00:00:00
So it was the President's Cup in 2005.
00:00:02
Won the US Open. Month later I won the
00:00:04
world match play. Week after that was
00:00:06
the President's Cup and Monday flew
00:00:08
straight to Washington DC. Now we're on
00:00:11
Tuesday night, black tie function. Both
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teams are there. All these important
00:00:16
people are there. The president was
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there. Clinton I think was then
00:00:21
uh it was uh Bush sat at his table. Had
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a nice conversation with him. So we're
00:00:26
in the in the uh in the White House.
00:00:28
That's pretty cool. Imagine a little
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moldy boy in the White House. You know,
00:00:31
it's crazy, isn't it? Um, so anyway,
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>> this podcast is filled with moments like
00:00:36
that.
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>> Oh, good. You're here. Come on. This is
00:00:40
the center of performance. Whenever
00:00:42
there's a top performance in New
00:00:43
Zealand, it all comes from here. That's
00:00:45
Lisa Carrington. She's been doing that
00:00:47
for days. That's the boys who got the
00:00:49
Holland one in.
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>> He did it again. Hey Finn, how's the
00:00:54
performance going?
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>> Top tier.
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>> Nice. This is our generate room. In here
00:00:58
you'll find our top performers helping
00:00:59
Kiwis maximize their Kiwi Saver
00:01:01
investments. Get in here in
00:01:03
>> maximize generate.
00:01:05
>> Putting performance first.
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>> Cambo, welcome to my podcast.
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>> Yeah, great to be here. Thank you.
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Thanks, Tom.
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>> It's so good to have you here. We've
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been like chatting um as we set up the
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studio for the last 10 minutes and um
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just some of the truth bombs you've
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dropped. I think it's going to be a
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great chat.
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>> I hope so. Yeah, I think it gives you an
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insight to my my pathway and and how um
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you know my performance over what the
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last 30 years as a pro and uh the
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insights of how I got there and so I'm
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looking forward to sharing that.
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>> Maybe Michael Campbell is he's never
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been heard before.
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>> Maybe maybe so depends on your questions
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how dig how deep you dig. So we'll see.
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when when you agreed to come on the
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podcast, I thought I'm sure I've got
00:01:44
Campbell's book in my bookshelf at home
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and I found this one, Rookie on Tour,
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Michael Campbell, which came out sort of
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at the beginning of your career.
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>> It was Yeah. 95, I think it was, written
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by Russell Gray, good good friend of
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mine. And that was after the Open,
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leading by, I think, uh, three shots
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going to the last round, finished third.
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Uh,
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>> British Open. Yeah.
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>> Yeah. The Open. The Open at St. Andrews,
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one of the biggest, you know,
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tournaments in the world. And that was
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when I um kind of said to myself, okay,
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I'm ready for the big stage now. Because
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if you think about it, you know, I came
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from very humble beginnings, a sheep
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farm, the golf course at Tahib Bay golf
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course was a sheet farm, fences around
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the greens. Went from that to leading
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the open. So I thought I was on the
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right track there.
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This is going to be so good. I've got
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I've got a whole card here uh about that
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open. Um because um yeah, you came third
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behind Rock Mediate and John Dailyaly,
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star of Happy Gilmore, too.
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>> Exactly. I saw that. Yeah.
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>> Um it was amazing. I remember at the
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time like being a Kiwi watching that
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just having goosebumps cuz I I don't
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know what happened in that third round.
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You shot like 65 or something, right?
00:02:46
>> Yeah, that's right. 65. I think the
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average that day was like 75. Was
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playing about 30 knots, I think, u that
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day. And and being brought up in
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Wellington, as you know, is the second
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windiest city in the world, I think they
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say. And and to me it was like home. So
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>> like it's not even a breeze.
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>> No. No. What's this? It's a wee breeze.
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And yeah, I played I mean probably the
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my best golf in my life that day and
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shot 65 and leading by three shots. And
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you know it was so much fun, you know. I
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remember the night before I didn't
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sleep. But I had I was so nervous, you
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know, and and a funny story about that
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is that um I went to after the third
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round I went to the press conference and
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the first time I was exposed to 300
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reporters from around the world and
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they're going, "Who's this Michael
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Campbell? Who are you?" You know, so I
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tried to explain myself where I was
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from.
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Some thought I was Poland uh some
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thought I was um I don't know Pakistani
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or something.
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>> Pakistani or it was like Yeah.
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Indonesian. And I said, "I'm a moldy."
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And they go, "Well, what's that?" You
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know, and so that's when I thought,
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"Okay, I stamp my stamp my my footprint
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on this um golfing world." And uh all of
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a sudden, all these management groups
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wanted to sign me on. So they enticed me
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with a uh helicopter ride cuz we stayed
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in Dundee and it's normally like a half
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an hour drive. It takes it took uh an
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hour because of the traffic, right? So
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they said, "Look, Mark, we'll organize
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your chopper ride from Dundee Airport to
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St. Andrews." I Yeah, that's great.
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Well, that was a big mistake. A big
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mistake. So I'm obviously last off on
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Sunday, 2:35 it was. And then forget the
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time. And um they said, "Okay, we'll
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organize a chopper for you at uh 2 hours
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before." So 12:30 at the airport,
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leaving the airport at 12:30 to St.
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Andrews. It's only like a 10-minute
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chopper ride. get there,
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airport's closed, no one's inside.
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So,
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it's compounded now because if you think
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about it, I'm leaning the open by three
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shots, the biggest tournament in the
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world, and I've got no way to get there.
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And I'm thinking to myself, I'm going to
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miss my my tea time. First time ever,
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you know, so I was panicking. It turned
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up probably about 45 minutes late, about
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quart 1. I'm thinking it's not going to
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work cuz it's 10 minutes to there.
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That's 1:30.
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And the helipad was like 20 minutes away
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from the actual golf course. And the
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driving range is away from the first
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tea. So I got to the driving range and I
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had about 15 minutes before my tea time.
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I probably four or five shots. My coach
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Mel Tong was there at the time. My dad
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was there. Um, yeah, it was it was
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weird. And then I rushed to the first
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TE. I think I had one practice putt,
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that was it. So, you imagine that, you
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know, leading the open, hitting four or
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five shots in your warm up before you
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play, one practice putt on the first te.
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So, my heart was went from, you know,
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140 to 180 nearly uh beats per minute.
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And I nearly missed I nearly missed the
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uh first uh first fairway. It's nearly
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impossible, right? It's like 150 m wide.
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I nearly missed it left.
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>> So, it was a rough day from the very
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beginning. And it's my fault. Uh I take
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full responsibility of that. No one
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else's. So,
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>> how is how is it your fault for for
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going for the chopper option?
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>> Yeah, I could I mean that that taught me
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a big lesson for me. Do not change your
00:06:25
routine. if I went through the uh my
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normal routine of you know it was it was
00:06:30
a nice journey with you know my team had
00:06:33
a couple of friends there Williams and
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Jonathan Ywood um Mel Tong my coach and
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my girlfriend at the time Julie and my
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dad so it was a nice kind of like you
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know hour together just to think about
00:06:45
the day um I didn't have that I was
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rushing around the whole time on that
00:06:48
day so bad start and then as you know I
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I finished third so um disappointed but
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if someone said to me, you know,
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Michael, you're going to finish third in
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the open in 95 at St. Andrews. Of
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course, you'll take that, right? But,
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uh, what I learned is, um, you know, you
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always learn from your losses,
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>> and I failed, you could say,
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um, it's a very harsh word to use, I
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think.
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Um, but I learned a lot that day.
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>> I had Sir Steve Hansen on the podcast
00:07:21
earlier this year, and he he had a
00:07:22
saying it's like we we don't lose, we
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learn.
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>> Exactly. I mean, I remember having a
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conversation with Steve Hansen about
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that. I was lucky enough to get invited
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a few times on the uh captain's run
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on the Friday and met some of the boys
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and you know, they were great and spoke
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to Steve Hansen, lovely guy. I really
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admire him, what he's done for the
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blacks and for for New Zealand and we
00:07:43
had a few conversations about that, you
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know, and that that subject came up with
00:07:47
Steve and I and um and I totally agree
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with him.
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>> Oh, this is going to be so good, mate.
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already already so good. Is it Do you
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feel like um Yeah, you you could have
00:07:57
potentially won that day had it not been
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for for this. Um I mean, hindsight, eh,
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you never know.
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>> Yeah. Ask ask Chris uh Crystal Bull. I
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don't know. Maybe. Yes. Um but maybe
00:08:09
fate stepped in and said, "Okay, you're
00:08:10
not ready yet.
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>> I made a big mistake." So,
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>> you know, uh I would love to win the
00:08:16
Open, of course, don't get me wrong. I
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mean to win the Open and the US Open
00:08:20
together would have been nice but um
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>> but I learned a lot from that day. So
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you know in in reflection now I look
00:08:27
back and go okay it was a stupid mistake
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Michael
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>> but I'll tell you a story about uh um
00:08:32
the US Open what I did then but uh right
00:08:34
now let's focus on the 95 but yeah it
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was it was um it was a nice um nice way
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to look at it I think more of a positive
00:08:42
way to look at it.
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>> Yeah. I said this cat in the book here.
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How Apparently your sister used to um
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get copies of that and sell it to girls
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at school.
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>> How'd you know that story?
00:08:54
>> Come on. How'd you do that? Research.
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Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,
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yeah. I was um
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>> Yeah. Oh, this embarrassing.
00:09:01
>> Why? Just just cuz all the girls at
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school loved you.
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>> Well, I thought they I I don't know.
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Maybe I was
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>> Was it cheek charm? You got You glitched
00:09:10
in your eye in that photo.
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>> I can't remember. I think I was a little
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bit cheeky and they like um in a bit of
00:09:16
a rabble I think. And
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>> I can't believe he put that up. This is
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this is embarrassing.
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>> If someone if someone said to that kid
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in the photo, how old were you then? Do
00:09:24
you re were you playing golf?
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>> I was and I know the exact picture was
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like 11 years old.
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>> Okay. So you were playing golf then you
00:09:29
and you were really quite
00:09:30
>> just started playing golf. Yeah. And so
00:09:32
if someone said to you back then um that
00:09:34
you're going to go on to win um you know
00:09:37
US Open, play the Masters 10 times,
00:09:39
third in the British Open, New Zealand
00:09:40
Open, etc. Um what would you what would
00:09:42
you have thought at that age? Would you
00:09:44
have thought, "Yep, that that sounds
00:09:46
about right." Or would you be, "No, no
00:09:48
[ __ ] way. This is
00:09:49
>> Oh, no. No. For me, for me it was like I
00:09:51
had those dreams at that age."
00:09:54
>> So if someone told you that was going to
00:09:55
happen, you wouldn't have been
00:09:56
surprised. You'd be like, "Yep, that's
00:09:57
the part." Yeah, that's that was my um
00:09:59
my plan from the very very start.
00:10:01
Obviously, every kid is important to
00:10:03
have those dreams, you know, and um
00:10:06
>> I just wanted to be different. Uh I'm
00:10:08
not sure if you saw my documentary dear
00:10:10
to be different, but it it gives you an
00:10:11
insight to um
00:10:14
my thought process and how I got there,
00:10:16
my pathway to uh a major championship.
00:10:19
>> But um yeah, as a kid that age, I wanted
00:10:21
to do that. I remember getting up early.
00:10:23
It's my dad. My dad uh got me into it
00:10:26
into golf at a very young age. I was
00:10:28
probably six, seven years old. Didn't
00:10:29
really play golf that much. I played
00:10:31
rugby. Of course, rugby was I wanted to
00:10:32
be an all black.
00:10:33
>> I I heard your mom was um anti you
00:10:35
playing rugby.
00:10:35
>> Yeah. She didn't like me. She didn't
00:10:36
like like playing playing rugby, but I
00:10:39
loved it. Dad loved it. But I kind of
00:10:41
found out very quickly I wasn't good
00:10:42
enough, strong enough, fast enough to
00:10:44
play for the All Blacks. I kind of knew
00:10:46
that. So I thought, okay, what's another
00:10:48
sport? Because I wasn't very good at
00:10:50
school, uh to be honest with you. I
00:10:52
mean, um, and so, uh, I tried softball
00:10:56
and there's not much money in softball.
00:10:58
So, from that age, I thought I think
00:10:59
golf is is the way to go. Uh, cuz I
00:11:02
remember getting up early in the
00:11:03
mornings with dad watching cuz dad was a
00:11:05
golf fanatic. Still is.
00:11:08
>> Pretty handy. E, a single handicapper.
00:11:09
>> Yeah.
00:11:10
>> And your and your uncle Roger was good
00:11:11
as well.
00:11:11
>> Uncle Roger was was was the man. Yeah.
00:11:14
Uncle Roger was off scratch handicap.
00:11:17
>> Wow.
00:11:18
>> Um, he taught me a lot as well. Uncle
00:11:20
Roger. Uh
00:11:22
and uh yeah, so I remember getting up
00:11:23
early hours of the morning watching the
00:11:25
last nine holes of Augusta
00:11:28
and um back in those days we just had
00:11:31
color TV and I remember watching I think
00:11:34
Jack Nicholas winning
00:11:36
player or Arnold Palmer winning and
00:11:38
sitting down with dad cuz I think the
00:11:40
time difference was like like 4 in the
00:11:42
morning, 5 in the morning before school
00:11:46
and um I thought wow that'd be pretty
00:11:48
cool to play
00:11:49
walk in those fairways one day and as he
00:11:52
mentioned before I 10 times
00:11:54
>> yeah 10 times or whatever it was I don't
00:11:56
know um and I said to dad there's
00:12:00
there's no moldy people there no moldy
00:12:02
golfers cuz oh no there's no moldy
00:12:04
professional golfers on tour I thought I
00:12:07
want to change that so that was around
00:12:09
that age I want I wanted to to um you
00:12:13
know break the mold and and and um turn
00:12:17
professional one day so I had that dream
00:12:19
from a very early age, you know, of
00:12:21
winning a major championship. Uh, for me
00:12:24
it was the Open, the British Open. Um,
00:12:27
and obviously winning the US Open was a
00:12:29
bonus, but um, that was my goal. I think
00:12:32
when you have tour dreams like that,
00:12:34
which I did, anything's possible. It may
00:12:37
seem impossible at the time. If you
00:12:39
think about it, you know, I'm 11 years
00:12:41
old playing golf on a sheep farm, fences
00:12:44
around the greens. I got one club,
00:12:47
probably two or three golf balls. I used
00:12:49
to tear it up on sheep [ __ ]
00:12:52
you know. Went from that to winning one
00:12:55
of the biggest tournaments in the world
00:12:56
and having along the way being the best
00:13:00
player in the world ever to play this
00:13:01
game, Tiger. Standing next to me on on
00:13:04
the prize presentation
00:13:06
>> that's gone from that back in the 70s to
00:13:09
2005.
00:13:12
It's pretty cool story, isn't it,
00:13:14
>> mate? It's so I've got goosebumps just
00:13:15
hearing it. And also as you're peeling
00:13:17
off some of those names about uh the
00:13:19
people you were watching at Augusta as a
00:13:21
as a little boy on color TV. Um yeah,
00:13:24
Arnold Palmer. He played his last uh
00:13:26
British Open the year that you finished
00:13:27
third. Yeah.
00:13:28
>> Uh
00:13:29
>> I remember that. He he was playing in
00:13:30
front of me. Yeah.
00:13:31
>> Jack Nicholas Golden Beer. He he he sent
00:13:34
you a handwritten letter after 2005.
00:13:36
There's so much to get into, but it's
00:13:38
just like a complete full circle moment.
00:13:40
Did it make it Yeah. What does being
00:13:41
moldy mean to you? Did did it make your
00:13:44
success even more special?
00:13:45
>> Strength.
00:13:47
Um
00:13:48
that's one word comes to mind. Um
00:13:52
I think um being different
00:13:56
is is powerful. Um I wanted to prove to
00:13:59
the world that Moldi can play golf
00:14:02
>> and I have
00:14:05
>> well yeah I was I was the first Moldi to
00:14:07
win lots of things, you know. uh firsts
00:14:10
on the Australasian tour, European tour,
00:14:14
first major, first uh Moldi to win a
00:14:17
world match play, uh first lots of
00:14:20
firsts and
00:14:22
I'm proud of that really. Um I'm proud
00:14:25
that I've, you know,
00:14:28
blazed a way for
00:14:31
uh other other young kids to fulfill
00:14:33
their dreams. Um that's my purpose on
00:14:35
what in this on this planet. I was
00:14:38
taught that from a very young age when I
00:14:40
was younger growing up in on the farm. I
00:14:42
was very close to my grandmother. Uh she
00:14:45
was a huge influence in my in my um my
00:14:48
dreams and
00:14:49
>> as a person she told me that um and
00:14:52
imagine I'm trying to paint a picture
00:14:54
here for you guys. I was sitting down on
00:14:56
the couch cuz I used to smoke rolies and
00:14:59
um so I used to help her prepare her
00:15:01
smoke. So she would sit down and we just
00:15:03
talk about life and she was a very wise
00:15:05
woman and I was probably about 10 9 10
00:15:09
years old at the time and she would just
00:15:13
say look Michael you know I can see that
00:15:14
you can do something special in your
00:15:16
life I can see it I can see the future
00:15:18
I'm thinking you're a little bit loopy
00:15:21
uh grandma but okay whatever
00:15:24
it was like was off duck ducks back you
00:15:26
know I didn't really think much of it
00:15:29
and then um uh she goes yeah once to
00:15:32
receive. I know you're born with two
00:15:33
hands. I use this phrase before, born
00:15:35
with two hands. One to receive, one to
00:15:37
give back. And we do receive a lot,
00:15:39
which you will. Um it's you've been in a
00:15:42
position to give back uh to the world.
00:15:46
And um yeah, so that was that always
00:15:48
stuck with me. She planted that seed
00:15:51
all those years ago and now now I get
00:15:54
it.
00:15:55
>> You lost her quite young age when you
00:15:56
were you were 16.
00:15:57
>> 16.
00:15:58
>> Yeah. 16. Um that was devastating for me
00:16:00
and but it's amazing when I turned 16
00:16:03
and sorry when she passed away my golf
00:16:06
just went skyrocketed.
00:16:09
I don't know what is some spiritual
00:16:11
moment where I thought to myself okay
00:16:13
it's time to shine time to get up there
00:16:15
and and work hard and and do what you
00:16:18
know what you can do and um yeah it gave
00:16:21
me more power. So so the word moldy to
00:16:23
me means that um we're very proud of our
00:16:26
culture.
00:16:28
uh has given me strength over during the
00:16:31
hard times especially
00:16:32
>> you know I remember when I sunk that
00:16:35
last put on the last hole at the US Open
00:16:38
I raise my hands towards the heavens and
00:16:40
thank my tupa you know the people who
00:16:41
passed on before me um for their
00:16:46
um strength and courage and
00:16:49
uh to make make it possible because I I
00:16:52
couldn't do by myself out there although
00:16:54
I'm I'm the one hitting the golf ball it
00:16:56
goes beyond that you know it goes beyond
00:16:59
um your own being. Um and my this is my
00:17:02
what I believe. Yes, you yes you work
00:17:05
hard for it. You train hard for it. You
00:17:07
mentally, physically, swing coaches, you
00:17:10
know, psychologists, um personal
00:17:13
trainers, nutritionists, and I had a
00:17:16
great team around me, but it was you
00:17:18
need more than that, you know, and uh so
00:17:20
I managed to nudge off target by a
00:17:23
couple of shots towards the end.
00:17:25
>> Yeah, it's incredible. So I I actually
00:17:27
had your your your nana's name written
00:17:29
down on a card to in case it came up in
00:17:32
conversation. But you know the fact that
00:17:34
you brought it up 40 years or whatever
00:17:36
after she's passed. Um it speaks volumes
00:17:39
about the impact she had on you. I think
00:17:41
that's powerful.
00:17:41
>> I mean that's when I kind of learned
00:17:43
about the whole mentoring part of it.
00:17:44
You know that's where it's important
00:17:46
right now. I think um because I've been
00:17:49
into this whole it's called a talent
00:17:51
pyramid. A talent pyramid is basically
00:17:53
you got the grassroots of any sports um
00:17:57
it's going to be thousands of kids right
00:17:59
start playing golf and then and when
00:18:01
they get to age from age from 10 to 13
00:18:05
14 is when the mentoring part kicks in
00:18:08
and I had a lot of mentors Ken Douglas
00:18:10
for example uh obviously my dad and I
00:18:13
had um other people around me who guided
00:18:16
me and mentoring is the most important
00:18:17
that's when you go either one way or the
00:18:19
other um so So she was big part of that
00:18:23
and then the so that's the middle middle
00:18:25
part of the uh the pyramid and the top
00:18:27
part is obviously when you the elite
00:18:29
part of it you know and the training and
00:18:32
that sort of stuff. So yeah I've got a
00:18:34
good understanding on how you if you
00:18:36
want to do something how to to develop
00:18:38
kids in that sort of manner. Um I've
00:18:41
been giving back a lot to the game of
00:18:44
golf that's given me so much with my
00:18:45
golf academy in in Maya in Spain. I've
00:18:49
really enjoyed that um passing on my
00:18:52
knowledge and experiences to these kids.
00:18:53
You know, uh I do teach them a little
00:18:56
bit um about the golf swing, but my my
00:18:58
role which I've I found out more so
00:19:01
actually um playing Chasing the Fox last
00:19:04
week. I spent a lot of time with uh for
00:19:07
what two or three hours with Dan Hillier
00:19:09
and and and Foxy and and they were
00:19:12
telling me stories I mentioned before
00:19:13
about how they met me for the first time
00:19:15
and the stories behind that and they
00:19:17
looked up to me and and that sort of
00:19:19
stuff. So
00:19:20
>> yeah, this is when they were kids.
00:19:21
>> Yeah, exactly. I mean I think Foxy just
00:19:23
turned pro. when I played with him at
00:19:24
Christ Church and um when I I heard
00:19:28
about this guy Foxy right about Ryan and
00:19:30
um I remember the first T-shot you hit
00:19:32
I'm thinking whoa this guy's good but he
00:19:35
had a shocking short game. So I said to
00:19:38
him, I'll never forget uh and he
00:19:41
mentioned it to me actually last week.
00:19:42
He said to me, "Oh Cambo, it was great
00:19:45
to play with you and blah blah blah."
00:19:46
And I said, "Okay, mate. We need to I
00:19:49
need to give you a tripping lesson,
00:19:50
mate, cuz you you're you're crap.
00:19:53
I'm very direct. Okay. So, uh I said,
00:19:55
"You're you're correct, mate." So, after
00:19:58
the round, I think it was the first or
00:20:00
second round, we spent hours together
00:20:02
and then Grant Fox was there, his dad,
00:20:05
and and all of a sudden there was like a
00:20:08
20 20 players around, you know, and um
00:20:11
that's when it started for me. I thought
00:20:13
Jeepers, you know, this is back in 2007,
00:20:16
I think it is. I can't remember.
00:20:18
>> Maybe earlier, I can't remember. around
00:20:20
that same area as the uh time as the US
00:20:23
Open.
00:20:23
>> It was the peak Michael Campbell.
00:20:25
>> Yeah. And then and there was more like a
00:20:28
clinic now of chipping and and that's
00:20:30
when I thought, "Yeah, okay." And now
00:20:33
this is my role now, you know. And then
00:20:34
and then Dan Hillier came up to me last
00:20:37
week and said, "Oh yeah, Michael, I won
00:20:38
your tournament. I was 9 years old at
00:20:40
the Michael Campbell Junior
00:20:42
Championships at Tahib Bay." And and
00:20:44
then uh I met him when he was 14 years
00:20:46
old about to he wanted to turn pros. So,
00:20:48
I sat down with him for 2 hours. Well, I
00:20:50
can't really remember that, but um it's
00:20:52
nice to hear that cuz now it's like a um
00:20:55
a rocking chair moment, you know,
00:20:56
watching these guys. I'm sitting in my
00:20:58
rocking chair. I'm not quite that old,
00:21:00
but I'm 56 and having my my glass of red
00:21:04
wine. Um, and watching these guys play,
00:21:06
watching Foxy win the Canadian Open,
00:21:09
uh, watching Dan win the British Masters
00:21:11
last year and Foxy winning, you know, he
00:21:14
won twice this year and he won obviously
00:21:16
the biggest tournament in the BW
00:21:17
Championship and Wentworth. So I I just
00:21:20
I'm so proud of them. Um, and both of
00:21:23
them were kindly
00:21:25
they kindly said to me, you know, um,
00:21:28
you you inspired us and stuff like that.
00:21:30
So, I've taken on a different role now,
00:21:33
I think, as a player. You know, I can't
00:21:35
compete against these guys. Don't hurt
00:21:37
long enough. Uh, I still play on Legends
00:21:40
Tour, which is a European version of the
00:21:42
Champions Tour. Uh, Stevie Ala is
00:21:44
killing it on the Champions Tour. Uh,
00:21:46
it's amazing. Great to see. He's a good
00:21:47
friend of mine. Um, but yeah, now I've
00:21:49
realized, I mean, it's my first trip
00:21:51
back home. um playing in front of, you
00:21:53
know, local people and it was
00:21:59
it was it was amazing. I mean, there was
00:22:01
like 4,000 5,000 people with that Fox
00:22:03
News tournament
00:22:05
and what really got me was um these
00:22:09
young kids, kids everywhere playing golf
00:22:12
now.
00:22:13
>> And it was um heartwarming to see. And I
00:22:18
was thinking to myself, uh, maybe I've
00:22:20
got something to do with this, you know,
00:22:22
maybe 1%. But, uh, this is this is why I
00:22:25
was born on this planet, you know, to to
00:22:28
make a difference.
00:22:30
>> Uh, I think I think you Yeah. 1% is
00:22:32
being um incredibly modest. Like I think
00:22:34
you you inspired a whole generation.
00:22:37
>> Yeah, that's what I got from it. I mean,
00:22:38
um, you know, two two generations um
00:22:40
with with Foxy and and Dan. Um,
00:22:43
>> and even I remember walking the fairways
00:22:45
with these young moldy kids. There's
00:22:46
about six of them, you know, walking
00:22:48
around asking me questions and
00:22:51
and yeah, it's such a amazing feeling.
00:22:54
Um,
00:22:56
and I thought, okay, this is this is
00:22:59
this is where I supposed to be.
00:23:01
>> Although, you're making it sound like
00:23:02
you're a really old man, like the rock,
00:23:04
you're painting a picture of the rocking
00:23:05
chair and the glass of pino or Merlo. I
00:23:07
don't know. Maybe like a heavier body.
00:23:11
>> South Australian.
00:23:12
>> Yeah, South Australian.
00:23:13
>> Yeah. Yeah. Um, but you're playing
00:23:15
really well on the Legends Tour. Um, I I
00:23:17
want to know what what's your why now?
00:23:19
Is it is it the the just the thrill of I
00:23:21
mean, you've got enough money to last a
00:23:22
lifetime, right? Money's not an issue.
00:23:24
Is it is is it still that like burning
00:23:26
competitive desire?
00:23:27
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah, definitely. Um, that's
00:23:29
why that's why I'm still playing. Maybe
00:23:31
give another four years, I'm done. But,
00:23:33
I love competing against the boys. Um,
00:23:35
it's fun. It's more fun now because, you
00:23:37
know, play three rounds of golf. We we
00:23:40
socialize together all the time. And
00:23:41
it's just fun to be with them. If you
00:23:44
think about it, you know, they've been
00:23:45
in my lives for 30 years.
00:23:47
>> We know each other. We know the wives,
00:23:48
the girlfriends, the their kids, what
00:23:50
they're doing, you know, and that sort
00:23:52
of stuff. It's a nice family to be
00:23:53
involved in. And when I retired from um
00:23:56
playing on the main tours in 2012, I
00:23:59
kind of missed it a little bit. And um I
00:24:03
had to wait, I think, uh seven years to
00:24:05
turn 50. And during those seven years,
00:24:07
that's when I started my golf academy to
00:24:09
keep me busy. I thought, it's quite
00:24:12
funny. I thought I would I'll be uh
00:24:14
enjoying time off, but
00:24:18
I was bored after about, you know,
00:24:21
2 months cuz I'm so used to be on the
00:24:24
road traveling, doing things, you know,
00:24:26
I didn't have a purpose to get up in the
00:24:28
mornings
00:24:28
>> and I thought this is not good. That's
00:24:31
why I started the golf academy to keep
00:24:32
me busy, my mind busy and and I got the
00:24:34
buzz in a different way now. I was
00:24:36
giving, you know, I was there seeing a
00:24:38
lot of progress with these these kids
00:24:40
and that was the adrenaline rush rather
00:24:43
than me being out there playing and
00:24:44
winning golf tournaments. It was
00:24:46
basically, you know, giving back to the
00:24:48
game.
00:24:49
>> So, what does life look like now for
00:24:51
Michael Campbell in Spain? You're
00:24:52
married again, eh? Second wife, Ganell.
00:24:54
>> Gor, how do you say it?
00:24:56
>> Gunnor.
00:24:57
>> Goro. Where is she from?
00:24:58
>> Sweden.
00:24:58
>> Sweden. And you got two um adult sons,
00:25:01
Thomas and Jordan, both in their 20s.
00:25:03
>> Yeah. 26 and 24.
00:25:04
>> Yeah. Um, one one is in um going to
00:25:07
America and the other one's in England.
00:25:09
They're kind of like spread out. It's
00:25:11
quite funny because we uh they've had a
00:25:13
crazy upbringing. Um
00:25:16
um um
00:25:17
>> Well, it's all it's all they it is a
00:25:19
crazy upbringing like especially I
00:25:20
suppose compared to yours, but it's all
00:25:21
they know.
00:25:22
>> Yeah, exactly. They always know that the
00:25:24
the world is their home, you know,
00:25:26
because we sat down one one night um
00:25:29
talking about houses, right? And uh we
00:25:30
lived in 12 different houses. That's
00:25:32
crazy. and they went to school um in
00:25:38
Australia, Switzerland, England, Spain,
00:25:42
you know, so it's not very it's not
00:25:44
normal.
00:25:45
>> Um
00:25:47
but yeah, they're they're doing well and
00:25:49
u it's um well, I'm an empty neester,
00:25:53
you know, all the kids gone now, which
00:25:55
is kind of nice and so I'm just enjoying
00:25:57
my time with Gunnel. So, uh it it's been
00:25:59
a it's been different. It's different.
00:26:02
I've um
00:26:04
you know I'm pretty relaxed now and I
00:26:06
actually had a bit of a a health issue.
00:26:09
U you had a heart operation a few months
00:26:11
ago.
00:26:11
>> I had a heart operation about 3 months
00:26:14
ago. Uh I feel so much better now. Uh
00:26:16
before then it was it's called atrial
00:26:18
fibrillation. So in other words beating
00:26:20
fast. My heart was beating fast and out
00:26:22
of rhythm. And I put it off for like 3
00:26:25
years because there obviously with an
00:26:26
operation there's a risk involved.
00:26:30
And um there I was very irritable,
00:26:33
impatient, no energy. I would go to bed
00:26:36
for 9 hours, sleep for 9 hours and get
00:26:38
up and still tired and I thought this is
00:26:40
not the quality of life. There was none.
00:26:42
So I thought I got to do this operation.
00:26:45
>> What caused that on is it is it a
00:26:47
genetic thing or is it just a random?
00:26:49
>> Look, I'll probably get canceled here,
00:26:50
but um it all started for me personally
00:26:53
since I had the jab, the co jab. I'll
00:26:56
never forget after the second one I I
00:26:58
was sitting down on the couch watching
00:27:00
TV
00:27:02
um and all of a sudden my heart was
00:27:04
racing like it was jumping out of my
00:27:06
chest and it happened probably about six
00:27:09
days
00:27:10
six times a day or maybe six times a
00:27:13
week and I thought this is not good.
00:27:16
>> Um ignored it and went away for a little
00:27:19
bit and started coming back again and
00:27:23
went on for like probably two and a half
00:27:24
years.
00:27:26
So I got a big checkup and uh health
00:27:28
checkup and they found that yeah my
00:27:29
heart was um not my resting heart rate
00:27:32
was 120.
00:27:34
>> Jeez.
00:27:34
>> Yeah. So so my my heart was working so
00:27:37
hard with no results. So that's when I
00:27:40
decided to I needed to do something
00:27:42
about it.
00:27:43
>> But now now I feel great. I mean I feel
00:27:45
like um 40 or 30 or 35 or something.
00:27:49
Well, I suppose after feeling so bad for
00:27:52
so long, it must feel amazing just to be
00:27:54
your old self again.
00:27:55
>> And then and then straight away there
00:27:56
was a correlation to my my performances,
00:27:59
you know. Uh I knew you wanted It's
00:28:01
funny because I was on the on the
00:28:03
operating table. Um and then my doctor
00:28:07
said to me, "Michael, you got to take at
00:28:09
least two or three months off." I
00:28:11
thought, "No, that's way too long." So I
00:28:14
actually started playing golf um 6 weeks
00:28:17
after the operation and I nearly won it
00:28:20
won the tournament on the legends tour
00:28:22
in Spain and then I played in Maitius uh
00:28:25
two week two two weeks ago and finished
00:28:27
uh 66 65 in the last two rounds. So I
00:28:30
mean to me it's it's
00:28:33
obvious what happened. You know I just
00:28:35
didn't have the f the focus or I was
00:28:37
fuzzy on the golf course but now it's
00:28:39
more clear and more clarity on the golf
00:28:41
course now. So, I'm pretty excited for
00:28:43
next year.
00:28:44
>> I appreciate you sharing that. No one no
00:28:46
one can cancel you for you speaking your
00:28:49
truth.
00:28:49
>> Well, you know, you never know. Maybe
00:28:51
hope maybe you can in England and other
00:28:53
places in the world. Jeepers, I'm not
00:28:55
sure they've let me in the country again
00:28:56
after saying that. But, um, that's my
00:28:58
honest truth. You know, um,
00:29:00
>> you know, uh, things have changed a
00:29:02
little bit now after what, 5 years since
00:29:05
the co jave came out and
00:29:08
>> and, uh, all this research and stuff
00:29:09
like that, you know. So anyway, I don't
00:29:11
want to talk about too much, but yeah,
00:29:13
>> there was definitely a thing here in New
00:29:14
Zealand where anyone that um had an
00:29:16
adverse effect to it, the the media just
00:29:18
wouldn't touch the story. So these
00:29:20
stories weren't getting the light of
00:29:21
day. Um yeah, and anyone here that was
00:29:23
sort of antivax and this is coming, I'm
00:29:25
a sheeple, so if Ashley Bloomfield and
00:29:27
just doing tell me to get a third jab,
00:29:29
I'll go and roll my sleeve up and get it
00:29:31
done. Um but anyone in New Zealand at
00:29:33
that time that didn't uh was reluctant
00:29:35
to get the vaccine, they were sort of
00:29:36
painted as being a little bit crazy,
00:29:38
like a tinfoil hat wearer. And you look
00:29:40
back now with recent sort of hindsight
00:29:41
and it's like actually they they had a
00:29:43
point and um they should have been
00:29:45
respected. I don't know.
00:29:48
You're not you're not contributing to
00:29:50
this.
00:29:52
May end up cutting this bit out. What
00:29:53
what um what other jobs have you had?
00:29:55
You worked in the meat works for a
00:29:56
while, eh? No, I had a I had had a real
00:29:59
job. Um
00:30:02
this is a funny uh episode of my life.
00:30:05
Final funny I'll start again. This is a
00:30:09
funny um chapter in my life.
00:30:12
Um I wanted to get a a job to save up
00:30:16
money to travel. So my dad organized
00:30:19
through the back door um a little bit to
00:30:22
uh work for telecom
00:30:25
and uh so age of 16 I think it was. It
00:30:29
was like a 5y year process to get fully
00:30:31
qualified. They said, "Okay, Michael,
00:30:33
we'll fully support you, but we need um
00:30:36
cuz he obviously mom and dad knew I
00:30:38
wanted to be a professional golfer, but
00:30:41
you need a plan B, which I didn't really
00:30:43
think it was right because if you have a
00:30:45
plan B, you're not focused on plan A,
00:30:47
but anyway,
00:30:48
>> you're more a burn the boats type of
00:30:50
guy."
00:30:50
>> Yeah. So, to just to please my mom and
00:30:53
dad, sorry, Dad, I know you. Um I said,
00:30:56
"Okay, I'll do it then."
00:30:58
Um, which was great because it it got me
00:31:01
opportunity to save a bit of money. Um,
00:31:04
I brought a car and so I could travel
00:31:07
around New Zealand and play all these
00:31:09
tournaments. And I remember my boss, uh,
00:31:12
Rod Tindle didn't like me. Uh, a couple
00:31:16
of stories is that I used to take
00:31:17
sickies, you know, on Fridays and
00:31:19
Mondays.
00:31:21
And the reason why I did that cuz I had
00:31:23
to travel on Friday say to Oakuckland or
00:31:26
Hamilton or or wherever I'm playing and
00:31:28
play two rounds of golf then come back
00:31:29
on Monday kind of thing and um I would
00:31:33
say to him, "Oh, yeah. Uh you know, I'll
00:31:35
go go to work on the Monday or Tuesday
00:31:38
and go see, oh, Michael." So, and
00:31:40
there's a little folded kind of
00:31:41
newspaper on the corner of his desk and
00:31:44
he goes, "Hey, Michael,
00:31:46
you feeling better?" Oh, yeah. I feel
00:31:48
much better now. And he opens up this
00:31:51
newspaper
00:31:52
and this picture of me holding a trophy
00:31:55
somewhere in Hamilton.
00:31:59
You go, you go, "You sure?" I said,
00:32:01
"Yeah, I um yeah,
00:32:03
>> busted."
00:32:04
>> Busted so many times. And and Gordon
00:32:08
McIntyre uh who was Rod's boss.
00:32:12
Unfortunately, he passed away. Gordon
00:32:14
Mack golfer uh he supported me so much.
00:32:18
He helped me. He bailed me out so many
00:32:20
times. Bailed me out cuz he knew that he
00:32:23
understood about my passion for golf.
00:32:26
And then another another story I want to
00:32:27
share with you is that I had a job where
00:32:29
I would work in remote satellite
00:32:32
exchanges. So um Wellington was the main
00:32:34
mother exchange and we had Kil Bernie,
00:32:36
we have Kelson, we had uh all different
00:32:40
um Pooker Bay you know all those
00:32:43
satellite stations around uh telephone
00:32:46
exchanges around Wellington and so I
00:32:50
used to drive my car to work then I used
00:32:54
to um pick up my pager cuz back in the
00:32:57
day there was no cell phones a pager
00:33:00
>> and uh my work car, drive around to my
00:33:04
car, put my golf clubs up, back of the
00:33:06
car of the work car,
00:33:08
and I drive to the nearest rugby field
00:33:11
and practice until I get paged.
00:33:14
And so I was there for hours one day
00:33:17
thinking, Jo, it's been 2 or three
00:33:19
hours, no no page. And I look at my
00:33:22
pager, it's wasn't charged properly. It
00:33:24
was flat.
00:33:26
And so, and all sudden, I see this
00:33:28
telecom car come rushing around and it's
00:33:30
my boss, Rod Tindle.
00:33:32
He goes, "Michael, where have you been?"
00:33:33
I said, "Well, obviously I'm practicing
00:33:36
golf rod." He goes, "It was a major
00:33:38
fault down uh a trunk line uh from
00:33:41
Oakland to Wellington. And all it took
00:33:43
was a switch, you know, and uh and I was
00:33:46
too busy following my dreams." So
00:33:50
>> just a one track mind, eh?
00:33:51
>> Oh, I was I mean, you have to be
00:33:53
>> Yeah. Just red hot focus, laser focus
00:33:55
>> all the time. All of it's a very selfish
00:33:58
game. you have to be obsessed uh to be
00:34:02
the best you can be
00:34:04
>> and I had to do those sort of things,
00:34:05
you know, and yeah, it's and then I I
00:34:09
quit when I was 21
00:34:11
and
00:34:12
>> you got to quit. They didn't fire you.
00:34:14
>> No, cuz Gordon McIntyre kicked me on. Uh
00:34:17
he was he was a legend. So you you got
00:34:19
to understand that you know part of my
00:34:21
journey
00:34:23
you know is obviously the ultimate the
00:34:24
the goal was winning winning a manager
00:34:26
which I did but there's people along the
00:34:28
way like Gordon McIntyre
00:34:32
uh my first coach ever was dad
00:34:35
um my second coach was Dennis Slin
00:34:39
uh he passed away unfortunately
00:34:41
>> lovely manel tongue came along
00:34:44
>> Vic Perhe who looked who kind of like I
00:34:47
was a little little [ __ ] you to say a
00:34:48
little rebel when I was growing up. I
00:34:50
need a guidance. I need to be, you know,
00:34:53
put in the corner sometimes and
00:34:55
punished.
00:34:57
Um Jonathan Ywood, you know, all these
00:35:00
people help you. I mean, people like
00:35:03
used to pick me up uh at 7:30 in the
00:35:06
morning and take me to a club match, you
00:35:08
know, Bruce Shand, Graham Vestie, Ken
00:35:13
Douglas, who I mentioned before.
00:35:16
there's so many so many people you know
00:35:19
who looked after me who gave me golf
00:35:20
balls who you know would play with me
00:35:23
and and teach me and you know so
00:35:27
you can't do by yourself and obviously
00:35:30
the end result is winning the US Open
00:35:31
but there's there's so many thank yous
00:35:34
you know um I wish I wish I could just
00:35:37
melt down the US Open trophy and give a
00:35:39
piece to every single one you helped me
00:35:41
along the way that's how I felt
00:35:43
>> and I'm sure there's a lot of stories
00:35:45
like that u from a lot of athletes
00:35:47
around the world. You see us up there
00:35:50
and doing our thing, but it's a it's
00:35:53
hard work, man.
00:35:54
>> Yeah. And there's the the sacrifice as
00:35:56
well. You you told me just before, so
00:35:58
you're back here for uh Ryan's Chasing
00:36:00
the Fox event, and the last time you
00:36:01
were back here was a couple of years ago
00:36:03
for um less than desirable
00:36:06
circumstances.
00:36:07
>> Yeah, mom passed away two years ago. Um
00:36:10
>> yeah, tell us about Maria Campbell. Um
00:36:12
well
00:36:14
um
00:36:16
hard worker.
00:36:17
>> That's where I get it from. I think mom
00:36:19
was a hard worker. She um
00:36:23
>> didn't want you playing rugby.
00:36:24
>> Didn't want you to play rugby.
00:36:25
>> But didn't mind you dressing up like
00:36:27
Prince and MJ.
00:36:28
>> Oh, come on. You bring these stories
00:36:30
out. Yeah. I was a big um Michael
00:36:32
Jackson fan in Prince. Yeah. I used to
00:36:34
have the hair do these pictures of me on
00:36:36
the internet. It was embarrassing.
00:36:38
>> A skunks young man.
00:36:39
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but one thing that
00:36:42
mom did for me, and funny enough, I
00:36:45
actually found it was my journal, my
00:36:47
diary when I was a kid.
00:36:48
>> Wow.
00:36:48
>> When I was 13 years old. It's her
00:36:50
writing.
00:36:52
Um,
00:36:53
cuz she got a friend who helped me to
00:36:55
help me out. I told her when I was 12
00:36:58
years old, I want to be a golf
00:36:59
professional. She go, "Okay, Michael,
00:37:02
you need to do this. You know, this is
00:37:03
the pathway."
00:37:05
And um so it's her writing writing down
00:37:08
goals and then be things like I don't
00:37:11
know um when I break a 100
00:37:16
I'll get a half set of golf clubs. When
00:37:19
I break
00:37:20
80 I'll get a full set of golf clubs.
00:37:24
You know break 70 I'll get a new driver
00:37:26
kind of thing. So I've always been goal
00:37:28
orientated through mom and she taught me
00:37:31
that from a very young age and I can't
00:37:33
thank her enough for it really. I still
00:37:35
do it and
00:37:38
>> you still still do it how
00:37:40
>> um
00:37:40
>> just by thinking about her or
00:37:42
>> uh no I always write it down still.
00:37:43
>> Okay. Um
00:37:46
uh there's one one uh one story I want
00:37:49
to share with you was I've said it
00:37:51
before but um
00:37:54
so it started from that when I was 13
00:37:56
years old and I found it at home
00:37:59
um and and it's quite funny making the
00:38:03
New Zealand team
00:38:05
making the the Wellington team first New
00:38:07
Zealand team the boys team junior team
00:38:10
men's team went in the Eisenhower
00:38:14
which is the world championship of
00:38:15
amateur golf in ' 92 and I saw it and I
00:38:18
saw these ticks achieved all the goals.
00:38:21
Yeah. So it's my writing of ticking.
00:38:24
Uh it was it was so wonderful to go back
00:38:27
to that that time and see those those
00:38:30
moments when I was young young. And so
00:38:33
that's when I started keeping a back in
00:38:34
the day it was uh once again no phones
00:38:37
it was a fileax you know that I had a
00:38:39
little black book
00:38:41
you uh if you see the documentary you'll
00:38:42
see it u I still got I found it
00:38:46
um and
00:38:48
all my goals written down there things
00:38:50
like um get your card on the European
00:38:53
tour win on the European tour and the
00:38:56
last one was always winning a major but
00:38:59
you can't just say winning a major you
00:39:00
need to have like a stepping stones
00:39:01
towards that like I don't know uh train
00:39:04
harder, work harder, you know, I can't
00:39:07
remember what I've written in this
00:39:09
thing, but uh the one time you know well
00:39:11
every week I had like a like a like a
00:39:13
goal uh could be break 30 putts per
00:39:16
round or run extra five minutes on the
00:39:19
treadmill or extra 10 sit-ups or oh
00:39:23
could be anything, right? Not
00:39:25
necessarily golf related but some some
00:39:28
weeks yes, some weeks not.
00:39:30
I remember I remember flying from London
00:39:33
to Pinehurst uh with Adam Scott. Scott
00:39:36
is a good friend of mine. Scott and I
00:39:38
were there and we're talking about um
00:39:40
you know expectations this this week and
00:39:43
I said well yep
00:39:45
um I I'm paying pretty well. Um got a
00:39:50
bit of momentum, bit of confidence. I
00:39:52
think top 10 I'll be happy. So what I
00:39:54
did um I wrote down my goal for that
00:39:57
week. top 10 a secondhand Porsche um cuz
00:40:01
I love my cars and you know like 25,000
00:40:05
miles on the clock £25,000
00:40:09
that was the start of the week. So what
00:40:11
I did you know normally um when you play
00:40:14
play golf you need to have a marker a
00:40:16
dash or dot or your initials or whatever
00:40:18
and I wrote 99 99
00:40:22
sorry
00:40:22
>> 997
00:40:23
>> 997
00:40:25
um
00:40:25
>> iconic.
00:40:26
>> Yeah. Yeah, it is. Yeah. 997.
00:40:30
And
00:40:31
so uh on my golf ball that whole week
00:40:33
was 997.
00:40:35
And then after three rounds, I saw
00:40:37
myself uh
00:40:39
I think I was third uh four shots behind
00:40:42
goose retent.
00:40:44
And I changed my cross out the uh top 10
00:40:48
to top three brand new Porsche.
00:40:53
And then uh in the last round after six
00:40:55
holes I'm leading. I'm thinking okay
00:40:59
this is different. Um so to distract my
00:41:03
mind what I did was I was visualizing my
00:41:06
Porsche. You know the color
00:41:11
what size wheels the interior
00:41:15
the color of the brake pillars the shape
00:41:17
of the exhaust
00:41:20
engine upgrade.
00:41:22
the last 12 holes. So I was playing a
00:41:25
game within a game. So obviously the my
00:41:28
game for myself was just visualizing
00:41:30
that Porsche because if I get distracted
00:41:33
and think about the US Open, which is
00:41:34
the bigger picture of the whole day, you
00:41:38
know, maybe it wasn't good for me. So
00:41:40
>> in hindsight, is that something you got
00:41:41
from like a sports psychologist or
00:41:43
>> No one taught me that. No one No one
00:41:44
taught me that.
00:41:45
>> Did Did you know at the time what you
00:41:47
were doing or
00:41:48
>> No,
00:41:49
far out. You do wonder if it's like your
00:41:51
nana or someone.
00:41:52
>> Well, that's why I think, you know,
00:41:54
sometimes um they're talking to me in a
00:41:56
very spiritual way. So, maybe it was,
00:41:58
you know, maybe it was. I don't know.
00:42:00
>> And that that winning ball with um the
00:42:02
997 still got it.
00:42:03
>> Do you?
00:42:04
>> Yeah. It's in my office. Yeah. Still got
00:42:06
it. Mounted or anything?
00:42:08
>> Well, the funny thing is that um when I
00:42:10
uh you'll see me on TV if you do see the
00:42:13
uh highlights is that I I threw it away
00:42:16
as I was throwing the ball thinking,
00:42:18
"Oh, you got to keep that ball.
00:42:20
So what I did um my man my managers
00:42:23
organized I don't know how they did it
00:42:24
um
00:42:26
they found the person who caught it and
00:42:29
they well basically they said look um
00:42:30
whoever um
00:42:33
uh has Michael's golf ball um please
00:42:36
return it and we'll give you a brand new
00:42:38
set of Callaway golf clubs and it came
00:42:42
back so that's why I got it back. Um
00:42:46
yeah
00:42:46
>> that'd be worth so much money on eBay,
00:42:48
wouldn't it? I don't know. I don't know.
00:42:49
>> But it just means more to you than any
00:42:51
amount of money.
00:42:51
>> Yeah, absolutely. So that's uh very
00:42:54
it's, you know, it's sitting on my my uh
00:42:57
my desk, my office.
00:43:00
>> There's so much more. Oh, I'm going to
00:43:01
have to drop some car. How much time do
00:43:03
you have today?
00:43:03
>> I've got plenty of time. I'm going have
00:43:05
to drop some.
00:43:05
>> I actually I I actually uh allocated two
00:43:08
hours for you, mate.
00:43:09
>> Okay. Oh, this is amazing.
00:43:10
>> Cuz I have to go to um
00:43:12
um other things as well.
00:43:14
>> Yeah. So um yeah, we were chatting about
00:43:16
your mom before. Do you remember your
00:43:17
last conversation with your mom?
00:43:22
Um,
00:43:31
yeah, I do.
00:43:36
Um,
00:43:42
you're going through cancer and
00:43:49
Yeah, it wasn't nice.
00:43:59
Yeah, I just said to it that um
00:44:07
give me a minute, Tom. That um
00:44:11
she was the wind beneath my wings.
00:44:18
Yeah,
00:44:20
>> you miss her every day.
00:44:22
>> Yeah, every day. Yeah, of course.
00:44:24
>> It's still raw. You know, it's been
00:44:28
2 years, so yeah, it's still raw.
00:44:30
>> I don't know if with grief, I I don't
00:44:32
know if you ever get over these things.
00:44:33
>> No, they say time will heal, but
00:44:36
>> I don't believe in it to be honest with
00:44:38
you. It's been 2 years for me and I
00:44:39
still, you know, think of her pretty
00:44:41
much every day. and the way she she
00:44:43
guided me. Um, obviously with dad as
00:44:45
well, she was very very tough on me, but
00:44:49
um yeah um
00:44:52
yeah, she was uh definitely the wind
00:44:55
>> beneath my wings so I could uh soar
00:44:57
above the others.
00:44:59
>> And you um your dad Tom, he's 80 now.
00:45:02
You're seeing him after he's he's 78.
00:45:05
>> 78.
00:45:06
>> Um uh he he was great. He was very
00:45:09
encouraging, very positive.
00:45:11
He um he obviously that's the reason why
00:45:14
I started playing golf was because of
00:45:16
him. And yeah, I used to dislike golf.
00:45:20
He used to drag me out early hours in
00:45:22
the morning in those cold winter
00:45:23
mornings and Chitahi Bay was playing
00:45:25
about 20 knots. It's freezing. Um
00:45:28
watching old men, you know, h on the
00:45:31
ground and playing golf for 4 hours. I
00:45:34
thought this is a stupid game.
00:45:36
>> It was an old man's sport back then. E
00:45:38
>> definitely was. Yeah, it was. It's um a
00:45:41
sport played by old men and uncles and
00:45:45
granddads.
00:45:47
But um the biggest thing for me was um
00:45:50
was my payment. It was it was a meat pie
00:45:54
and a strawberry milkshake. So every
00:45:58
Sunday
00:45:59
>> that good me
00:46:00
>> I get a knock on the door at 7:00 in the
00:46:02
morning. Come on, son. Time to c for me.
00:46:06
Yeah.
00:46:08
>> Yeah. How's he coping without your mom?
00:46:10
>> Yeah, he's he's struggling a little bit.
00:46:12
I think he's struggling a little bit.
00:46:13
Um, of course they're very close and
00:46:16
when you have your best friend pass
00:46:17
away, your loved one pass away, of
00:46:20
course it's going to, you know, you're
00:46:21
going to find uh find it hard to carry
00:46:23
on. And
00:46:24
>> but yeah, I flew him over to uh to
00:46:28
Europe to watch me play for a couple
00:46:30
weeks. He really enjoyed that meeting
00:46:32
his heroes. He met uh who was it? He met
00:46:35
um Gary Player for the first time. Wow.
00:46:38
>> So, he was buzzing from that and uh cuz
00:46:40
I know all the guys obviously and and
00:46:43
yeah, a few other legends. So, he was uh
00:46:45
Ernie Owls he met for the first time and
00:46:48
Ret and uh yeah, it's uh so it's nice
00:46:51
that I could, you know, do things like
00:46:52
that for him. But, um still playing
00:46:54
golf. Yeah, still playing golf. I'm
00:46:57
going to play golf with him um when I
00:46:59
get back to uh to Wellington. I
00:47:01
>> I had uh Lori Mains on the podcast um a
00:47:03
few months ago. He's 79. Still shoots
00:47:05
his age. Does he dare?
00:47:06
>> Does he really? Yeah.
00:47:07
>> Wow, that's impressive.
00:47:10
>> What does your dad do these days?
00:47:11
>> Uh, no, he's he's uh he's probably the
00:47:14
mid80s now.
00:47:15
>> Yeah, that's that's good though.
00:47:17
>> Yeah, I suppose he
00:47:19
>> um So, you're one of two? It's just you
00:47:22
and your sister Michelle.
00:47:23
>> Mhm.
00:47:23
>> Yeah. How's it been How's it been for
00:47:25
her being Michael Campbell's sister?
00:47:26
like I'm I'm sure she's immensely proud
00:47:27
of you, but there's a story I heard that
00:47:29
she she gave birth to her son who's
00:47:31
called Michael and um no one came to
00:47:33
visit her because they were all watching
00:47:34
you play the third round of the British
00:47:36
Open.
00:47:37
>> It was it was it was the same cuz uh
00:47:39
yeah, cuz dad was there too. Mom was
00:47:41
home, but yeah, she um she gave birth to
00:47:44
Michael on the on the sad day after
00:47:46
shooting 65. So that's why she called
00:47:49
him Michael. Um yeah, it's quite a funny
00:47:52
story. I mean, Michelle, I love it a
00:47:54
bit. Um, she treats me like her her
00:47:56
brother, nothing else. I'm not this
00:47:58
golfing superstar to her. I'm just
00:48:00
Michael.
00:48:01
>> Mhm.
00:48:01
>> Trust me, when I get home, when I get
00:48:03
home, uh, when I'm going home for five,
00:48:06
six days, she'll treat me like a normal
00:48:08
person, which I really, really love, you
00:48:09
know, I'm not this, you know, every time
00:48:12
I go home to New Zealand, even after my
00:48:14
victory. I remember coming home,
00:48:18
where was it? Uh, the homecoming tour
00:48:20
back in '05, you know, it was wild.
00:48:23
I came home for 10 days.
00:48:25
>> Oh, that's when there was the ticket
00:48:26
tape parade and
00:48:27
>> Yeah, it was it was
00:48:30
mad. But I remember my management group
00:48:33
um I rang them up said, "Look, I want to
00:48:35
go home." And this is probably a month
00:48:38
after winning the US Open.
00:48:41
And they said, "Um,
00:48:44
there's no time, Michael." I said, "I
00:48:47
don't care. Clear everything. I'm going
00:48:48
home." But but I said, "No, there's no
00:48:50
butts. I'm I'm coming home. Organize it.
00:48:55
And I did. And it wasn't for me. It was
00:48:58
for
00:49:00
the whole of New Zealand, you know, to
00:49:02
share my success with them and to
00:49:04
inspire these young kids. Once again,
00:49:07
that's my grandmother.
00:49:09
>> Yeah. Uh you got to thank her.
00:49:13
I wanted to inspire these kids and and
00:49:16
say that, you know, your dreams may be
00:49:18
impossible, but it can be achievable. M
00:49:20
>> and
00:49:22
you know I visited
00:49:24
different schools around Oakland,
00:49:26
Wellington, Queenstown.
00:49:29
Hung out with my friend Greg Turner. It
00:49:32
was fun cuz Greg Turner looked after me
00:49:34
when I first turned pro in 93. I stayed
00:49:37
with him for a week. Ended up probably
00:49:40
be three or four months I was on this
00:49:42
couch.
00:49:44
So you know to have people like that for
00:49:46
example. So that's why it's all about
00:49:47
payback, you know, pay it um you got
00:49:49
pass it on.
00:49:50
>> Pay it forward.
00:49:50
>> Pay it forward. Thank you.
00:49:52
>> Pay it forward. And cuz when I went over
00:49:54
to Europe, Frank Nobly was still playing
00:49:56
then. Frank Nobly, Greg Turner, the two
00:49:59
Kiwis there. And it I felt like it felt
00:50:02
like a second home to me. You know, I
00:50:04
was very welcome to the house and Jane
00:50:07
uh the wife now was there looking after,
00:50:09
cooking for me and and stuff like that.
00:50:11
And because if you think about it, I'm
00:50:13
24 years old,
00:50:15
>> going to a big city, London, flying from
00:50:18
here to there. I remember saying to
00:50:20
myself, am I am I doing the right thing
00:50:22
here? Is is this right, Michael? Am I
00:50:25
is this is this the pathway to, you
00:50:27
know, my my career? I mean, I had all
00:50:30
these doubts
00:50:32
because it's a long way to fly. You got
00:50:34
time to think.
00:50:35
>> Mhm. And then I kind of
00:50:39
uh said to myself, no, this is this is
00:50:41
the right way. You know, you need to be
00:50:42
here and this is the right place to be
00:50:45
for you right now uh to fly over to
00:50:48
England to Europe to test your skills
00:50:49
against the best European players. But
00:50:51
back in those days in 93 there was I
00:50:53
think top seven players in the world
00:50:57
uh top 10 players in the world were no
00:51:00
top seven players in the world were um
00:51:03
Europeans.
00:51:04
>> Mhm. So they had Sandy Langanger Woo
00:51:09
Lazabel Sevy Fo
00:51:12
um Norman Norman Greg Norman played on
00:51:15
Europe Nikki Price so you know the best
00:51:18
players in the world played on the
00:51:20
European tour back in 93 94
00:51:23
and so I decided to test my skills
00:51:25
against these guys and I had no chance I
00:51:27
got my butt kicked and I thought I'm not
00:51:30
good enough so I came back
00:51:33
terrible my legs. I thought I need to
00:51:37
work harder. So I did and that's when 95
00:51:40
came along, you know. So it's amazing
00:51:42
when once again I failed, you know. I it
00:51:45
was a big loss for me and
00:51:49
I mean you can take do two different two
00:51:52
different pathways. You can go okay I'm
00:51:53
not good enough or I need to work
00:51:55
harder.
00:51:55
>> Mhm.
00:51:56
>> So I chose the the obvious one, worked
00:51:59
harder and then came back even better.
00:52:02
>> Yes. Yes. So, the 95 Open. Um, I've
00:52:04
heard you said that that week changed
00:52:06
your life even without winning. Yeah.
00:52:08
What was it that shifted internally?
00:52:11
>> Um,
00:52:14
confirmation that I could um, you know,
00:52:17
play with
00:52:17
>> mix it with the Yeah.
00:52:18
>> big boys. Uh, mix it with the big boys.
00:52:21
Best players in the world were there
00:52:24
>> and I had the chance to win the major.
00:52:26
>> So, I thought, okay,
00:52:27
>> I'm in the right place here. uh I'm in
00:52:29
the right place to do do great things.
00:52:33
So that's when it really kicked on for
00:52:36
me
00:52:36
>> that third. Yes. So if you go through
00:52:38
like the leaderboard day by day, day
00:52:40
one, no Michael Campbell, day two, no no
00:52:42
Michael Campbell, day three, oh [ __ ]
00:52:44
New Zealand flag at the very top. Um
00:52:46
when you when you when you watch video
00:52:48
of that third round where you where you
00:52:49
scored 65 like on YouTube or whatever,
00:52:51
what do you feel?
00:52:54
flow,
00:52:57
carefree,
00:52:59
fun,
00:53:01
not worrying about consequences,
00:53:04
just
00:53:08
I saw it recently actually, funny
00:53:09
enough, cuz my one of my friends sends
00:53:12
me videos all the time and and um I was
00:53:15
just having fun, you know, like a a
00:53:18
child in the in the playground, just out
00:53:21
there having fun.
00:53:24
And then you see me on the last round.
00:53:26
Um I had this seriousness and this uh
00:53:30
not darkness but uh just doubt. I saw um
00:53:35
there's a picture of me a video of me um
00:53:37
on the first tea and I'm just standing
00:53:39
there and and like a little lost boy,
00:53:41
you know. It's like what have I done
00:53:44
here?
00:53:45
>> But you told us before the helicopter
00:53:47
story, so there was there was a lot
00:53:49
going on behind the scenes. a lot going
00:53:50
on. I was I was very pissed off with
00:53:53
what happened.
00:53:54
>> Yeah. Flustered.
00:53:55
>> Flustered. Frustrated.
00:53:57
And uh I knew I wasn't going to win that
00:53:59
day.
00:54:01
>> I came close, you know, but th those
00:54:03
demons always pop up
00:54:05
>> and unfortunately I got a bit power
00:54:07
those u those thoughts because I was
00:54:10
angry the whole time
00:54:12
>> at myself. No one else.
00:54:15
>> Who were you paired with in the final
00:54:16
round? Were you playing with John D?
00:54:18
>> Constantino Rocker.
00:54:19
>> Right. And I was there when he chipped
00:54:20
in on the last hole. That was amazing. I
00:54:23
mean I mean if you think about I mean
00:54:24
you you play the biggest tournament in
00:54:25
the world on the last group. So in the
00:54:27
last group they rope off around you
00:54:30
right? So these I don't know 60,000
00:54:32
people there 50,000 people there and
00:54:37
walking down the last hole at St.
00:54:39
Andrews
00:54:42
was one of my my best experiences in my
00:54:44
life as a golfer
00:54:46
and I having a chance to win cuz I had
00:54:48
to hold a 40footer on the last hole for
00:54:51
Eagle to tie John and Rocker.
00:54:55
So that was a good story.
00:54:56
>> That's a great story. Did you have you
00:54:58
ever been paired with John Daily? You
00:55:00
>> Oh, many times.
00:55:00
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What's that like?
00:55:01
What's it like playing around with him?
00:55:02
How many How many Diet Cokes did he go
00:55:04
through?
00:55:04
>> Yeah. Well, yeah. I've played with John
00:55:07
a lot over the time. Um,
00:55:10
he's uh he's so talented. It's a waste.
00:55:14
You know what? He's he's only won two
00:55:16
majors. He could have won 10 at least
00:55:18
>> if he was more serious and and dedicated
00:55:21
to his to his golf because wow, you ask
00:55:24
anybody who played with John, he was so
00:55:25
good. Mhm.
00:55:27
>> But just his work work ethic,
00:55:31
the way he um goes about things, you
00:55:33
know, is a little bit different to any
00:55:35
other professional, but that's just
00:55:36
John.
00:55:38
>> He's unique. He's like so I don't know
00:55:41
if anti-establishment is the term, but
00:55:44
>> you know, does he does he smoke as many
00:55:46
cigies as people?
00:55:48
>> I mean, he he stopped drinking now.
00:55:50
Well, now he started again. He's always
00:55:52
off and on alcohol and and cigarettes.
00:55:55
still smoking a lot.
00:55:56
>> And um I said to him, he said to me one
00:55:59
day, he said to me u he goes I said,
00:56:02
"John, you you could have won more more
00:56:04
majors, you know, and that sort of
00:56:05
stuff." He goes, "Oh, I'm just What do
00:56:06
you say?" He said, "I'm just trailer
00:56:08
trash."
00:56:09
>> Ah,
00:56:09
>> well, that's his upbringing.
00:56:10
>> Yeah.
00:56:11
>> You know, he's from the trailer trailer
00:56:13
park.
00:56:13
>> Well, he's best mates with Kid Rock now.
00:56:15
>> Yeah, I know. I know. But he's a true
00:56:17
character. You know, everyone loves
00:56:18
John.
00:56:20
>> Um he has a real appeal to certain
00:56:22
demographic of people. He brought along
00:56:25
a lot more louder people uh to the game.
00:56:29
>> But yeah, he's he's fun. He's
00:56:31
>> some energy and excitement. What What's
00:56:33
it like for you when you watch Have you
00:56:34
seen the the Happy Gilmore sequel?
00:56:37
>> No.
00:56:37
>> No. Cuz a lot of these guys that you
00:56:39
know personally are in it. You know,
00:56:41
Jack's in it. John Dy's got a big role
00:56:43
in it.
00:56:44
>> Why haven't you seen it?
00:56:45
>> I don't like golf movies.
00:56:46
>> It's not really a golf movie.
00:56:48
>> I know, but they they it's a golf themed
00:56:51
movie. I never watch it like in a tin
00:56:53
cup.
00:56:53
>> Yeah. I never watched it.
00:56:54
>> Oh, the Kevin Cost one. Oh, that's a
00:56:56
great movie.
00:56:56
>> Happy Gilmore. No.
00:56:57
>> Yeah,
00:56:58
>> the first one. I never watched it.
00:56:59
>> Yeah. So, so you finished third in that
00:57:01
British Open. Um Oh, by the way, you've
00:57:03
got to watch the Happy Iconic. Great
00:57:05
movie.
00:57:06
>> Okay.
00:57:07
>> Promise me you'll watch it.
00:57:09
>> I got to watch the first one, please.
00:57:10
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I
00:57:11
mean. The second one's It's But the
00:57:14
first one's iconic. It's But so you
00:57:16
finished third in that British Open um
00:57:17
as a like a young Maldi boy from Tatah
00:57:19
Bay, New Zealand. Um Yeah. Are you are
00:57:23
you are you excited? Are you
00:57:25
disappointed? Are you underwhelmed?
00:57:28
>> Um
00:57:30
I think I was excited
00:57:33
um
00:57:34
that I sent a message to the golfing
00:57:37
world that I was I'm here.
00:57:40
>> That was pretty exciting. And that was
00:57:42
that was um once again uh
00:57:46
an experience because I was flying
00:57:48
everywhere, you know. Uh, I played
00:57:53
like seven weeks in a row in six
00:57:55
different countries. The last week was
00:57:57
actually New Zealand Open at at the
00:57:59
Graange.
00:58:01
Played that and I had a wrist injury.
00:58:04
Had to pull out from New Zealand Open.
00:58:07
It was overwhelming a little bit
00:58:10
and um so the first impact I made I
00:58:13
think in the in the sense of the world
00:58:15
golfing world was the definitely that um
00:58:17
finishing third at the open and what
00:58:20
happens afterwards is uh is kind of
00:58:22
crazy
00:58:24
but it's it's a good crazy cuz I'm a I'm
00:58:25
I'm a kid you know I'm running around
00:58:28
yeah Michael just fly to fly to I don't
00:58:30
know some country and they're going to
00:58:31
pay you x amount of money and play some
00:58:33
golf and then fly to another country and
00:58:35
and pay some money And I thought, "Wow,
00:58:37
this is got all this money now." I was
00:58:39
like, "What the hell's happening here?"
00:58:42
And um it just got too much for me, you
00:58:45
know? I was on the plane pretty much the
00:58:47
whole seven weeks in a row, seven
00:58:49
different six different countries.
00:58:52
It was tough. Um and then I had an
00:58:54
injury. I was out for like 6 months.
00:58:57
Enjoyable. Tough or just not not
00:59:00
enjoyable? Definitely not sustainable,
00:59:01
eh?
00:59:02
>> Not sustainable. No. Um but enjoyable.
00:59:05
Yes. because um I met a lot of wonderful
00:59:08
people along the way, played these great
00:59:10
tournaments, met other famous golfers as
00:59:12
well for the first time. They kind of
00:59:14
recognized me now.
00:59:16
>> Um yeah, it was it was different. I
00:59:19
really enjoyed that part. But once
00:59:21
again, I learned a lot
00:59:24
um because what caused the injury was
00:59:27
um playing too much, dehydrated in the
00:59:29
plane. You know, I'm I'm talking
00:59:31
literally not just a short trip, 15
00:59:34
hours flying, playing one tournament,
00:59:37
and then 15 hours the other way, 15
00:59:39
hours the other way, 10 hours this way,
00:59:41
6 hours that way, everywhere. And my
00:59:44
body just broke down and said, "I can't
00:59:46
handle this." So once again, I learned a
00:59:48
lot from that. So
00:59:52
>> you played um the um Masters at Augusta
00:59:55
10 times. Um you've been there as a
00:59:57
spectator as well. You've been invited
00:59:58
to watch. What's is it better to go
01:00:00
there as a spectator or a player?
01:00:01
>> Yes, much easier.
01:00:04
>> Is it more enjoyable? Yeah.
01:00:06
>> Absolutely. Absolutely.
01:00:07
>> Are you full of like butterflies before
01:00:10
>> before these events?
01:00:11
>> Um yeah, I think it's important to have
01:00:13
anxiety. That means you care.
01:00:15
>> Um funny enough, I was talking to Foxy
01:00:18
about that. The first tier jitters, you
01:00:19
know, you always get that. Um I spoke to
01:00:21
other people as well, sports people.
01:00:23
your first serve in tennis or whe it's
01:00:25
getting run over the white line when it
01:00:26
comes to the abs, you know, the all
01:00:28
blacks, it's um it's important to have
01:00:30
that kind of nervousness um excitement.
01:00:34
Uh that means it means something to you.
01:00:37
>> So yeah, I always had that and um spoke
01:00:42
to Grant uh to uh to Foxy about that and
01:00:44
he said, "Yeah, he feels the same now."
01:00:46
Um that that never goes away. I don't
01:00:49
think as an athlete. I think it's
01:00:51
important part of the of the process.
01:00:55
>> And then after the first t-shot, you're
01:00:56
away. And same with, you know, after the
01:00:59
first kickoff at a test match, they're
01:01:01
away. But the first, you know, build up
01:01:03
to it, you know, 15 minutes before the
01:01:05
first first T-shot or
01:01:09
uh when the whistle blows for the first
01:01:11
half, whatever's going to be, you know,
01:01:12
there's always going to be, you know,
01:01:13
jitters or or nerves.
01:01:15
>> Is it amazing being there, though, as a
01:01:17
player?
01:01:19
It's iconic, eh? Such an iconic course,
01:01:22
especially, you know, you told the story
01:01:23
before about when TV just moved from
01:01:25
black and white to color and, you know,
01:01:26
you're getting up early before school,
01:01:28
watching it with your dad,
01:01:29
>> then you're there.
01:01:31
>> Oh, it's it was it was such a cool
01:01:32
experience because my and I remember
01:01:34
seeing the draw. So, my first US Masters
01:01:39
was in 1996,
01:01:42
and I just came off an injury from a
01:01:45
wrist injury. I was out for like 3
01:01:48
months. I didn't practice, but I was
01:01:51
building up to my first US Masters
01:01:54
at Augusta and the the draw came out.
01:01:57
I'm playing with Jack Nicholas
01:02:01
and it was like, oh my goodness,
01:02:04
you know, but he was wonderful. He knew
01:02:08
it was my first one and he looked after
01:02:11
me and I thought, wow, the best best
01:02:14
golfer in the world. Don't this is
01:02:16
before Tiger in 96 looking after me you
01:02:19
know he's you know he was guiding me and
01:02:22
not guiding me but he was just you know
01:02:23
what I mean he's such a lovey man.
01:02:25
>> How did he look after you?
01:02:27
>> He would he would tell the the crowds to
01:02:29
be quiet. Oh, you know, things like that
01:02:32
cuz I stand on the first tea,
01:02:36
a big, you know, standing ovation for
01:02:39
him. Both tea off. And as we walked down
01:02:43
the fairway down and up again on the
01:02:44
first hole, everyone stood up and
01:02:46
started clapping.
01:02:48
And they only stopped when he played or
01:02:51
I played. So we both hit our second
01:02:53
shots on the green. Everyone stands up
01:02:56
clapping until we get to green. And that
01:02:58
that happened every single hole. I'm
01:03:02
thinking, "Holy [ __ ] a little moldy boy
01:03:04
from Tahib Bay is playing with one of
01:03:06
the best players in the world. First
01:03:08
round of Augusta and I'm I'm witnessing
01:03:10
this witnessing this amazing experience
01:03:13
of adgulation. It was
01:03:17
it was incredible experience.
01:03:21
>> It's almost like the organizers were
01:03:23
trolling you. How can we make this kid
01:03:24
even more nervous?"
01:03:25
>> Yeah, I know. I don't know what it was,
01:03:26
but I don't know how I got that gig, but
01:03:28
uh yeah,
01:03:30
I was completely blown away. And he shot
01:03:32
70 that day. I never forget it. And he
01:03:35
made like five birdies.
01:03:36
>> And every time he made a birdie, it was
01:03:38
like like the whole world exploded. It
01:03:41
was incredible.
01:03:42
>> Just the crowd rooting for him.
01:03:43
>> Yeah. And then back in the day, there
01:03:44
was like a redraw after each round. And
01:03:46
so I shot like I don't know two or three
01:03:48
over. Wasn't great. And the second day I
01:03:51
played with Gary Gary Player. I'm
01:03:54
freaking Oh my goodness. I think they've
01:03:55
won like 10 jackets between them.
01:03:59
I was so exhausted because I'm I'm just
01:04:02
thinking about how is how how is this
01:04:04
happening? You know,
01:04:05
>> how do you how do you remain chill in
01:04:07
that? Do you get photos with them or
01:04:09
anything or do you do you
01:04:10
>> express how much of a
01:04:12
>> That's not cool.
01:04:13
>> I know it's not cool. But
01:04:15
>> but no, I didn't ask cuz you're not
01:04:17
allowed any um cameras. Yeah. on the
01:04:20
other side of you can you can do it on
01:04:21
the practice range and stuff like that
01:04:23
once you reach go past the clubhouse
01:04:25
onto the
01:04:26
>> ping green and the oak tree you can't
01:04:28
there's no cameras allowed so
01:04:30
>> but yeah I was I was chuffed I mean more
01:04:32
than chuffed
01:04:34
>> uh to play with those two legends you
01:04:35
know my first first Augusta
01:04:38
>> man in that mind of yours there's just
01:04:39
so many good memories
01:04:41
>> oh yeah I mean so so good memories so
01:04:43
many so many memories
01:04:44
>> you've given a lot uh to the sport but
01:04:46
the sport's given a lot back as well
01:04:47
>> of course it has I And another story uh
01:04:52
back in ' 93 94
01:04:55
um I I made the it was like a teams
01:04:59
event. So it was Southern Africa versus
01:05:01
Australasia
01:05:02
and in my team there was Greg Norman,
01:05:05
Baker Finch, Craig Perry, Lucas Parsons,
01:05:08
myself, um BJ Singh
01:05:12
>> and on the Southern African team was
01:05:14
Ernie Retif, David Frost, Nick Price and
01:05:20
they had this event, a team's event,
01:05:21
right? Um so it's us versus them in
01:05:24
Johannesburg and this is just when
01:05:27
Nelson Mandela uh was the prime minister
01:05:31
>> president of of South Africa. So we're
01:05:34
invited to his house
01:05:37
um
01:05:38
and security tough security you know
01:05:41
this is the year after he got gone to
01:05:42
office and
01:05:45
amazing night you know he spoke about
01:05:47
his you know his his um his life and his
01:05:51
presence was incredible um and we all
01:05:55
went outside and
01:05:58
he was there and two teams were there
01:06:00
lined up and I'll never forget get the
01:06:04
I'm trying to paint a picture for you
01:06:06
guys. There's a these steps and over
01:06:08
these steps came these Zulu warriors
01:06:11
with um shields and spears and and
01:06:14
they're challenging us, you know, like
01:06:17
it was scary. I mean there, you know, it
01:06:20
was a scary experience. And I'm standing
01:06:22
there next to uh I forget this uh to
01:06:25
Norman. Greg being a captain said,
01:06:29
"Kambo, you got to respond." I said,
01:06:32
"What?" He goes, "You got to do the
01:06:34
hucker."
01:06:36
And I said, "What?" "By myself?" He
01:06:38
goes, "Yep." He goes, "I'm the captain
01:06:42
respond." I thought, "Oh my goodness."
01:06:44
And obviously we had jacket and tie. So
01:06:46
I took my shirt off, my jacket off, tie
01:06:48
off, whatever, and did the hacker in
01:06:50
front of Nelson Mandela. And he loved
01:06:52
it. Um, so that's a really cool story.
01:06:56
And not many people have done the hacker
01:06:58
by themselves, by the way. Obviously you
01:07:00
seen the hucker in the World Cup 95 or
01:07:02
the abs but uh by yourself
01:07:06
in front of Nelson Mandela in front of
01:07:08
the Zulu Warriors in front of the other
01:07:11
um players
01:07:14
I actually did okay cuz I was I brought
01:07:16
up I was brought up that way you know to
01:07:17
do the haka
01:07:18
>> come
01:07:19
>> yeah come y
01:07:21
>> so yeah that's a cool story
01:07:23
>> that is a that is that's one of the
01:07:25
coolest stories ever on the podcast
01:07:26
thank you so much for sharing that were
01:07:27
you nervous or you didn't have time to
01:07:28
get nervous had enough time. I got into
01:07:30
the mode of being a warrior, you know,
01:07:32
the moldy warrior that that I can be and
01:07:35
um I did it and then he loved it, you
01:07:38
know, everyone loved it, but um in the
01:07:40
moment you just just do it and uh yeah,
01:07:43
it was uh wellreceived.
01:07:45
>> Is Greg a good dude,
01:07:47
>> Norman? Oh, yeah. He was he was so good
01:07:49
to me. He was so good to me.
01:07:50
>> Yeah.
01:07:51
>> In that book, Rookie on Tour, like he
01:07:52
there's there's like a preamble that he
01:07:54
writes. So, he's been in your corner
01:07:56
since
01:07:56
>> Yeah. I mean, he he was incredible. I
01:07:58
mean, I don't know why he took me on. He
01:08:00
under his wing and looked after me and,
01:08:02
you know, flew in his jet, his private
01:08:04
jet. He sat at his place a couple of
01:08:06
times. Um, he we had practice rounds
01:08:08
together. I don't know why. Maybe
01:08:11
>> saw something in you.
01:08:13
>> Maybe cuz I think what happened was
01:08:15
um someone told me uh reminded me of a
01:08:17
story. I think I broke the ice cuz
01:08:19
obviously when Greg goes to a
01:08:21
tournament, this is when he was number
01:08:22
one in the world. No one talks to him
01:08:24
and no players come up to him. And I
01:08:26
said, "My first tournament
01:08:29
as a pro, I saw him. I went up to him."
01:08:31
Oh, Greg, can I have a practice round
01:08:32
with you? He's like, "Who are you?" You
01:08:35
know, he goes, "Yeah, sure."
01:08:39
And um
01:08:40
>> it's so Kiwi, by the way.
01:08:42
>> Yeah, I know.
01:08:42
>> Just rock on up.
01:08:44
>> I was pretty confident, but um I
01:08:47
thought, you know, let's break the ice.
01:08:49
And I played great that day and in the
01:08:52
practice round practice round but still
01:08:53
playing with Greg Norman you know it was
01:08:55
pretty cool and ever since that day um
01:08:58
he he he's really looked after me so um
01:09:01
I think that's the reason why um he saw
01:09:03
he saw something in me and and uh yeah
01:09:07
he was he was great to me.
01:09:10
>> He's one of the goats.
01:09:11
>> Mhm. Mhm.
01:09:12
>> All right. Um the 2005 US Open. Um I
01:09:15
want to start with an impossible
01:09:16
question and you you can pass on this
01:09:18
one. Um, but what was better? Uh,
01:09:20
winning the US Open or the birth of your
01:09:22
kids?
01:09:25
>> Dom, that's so unfair.
01:09:29
>> That is so unfair.
01:09:30
>> Are we going to pass on that one?
01:09:37
>> That's a mean-spirited question.
01:09:38
>> That's [ __ ] horrible.
01:09:40
>> Um, yeah, it seemed like
01:09:42
>> Cut it. Cut it.
01:09:44
>> It just seemed It seemed like everything
01:09:45
clicked. I've been watching highlights
01:09:46
this week. Um yeah, when you look back
01:09:49
Yeah. What happened? What happened that
01:09:51
week?
01:09:52
>> Um
01:09:54
there's a saying that I've heard that
01:09:55
you can, you know, you can fluke a hole,
01:09:56
but you can't fluke 72 holes. So, so no
01:09:59
one no one wins a major as as like a
01:10:02
lucky accident.
01:10:03
>> No, no, it's not not wasn't an accident.
01:10:05
It was meant to be, you know. Um
01:10:08
>> well, it's a combination of a lot of
01:10:09
things. As said before, it's a result of
01:10:11
what I've of 40 years of, you know,
01:10:16
all the help I've had along the way. But
01:10:19
going into the US Open, I was feeling
01:10:20
pretty confident. I mean, I mean, it was
01:10:23
the first time and once again, it's kind
01:10:25
of funny how things kind of pan out or
01:10:27
the the fate of of of how it pans out
01:10:31
cuz it was the first time that USGA had
01:10:33
qualifying outside America of America.
01:10:37
So the qualifying um course was like a
01:10:39
half an hour 45minut drive from my house
01:10:42
in Brighton and it's called Walton Heath
01:10:46
and I actually only went because it was
01:10:48
convenient you know I was living in
01:10:52
Brighton in England and um Walton Heath
01:10:54
up the road 45 minutes away so I thought
01:10:56
why must I go I'm playing well
01:11:00
and 36 holes qualifying
01:11:06
and I'm playing the last hole and I knew
01:11:09
I had better do the last hole to qualify
01:11:12
and I'm playing with my
01:11:16
playing partner Steve Webster. Yeah,
01:11:18
Stevie
01:11:20
and last hole is a short path for we hit
01:11:22
close. He's 10 ft away. I'm 9 ft away
01:11:25
from the hole and my marker is right in
01:11:29
line of his his ball. So I had to move
01:11:31
my marker
01:11:33
and as you do it he hits it and I kind
01:11:35
of peaked to see where what the ball did
01:11:37
and it went straight.
01:11:40
So I aimed straight in the hole and went
01:11:42
in the hole. So I buried the last hole
01:11:44
and I was the last one to qualify.
01:11:47
So, it's meant to be.
01:11:49
>> Exactly. I said before, the very very
01:11:50
beginning of this was meant to be. And
01:11:53
so, I hold that part and now I'm on my
01:11:57
way to uh the US Open.
01:11:58
>> And going into that event, I was playing
01:12:00
great.
01:12:01
>> But once again, you know, I I played
01:12:03
practice rounds with friends of mine and
01:12:06
there's a story about VJ Singh and I I'm
01:12:10
on the first team waiting for the guys
01:12:11
to clear in front of me and VJ's on the
01:12:13
ping green. He goes, "Oh, Cambo, can I
01:12:15
join you?" I said, "Yeah, come join me."
01:12:16
See, he comes over, you know, you play.
01:12:21
And I struggled with my bunker shots
01:12:23
that week. And I watching I was watching
01:12:25
VJ
01:12:26
cuz my bunker shots were coming out top
01:12:29
spinny, no spin. He's playing his bunker
01:12:32
shots as we're playing the practice
01:12:33
round. He's coming out spinny and
01:12:35
holding.
01:12:36
I said, V, how you doing that? He go,
01:12:42
I'll keep it simple. basically keep be
01:12:44
more steeper and and you know uh a few
01:12:47
adjustments in your in your setup kind
01:12:49
of thing. There's more to that than
01:12:50
that, but I just want to keep it nice
01:12:52
and simple. And I said, "Oh, that's
01:12:54
cool. Okay, great." So, I did that. I
01:12:56
practiced that. Perfect. And that week I
01:13:00
hit it in eight bunkers, I think, up and
01:13:03
down seven times and hold one.
01:13:05
>> Wow.
01:13:06
>> Yeah. So if I didn't ask V I know if you
01:13:10
know how to play bunker shots because
01:13:11
that wig the the sand was quite
01:13:15
a heavy sand
01:13:17
wasn't powdery sand. So you need to have
01:13:19
a different angle of attack of the ball
01:13:21
and more more loft and yeah it's it's
01:13:24
hard to explain but basically that yeah
01:13:26
so once again you know things like that
01:13:28
holding the putt
01:13:31
uh to qualify last person to qualify at
01:13:34
Warton Heath and asking VJ about
01:13:38
bunker play
01:13:39
>> you know and then I'm out there and yeah
01:13:43
found myself holding the US Open trophy.
01:13:45
So, when you turn up to Pinehurst, um,
01:13:47
whole one, day one, what are your goals?
01:13:49
What are your expectations?
01:13:51
>> Top top 10.
01:13:52
>> Okay.
01:13:52
>> Second secondhand, um, Porsche.
01:13:56
>> Yeah. 25 grand
01:13:58
pounds.
01:13:59
>> Um, and, you know, 20,000 miles on the
01:14:02
clock. So, that was my goal.
01:14:04
>> And when did you believe you could win?
01:14:05
Was it going to the final round?
01:14:07
>> Well, I had lunch cuz Goose and I, Ret
01:14:10
Goose and I are very, very good mates.
01:14:12
One of my best mates on tour. And it was
01:14:14
the
01:14:17
Sunday
01:14:19
and he's last off. I'm second to last
01:14:22
off. So we had lunch together. Just him
01:14:25
and I and a few other people
01:14:27
sitting down there having lunch and
01:14:30
chatting away about normal things. Not
01:14:32
about golf really, about cars.
01:14:36
How's your kids? How how's my kids?
01:14:37
How's the wife? You know, that's just a
01:14:39
chitchat.
01:14:41
And I walked away. I thought, you know
01:14:43
what? Tell you what, he he's he looks
01:14:45
like he's in control of his emotions, I
01:14:47
think. Yep.
01:14:50
I'm going to finish third definitely.
01:14:52
He's going to win this cuz he won twice
01:14:53
before
01:14:55
>> and um
01:14:58
and after six holes, uh he fell away and
01:15:02
then I was I think I was one one under
01:15:04
he was like four over or something. Now
01:15:06
I'm leading
01:15:08
and everyone else Jason Gore fell away.
01:15:10
Olen Brown, VJ, Sergio,
01:15:14
and the only two guys left. It was me
01:15:15
and Tiger. So, I'm thinking, "Wow, this
01:15:18
is going to be fun, you know. I'm going
01:15:19
to really enjoy this."
01:15:21
>> Is that really what you were thinking?
01:15:22
>> Oh, yeah. Um,
01:15:23
>> you weren't nervous.
01:15:25
>> I think this must be like peak Tiger
01:15:26
Mania, right? Like he he was he was
01:15:28
intimidated. Even though it's like a
01:15:29
non-cont sport, he was very intimidating
01:15:31
at that time.
01:15:31
>> Oh, yeah. It's like going to a boxing
01:15:33
ring, you know, with a heavyweight
01:15:34
champion.
01:15:34
>> Like Mike Tyson at the peak of his
01:15:36
powers.
01:15:36
>> Yeah, exactly. It's like that. And then
01:15:38
I but you know once again you can you
01:15:40
can choose your thoughts and
01:15:43
you can go down the road of I'm not good
01:15:45
enough or see it as a there was one
01:15:49
sentence actually uh let me think of
01:15:51
what I said to myself. Um
01:15:54
yeah see this as an opportunity not a
01:15:56
threat. See this as your playground. So
01:16:00
I I was visualizing I remember reading a
01:16:02
book on uh from
01:16:06
Bruce Lee.
01:16:08
I love reading books and Bruce Lee said
01:16:11
that you know
01:16:14
energy is like water flowing flow
01:16:17
flowing through your body and if the
01:16:19
water is flowing that means energy will
01:16:21
flow.
01:16:22
>> As soon as it starts freezing that means
01:16:24
you're in trouble. So I was I was
01:16:26
thinking about empty cup filling my cup
01:16:28
up with these thoughts about you know
01:16:31
see it as a playground um see this as an
01:16:35
opportunity not a threat you know I
01:16:37
worked I worked hard for this um I'm
01:16:41
deserving you know all the I can't
01:16:43
there's so many things I I was
01:16:44
constantly filling my cup up with until
01:16:46
it was overflowing
01:16:48
>> in between thinking about that Porsche.
01:16:49
>> Yeah. In between that. Yeah.
01:16:50
>> Yeah. What other what other um books or
01:16:53
like psychological tools have you found
01:16:54
helpful? Have you had a sports
01:16:56
psychologist over the years?
01:16:57
>> Yeah. Yeah, I have. Yeah. But also I
01:16:58
worked on myself. Um Louise Haye was a
01:17:01
big thing for me. Uh I got that back in
01:17:03
2000. Louise Haye is more of like um
01:17:06
more spiritual kind of reading.
01:17:09
Nothing to do with golf at all is but
01:17:11
but you as a person. Uh that that helped
01:17:13
me a lot.
01:17:13
>> Can you remember the name of the book
01:17:14
off the top of your head or
01:17:16
>> you can how to heal yourself?
01:17:18
>> I think I've got that at home. It's a
01:17:20
real color colorful cover.
01:17:22
>> Amazing. That that changed everything
01:17:24
for me.
01:17:25
Um
01:17:26
>> what did you get from that?
01:17:32
>> That um how thoughts can thoughts can be
01:17:35
powerful and you have a choice. M
01:17:39
>> your feelings can uh and your thoughts
01:17:42
can dictate
01:17:45
how you're going to perform and and law
01:17:49
of attraction,
01:17:50
>> you know, what you give out, you get
01:17:53
back.
01:17:54
>> Um Oh, there's so many things.
01:17:56
>> Yeah.
01:17:57
>> Wonderful things in that book. And that
01:17:59
that changed my life
01:18:01
because I knew there was something
01:18:02
missing. But don't forget these other
01:18:04
things, too. Not just Louis Haye. Yeah.
01:18:06
I I I mentioned her in an interview
01:18:09
somewhere on TV and she wanted to meet
01:18:11
me. I met her personally, had dinner
01:18:12
with her. She was a amazing person.
01:18:15
Amazing person. What she went through
01:18:17
and
01:18:18
gratitude.
01:18:20
Um
01:18:21
>> I I m we've been going for like an hour
01:18:22
20 now and I've got that just from
01:18:24
speaking with you. Like I can tell how
01:18:25
grateful you are. There is just so much
01:18:27
gratitude. Yeah.
01:18:28
>> With everything you say.
01:18:29
>> Yeah. Yeah, there is. Um and you know
01:18:33
Yeah. It was a very powerful book for me
01:18:36
to read.
01:18:37
>> Yeah, I'm a big reader as well, but um
01:18:39
yeah, one thing I've learned, you can
01:18:41
read all the books in the world, but you
01:18:42
you have to do the work yourself. You
01:18:45
know, you're reading a book's great.
01:18:47
It's wonderful, but then you have to
01:18:48
implement the plan.
01:18:49
>> Well, there is a lot of um she calls it
01:18:51
mirror mirror work. You know, you got to
01:18:53
kind of look in look in your eyes and
01:18:54
and tell yourself that you know these
01:18:56
because anybody can write things down,
01:18:58
right?
01:18:59
>> But you look in the mirror,
01:19:01
>> man in the mirror like Michael Jackson.
01:19:03
Yeah.
01:19:04
>> Uh, you know, it's
01:19:05
>> Yeah.
01:19:07
>> What do you see when you look in the
01:19:08
mirror now? You like you like the Yeah.
01:19:10
When when you stand in front of the
01:19:11
mirror shaving in the morning, you like
01:19:12
you like the guy looking back at you
01:19:14
>> at the moment? Yeah.
01:19:15
>> Yeah. At the moment.
01:19:16
>> Yeah. Uh, obviously I went through some
01:19:18
dark times. Um, as we all do,
01:19:22
>> uh, I'm I'm satisfied what I've done
01:19:25
uh for the game,
01:19:27
>> especially now. Yeah. Yeah.
01:19:28
>> Coming back home for, you know, first
01:19:29
time for a long time and seeing what I
01:19:32
saw at Chasing the Fox, that's
01:19:36
I thought, yeah,
01:19:38
>> you've got so much mana. There's so much
01:19:39
love for you here in New Zealand.
01:19:41
>> Yeah. I mean the thing is that
01:19:44
unfortunately is that tor po puppy
01:19:46
syndrome a little bit cuz you know
01:19:47
you've soon forgotten
01:19:49
you know
01:19:51
>> um once you're not in the limelight
01:19:55
anymore you get forgotten very quickly
01:19:58
here.
01:19:58
>> Yeah things move on. Yeah I was going to
01:19:59
ask you about to tall poppy. Um, this
01:20:02
isn't particularly a New Zealand thing,
01:20:03
but yeah, there was an article in um,
01:20:06
uh, 20 2018 Golf Digest um, which called
01:20:09
your win uh, at the US Open
01:20:11
underwhelming. Um, yeah. Did and you
01:20:15
clapped back on Twitter with a really
01:20:16
good response, but did did that did that
01:20:19
[ __ ] you off?
01:20:20
>> Oh, can you swear on this podcast?
01:20:22
>> Yeah. Yep.
01:20:23
>> No, no, you can't.
01:20:24
>> Yeah. Yeah, it's Yeah, it's a podcast.
01:20:26
Yeah.
01:20:27
>> Um, no. Uh, that would that would I I
01:20:30
suppose I'm just projecting if that if I
01:20:32
was you that that would have really
01:20:33
pissed me off.
01:20:34
>> I don't care what people think about me.
01:20:36
Um, I had some fun with it. I mean, you
01:20:38
see, you can respond in different ways,
01:20:40
right? You can you can respond with
01:20:41
anger, which I never done. I I responded
01:20:45
with humor and and it made the guy look
01:20:48
silly.
01:20:48
>> Yeah. What was your response? Something
01:20:49
like um, oh, the at least the trophy
01:20:51
still loves me.
01:20:52
>> Yeah, I think I think what I did uh, I
01:20:55
can't remember. I think I wrote um I put
01:20:57
a post-it note and then wrote tears on
01:20:59
the on the trophy and put on the trophy
01:21:02
and I said, "Oh, I just told um the
01:21:04
trophy that what been written about you
01:21:06
and he was you can see he's pretty
01:21:08
upset, you know." It was fun to me. It
01:21:10
was fun. I mean, cuz it's one thing that
01:21:13
I once again um I learned from Louise
01:21:17
Haye is that is how you respond to
01:21:19
things. M
01:21:20
>> and uh if I responded angrily, I think
01:21:23
I'll probably get more more [ __ ] back.
01:21:26
>> Yeah.
01:21:26
>> As soon as I responded, everyone loved
01:21:28
it. I mean, the feedback and u and um
01:21:32
all the golfers uh all my friends who
01:21:34
play on tour loved the whole thing, my
01:21:37
response and
01:21:38
>> and it was the right one, I think,
01:21:40
>> cuz what did they mean an underwhelming
01:21:41
win? Like to me, it was it was just
01:21:43
iconic. Like it was a jewel between two
01:21:45
great golf one, you know, the greatest
01:21:46
golfer of all time. Well, don't forget I
01:21:49
think that's written by a a a US um
01:21:53
reporter reporter, right? So,
01:21:56
they don't really I didn't know my my
01:21:59
achievements before then. I mean, if I
01:22:02
played on the PGA tour full-time, it'd
01:22:04
be different, but because I came from
01:22:06
New Zealand, played on the European tour
01:22:09
mainly and Australasian tour, it must
01:22:11
have been a fluke. But if you ask all my
01:22:14
my peers
01:22:17
who are the most important ones um when
01:22:19
it comes to to to a uh opinion
01:22:23
>> um it's hard to win a major.
01:22:26
>> It's hard especially having I I didn't
01:22:29
understand where he was coming from. I
01:22:30
didn't really read the article cuz it
01:22:31
didn't really matter. Um but uh I had
01:22:35
great support from my my peers all the
01:22:37
other players saying you know forget it.
01:22:39
No doesn't bother me. M um but you know
01:22:42
if you think about it I
01:22:46
to win a major on that golf course it's
01:22:48
the golf course is so hard
01:22:50
>> and to have the best player that we'll
01:22:52
probably ever see
01:22:55
um to beat him because don't forget he
01:22:58
just won Augusta 3 months before
01:23:01
>> he comes second at the US Open he wins
01:23:03
the open a month later
01:23:06
>> so he's on his best form ever and I beat
01:23:12
Yeah. And at that time almost any other
01:23:15
player in your position was almost like
01:23:17
giving way to him even subconsciously.
01:23:19
>> But but once again once again it all
01:23:20
depends on your attitude. And as soon as
01:23:22
I started saying those things to me to
01:23:24
myself during the last round of of the
01:23:26
US Open I knew that um you know I was in
01:23:30
control of my emotions and and trust me
01:23:32
it was hard work man. I just
01:23:35
continuously say it to me to myself
01:23:39
every single second
01:23:41
>> because I could either I can go the
01:23:43
other way easily
01:23:45
because always have that guy chirping on
01:23:47
your shoulder. You're going to have
01:23:48
that.
01:23:49
>> And Tiger uh famously waited around
01:23:51
afterwards for the prize giving. Um
01:23:54
>> yeah. What did that mean to you?
01:23:56
>> Oh, that was massive. Um
01:23:57
>> why did he why did he do that? It was
01:23:58
sort of out of character for him. Eh,
01:24:00
>> yeah. I think it was um obviously an
01:24:03
amazing gesture
01:24:05
and I found out um about 6 weeks later I
01:24:09
was talking to Steve Williams
01:24:12
uh about it and Steve said to me that
01:24:14
you know he explained to Tiger my
01:24:15
upbringing humble beginnings from from
01:24:18
Titah Bay sheep fences around the greens
01:24:22
sheep [ __ ] you know that sort of stuff
01:24:25
and so there there's a nice correlation
01:24:26
between him and him and I a little bit
01:24:28
because he came from the very similar
01:24:30
background grounds.
01:24:32
So for him to stand next to me uh
01:24:34
winning the US Open, I mean winning the
01:24:36
US Open was is was
01:24:39
absolutely enough for me
01:24:41
>> as a player. But to have the best player
01:24:43
in the world right there
01:24:46
side by side, sharing sharing my success
01:24:51
is the biggest compliment you can ever
01:24:52
ever get for for a golf player.
01:24:57
>> I thought, "Wow, this is this is pretty
01:24:58
cool." you know, this is cool. Um, and
01:25:02
you showed that picture before of me 11
01:25:04
years old, you know,
01:25:06
going from that to standing next to the
01:25:08
best player on the wall with the US
01:25:10
trophy,
01:25:10
>> having conquered him.
01:25:12
>> Having conquered him. Yeah.
01:25:13
>> Yeah. Like being a photo of you and
01:25:15
Tiger Woods when you're the you're the
01:25:16
guy in the you're the main guy in the
01:25:18
photo.
01:25:18
>> He's in the background.
01:25:20
>> For once.
01:25:21
>> Yeah. Yeah. A very very rare occasion
01:25:24
that he's the guy in the background.
01:25:25
>> Yeah. Exactly. Did that win change you
01:25:27
as a person?
01:25:29
Um,
01:25:34
as a person or as a golfer?
01:25:36
>> As a person,
01:25:40
>> as a golfer, I'd imagine it gives you
01:25:41
more confidence.
01:25:43
As a person, I just wonder if
01:25:44
>> um, as a person, not really. No,
01:25:48
>> I was still, as I said before, when I
01:25:50
came home for those uh 10 days,
01:25:55
I walked into the house and I was just
01:25:58
their son, you know, or or their
01:26:00
brother.
01:26:00
>> Yeah. Michelle still throws you a tea
01:26:02
towel.
01:26:02
>> Oh, yeah. I wash you wash up, Michael.
01:26:04
Oh, yeah, sure. Sweep the floor, you
01:26:07
know, make your bed. I love that, you
01:26:09
know. No, it didn't change me in person
01:26:11
at all. No, but it changed
01:26:12
>> how people perceived me. I was the same
01:26:15
person
01:26:16
>> but it's
01:26:18
>> the perception of other people changed
01:26:21
>> who yeah how's that for you being in
01:26:22
that position where you see people
01:26:23
change around you or people weird is it?
01:26:25
Yeah.
01:26:26
>> Yeah. I didn't like it.
01:26:28
>> I mean
01:26:28
>> do you develop trust issues like you
01:26:30
don't know who to who big time. Yeah.
01:26:32
Big time. That's that's normal. You know
01:26:35
any anytime you do something great
01:26:38
people will come all of a sudden
01:26:41
um appear. I mean there's a great quote
01:26:44
from my friend uh Mel Tong my coach he
01:26:47
coached me from like 15 to about 23 24
01:26:50
no longer than that 25 26 Mel Mel always
01:26:53
comes up with these brilliant quotes and
01:26:55
he said to uh said to me um I know uh
01:26:59
there's more it more klingongs uh in
01:27:02
golf in Star Trek. It's brilliant. It's
01:27:05
true. And I saw that especially after
01:27:06
the US Open with
01:27:08
>> everyone
01:27:09
>> and um thank God I had a buffer you know
01:27:12
I had my management group to deal with
01:27:13
the whole I had three managers at one
01:27:15
stage. I mean the the busyiness I got
01:27:19
from
01:27:22
>> he used to Adrian Mitchell my manager
01:27:25
used to come to my house and we used to
01:27:26
go through the
01:27:28
uh requests and he had a big A4 book
01:27:32
four pages of requests could be
01:27:36
interviews TV magazines podcast no it
01:27:39
wasn't podcast back in the day uh you
01:27:42
know tournaments to play in get paid
01:27:43
that you know you go who and there was a
01:27:47
time when I said I've had enough.
01:27:49
>> I was invited
01:27:53
uh my wife at the time wasn't happy with
01:27:54
me. Um
01:27:56
I was invited to the raw box at
01:27:59
Wimbledon finals.
01:28:02
This is a month after I won. And I said
01:28:05
no.
01:28:08
And the reason why cuz I just had enough
01:28:10
of people. I I I just you know me. I'm a
01:28:12
quiet little moldy boy from Titi Bay and
01:28:16
I I was
01:28:18
it's it's hard to comprehend sometimes
01:28:20
just looking back now and thinking all
01:28:22
the stuff I I did and and said no to cuz
01:28:26
at first I was saying yes to everything
01:28:28
and I said to my wife at the time I said
01:28:30
I can't I've had enough
01:28:32
>> just burnt out maybe.
01:28:33
>> So that's when I hired her
01:28:35
>> I'm on team Julie on this one.
01:28:38
And uh so she I remember she she um
01:28:41
rented a boat for two weeks and we
01:28:43
stayed in the somewhere. We uh we were
01:28:45
back in Australia at the time and stayed
01:28:46
on the boat for two weeks away from
01:28:48
people.
01:28:49
>> I needed a break.
01:28:50
>> Whose boat? Gregs.
01:28:51
>> No, it wasn't Greg. I just I just rented
01:28:53
one.
01:28:53
>> Yeah. Um yes, after that open win, you
01:28:57
get a call from Greg Norman. Um and a
01:28:59
letter from Jack Nicholas. Unbelievable.
01:29:01
What does what does Greg say on the
01:29:03
phone?
01:29:04
>> Well, he I mean uh
01:29:06
>> congrats.
01:29:07
>> Yeah, congrats. and we organized a
01:29:08
practice round for the open at St.
01:29:10
Andrews in 2005 like a month later and
01:29:13
met up with him. So he was um I was
01:29:16
busy, he was busy kind of thing. So it
01:29:17
was like quick chitchat
01:29:19
>> and organizing a around a practice
01:29:21
round. So we had practice round together
01:29:23
and we had a wonderful time and you know
01:29:25
we went through the stories how we met
01:29:27
and um so I said to him on that day
01:29:29
actually I said so why did you look
01:29:31
after me Michael uh Greg? He said, "Oh,
01:29:33
the reason why cuz you um" He liked my
01:29:36
what was it? Um cheekiness.
01:29:39
Cuz he said to me, "No one comes up to
01:29:41
me, you know, ask for a practice round,
01:29:44
especially a rookie."
01:29:46
>> It's quite funny. It's like that photo
01:29:47
that we showed before. I suppose that
01:29:49
cheekiness just never leaves you.
01:29:50
>> Even
01:29:52
look, that's a that's a cheeky kid.
01:29:58
>> Are there still times where where you
01:29:59
feel like that little boy?
01:30:00
>> Oh, yeah. All the time. Yeah. All the
01:30:01
time. If you ask all my friends um who
01:30:04
grew up with me playing golf with me, uh
01:30:06
they'll probably say the same thing. And
01:30:08
uh after watching the uh the documentary
01:30:11
Dare to Be Different, my documentary, um
01:30:14
Vick Purhei, who I love to death, um he
01:30:17
he straightened me out. I he was a hard
01:30:20
man on me and I actually needed that as
01:30:22
a teenager growing up cuz I was
01:30:24
mischievous.
01:30:26
>> Uh I was a bit of a rebel and
01:30:28
>> Well, yeah. In what way? Oh,
01:30:29
>> what was the most trouble you got into?
01:30:31
>> I thought it had difficult to believe
01:30:33
like you had really good grounding,
01:30:35
really good parents.
01:30:36
>> Yeah, but I just was that cheekiness in
01:30:38
there. Um cuz obviously we when we uh
01:30:42
went away, it was like a like a junior
01:30:44
event, a moldi development squad. There
01:30:47
about six of us and we used to go away
01:30:49
and to all these different events around
01:30:51
um New Zealand and and Vic was the
01:30:53
manager and we had a strict uh curfew of
01:30:56
11:00.
01:30:58
Well, I didn't like that. Uh, so I just
01:31:01
sneak out of the hotel window and go and
01:31:04
party and come back again. And one time
01:31:07
I uh I brought back a few friends and
01:31:10
started drinking in the in the hotel
01:31:14
room and he came in. He said, "What are
01:31:16
you doing?" I said, "Yeah, PPY bags are
01:31:17
out."
01:31:19
So he kicked me out of the squad.
01:31:22
And um cuz I had long hair and earring
01:31:27
and that sort of stuff. And he said,
01:31:29
"You're out, Michael. You're not not
01:31:31
invited back again." I was begging him
01:31:34
and I said, "I won't do it won't do it
01:31:36
again." And I didn't. Um so that was a
01:31:37
good learning lesson for me, you know.
01:31:39
>> Big lesson.
01:31:40
>> Big lesson.
01:31:42
>> Um
01:31:43
these are great stories, by the way.
01:31:45
>> On Jack Nicholas, do you still have have
01:31:46
that letter that he wrote you?
01:31:49
Yep.
01:31:49
>> Yeah, that's that's a really kind
01:31:51
gesture.
01:31:51
>> Yeah, it was. Um and then I got Franny
01:31:53
with his son Gary Nicholas. So Gary and
01:31:56
I traveled together on the uh
01:32:01
on the challenge tour. Can't remember
01:32:04
when. Jeez, late 90s.
01:32:07
So Gary and I become very very good
01:32:09
friends. Gary Nicholas and
01:32:12
there was a time
01:32:14
so it was the president's cup in 2005.
01:32:18
I won the US Open.
01:32:20
Month later I won the world match play
01:32:24
and week after that was the President's
01:32:26
Cup and
01:32:30
Jack Nicholas was the US captain
01:32:35
and our captain was Gary Player uh the
01:32:38
international team.
01:32:40
So, I just won the won the um world
01:32:43
match play Monday, flew straight to
01:32:46
Washington DC. Now we're on Tuesday
01:32:49
night, black tie function. Both teams
01:32:52
are there. All these important people
01:32:53
are there. The president was there.
01:32:55
Clinton I think it was then. No. Uh it
01:32:58
was uh Bush, George W. Bush.
01:33:01
>> Yeah, he was there. Sat at his table,
01:33:04
had a nice conversation with him.
01:33:07
And so we're in the in the uh in the
01:33:10
White House. That's pretty cool.
01:33:14
Imagine a little moldy boy in the White
01:33:15
House. You know,
01:33:17
>> it's crazy, isn't it? Um so anyway,
01:33:20
>> this podcast is filled with moments like
01:33:22
that.
01:33:24
>> Um so
01:33:26
where was I? Yeah. So I see Jack coming
01:33:30
over because I I'm known him quite a
01:33:32
long time now, but not a long time, you
01:33:34
know, 10 years or so because I have his
01:33:35
son Gary.
01:33:37
comes coming over to me. He's got this.
01:33:41
I thought he's got these eyes. I
01:33:43
thought, "Oh no, what have I done? What
01:33:44
have I done? What have I done?" He goes,
01:33:45
"Market, well done for winning the US
01:33:47
Open. I watch every single shot. Well
01:33:48
done. Well done." And the world match
01:33:50
play. You know, your form right now,
01:33:52
you're one of the best players in the
01:33:53
world right now. I thought, "Wo, okay,
01:33:55
that's that's pretty cool. Big
01:33:57
statement." You know, you got Tiger
01:33:58
here. Goes, "No, no, your form right
01:34:01
now." because I just finished like fifth
01:34:02
in the open,
01:34:04
sixth in the USPGA, won the US Open and
01:34:07
so I had three months of probably being
01:34:09
one of the best players in the world
01:34:11
>> and the world match player.
01:34:14
Um, also top five player in the world
01:34:16
for those three or four months
01:34:19
through my results, right? And he goes,
01:34:25
he points at me, he goes, "So, Michael,
01:34:28
since you're this major winner,
01:34:31
you are responsible to grow this game."
01:34:35
And he walked off.
01:34:38
I thought, "What's that mean?"
01:34:43
So, I stood there thinking for like, I
01:34:45
don't know, 15, 20 seconds thinking,
01:34:47
"What does he mean by that?"
01:34:50
Then I kind of got it and I thought,
01:34:51
okay, maybe I need to grow the game in
01:34:54
the sense of
01:34:56
start up my own
01:34:59
golf academy,
01:35:00
>> you know, giving back to the game. So
01:35:02
that's when So you planted that seed
01:35:04
back in 2005.
01:35:08
>> So and here I am, you know, what's 20
01:35:11
years later.
01:35:11
>> Yeah. Yeah. Well, you've done it. You've
01:35:14
definitely grown the game. Um
01:35:17
Yeah. especially here in New Zealand
01:35:18
just through your actions really.
01:35:21
You've been really open um over the
01:35:23
years about dealing with self-doubt and
01:35:25
anxiety and your mental health. What's
01:35:27
been the toughest period do you think
01:35:28
for you mentally?
01:35:33
um
01:35:36
to continue I think cuz yeah I mean I've
01:35:42
I've always been that player if you ask
01:35:44
any
01:35:46
from an amateur
01:35:49
you ask all my mates from when I was
01:35:50
playing on the New Zealand teams to
01:35:53
professional ranks
01:35:56
I had this switch that turns off
01:36:01
Um
01:36:04
because I don't like attention.
01:36:06
As a kid growing up in New Zealand, all
01:36:09
I thought about was winning the triumphs
01:36:12
and victories. That's all I thought
01:36:14
about,
01:36:15
>> not the other stuff, not the fame and
01:36:16
fortune. Couldn't care less about that.
01:36:20
So I'll have some sort of success,
01:36:26
you know, be
01:36:28
on TV, interviewed, magazines,
01:36:30
newspapers, you know, you name it.
01:36:33
>> I didn't like it. So I thought to
01:36:35
myself, okay, if I just My coach, my
01:36:38
coach calls it self-sabotage.
01:36:41
>> Wow.
01:36:41
>> Yeah. If I do that, it'll go away.
01:36:44
It did. Then I kind of miss playing role
01:36:48
again. So I try a little bit harder and
01:36:50
and be more determined and more
01:36:52
motivated and that sort of stuff and
01:36:53
start winning again
01:36:56
and all the attention was coming back to
01:36:58
me.
01:37:00
Switch, turn it on again, self-sabotage,
01:37:04
go away. And and that's when I think now
01:37:08
in hindsight and and and thinking about
01:37:10
it, that's what happened to me in 2005.
01:37:13
It was so overwhelming.
01:37:16
I thought I'm done.
01:37:19
you know, I've I've done what I wanted
01:37:22
to do. You know, I achieved my goal. Um,
01:37:28
uh, I climbed my Everest, I say, uh, the
01:37:31
highest mountain in the world. I'm done
01:37:34
because what happened there after
01:37:36
winning the US, no, no one, no one
01:37:38
prepares you for that. No one prepares
01:37:39
you
01:37:41
of the responsibility,
01:37:43
the consequences,
01:37:46
and
01:37:47
I didn't like it. Is this what you were
01:37:50
talking about before, the four pages of
01:37:51
jobs, including, you know, the
01:37:53
opportunity to go to Wimbledon? Yeah,
01:37:54
it's it's overwhelming.
01:37:56
>> It's over. I don't I don't know how
01:37:57
these guys do it. I mean, I don't know
01:37:59
how Tiger does it. You know, he has a a
01:38:02
really tight team around him. I think
01:38:04
that's how he does it.
01:38:05
Um,
01:38:06
>> I suppose it's learning to say no and
01:38:08
just learning about boundaries and
01:38:09
things.
01:38:10
>> Yeah. No boundaries, but also when you
01:38:12
say no to to people, you feel guilty.
01:38:14
For me, you know, I said no a lot to to
01:38:17
charities
01:38:18
because I didn't have time and I was
01:38:20
exhausted. I knew if I go to this
01:38:22
charity event, I wouldn't give it my
01:38:23
all. So, there's no no point me going
01:38:25
there in the first place.
01:38:27
>> And then the reason you're there, which
01:38:28
is being a good golfer, that suffers.
01:38:31
>> Exactly. And I spent more time doing I
01:38:33
trained less. I practiced less. I spent
01:38:35
more time away from the golf course. I
01:38:37
spent more time, you know, raising funds
01:38:40
and going to charity balls and stuff
01:38:42
like that and which I really enjoyed.
01:38:43
But it was hard. It's a hard balance
01:38:45
between the two.
01:38:48
>> Yeah. I saw a clip where um one of your
01:38:51
boys was recalling seeing you break down
01:38:53
after poor form.
01:38:57
>> Yeah.
01:38:57
>> Yeah. I mean, it's hard to see.
01:39:00
>> Yeah. But um it's just every every
01:39:03
sports person goes through that that um
01:39:06
that cycle of disappointment
01:39:09
whether it's going to be you know to
01:39:12
ever play the game again uh to give it
01:39:14
up. I mean I thought about giving up the
01:39:16
game probably about I don't know 10
01:39:17
times.
01:39:18
>> M so it sort of becomes like a lovehate
01:39:21
relationship.
01:39:21
>> Yeah. And then then you miss it.
01:39:23
>> You miss competing. Um you miss the
01:39:27
um the fan base. You know, the fans are
01:39:30
great. Uh what they give you. Um
01:39:35
just the energy they give you when you
01:39:37
start doing well and play well and win.
01:39:39
I miss that more than anything else.
01:39:41
>> Yeah.
01:39:43
I've heard you say you no longer knew
01:39:45
who you were once the winning stopped.
01:39:47
>> I read that. That was a quote from you.
01:39:48
I read somewhere. Who are you now?
01:39:53
>> It's getting quite deep here, Tom.
01:39:54
What's going on?
01:39:55
>> Home stretch.
01:39:57
Home stretch. um
01:39:58
>> like are you are you um yeah I mean at
01:40:01
this age and stage of life at 56 you
01:40:03
know you're not just Michael the golfer
01:40:06
are you? No, I think I'm I'm more like a
01:40:09
person now that um
01:40:13
that understands
01:40:15
what happens after
01:40:17
>> you know what happens after success and
01:40:20
some people find it I mean I spoke to a
01:40:23
lot of people I won't mention who um
01:40:25
sports people who are had amazing
01:40:28
incredible careers
01:40:30
uh they go through depression
01:40:33
>> I'm not that
01:40:34
>> easy to understand how
01:40:35
>> yeah I think cuz cuz you miss that you
01:40:37
miss that buzz. You miss that uh the
01:40:41
acceptance maybe I don't know what the
01:40:43
word of of people to me. I doesn't
01:40:47
bother me. I mean I I really enjoy um
01:40:51
walking down the street now and not
01:40:52
being recognized. I I feel really really
01:40:55
safe.
01:40:57
Before like I couldn't go anywhere, you
01:40:58
know, especially in New Zealand. Uh but
01:41:01
now I feel okay 20 years ago different
01:41:04
generation of people here now. Yeah, I I
01:41:06
feel safe.
01:41:07
>> Well, you walked here today from um the
01:41:09
Intercontinental Hotel, but did anyone
01:41:11
yell out a window like Cambo?
01:41:13
>> Surely you can't walk from like your
01:41:15
hotel to here, which is maybe a
01:41:16
kilometer without at least one person.
01:41:18
>> Yeah, there was one person here. Um I
01:41:21
tried to, you know, be incognito with my
01:41:23
glasses and that didn't work. Yeah, I
01:41:26
mean I went to have lunch with my friend
01:41:28
of mine from school, Darren Prada, and
01:41:30
uh took like two selfies or something
01:41:32
like that. So, you know, I know it's
01:41:34
still
01:41:35
>> manageable.
01:41:35
>> It's manageable. But before, forget it.
01:41:38
>> I would stay home. I wouldn't go out.
01:41:40
But now, I can go out and be normal.
01:41:42
>> Yeah. What does success look like to you
01:41:44
now?
01:41:47
>> Uh success to me for me or or for
01:41:49
>> for you? For you personally.
01:41:52
>> Um
01:41:56
I haven't really thought about that.
01:41:57
>> Yeah.
01:41:58
>> Uh
01:41:58
>> just like being happy and content or
01:42:01
>> Yeah. I I think uh for me it's just
01:42:05
enjoying life and and having a different
01:42:08
kind of life away from golf if I can. I
01:42:10
know golf will be always be a big part
01:42:11
of my life.
01:42:12
>> M
01:42:13
>> that will never end.
01:42:15
um to to
01:42:17
still help in some sort of
01:42:21
way.
01:42:23
Um
01:42:24
to I still get requests to help kids out
01:42:28
on my social media advice. You know,
01:42:31
it's always nice to do that.
01:42:33
>> You're great on social media, by the
01:42:35
way.
01:42:35
>> I don't like it.
01:42:36
>> Yeah.
01:42:36
>> Don't you?
01:42:37
>> No.
01:42:39
>> Sorry all these influencers, whoever
01:42:41
watching, but I'm sorry. I don't like uh
01:42:43
social media. I mean, once again, I'm a
01:42:45
shy boy, you know? I don't like doing
01:42:46
stuff and and uh it's it's like pulling
01:42:49
teeth.
01:42:50
>> Yeah.
01:42:51
>> Well, you and I were both in our 50s.
01:42:53
Like, we we weren't brought up with
01:42:54
this.
01:42:55
>> No, no, no, no, no. But but you're very
01:42:57
good at it, though.
01:42:58
>> Yeah. Oh, out of necessity. Also, I've
01:43:00
I've got a team that do a lot of the
01:43:01
stuff as well. If you get a DM, it'll be
01:43:03
from me, but yeah, a lot of the posting
01:43:05
is done by the team. Um, when was the
01:43:07
last time you cried?
01:43:09
>> Just now.
01:43:10
>> Oh, of course. Yeah. Reflecting on your
01:43:12
mom.
01:43:12
>> Yeah.
01:43:14
It's shows how much you care that um
01:43:16
just like talking about that even
01:43:18
without getting too deep on it. Um yeah,
01:43:20
it just brings the emotions straight to
01:43:21
the forefront.
01:43:22
>> Yeah, I mean as I said before that time
01:43:24
never heals I think well for me right
01:43:26
now it's only been two years but still
01:43:27
you know I think it's uh it's going to
01:43:29
take a a long process
01:43:31
>> but I think the the the day that you
01:43:34
stop getting emotional about it you know
01:43:35
it means it's I don't know her memories
01:43:37
you're further away potentially.
01:43:38
>> Well the thing is I think we stop
01:43:41
caring. That's the thing, you know. Um
01:43:44
she's a big part of my life and
01:43:46
>> um and she helped me along the way with
01:43:49
um so many things, you know.
01:43:51
>> She was very tough on me. She knew uh I
01:43:53
was a little, you know, sneak out the
01:43:55
door and sneak out of my bedroom window
01:43:58
and cause trouble and come back and
01:44:00
Yeah, I was I was a Yeah, I wasn't uh
01:44:03
easy the easiest uh teenager.
01:44:05
>> Tough on you. And and and what was she
01:44:07
the disciplinarian?
01:44:07
>> Oh, yeah. Was she? Oh, yeah. It's the
01:44:09
opposite in my house. Like we we we'd
01:44:11
get up to [ __ ] during the day and my mom
01:44:12
would be like, "Wait until your dad gets
01:44:14
home and 5 hours later we'd be getting
01:44:16
the belt for something that happened so
01:44:19
long in the past that we couldn't even
01:44:20
remember what we were
01:44:22
>> No, no. My my dad's a big softy. I love
01:44:24
my dad." Um but my mom Yeah.
01:44:27
>> Was it What was it for you? Was it a
01:44:29
belt or a jander or
01:44:31
>> um combination of both really? Soap down
01:44:34
my down my mouth.
01:44:36
>> I got that too. Only when we swore
01:44:37
though. That's old now, isn't it? I
01:44:39
mean,
01:44:39
>> no one's doing that.
01:44:40
>> No. Yeah. As a kid now, you could
01:44:42
probably call um children young, you
01:44:44
know, call the authorities
01:44:47
and you get
01:44:48
>> Well, the thing is I used to get
01:44:49
strapped all the time at school, you
01:44:51
know, cuz I was always when playing up
01:44:52
always I was always in the back of the
01:44:54
classroom causing trouble and and the
01:44:57
six of the best. So, you got put your
01:44:58
hand out big thick leather strap.
01:45:03
>> Yeah. Getting your That's so funny that
01:45:05
you got your mouth washed out with soap
01:45:06
as well. It was a big thing in the 70s.
01:45:08
>> Of course it was. Yeah, of course it
01:45:09
was.
01:45:10
>> Cake of pal of gold down the of gold.
01:45:13
Yeah.
01:45:14
>> Do do you have any regrets?
01:45:17
>> Um
01:45:19
regrets as in what? Uh in my golfing
01:45:22
career or just uh in life?
01:45:24
>> Anything really.
01:45:25
>> Um
01:45:26
>> both.
01:45:28
>> Yeah. Um I've won really. I think um for
01:45:30
me, well two really personally
01:45:34
um not seeing my parents
01:45:38
that often um because I obviously left I
01:45:41
was 23 years old
01:45:44
uh to overseas and never came back. You
01:45:46
know, I came home probably once every
01:45:48
two or three years, sometimes four
01:45:50
years. So time you know you lose time
01:45:55
with your loved ones but I had to uh to
01:45:58
achieve
01:46:00
what I wanted to achieve in life.
01:46:03
Um so that's the biggest thing for me is
01:46:05
that is that my job was not a job my
01:46:08
sport
01:46:09
took me away from but I actually knew
01:46:12
that from the very beginning
01:46:14
>> when I jumped on that plane when I was
01:46:16
23 years old I'll be I'll see less and
01:46:19
less of my my family.
01:46:21
Yeah, it's just the way it is. And uh
01:46:24
golfing wise
01:46:28
is not to because after winning the US
01:46:31
Open, you're exempt on the PGA Tour for
01:46:34
five years and I said no to it.
01:46:40
So from a golf golfing point of view,
01:46:44
uh yeah, that's my only regret really.
01:46:46
>> Why did you say no to it? Well, I wanted
01:46:48
to bring up my kids in England rather
01:46:50
than America for obvious reasons. Um,
01:46:53
and myself and my wife at the time,
01:46:55
Julie, we agreed. And but now looking
01:46:58
back in hindsight,
01:47:00
uh,
01:47:01
it would have kicked on, I think, my
01:47:03
career. But, you know,
01:47:07
>> it is what it is right now. And, um, I'm
01:47:09
happy where my kids are and how they
01:47:12
are. Um, so the most important thing
01:47:14
right now is, you know, is your health
01:47:15
and they say health is your wealth and
01:47:20
um, yeah, so that's where I'm at.
01:47:24
>> That that personal regret you you you
01:47:27
can't beat yourself up too much about
01:47:28
that because I mean, if you had your
01:47:30
time again, you you probably wouldn't do
01:47:31
anything differently, right?
01:47:33
>> Exactly. No.
01:47:33
>> Yeah.
01:47:34
>> No. Exactly.
01:47:35
>> I'm um, acutely aware of that, too. Like
01:47:36
my dad lives in we're not a particularly
01:47:38
close family, but my dad lives in
01:47:39
Wellington. He's in his late 70s now.
01:47:40
probably the same age as your dad. And I
01:47:42
I'll see him maybe once or twice a year
01:47:44
and you start to do the sums in your
01:47:46
head. I'm like, "Okay, if he lives to
01:47:47
90, it's like we're down to like the
01:47:49
last 15 or 20 visits."
01:47:51
>> Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. There you go. Yeah.
01:47:54
>> I mean I mean we
01:47:56
you got to realize that I'm from a very
01:47:58
big family. So on my mom's side,
01:48:03
don't crucify me here. Uh don't crucify
01:48:05
me here.
01:48:07
I think eight eight or eight um sorry
01:48:12
she had seven seven brothers and sisters
01:48:14
>> my dad's side
01:48:17
14
01:48:18
brothers and sisters.
01:48:19
>> Wow.
01:48:20
>> So at one one time I had 65 first
01:48:24
cousins and it was the best the best
01:48:27
time of my life. I mean, the best time
01:48:28
of my life was when we used to get all
01:48:31
together
01:48:33
for Christmas or Easter or whatever
01:48:36
gathering
01:48:38
and hang out with my cousins. That's the
01:48:40
best memories of my whole life. If you
01:48:43
take away what I achieved in golf,
01:48:46
that question because um obviously we go
01:48:48
on the farm. Um it was a small
01:48:51
three-bedroom house and we used to go to
01:48:53
the uh
01:48:55
Mai to stay there or even like camp
01:48:58
around the house and and just
01:49:01
obviously back in the day there was no
01:49:02
electronics so we had to do something.
01:49:04
So get a ball and golf or whatever you
01:49:07
know and just do that. That's those
01:49:10
memories I'll never forget.
01:49:13
Man, there's so many parallels. Yeah. My
01:49:15
my mom big Catholic family from Levin,
01:49:16
which is she's one of 14. So there's
01:49:19
always always cousins your own age. So
01:49:21
many cousins. And yeah, same sort of
01:49:22
thing. You just found fun.
01:49:24
>> Um yeah, the the rotary clothes line,
01:49:27
that was always a lot of fun.
01:49:30
>> Yeah, I used to play Bull Rush back in
01:49:31
the day.
01:49:33
>> Having that many cousins, that must have
01:49:34
been niggly for you when you're back
01:49:35
home for the NZ Open or something.
01:49:37
That's a lot of cousins. Well, the funny
01:49:39
thing about it was that every time I go
01:49:40
back home, the tournament tournament
01:49:42
director, right, or the organizers knew
01:49:44
I needed like 12 150 tickets.
01:49:49
That was that was part of the contract
01:49:52
for me to play, you know, um this and
01:49:55
that, but I need 150 tickets.
01:49:59
>> Unbelievable.
01:50:01
They came through.
01:50:02
>> Oh, yeah. Of course.
01:50:03
>> Yeah, of course.
01:50:04
>> What are your what are your biggest
01:50:05
flaws?
01:50:07
stubborn.
01:50:09
>> Um,
01:50:10
>> it's funny, I mentioned before I had
01:50:11
Steve Hansen on, and he said a person's
01:50:13
greatest flaw is usually their greatest
01:50:15
strength as well. So, I wonder if for
01:50:17
you that's being stubborn, like being
01:50:19
stubborn, it served you pretty well in
01:50:20
your career.
01:50:20
>> I suppose it has cuz um, you know,
01:50:22
people were telling me that, you know,
01:50:23
to to actually think about, you know,
01:50:26
turning pro was a stupid idea.
01:50:29
>> I had that a lot. Not so much from my
01:50:32
close family,
01:50:33
>> but people around me. I mean, that's why
01:50:35
I didn't tell my my my mates from school
01:50:38
I played golf.
01:50:40
You know, you imagine at 15 years old,
01:50:43
also 84 in the 80s, mid 80s,
01:50:47
I didn't tell my friends to play golf
01:50:49
because back in the day it was rub your
01:50:51
rub your leg.
01:50:52
>> That's it. No other option.
01:50:55
And because it's it's quite a tough
01:50:57
culture if you think about it. back in
01:50:59
the day, you know,
01:51:02
golf was meant for old people,
01:51:05
>> not for young kids.
01:51:07
>> So, yeah, I I was I was very stubborn in
01:51:09
that way and thinking, "No, this is the
01:51:10
right pathway. I'm going to do this. I
01:51:12
don't care what you guys say. I'm doing
01:51:14
it."
01:51:16
>> What about future goals? Where do you
01:51:18
see yourself at? 60, 65, 70.
01:51:21
>> Um,
01:51:24
I haven't gone that far. I think I want
01:51:26
to still play. I mean, I still want to
01:51:28
play on the Legends Tour. Um, if I knew
01:51:30
if I feel that I can't win anymore, I'll
01:51:33
definitely throw the towel cuz, you
01:51:35
know, deep down inside that hell, you
01:51:37
know, if you're not good enough. Um,
01:51:39
besides that, just enjoy life really,
01:51:42
>> you know. Um, just enjoy being out there
01:51:44
and and um, you know, seeing the
01:51:48
success, you know. Of course, you got
01:51:50
Lydia Co as well. Lydia is doing
01:51:52
fantastically and seeing Ryan Ryan and
01:51:55
and Dan and Kaburi as well uh do well.
01:52:00
It's kind of cool to sit back and have a
01:52:02
glass of red wine and watch you guys
01:52:03
guys play and and just um think, okay,
01:52:07
I've got I have something to do with it.
01:52:11
>> You just mentioned Lydia Co. then I I
01:52:12
put into um chat GPT on AI like who are
01:52:15
the who's the greatest New Zealand
01:52:17
golfer of all time.
01:52:19
>> Now, what do you think the top three
01:52:20
would be?
01:52:21
You You're putting Lydia at number one.
01:52:23
>> Yeah.
01:52:23
>> Yeah. Number two,
01:52:24
>> above Charles
01:52:25
>> number three.
01:52:27
>> Me.
01:52:29
>> According to AI, you're number one.
01:52:31
Lydia is number two. Charles is number
01:52:33
three. But they had a little asterisk
01:52:35
next to Lydia saying depends what
01:52:36
happens. But you know,
01:52:38
>> moving forward in her career.
01:52:40
>> Yeah.
01:52:41
>> You're disputing AI.
01:52:42
>> Yeah, I am. Yeah.
01:52:43
>> You're calling [ __ ] on that.
01:52:44
>> Yeah, I was calling [ __ ] AI. Sorry,
01:52:46
man. But definitely definitely Lydia
01:52:48
what she's done. Absolutely. number one
01:52:50
in the world. Come on.
01:52:52
>> Um, so Bob Charles in front of me.
01:52:53
Definitely he his career has been in the
01:52:55
mind. So AI, you're completely wrong
01:52:57
there. Sorry. You got to change that.
01:52:59
>> Have you Bob's still alive? E um you
01:53:01
have you had much to do with him over
01:53:02
the years?
01:53:03
>> No, I haven't actually cuz um he doesn't
01:53:06
do much uh you know uh social media
01:53:08
stuff or or I don't haven't got his
01:53:10
number. Um
01:53:11
>> I tried to get him on the the podcast,
01:53:12
but he politely declined. But I think
01:53:14
he's still quite sharp. still travels to
01:53:15
the UK, still plays golf,
01:53:17
>> but he's he's what must be 80 something
01:53:19
now.
01:53:20
>> Yeah. Yeah.
01:53:21
>> Um it's not his type of thing to do, you
01:53:23
know. Um I mean I remember playing the
01:53:24
practice round with him actually. You
01:53:26
probably can't remember this back in 93.
01:53:27
It was at uh Tbury. I play played with
01:53:30
him then. He's still playing. Um I'm I'm
01:53:34
a big fan of Bob what he's done for the
01:53:36
game here in New Zealand. and and um
01:53:38
obviously I think he needs more credit
01:53:39
because you know what he's done for uh
01:53:42
back in the 60s and 70s is different
01:53:44
now. He's more of a social present media
01:53:46
present here of platforms.
01:53:49
Um you know he should be more revered I
01:53:52
think as as a player and as a ambassador
01:53:55
of the game. Um he he started the whole
01:53:58
thing you know if you think about it and
01:54:00
I came came along and took over but now
01:54:02
it's time to pass on the to the next
01:54:05
guy. Yeah.
01:54:08
Say, say your two sons were in the next
01:54:10
room, uh, talking about you behind your
01:54:12
back. What three words would you like
01:54:14
them to use to describe you?
01:54:15
>> Oh my god,
01:54:17
this is really getting deep here, mate.
01:54:20
Um,
01:54:22
>> are you are you comfortable with the
01:54:23
deeper stuff or
01:54:24
>> Oh, yeah, of course.
01:54:25
>> Yeah.
01:54:25
>> You've always been quite an open book,
01:54:27
haven't you?
01:54:27
>> Yeah, I have. Yeah, somehow too open.
01:54:29
Um, uh, I think,
01:54:33
uh, they probably be pr proud of me.
01:54:35
>> Yeah.
01:54:35
>> Um, fun
01:54:38
>> and honest.
01:54:41
>> Great words. Yeah. Are you proud of
01:54:44
yourself?
01:54:45
>> Yeah, I suppose.
01:54:46
>> Yeah,
01:54:48
>> a little bit.
01:54:49
>> Just a little bit. Come on.
01:54:52
Are you um Yeah. What's your inner
01:54:54
monologue like? Like what's your inner
01:54:56
voice like? Are you are you like are you
01:54:57
quite kind to yourself or are you quite
01:54:59
hard on yourself?
01:55:00
>> I'm both. I think all depends on the
01:55:01
situation.
01:55:02
>> Yeah,
01:55:02
>> I think I'm both. Um I think I'm the
01:55:04
type of person who who um if I need a
01:55:07
bit of a you know a giddy up I I tell
01:55:10
myself to do that
01:55:11
>> and
01:55:13
>> if I get too loud I tell myself to be
01:55:15
quiet kind of thing. So I think in my
01:55:16
internal monologue is pretty good.
01:55:18
>> Yeah.
01:55:19
>> Um once again I I learned it from you
01:55:22
know from reading books and other people
01:55:24
and asking questions. That's one thing
01:55:26
I've I did u as a as um trying to learn
01:55:31
this game, trying to learn this
01:55:33
beautiful game is asking questions to
01:55:34
the to the right people,
01:55:38
>> you know, and not just golfers, but also
01:55:40
other people as well of of influence.
01:55:44
>> Thanks, Hans. I just noticed your
01:55:46
Panama. What's the story behind that?
01:55:48
Who's that from?
01:55:49
>> Um
01:55:51
it's it's from my family. Um,
01:55:54
cheapest. It's like 20 years old, I
01:55:56
think. 15 years old.
01:55:57
>> Yeah, I broke my previous one. So,
01:56:00
>> yeah, obviously it means good luck. It's
01:56:02
one of those.
01:56:04
>> Jeez, you're so connected with family
01:56:05
and culture, aren't you?
01:56:06
>> It's one of my strengths, you know. I
01:56:08
think um as I said before, you can't do
01:56:09
by yourself. You got to have a a team
01:56:12
around you. What um part of my team is
01:56:14
my family and my culture. And um uh as I
01:56:18
mentioned before earlier in the podcast
01:56:20
that you know uh I said as a
01:56:23
it gives me mana as well I think and
01:56:26
yeah it's a combination a lot of things.
01:56:29
>> Well Michael Campbell this has been an
01:56:31
incredible podcast.
01:56:33
>> It's gone to places that I didn't
01:56:34
expect.
01:56:35
>> Yeah me too. Me too.
01:56:36
>> Is there is there anything that we've
01:56:38
left uncovered that you were hoping we'd
01:56:40
touch upon today?
01:56:41
>> Um
01:56:43
[ __ ] I think we've covered everything
01:56:45
really. Yeah, I mean there's so much to
01:56:46
your story that I missed out. I was like
01:56:48
dropping cards on the floor as we went,
01:56:49
but uh I just captivated by the stories
01:56:51
and I'm so it's such an honor to have
01:56:53
you here. I'm so pleased we can mate.
01:56:55
>> Um yeah, it means a lot and I really
01:56:57
appreciate it.
01:56:58
>> Good. I'm glad you enjoyed it.
01:57:00
>> Loved it.
01:57:01
>> I actually enjoyed it, too. I enjoyed
01:57:03
cuz you know, obviously you do a lot of
01:57:04
these podcasts and things like that and
01:57:07
interviews, but you know, you you
01:57:09
actually dig a little bit deeper than
01:57:11
than the surface of of how you feel. Oh,
01:57:14
I try. So, if someone like yourself is
01:57:15
going to give me a couple of hours of
01:57:16
your time on a Sunday, the least I can
01:57:18
do is um you know, thoroughly prepare
01:57:20
for it and hopefully ask you a couple of
01:57:22
things that you've never been asked
01:57:23
before.
01:57:24
>> Yeah.
01:57:25
>> Cool.
01:57:26
>> Legend, mate. Keep in touch.
01:57:28
>> Cheers, mate.
