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I would say overall you know my my childhood was good you know you know except for you know the the the early
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Runnings with the police I got I got to be well known amongst uh Jun officers and other
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police officers in Quincy Jimmy Scott grew up in Quincy Illinois right on the Missouri Illinois border the two states
00:00:29
are separated by the Mississippi River Jimmy was close to his two brothers Mike and Jeff the three boys were just one
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year apart he would I think kind of Mastermind something and then they just kind of you know he was he was like a
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leader type this is Jimmy's mother Sharon Scott she says that when her kids were little they got in trouble all the
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time not anything too unusual smoking cigarettes ringing random doorbells in the middle of the night sometimes they
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built small fires in their yard but Quincy is a small town and so the Scott boys and especially Jimmy got
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reputations and then in 1982 when the brothers were 13 12 and 11 they rode their bikes to their old school Webster
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Elementary the school had shut down the year before the doors were locked and so
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the brothers climbed up a fire escape kicked through a window on the second floor and snuck in you know I know we uh
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kind of did some some Ram sacking through some of the some of the classrooms um I got me a big red
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kickball like yeah that that that was pretty neat they wandered into the auditorium where they'd been in school
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plays the two older brothers Mike and Jimmy were smoking the youngest brother Jeff asked for a cigarette but his
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brother said no so he asked if he could hold the lighter Jimmy dared Jeff to light one of the stage curtains on fire
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and Jeff who was 11 held the lighter against the curtain it caught on fire easily and they couldn't make it stop
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Mike tried to stomp it out but it was spreading up the curtains they ran back towards the window where they'd broken
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in and then Jimmy remembered that Mike had taken a grade book Jimmy lit the grade book on fire too he was worried
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about fingerprints and threw it along with the lighter into a classroom and closed the door the brothers biked home
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and promised never to tell anyone by 2: a.m. the entire town smelled like smoke people including
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Jimmy's parents watched the school burn from their front porches 80 firefighters
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work through the night to put it out but it was still burning the next morning four other fire departments were called
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in to help we had no idea that it was going to burn to the ground it was gutted I think Mom knew because she
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that's one of the things she did was she smell her hands and Mom knew that that that something was a Miss but she didn't
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know the the extent of the scope and I don't think we did either it was probably I would say
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probably about 3 days later that uh the police came to the house arson investigators worked with
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local teachers to identify any kids behaving strangely which the Scot boys were and Jimmy had even done some
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cryptic bragging the police interviewed the brothers one at a time Mike first then Jeff Jimmy last they all confessed
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they were tried before a juvenile judge with a court-appointed defense attorney Mike the oldest got probation till he
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was 18 but he would go home with his parents that day Jeff the youngest was sent to live with a foster family Jimmy
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who the judge determined was the in Ator was moved to a youth home to finish out
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the school year uh then if I recall I was sent to have an evaluation a mental evaluation um and after that I think I
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returned home they diagnosed him with mild depression and add by August of 1982 the whole family was back under the
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same roof but things felt different people criticized Sharon's parenting to her face other kids weren't allowed to
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play with the Scott Brothers especially Jimmy people knew who I was and I think that there was a
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fear probably amongst teachers and others that what's he going to do you know what what's going to happen is he
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going to do something that's going to hurt you know me or or anybody else after he graduated from high school
00:04:54
Jimmy spent a lot of time hanging out and drinking with his older half-brother Dan one night Jimmy had a lot of beers
00:05:01
and then lit some wood on fire in an old carport destroying an antique tractor and he kept going from there small arson
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here and there I think dumpster fires maybe a car fire you know petty theft just Petty you know if if something
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happened in my neighborhood the cops were the first one to call to our house you know they they they were the first
00:05:22
one to show up you know where was you at what was you doing right around this time a man named Neil Baker was promoted
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to Detective with the Quincy Police Department in one of his first cases as a detective was a series of arson an
00:05:36
apartment an old carport and a car wash he says there wasn't much crime in Quincy detectives normally spent their
00:05:44
time on misdemeanor marijuana cases he was trying to find a pattern to the fires and he was able to connect each
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fire to Jimmy Scott one was a car wash on Broadway here in Quincy he was mad at the owner because something the owner
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did I believe to his brother one was an old guy's garage here in town uh shed he
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had a bunch of wood in it he was showing off for some friends he was in his late
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teens and one was a young lady that had rebuffed his advances and he set fire to the
00:06:17
apartment house when he went to arrest Jimmy detective Baker brought along his younger brother Bruce also a detective
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they arrested Jimmy on six counts of arson and one account of disorderly conduct Jimmy was 18 years old when he
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began his 7-year prison sentence he'd only end up serving three of those seven years when he got out of
00:06:41
prison he got a job at Burger King he dated a woman named Susie they got married and he went back to hanging out
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at Dan's house every night you know I was a drinker partyer love loved to have fun love my friends my family and then
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all hell broke loose and Quin and Jimmy Scott was right in the middle of the worst of it for today's story we
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worked with contributor Noam osband who learned that in a small town people have
00:07:11
a very hard time forgetting who they think you are I'm phebe judge this is Criminal the summer of 1993 was a
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memorable one for people living on the Mississippi River in Illinois and Missouri the winter before they'd seem
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particularly heavy snowfall and then that spring and into the summer it just rained and rained and rained two to
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three times the normal amount of rain the soil was saturated so the rain water just ran into the river I me we just had
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kept having rain rain rain rain rain and the everything just kept going up the rivers kept going up and they was trying
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to keep the the levies from breaking and they was breaking up and down all the way up and down the the
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Mississippi thunderstorms are likely tonight and the National Weather Service still saying locally Heavy Rain they're
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patrolling they are sand bagging they are cutting brush so they can get to even more ly so that they can get maybe
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get some bulldozers in we are this morning um I have declared a state of disaster for the city of Ken can you
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tell me what the river stage is at Quincy please where is it all going to go more than a thousand levies failed that
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summer along the Mississippi and Missouri Rivers 20 million Acres were destroyed more than 500 counties flooded
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doing almost $15 billion in damage but the town of Quincy was safe it sits up high on Limestone Bluffs protected from
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the river however its sister city just across the Bay View Bridge West Quincy Missouri was not safe not at all their
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Levy simply wasn't tall enough so they they tried to bulldoze the dirt from the basee of the levy up toward the top and
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then started lining it with plastic sheets and put sand bags on top of that 3.5 million sandbags in all well
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everybody was working very hard to keep you know the the levies from breaking and it was it was a hot summer um and
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everybody was just doing their part you know filling sandbags and that one of those volunteers was Jimmy Scott I
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started working on the West Quincy Levy you know help Patrol walk P sandbags uh I think it did that for like four or
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five days Jimmy says he took the work seriously and felt useful when he finished working at the levies he often
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went to Dan's house for beers there are always a lot of other people hanging out
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there watching baseball and drinking and Jimmy told them stories about what he'd
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seen happening at the river one evening Jimmy played basketball with some teenagers in Dan's driveway one of the
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boys asked Jimmy if he was scared the levy would break to which Jimmy replied if the Levy Breaks then we'll have good
00:10:06
catfishing in West Quincy on July 13th engineers said the levy could hold 32 ft of water the water
00:10:13
level was at 31.9 hundreds of communities and thousands of people are bracing for the
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highest water in 20 years I told my husband I'll stay till I see the first snake and then I'm
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gone they think they've got the levy be high enough they're worried now about what's seeping through the bottom well
00:10:33
meanwhile the levies at West Quincy and Hall Illinois are holding as tensions rise flood watch 93 is
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next on the night of July 14th Jimmy was back at Dan's and his wife Susie was there too Jimmy chatted with a
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16-year-old named Joe flax Jimmy talked about wishing his wife wasn't always around she worked across the river in
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Taylor Missouri and Joe flax remembered Jimmy saying if that Levy Breaks I hope it strands
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Susie over and Taylor so I can party here without [Music] her on July 16th the water was cresting
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and even though the Army Corps of Engineers and National Guard had been able to make the levy taller by
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bulldozing sand upward that process also thinned the lovey walls pretty dramatically Jimmy went down to the bayy
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bridge to help and told a national Guardsman that he'd already been taught how to spot trouble areas Jimmy joined
00:11:28
another volunteer here and they got to work inspecting a on Mile Stretch there there was uh a larger amount of of water
00:11:38
or seab bridge in one one section this Levy and I was like well we need to find someone in charge and go tell him
00:11:47
according to Jimmy they set out in opposite directions to try to find someone in charge Jimmy walked South and
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when he got to the Bay View Bridge he found Sergeant Duke Kelly this was just before 2 p.m Sergeant Kelly asked Jimmy
00:12:03
to lead him back to the trouble spot and according to Jimmy the two men walked about a half mile before Sergeant Kelly
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realized they were walking toward a low priority area he stopped and said my main concern is with my guys uh south of
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the bayy bridge but I'll make sure I inform somebody and let him know Sergeant Kelly turned back but told
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Jimmy to keep an eye on it and that if it got worse to let someone know every so often they had you know everybody
00:12:31
thinks when they talk about a sandbag Levy that it's sandbag roll sandbags that wasn't the case every every so
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often they had uh sandbags to where they used to use a Shore up a depressed area
00:12:44
and the levy was you know it was like up and down up and down it wasn't a solid you know height all the way down the the
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levy you know it was up and down up and down up and down I moved uh I took sandbag from the brim and put them on a
00:13:01
depressed area of the levy you heard the ly break I mean being on being on the baby
00:13:13
bridge I seen you know sort of trees cracking and it was loud you know we we heard the Rushing Water from half a mile
00:13:22
away you know quar mile away a 100t gap opened in the levy over 14,000 Acres of farm land were flooded barges were
00:13:31
propelled from the river onto farmland and one crashed into a gas station which promptly exploded the Bay View Bridge
00:13:38
was shut down for 2 months forcing drivers to go hours out of their way to cross the river all traffic on Quincy's
00:13:45
Bay View Bridge was forced to stop when a levy just several hundred yards Upstream of the bridge broke and the
00:13:51
fight to save all this land was over now this happened 3 minutes ago this was 3 minutes ago folks
00:13:59
water is spilling out over in into West Quincy and people understandably are being asked to
00:14:07
evacuate the premises because of a fire that is erupted at the air Coast storage
00:14:11
station gentlemen back behind the squad car now it's just it's so difficult to describe to see that quantity of water
00:14:18
uh and to know that the destruction of what is coming it's uh you know it's just moments
00:14:23
away Jimmy says he was walking back to his car when he was stopped by Michelle mccormac a reporter for local TV station
00:14:32
wgm he told her that he'd seen water coming in and move sandbags on top of the puddle after that he stayed on the
00:14:39
scene and helped the Coast Guard unload boats from a truck and then he spoke with Michelle mccormac again for the 10
00:14:46
p.m. broadcast that night I'm watching TV the news cuz I watch the news and I see James Robert Scott standing on the
00:14:54
bridge talking to a reporter and she was doing a fine job interviewing detective Neil Baker was at home
00:15:01
watching this and he just couldn't believe Jimmy Scott was actually there to help he did not look like somebody
00:15:08
had been working on Levy and the heat was uh incredible it was very humid it had been raining every fraking day for
00:15:15
quite a while this guy was a little sweaty and stuff because it was so hot he didn't have on a life vest he didn't
00:15:23
couldn't answer this uh good reporter's any of her softball questions she wasn't
00:15:27
interrogating him who who were you working with where were you working what' you have for supper
00:15:33
where did you have supper couldn't answer anything and I I'm looking at him I knew him and uh from previous
00:15:41
encounters and uh it looked to me like this is you know this is a guy that uh had something to hide and it could
00:15:50
barely contain himself the news made it clear that Jimmy was one of very few eyewitnesses everyone else was working
00:15:57
along parts of the levy that seemed weaker Bob null the sheriff of a neighboring Illinois County also watched
00:16:04
Jimmy live on TV and wanted to ask him a few questions uh the first time I got interrogated was on July 17th the day
00:16:11
after the ly failed the the evening of July 17th it was late at night and lo and behold who pulls up almost as we're
00:16:18
getting out of the car Sheriff no can we talk to you so yeah what's this about you know what it's about and I told
00:16:29
Susie I said I'm he wants me going around am insurance department I said I'll be be home she no I'm going with
00:16:34
you and she did but you know uh I remember we come out and Susie asked me said uh what's
00:16:43
going on I was like they think I broke the levy and she said did you I said no I
00:16:48
didn't Sheriff n's next move was to start questioning people who knew Jimmy he talked with some of the teenagers
00:16:55
who'd hung around Dan's house drinking they told him what they knew and repeated things Jimmy said about how a
00:17:01
levy break would mean good catfishing on July 22nd startling news as an investigation is announced into
00:17:08
the West Quincy Levy break the Maran County Missouri and Adams County Illinois sheriff's departments along
00:17:14
with the Quincy police department will be investigating the possible sabotage of the levy specifically the sighting of
00:17:20
an unfamiliar man on the levy at the time of the break Commissioners say they call the law in in order to quell rumors
00:17:27
and let Levy workers know their efforts were not in vain if this Levy gave way of its
00:17:34
own effort we would almost have to say it's the Lord's will and the Lord's will also
00:17:40
but if if if it has been caused by something other than natural occurrence I believe that the the whole Community
00:17:47
who has pitched in so valiantly to help in this lever fighting can feel that we were not
00:17:53
defeated now obviously because the tangible evidence has been washed away investigators will have to gather all
00:17:59
the circumstantial evidence that they can the crime was in Missouri not Quincy Illinois but it was a larger issue than
00:18:07
that detective Neil Baker and of course the Missouri authorities were pretty constrained what they could do because
00:18:15
it was all underwater so I interviewed uh pertinent people I did an investigation and as well as my brother
00:18:21
Bruce the Baker Brothers helped form a task force with other County state and federal law enforcement agencies to
00:18:28
investigate the levy break even the FBI got involved this went on for months but
00:18:34
Neil Baker felt Jimmy Scott had to be involved him and others others said that you know I made statements that I want
00:18:41
the levy break so you know I can do some fishing and partying and and and have suie on the other side so I can mess
00:18:47
around with other women and his that I'm not going to say that I didn't make you know some of
00:18:55
the statements that that that that were were supposed to be made and I remember uh telling Neil Baker and
00:19:02
and his brother the same thing you know if if I said that you know I don't remember but it was just in in a joking
00:19:09
manner [Music] regardless on October 1st the Baker Brothers paid a visit to the Burger King
00:19:18
where Jimmy worked they waited in the parking lot for Jimmy to finish his shift but as I'm getting ready to pull
00:19:24
out Neil Baker and Bruce Baker pull up in front and pull pull in front of my car why why I couldn't pull out and they
00:19:33
come in the car and say James guys say yeah step out the car see yeah so we got a warrant for your arrest for
00:19:40
burglary okay what I burglarize oh we got you have plenty of time to talk about that I will have plenty of time to
00:19:47
talk about that and we get down to Quincy police department and they put me in um an
00:19:54
interrogation room or or or holding room we had actually five crimes to uh interviewing in
00:20:02
B Numero Uno would have been the levy break but we thought he might have committed a armed robbery a purse
00:20:10
snatching a burglary to a vehicle and uh bad checks Jimmy admitted to writing bad
00:20:17
checks and stealing a backpack from a truck but his story about the levy never changed he told him what he told
00:20:25
everyone else all along that he moved sags he said on tape that he moved at least four to five sandbags and that he
00:20:33
never intended to make the levy worse there's no physical evidence which shows that he broke it it's it's mostly like
00:20:39
the fact he was there and that there people like Witnesses about things he said is that I I have no sense of if
00:20:46
that's common or uncommon for somebody to be convicted on that degree of evidence with without any physical
00:20:54
evidence well physically he was there physically he was the first one that saw it break
00:20:59
I know what you're getting at uh physical evidence I think's often times overrated it's not
00:21:07
it's a lot more flimsy than people think it is and U so i' I'd say yeah I'd say that's not
00:21:15
that uncommon you know I remember when my trial was going on the OJ trial was going on and I remember on the news
00:21:23
you'd see the OJ trial OJ Simpson trial in in big bold gold letters well here when my trial was going they had the
00:21:34
James Scott trial same way Big B go letters the main question of the trial was whether the levy would have failed
00:21:42
regardless of Jimmy's presence Jimmy didn't testify his attorneys presented an expert named Charles Morris a civil
00:21:50
engineer from Missouri who told the jury that the levy was absolutely in danger of failing on its own Morris said that
00:21:57
anyone sabot aing it would have died Swept Away by the undercurrent for the prosecution experts
00:22:05
testified to the strength of the levy detective Baker testified describing Jimmy as a career criminal and
00:22:11
16-year-old Joe flax who by this time was incarcerated himself recalled Jimmy saying that he wouldn't mind his wife
00:22:19
getting stranded on the Missouri side of the river and then Joe flax added something he'd never said before that
00:22:26
Jimmy planned to break the levy in advance of July 16th after a 3-day trial and 4 hours of
00:22:33
deliberation the jury reached a verdict I'm the first and only person arrested charged tried convicted and sentenced of
00:22:41
knowingly causing a catastrophe Jimmy Scott was convicted under a Missouri law that makes it a
00:22:48
felony to quote knowingly cause a catastrophe according to the law one can cause a catastrophe by explosion fire
00:22:57
flood collapse of a building or the release of poison radioactive material bacteria viruses or other difficult to
00:23:05
confine forces catastrophe is defined as death or serious physical injury to 10 or more
00:23:11
people or substantial damage to five or more buildings did you know that law even existed the the law about
00:23:20
intentionally causing a catastrophe had you no other others didn't either you know I'm I'm thinking is
00:23:26
property damage matter of fact when it come to my sentencing I think uh my attorneys looked you know tried tried to
00:23:34
find other cases that were similar there is none there is none like this at all I don't think they had enough
00:23:42
evidence that all right I'll just say it like this they I think they was looking
00:23:47
for a scapegoat Jimmy's mom Sharon Scott and he was there and think well you know
00:23:54
Jimmy Scott was the one he was over there and and he he was the one that broke the
00:24:03
[Music] levy during sentencing the judge cited Jimmy's previous convictions going all
00:24:10
the way back to the fire at Webster Elementary and then he sentenced him to life in
00:24:17
prison we met with Jimmy at the Jefferson City Correctional Center a Maximum Security Prison you know I'm I I
00:24:24
have one of the one of the highest profile cases in this camp you know the most unique in the state you know being
00:24:31
that that there's no other case like mine at all and when guys hear about it uh you know are you kidding you're for
00:24:37
murder I said no I'm not this is what I'm here for have you ever been convicted of any violent crime no it's
00:24:45
but you like to fire that that's one of the things that uh uh the judge said in my sentencing he
00:24:53
said he said it's it's funny that it started out started out with fire and in [Music]
00:25:01
water Jimmy's lawyers appealed his conviction on the grounds of procedural misconduct arguing that the prosecution
00:25:09
had not revealed all their Witnesses beforehand the Missouri Supreme Court gave Jimmy a new trial in
00:25:16
1998 this time the defense called a soil scientist named R David Hammer who testified that when the Army Corps of
00:25:23
Engineers bulldoze sand from the bottom of the levy walls to the top they made the Walls Way Too Thin he said it was
00:25:31
quote absolutely insane adding that it wasn't a matter of if that Levy would fail but
00:25:39
when Jimmy was found guilty a second time he will be eligible for parole in 2023 you know there are probably things
00:25:49
that I've done in my life you know leading up to the flood um that I never got caught for
00:25:57
that be in prison for you know my my personal my my personal opinion but as for the West Quincy Levy no this is a
00:26:07
guy that I don't think there's much beyond what he would do detective Neil Baker he broke that Levy in my opinion
00:26:16
because he's an arsonist at heart and it was similar to to setting a fire it was
00:26:22
very simple thing to do people think how can one guy do all that damage a child could have done that damage there was
00:26:30
not much to it so he did $100 million worth of damage there people in both trials who
00:26:37
were experts who had said that the levy seemed like it might have broken anyways
00:26:41
and levies had broken in other places and so has there ever been a time where you have doubted I guess uh since that
00:26:49
you know since you first saw him on TV whether or not he did it no not ever and and remember I have a history with Jimmy
00:26:55
Scott I've talked with him before and reference other crimes before and uh I can kind
00:27:02
of I have a feeling for when he's telling me the truth and when he's lying to me there's only two that knows what
00:27:10
happened that night and nobody's going to change my mind that is God Almighty and Jim that's the only
00:27:18
ones I can't I can't change what happened and sometimes things are happen for they everything happens for a
00:27:29
reason everything happens for a reason but me and the river don't get along I just no it's not my I'm far far
00:27:41
away from the river I can stay I'm I'm [Music] happy no I'm oand criminalist produced by Lauren
00:27:55
Spore Nadia Wilson and me audio mix by Rob buers and Johnny Vince Evans special thanks to Adam pitluck who wrote a book
00:28:04
about Jimmy called Damn to Eternity we'll have a link on our website our intern is mati urino Julian Alexander
00:28:12
makes original illustrations for each episode of Criminal you can see them at thisis criminal.com or on Facebook and
00:28:19
Twitter at criminal show Criminal is recorded in the studios of North Carolina public radio
00:28:25
wnc we're a proud member of radio otopia from PRX a collection of the best podcasts around shows like the westwing
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a lot more than that they also delve into political issues and Source material that inspired the show in a
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recent episode they interviewed Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau hey guys hi I was a little bit daunted when my
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Skype told me that right honorable Justin Trudeau was joining the conversation can we establish your
00:29:01
fanhood bonafides did you watch the westwing when it was originally on when I watched this uh episode that was the
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first time I'd ever watched an episode of westwing outside of the regular time slot with the exception of the Richie
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debate one I actually watched it a few years ago to try and uh bone up for my own debates but that yeah i' never
00:29:25
actually seen West Wing other than when it was scheduled to appear and I saw pretty much all episodes go listen
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platform to radiotopia I'm phebe judge this is Criminal [Music] radio topia from PRX