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This episode contains language that may not be suitable for everyone. Well, let's just jump right in and let's
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just start with you introducing yourself. >> Oh god. [laughter] >> And it's not a trick question. It's like
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a very simple just what's your name? >> That's you just started off with the hardest question.
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>> This is Gavin Bane, but for years he went by another name. It all started in 1998 on his first day of college in
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Dundy, Scotland, when he met another student named Billy Boyd. >> I was uh running late. I was
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skateboarding in and I saw this guy standing outside the campus just nonchalantly. I mean, I'm rushing. This
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probably sums up both of our personalities. [music] I'm rushing. I'm thinking, "God, you've messed us up
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already." you know, and he's just standing there. He's got like a bag of jeans on, hair cornolled,
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a Hansen t-shirt. [music] I don't know why he's wearing [laughter] that, but he's listening. He's just got his
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headphones on and I kind of I I kind of skid past him and stop. And I'm like, "Hey, have I [snorts] got the time
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wrong? Why aren't you inside?" And he's got Nirvana. I can hear that that's blasting. He's got it so loud. And he
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looks at me and he's like, "What do you want?" He's so [laughter] offended that I've interrupted Nirvana and then I kind
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of rush off in and I'm like, "Oh man, first person I meet looks really cool." And I just like made an enemy out of the
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first person. But then I get lost. I go into the wrong class. >> After a while, he managed to find the
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right classroom. He was 45 minutes late, and the only seat left was next to the guy he'd met out front. And when we were
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in close range, he was looking at my bag and I was looking at his bag and I had Rage Against the Machine, Cypress Hill,
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Wuang Clan badges on my backpack. And he had the same, but he had corn and he had
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uh some other like metal bands mixed in with um Tribe Called Quest. So it was like together we covered the entire
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gamut of the coolest bands in the world at the time. And he had Limp Biscuit. So
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uh so yeah, we just kind of cracked it off. We started to talk in quotes from uh kind of rap films
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from the early '90s. Yeah, we were just it was just straight in with a flow. And
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by lunchtime, we were freestyling uh quietly at first and then by the end of lunchtime we had performed our first gig
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in a way. Everyone was kind of gathered around us and we were we were rappers. And uh on the way home um I turned to
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him and said, "Hey, do you want to be a rap group?" And he was like, "Is a [ __ ] Lily?" [laughter] And that was
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it. We were a rap group. >> They practiced all the time competing with each other to make up the smartest
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and funniest lyrics they could on the spot. So, we created a game called Porcupine and uh that was a way for us
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to battle rap each other, but then also like throw each other words and then we just start freestyling off the word.
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>> And why did you call it porcupine? >> Because some people think that's a hard
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word to rhyme with, but when someone throws a hard word like porcupine, [music] it can make the game funner. But also,
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we would use it as like that would be the last [music] word to try uh beat the other person with. You couldn't win the
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game unless you ended [music] with something to do with a porcupine. >> They started performing gigs in bars
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near their college in Dundee and their friend Oscar [music] joined the group. Gavin says their main influence was
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quote the best white rapper we could think of, Eminem. Eminem released his major label debut
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album, The Slim Shady LP, in 1999, not long after Gavin and Billy had met. One reviewer wrote that his lyrics are
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so clever that he makes murder sound funny. One night, Gavin, Billy, and Oscar [music] stayed out very late and ended
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up going back to Gavin's room. Oscar got on the computer. I mean, the internet was kind of early days. So, he just
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randomly found this thing that was on a website called undergroundhip hiphop.com
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and it was just this kind of flyer, this poster for Are You the Next Eminem? And
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uh as soon as we saw it, we thought, "Yeah, of course we are." [snorts] A record label was holding open
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auditions in London. Gavin, Billy, and Oscar took a 13-hour bus ride there, playing Porcupine most of the way. But
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when they finally got to the audition, the line to get in went around the block twice.
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>> It was quite apparent there's just no way we're going to get in cuz there's far too many people here. And um so what
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we decided to do was to go and uh um ask if we could battle people for their spot. So we and knowing like hip-hop
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people once you get challenged to battle, you can't say no. um if you say no, you essentially step aside and let
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us just take your spot. So at first most people would say yes and then we started
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battling and eventually after you beat like 10, 15, 20 people the the seas part, you know, and by the time we got
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to the front there was a there was so many people behind us kind of rooting for us like oh my god these guys
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actually are like Eminem. So the feeling outside is that these three Scottish kids are just going to walk this. And so
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our confidence is so high. Well, as soon as we get in and we're going past these
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dance studios and it starts to become very commercialized [snorts] and we start to feel like, you know, so
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we were kind of shrinking as we got closer and closer and closer. When they got to the audition room, they handed
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the sound guy their CD. Gavin remembers there were X's on the floor for them to stand on in front of a table with three
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English talent scouts from the record label ANRS sitting behind it. >> And then we said to press play and the
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guy presses play, but he hasn't turned the the volume up. So by the time the beat comes in, it's already like halfway
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into the song. [laughter] So we're like, "No, no, no. Please put it back to the start." And now we're just like shaking
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because it's all going wrong. [snorts] Um, so then we start to rap. What can I'm the impact of a fat drum? I'm
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smacking my spot. The rappers acting handsome. I'm the m starting with like asking for a smack and after
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>> and as soon as we start to rap, you know, you're hyper aware the situation. You're so focused on everything. You're
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looking around the room. And when you're a rapper, you're constantly making eye contact with people cuz you feed off
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their, you know, their response. And the three of these these ANRs were just like
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kind of looking at each other at the side of their eyes and kind of trying to stop themselves from laughing.
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>> And then about like 30 seconds in 30 40 seconds into my rap verse, they just kind of put their hand up to the sound
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guy and said, "Cool. That's enough." And then they just were kind of like laughing and one of them said, "Is this
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a joke? You know, did Dave put you up to this?" And uh we said, "No, this this is
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serious." They they said, "This is this is a this is a cool comedy act, but not quite what we're looking for." You know,
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Scotland is Grounds Keeper Willie. It's Braveheart. It's Shan Connory. You know,
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it's it's drunk ginger people in skirts. Scotland is not rap. We can't sell that.
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>> Gavin says they all went straight to a pub after that. And while they were there, they decided
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to go and try to see someone else before they left London. >> I just thought they don't get it. But so
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then let's go let's go somewhere to someone who gets it. And there was a guy called Dave Loe who ran Word Play and
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the biggest hip-hop magazine in Europe, Hip-Hop Connection. So I thought, let's go and see Dave Loe and we'll ask him,
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you know. So we go there. Um it's kind of like this uh security. you got to get past a security gate. So, we wait for
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ages. Eventually, a guy bringing records comes up the road. He goes in, we sneak
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in. Um, we get to their office. Billy's trying to flirt with the the lady on reception to buy his time to get in
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until he walks past. And eventually, he walks past and we're like, Dave, you know, and we kind of like just don't
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want to leave. We're like, look, [music] it it's taken a lot to get here. We're not leaving until you give us like 5
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minutes. So eventually [snorts] we go into his office and um we're like, "Here's our songs. Like, let us know
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what you think." And he's like, "All right." You know, so he starts playing the CD and he plays the first beat and
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he's like, "Oh god." Yeah. And you can see he really loves the beat. And then as soon as one of us starts rapping,
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he's like, "Nah." Skips to the next one. And then the same thing. He's like loves
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the beat and then skips to the next one as soon as vocals come in. And um the third one, he loves the beat again as
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soon as we start rapping. pulls the CD out and uh he said, "Don't make me say it." And I said, "No, say it." And he's
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like, "You [ __ ] sound like the rapping proclaimers." And the Proclaimers are are are great.
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They're amazing Scottish group. Um they sing that classic song, I will walk 500 miles. and uh they're Scottish heritage,
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but he's meaning it in a like they're a bit of a joke, you know, like no rapper would ever listen to that, you know?
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>> Gavin says that he and Billy didn't say a word to each other for the whole 13-hour bus ride back home.
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>> I kind of was really just trying not to cry and a part of me was like, they are
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right, though. You know, I I saw that if your job is in marketing at the time and
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hip-hop was all about uh your credibility, what you've gone through, you know, like what street you come
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from, you know, like the branding of rap in America was so powerful and Britain didn't quite have that yet and Scotland
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definitely didn't have that, you know, so I so they were right, they can't sell it. So, I understood that, but then that
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left me with the predicament of, "Well, then we can never do this." >> When Gavin got back home, he started
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spending more and more time alone. And he wasn't sleeping well. And then one night, he was watching TV and a movie
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came on. >> A film that I'd seen loads from the 80s called The Secret of My Success. And
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there's a scene where Michael J. Fox's character. Um, he's trying to get this job that he's a little small town boy
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and he's trying to make it in the New York City and he's just getting turned down everywhere, you know? It's cuz he
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doesn't fit. They can't he doesn't fit in their world. And um [clears throat] he he goes into this one office to get
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changed cuz he's not wearing the right thing and he's trying to like go to this uh meeting that he's got. And in this
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office the phone rings and he picks it up and the person says, "Is that you know so and so?" and he goes, "Yeah."
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And he and he starts to just pretend he [music] is. And he gets so empowered that that he can be that person. And I
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think like, "Well, why don't we just become [music] someone else?" If being Scottish was the problem, then
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they'd become Americans. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. [music] >> [music] >> We'll be right back. To listen without
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ads, join Criminal Plus. Gavin Bane started recording himself rapping his lyrics with an American
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accent just to see what it sounded like. So the first few times sober that I tried to record myself in the American
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accent, it didn't sound good. It sounded fake. Like the way the tongue moves isn't the same as when you switch to
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another accent. So I was struggling with that and then I was thinking too much when I was sober. So then I took certain
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uppers with certain downers like to get knock myself off center so I could stop being hyperritical about myself and
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allow myself to flow. And it sounded so good. It sounded real. It sounded like this kid is from California and he
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sounds like Eminem. I liked the song so much that I took it to a party. My friend Brian was throwing
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this big party and he used to throw like really cool parties where he'd have like
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DJs and everyone he was into hip-hop in the area would be there. And so I go into the party and uh I gave our DJ at
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the time, Skinny, I gave him the CD and I was like, "I'll play this." This is a new American rapper I just heard play
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this, you know, and he played it right after an Eminem song. And everyone was dancing and loving the Eminem track and
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then he played that song and nobody like no one batted an eyeadins. [music] [music]
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>> They were like, "Is this the new Eminem track or something?" Like they just thought it was Eminem or they thought it
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was an American rapper. And so I'm watching the room and then I look at Billy and he looks over to me cuz he
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knows they're my lyrics and he's just like mind blown. He's like, "Oh my god, it sounds real." And then Gavin told
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Billy about his idea to pretend to be Americans. Gavin says that Billy said no, but he
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did want to see what it sounded like, and he experimented with recording some of their songs in an American accent.
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A few weeks later, their friend Brian, who had thrown the party where Gavin played the song, died in an accident.
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Gavin and Billy drove to the funeral together. On the way there, they listened to the
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radio and then one of their songs came on with them rapping in American accents.
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Gavin says they each thought they were playing a trick on each other. But when they got to the funeral, Brian's brother
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told them that before Brian died, he'd entered the song into a national radio competition as a surprise and that it
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had won. We'd beaten every single rock band, every single folk act, every pop act. We won it. And the song was getting
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airplay. And uh Billy finally kind of turned around and said, "Okay, let's do this for Brian." And so we were on our
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way. [music] >> Someone from Sony had heard the song on the radio and had gotten in touch to see
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if they could meet with Gavin and Billy in person in London in 2 weeks. >> So we had 2 weeks to perfect the accent.
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And so we made this agreement that we would speak to each other all the time in American accent. Everything we did,
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we did an American accent. We'd have sex in American [music] accents. Um, >> wait, what? [laughter]
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>> Which our our girlfriends thought was really [ __ ] annoying. Um, >> uh, and >> that does [laughter] seem really bad.
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I'm surprised they stayed with you. >> I'm surprised as well. But, uh, >> but but you only you [music] like did
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you know anything about Americans besides the movies? I mean, did what did you think Americans?
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>> We were Yeah. No, we were like we just [music] grown up watching American movies. Um, we loved American standup
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comedy. Um, and we just took a whole bunch of different characters and we mashed them
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together. >> Gavin says they wanted to study interviews with American rap stars and
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skaters, but all they could really get their hands on in time was a DVD of Friends [music] and a few American
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movies. Gavin started watching Back to the Future over and over again until he could say Michael J. Fox's lines along
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with him. He also watched a lot of Goodwill Hunting and studied Matt Damon's character.
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Billy studied Matthew Perry's character [music] in Friends, Chandler. They watched as many episodes as they could.
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Gavin says they paused it whenever Chandler said something funny and then tried to repeat it.
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>> [music] >> They came up with new names for their American personas. Gavin Bane became
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Brains McCloud and Billy [music] Boyd became Syllable. They called their group Syllable and Brains.
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They decided they would be from California. [music] They picked a city called Hemet where
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Billy actually had family. [music] Billy bleached his hair. Gavin tried out a trucker hat. They both started wearing
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more colorful clothes. And at the end of the two weeks, they got back on the 13-hour bus ride to
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London. The first place they went was Sony Records to meet [music] with Douggee Bruce, the scout who had heard their
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song on the radio. And uh as soon as he sits down, he's like, "All right, all right, boys." You know, and he's got
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this broad Glaswegian accent. the first [music] person, the first ANR that interviews us is Scottish. We're
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screwed at that point because when someone's Scottish is speaking to someone Scottish, you start to to kind
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of like you join, you know, and so we we were talking and and we were both finding it very difficult not to say
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Scottish words. And then eventually he said something. He said I and Bill went straight back with I can, which is I
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know in in Scotland. And two Americans would never know to say I can. It's in the way that Bill said it. And soon as
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we said that, he looked straight at Billy and then he looked at me and it was like he knows, you know. So we felt
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like uh everything that we were saying he was like where are you boys actually from? And the way he said actually was
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like he knows. This is this is you know we're done here basically. And uh when we left that outside of the Sony
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building, I grabbed Bill and I said, "This isn't going to work if we're halfassed. Like, we need to be in all in
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like 24/7. We need to become the characters [clears throat] if this is going to work. Let's just be the the
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craziest version of who we want to be. Turn it all up to 11 and let's just go, you And so as soon as we went to do a
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show that night, we kick in the door, you know, we start stomping around like we own the place. We did this crazy
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stage show, chasing each other around. We're vomiting on the front row. Um, and then when we came off stage, this guy
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came up to us and he was like, "Uh, where are you guys from?" Now, earlier in the morning when
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Doggy [snorts] Britt asked us, "Where are you guys from?" We both answered at the same time because we hadn't even got
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our story in line. We were just so excited that we didn't even, you know, run through what our story is. So, in
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the morning, I said Huntington and Billy said Hammet. At night, um, with, uh, Chris Rock at Island Records, Billy says
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Huntington and I say [laughter] Hammet at the same time. And this guy is just looking at us like, cool. And he didn't
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he didn't care. And he's like, great, here's my here's my card. He slid his card to us and he's like, come and see
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me on Monday morning. When you say you were like banging and stomping, is that something you thought
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like Americans did? Like they just kind of take the room? >> Yeah. Like [laughter] Yeah. If you watch
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if you grown up watching rap music videos, we just basically became like our our favorite rappers in those
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videos, you know. But then in person with people, we would switch to characters from like friends, you know.
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And so we'd play, Bill would play a version of Joey and I would play a version of uh Ross or Chandler because
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those are likable characters, you know, so we knew that when we're around people, don't be banging around. And
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also that's those characters are actually closer to our personalities. >> I mean, it's it really feels like two
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opposite ends of the spectrum to be Eminem on stage and Chandler off the stage. I don't really [laughter] know how those
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two meld. >> You know, every artist I've ever met um has been one person on stage and
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offstage a completely different person. I had seen loads of interviews uh with members of Slipnot and members of Korn
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and all these um kind of dangerous kind of rock bands, but actually they were like real sweethearts when the masks
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were off, you know? Gavin says that on Monday morning after going over their story again, he and
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Billy went to Island Records to meet with Chris, the scout who'd given them his card at their show. Now that we're
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American, he was selling himself to us. So, it's a big change, you know, and so he was like, "Tell me everything about
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you [laughter] guys." And that's a different question from where you from or what do you do or you know cuz
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[music] that you kind of feel like you're being examined. So Bill and I just started
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telling this story like look we're from this this uh kind of uh cookie cutter neighborhood in Hemet and then you know
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we we met each other at the San Diego um Vans tour because we had known a lot about that tour specifically because of
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bands that that played. We were really interested that we had [music] the DVD about it. So, we actually knew some
00:22:02
things that happened and we knew that there was a battle rap competition that happened in the parking lot in that. So,
00:22:07
then we kind of incorporated that and I said that yeah, we we met at that [music] at San Diego World Tour and then
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we moved to Huntington Beach, slept on the beach under the pier, [laughter] you know, like this is just like
00:22:19
versions of Chili Pepper songs now coming out, you know. And then uh we got um got this job in this uh skate store
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and [music] and then you know we became a rap grip, came over here, ran out of money and now you're gonna give us a
00:22:31
record deal and let the fun continue. And the way it just flowed off the tongue, us cutting each other off. It
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was like we were rapping. >> Gavin says Chris seemed to believe the story completely. Gavin remembers that
00:22:42
he even told them it [music] was beautiful. And he was like, "You've got to do that thing that you did the other
00:22:48
night." You know, cuz [music] basically we had this thing that if anyone heckled us from our audience, we
00:22:54
would just like pick that person out and then we would, [music] you know, just tear into that person with freestyles.
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So he called all the ANRS into the the main kind of open area. And he was like, "All right, do that thing now.
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Go." And he was basically telling us to go around the room just ripping into everyone. And I was like, "Oh
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[clears throat] my god." You know, so like this is it. And so we just started doing it, you know, look at this guy in
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the fake Adidas. Look at his beard. Who does he think he is? Jesus. You know, and just move on to the next person. And
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eventually we get to to Chris. Everyone's like falling around laughing. We get to Chris and we start making fat
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jokes. And Chris is quite fat. And Chris was not laughing at this point. [laughter]
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He started to look furious that the joke had now been turned on him. But as all of his staff were in tears laughing and
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then he they they realized he wasn't laughing and they all stopped and then he just burst out laughing and we knew
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that we've got it. Then we just felt like God we this is easy. >> But Gavin says they couldn't just sign
00:23:58
with the record company. First they needed a lawyer and a manager. Chris got them a meeting with one of the biggest
00:24:05
music managers in London, a man named Jonathan Shaled. This guy is the Simon Cow, like the the
00:24:13
nicer version of Simon Co, you know? So, he just gets straight to the point and he's like, "What do you want?" And uh at
00:24:20
this point, we had no money. We had no money left. So, as soon as he said, "What do you need?" [snorts] I don't
00:24:26
know why I said it. Maybe it was like a line in another movie, but I said, "We don't get out of bed in an American
00:24:33
accent. We don't get out of bed for anything less than 70k." And Bailey looked at me like, "What the
00:24:40
holy crap," you know, >> but Jonathan Charlotte said, "Okay." >> And all of a sudden, we had 70,000.
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[music] For a couple of days after that, we kept going to the bank machine to see if the
00:24:55
money was in. And [music] every day that it wasn't in, we felt like, "Ah, okay. This this isn't really real." And then
00:25:03
[music] the day that the money was in, we both never seen that amount of money in our bank [music] accounts. And I
00:25:08
think that changed something a little bit because my head started to be like, hm,
00:25:16
what if is this a crime? And and then Billy was like, [music] what if how is this our money? You know,
00:25:26
that didn't stop us from immediately going out and getting bloo drunk and having [music] the best week of our
00:25:34
lives getting hammered every single night. Jonathan Shallot's office [music] helped
00:25:40
get them set up in a big apartment and arranged for them to play at showcases around London, trying to see what kinds
00:25:47
of offers came in. And it [music] worked. After about 3 months, they made a deal with Sony. They went into the
00:25:54
office to sign [music] the contract. Gavin remembers it was in a big boardroom with staff there to help them
00:26:02
celebrate. [music] There was champagne and people kept coming up to them to ask them about the stories [music] they'd
00:26:09
heard about them. A big part of the story was [music] that we became very close friends with D12 and Eminem, which
00:26:19
is quite a stretch, but uh when you're like kind of improvising and acting, the whole point
00:26:25
is the same as freestyle is to make little links and [music] then let them grow and let them grow. So on that day,
00:26:33
we're in Sony and [music] this girl comes up um and she's like, "No way. you guys are
00:26:40
from Huntington Beach. And I'm like, "Yeah, yeah." She's like, "That's where I'm from." [music]
00:26:44
I'm like, "Oh, no." And she's like, "I heard you worked in a a skate store. What? Which one?" I'm like, "Oh no."
00:26:54
And I say, "Slam City Skates." And she's like, "No way. I work at Slam I work there as well." And I'm like, "Oh my
00:27:00
god, no." And I'm just dying inside. So I'm smiling. I'm like, "No way." Yeah, that's cool. But like I'm dying now cuz
00:27:07
and I'm starting to sweat and I'm looking around for Bill like I I need help here.
00:27:12
>> By this time Gavin and Billy had developed a system for whenever anybody started asking questions about their
00:27:18
lives in America. They called it lead and recover. >> So the lead recover system is that one
00:27:25
listens and one answers. And so if I'm answering and Bill's listening and I start to stutter or make a mistake, Bill
00:27:34
jumps in and either takes the person who's asking questions and takes them on a different direction or if it's getting
00:27:41
real bad can just, you know, throw a hand grenade in or do something to kind of distract so that they forget what
00:27:47
they were they were asking. So but but then on this day people are pulling Bill this way and we're not together. So
00:27:54
we're we're not an earshot of each other. So I'm now done. And I can feel the breathing, my breathing starting to
00:28:01
you kind of like you you're about to tell that I'm worried here, you know, uh, and I'm holding on for dear life.
00:28:08
And then Bill turns and looks and sees my face and he knows. And so Bill knocks a Mariah Carey poster, a frame like with
00:28:18
a you know a record in it um off the wall and it cracks and then everyone turns and I sneak out of the room and go
00:28:28
to the toilet. Went to the down at the toilet, vomited, kind of washed my face. But by the time I went back in,
00:28:36
Belle had kind of just [laughter] got everyone going again. And you know, she kind of forgot that lane of
00:28:43
questioning. >> Gavin says they signed the contract as syllable and brains for £50,000 upfront
00:28:51
and £300,000 more when they released more material and their album. Did you have a plan? Did you say, "Okay,
00:28:59
we'll go for this long or we'll make this much money and then we'll we'll tell people who we really are." I
00:29:06
remember in Dundee in Scotland saying, "Look, this is what we do. We go down, we get a record deal, you know, we blow
00:29:15
up overnight, get a number one record." Obviously, as soon as I hear someone singing my words back to me, I'm good. I
00:29:24
can walk from it. And then we go on Jonathan Ross's uh TV show, cuz Jonathan Ross is like the king of late night TV
00:29:30
here. And so we'll go on Jonathan Ross's show and then we'll just go, you know what, Jonathan, we're not American.
00:29:37
We've never been to America. We're Scottish. And then we'd make a point to be like, we always had talent. Why did
00:29:44
we need to do this? >> Not long after they signed the contract, Gavin and Billy got an appearance on the
00:29:52
UK version of one of MTV's most popular shows, Total Request Live. Put your hands together for syllable and
00:30:02
brains. >> What's up? What's up? What's up? >> Shut up. >> Thanks for coming on, guys.
00:30:08
>> You guys are great. >> Shut up. [cheering] >> Okay. Okay, >> boys. You are spanking new music.
00:30:13
>> Spanking. >> How would you describe your sound? >> Spanking. >> Spankingly new. [laughter]
00:30:18
>> Spankingly new for comedy, humor. New >> Excellent. >> Well, you did a performance for us to
00:30:25
try and drag this back from the edge of despair. Uh, your mom's is what it was called. What was it called? My mom's.
00:30:30
>> Just your mom's in general. Your mom's mom's in general. >> Don't bring my mom into it. Not on my
00:30:34
own show. [laughter] >> Let's take a look at it. It's very entertaining. >> Check it out.
00:30:39
>> That's your mom. [music] I was in luck WHEN SHE DIDN'T KNOW. And she's my fantasy. That's your mom.
00:30:46
[music] >> And then on live TV, the host asked them another question. >> So, were you guys from planet Zordon?
00:30:56
Really? We were adopted by aliens when we were kids and uh we travel around the solar system ever since then.
00:31:03
>> Gavin says that when he got home that night, he googled syllable and brains to
00:31:08
see what people were saying about them. >> And there was this website and these forums that were like, "What's Gavin
00:31:13
Bill doing?" All these people who knew us in our life were online going, "Wait, I know like what's [music] going on."
00:31:20
>> One comment read, "I had a fight with Gavin Bane [music] in a chip shop once.
00:31:25
wasn't in America, though. This was Dundee. Your man's a Scott. [music] Gavin says he and Billy got called into
00:31:34
Sony's offices the next day, [music] but when they got there, nobody said anything about them being from Scotland.
00:31:43
Instead, Gavin says they got the news that MTV wanted them to come back soon and that there was even some interest in
00:31:51
them hosting their own show. They started working on show ideas and going to meetings with TV producers.
00:31:59
Gavin says Sony decided to wait [music] to release Syllable and Brains first single until something happened with the
00:32:05
TV show. And in the meantime, Syllable and Brains was touring as much as they could. There was a lot of drinking every
00:32:14
single night, waking up the next morning, having two hours of not drinking, and then back on it. And uh
00:32:20
Bill and I at this point were starting to do back flips off uh drum risers. We kept trying to up our stage show and it
00:32:27
was [music] kind of getting dangerous. >> By the end of the tour, they were exhausted. Gavin says he went to bed as
00:32:34
soon as they got home at 6:00 a.m. >> And we've got like, you know, I I think I sleep for 1 hour and then my phone
00:32:41
goes at 7:00 a.m. and it's one of the managers at um Jonathan Charlott's office and he goes, "I've got good news
00:32:48
and bad news for you. The bad news is you're not coming off tour. The good news is you're going on
00:32:56
tour with your best friends." [laughter] And I'm thinking, who who who's our best
00:33:01
friends? And he's and I'm like, who? And he's like, Eminem and D12. [laughter] And so I'm like I'm just like, oh my
00:33:10
god, no. Like, how are we going to pull this off? [music] We'll be right [music] back.
00:33:33
A couple of hours after Gavin Bane and Billy Boyd heard they'd be going on tour with Eminem and his group D12, a tour
00:33:41
bus picked them up to take them to the first venue. They were excited, but Gavin says they also spent the whole
00:33:48
ride trying to figure out what to do. You know, anyone sees us for 5 minutes around them, they're going to see
00:33:56
unfamiliarity. Like, this will be over. As soon as we walk out in front of them, this will be
00:34:02
over. So, it was just like a let's just see how it goes. Maybe we can hide. Maybe we can stay away from them. And
00:34:09
so, then we hold on to that. We think, "All right, we'll just hide from them. We will not be in the same place they're
00:34:15
in." We come out of our tour bus. We walk right in. There's D12 on stage soundchecking
00:34:22
and [snorts] we're like [ __ ] And then we turn to go but all of the loadin's happening so we can't get past the
00:34:27
loaden. The other side all of our management team is there. Next to them is a camera
00:34:34
crew who are there for MTV filming D12 and Eminem over on this promotional tour. So there's nowhere to go. So, like
00:34:44
the clock was just ticking in my head like tech ticking their um soundchecking purple pills and we know when the song
00:34:52
ends and it's just a countdown to like them walking past us. And so where me and Bill are like looking at each other,
00:35:00
not saying a word, but we're having a crazy conversation with our eyes. And as soon as our song finishes, I look at
00:35:07
Bill and we kind of like, "Yeah, [ __ ] it. Let's go." And then we just stomp on
00:35:10
the stage like like we own the place. were like, "What up?" You know, like start high-fiving them. I high-five um
00:35:17
Bizarre and I'm like holding him. I'm like kind of wrap my hands into his kind of belly and back [laughter]
00:35:24
so that he can't pull away from me. So, it looks like he's hugging me tightly and I'm like,
00:35:30
you know, and um I think from a distance it probably just looked like this was a
00:35:35
warm embrace from friends, but up close we could see their faces were like they were going through, who are these guys
00:35:41
again? >> But Gavin says they just went with it. They high-fived again and agreed to meet
00:35:47
up after the show. Gavin and Billy had never performed on such a large stage in front of such a
00:35:55
huge audience, almost 5,000 people. Gavin says he'd never sweated so much as he did when they went on stage that
00:36:03
night, and that once they got going, he never wanted it to end. [clears throat] They ended the set with a song they
00:36:11
hoped would become their hit single called Losers. >> Always in the wrong place [music] at the
00:36:16
wrong time. When God handed our brains, I send the wrong shallow like Psal. Trouble follows me like it's my shadow.
00:36:24
People see me and they [music] say I'm a weirdo cuz I be sticking dynamite in my
00:36:28
ear. >> The crowd went wild for them. It was everything they had dreamed of. >> And then after the show, Gavin and
00:36:37
Billy's lawyer pulled them aside. >> And he was like, "You're Gavin and you're Billy and I know it all." Gavin
00:36:44
and Billy's lawyer had been asking them for their American passports for months and months. They always told him they
00:36:52
couldn't find them and that they'd get them to him later. And then he saw the post on the hip hop
00:36:58
forum after their appearance on MTV saying that they were actually Gavin and Billy from Scotland, not Syllable and
00:37:06
Brains from California. >> And so he was really angry and he was like, "You need to come with me. we need
00:37:13
to speak to the label. I'm gonna pull you off the tour. We'll go to the label. We'll talk it through. And we're just
00:37:19
like, get lost. You're like, what are you smoking? You know, like we're just making out that he's completely crazy.
00:37:26
But then he says this thing to us where he's like I think he he got Bill on this
00:37:30
one. He was like, look, you didn't need to do this. You're so good. Why are you doing this? And I just laughed and uh
00:37:38
Bill walked into the the changing room and Eminem was about to come down the hallway with a whole camera crew from
00:37:44
MTV and Tim, our lawyer, was like, "Okay, so you're best friends with this guy?" "Okay, let me ask him quick." And
00:37:51
he was he was going to stop Eminem and ask him. And I was trying to call his bluff. I was like, "Yeah, yeah, ask
00:37:57
him." And then he got closer and closer and closer and I just like freaked out and I just like ran in the dressing
00:38:03
room, which to Tim said, "You're right." And yeah, um, so that [snorts] was very
00:38:09
that was very close, but Tim didn't go to the label and we didn't get caught. It just went on and on and on.
00:38:16
Billy and Gavin kept touring and playing pack shows and their MySpace page started filling up with messages from
00:38:23
fans. They got an endorsement deal with a soda company. Gavin had developed a stomach ulcer
00:38:31
>> and it just it was getting so big, you know, to the point where within 2 years,
00:38:38
this is 2 years now, we haven't released a record. [music] We've got all this stuff going for us and we haven't
00:38:42
released a record. Um, the amount of money that's been spent on us at this point is over a million.
00:38:50
>> Gavin was barely talking to his family. He says it took him out of character.
00:38:54
His girlfriend in Dundee had broken up with him after a visit during which he'd mostly spoken in an American accent
00:39:02
and he and Billy were drifting apart. Billy was going back to Scotland more often to visit his girlfriend [music]
00:39:10
and then he found out she was pregnant. Gavin says everything changed after that.
00:39:17
Billy had had enough. >> So basically we have [music] this big fight. Um, and it's one of those fights
00:39:25
you can't come back from, I'm afraid. [clears throat] So, essentially, the group was over. We
00:39:32
didn't get caught. And [music] the fact that the group was over was kind of a bit of a blessing because it
00:39:41
there was a um a clause in the contract that if the band breaks up before the record comes out, then you don't have to
00:39:47
pay the money back. And so we essentially got away with not having to pay that money back. I
00:39:53
>> mean, how did you announce it to the fans? >> We we kind of just didn't. We just kind
00:39:58
of went away. We went quiet. >> Billy went back to Scotland and eventually got a job on an oil rig.
00:40:06
Gavin stayed in London and tried to make it work without Billy, but Sony stopped
00:40:12
taking Gavin's calls. He says it was hard to give up his American persona. He worked odd jobs for a while. He
00:40:21
worked for an American skate shoe company. He spoke in an American accent when he applied and they thought he was
00:40:27
American. And then a couple of years after syllable and brain split up, Gavin heard
00:40:34
that one of his closest friends from childhood had cancer and he decided to put on a show
00:40:41
>> and then do it as a comeback show and make that money and then give give Ivan
00:40:46
the money for his treatment. >> But right before Gavin was about to go on stage, he heard that his friend had
00:40:53
died. And so when I walked out on stage, uh, I kind of just looked out and my band were playing the intro of the song
00:41:01
and I was I was missing keys to go into the first lyrics. And, uh, I tried to I tried to go into lyrics. I just couldn't
00:41:08
get anything out. I was just like crying. And so I stopped the music and I turned to the crowd and I said, "Uh, I'm
00:41:15
not Brains. I'm Gavin. Um, and I've never been to America. And so we got through that show. I came
00:41:27
off, but I just went to the dressing room and kind of couldn't really deal with everyone wanting to ask more
00:41:32
questions. So I hid in there until everyone was gone and I snuck out the back. And when I snuck out the back,
00:41:39
there was about 200 kids and I [music] was thought they wanted more answers like what what happened, you know? And I
00:41:46
just kind of started to apologize [music] and then they started to wrap my lyrics back to me.
00:41:52
They cared only about the lyrics. >> Billy and Gavin didn't speak for years, but in 2012, they briefly got back
00:42:03
together to record and finally release a syllable and brains album. They called it Dirty Rotten Scoundrels.
00:42:13
Gavin went on to have his own music career. He's working on an album right now. >> So, yeah, I'm just having a lot of fun.
00:42:21
And you're doing it all now in a Scottish accent. >> Yeah. Or whatever accent hits me.
00:42:27
[laughter] Criminal is created [music] by Lauren Spore and me. Nadia Wilson is our senior
00:42:43
producer. Katie Bishop is our supervising producer. Our producers are Susanna Robertson, Jackie [music]
00:42:49
Sajiko, Lily Clark, Lena Sillison, and Megan Canain. Our show is mixed and engineered by Veronica Simeonetti.
00:42:58
Julian Alexander makes original illustrations [music] for each episode of Criminal. You can see them at
00:43:03
thisiscriminal.com. And you can sign up for our newsletter at thisiscriminal.com/newsletter.
00:43:11
Gavin Bane has written a book about syllable [music] and brains. It's called California Schkeeman. A movie about
00:43:18
their story with the same title is coming out this year. We hope you'll join our membership
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00:44:06
I'm Phoebe Judge. This is criminal.