00:00:06
hey weirdos I'm Elena and I'm Ash and this is [Music] morbid yeah a whole plan where we were
00:00:31
going to say hey morbid this is weirdos and then just not comment on it and act like it was just a big
00:00:39
LOL I forgot us even though we talked about it 5 seconds ago I forgot quite frankly quite frankly quite literally
00:00:47
seconds before the intro seconds before quite frankly and quite literally seconds before the goddamn
00:00:54
intro you know we're Wy up in here we're we're Wy up in here it's crazy this is one of those weeks where I don't [ __ ]
00:01:02
know what day it is yeah it's been you know we've been working on I think we mentioned in the last episode or maybe a
00:01:08
couple episodes that were like kind of renovating our studio space a little bit it's so much better and it was like real
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up in arms for a little while like it just it looked like a bomb went off in here and well we had to be out of here
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for a little bit yeah we couldn't be in here cuz they were doing some stuff so we have been putting it back together
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just me Ash and Mikey Ash lightly I don't really sign on to the manual labor part of things I don't know if you
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heard me go Ash and [Laughter] Mikey I'm here for moral support baby Mikey and I have put it back together
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and Ash has pointed yeah and I put a couple of frames together that's true she put a couple of frames oh wait no
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[ __ ] that oh she put a shelf up two two shelves two shelves I got a [ __ ] splinter in the process and that's
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exactly why I don't do [ __ ] like this and I took the SP splinter out she did did it was very impressive because it
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was well actually I thought it was small but you thought it was big it was a pretty big splitter but it was like it
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was like a small like it was thin small yeah that's that's the dimensions of my splinter yeah exactly but yeah so it was
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just a little crazy in here like we were just starting to put things back together sorry if you hear my stomach
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grumbling I got you a bagel you hear the little that was my stomach yeah I don't
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know why did you eat your bagel I did I ate my bagel but my stomach's like not enough
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not enough I don't know if she's grumbling this morning is oliv her twist P can I have some and I said shh not yet
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said no [ __ ] not yet you can have some water uh but yeah moral of this whole very long very uh kind of stupid story
00:02:47
of mine is that it's been a little crazy in here and now it's finally almost completely done and put together so
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we're feeling very exhausted but very happy yeah we painted it a different color I think did we talk to you guys
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about this it was red before that exhaust now it's blue it's tranquil it's safe very tranquil in here I love it I
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look forward to being in here yes it's such previously not so much because of the color not the company exactly and
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it's like they you know it can there's a lot going on at all times so we need a tranquil cover color color do it with me
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now I'm not color to chill everything out and make us feel good you know we also painted
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the molding which to me just says [ __ ] Chic [ __ ] yeah when you paint the molding in a room you know that's
00:03:37
what this episode is about now we're just going to talk Home Design uh it feels this is our new HGTV show no we
00:03:43
were talking the other day it feels velvety it does feel velvety sorry I cut you off entirely okay I was like anyways
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we were talking anyway it feels velvety but next I think I want to do an HGTV show with you I love the you next I'll
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just do an HGTV show you know manifest it that's how that works wouldn't that be so much fun it would be fun let's do
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it let's go HGTV are you listening let's go girls I bet they are they might be I
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bet HGTV is listening as a whole as a company well you know what speaking of careers this this actually the Segways
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pretty nicely into what we're going to be talking about today because we're going to be talking about the career
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girl murders um and I say it Segways because this whole this is a really horrific case and they it kind of
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ushered in this whole thought process of like the career girl meaning the girl coming out of the 1950s where like women
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were like you know what I don't have to get married like I don't have to get married right away like I can get my own
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thing going become independent kind of stand on my own two feet and then I can decide if I want to get married later
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like I'm a career girl so it's like people this whole like notion that Society was putting in everyone's heads
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of like women you have to either choose to you know like like you got to get married like right away like out of
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school that was all kind of going away and then this happened and it like shook a lot of people because it made people
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think well wait a second is this what's going to happen like all of a sudden it kind of like threw people backwards
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where it was like oh well you know women are vulnerable and see what happens when
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they strike out on their own kind of thing and they kind of blamed it on that instead of just being like well no some
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you know some [ __ ] are [ __ ] right we should make sure that we stop them from being [ __ ] it's not women
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are vulnerable it's people are depraved yeah exactly and it's like let's concentrate on that and maybe stopping
00:05:39
that first so this takes place in New York City New York and it takes place in the early 60s um this was on the
00:05:47
afternoon of August 28th 1963 Patricia tlus returned home from work to her apartment in New York City and she found
00:05:55
it rans sacked oh it was nothing like she had left it that morning and she also ended up and we're going to get
00:06:01
into the details of this don't worry but she found a bloody knife in the bathroom
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and her roommates Emily hawford and Janice Wy were nowhere to be found initially okay she obviously she was
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young like they were in their 20s like they were in New York City living together the three of them she came into
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this apartment saw it ransacked found like took a quick glance of like what the [ __ ] was going on didn't Venture
00:06:26
super far in because that's smart yeah like she was like uh I'm going to call someone what's going on still be here so
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again the horrific details are to follow and we will find out that um Emily hawford and Janice Wy were in that
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apartment she just did not see them initially um but the murders of Emily hofford and Janice Wy shined a light
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also on to when it comes to like the career thing we're going to talk about that as well but it also shined a light
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on how race and class can influence a police investigation and a jury verdict especially back then and how Justice can
00:07:01
be delayed or diverted completely in the interest of efficiency and the illusion
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of safety not actual safety not actually taking bad people off the streets just giving everyone the illusion that we
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caught the bad guy that's so [ __ ] up and especially in the 60s at this point it was like we're going to catch a bad
00:07:23
guy and we're going to make you think that this is the perfect picture of what a bad guy is when in reality the B guy
00:07:29
was something totally different of course they were like look over there yeah look at this like everybody's fine
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don't worry about it which is really [ __ ] up in this case too in any case but in this case too because they were
00:07:40
kind of being like okay we got the bad guy we're going to take him off the streets everything's fine everybody calm
00:07:44
down don't worry about it ladies like you don't have to worry about getting murdered in your apartment anymore leave
00:07:48
your doors unlocked it's fine in reality they had not removed any of the dangers
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and they were putting everybody at risk I don't see like how do you not think about that like you're like what they
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were doing back then is saying let's put somebody up for this and make it seem like everything is okay how are you not
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thinking like but everything's not okay but there's still a bad guy out there who did this like this guy is still
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prowling around and they like they must have felt some sense of like okay like we did it but it's like you that's so
00:08:18
fake yeah they just wanted the Pats on the back and they wanted everyone to shut up about it that's I can't imagine
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so and also and race plays a role in this as well and so they were just like well whatever
00:08:30
yeah whatever we did it and this is going to be a two-parter because there's a lot going on in this case and I think
00:08:36
a whole part needs to be totally talking about how [ __ ] up the investigation and the trial and who
00:08:44
ends up actually coming forward as the person okay that's a whole thing in and of itself so it needs some attention
00:08:50
paid to it now let's talk about the victims here yeah Janice lamb Wy was born March 6th 1942 in Evanston Illinois
00:09:01
uh she was one of two children her parents were Max and Isabelle Wy not not long after she was born the family
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relocated to Manhattan New York and Max was actually working as an advertising exec and eventually transitioned into
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television production uh most notably he was the co-creator of The Flying Nun from 1967 to 1970 oh wow so he was doing
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really well I guess so um and as the daughter of a very powerful and you know High
00:09:29
respected ad executive Janice was raised in considerable privilege obviously uh she attended the finest schools the
00:09:36
finest summer camps like received tutoring from very expensive tutors she got everything she needed nice um and
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from an early age it was apparent that Janice was a very confident very self assured person as well so it was all
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like it seemed like she was she was raised with anything she needed and everything she could ever want right but
00:09:56
she really became like such a such a a unique person in of herself which is really interesting cuz sometimes when
00:10:03
you hear about like High Society yes kids you know I mean like they end up all just being very um spoiled spoiled
00:10:11
and yeah like having yeah exactly silver spoon kind of yeah you know and she didn't seem like that was who she was
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she had what she needed on her fingertips and she utilized it to like project herself for yeah to kind of like
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just be her own person and great I feel like that probably like it seems like she was raised well that way you know
00:10:31
what I mean like it seems like they kind of put that into her as a person which is nice and um as she got older she
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would find herself all the time the center of attention uh she was beautiful like truly beautiful and she was
00:10:43
beautiful inside and out she loved hosting and attending parties like she was such a like girl of the time like
00:10:52
you know I mean like she just wanted to be out there everywhere meeting all kinds of people she was s to have dated
00:10:58
quote more more than the average woman at the time oh [ __ ] off and she had and
00:11:02
also Janice dated both men and women hell yeah which at the time obviously very and it also plays a little bit of a
00:11:11
role at a time when they were investigating the investigation so I can only imagine investigating the
00:11:16
investigation I just said investigating the crime I didn't even catch that I I caught it inside of myself but she had
00:11:22
you know this beautiful blonde hair she had stunning what was described as like startling green eyes she's so pretty I'm
00:11:29
looking at a picture right now and someone uh once described her as the kind of woman quote who surrounded
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overwhelmed you at first meeting she had a sensuality and animalism about her like so she was just like people were
00:11:42
like you met her took one look at her she opened her mouth and talked and you were just like shot off your feet an
00:11:49
enigma yeah and it was likely this confidence that allowed her to the confidence that she was able to build
00:11:55
through her entire life here it allowed her to strike out on her own to make a career for herself as an independent
00:12:00
woman yeah that's great and again this was actually pretty unusual for young women at the time so when she was just
00:12:06
out of college she found work as a research assistant at Newsweek where she and several other young women at the
00:12:12
time spent their days clipping articles and pasting them into like huge reference books for journalists higher
00:12:18
up in the magazine to look to use for their stories and again she didn't really need the income she came from a
00:12:26
lot of money she did it because she wanted to do it she wanted to work and she wanted to make a name for herself
00:12:31
good for her and to Janice the job at news week was even more than an income cuz she really didn't need it it was
00:12:37
another opportunity for socialization she loved being around people according to journalist Bernard lewitz I believe
00:12:43
is how you say it quote in a little more than five months working for Newsweek Janice had become the office Livewire
00:12:50
she relieved the tedium of routine with her rockus humor with her unabashed theatricality with her blunderbus cander
00:12:58
wow like that's the best sentence ever and Janice again didn't need the income but it also the income did mean
00:13:07
that she could prove to her father especially that she could take care of herself that she didn't need to rely on
00:13:12
him like Daddy look at me yeah and specifically she wanted to be able to move out to her own apartment and take
00:13:17
care of and not worry about him having to pay for the rent she wanted to pay for the rent she really wanted that
00:13:22
independent yeah and so she ended up sharing this apartment with two other women so she was like I know you can
00:13:27
probably buy me a place and it or me bu my own place but you know what I'm going to find two two
00:13:33
friends we're going to together because I can AFF this with my own [ __ ] which I
00:13:37
was like hell yeah Janice that's really awesome now a few weeks after taking the
00:13:41
job with Newsweek uh Janice's friend Pat Tois asked her to share an apartment with her on the Upper East Side and it
00:13:48
was just a few blocks away from Jan where Janice had actually grown up so she was very familiar with the area and
00:13:55
she knew because she was like a lifelong New Yorker at this point yeah she knew that they definitely could have found a
00:14:02
cheaper apartment somewhere else not on the Upper East Side but the Upper East Side is a nice area it's a well that's
00:14:07
the thing it's a very nice area so she's like um I'm pretty sure I could we could
00:14:13
find something a little cheaper but you know what this neighborhood is actually pretty really safe like I grew up here
00:14:19
so let's spend a little more money and we live in a safer Place worth the cost kind of that's so sad like knowing what
00:14:26
ends up happening right it really is cuz that that extra money bought her some kind of Peace of Mind exactly you would
00:14:33
think you know yeah exactly so because of the added safety kind of situation she agreed happily to move into the
00:14:41
apartment um 3C at 57 East 88th Street and it was managed it was like a a very highly managed complex and doctors
00:14:51
dentists other professionals were living in there so it was like a very like they
00:14:55
felt safe it was a well to-do apartment building and they were paying $28 per month on rent and remember that was
00:15:02
expensive honey that was it was a different time honey could you imagine it was a different time now it was here
00:15:10
that Janice met Emily hawford who was a friend in former college roommate of Pats not Janice's oh okay um who was
00:15:17
looking for a place to stay just for like temporarily for a short time um because she was trying to work out like
00:15:22
a longer term plan for herself she just needed somewhere to kind of take a beat yeah and Emily grew up in um Adena
00:15:30
Minnesota I hope I'm saying that right a suburb just outside Minneapolis and after graduating from high school she
00:15:36
ended up going out east to pursue a teaching degree at Smith college and after a year of graduate courses at
00:15:42
tough's University [ __ ] these were brilliant women really and a couple months teaching at a private Progressive
00:15:49
High School in Newton Massachusetts Newton I used to work in Newton uh which is in case you were wondering a suburb
00:15:55
of Boston yeah uh Emily decided that new England wasn't right for her which I was
00:16:00
like okay Emily all right that's fine Emily that's fine you know she was a New York gly yeah two very different places
00:16:07
and in the fall of 1963 she relocated to New York where she just kind of like went into a few short-term rentals with
00:16:14
friends just trying to look for work figuring out what you wanted to do next and after bouncing from shared living
00:16:20
arrangements like one to the other um Emily's friend Pat Tois was like hey come stay with me in my roommate Janice
00:16:27
for a little while you know until you find something more permanent yeah so Emily was like that's amazing thank you
00:16:33
so much so in Late July 1964 she moved in with Pat and Janice so as far as roommates went Emily hawford
00:16:42
could not have been more different than Janice like they were very different people yeah but they got along like this
00:16:48
wasn't to say they like you know or anything so Janice like we said was very outgoing very social like just
00:16:56
everywhere always and Emily was like much more quiet reserved shy Janice was this tall like Bombshell Blonde like by
00:17:07
you know by social standards of the time very conventionally attractive sure well
00:17:11
Emily was and this like upset me cuz look up these two women they're both beautiful but Emily was described as
00:17:18
basically plain and I was like I think she was beautiful I don't think she was plain at all yeah like and she was like
00:17:24
5 foot three dark brunette hair like she was described as having a very pale complexion which I was like easy
00:17:30
everyone easy on cuz that she's beautiful okay and she had glasses which is very like the She's All That of the
00:17:38
of the 50s it's like she had glasses so she wasn't as like bombshell as anybody else hey shout out to Freddy Prince to
00:17:46
to this I say like [ __ ] beauty standards because they were both gorgeous they were both just very uniquely gorgeous
00:17:52
people in their own way I agree beautiful both smart both capable just want to put that out there because a lot
00:18:00
of times Emily gets put down as like plain she had glasses and it's like okay they were both beautiful get a grip
00:18:07
everybody but again too Emily was friendly sweet very smart like just like Janice they were both and that's why
00:18:16
they got along like they it seems like they appreciated the differences in each other like I think Emily kind of like
00:18:22
looked at Janice and was like [ __ ] Janice like girl that crazy lady and it's like and Janice was like here's my
00:18:29
like very reliable like wonderful friend Emily you know like they just it worked
00:18:34
um and Emily's personality how sweet she was and friendly and like very capable it helped her in her professional life
00:18:42
cuz she was an elementary school teacher oh and in fact their professional Pursuits were probably like the biggest
00:18:49
thing that they had in common together that they were both very driven they had both intentionally put off any serious
00:18:55
romantic relationships or marriage to build their own careers for themselves something that the Press would make a
00:19:02
great deal about after their deaths when in reality these were just two driven young women that's really as far as it
00:19:09
went now despite their differences in personality like I said they got along very well um but again Emily this was
00:19:16
temporary for her she never intended to stay at 57 East 88th Street for very long okay which makes this even more
00:19:23
horrific yeah tragic now according to her friend Clark Montgomery Emily had quote a fairly clear list of priorities
00:19:31
get a job teaching preferably in a suburban school system move at the end of August into an apartment on Park
00:19:36
Avenue in 37th Street with two Smith classmates and save enough money for a trip to Europe next summer so she was
00:19:43
like let's go like doing it while her goals were ambitious Emily was committed and by the end of August she had begun
00:19:49
packing what few belongings she had at this apartment and she was going to be moving she was starting to move them to
00:19:55
Park Avenue so she had already she literally started the process she was starting the process when this happened
00:20:00
on the morning of August 28th Emily had gone by the apartment to pack up the last of her belongings and say goodbye
00:20:06
to her friends oh my God completely unaware that this would be the last time she spoke to
00:20:13
anyone wow which makes this even more horrific now just as Janice Emily and Pat were kind of establishing their
00:20:20
independence and starting out on their professional paths like I was talking about before the nation as a whole was
00:20:27
undergoing a kind of social identity crisis with regard to race gender sexuality you know this was a time of
00:20:33
like immense like what the [ __ ] is going on lots and lots of change everybody figuring out that like we don't all fit
00:20:38
into this box yeah it doesn't all have to go like Leave it to Beaver way exactly coming out of the 50s being like
00:20:44
what the [ __ ] was that right like you know so the Civil Rights and feminist movements sometimes referred to as the
00:20:51
women's movement MH were gaining traction very much so in urban areas and they were directly challenging those
00:20:58
those attitudes that we were just talking about and the long held beliefs about what was appropriate and
00:21:03
acceptable in Social spaces people were really striking out in different directions for women especially younger
00:21:09
women the idea of marrying young and immediately starting a family was no longer looking like a super attractive
00:21:15
option w w some people did that's the that's the beauty of this movement it was like do what's right for you if you
00:21:21
think this is what I want to do I want to get married I want to have children I want to be a homemaker I want to be
00:21:27
there I want to cook for my family I don't want to go out and do anything else like I want to do this then hell
00:21:34
yeah it was all about what Wasing to you as a woman but if you don't want to do that then hell yeah Queen you're both
00:21:40
Queens you get to choose what you want to do and that's the key word the the choice you get to choose and whatever
00:21:47
you choose and you you are happy with it you feel successful and you feel productive [ __ ] yeah Queen that's the
00:21:53
whole point right whatever you want to do nothing is the wrong choice here um but but for women you know that idea of
00:21:59
marrying younger and all that that was becoming less of like the you have to do this at this point and for and many
00:22:07
young women like Janice and Emily were like you know what I'm going to put it off for a little while and I'm going to
00:22:11
work on this and according to women's study scholar Marilyn Johnson this quote produced a panic about career girls and
00:22:20
crime that reinforce Notions of women's vulnerability at a time when young women
00:22:24
were enjoying greater autonomy and visibility now for the better part of the first half of the 20th century the
00:22:31
crime rate in New York City had actually remained relatively low uh which kind of
00:22:36
made everybody feel a little safe throughout the city like nothing's really happening so their why feel safe
00:22:42
but by midcentury the murder rate had been slowly Rising not a boom but slowly Rising uh it went from four homicides
00:22:51
per 100,000 residents in the early 1950s to 7.6 per 100,000 in early 1960 doesn't
00:23:00
sound like a lot but it's a jump and it's a difference so that has to be looked at and again notable uptick in
00:23:08
the grand scheme of things in violent crime and even despite this Janice felt really comfortable living in the
00:23:15
neighborhood she'd grown up in so she was like I've grown up here and she told her roommates like don't worry nothing
00:23:21
happens here like I grew up here I know this place like the back of my hand she's like nothing ever happens here oh
00:23:27
that's you know like why wouldn't you feel safe thing right now on the morning of August
00:23:32
28th Pat Tois was rushing to get ready for work while 21-year-old Janice slept in and 23-year-old Emily was in the
00:23:40
kitchen making coffee now after finishing an orange and drinking the last of the coffee Pat rinsed the cup
00:23:46
took the trash out to the garbage shoot listened for the click of the automatic bolt that would lock the door behind her
00:23:53
and she heard it and was on her way and Emily followed Pat's exit a short time later and after loading a few items in
00:24:00
the car that she was actually borrowing from her roommate's sister um she drove the short distance to an rosenberg's
00:24:07
apartment in Riverside to return the car Anne Rosenberg was who she was borrowing
00:24:11
the car from so she was going back to the apartment to drop it off you know and apparently like they they kind of
00:24:17
just like sat with each other uh Emily and an had a cup of coffee and then they ended up going there respective ways
00:24:23
sure now Pat was at her desk at the time life company when her phone rang a little afternoon and it was Janice's
00:24:30
mother and Janice's mother was calling to ask whether Pat had heard from Janice that morning because she said someone
00:24:36
from Newsweek had called to ask where Janice was and why she hadn't come to work that day oh no as far as Pat knew
00:24:44
Janice was still asleep when she left the apartment that morning but she remembered she was like you know what
00:24:49
she did mention that she was maybe going to travel down to a March on Washington
00:24:54
that was happening so she was like you know what maybe she ended up doing that I don't know if she called the job I
00:24:59
don't know maybe she got caught up there yeah like who knows but she didn't really tell anyone else about that like
00:25:04
I think I'm the only one she mentioned it to so she was like you know what maybe that's where she's gone but
00:25:09
whatever the case Janice would have definitely left left a note she was like so I'll I'm sure she left something
00:25:15
about it and it doesn't sound like she was the type to no call no show no she really wasn't she wasn't irresponsible
00:25:20
so Pat promised to call Mrs Wy as soon as she got home she was like I'm sure I'll find a note when I get there and
00:25:25
I'll let you know so she was a little concerned like she was like it was just like nothing outright but she was like
00:25:33
something was a little off here and so Pat called one of Emily's new roommates to see if Emily had arrived at the new
00:25:39
apartment yet because she was like I just want to make sure everybody's good yeah and the girl told Pat she hadn't
00:25:45
seen Emily at all that day so she was concerned but she said she wasn't wasn't yet alarmed at this point but she was
00:25:53
like huh like that makes this Weir something's off like something's a little off but Pat about her day as
00:25:58
normal cuz she was like you know what we'll figure this out later like I'm sure they're wherever they need to be
00:26:03
and she got home around 6:30 p.m. and when she reached the front door of their third floor apartment remember it's on
00:26:09
the third floor uh Pat unlocked the door which was still locked H walked in nothing seemed unusual when she first
00:26:17
walked through the door but when she reached the kitchen the service door that led out to the garbage shoot the
00:26:22
one that she heard click behind her yes that was a jar huh even though again she
00:26:28
had heard it lock when she left for work so things were becoming even more alarming when she reached the bedroom
00:26:33
she shared with Janice she found it in shambles oh no like someone had torn through that
00:26:40
room wildly clothes shoes papers everything was scattered around the room and two suitcases which were always
00:26:48
stored in a on a shelf in the closet they were never taken out unless they were going somewhere were open on the
00:26:54
bed huh like there's no way reason they would have been there and on the other side of the room the drawers of both
00:26:59
dressers had been pulled out and all the contents were scattered all over the floor and that must have been
00:27:05
frightening no matter what but then you think you're seeing all of your personal
00:27:08
belongings scattered and you're like thrown about what yep there were hair curlers empty half empty packs of
00:27:15
cigarettes and pile and a pile of pennies on the floor too now she was like we've definitely been burglarized
00:27:22
so that's terrifying so she left the room and didn't notice the Heap of sheets lying just on one side of the bed
00:27:29
okay made her way into the bigger of the apartments two bathrooms the light was on in the bathroom when she went in
00:27:36
there which again was weird and Pat immediately noticed that there was a large 12in carving knife just sitting on
00:27:42
the edge of the sink oh my God and so she's looking at the knife and she's like why the [ __ ] is that in the
00:27:48
bathroom and then she notices that there are streaks of Blood on the handle just
00:27:53
on the handle like somebody had rinsed the blade sure and was like oh no and then she thought she said her immediate
00:28:01
thought was oh no Janice has slashed her wrists H which like I'm not sure why that would maybe that was just like what
00:28:09
else could have I don't know what's happening here yeah cuz she said she was just panicked like this is panic and in
00:28:14
that moment nothing made sense to her so she was like that didn't make sense to me but it was the I don't know what else
00:28:19
to think like I'm just freaking out cuz she didn't think Emily because she thought Emily left like I know Emily
00:28:25
left the apartment Janice was the only one here she was sleeping late right and then when she didn't show up to work she
00:28:30
was like oh my like what happened like did something yeah yeah so again nothing made sense so she was like I got to call
00:28:35
someone for help I don't know what's happening and I got to get the [ __ ] out of here so she was like I have to get
00:28:40
out of here so she so out she ran into the hall and she was trying to find somebody out there but she found an
00:28:46
empty hallway so she ran down to the lobby and from a pay phone she called her boyfriend okay again she's very
00:28:52
stressed out she doesn't know what to do yeah he agreed to come over immediately
00:28:56
she was never able to remember exactly how the next hour unfolded she was like it was so panicked that I didn't know
00:29:02
what to do but she was like I know that I called the police I just don't know if
00:29:06
it was the second phone call I made the first or the third I don't know she called the police and then she placed a
00:29:13
call to Janice's parents so she was like I don't know what order I did this in but I called them need I called everyone
00:29:21
and when Mrs Wy answered she asked to speak to Max instead and she said I wanted to speak to you so as to not
00:29:27
alarm Mrs Wy oh now Pat told Janice's father before explaining that she'd returned home to find no note from
00:29:34
Janice and it appeared that someone had ransacked their apartment like I don't know what's going on here and she's like
00:29:41
I don't know where Janice is and I did not find a note now living just a few blocks away Janice's parents because
00:29:46
remember that's she grew up in this neighborhood they arriv before the police okay and Max panicked went into
00:29:53
the apartment to try to survey what was going on and try to make sure wasn't in there and Max Wy would later recall this
00:30:01
to Bernard lewitz and he said I stepped into the bathroom and leaned over and looked at the knife and realized that
00:30:07
although it had been put under the under the faucet and the blade was clean there
00:30:11
was a quar inch of Blood on the hasp I was frightened and I went back to the bedroom that the two ladies were
00:30:17
inspecting and told them to go into the living room and sit down and not touch anything now Max entered Emily's bedroom
00:30:24
and found it in a similar state of disarray he said quote when the door was half opened I saw the first of the two
00:30:30
twin beds there was a lot of luggage on the bed but the second bed was completely saturated by Blood and she
00:30:38
hadn't noticed this when she first walk in cuz she was so she just looking everywhere I'm sure he said it was
00:30:42
complet and you look at a crime scene photo it it is completely saturated by Blood oh man he said it was a massive
00:30:48
gore that's how he described it and so max entered the room and made his way around to the other side of the bed by
00:30:55
the window where he unfortunately found the bodies of his daughter Janice and her roommate Emily on the floor oh my
00:31:02
God they were facing each other on the floor and appeared to be tied together with what they later found out was
00:31:08
strips of bed sheets so this person whoever had done this had ripped strips from their own bed sheets which takes a
00:31:15
long time he recalled quote and this is he's talking about his own child here he
00:31:20
said Janice was nude Emily was dressed oh my God Janice had been stabbed through the heart Emily knifing around
00:31:28
the neck was noticeable oh my God the curlers were still in Janice's hair Emily had been frightfully cut it was
00:31:34
very gory that's how he described it oh my God so he pulled the blanket from the
00:31:40
bed and laid it across the girls then he went back out to the living room and called in the police to report the
00:31:46
discovery and it's like that's his daughter he walked in on that oh my God that I don't know how you
00:31:53
ever go on after that unfortunately it affects him later of course I bet it did um now in reality the attack on Janice
00:32:00
and Emily was even more brutal than what Max had described oh no um both had been
00:32:08
stabbed over 60 times each yep what the [ __ ] seven of which were directly to Janice's heart and this is very graphic
00:32:20
Janice's intestines were quote out of her stomach oh my God yeah and her father saw that yeah so she was
00:32:29
literally like she was disemboweled disemboweled and even worse somehow the killer had actually initially stabbed
00:32:36
them with a broken soda bottle oh my God then a small knife that small knife broke in the
00:32:46
process so he went back to the kitchen found a large chef's knife and returned to the bedroom and continued stabbing
00:32:56
them and was that that the knife that she had found when she KN Pat had found in the bathroom wow so he stabbed them
00:33:03
over 60 times using a broken soda bottle which do you know how brutal and [ __ ]
00:33:10
up that is yes and then when he had to stopped doing that cuz he broke the soda bottle enough he used a knife and so
00:33:18
much Fury and rage that he broke that knife and then went and found a third weapon to continue stabbing them this is
00:33:25
insane yeah now upon closer inspection detectives realized that Janice and Emily had
00:33:32
actually been tied at the wrists and the ankle separately and then the killer tied them together okay so laying near
00:33:40
the body they also found the Broken Blade from that first knife the broken bottle initially used in the attack and
00:33:47
an open jar of noxema cream a Gillette razor blade a pair of women's underwear and a piece of paper smeared with
00:33:55
lipstick laying nearby Emily's head okay everything was completely saturated with
00:34:01
blood I'm just thinking to myself right now this was obviously like midm morning
00:34:05
that this happened because one of them was expected to be at work one of them Pat was at work and then like came back
00:34:11
to this later yeah in the in the day how did nobody heard anything it's wild and
00:34:17
they're in the they're on the third floor like no one heard anything it's wild this is and just the fact that this
00:34:24
happened midm morning it sounds like and just so you know we are going to find out what happened here okay like exactly
00:34:31
what happened here and like just as a quick little trigger warning cuz there is sexual assault involved in this and
00:34:40
I'm not going to get into like the graphic details of it but the open jar of noxa Cream came into play there okay
00:34:47
so this is how brutal This was oh you know God now for the officers on the scene who had seen a lot of like Horrors
00:34:57
with their time on the police force I mean they're in New York City they're part of the homicide unit the violence
00:35:04
that they saw perpetrated against these two women was overwhelming I mean this is like on a completely Galactic level
00:35:13
like this is insane they were shocked like just the fact that her intestines were out of her body yeah and after
00:35:20
hours in the apartment detective John Lynch came out into the hallway and was overheard to say quote there's a
00:35:27
slaughterhouse in there in 12 years I've never seen anything like it I believe it
00:35:31
12 years on the NYPD and he had never seen anything like that obviously saying something but I mean I believe that yeah
00:35:38
now 10 nearly 10 hours later investigators and technicians had finished the whole initial processing of
00:35:44
the scene and the bodies were taken by ambulance to the morg that's all while Max Wy had to take it upon himself to
00:35:52
call Emily's parents and let them know what happened so max Wy was the one who called Emily's parents
00:35:59
which he took on so much that day yeah like and his daughter was brutally attacked and killed as well I'm like who
00:36:06
was taking care of him that's remarkable that he even was able to do that yeah now I mean besides the complete
00:36:13
brutality of this scene and just the absolute shock of all this happening the crime scene was baffling to
00:36:20
investigators as well right because although the apartment was definitely rans sacked it was clearly as as far as
00:36:27
Pat could tell nothing had been stolen and was there any sign of like any Breakin no no sign of forced entry right
00:36:35
cuz when she came home the door was still locked which is so strange to me well and all the jewelry was still on
00:36:41
the dressers Emily's purse was still at the scene and then there were you know Emily and Janice's bodies themselves
00:36:49
like I had mentioned before again trigger warning Janice had been violently sexually assaulted her wounds
00:36:56
were also more severe yeah I mean and she'd been left nude Emily on the other hand was fully clothed and mhm based on
00:37:05
the state in which the bodies were found and the lack of any other apparent motive investigators determined that
00:37:12
Janice was likely the primary victim and Emily's death might have been her being
00:37:16
in the wrong place at the wrong time oh that's awful and just the fact that she was like not supposed to be in that
00:37:22
place like that day she was going to go to the other apartment yeah and adding to the mystery was how like you said how
00:37:30
the killer even gained access into the apartment in the first place because like we said there was no sign of forced
00:37:36
entry and the doorman didn't recall seeing anything unusual that day and the building had no fire escape on the
00:37:43
exterior cuz that was going to be my next question because not only did they like they got in somehow but then they
00:37:49
got out and the door remained locked exactly so it's like what somebody with a key yeah now like we said Remember
00:37:57
When Pat returned home that door was still locked the only notable thing was an open window okay but remember we're
00:38:07
on the third floor in New York city so and all investigators determined was there was no way that someone could have
00:38:13
gotten up there scale a building you can't scale the building there's no fire escape so how the [ __ ] did they get to
00:38:19
the third floor like this doesn't make sense and then also crazy that the windows open and still nobody heard
00:38:24
anything yeah so they basically just kind of closed any kind of possibility that somebody broke in right away which
00:38:32
we find out like might have been a little too soon that they did that okay but investigators were basically
00:38:38
operating on the assumption that the killer was definitely willingly invited into the apartment by one of the victims
00:38:44
it really is the only possibility that looked likely at the time likely but then how did they lock the door on the
00:38:50
way out well they thought that's the thing like how did they get out that's what no one is really coming up with and
00:38:57
they were so focused on that idea that like oh they must have just been led into the apartment they weren't thinking
00:39:02
logically about what you just asked like asking the real questions that you should be asking how the [ __ ] did they
00:39:07
lock the door on their way up right so they were they were so focused on it that they kind of negated the idea that
00:39:14
there was a stranger involved here and they also said that they couldn't fathom that a random stranger would break in
00:39:22
and inflict this much brutality on someone because which you get but so that does happen and you can't close off
00:39:29
an Avenue until you know that that Avenue needs to be closed off like we've seen this time and time again when you
00:39:35
enter a crime scene with a preconceived narrative in your mind it is almost always wrong and you almost always [ __ ]
00:39:41
up the crime it's true and it's like so and also because of the status of the victims Daughters of an advertising
00:39:48
executive and a surgeon yeah wow the murders were made the highest priority at the time with roughly 150 um officers
00:39:57
and detectives assigned to the case many of them were pulled from other precincts
00:40:01
and Burrows and in their first press conference chief of detectives Lawrence McCarney told reporters quote the police
00:40:08
had no suspects no leads what they did though what they did have was a basic theory that someone had come into the
00:40:15
apartment either with a plan to murder Janice or something happened in the Heat of the Moment that led to her death okay
00:40:22
but again no one can say how they got back out of the apartment right and this was supported by the fact that Emily was
00:40:28
known to have left to have left to return the car to Riverside that morning so her coming back to the apartment
00:40:35
would have been a surprise to anyone in there like she wasn't supposed to be there she had left right so if somebody
00:40:41
was in there they were like oh [ __ ] I thought she was gone so they're still running off this idea that it's Janice
00:40:46
and Emily was just wrong wrong time wrong place and also Emily hadn't been in New York for very long and really
00:40:52
only knew a small number of people so if the killer was known to the victims as detectives really thought that they were
00:41:00
he was most likely going to be found among Janice's friend group okay now knowing that Janice had like we had said
00:41:06
before a very rich social and dating life investigators started running down the names in a small green address book
00:41:13
that she had that they found in the top drawer uh this included dozens of men and women many of whom she had actually
00:41:21
dated M um and they were absolutely convinced it was somebody in that book someone Janice knew and the the idea
00:41:29
that she also could have been involved with women really threw investigators for a loop they focused really solely on
00:41:38
her like that was really it and there's actually an ID discovery about this and there's this great quote about how this
00:41:44
is a great example of cops plunging into a lifestyle that they were just way over
00:41:50
their heads about and in the meantime cuz like they were they were basically interviewing a couple there was one
00:41:56
woman that she was known to have I think lived with for a little while named Pearl okay and pearl was like this like
00:42:02
Brash like just like the [ __ ] do you want to know kind of girl like she was just a hot [ __ ] and she was just kind of
00:42:09
like I don't know it's like I clearly didn't kill her you know what I mean like what but she was seemingly like you
00:42:15
know [ __ ] up about what had happened to Janice but she was like I don't know why you're thinking I do this like car
00:42:21
about each other and the cops were like like I don't know what to do cuz remember it's barely out of the 1950s at
00:42:29
this point so the cops were like what like what she dated women and then it became this whole thing of like oh God
00:42:35
she dated women too like what's going on here it must be some must be some deviant lifestyle that has led to this
00:42:41
you know so it's just ridiculous how sad is it that that like would still happen
00:42:44
probably exactly now in the meantime Max Wy Janice's father offered the first potential lead okay when he told
00:42:52
detectives that in the weeks before she died his daughter had actually been plagued and terrified quote unquote by a
00:42:59
series of obscene phone calls oh unfortunately all the people in Janice a dress book had Alibis for the days that
00:43:06
the girls were murdered I say unfortunately fortunately too I guess cuz I would hate to think somebody in
00:43:12
her dress book was this person but caught now similarly the lead about the obscene phone calls really went nowhere
00:43:21
couldn't really go anywhere uh there were also other holes in the theory that they were running off of that really
00:43:26
couldn't be ignored for instance Janice had planned to go to the March on Washington that day and would have
00:43:32
otherwise been at work so like there was really no reason for her to be home like
00:43:36
this was out of her General routine and she wasn't even planning on being at home for the rest of the day right so
00:43:42
the killer would have had to either know her plans that day which seems unlikely
00:43:45
since her own roommates didn't know her plans that day yeah or they would have had to been watching the apartment which
00:43:51
seems sort of likely which could be likely now if the killer had been watching the apartment building to find
00:43:56
out whether Janice was home that also had certain implications like for example East 88th Street was in one of
00:44:03
the nicer neighborhoods and populated with middle and upper middle class residents so in that case someone
00:44:09
certainly would have noticed an unfamiliar face lingering in the area people knew each other here and they
00:44:15
were on the lookout especially if that person was like noticeably out of place in any way like people would be like
00:44:21
you're not from around here like what are you doing staring at this apartment kind of thing and after after all based
00:44:26
on the viciousness of the attacks and the mutilations to the bodies essentially Janice and Emily's killer
00:44:32
would have been covered in blood covered yeah which someone would have noticed in
00:44:38
broad daylight you would think and so armed with this new theory of like okay now we got to move away from that
00:44:45
original one an army of police officers descended on the Upper East Side neighborhood and started canvasing all
00:44:51
the buildings around Janice and Emily's building cuz they were like it's got to be someone around here mhm that nobody
00:44:57
would notice they wouldn't look out of place mhm now among the investigators leading the canvas was detective Eddie
00:45:04
buer oh I don't like that look yeah he was a detective from Brooklyn and he was brought on to assist in the case you're
00:45:12
going to want to kick Eddie buer in the [ __ ] chin I got that feeling immediately as you had this look in your
00:45:18
eye when you said that fucker's name now I'll give it to the detectives in Manhattan they were not into him either
00:45:24
so I'll give them that okay um they were appreciative of the help because they needed all the help
00:45:29
they could to Canvas you know there was a lot of people to talk to but a lot of them found uh buers I'll say his
00:45:38
personality and his approach distasteful at best okay uh particularly the way he interacted with some of the
00:45:49
residents in an around Janice's and emth Emily's neighborhood according to Bulger
00:45:54
so according to this Detective bul mhm not according to anybody else according to him he claimed that he had what he
00:46:02
would call a six sense for knowing not when any person was lying when black people were lying oh so he's a racist
00:46:12
[ __ ] yep cool and he was known by all to treat black interviewees with far less
00:46:20
respect than he did anyone else and he never got in trouble for this well because was such a high-profile case it
00:46:28
was determined pretty quickly that bulger's obvious racial bias was very risky to this case like it was not going
00:46:37
to help say you're going to you're going to shoot yourself in the foot here they
00:46:40
knew they were like he's going to taint this like this is going to happen he's going to push someone that's just just
00:46:45
because he's a racist [ __ ] right so bye [ __ ] they kicked him off the case almost immediately oh good yeah cuz they
00:46:51
got some reports that he was interacting with some of the people in the buildings
00:46:57
around Janice and Emily's building yeah and it was very clearly who he was treating nicely and who he wasn't and so
00:47:03
I think people that were partnered with him were like he's going to try to not only is this [ __ ] up but he's going to
00:47:09
get me in trouble too and like this whole case is going to fall apart and you're going to you're going to get the
00:47:13
wrong guy instead of so you're out of here Bulger but how [ __ ] up is that I know when a black person is lying that's
00:47:20
disgusting what the [ __ ] is wrong with you that's just literal pure hatred literal just you're just just say you're
00:47:27
racist like just say it R you essentially are now unfortunately even with Bulger off the case the
00:47:32
neighborhood canvas really turned up like no substantial leads and a month later investigators were still without
00:47:39
anything I almost said without nothing without nothing no a police spokesperson said there's a complete lack of physical
00:47:47
evidence no description of the murderer not one substantial clue not one tangible motive huh which is so
00:47:54
frustrating and despite having no new information or motive investigators continued to reject the notion that the
00:48:01
killer was quote a psychotic stranger who entered the apartment by chance instead they remained committed to the
00:48:08
belief that whoever killed Janice and Emily was most likely an acquaintance of Janice so they were moving slightly away
00:48:15
from the original Theory but still focusing on Janice which again I get it I get it because of what they're seeing
00:48:21
but I'm getting the sense though that it's like not well this was also refuted by Max Wy Janice's father who insisted
00:48:29
quote I knew most of the men Janice dated they were a very decent crowd and according to Max he said quote there was
00:48:37
only one that I had my that I had any deep inner disapproval of Jenice was infatuated with him he was a liar he was
00:48:45
mean he was cruel and so he reported the man's name to investigators he was like
00:48:50
here you go go check him out he was instantly checked out and cleared because he had a Rock Solid Alibi oh so
00:48:57
he's just an [ __ ] yeah now despite thousands of manh hours and the offer of $10,000 in a reward put up by Newsweek
00:49:04
where Janice worked which now would be like $100,000 oh wow uh the oneyear anniversary of the murders was coming up
00:49:11
quick and they didn't find a single piece of evidence that was going to help them now months later on April 14th 1964
00:49:20
a 46-year-old cleaning woman and mother of five named Minnie Edmonds was murdered she was stabbed to death near
00:49:28
Suter Avenue in Chester Street in Brooklyn by a man who was trying to steal her purse okay now this ended up
00:49:35
being kind of the first break in the case because what they didn't know it at the time and what really ended up being
00:49:42
what like I guess kind of broke the was the first break in the case was another young woman in Brooklyn was then report
00:49:50
um reported to police that she had been attacked like right like a week later after mini Edmonds was wow and she was
00:49:56
attacked in the same area and her name was Elba barrero and she was also in Brooklyn and it was around 1:30 a.m. uh
00:50:05
again a week after mini and she was grabbed from behind by a man who held her by the throat and then according to
00:50:12
her dragged her into a doorway and was trying to steal her purse H now Elba screamed and I guess he had told her
00:50:20
like if you scream I'll kill you yeah but she started to scream obviously cuz she's yeah you got to try
00:50:26
um and her attacker ended up running off oh okay so he ran off and before he ran
00:50:31
off she tore a big button off of his Overcoat smart girl and a nearby patrol officer Frank Isola responded to the
00:50:39
screams and chased the suspect wow and he ended up losing sight of the suspect at one point but he saw a man named
00:50:47
George Whitmore who was 19 years old at the time and originally thought he was shorter and thinner like didn't match
00:50:54
the build of the person that he saw running away from the scene and who um who barrero had described him as looking
00:51:02
like MH so he kind of lost sight and he was just like I don't know about that but the following day while detective
00:51:09
aola and his partner detective Richard um adala was on patrol in the same neighborhood they spotted Whitmore again
00:51:16
George Whitmore sure and just arrested him oh now it should be noted he's a black
00:51:24
man why did they arrest him when he didn't match the suspect that he saw with his own eyeballs running away from
00:51:31
the scene I don't know like what what charge are you what are you charging him with out of nowhere well what's what's
00:51:39
even better is they called um Elba up and they were like hey we have a suspect uh we need you to go identify him which
00:51:46
like ooh oof tainted already you can't say that he's nope like that that's not how that work we have someone we want
00:51:53
you to look not how that works so they asked her if they could I she could identify him and she was like well I
00:51:59
never saw his face and they I come down and she was like but yeah I can identify him but you
00:52:08
just said you never saw his face I don't know about that a million people in this
00:52:13
world have the same build not usually the same face yep Alba honey and so I was in your corner for a minute there
00:52:20
you think is that they would put him in like a proper lineup correct just that's how this works I don't know if I
00:52:27
would think that but yeah it's even worse because they brought Elba to the door of the interrogation room where
00:52:34
Whitmore was sitting and said is that the guy we just arrested him and we think he's the guy is that
00:52:42
the guy can you look at him in that interrogation room no where he is very clearly looking like a suspect no you
00:52:49
literally can't do that like you can't can't and she hesitated and she was like I don't know and then she said can I
00:52:57
hear him speak and they had him say something and she was like yep that's him oh that's the shakiest [ __ ] I've
00:53:06
ever heard I don't know what yeah so as Ela barrero was helping to identify her attack her and she was
00:53:14
overheard by a detective who happened to be in the area no don't you even a detective by the name of uh Eddie buer
00:53:21
no not this [ __ ] I knew we hadn't seen the last of him I felt it in my bones yeah he happened to work in the same
00:53:27
Precinct oh goody he was also very bitter about being kicked off the the Wy hawford murder case a few monser solve
00:53:36
it quote unquote so detective Bulger saw this moment as an opportunity to redeem
00:53:40
himself and he was given permission to interview the suspect whose idea was that yeah according to detective Bulger
00:53:49
when officers searched George Whitmore they found several photographs of women in his pockets okay um or excuse me of a
00:53:57
woman I should say in his pockets and when they asked who the woman was Whitmore claimed he found the photos and
00:54:04
had been showing them to his friends to make them think it was his girlfriend okay detective Bulger though was like no
00:54:11
that's a picture of Janice Wy and immediately was like you are the killer of Janice Wy and Emily hawford
00:54:20
was it even a picture of Janice I guess we'll have to see huh we'll have to see in part two you son of a [ __ ] because
00:54:30
when I tell you that this is a twisty turny series of events that is going to happen right now oh man because remember
00:54:40
Elba barrero grabbed a button off of this person so that's going to be a thing yes they have a button she's
00:54:46
identified him George Whitmore and now detective buer here who is racist a known racist and was actually kicked off
00:54:54
the cas for being RAC being racist is now in charge of dealing with this black man who is a suspect based off a real
00:55:05
wonky identification based off of nothing essentially and is now they found pictures in his pockets like just
00:55:11
so you're set up for the next thing yeah of a woman who he's saying I just found
00:55:15
these pictures I was just claiming it was my girlfriend I was trying to be cool mhm and now detective Bulger is
00:55:20
like that's Janice Wy so you would think with all that you're like wow okay that's a little weird we got them right
00:55:29
we don't so yeah I had a feeling we didn't um stay uh stay tuned for part two because it's going to get very
00:55:37
frustrating but um in the end there's at least a a tiny bit of Justice do we get
00:55:44
the right person eventually we'll know who did it oh no all right well we hope you keep
00:55:51
listening I'm so trepidacious keep weird but not so weird that you're anything like detective
00:56:02
buer no [Music] no