's our it's our cute little thing
00:02:38
at night we lay in bed and we scroll Tik
00:02:40
Tok but that was a horrible one to end
00:02:42
on and then in the middle of the night I
00:02:45
woke up and it was of course ready ready
00:02:47
say it with me 3:00 a.m. oh 3:00 a.m.
00:02:50
sorry yeah that's fine I was like pitch
00:02:53
black you're like we didn't prepare this
00:02:56
sorry again I'm tired I'm not on point
00:02:58
it was 3:00 a.m. of course
00:03:00
and I it was so and it was pitch black
00:03:02
so you were on the right thing and then
00:03:05
I just was convinced that there was
00:03:06
going to be those ladies in my room and
00:03:08
I got so scared and I woke Drew up and I
00:03:10
was like give me the clicker I don't
00:03:12
blame you on that one now I'm just I was
00:03:14
on the treadmill this morning [ __ ]
00:03:16
terrified that they were behind me cuz
00:03:18
there's like two empty rooms behind me
00:03:20
which I don't love when I'm on my
00:03:22
treadmill I need to like move it so
00:03:23
there's a wall behind me yeah any want
00:03:25
empty space I'm paranoid about
00:03:27
Appalachia you know aren't we all
00:03:30
yeah I think that's valid I think people
00:03:32
in Appalachia would tell us we're we're
00:03:35
doing the right thing by being paranoid
00:03:37
about it let us know because you hear
00:03:39
even if it's like even if it's like you
00:03:41
know folklore to me is like horror it's
00:03:45
very interesting but man it'll get you
00:03:48
it'll get you and Appalachia is like
00:03:51
just lousy with folklore lousy like the
00:03:54
whole like if you hear they'll be like
00:03:56
if you hear you know a whistle outside
00:03:59
you better get inside and it's like and
00:04:02
then you'll be like why and they're like
00:04:04
can't tell you can't tell you and you're
00:04:06
like and then they're like Johnny Johnny
00:04:10
boy here knows why and then you're like
00:04:12
Johnny Boy why and he's like I've been
00:04:14
sworn to secrecy he actually just shakes
00:04:16
his head because he doesn't even talk
00:04:17
anymore after his ordeal you're like why
00:04:19
don't you talk and he's like I can't
00:04:21
talk to tell you he just shrugs at you
00:04:24
yeah M and he throws away the key and
00:04:27
here's the thing I respect it I respect
00:04:29
it so deeply I respect it so hard but
00:04:32
you know where you're not going to find
00:04:33
me
00:04:34
abach no baby no baby oh I'm even like
00:04:38
freaked out now just that we talked
00:04:39
about it and it's the middle of the day
00:04:41
yeah oh anyway I don't think I'll be
00:04:43
sleeping with the TV off anymore yeah I
00:04:45
mean you gave I really tried you gave
00:04:47
healthy sleeping habits a try and it
00:04:50
didn't work out oh my God also just
00:04:52
another thing about me sorry I'm really
00:04:54
self- serving lately take it it back you
00:04:56
know whatever you know that oh did did
00:04:59
you talk about that alarm clock on here
00:05:01
that we were talking about together or
00:05:02
was that a private conversation I know
00:05:04
we had a private conversation about it
00:05:06
we have so many conversations and I'm
00:05:07
like which one was private and which one
00:05:09
was on air yes it's not private it's
00:05:12
just she found this really cool alarm
00:05:13
clock yes can I tell you all about it do
00:05:15
you mind if I encroach on you for no no
00:05:17
I motioned at you it's your Discovery so
00:05:20
I'm telling you guys I've been
00:05:22
researching like Sunrise alarm clocks
00:05:25
for months and months and months and
00:05:27
they just intrigued me the idea it's the
00:05:28
idea is that
00:05:30
you are waking up not to
00:05:32
like and like jolting you out of deep
00:05:35
sleep instead what Sunrise alarm clocks
00:05:37
do is they have a warm Sunrise effect
00:05:40
that happens like a light yeah and it
00:05:43
slowly Rises and gets brighter like a
00:05:45
sunrise and also you can set it to like
00:05:47
birds
00:05:48
chirping a bubbling brook or something
00:05:51
you know what I mean like something very
00:05:52
just very calm peaceful and I was
00:05:55
intrigued by this idea cuz it tricks it
00:05:57
basically like makes your Cadian Rhythm
00:06:00
go into like a lighter sleep for a bit
00:06:04
and then it will wake you when out of
00:06:06
that lighter sleep so when you wake up
00:06:08
you feel more rested natur way to wake
00:06:12
up exactly and so I was intrigued by it
00:06:15
I I was reading all this stuff about it
00:06:16
and I was like you know what I'm going
00:06:17
to give one a try because I really
00:06:19
[ __ ] hate waking up to a jarring
00:06:20
alarm and I was waking up like pissed so
00:06:24
like I immediately like [ __ ] this so I
00:06:27
tried it and I got the Phillips one
00:06:30
and it was like a Christmas birthday
00:06:33
present to myself I was like let's do
00:06:34
this let's wake up with the goddamn son
00:06:37
and so she's natural I'm natural guys it
00:06:42
[ __ ] works yeah and I'm telling you
00:06:45
it is the like most refreshed and calm I
00:06:50
have ever woken up in my life and I've
00:06:51
done it for like almost a week now it is
00:06:54
lovely yeah you just wake up and you
00:06:57
don't know why you're waking up because
00:06:59
you don't hear anything yeah and then
00:07:01
when you do hear something it's just
00:07:02
birds tweeting you know what that must
00:07:04
be [ __ ] great I wouldn't know yeah I
00:07:07
wouldn't know why would you know I got
00:07:09
one and I set it all up last night but
00:07:11
my dumbass didn't realize that I set it
00:07:13
up in military time oh I did that too at
00:07:16
first I can show you how to change it I
00:07:19
need I need you to tell me how to change
00:07:20
it cuz I set it I set it I set it I
00:07:23
don't know why I just said it like
00:07:25
that leave it in I said it and I made it
00:07:29
you know 9:00 p.m. cuz that's the time
00:07:31
it was yeah and then when I woke up at
00:07:33
3:00 a.m. and was like oh God there's an
00:07:35
Appalachian woman in my room an it was
00:07:38
like 15:00 and I was like what I was so
00:07:42
confused you're like wait there's an
00:07:43
eldrich Horror in my world and then
00:07:46
you're like and it's 15:00 what I like
00:07:48
I'm in an alternate universe
00:07:51
[ __ ]
00:07:52
[ __ ] but
00:07:56
but in at 3:00 a.m. I wasn't going to I
00:07:59
I you I came to after I was in alterate
00:08:01
Universe [ __ ] I was like oh military
00:08:03
time don't know how to do that and I
00:08:06
also was like I'm not fixing this
00:08:07
problem at 3: a.m. so I just set my
00:08:09
regular stupid alarm on my phone and
00:08:11
woke up to
00:08:14
like was angry it was angry uh I could
00:08:17
teach you how to take it out of military
00:08:19
time but if you ever need to tell
00:08:20
military time you just subtract two so
00:08:23
15:00 would be like you take from the 5
00:08:26
so 532 it's 3:00 oh you know who's told
00:08:30
me that
00:08:31
740 bajillion times Drew yeah and every
00:08:35
time I come across military time I don't
00:08:38
remember that I the only reason I know
00:08:40
why to how to use it is when I was
00:08:42
taking criminal justice classes and they
00:08:44
made you do like fake police reports and
00:08:46
they would make you do it in military
00:08:47
time yeah here's the thing though I
00:08:49
don't want to do math I just want to
00:08:51
know what time it is that was my problem
00:08:53
was I looked over and I realized it was
00:08:55
military time before I went to bed and I
00:08:57
was like oh I'm not doing math in the
00:08:58
middle of the night so I was like no I
00:09:01
need to just set and I figured out how
00:09:03
I'll help you yeah it's it's a little
00:09:04
bit complicated but I you know I'm
00:09:05
looking forward to waking up with the
00:09:07
sun it's worth it in my own time I'm
00:09:09
telling you guys it's very worth it it
00:09:11
has changed my wake up feelings I'm
00:09:14
excited um we'll talk you know we'll
00:09:16
have a private conversation off fair and
00:09:18
maybe we'll forget we had that we'll
00:09:20
have it again um low key we can we can
00:09:22
get into it now I was I was putting it
00:09:24
off a little bit because we are covering
00:09:26
if you you know have clicked on this
00:09:27
episode you know that we're covering
00:09:29
Rodney Alcala The Dating Game Killer
00:09:32
yeah I had a very surface knowledge of
00:09:36
this case like and when I tell you so
00:09:39
surface it was barely even you know I
00:09:42
don't know I think a lot of people do
00:09:44
yeah and included yeah so I saw you know
00:09:47
that movie and I was like oh cool like
00:09:49
that's an interesting case I'd like to
00:09:51
cover that so I told Dave and Dave was
00:09:52
like are you sure and I said yeah we
00:09:54
should have known then we should have
00:09:56
known then it's obviously a case that
00:09:58
should be told cuz these people deserve
00:10:00
to have their story told but it is
00:10:04
brutal it is very
00:10:07
grome uh a lot of these women were
00:10:10
unfortunately raped so we're going to
00:10:12
that that's something we're going to be
00:10:13
talking about um so I am going to break
00:10:15
this up I think into three parts yeah um
00:10:19
just you know it makes it a little
00:10:20
easier to digest in smaller parts and
00:10:23
there's a lot to cover yeah so this is
00:10:25
going to be part one part one I think is
00:10:26
definitely going to be a little bit
00:10:28
shorter than Parts two and three but it
00:10:31
kind of sets the sets the scene so let's
00:10:35
start even somewhat kind of in the
00:10:37
middle I would say and a lot of people
00:10:39
will know this as The Dating Game Killer
00:10:41
case so that's what we're starting yeah
00:10:44
when Cheryl Bradshaw appeared on the
00:10:46
popular game show The Dating Game In
00:10:48
1978 she was very Charmed by Bachelor
00:10:51
number one Rodney Alcala and by the end
00:10:54
of the episode she had actually chosen
00:10:55
to pick him as her date but just minutes
00:10:58
after the episode finished taping she
00:11:00
actually met him in person backstage and
00:11:03
she was immediately uncomfortable and
00:11:06
actually quickly contacted producers of
00:11:08
the show to cancel the date immediately
00:11:10
this is the craziest part to me it was
00:11:12
just a gut instinct she had and it just
00:11:15
I don't know what happened during that
00:11:16
conversation but something struck her
00:11:19
and she she went with her gut which you
00:11:21
have to applaud thank goodness she did
00:11:23
mhm she called the contestant
00:11:25
coordinator uh Ellen mezer I believe is
00:11:27
how you say her name the day after
00:11:29
filming and she said Ellen I can't go
00:11:30
out with this guy there's weird Vibes
00:11:32
that are coming off of him he's very
00:11:34
strange I'm not comfortable is that
00:11:36
going to be a problem luckily Ellen was
00:11:38
like nope is not going to be an issue at
00:11:40
all you don't have to do anything you
00:11:41
don't want to do she said trust your gut
00:11:42
girl that's fine now what Cheryl
00:11:45
Bradshaw didn't know at that time was
00:11:47
that in cancelling the date she had
00:11:49
narrowly avoided spending an evening in
00:11:51
the company of one of America's most
00:11:53
notorious serial killers at the time of
00:11:56
his appearance on The Dating Game in
00:11:58
1978 Rodney alala was already a
00:12:01
convicted sexual predator which just
00:12:04
goes to show you you know what work went
00:12:06
into vetting people back then yeah
00:12:07
that's what's so horrifying yeah he had
00:12:09
already served time for sexual assault
00:12:11
and also had avoided a charge of
00:12:14
attempted murder on a small
00:12:17
technicality and was able to be a
00:12:19
contestant on the show that's
00:12:22
unbelievable luckily times have changed
00:12:24
yeah after his arrest though
00:12:25
investigators would learn that by the
00:12:27
time he did appear on the game show he
00:12:29
was also a killer he had killed many
00:12:31
women at that point in the year that
00:12:33
followed Alcala would go on to murder
00:12:35
several other women until he was finally
00:12:37
caught and luckily I'll tell you right
00:12:38
at the top convicted for his crimes
00:12:40
thank goodness ultimately he was found
00:12:43
guilty of eight murders and various
00:12:45
other crimes but he is suspected of many
00:12:47
other murders some people believe as
00:12:49
many as a hundred or possibly even more
00:12:53
Jesus yeah he is
00:12:56
vicious luckily he's dead
00:12:59
thank goodness I just sometimes you got
00:13:01
to give you that right at the top you
00:13:02
got rest and distress rest and distress
00:13:05
you absolute piece of [ __ ] yep so let's
00:13:08
go back to his you know uh Roots I guess
00:13:12
yeah even though we don't want to
00:13:14
Rodrigo Rodney Alcala buor I believe
00:13:17
it's how you say his last name uh he was
00:13:19
born August 23rd 1943 in San Antonio
00:13:22
Texas he was one of four children born
00:13:24
to Anna Maria Gutierrez and Raul aala
00:13:28
bukur by all accounts the family enjoyed
00:13:30
a pretty normal middle class life in San
00:13:33
Antonio all of the alala children
00:13:36
attended Catholic school and Rodney did
00:13:38
really well in school he worked really
00:13:41
hard he maintained really great grades
00:13:43
like no warning signs really yeah none
00:13:47
of Rodney's teachers would ever remember
00:13:48
him being a problem student actually on
00:13:50
the contrary they said that he was
00:13:52
considered respectful and kind and they
00:13:55
all said that he was among the most
00:13:56
intelligent children in the class wow
00:13:59
crazy now in 1951 Rodney's grandmother
00:14:03
did sadly become terminally ill and she
00:14:05
wanted to return to Mexico to live out
00:14:07
her final years so the family packed up
00:14:09
everything they owned and they moved
00:14:10
across the border despite the obvious
00:14:13
differences you know in culture and
00:14:14
everything it seems like life in Mexico
00:14:16
was pretty happy for the Alcala family
00:14:18
at least for the first few years in 1954
00:14:21
when Rodney was just 11 his grandmother
00:14:24
who he had always been really close to
00:14:26
ended up passing away and of course that
00:14:28
left a giant hole in the family
00:14:30
structure yeah of course her passing was
00:14:33
then soon followed by the very abrupt
00:14:35
departure of Rodney's father who just
00:14:38
left the family one day and decided to
00:14:40
return to the US oh like he left them
00:14:43
with absolutely nothing he was the
00:14:45
provider of the family what the hell
00:14:47
left them with like nowhere to live left
00:14:49
Anna Maria to figure it all out and all
00:14:52
of those kids were just left without a
00:14:53
father wow and Rodney was 11 holy [ __ ]
00:14:57
what is interesting though is that
00:15:00
obviously I'm sure these experiences
00:15:02
were disruptive to him to some degree
00:15:04
and especially all the kids but for some
00:15:06
reason he seemed pretty unaffected by
00:15:09
both of these things his grandmother
00:15:10
dying and his father just leaving the
00:15:13
family and that's like a little
00:15:15
concerning in and of itself yeah
00:15:17
definely not that you want somebody to
00:15:18
be like traumatized by these
00:15:20
things being like holy unaffected is
00:15:22
like interesting yeah I feel like you
00:15:24
would be concerned yeah but it it was
00:15:28
also a very different time
00:15:29
so it kind of went without notice after
00:15:32
graduating from high school in 1960
00:15:35
Rodney followed his older brother's
00:15:36
footsteps and he decided to join the US
00:15:38
Army so he relocated to boot camp in
00:15:40
North Carolina where he trained as a
00:15:42
paratrooper and also took on additional
00:15:45
clerical work in 1962 while he was
00:15:48
training in North Carol uh North
00:15:50
Carolina almost said that with an accent
00:15:52
North Carolina I think that's what
00:15:53
happened and then I was like don't do
00:15:55
that like damn while he was training
00:15:56
there his father actually passed away
00:15:58
unexpect L even though you know Raul
00:16:01
just abandoned the entire family almost
00:16:04
10 years earlier at that point his
00:16:06
passing obviously affected his family
00:16:07
pretty deeply but just like with his
00:16:10
grandmother's passing years earlier
00:16:12
Rodney seemed pretty unfaced yeah
00:16:14
something's off something's definitely
00:16:16
off about a year after his father's
00:16:19
death is when he really started to
00:16:20
exhibit actually unusual behavior like
00:16:23
obviously that's pretty unusual but it
00:16:25
definitely picked up steam throughout
00:16:28
his life he had always been respectful
00:16:29
he followed rules and expectations that
00:16:31
had been set for him but that all
00:16:33
changed one evening in
00:16:35
1963 his mom was at her home in La
00:16:38
making dinner and Rodney just showed up
00:16:40
unexpectedly at her door which uh was
00:16:43
very strange because he had to have
00:16:45
hitch hitchhiked more than 3,000 miles
00:16:47
from North Carolina whoa yeah uh which
00:16:51
you know was strange in and of itself
00:16:53
yeah but even more uncharacteristic was
00:16:55
the fact that he just up and left the
00:16:57
military base with no permission so he
00:17:00
was technically awall oh yeah I was
00:17:01
going to say that's a very bad thing
00:17:04
yeah so Anamaria was able to convince
00:17:06
her son to turn himself in at the
00:17:07
nearest recruitment station and there he
00:17:10
was evaluated by an army psychiatrist
00:17:12
who at that point determined that Rodney
00:17:14
was actually in acute psychological
00:17:16
distress and had him admitted to the
00:17:18
nearest hospital for psychiatric
00:17:20
treatment oh boy but this seemed to came
00:17:23
this seemed to have come out of nowhere
00:17:24
yeah initially he was treated just at a
00:17:26
regular Hospital in San Francisco but he
00:17:29
was soon transferred to a military
00:17:30
facility just outside of Irvine
00:17:32
California and he was admitted for more
00:17:35
long in uh long-term impatient treatment
00:17:37
at that point okay now the triggering
00:17:41
event for all of this like essentially
00:17:42
his breakdown is remains unclear but
00:17:45
even at that time there were allegations
00:17:47
of sexual misconduct on his part okay so
00:17:50
I don't know if he did something and I
00:17:54
don't know that he necessarily would
00:17:55
have regretted it but maybe it was just
00:17:57
overwhelming to have done something
00:17:59
awful for the first time who knows but
00:18:02
after months of treatment it became
00:18:04
clear that he would no longer be able to
00:18:06
keep up with his responsibilities in the
00:18:08
military so in February of 1964 he was
00:18:11
given a medical discharge and at that
00:18:13
point a diagnosis of antisocial
00:18:15
personality disorder listed as chronic
00:18:18
SL
00:18:19
severe ah wow so this is like well
00:18:23
documented super well documented the
00:18:25
crazy thing about this case is that
00:18:28
there are so many things that are well
00:18:30
documented but he just flies under the
00:18:32
radar and ends up on the dating game
00:18:34
ends up on The Dating Game is able to
00:18:36
get off of things on like a weird
00:18:38
technicality just very strange yeah it's
00:18:41
very odd after being released from the
00:18:44
hospital though he returned to his
00:18:45
mother's house in Los Angeles and he
00:18:47
just started taking courses at
00:18:49
California State University like nothing
00:18:51
ever happened okay pal given his past
00:18:53
success in school and his IQ which uh
00:18:55
was reported to be around 140 which is
00:18:57
actually right about where the genius
00:18:59
category starts H so he was exceedingly
00:19:01
intelligent I mean it sounds like he's
00:19:03
he hasn't had any trouble in that area
00:19:05
no not at all he had no trouble with his
00:19:07
coursework and after that he transferred
00:19:09
to UCLA where he ended up graduating
00:19:12
with a bachelor's degree in 1968 wow now
00:19:15
free of academic obligations he embarked
00:19:18
on the next phase of his life where he
00:19:19
had a lot more free time I think that's
00:19:21
where things went that's not great
00:19:22
really wrong in between being released
00:19:25
from the hospital and getting his degree
00:19:27
though Rodney did did attack one of his
00:19:29
first documented victims Morgan Rowan
00:19:33
fortunately she was able to escape him
00:19:35
not once but twice really yes in 1965
00:19:40
she was hanging out in the parking lot
00:19:41
of uh a teen nightclub with some friends
00:19:43
and that's when she first saw Rodney
00:19:46
nothing seemed off about him in that
00:19:47
moment in fact she actually thought he
00:19:49
was pretty attractive thought he was
00:19:51
charismatic so sorry how old was he
00:19:54
around this time I think he's like early
00:19:56
20s probably 22 at this point and he's
00:19:58
in a teen nightclub yeah he's outside of
00:20:01
a teen nightclub very Rodney just a
00:20:03
grown ass man outside a teen nightclub
00:20:06
nothing nefarious about that yep I'm not
00:20:08
worried at all at this point just
00:20:10
kidding I'm very worried so worried you
00:20:12
should be so he and Morgan kept making
00:20:14
eye contact and eventually there two it
00:20:17
seems like maybe he was with a group and
00:20:18
she was with a group and then they kind
00:20:19
of like became one group yeah and they
00:20:22
all started chatting eventually the two
00:20:24
of them split off from this big group
00:20:26
and they made their way uh into an alley
00:20:28
near the club okay everything very
00:20:30
quickly turned once Rodney got Morgan
00:20:32
away from this group he immediately got
00:20:35
very rough with her he hit her head
00:20:37
against the wall immediately knocking
00:20:40
her unconscious luckily before anything
00:20:42
could escalate any further she did come
00:20:44
too and was able to scream which then
00:20:46
alerted the owner of the nightclub and
00:20:48
his wife who came running out to help
00:20:50
her but in the shuffle of all that he
00:20:52
was able to run away like get out of
00:20:54
Dodge before anybody even saw him what a
00:20:56
piece of [ __ ] yeah so [ __ ] crazy she
00:21:01
Morgan runs into Rodney again 3 years
00:21:04
later in the summer of 1968 at this
00:21:07
point ha this this was during her going
00:21:09
away party she and her family were
00:21:11
actually going to be moving from
00:21:12
California to New York so her friends
00:21:14
decided to take her out for one last
00:21:16
celebration altogether on the Sunset
00:21:18
Strip there was a big group of people
00:21:20
and while they were out Rodney happened
00:21:22
to join the group by chance cuz he's
00:21:24
living around that area and Morgan said
00:21:26
she immediately felt creeped out she was
00:21:28
very nervous as she and her friend sat
00:21:31
in a car waiting to head wherever they
00:21:32
were going next Rodney ended up slipping
00:21:35
in behind the wheel and was like oh I'll
00:21:37
I'll give you guys a ride to wherever
00:21:38
you're going next nope I don't know if
00:21:40
it was like a situation where maybe
00:21:41
somebody was drinking so he drove that
00:21:44
car mhm but he hopped behind the wheel
00:21:47
and he was like oh why don't we all head
00:21:49
to my house like I've got some weed we
00:21:51
can all smoke together and of course
00:21:53
every nobody else knows what happened so
00:21:55
they're like yeah sure sounds good and
00:21:56
it's the time period remember it's the
00:21:58
time period it's like these are like
00:21:59
kind of like hippie people you know
00:22:00
everybody's laid back everybody's laid
00:22:02
back exactly it was California dude yeah
00:22:05
Hollywood so once there with everybody
00:22:07
smoking and kind of distracted he took
00:22:09
the opportunity to get Morgan alone and
00:22:12
ended up bringing her into his bedroom
00:22:14
it sounds like forcibly and I'm just
00:22:17
going to kind of do an overview of this
00:22:19
just because the details of a lot of
00:22:21
this is very intense like in most of
00:22:24
these cases so I'm just kind of going to
00:22:26
give like an overview yeah he did phys
00:22:28
physically and sexually assault her and
00:22:30
actually pulled a knife on her during
00:22:32
the attack her friends at a certain
00:22:34
point probably heard something and also
00:22:36
realized that she was gone for too long
00:22:38
so they started pounding on Rodney's
00:22:40
closed and locked door to try to help
00:22:42
her but it actually took one of her
00:22:44
friends breaking Rodney's bedroom window
00:22:47
and entering that way for Morgan to
00:22:49
escape a second time oh my God so she
00:22:52
escaped him twice and it was like she
00:22:55
had to go through a lot to escape him
00:22:57
yeah she was
00:22:59
assaulted in a big way like he's very
00:23:01
very aggressive he's super aggressive oh
00:23:03
that's awful no she didn't end up
00:23:05
reporting this attack because her family
00:23:07
was leaving for New York the next day
00:23:09
she was overall just too scared and like
00:23:11
we were saying these are like kind of
00:23:12
like hippie people she was saying she
00:23:14
didn't feel like she was going to be
00:23:15
believed I was going to say and they'd
00:23:16
probably just be like well you went to
00:23:18
the house like especially in that time I
00:23:20
mean they would do that now but back
00:23:23
even more so they'd be like well you
00:23:24
went to the house and you were smoking
00:23:26
weed and you were like you know I mean
00:23:27
it would all be hurtful it would be very
00:23:29
much you put yourself in this situation
00:23:32
she didn't and even like you should
00:23:34
never that should never be the case no
00:23:36
don't be but sadly she she was terrified
00:23:38
after this she said she slept in bed
00:23:40
with her parents after this she was
00:23:41
horrified once they moved to New York
00:23:44
and then she later learned you know a
00:23:46
lot of different crimes that he
00:23:48
committed and carried a lot of guilt for
00:23:49
not reporting him yeah which it's like
00:23:51
girl that is not on you he is the
00:23:53
monster no no now this next attack is on
00:23:59
a young girl who's 8 years old so again
00:24:02
it's it's brutal and I'm just going to
00:24:04
give you an overview of it thank you so
00:24:07
just 3 weeks later a little past 8: a.m.
00:24:09
on the morning of September 25th 1968
00:24:12
8-year-old tal Shapiro left her family's
00:24:15
temporary home at the chatau Marmont and
00:24:18
just started making her way to school
00:24:20
she's eight eight years old like a tiny
00:24:22
babe unbeknownst to her parents since
00:24:24
they moved to the hotel a few months
00:24:26
earlier tally had been getting up early
00:24:28
and actually walking to her elementary
00:24:29
school instead of taking the bus like
00:24:31
she was supposed to it's probably just a
00:24:33
fun adventure for her she obviously
00:24:35
didn't know any better and different
00:24:37
time very different time as she walked
00:24:39
to school that morning though A car
00:24:41
pulled up beside her and she heard the
00:24:42
driver say come on in I'll give you a
00:24:44
ride to school no but her parents had
00:24:47
advised her many many times that she was
00:24:49
not supposed to talk to strangers they
00:24:51
instilled that in her so she declined
00:24:53
the offer and was like I'm not supposed
00:24:54
to talk to you like leave me alone but
00:24:57
Rodney cuz it's Rodney told her I'm not
00:25:00
a stranger I know your parents oh my God
00:25:02
[ __ ] this guy yeah obviously he did not
00:25:04
know T's parents but he had seen her and
00:25:07
her parents at the Chateau Marmont
00:25:09
because he had also been living there
00:25:11
recently I hate this so much to convince
00:25:14
her even more to come with him he was
00:25:16
like you know what I actually have a
00:25:18
beautiful photo to show you like it
00:25:19
won't take any time at all no in 1968
00:25:23
Los Angeles and California in general
00:25:26
had yet to undergo the very dark dark
00:25:28
transformation brought about by the
00:25:29
Manson family murders yeah so while she
00:25:32
knew she wasn't supposed to talk to
00:25:34
strangers tal Shapiro didn't really get
00:25:36
why she wasn't supposed to the man in
00:25:38
the car seemed nice enough and he knew
00:25:40
her parents and even lived in the same
00:25:41
hotel as they did plus he said he had a
00:25:44
beautiful picture to show her and she's
00:25:46
eight years old yeah of course like
00:25:48
she's a baby she's a literal baby I mean
00:25:50
that's a baby yeah so she didn't see
00:25:52
anything wrong with getting in his car
00:25:53
and going back to his apartment with him
00:25:55
and then getting on her way to school
00:25:57
she was already early remember cuz she
00:25:58
woke up early to walk as he was sitting
00:26:01
at a red light across the street hero of
00:26:04
the [ __ ] Century Good Samaritan
00:26:07
Donald Haynes watched the Curious
00:26:09
exchange between this man in the car and
00:26:11
the little girl on the sidewalk and even
00:26:13
though he couldn't hear what was being
00:26:15
said he didn't know what the
00:26:16
relationship was between them something
00:26:18
about this this whole scene just made
00:26:20
him very uncomfortable he said it was
00:26:23
something about the way the girl tried
00:26:24
to keep walking and the way the car
00:26:26
seemed to follow along slowly trying to
00:26:28
keep her attention oh that makes me
00:26:29
upset it caught his eye and he was just
00:26:31
like I don't know something's real off
00:26:32
about this but his Focus was broken when
00:26:35
the light turned green and the car
00:26:37
behind him honked which of course he has
00:26:39
to go forward but as he started to drive
00:26:42
away he watched as the little girl got
00:26:44
into the car and later he would describe
00:26:46
feeling in that moment as a kind of sick
00:26:48
sense or he said going off one's rocker
00:26:52
oh whatever the case this feeling
00:26:54
prompted him to turn his car around and
00:26:56
look for the man in that car to see
00:26:58
where he was going this is an amazing
00:27:00
man like truly good Samaran of the
00:27:02
century we need more people like him
00:27:04
it's the it's like what we were saying
00:27:05
last episode see something say something
00:27:08
see something he did something so it
00:27:11
took him a few minutes but he soon
00:27:12
spotted the vehicle again and actually
00:27:14
started following alala alcala's car a
00:27:17
few Paces behind and trailed him all the
00:27:19
way back to the parking lot at Chateau
00:27:22
Marmont from his vehicle he watched as
00:27:24
Alcala and T got out of the car and
00:27:27
started walking towards one of the
00:27:28
apartments with the little girl
00:27:30
following just a few steps behind
00:27:32
meanwhile her parents live in the chatau
00:27:35
Marmont right now yes she is living
00:27:37
there he's bringing her back to where
00:27:38
she lives yes so that's why she's like
00:27:40
there's nothing wrong with this he knows
00:27:42
my parents he's a neighbor and obviously
00:27:45
the fact that they both lived in the
00:27:46
same place added to the fact that she
00:27:48
was or added to the you know story of I
00:27:50
know your parents yeah of course so not
00:27:53
wanting to wait any longer and fully
00:27:55
aware that he could be very wrong about
00:27:57
what he thought was happening
00:27:58
Haynes was like I don't care he drove to
00:28:00
a nearby pay phone and called the police
00:28:02
what a badass truly he told the
00:28:04
dispatcher you might think I'm a little
00:28:06
screwy but I just witnessed something
00:28:08
that doesn't look right I think a man
00:28:09
just lured a little girl into his car
00:28:11
and now he and the he and the girl went
00:28:13
into his apartment together and they
00:28:15
sent a cruiser good which is actually
00:28:18
pretty boners for that time period
00:28:20
because nobody believed anybody back
00:28:22
then but thank goodness that's actually
00:28:24
shocking it is so minutes later a police
00:28:27
cruiser pulled up alongside the pay
00:28:29
phone and hannes pointed out the
00:28:30
apartment that the man had walked into
00:28:34
and the officer Chris kamacho I believe
00:28:35
it is thank Tes walked over to the
00:28:38
apartment door and knocked on the door
00:28:40
hard and fast again I'm not going to go
00:28:42
into all the details here they're
00:28:44
available elsewhere if you want them but
00:28:47
when the officer was able to make his
00:28:49
way in it was a horrible scene oh no he
00:28:52
ultimately found tally laying in a large
00:28:54
pool of blood coming from her head it
00:28:57
was clear that she had been sexually
00:28:58
assaulted and there was a metal bar
00:29:01
across her throat that was effectively
00:29:03
suffocating her oh my God he is a
00:29:06
[ __ ] monster he's a monster she's
00:29:08
eight she is a bab I can't even I can't
00:29:11
even like my so officer kamacho uh
00:29:14
grabbed a towel from the kitchen counter
00:29:16
so as not to disturb any of the evidence
00:29:18
and carefully lifted the bar off of her
00:29:20
throat and then checked for a pulse she
00:29:22
was pale she was badly injured but T was
00:29:25
still alive holy [ __ ] in the mean time
00:29:28
the occupant [ __ ] piece of [ __ ]
00:29:31
garbage human [ __ ] of the
00:29:33
apartment had slipped out of the bedroom
00:29:35
window and kamacho didn't want to leave
00:29:37
T alone so he ended up just staying in
00:29:40
the apartment and waiting for the
00:29:41
ambulance while officers and detectives
00:29:43
then spread across the entire
00:29:45
neighborhood looking for this creep oh
00:29:48
tal remained in a coma for over a month
00:29:52
at a nearby hospital H [ __ ] but after
00:29:56
months of Rehabilitation she was able to
00:29:58
return to school and actually lived a
00:30:01
pretty normal
00:30:02
life I am so glad to hear that yeah when
00:30:06
she recovered from all of her physical
00:30:07
injuries the Shapiro Family actually
00:30:09
moved to uh Puerto viarta Mexico hoping
00:30:12
that a new environment would help her
00:30:14
healing process and the last thing she
00:30:17
remembered was entering the apartment
00:30:19
but she said everything that happened
00:30:20
after that was and always would be a
00:30:23
blank oh she doesn't remember any of it
00:30:26
I so glad I hope that never comes back
00:30:30
to her never ever ever I hope she never
00:30:33
that never resurfaces ever when we say
00:30:37
he's a monster he's he's worse he's
00:30:41
worse than that and the fact that she I
00:30:44
mean she's one of his what we believe to
00:30:46
be one of his first victims but it's
00:30:48
like that's where you start your
00:30:51
criminal activities what a disgusting
00:30:55
piece of [ __ ] like a pig he's awful I I
00:30:58
can't I can't even Linger on it too long
00:31:00
years later though Morgan and tally
00:31:02
connected over their shared experiences
00:31:04
through letters and they actually even
00:31:06
appeared on the show I survived a serial
00:31:08
killer oh [ __ ] I think in either 2021 or
00:31:10
2022 oh wow yeah and uh Morgan said she
00:31:14
like felt this like prot like
00:31:15
protectiveness over tal and that's what
00:31:17
connected them and uh she even said like
00:31:20
she was sorry to tally that she didn't
00:31:22
report what happened to her she was like
00:31:24
if I had done that maybe it wouldn't
00:31:25
have happened to you but T was like no
00:31:28
it's not you it's him that did this and
00:31:30
they became friends oh I love that I
00:31:32
know I'm so glad something good came out
00:31:34
of that I know I wanted to tell you guys
00:31:35
that I'm like cuz again it's going to
00:31:38
get rough so we got to have those little
00:31:39
glimmers there uh Los Angeles police
00:31:42
detective Steve hodell who's a name you
00:31:44
might recognize I sure do he is George
00:31:46
hodell one of the Prime suspects in the
00:31:48
black Dolly his case his son uh he was
00:31:50
assigned to this case and immediately
00:31:52
set out learning everything he could
00:31:54
about the suspect Rodney Alcala because
00:31:56
remember they know his name
00:31:58
this is his
00:31:59
apartment rting BL my mind yeah like
00:32:03
that's blowing my mind and this like how
00:32:06
this went any further it was like 8:30
00:32:08
in the morning too this girl's just it's
00:32:11
a week on her way to school like just
00:32:14
like you would never expect something
00:32:16
that happen right then on her way to
00:32:18
school mhm like Jesus now to his
00:32:21
surprise no one at chatau Marmont seemed
00:32:23
to know anything about alala personally
00:32:25
but they all described him as a quiet
00:32:27
person and not a troublemaker and that
00:32:29
impr go that far yeah I know that
00:32:32
impression was echoed by his former
00:32:33
classmates and professors at UCA when
00:32:36
Steve hodell talked to them uh one
00:32:38
faculty member told hodell that alala
00:32:40
quote wouldn't harm a fly um again I
00:32:44
wouldn't go that far it's like yeah we
00:32:46
have that he uh did hurt much more than
00:32:48
a fly actually an 8-year-old little girl
00:32:50
yeah he um sexually assaulted an
00:32:52
8-year-old so do you want to you want to
00:32:54
suck that one back into your mouth
00:32:55
essentially tried to kill her so I hate
00:32:57
that [ __ ] yeah I do hate that [ __ ] don't
00:32:59
say that don't say that when you just
00:33:01
heard that this man might be a child
00:33:02
rapist don't say he wouldn't hurt a fly
00:33:04
because that's not true we can only hope
00:33:06
that whoever said that didn't know what
00:33:07
he was being well I know it's like the
00:33:09
impression of somebody like I how many
00:33:12
times you hear about something happening
00:33:13
and you hear the people be like holy
00:33:15
[ __ ]
00:33:16
I but it's like just you know be careful
00:33:20
of the words that come out of your mouth
00:33:21
during those times agreed uh more
00:33:24
important than what his peers and
00:33:25
neighbors thought of him though was the
00:33:27
fact that none of them had seen him
00:33:29
recently in fact hodell could have
00:33:31
searched all over California and he
00:33:33
never would have found Rodney alala
00:33:35
because by then Rodney Alcala was
00:33:37
thousands of miles away as Steve hodell
00:33:40
was making the rounds of the UCLA campus
00:33:42
to learn about his suspect Rodney Alcala
00:33:45
now calling himself John Berger walked
00:33:47
into the Admissions Office at New York
00:33:49
University and applied for a spot in the
00:33:52
undergraduate film program at the School
00:33:54
of Fine
00:33:55
Arts wow your next move you know what I
00:33:59
think I'll do I think I'll take a film
00:34:01
class after you know terrorizing people
00:34:04
in California and a small child that
00:34:05
sounds good yeah yeah despite the highly
00:34:08
competitive nature of the program
00:34:10
actually at the time one of the
00:34:11
instructors was the then acclaimed Roman
00:34:14
palansky uh and the fact that the
00:34:16
semester had already started alala was
00:34:19
admitted wow like he's a charmer wow
00:34:22
he's a charmer yeah that just goes to
00:34:25
show you that right there that's a
00:34:27
competitive school at the time Roman
00:34:28
palansky was like a very prominent name
00:34:31
prominent name exactly and they're like
00:34:33
yeah you can take this class wow what
00:34:36
damn once again though he impressed his
00:34:38
professors his peers who found him to be
00:34:40
charismatic like I just said and highly
00:34:42
motivated student he's like John Wayne
00:34:44
gasy though like you know he's got that
00:34:47
kind of like you can turn it on but when
00:34:48
it's off it's all he's got that smarmy
00:34:50
charm smarmy charm yep admission
00:34:54
admissions chairperson arle mock out of
00:34:56
Alcala there was a quiet deter ISM that
00:34:58
seemed to pervade everything he did
00:35:00
outside of class it appeared that he was
00:35:02
similarly successful he dated casually
00:35:05
oh can you [ __ ] imagine can you
00:35:06
imagine looking back absolutely not cuz
00:35:08
you'd have no way of knowing no you'd
00:35:10
never know that's the thing so
00:35:12
charismatic I mean somebody just said he
00:35:13
wouldn't hurt a fly he obviously is not
00:35:16
showcasing his aggression outside of
00:35:18
these things like I me again going back
00:35:20
to the beginning of the episode he was
00:35:22
the The Bachelor who won the dating game
00:35:25
won the date the amount of women who
00:35:27
must be like holy [ __ ] yeah I can't even
00:35:30
imagine I cannot even imagine he made
00:35:33
friends with fellow students he was
00:35:34
working on group projects with people
00:35:37
wow he even managed to make some money
00:35:38
as a commercial photographer at that
00:35:40
time in every sense he seemed an
00:35:42
ordinary but particularly driven student
00:35:45
and nobody suspected there was anything
00:35:47
dark about him at all that's so scary
00:35:51
it's that is hor so scary yeah on the
00:35:54
evening of June 12th 1971 on the other
00:35:57
side of Manhattan though friends had
00:35:59
been trying unsuccessfully to reach
00:36:00
Cornelia Michelle krly all afternoon
00:36:04
23-year-old uh she went by Michael krly
00:36:06
as she was known to friends had recently
00:36:08
moved out of her parents home in Bayside
00:36:10
Queens and found her own apartment in an
00:36:12
Upper East Side neighborhood that is
00:36:14
sometimes called and it's a quote girl
00:36:16
ghetto or mecca for maidens okay uh it's
00:36:20
it was very affordable at the time and
00:36:22
young people were all moving over there
00:36:24
it's kind of like um if you're from
00:36:25
Boston like the Brookline Somerville
00:36:27
area that makes sense krly had spent
00:36:29
that spring at the Transworld Airlines
00:36:31
campus in Kansas training to be a flight
00:36:33
attendant and she had just come back to
00:36:35
New York she was super excited to start
00:36:37
her career so excited to have an
00:36:39
apartment of her own was just setting
00:36:41
out in the world according to her
00:36:43
boyfriend Leon Bornstein Michael was
00:36:46
funny vivacious had a jaunt on her step
00:36:48
and she had a real zah deiv she was also
00:36:51
gorgeous he said the night before he was
00:36:53
trying to get a hold of Michael by the
00:36:55
phone and after several UNS uccessful
00:36:57
attempts he finally went over to her
00:36:59
apartment and tried the door but it was
00:37:01
locked so concerned for her safety he
00:37:03
called the police and an officer was
00:37:05
able to access the apartment through a
00:37:07
window just off the fire escape uh krly
00:37:10
was still in the process of moving in so
00:37:12
the apartment was pretty much empty but
00:37:14
in the bedroom lying on the floor they
00:37:16
found Michael Curly's partially clothed
00:37:18
body a stocking tied tightly around her
00:37:20
neck Jesus to the investigators her
00:37:23
apartment had all the Hallmarks of a
00:37:25
targeted murder nothing was missing
00:37:27
there was a small amount of cash and
00:37:29
other valuables Right In Plain Sight
00:37:31
there was no sign of a Breakin and no
00:37:33
sign of a struggle elsewhere in the
00:37:34
apartment and it was obvious that she
00:37:37
had been the victim of a violent sexual
00:37:39
assault this is very brutal I just want
00:37:41
to give you a heads up her shirt had
00:37:44
been stuffed into her mouth and there
00:37:45
was saliva and bite marks on both of her
00:37:48
breasts there were also signs of serious
00:37:50
trauma to the rest of her body and it
00:37:52
was very clear that she had been
00:37:54
raped I can't imagine what she went
00:37:57
through no
00:37:58
one of the officers asked and this is
00:38:00
horrible one of the officers asked Leon
00:38:02
her boyfriend to come into the bedroom
00:38:04
to identify her which is [ __ ]
00:38:08
insane that is beyond like we were
00:38:12
talking I for the blackout Ripper I
00:38:14
forget the time period but it was way it
00:38:17
was during World War I wasn't it yeah it
00:38:19
the 1930s 40s it was liter and they were
00:38:23
being sensitive to make sure family
00:38:26
members didn't see these
00:38:28
they did everything they could and made
00:38:30
sure that nobody saw the scenes these
00:38:32
officers pulled him in and was like can
00:38:35
you can you tell us is this her what the
00:38:38
[ __ ] wild who would ever bring
00:38:41
especially like their boyfriend or their
00:38:44
loved one significant other any loved
00:38:46
one of any kind to see them in that
00:38:49
position yeah that will ruin you for the
00:38:52
rest of your life I don't know how you
00:38:54
ever recover from seeing someone you
00:38:56
love in that position I would never
00:38:58
recover you don't we even take great I
00:39:02
don't that doesn't make any [ __ ]
00:39:03
sense to me cuz I've done plenty of
00:39:06
viewings when I worked at the morg we
00:39:08
went to Great Lengths to make sure there
00:39:11
was nothing upsetting about like nothing
00:39:15
Beyond seeing your loved one dead but
00:39:17
like we would go to Great Lengths to
00:39:20
make sure there was nothing seen that
00:39:22
was beyond what they were already going
00:39:24
to see exactly so like I just can't like
00:39:27
my brain doesn't wrap around that
00:39:30
sometimes especially back then the ND is
00:39:33
very similar to the LAPD I going to say
00:39:35
that you just sit here like question
00:39:37
mark question mark That's a state of
00:39:39
dumb that I I didn't know people existed
00:39:42
you have to assume that that was like a
00:39:43
you and you have to almost hope even
00:39:45
that that was a rookie who was just real
00:39:47
[ __ ] dumb in that moment you I mean
00:39:50
lose your [ __ ] job at that point
00:39:52
you've just ruined someone for the rest
00:39:54
of their lives years later he said it
00:39:56
was a terrible
00:39:57
yeah Michael's mouth was wide open
00:39:59
because rigger mortise had set in and
00:40:01
the killer had put something in her
00:40:02
mouth to prevent her from screaming I
00:40:04
couldn't even tell it was Michael she
00:40:06
was so
00:40:07
disfigured yeah I can't the fact that
00:40:10
they had that guy do that is so messed
00:40:13
up Beyond so messed up wow but
00:40:15
detectives learned from Leon that
00:40:17
earlier that day Michael had been
00:40:18
looking for somebody who could help her
00:40:20
move two heavy beds and other Furniture
00:40:22
up to her apartment and since some of
00:40:24
the furniture appeared to have been
00:40:25
moved in by the time she was killed they
00:40:27
theorized that whoever helped her move
00:40:29
was probably the same person who killed
00:40:31
her but Leon rejected that theory he
00:40:33
said Michael would have had to have
00:40:34
recognized him or known him before she
00:40:36
would have let anybody inside mhm but
00:40:39
the coroner took swabs of the saliva and
00:40:41
a bite mark impression but otherwise the
00:40:43
body was absent of any other physical
00:40:45
evidence that could help identify their
00:40:47
killer meanwhile uh Executives at tww
00:40:50
authorized a $5,000 reward for any
00:40:53
information leading to an arrest and a
00:40:55
few days later the professional Airline
00:40:57
stewardess Association uh upped that
00:41:00
reward by $1,000 wow and despite the
00:41:03
offer of of the reward though the case
00:41:05
quickly went cold wow a few days later
00:41:07
Michael cly's funeral was held in Queens
00:41:09
and was attended by nearly 1,500 people
00:41:12
holy [ __ ] this girl was so beloved wow
00:41:16
after the murder of Michael curlyy
00:41:17
Rodney Alcala needed to get out of the
00:41:19
city obviously so in early July he
00:41:22
applied for a position as an Arts camp
00:41:24
counselor at a children's summer camp in
00:41:27
New Hampshire no no what the [ __ ] stop
00:41:32
what the [ __ ] but he was using an alias
00:41:35
he was using the name John Berger so
00:41:37
they wouldn't have known any better but
00:41:39
at the same time investigators in
00:41:41
California still had not given up the
00:41:43
the search for tally Shapiro's attacker
00:41:46
and by then Alcala had actually been
00:41:47
added to the FBI's list of most wanted
00:41:50
fugitives and here he is just on the
00:41:52
East Coast yep his face and description
00:41:54
appearing on wanted posters and federal
00:41:56
buildings pretty much much everywhere in
00:41:58
the US wow now and this is crazy the
00:42:01
amount of times he just like just by
00:42:04
chance somebody sees something in these
00:42:06
cases there's it's wild in August two
00:42:08
girls from the camp they walked a short
00:42:10
distance to the post office just to mail
00:42:12
some letters back home it was meant to
00:42:14
be a pretty quick trip actually but by
00:42:16
the time they reached the post office it
00:42:18
started to rain heavily so they were
00:42:20
like let's just wait inside until the
00:42:21
rain lets up cuz we don't want to get
00:42:22
soaked on the way back to Camp yeah so
00:42:25
they just wandered around the post
00:42:26
office it was a pretty building they
00:42:28
were looking at the governmental notices
00:42:29
on the wall and eventually their eyes
00:42:32
settled on the bulletin board of all the
00:42:33
wanted criminals and one of the faces
00:42:36
looked very familiar according to the
00:42:39
notice the man's name was Rodney Alcala
00:42:42
and he was wanted for assault of a child
00:42:44
in California but he looked remarkably
00:42:47
similar to their very popular camp
00:42:49
counselor John oh my God can you imagine
00:42:53
no I I cannot to be a parent and later
00:42:56
Lear that Rodney alala was your child's
00:42:59
camp counselor I'd never let my kids do
00:43:01
anything again never I like you're
00:43:03
actually we actually live in the house
00:43:04
and we never leave Yeah we actually have
00:43:06
um like a bomb shelter now and we're
00:43:08
going to live there sound good never
00:43:10
leaving bye so the girls dismissed the
00:43:13
notice as merely a coincidence after all
00:43:15
John Berger said he'd come from New York
00:43:17
where he'd lived his entire life and he
00:43:19
definitely didn't seem like somebody who
00:43:20
would hurt a child he was good to them
00:43:22
in that at that camp but still the
00:43:24
resemblance was uncanny so when they got
00:43:26
back to Camp they did mention the poster
00:43:29
to the camp director good who was like
00:43:31
you know what I'm going to go check that
00:43:32
out just to be sure cuz I actually give
00:43:34
a [ __ ] about the safety of children I
00:43:36
love that at the post office the camp
00:43:38
director stared at the wanted poster for
00:43:41
several minutes just sat there in awe
00:43:43
reading and rereading the information on
00:43:46
Rodney alala none of the details matched
00:43:48
what he had been told about John Burger
00:43:50
but he simply could not ignore the fact
00:43:52
that that man in the photo was pretty
00:43:55
much identical to the counselor he'
00:43:56
hired just one month earlier and he has
00:43:59
a very like um he's got a distinct face
00:44:02
yeah it's not like he's I'm trying to
00:44:03
think of like how to describe it cuz
00:44:05
it's not like he's like you know uh like
00:44:08
somebody that you're like oh like how
00:44:09
could you ever like you know even like
00:44:12
they look like everybody else he's just
00:44:14
got something he's got very like it's
00:44:17
very like cheekbones are very he's he's
00:44:20
very um reminiscent of uh Richard
00:44:22
Ramirez in that reminiscent where he has
00:44:24
like very like pronounced cheekbones got
00:44:27
like you know his eyes are are like a
00:44:30
certain way so I UND cuz like a lot of
00:44:33
guys around that time like same haircut
00:44:36
same kind of thing going on so you'd be
00:44:38
like yeah I don't know it kind of so the
00:44:39
fact that they are so so short like this
00:44:42
is got to be that you know he's got to
00:44:44
have some something about him I think
00:44:47
it's his
00:44:48
eyes they're dead they and they're scary
00:44:51
there yeah like there's something evil
00:44:54
in those eyes it feels like something is
00:44:55
like brimming in those eyes and I think
00:44:57
it's because a lot of the pictures
00:44:58
obviously you see are after his arrest
00:45:00
so he just let his facade go completely
00:45:03
but you can also see how somebody would
00:45:04
be like oh that guy's harmless you see
00:45:07
him on The Dating Game have you ever
00:45:08
seen the clips I actually I can't even
00:45:10
watch them because it freaks me out are
00:45:12
horrifying I've seen a couple but CU you
00:45:15
get why people are didn't think twice
00:45:17
about him again he is super charismatic
00:45:20
he's very much like a like in the vein
00:45:22
of Ted Bundy that way I was literally
00:45:24
just thinking that and I think it's the
00:45:26
int level they know they and they study
00:45:29
other people and they see what makes
00:45:32
people tick when they talk to others and
00:45:33
what makes people a people like they
00:45:35
they literally just try to kind of
00:45:39
duplicate and imitate what they see and
00:45:41
it works because intelligent yeah so the
00:45:45
director asked the woman at the counter
00:45:46
in the post office if he could use the
00:45:48
phone after standing there for several
00:45:49
minutes just going back and forth in his
00:45:51
head but he was like I got to report
00:45:53
this I just in case good for him so he
00:45:55
dialed the number on the poster and he
00:45:57
was immediately connected with the
00:45:58
regional branch of the FBI which can you
00:46:01
imagine just a camp counselor from
00:46:03
[ __ ] New Hampshire and he's just like
00:46:04
oh hey he's like hi um I'm terrified
00:46:07
yeah hi the agent on the phone took all
00:46:09
the details that the director could
00:46:11
remember about JN off the top of his
00:46:12
head you know John Burger the camp
00:46:14
counselor yeah and then instructed the
00:46:16
man to return to the camp and act as
00:46:18
normal as he could he was like you just
00:46:20
have to go back to the camp and act like
00:46:22
nothing is wrong but he emphasized do
00:46:25
not leave him alone alone with any of
00:46:28
the young female Campers or any female
00:46:29
Campers at all oh [ __ ] make act as
00:46:32
normal as you can but you got to make
00:46:34
sure he's not alone with anybody that
00:46:36
would be hearing that how do you act
00:46:39
normal after knowing that he is possibly
00:46:41
wanted in California for the assault of
00:46:44
a child but thank goodness this guy went
00:46:46
this far cuz I'm glad people intervened
00:46:48
here yeah it's it seems like this is
00:46:51
case that's very different from a lot of
00:46:52
cases we see that's the thing exactly
00:46:55
now he didn't have to keep up the facade
00:46:57
too long because the next morning a
00:46:59
group of FBI agents arrived at the camp
00:47:01
and took alala into custody without
00:47:03
incident oh wow after comparing his
00:47:05
fingerprints with those on file they
00:47:07
knew that they had the right person and
00:47:09
they called Steve hodell in Los Angeles
00:47:11
who immediately booked a fight a flight
00:47:12
to Boston so he could personally bring
00:47:15
Alcala back to California to stand trial
00:47:17
he was like [ __ ] you I'm bringing you in
00:47:20
hodell arrived at the local police
00:47:21
precinct uh early on the morning of
00:47:23
August 12th where he was introduced to
00:47:25
alala and as waited for the extradition
00:47:28
paperwork to be completed hodell asked
00:47:30
Alcala why why did you attack a little
00:47:33
child and in response Alcala looked
00:47:36
expressionless at hodell and said I
00:47:38
don't want to talk about Rod Alcala and
00:47:39
what he did oh
00:47:42
please that's it
00:47:44
please and that is where we're going to
00:47:46
end for part one God yeah uh we're going
00:47:50
to talk about you know his arrest a
00:47:53
conviction and his eventual release in
00:47:56
part two
00:47:57
so ready for that um and then so part
00:48:00
there's going to be a little break
00:48:01
between part one and part two because we
00:48:03
have you know listener Tales which
00:48:05
you'll need as a little pet cleanser you
00:48:06
are going to need that yeah so part two
00:48:08
will be coming out next Monday we'll do
00:48:10
a little listener Tales video in between
00:48:12
then so definitely tune in for that it
00:48:14
will be kind of like a pre pallet
00:48:15
cleanser I guess yeah also kind of a
00:48:17
post and again you'll you have a lot
00:48:19
more after that coming so yeah yeah so
00:48:24
uh stay tuned we hope you keep listening
00:48:25
and we hope you
00:48:27
it
00:48:28
Weir but not so weird as any of this and
00:48:31
guys I know I don't have to tell you
00:48:32
that no certainly not yeah do keep it as
00:48:36
weird as all these Good Samaritans
00:48:37
though who actually called people keep
00:48:38
it that [ __ ] weird keep it real weird
00:48:40
like that all right bye bye
00:48:48
[Music]
00:48:56
oh
00:49:08
[Music]