00:00:00
[Music] hi how it's um like a quarter to 10 and um Philip and I were wondering if you
00:00:14
were still at work give me a call let me know what time you're going to be home talk to you later bye love
00:00:20
[Music] you we were in Arizona when I got a phone call on a Friday morning March 20
00:00:30
second 1996 to tell me that Howard was a victim of a homicide I was in complete disbelief no
00:00:43
I can't be you know I mean murdered it was very violent he was slaughtered he was stabbed over 40 times
00:00:54
it had to be somebody who he knew that that hated him so much who could have done this to Howard who
00:01:04
would want to kill my son how can I tell you about Howard with me the son Rose and set with
00:01:17
Howard he couldn't do anything [Music] wrong Howard was full of energy he was goodlooking he loved to dress and go go
00:01:30
out he was married to Roslin and they had a child Phillip who was the love of his life Howard worked for you right oh
00:01:38
sure we had an off Supply in stationary business he made me look like a minor leager as far as being a uh
00:01:47
entrepreneur he's going to start this little coffee thing in our store Starbucks before Starbucks was right
00:01:55
Starbucks that's right I says people in New York are not going to be walking around the streets with coffee cup shows
00:02:01
you how smart I was but he was a little bit smarter here's how is right [Music] here we miss you so very very
00:02:16
much oh please they never found the weapon and they never had a witness I called the police practically every day
00:02:26
I wouldn't give up [Music] years went by Dear Son it is 5 years 10 years 15 years 17 years 20 years since
00:02:41
your horrific murder he's 90 I was worried Frank would not see the end of this today is 22
00:02:49
years how can we let them get away with murder [Music] [Music] it was fridy March
00:03:47
22nd I was in the greatest mood blue sky bright Sunshine it was the first day you
00:03:52
feel like spring has coming I was feeling [Music] great but Ron Tucker's mood and his day
00:04:00
and his life were about to change because on that beautiful morning in 1996 when the king office supply
00:04:09
salesman arrived at work he learned his boss Howard pilmar had been murdered in the office within 30 seconds of coming
00:04:18
here they brought the body out right here I couldn't racking my brain what happened Howard pilmar's body was found
00:04:26
in a large pool of blood in the fourth floor offices was Bloody because after he's on the floor for a few hours he's
00:04:34
draining out Roger Pino was in charge of the Midtown South detectives pilmar was
00:04:41
stabbed repeatedly in the chest back and neck there was no sign of forced entry nothing was taken from the office or
00:04:50
from his wallet we got to get down to business we don't know what we have here Howard had just turned 40 he was
00:04:58
married the father of a young son he had recently taken over his family's successful office supply store so his
00:05:06
father Frank and stepmother Carol could spend more time in Arizona and that's where they got the news how was
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dead couldn't believe it Howard was a swaggering risk taker he was a Visionary he envisioned that
00:05:28
people would go crazy for coffee and be willing to spend big for it so he opened
00:05:33
the first of its kind high-end coffee bar inside a store I'm telling you there were a line of people out the door right
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here a lot of people he named it Phillips after his young son it was so successful he opened a second shop
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around the corner from Carnegie Hall his wife Roslin gave up her career as a dental hygienist to run the coffee
00:05:58
business and on that March morning after the murder rosin joined the employees gathered inside King office supply
00:06:07
putting on a brave face she was totally calm composed collected no tears no anger no nothing I thought to myself
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what a trooper she assured everyone the business would endure don't worry we're going to carry on we're going to keep
00:06:27
the business it's almost like it wasn't real her husband was dead her best friend roslin's sister
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Janna says Howard and Roslin were high school sweethearts they had a great love they married in
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1982 it was a beautiful wedding Howard's sister Ronda was there it was a big beautiful wedding so is his stepsister
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Heather Frank adopted Heather when he married her mother Carol Ros was like a sister to me she was probably one of my
00:07:05
closest friends rosn and Howard were living the life an apartment on New York's Swanky
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Upper East Side a home in the country and in 1986 their son philli was born it was
00:07:22
the perfect family as passionate how it was about business that's how he was about his son
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but now Howard's life was over it's as if someone punches you in the stomach as hard as they could and knocks the wind
00:07:43
out of you I couldn't take a deep breath I have my life before Howard was killed and my life after Howard was
00:07:52
killed they didn't really understand the ramifications of it how it would change
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my father how it would change the dynamic of my family the police now needed to learn
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all about Howard's family and his friends and his business who's the last one to see him who's the last one to
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talk to him who's related to him who's work with him who should have been here who was here who first sees him who's
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coming next who are the last people to see Howard pilmore was his uh wife and his brother-in-law Pino went to the
00:08:26
pilmar's apartment to talk to Roslin she seemed Cooperative helpful what did you
00:08:32
talk to her about just uh normal things how was her marriage she's that they were happily
00:08:41
married according to rosin on the night of the murder she and her brother Evan Wald who worked at Philip's coffee met
00:08:49
Howard at his office Roslin told police that she and Evan left Howard who planned to keep working and watch a
00:08:57
basketball game but later that night when Howard didn't come home Roslin left this voicemail on his office phone hi
00:09:07
how it's um like a quarter to 10 Philip and I were wondering if you were still at work working or if you went off to
00:09:13
some sports bar like you said you wanted to to go watch the ncaa's I'm sure you'll call me from wherever you are and
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um talk to you later bye love you Howard never called back but Roslin made a lot of calls asking about him
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including in the early morning hours to several hospitals police had a lot to sift through and interviewing all those
00:09:40
people and talking to all those people you just take the facts where they where they Lead You Pino's detectives heard
00:09:46
stories about disgruntled employees could one of them be the killer there were rumors that Howard was a womanizer
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could it be a jealous husband lots of people have motives you got to have more than just a motive there's got to be a
00:10:01
reason and then you have to have access and whoever did it would also have to have a lot of anger Howard had been
00:10:09
stabbed 48 times it was in a word Overkill a good percentage of the stab wounds on the back were all postmortem
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after he was dead yeah after he was dead this is I want to make sure your dead absolutely dead completely and utterly
00:10:26
dead there were some leads that looked promising early on when detectives interviewed rosalyn's brother Evan they
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noticed something he had a injury on his hand he had cuts on his left hand he said he got them when he was working at
00:10:43
Philip's coffee did they look suspicious to you given that this was a stabbing so
00:10:48
the cuts don't look suspicious the individual starts looking suspicious they thought it could be suspicious when
00:10:54
they learned Evan and Howard did not get along and there was more we found out that Eman was asking questions about
00:11:02
what he thought was a camera asking questions about the alarm system and there were also one or two
00:11:09
surprises about Roslin we find out that Rosen Howard marriage is not successful and she was giving us a different
00:11:19
image it was beginning to look like Howard's murder could be a family affair it was mindblowing it was like
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no [Music] [Music] way I'm telling you and on the way to the cemetery I knew that something was
00:11:54
wrong Frank pilmore knew now that Howard was dead that Rob Lin could make out really well I love you and I always love
00:12:05
you she's the one who had get more than a million dollars in life insurance the family's real estate and King office
00:12:13
supply the company that Frank pilmar had built and passed on to his son here I gave up the business she've
00:12:23
got it I just couldn't even look at her and roin appeared to be moving quickly less than 2 weeks after Howard
00:12:33
was killed she went to King office supply and despite what she had said just 10 days earlier she announced she
00:12:42
was selling the company I was shocked at that Ron Tucker says when she should have been grieving over all she'd lost
00:12:53
Rosalyn had been negotiating over how much she'd get for the business it's inconceivable that you would do that
00:13:03
instead of mourn and right then and there I started to question her motives police also had questions about
00:13:13
Roslin and they were starting to see why she might have needed money and fast I think when we find out about the
00:13:24
financial issues she's not quite what we originally thought we were looking at here
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[Music] for 16 years Rosalyn worked for a dentist Dr Stanley winck she was his dental assistant and also his bookkeeper
00:13:42
the police found out she embezzled money from her boss and a lot of it hundreds of thousands of
00:13:50
dollars it was like a family member stealing from you nobody noticed until after she left to manage Philip coffee
00:14:00
that's when the dentist and his accountant Neil kleene discovered Rosalyn had deposited 186 patients checks into her
00:14:11
own bank account and how long had she been doing this about 34 years Klein confronted her in late
00:14:19
1995 just a few months before Howard's murder she just said yes I took the money and she said don't
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tell my husband she said that yes he'll throw me out and I'll never see my son again what
00:14:39
did you make of that that was pretty shocking Klein agreed to keep her secret Roselyn agreed
00:14:46
to repay the money weeks go by and I called her several times and it's happening it's happening it's happening
00:14:54
but of course it didn't happen and Roslin owed even more money she was supposed to pay the taxes for
00:15:01
the coffee shop but she didn't and she owed New York State almost $115,000 the state was threatening to
00:15:10
seize the business if the taxes weren't paid all this started to add up give reason for the murder I mean she was
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desperate for money she was afraid if he found out he would divorce her she didn't want to lose Phillip here's a
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woman who's an embezzler she's a tax cheater she's not fit to be a mother Roslin didn't talk about her
00:15:36
problems but Heather noticed Roslin seemed jittery in the weeks before the murder she seemed really stressed out
00:15:44
and I did ask her you know is everything okay cuz she like lost a lot of weight she was like no I'm fine I'm
00:15:53
fine Heather didn't bring it up again but she did ask Evan about his sister he said to me if Howard hurts her in any
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way and I was like what do you mean if he hurt her I would kill him and I said what he said if he hurts her I will kill
00:16:12
him yeah well I mean at that point did you think that Evan was capable of murder
00:16:20
no but the next night Howard was murdered I immediately thought that Evan did it I
00:16:36
had like a pit in my stomach Heather had a more difficult time believing Rosalyn
00:16:41
was involved I still couldn't believe that this person that I've known most of my life could do something like this
00:16:50
even though there was no physical evidence her father never had a doubt anytime I've met anyone going going back
00:16:59
all these years who've asked me about who did this I said his wife and her brother Rosalyn knew what Frank thought
00:17:07
and decided he Carol and Heather could never speak to her or Phillip again his family was split apart but right from
00:17:17
the start Frank decided he was not going to let his son's Killers get away with it he would spend lots of times coming
00:17:25
to the precinct or calling even calling my supervisors telling him that we need to do a better job so you would call
00:17:31
them what once a week no once a month maybe once a day once a day maybe once every other day did you ever hear from
00:17:39
Roslin she ever call asking what was going on yeah never while Roslin didn't seem interested in the police they
00:17:48
stayed interested in her and her family about a year later detectives put up posters asking the public for help in
00:17:56
solving the case and the the posters kept disappearing we set up a surveillance fan to see what was happening and then
00:18:08
who is it it's Evan Evan tearing down the posters that woman with him that's Jan
00:18:17
Roslin and evans's sister they just kept Plastering them all over the doors of the business I
00:18:27
found it extremely harassing I'm sorry that in an investigation to solve their brother-in-law or husband's murder that
00:18:36
they thought it was harassment to try to get more information you're not really sorry
00:18:42
yeah about a year after the murder Roslin was arrested but only for embezzling from the dentist she plad
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guilty and was given probation after paying back the money she stole where did she get the money to pay
00:19:00
the insurance policy and the sale of the business I believe that tell you anything yeah it's all part of the
00:19:06
motive it's a circumstantial case and it's kind of like a bucket of water right so every drop fills that bucket
00:19:13
and it's not until that bucket's full is it ready to go and in 1999 it looked like new
00:19:20
evidence would start pouring in DNA technology had Advanced and a court ordered Evan Wald to give a sample of
00:19:29
his blood it was a match a match to this small drop of blood found near Howard's
00:19:37
body puts him on the scene puts him in the place it was one crucial piece of physical evidence but it was not enough
00:19:46
for prosecutors and the case went cold did you despair I don't think I ever despaired
00:19:55
no she did I didn't want to get his hopes up and then you know she thought I was nuts but Frank refused to give up I
00:20:05
remember feeling that something good was going to come with this because uh I was
00:20:11
getting too old for it not to happen over the decades Roslin and Evan moved on with their lives their sister
00:20:29
Jan says Roslin returned to being a hygienist she worked like everybody else does she work make a payche you pay your
00:20:37
bills she raised an amazing son Philip went to private school then on to college and law school he eventually
00:20:45
joined a top firm and got married Evan got married and continued his career in the food industry there wasn't a shadow
00:20:54
over your brother and sister they didn't feel like they had to look over their shoulders shoulders why should you look
00:21:00
over your shoulder when you're Innocent but what they didn't know was Manhattan prosecutors Elizabeth letterer
00:21:08
and Melissa Hindman had spent four years reviewing all the evidence and finding new Witnesses and on August 15th
00:21:18
2017 Janna received a panicked early morning call from Evan's wife Evan just got
00:21:27
arrested and nice said for what how it's murder I was like are you kidding me Janna barely hung up when the phone
00:21:40
rang again and this time it was about Roslin my sister was arrested and all I did was break down
00:21:51
and cry Janna is just as certain today as she was when Howard pilmore was murdered that her siblings are innocent
00:22:01
I think people listening to you may say she's a very good sister she's devoted but she can't accept what's staring her
00:22:11
in the face I don't think that's correct I'm sorry even being biased and I love my
00:22:19
family but they're just not capable these are not Killers Frank and Carol not surprisingly reacted to the arrest
00:22:28
somewhat but differently we all hugged the of cried and course I didn't really expect her to be arrested as well Frank
00:22:36
immediately called his daughters in New York I remember my heart I couldn't control myself my heart
00:22:44
was pounding so it was unbelievable you've known for all these years that at some point something's going to happen I
00:22:52
was kind of shaking inside Roslin and Evan were held without bail that was a big day for us but it
00:23:00
was a very bad day for the wals especially when they visited rosin and Evan Behind
00:23:08
Bars I've never felt so broken in my life I went through all the evidence and it wasn't a shred a cintilla of new
00:23:18
evidence against Evan wal Daniel gotlin is Evan's attorney bring me the evidence
00:23:26
you will find there's nothing zero now the defense has to deal with a case that's more than 20 years old rosin's
00:23:34
lawyer is Sam tolin this's witnesses that passed away we don't have opportunity to Canvas the neighborhood
00:23:40
we don't have an opportunity to talk individually and conduct our own investigation they will have to explain
00:23:45
that drop of Evans blood at the crime scene evans's family and his lawyers reminded everyone that Evan worked in
00:23:53
the food business in kitchens where people frequently cut themselves and that he sometimes prepared meals at
00:24:01
Howard's office there's no way of telling when that blood was put there of course there's also the hundreds of
00:24:08
thousands of dollars Roslin embezzled from the dentist roslin's sister Janna says Roslin did a bad thing but for a
00:24:16
good reason their mother was having difficulty paying the mortgage I guess my sister felt that she wanted to help
00:24:24
her so why did Roslin keep it a secret from Howard Janna says that's simple she didn't Howard knew what Roslin had done
00:24:35
my belief is that he wouldn't have known unless he knew moments before he was killed wow that's chilling the Wald
00:24:43
family believed the police focused solely on Evan and Roslin and ignored other possible suspects there were other
00:24:51
people that may have had a motive I found multiple people that didn't like the deceased some of them had made
00:24:58
threats and interviewing all those people there was nothing came out so it's following the evidence and it's
00:25:03
going nowhere but right back to rosin and [Music] Evan on January 17th 2019 almost 23
00:25:25
years after Howard pilmar's murder his wife Roslin and brother-in-law Evan went on trial for killing him there was some
00:25:35
kind of satisfaction seeing them in handcuffs Frank and Carol pilmar came from Arizona and for the first time in
00:25:43
decades they came face to face with their former daughter-in-law and their grandson Phillip I saw him and he looked
00:25:52
exactly like Howard one face you knew that this kid was Howard's kid they they are one face but they never spoke it's
00:26:01
as divided as that aisle in between there was our side and there was their side and it was that simple both sides
00:26:09
sat through graphic evidence about the gruesome killing rosin pilmar and Evan Wald savagely and brutally murdered
00:26:17
Howard pilmore their plan was deliberate and detailed it was meticulously carried
00:26:23
out the evidence was mostly circumstantial but Evans lawyer Dan Scotland was worried there was that drop
00:26:31
of Evans blood at the crime scene it is the only physical evidence that ties him
00:26:37
to the murder clearly it's evans's blood we don't dispute that Scotland says there's no way to know when the
00:26:45
blood drop got there but investigators noticed that injury to evans's hand the day after the murder his left hand
00:26:54
because he is Left-Handed held the knife maybe as Howard bled the knife handle became slippery we won't know for sure
00:27:01
but all we do know is that Evan cut himself and bled at the scene where he killed Howard pilmar the knife was never
00:27:07
found and police waited a week to photograph Evan's hand and if you look at those photographs it's not just one
00:27:15
cut it's a number of cuts but the defense insists Evan cut himself while working the day before the murder he
00:27:23
said I was at an event and at the event a plate dropped and I cleaned it up and I cut my
00:27:31
hand that's why he was wearing a Band-Aid except the prosecution had Heather's testimony that she saw Evan
00:27:39
the night before the murder and he seemed fine did he have any cuts on his hands or anything no he did not he only
00:27:46
had coffee grinds under his fingernails the way I did there were no bandages on his hands but gotlin hopes the jury will
00:27:54
wonder if this drop of evans's blood got there when Howard was murdered why wasn't it mixed with Howard's blood if
00:28:02
he's stabbing him and Howard's bleeding blood should have gotten all over him and evans's blood was not found anywhere
00:28:10
else there was no blood found of him in the bathroom where he supposedly went to
00:28:16
clean up none of his blood found anywhere near the crime scene there's no blood of his found on the stairwell
00:28:22
going down into the street in fact there's no blood found in the street and what will jurors think about Heather's
00:28:28
account of her conversation with Evan the night before the murder where she says he told her if Howard hurt Roslin
00:28:37
he would kill him that's not a good thing to have to have to explain would I have prefer look especially when your
00:28:43
client shows up with cuts on his hand I have preferred that there were no cuts on his hand that there was no blood on
00:28:49
the wall or he hadn't made any statements yes because then even though I love speaking to you I wouldn't be
00:28:54
speaking to you because there wouldn't have been any case but the case against Roslin was all
00:29:03
circumstantial even though her family says she was happily married to Howard the prosecution says Howard had met with
00:29:11
a divorce lawyer and all the while Roslin was facing mounting pressure to pay back her crushing debts she had to
00:29:20
find money and she had to find it quickly she owed all that money she embezzled from the dentist we had the
00:29:27
debt from the dentist but it wasn't due that's not what Neil Klein says the dentist's accountant remembers leaning
00:29:35
on rosalin for the money in the weeks leading up to Howard's murder were you saying to her we need the money yeah we
00:29:43
need it soon yeah I was putting a little more pressure on her yes you don't strike me as a kneecapping kind of guy
00:29:52
so how were you turning up the pressure on her just as Sur Rises this can't go on much longer if if you're not going to
00:29:58
make payment then we're going to have to go further at the same time New York state was demanding the back taxes for
00:30:06
Philip's coffee and if she doesn't pay by certified check on that day they'll file a lean they'll padlock
00:30:15
the store the due date March 21st the same day Howard was murdered needing money does not mean that you're going to
00:30:26
kill your husband killing your husband doesn't mean it's going to resolve the need for money Evan and Roslin both
00:30:33
decided not to testify but the jurors heard Roslin on that message she left on Howard's voicemail hi how it's um like a
00:30:43
quarter to 10 and um Phil and I were wondering if he was still at work working or if if you listen to it and
00:30:49
I've listened to it a thousand times that is clearly a woman who is looking for her husband and is worried but not
00:30:56
everyone hears it the same way anyway I got home I guess by like uh 810 8:15 and Roseman called about 8 for 8:30
00:31:07
he was still at the office I told him to try to call you I hear a timeline being
00:31:13
put down for the police's benefit really yeah it's just too contrived too drawn out talk to you later bye love you and
00:31:24
the state has a witness who's relatively new to the cas Allison Lewis in 1996 she was Philip's
00:31:32
Nanny she was just out of college and she didn't want to talk to police back then I think when you consider the fact
00:31:40
that this was the person who was paying her and employing her and perhaps as she
00:31:45
matured and got older she realized that she had something that she could share she now says on the night of the murder
00:31:51
she took Philip to ice hockey practice because Roslin and Evan plan to meet with har card she said that rosin pilmar
00:31:59
was very vague in her instructions to her that it was very different than she usually was Allison says rosin later
00:32:06
told her to take Phillip home after practice because she was still at Howard's office she said we're not done
00:32:19
here those words are chilling ladies and gentlemen and you know that she's at the
00:32:25
fourth floor the king office company with Howard pilmar and her brother and when Allison and Phillip finally arrived
00:32:33
home Roslin met them at the door she had wet hair Allison said it was odd the apartment was dark and Rosalyn didn't
00:32:43
want her to come in I'm sorry but I do not believe a single word that came out of her mouth roslin's sister Janna says
00:32:52
there's no one to corroborate Allison Lewis's testimony I'm still very dismayed by the fact that she was so
00:33:00
adamant about not wanting to talk to the police and then 20 years later was so willing to
00:33:10
talk the trial lasted almost 2 months and then the jury got the case and from their first vote the jurors knew their
00:33:20
job would be tough listen things got pretty heated at times well [Music] I was feeling very
00:33:38
nervous if you're not nervous when the jury goes out you're not alive by the second day were you coming
00:33:45
together were were were the votes getting closer I don't think so and no we had two staunch holdouts
00:33:57
I think in a case like this the longer the better by the fourth day of jury deliberations defense attorney Sam tolin
00:34:06
was starting to feel optimistic we're asking them to think and they were thinking so yes I think that was a good
00:34:13
sign that afternoon the jury came back my father was in a courtroom on the other side Philip was there with raza's
00:34:22
family cameras were not allowed in the courtroom for the verdict we sat down and I'm holding his hand I was
00:34:30
scared and I was like crying inside what were you worried about what were you scared up that he dropped
00:34:37
dead literally y I thought he'd collapsed we're lining up and it was at that moment that the entire room tensed
00:34:51
up Ryan Smith Sam resnicow and the other jurors prepared themselves to deliver their
00:34:58
verdict and headed for the courtroom we walked in and it was super quiet and you could just feel the room
00:35:11
vibrating Smith was the jury Foreman he announced the verdict Ross was first and
00:35:17
that was what guilty and the second was Evans verdict and that was guilty both guilty of second deegree murder after
00:35:26
nearly 23 years it was almost as though the word echoed through the courtroom when you
00:35:34
heard the verdict Frank didn't hear it my father couldn't hear a word I screamed in his ear guilty guilty guilty
00:35:45
guilty I was like Euphoria I like you're so happy both of us were hugging and crying when Philip heard his mother had
00:35:55
been convicted of killing his father he ran out of the room we were all shocked by the
00:36:03
verdict I felt so numb I can't even begin to describe how it the pain the Heartbreak both families would have to
00:36:25
wait for 4 months to find out how much time Roslin and Evan would serve in July 2019 family friends lawyers and
00:36:38
detectives crowded into the courtroom for the sentencing hearing Philip was there alongside Raz
00:36:47
and Evan's sister but before Rosland and Evan hear their sentences they will have to hear
00:36:57
family members tell judge Gilbert Hong what Howard's murder had done to them March 22nd
00:37:09
1996 was the worst day of my life sorry to bury a child in my case is Deon our lives have never been the same
00:37:21
and never will be I implore you to give these murderers the maximum sentence I want them to suffer you want
00:37:34
them to suffer yes it's not that I want them to suffer they've got to pay the price you just don't go killing
00:37:42
people Frank was next you know you Runner every night when I go to bed I try to close my eyes before hoping that
00:37:54
I will get some sleep but I can't get sleep because I keep thinking about the terror and the
00:38:04
fear that went through Howard's mind in those last seconds that he was slaughtered and butchered by those
00:38:15
two then Frank turned to speak to his grandson and I'm going to direct this to Phil they have not spoken in
00:38:25
more than two decades that day in March I lost three things two of which I can never ever get
00:38:35
back my son and my business but I also lost philli and I know Philip doesn't want to look at me I'm sorry about that
00:38:45
but I just want him to know we love you and we want you back please that's take your life
00:38:57
I was hoping that he would come and reciprocate and hold me around and hug me pH no more but that never
00:39:08
happened philli did not speak to his grandfather but he did speak to the court you can't hear him because he
00:39:16
asked the judge to order us to cut off the audio these are the words of a son trying valiantly to save his mother from
00:39:25
spending the rest of her life in prison having my mom die in jail will not bring
00:39:31
back my dad as his uncle and his mother wept Philip credited her for making him the
00:39:39
man he is today she raised me to be kind to be loving to Value education value hard work she was there for me every
00:39:49
step of the way when I struggled with the death of my dad he asked the judge for
00:39:59
leniency but it didn't work this was an exceptionally brutal and violent murder its violence and brutality reveal
00:40:09
boundless anger and hatred towards Mr pilmar for this crime for this murder I sentence each of you to 25 years to life
00:40:21
incarceration it's the maximum sentence and it's what Howard's family except for
00:40:26
Phillip W haed but still they are not doing much celebrating it's bittersweet there's Justice for Howard
00:40:36
and that's the important thing but there's collateral damage we all lost something how you doing my son what does
00:40:47
Justice feel like you've gotten it justice feels like uh like happiness I just feel that Frank
00:40:56
you work at it all your work it's okay paid office for got them finally after all these
00:41:04
[Music] years 48 hours to miss it will be a crime were you at all prepared for what
00:41:15
happened in this case [Music]