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Hey guys, it's Blaine. You're listening in to Dateline's morning meeting. It's a big week.
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Our team is catching up on breaking crime news. There's ring footage. This is all on camera.
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Is this going to throw a wrench in the whole trial? Is it going to be a delay? We figured this was going to happen.
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Welcome to Dateline True Crime Weekly. I'm Andrea Canning. It's September 25th, and here's what's on our docket.
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In California, after serving almost 14 years in prison, a man convicted of murdering his girlfriend and setting their house on fire, gets a new trial.
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The federal judge says the prosecution misrepresented the evidence at trial. In Dateline Roundup, a judge makes a critical ruling in the case of the alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer Rex Heuerman.
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Karen Reed is back in court, this time for her civil case. And Barry Morphew, the man charged with his wife's murder for a second time, gets some big news.
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Barry Morphew was released after posting a $3 million bond. Plus, I'm joined by my fellow Dateline correspondents.
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We'll be in Nashville this week for our first ever Dateline Live event, and we're going to give you a sneak preview.
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Everybody getting together will be a wonderful thing. Before all that, we're heading to a courthouse in Chambers County, Texas, where a woman accused of poisoning her fifth husband is heading to trial.
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On January 7, 2023, Sarah Hartsfield called 911 in a panic from her home in Beach City, Texas.
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She told investigators that her diabetic husband, Joseph, had experienced a crash in his blood sugar overnight.
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Paramedics rushed Joseph to the hospital where doctors noticed something strange.
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His medical condition didn't seem to match the story Sarah was telling them. A nurse made a call of her own to the police to report her suspicion that Joseph had been poisoned.
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Days later, he was dead. A detective began taking a closer look at Sarah and quickly learned that she was no stranger to law enforcement.
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In 2018, she came under scrutiny from police after fatally shooting her fiancé. She said she shot him in self-defense.
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In 2021, her ex-husband accused her of plotting to murder his new wife, something Sarah denies.
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But Sarah was never charged with any crimes until three weeks after Joseph's mysterious death.
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The detective arrested Sarah for his murder. She has pleaded not guilty to first degree murder.
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Next week, Sarah's trial will begin and prosecutors have announced their plans to call witnesses from her past.
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Dateline Field producer Rachel White, who has crossed the country investigating Sarah's case, is here to bring us up to speed.
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Hey, Rachel. Hi, Andrea. Rachel, to start, tell us about Sarah and Joseph's relationship.
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Sure. So they had gotten married really quickly after meeting. They had only known each other for
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about three months, and that wedding happened in February of 2022. Were there any signs that the relationship was in trouble?
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Yeah. A friend that we spoke to shared some messages that she had back and forth with Sarah
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in December, right before Joseph ended up dying, where Sarah had called him a nightmare.
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And she also told that same friend that she had planned to end the relationship.
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Did Joseph want out of the relationship too? Were they at that point? Yeah. So according to a search warrant affidavit on January 3rd, 2023, just a couple of days before
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Joseph was rushed to the hospital, he had actually asked a family member if he could stay with them
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because he was planning to divorce Sarah. Other members of Joseph's family also told investigators
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that they had voiced their concerns that Sarah might try to harm him. What was Sarah telling people in the days after he died?
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So she was always very active on Facebook, and she made a social media post a day after Joseph died.
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And it said from the moment she shared the news of Joseph's mysterious illness that his family went on a witch hunt and pointed the finger of blame at Sarah, instead of accepting the truth that his death was from his own poor health.
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And she says she told him to take better care of his health and wrote, honey, I didn't marry you just to bury you.
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My. So then about a month after Joseph died, there's news of an arrest. Sarah Hartsfield was indicted for his murder.
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That's right. And Joseph's autopsy comes back and a medical examiner had ruled that he died from complications with insulin.
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And investigators accused Sarah of ignoring the alarms from the glucose monitoring app on her phone.
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And from a search of the Hartsfield's house, investigators were able to find 10 insulin pens by Joseph's bedside.
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But it was a close examination of Sarah's past that really started to raise alarm bells for investigators.
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Rachel, as part of Dateline's reporting on Sarah, you spoke with some husbands, a former boyfriend.
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What did you learn? Yeah, so many of the men felt that they were in danger leading up to the end of those relationships.
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It doesn't seem like she had many cordial breakups. One of Sarah's ex-boyfriends alleges that after breaking up, his home went up in flames.
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Investigators ruled that the fire was caused by faulty wiring. And her third husband, a man named Christopher Donahue, claimed that Sarah and her fourth husband were plotting to kill Christopher's new wife.
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And this was all according to an affidavit in support of a request for a restraining order.
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And we should mention that Sarah told Dateline she denied plotting to kill Christopher's new wife.
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But tell us a little bit more about the shooting death of her former fiancé, Rachel.
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His name was David Bragg? We learned that Sarah told investigators that she and David would argue, and at the time of the
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shooting, she claimed that she went back to the couple's house and David pointed a gun at her.
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She had brought two guns with her to the house and she claimed she fired blindly in self hitting and killing David Initially David death was being investigated as a homicide but no criminal charges were ever filed against Sarah In fact investigators who examined the
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scene said that the evidence was consistent with her story. Right, Rachel? They did, and witnesses
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even provided statements that seemed to support Sarah's story. And in January of 2019, the county
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attorney announced that Sarah was justified in firing at Bragg in self-defense. After Sarah was
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indicted for the murder of Joseph Hartsfield, investigators announced they were going to reopen
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their investigation into her former fiance's death. Yeah, so they've reopened it and are looking into
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it again. We don't really know the status of it or where it stands at this moment. So Sarah Hartsfield
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is set to go to trial in Texas for the murder of Joseph Hartsfield next week. And the big question
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here, will prosecutors bring up Sarah's past and are they allowed to bring up her past? I think
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that's definitely in the cards. So jury selection expected to start September 29th. Rachel, any
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insight into who will be testifying, if Sarah herself will take the stand? I'm not sure if
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Sarah will take the stand, but I would imagine that her ex-husbands will be called, that her
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kids will be called to testify. I think that for her family, her kids, it's going to be a very
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emotional trial and one that I'm sure they're looking forward to putting behind them. Wild story,
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Rachel, I look forward to hearing more about this one. Thank you so much for bringing us this complicated story.
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Thank you for having me. Coming up, a California man accused of murdering his girlfriend gets a new trial.
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We'll tell you about the security video at the heart of the case. On the evening of October 15, 2009,
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Hookah Lounge owner Boulos Paul Zumat returned to his Palo Alto, California home
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to find it up in flames. He shared the house with his girlfriend, Jennifer Skipsy, who was nowhere to be found.
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Firefighters were on the scene in minutes. Paul could barely get his words out when he spoke to Jennifer's parents from a police interview room.
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Not long after, a detective broke the news to Paul that they'd found a dead body inside the house.
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It was Jennifer. But in the days that followed, investigators learned something disturbing.
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Jennifer was dead before the fire even began. She'd been strangled. Paul quickly came under suspicion,
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especially after police uncovered holes in his alibi and fractures in his relationship with Jennifer.
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In 2011, he went on trial for murder and arson and was found guilty on both charges.
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But now, over a decade later, Paul is back in front of a jury after a federal judge ruled his initial conviction
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was based on false evidence. Could Paul, who has always maintained his innocence, walk free?
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Here to bring us up to speed on the latest is Dateline producer Brittany Tom. Hi, Brittany.
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Hey, Andrea. Yeah. Tell us a bit more about Paul Zumot and Jennifer Skipsy. Well, Paul and Jennifer, they were a young, popular it couple in Palo Alto. Jennifer was
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a real estate agent. Paul was originally from Jordan, and they'd been dating for two years.
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So back in October 2009, Paul said he was out running errands and learned his house was in
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flames. After Jennifer's body was found, investigators went pretty quickly to arson
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and then to murder, right? Right. When firefighters and investigators entered that home,
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they were struck by the overwhelming smell of gasoline. And they also located a gasoline can
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next to Jennifer's body. So that was enough for them to determine this fire was likely set
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intentionally. Then when the autopsy results came back, Jennifer actually had died hours before the
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fire was set. Her cause of death, strangulation. So once authorities determined this was a homicide,
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What made them zero in on Paul? It turns out there were some ups and downs in Paul and Jennifer's relationship and actually were quite serious and documented.
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There were various restraining orders and domestic violence reports. And two months before her death, Jennifer had been getting threatening phone calls from a block number.
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She believed they were from Paul. Jennifer had told authorities that Paul had been making death threats to her and even filed for an emergency restraining order.
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In his interview with police, Paul actually mentioned that. I'll tell you PD, they put an emergency restraining order on me in August because she said, Paul, threatening me, blah, blah, blah.
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And I said, no. We had these problems, me and her. After that incident, Paul was ordered by a judge to attend anger management classes.
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Even though the relationship was rocky the night before the fire, Jennifer threw Paul a party.
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That's right. Based on the photos that we've seen, it looked like a beautiful celebration with cake and everyone was having a great time.
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But apparently later that night, the two had gotten in a fight and Jennifer went home alone and they exchanged these like angry text messages.
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Paul told police when he went home, they actually made up. But text messages continued the following morning and showed that the couple began to argue again.
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And things really escalated to a point where Jennifer threatened to file charges against Paul.
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All right. So we fast forward to trial in 2011 and prosecutors present all this evidence against Paul.
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What was his defense? Well, Paul actually hired famous attorney Mark Garagos, who you may have heard of.
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I just interviewed him for the Arkham special. Exactly. So they had a great defense team and Paul actually took the stand in his own defense.
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He said it's true that him and Jennifer did have a volatile relationship, but he didn't kill her.
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He also said he had a strong alibi and he said he was at his hookah lounge the time the fire was set.
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And there are security videos to support this. The jury didn't believe him, so he was convicted and sentenced to 33 years.
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So, Brittany, this is where this big twist comes in. More than 14 years later Paul Zumot is now back in court for a new trial How did his team convince the judge Paul maintained his innocence over the years
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His defense team has submitted various petitions. All were rejected until 2020 when his petition finally made it to federal court.
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Paul argued he should either be released or retried based on the inclusion of false evidence in his first trial.
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And the federal judge agreed. And what false evidence are they referring to? There were two major pieces. First was that security camera footage that shows Paul at his hookah lounge. Remember, Paul's alibi was that he was at his hookah lounge, therefore could not have committed the crime. The fire was first reported at their house at 6.39 p.m. by a passerby. The prosecution used security video from Paul's hookah shop to show Paul arrived at his lounge at 6.47. Paul had eight minutes to make it to the hookah lounge after allegedly setting the house ablaze.
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The lead detective in the case testified it takes anywhere from like four to ten minutes to drive from the couple's cottage to the hookah lounge.
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But Paul's defense team said they found another video which shows Paul arriving at his shop as early as 6.45 p.m., making this window to start the fire much, much tighter, six minutes instead of eight.
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Though I've heard this video is quite grainy and it's hard to make out who is in the video.
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The federal judge says the prosecution misrepresented the evidence at trial, and he also found Garagos did not do his client any favors by failing to adequately review the security footage.
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Okay, and you said there's more, right? Yes. The second piece is related to those threatening calls Jennifer said she got from a blocked number two months before her death.
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After Paul's conviction, investigators interviewed a friend of Jennifer's named Roy Enderman,
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who told them that Jennifer had asked him to call her from a blocked number to make it look like she was receiving blocked calls from Paul.
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She thought it would bolster her case to get the restraining order. At the time of the trial, both the prosecutors did not know those blocked calls had been fabricated by Roy Enderman.
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The federal judge says that was enough to grant him a new trial. Brittany, do we know what they're doing differently this time around?
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And will there be any new witnesses? So right now we're still in the prosecution's case.
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And so far, it's generally been the same evidence and the same witnesses. One thing we are monitoring is when Jennifer's friend Roy Enderman will take the stand.
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We learned he is a defense witness this time. I believe he testified for the prosecution the first time around.
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And he will have to address those fake phone calls he made to Jennifer from a block number.
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When the defense takes its turn, do we know if Paul Zumat will take the stand since he did take the stand at his first trial?
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That remains to be seen. Defense will start next week, but we've heard their case will probably only take three days maximum.
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Based on the reporting from the last trial, his testimony was not very helpful to his own defense.
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And given that we've heard that it's only a three-day long defense, it sounds like he may not take the stand.
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We will be sure to follow along. Thanks so much, Brittany, for this update. Thanks, Andrea.
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Up next, it's time for Dateline Roundup. A major hearing for Rex Heuerman, the man charged with seven murders along Gilgo Beach.
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Karen Reed is back in court for the wrongful death lawsuit filed against her. And an alleged murderer is out of custody in Colorado.
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Plus, we've got my fellow correspondents to talk about the Dateline live event in Nashville this weekend.
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Welcome back. Joining me for this week's roundup is Dateline producer Mario Garcia.
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Welcome back to the show, Mario. Thanks for having me, Andrea. All right. For our first story, we're headed to Long Island to a story that you and I both know well.
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There was a major hearing on Tuesday in the case of alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer Rex Heuerman.
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He has pleaded not guilty to the murders of seven women. Mario, what's the news out of this latest hearing?
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Last time you were on the podcast, we talked about DNA and how critical it is to this entire case.
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That's right, Andrea, and that's right where we pick back up again. In this hearing, we knew that the schedule was for the judge to rule on a couple of defense motions.
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One was a DNA motion based on a kind of obscure health standard. because the lab that did the DNA isn't licensed in New York. Well, the judge has denied that motion.
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And so now we know definitively all of the DNA will be admissible in this trial.
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Okay. And you also found out that there is a lot of discovery documentation to go through.
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You're right, Andrea. It was revealed by District Attorney Ray Tierney that they've turned over
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120 terabytes of information. So for math nerds out there, there's one estimate that says one
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terabyte of information is approximately 6.5 million pages if you print them out as Word
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documents. And so is that going to affect possibly a trial date? Where are we at with that?
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We thought we might get a trial date on Tuesday, and we did not. In fact, the defense said because
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there's so much information to go through, they know that they will be filing more motions,
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and the judge allowed them until January 13th of next year to get those motions filed.
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We know how hard this is on families when these pretrial hearings and all of it just
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keep dragging on and on. And do we know how they're doing? You know, it's difficult for everybody.
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It's difficult for the families of the victims. and it's let's not forget it's difficult for rex herman had a wife and children and they were there
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yesterday we stood in very close proximity in line waiting to get in and the lawyer for his ex-wife
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uh s al over spoke outside the courtroom on tuesday and we recorded some of what uh that he had to say the longer it drags the longer they have to basically have their lives on hold They cannot move forward So in July of 2023 I don think anyone anticipated this taking two and a half three years to
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get to this point. And we don't know if it's going to be even finished in 2026. Mario, the defense also asked the judge to hear a motion involving having these cases
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possibly severed, these trials. One ruling on Tuesday was that that will not be the case.
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It will be one trial. For our next story, we are off to Colorado for an update in the case of Barry Morphew.
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His wife, Suzanne Morphew, disappeared on Mother's Day 2020. And this year, he was arrested and charged with her murder a second time after previous charges against him in 2021 were dropped.
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Barry Morphew has pleaded not guilty, and there is a really big update here. That's right. Barry Morphew was released after posting a $3 million bond.
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There are some specific conditions to his bail. The judge said Morphew must surrender his passport.
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They may not leave Colorado for any reason. And interestingly, the judge said he must also
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only use the name Barry Morphew, which is significant because you may recall when authorities arrested him in June, they said he was living hundreds of miles away in Arizona
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under another name, Lee Moore. Morphew is due back in court on November 3rd. And for our last story, we're off to Brockton, Massachusetts, where Karen Reed was back in
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court this week. She is the woman who was found not guilty earlier this summer of murdering her
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police officer boyfriend, John O'Keefe. The state alleged she hit O'Keefe with her SUV and left him
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to die in the snow. What was this week's hearing all about? As you said, Karen Reed was found not
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guilty of murder, but she was found guilty of lesser offense of drunk driving. And so John
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O'Keefe's family has now filed a wrongful death civil suit against Karen and two of the local bars
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in Canton. And it's this wrongful death lawsuit that brought Karen back to court this week for a
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status hearing. Reed's lawyers, of course, Alan Jackson, they have tried to have this wrongful
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death suit dismissed without any success. In Monday's hearing, they announced Karen's plans
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to sue. So Karen herself is going to sue several of the witnesses we discussed while covering her
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murder trials. That's right. And the list is long. She plans on suing members of the Massachusetts
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state police, including Michael Proctor. You'll remember he's the officer who was fired for sending
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disparaging texts about Karen to other officers. But this lawsuit also claims her civil rights were
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violated by those messages and claims that there was a broader conspiracy against her headed by
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Proctor. She also plans on suing both the McCabe and Elbert families. Dateline listeners will
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remember that the Elberts house is where Karen said she dropped John O'Keefe off for a party the
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night of his death. And we should say that the McCabes and the Alberts have denied any wrongdoing.
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This is really incredible, Mario, how this saga continues. On and on and on. Thank you so much for bringing us all these stories today.
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Happy to help, Andrea. For our final segment this week, I have the special treat of chatting with my fellow Dateline
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correspondents about something very exciting happening in just a few days. This Sunday,
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September 28th, we'll all be together in Nashville to present the first ever Dateline
00:21:10
live event. Thank you for joining me, everyone. I see Blaine. I see Dennis. I see Keith. I see
00:21:17
Lester. Hello, hello. And I should say, we are sadly missing our friend Josh Mankiewicz today.
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He's probably off shopping for a cowboy hat, some cowboy boots, maybe a, I don't know,
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you know, a pocket square. I think he's in lockout. Somebody put him in jail overnight.
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He'll be out in a couple of days. What kind of pocket square could he wear for Nashville,
00:21:41
guys? I think it's like a blue denim, right? Yeah, that would be good. Okay, let's talk Dateline
00:21:48
Live. One of the things I'm looking forward to is that we're going to talk to some familiar faces,
00:21:53
people who have actually been on Dateline. Keith, you're going to be talking to someone Dateline
00:21:58
fans will probably be quite familiar with. I would think so. I'll be talking to Colby,
00:22:04
who is Lori Vallow's son. Lori Vallow, of course, being at the center of that really horrific murder story involving her children. And Colby was the one who didn't
00:22:16
know what was going on for the longest time and was caught right in the middle of it.
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That's going to be very interesting. And we're going to talk to some experts. Blaine,
00:22:25
you and Josh are going to do something really exciting and talk to an investigator and a
00:22:29
detective. I am really looking forward to that conversation, Andrea. So we're going to talk to
00:22:34
them about some of the different tools and techniques that they use to crack the cases,
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which of course is very interesting to all of us as we report our stories. So lots of questions for
00:22:43
them about what they do when they hit a dead end, when cases go cold, how they can try and revive
00:22:48
that investigation. Fascinating. And Lester, Lester, you are going to be talking to an expert
00:22:55
on something that I feel like I would be absolutely terrible at and would fail miserably,
00:23:00
eyewitness identification. Yeah, I mean, how well do we remember things? And that's the heart of so
00:23:06
many stories we've done on Dateline over the years, you know, where they rely on someone who
00:23:11
says, I absolutely saw him, that's the guy sitting there in the gallery. So in this case, we will talk
00:23:17
to an expert about the strength of eyewitness testimony in criminal trials. But this is also
00:23:22
going to be an opportunity for us to revisit some, let's just say, Dateline lore. So that's
00:23:27
something to look out for. Okay. Yeah. Blaine knows all about that since she's joined the team.
00:23:33
Absolutely. I mean, I always say that I've been a Dateline viewer longer than I've been a Dateline
00:23:36
correspondent, right? And so I think that this conversation will be so interesting because this
00:23:40
is what is the secret sauce of Dateline, all of the things that viewers remember. So those
00:23:45
interesting interviews, those memorable moments, those conversations with either family members or
00:23:50
suspects, killers, con men. We're going to talk about all of those things. And Keith,
00:23:55
we're going to share what goes into making a dateline. And anecdotes. My gosh, there's so
00:24:00
These have happened in the field. We also have some really exciting celebrity hosts lined up to moderate these conversations.
00:24:07
Dennis, tell us all about that. Yeah, I'm delighted to say that we're going to have the multi-talented actress and singer-songwriter, Annette O'Toole.
00:24:15
And she's going to be joined by her husband, the great Michael McKean, the singer and actor of Spinal Tap and starred in Better Call Saul.
00:24:24
And finally, we're going to be joined by Holly Robinson-Pete, the actress I'm looking forward to meeting all of those people.
00:24:29
Yeah, me too. I love Holly Robinson-Pete. She's so much fun. Okay, so this is really cool. We'll also have an audience Q&A where we'll answer all your questions, so make sure to come prepared for that. In the meantime, let me ask each of you, what are you most excited for in Nashville?
00:24:47
I'm way in there. I love Nashville because it's a music town, and as you know, I'm a musician.
00:24:53
So I may have to put my hat on and my dark glasses and kind of just work my way through the neighborhood there and some of the bars.
00:24:59
But I will not leave without hearing some good music. Nice. Well, I'm excited about seeing all you folks.
00:25:05
Everybody getting together will be a wonderful thing. That is terrific. And in the company of the people who seem to love us the best to actually get in their car and make a long trip to Nashville to come check us out.
00:25:15
Yeah, I'm excited to say hi and take lots of selfies. Yeah, and I agree with everything all of you just said.
00:25:21
That my answer Easy answer We are looking forward to seeing everyone there And if you haven got your tickets yet there are still some available at datelinenbc forward slash event
00:25:33
You can also find a link in the description of this episode. Thank you guys so much for coming on the podcast.
00:25:40
I can't believe I'm going to be seeing you in a few days. This is so great. Can't wait.
00:25:44
See you all there. You guys take care. Travel safe. Here we come. Lester, bring your base.
00:25:48
Yeehaw. that's it for this episode of dateline true crime weekly to get ad-free listening for all our
00:25:56
podcasts subscribe to dateline premium coming up this friday on dateline it's the season premiere
00:26:02
josh has an all-new two-hour episode what happens when a killer leads detectives in the wrong
00:26:08
direction you were on the wrong path the whole time because somebody wanted you on the wrong
00:26:13
path the whole time. I felt like a puppet. Watch The Phantom this Friday at 9, 8 central on
00:26:19
NBC. Thanks for listening. Dateline True Crime Weekly is produced by Carson Cummins
00:26:25
and Katie Ferguson. Our associate producer is Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown-Kurloff.
00:26:32
Veronica Mazzaca is our digital producer. Rick Kwan is our sound designer. Original music by Jesse
00:26:37
McGinty. Bryson Barnes is head of audio production. Paul Ryan is executive producer and Liz Kohl is senior.
00:26:43
executive producer of Dateline. All right, see you later.