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Before we begin, just a trigger warning. The following episode contains references to graphic physical violence.
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Please listen with care. [Music] I mean, Chris, do you believe that Daniel Marsh was a serial killer in
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training? >> Absolutely. perhaps without a doubt that if if he had been allowed to keep on
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going, um he actually talked about how he was going to take his next victim. >> Almost 4 hours into questioning at the
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police station, Daniel Marsh admitted to FBI special agent Chris Campion that he
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had murdered Claudia Min and Chip Northup. But he didn't stop there. Campion learned the teenager was already
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thinking about his next killing. >> Well, it's going to basically do this same thing only with a different
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mask and a different gloves, a different jacket, and instead of breaking in, I figured I'd get somebody when they were
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alone at night out in the street or out somewhere, just find somebody alone at night and beat him to death with a
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baseball bat. >> Okay. Did you have anybody in mind? No. >> Had you actually gone out looking for
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someone? >> Yeah. >> He was someone who did not have a conscience. >> You believe Daniel Marsh is a
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psychopath? >> I do. I believe Daniel Marsh is a psychopath. I I knew it when he was
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talking to me. He actually admitted it. cuz I don't feel sympathy for other people
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at all. I don't feel empathy for them. And whether I like that or not, it's the way
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it is. Just like I want to hurt people. >> Campion maintained his composure. And then he asked Daniel a question that
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I had never heard in a police interrogation. No. How would you kill me? There's a lot of ways I mean that you've
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thought of so far in the couple hours that we spent together here. >> Well, choking you to death with your
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tie. >> Okay. Uh beating your face into the mirror until it broke and using the glass to cut your arteries. Uh gouging
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your eyes out and just smashing your face into the wall. Campion had asked, "How would you kill
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me?" And almost immediately, Daniel had thought of three different gruesome ways
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that he would do it. >> Nothing personal. I don't take it personal. >> Okay. It's just that's what happens when
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you meet somebody, when you're thinking, when there's that time when you >> involuntary. It's something that just
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happens. And I said I didn't take it personally cuz I didn't I don't think I did anything to offend him, to upset
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him. Um I think he literally thinks about that with anybody he meets. That's what he thinks about doing. That's his
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fantasy life. >> While Daniel was questioned, police had searched his mother's home. There they
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found writings, drawings, a knife, duct tape, and clothing with Chip and Claudia's DNA.
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Police also searched Daniel's father's home. When he found out his son was being questioned, he said he sent a
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public defender down to the police station. Authorities finally had a suspect in
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Chip Northup and Claudia Mppin's murders. And with physical evidence, DNA samples, and a complete confession, it
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seemed like the case against Daniel was solid. But the fact that the suspect was
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a teenager would complicate things for the prosecution. [Music] I'm 48 hours correspondent Aaron
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Morardi. This is 15 inside the Daniel Marsh murders. Episode 5, A Killer's Mind.
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>> When did you first hear the name Daniel Marsh? the victim's advocate as well as
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the Davis police u liaison who was in charge of our case uh called and said that they had made an arrest.
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>> Victoria Herd had finally gotten the call she had been anxiously waiting for.
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>> I just remember shaking my head going, "What? What?" >> That anyone could kill her mother and
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stepfather was difficult enough to believe. by a 15-year-old, a teenager. Who was this boy named Daniel Marsh?
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I'm in shock. And then all of a sudden, I get a burst of, you know, eldest daughter can do anything. And I said,
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I've got to go to that arraignment. That arraignment's going to happen within 24
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hours. I've got to go there and see this man, young man. So >> kid, >> kid. But Victoria would have to wait even
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longer to see him. Because Daniel was a minor, his face was hidden by a wall at the arraignment.
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>> My sister-in-law was with me. I said, "I I have got to see him. I've got to look
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in his face and see this man who killed my mother." >> Finally, she saw Daniel's face through a
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TV monitor. >> He looked like somebody who would be one of my niec's boyfriends. He looked like
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some hippie kid from Davis. When I was at the arraignment, his father sat in front of me. And uh I
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think it was my victim's advocate who told me that was his father. And there was something strange. I didn't like it.
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I didn't like the feel. [Music] >> Daniel's father is Bill Marsh. We spoke in 2018.
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>> Did it ever occur to you that your own son could be involved in something like
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that? >> Not in a million years. You never saw any sign of that. You never got a sense
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that >> if I had had any sense of it, I would have taken action. >> Bill seemed to still struggle with what
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his son was accused of. >> Show me the pictures you have here. Tell me who this is.
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>> This is This is Daniel in 2009. So that would have made him uh 12. >> This was about the time when you had the
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heart attack. >> Yes. Right. One day in November 2009, Daniel was home with his father when Bill says he
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had started feeling dizzy >> and I I'd gone upstairs and taken a shower, came down and said, "Come on,
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Dan. Let's go to the hospital. I got checked out. >> They got in the car and made it to the
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corner of their street. >> Next thing I knew, I woke up and the car was ran into a wall covered in bushes
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and a tree. I asked Daniel, "How did we wind up here? What happened?" He says, "I don't know, Daddy." He says,
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"Suddenly you just passed out." He says, "I climbed into your lap and steered the
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car into the wall to stop it." >> It must have been terrifying for Daniel, who started banging on his father's
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chest. Something Daniel later said he had seen on a medical drama. It worked. Daniel
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had saved his father's life. About a month later, Daniel was presented with an American Red Cross
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Heroes Award. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. It was a major event. Um, he was all over the media and they
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were, you know, touting this young American hero. And look at this. He might actually be a future doctor. And
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>> sure enough, there was Daniel featured in local newspapers, hailed for his heroism. In photos, he looks innocent
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and sweet, wearing a suit with a rose bud in his lapel, his father proudly standing beside him. The next year,
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Daniel enrolled in the Davis Police Department's Youth Academy, receiving instruction on crime scene
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investigation. But while Daniel may have appeared a model citizen on the outside, he was
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also harboring a dark side. Something Bill said he didn't notice until after his heart attack.
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>> You know that he told counselors that he was actually killing animals before then. Did you
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have any sense of that, Bill? >> No, not at all. Um, in fact, I had because of all the upheaval in the
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family and the rest, I had no basis of of experience to counsel him. But he told the FBI agent that he had thought
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about killing your wife's >> lover >> lover that he thought about killing her. That was 2 years earlier.
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As Daniel entered the Yolo County courthouse almost a year and a half after Claudia Mopin and Chip Northup's
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murders, a judge and jury were about to decide his fate. Now on trial is Daniel Marsh, the teenager being tried as an
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adult after the gruesome killings that rocked the city of Davis last year. On Tuesday, September 2nd, 2014,
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the long awaited murder trial against Daniel Marsh, now 17 years old, began at the Yolo County Courthouse.
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Daniel had been charged as an adult with two counts of first-degree murder. Prosecutors concluded that he had quote
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committed a very adult crime in a very adult manner. And then just 3 months before the trial began, Daniel changed
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his plea from not guilty to not guilty by reason of insanity. A clear indication of the defense to
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come. Inside the courtroom, Daniel looked noticeably different from the year before when he had first confessed to
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killing Chip Northup and Claudia Mopin. Gone was the long scruffy hair. Now it was cut short, neater, and darker.
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[Music] >> He showed zero emotion. Um, he didn't seem scared. Um, he would just face
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forward. He never cried. >> This is Amanda Zambour, the deputy district attorney for Yolo County. I
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spoke with her in 2018. At the time of the trial, she was one of the two prosecutors.
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Had you ever run into a defendant like this? >> Not in real life. Only in books. When
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you read about Ted Bundy, Jeffrey Dmer, um you know, Richard Ramirez, all people
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that he idolized and and studied and identified with. I >> mean, did that add a whole another the
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fact that this defendant was a kid? >> Yeah. So, I was pregnant with my third child on um during the trial and you you
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definitely reflect back and how can a child do this? How can they have such a depraved mind? How do how do they get
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that way? Um is it possible to change them? >> Zambour along with co-prosecutor Michael
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Cabraw began prepping for the trial as soon as Daniel was arrested in June 2013.
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Davis Police Department thankfully built a very strong case and Chris Campion um
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from the FBI did a masterful job in his interview of Marsh. Had Campion not been
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on that, I don't know that we would have gotten the confession that we did. But they really built a solid case on Marsh
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from the get-go once we figured out it was him. >> What about though the defense argument
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that this guy, this young man had a lot of trauma? his mother left the family for another woman. Um, he was in this
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car accident when his father had a heart attack. He had to save his father. He was bullied in school. Possible that
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that could cause this kind of anger and lashing out. >> You know, there's no doubt that he he
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had some trauma in his life, but there's how many kids that go through and have divorced parents and they don't kill
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other people. They may struggle with depression. and they may struggle with other things, but there's a lot of
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people who actually have severe trauma that don't act like this. >> But Zamour needed to convince the jurors
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that Daniel had intended to kill. >> I mean, he had been fantasizing about it since he was 10, 11 years old about
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killing somebody. So, it wasn't this spur-ofthe- moment um murder where he just snapped and went
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out. He planned and stole items and sharpened the knife and put duct tape on his boots to not leave footprints, which
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you know, it it just shows how intelligent he is. >> To put Daniel behind bars, Zambour
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needed to make the case to jurors that Daniel knew exactly what he was doing and if given the chance, he'd do it
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again. And if that happened, he'd be even better at it. I believe he would have gotten away with these murders if
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he had not bragged to his friends. If he had not bragged, he would have killed others. He would have he bragged about
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going out with a baseball bat in the middle of the night and just not being able to find the right victim. He had
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plotted and planned another victim for his girlfriend's ex-boyfriend and had done reconnaissance on him and I mean
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knew the pets in the home, the neighbors, what family members lived there. He had created a fake Facebook
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account to get more intel on this family to to try and figure out how he could kill them. And he actually went out and
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waited for him on one night, but he didn't come. In the courtroom, the prosecution
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questioned dozens of witnesses, including friends of Chip and Claudia, Daniel's former friend, Alvaro Garab,
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police officers, and psychiatrists. One witness, a member of the Davis Police Department, helped process the
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crime scene. He testified that the blood stain patterns left behind suggested that Chip and Claudia were awake and had
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tried to defend themselves against Daniel. >> Claudia fought, made him mad, and it
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just invigorated him to keep going. and he describes how her please for for him to stop just
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enthused him, made him want to keep going. >> These were horrific details. Prosecutors
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tried to prepare Claudia and Chip's families for what they would hear in the courtroom.
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>> So, they would brief us before we'd go in and say, "Okay, now in this next part, you're going to hear some things
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that you haven't heard before." Claudia's daughter, Victoria, told me that one of the most painful times for
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her was sitting in court watching that taped interview between FBI special agent Chris Campion and Daniel Marsh.
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>> It was really tough for me. Um especially when he got to the part where he talked about killing my mother and he
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talked about um he had to stab keep stabbing her because she wouldn't die and that she was
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begging for her life and that was hard. And I I felt I was sitting there and I felt like I couldn't stay in the seat
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anymore. I felt like it was so real that I was experiencing the death of my mother. He was saying all the details in
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the interview and I felt like I was watching the murder of my mother and I I couldn't sit. I stood. How do you
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describe a person like Daniel Marsh after hearing him talk? >> My mind can't process that degree of
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evil. So hearing that was just something that I I just can't go there. I can't It's so dark. It's just so dark.
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Adding to Victoria's horror was the score of friends and fans. Yes, fans who showed up to the trial to support
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Daniel. >> He had a lot of goth followers. So he had a lot of young women who were
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following him. acting like little teenage girls, you know, dressed in black and black makeup and all that and
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thinking that he was innocent, you know, and if he could have waved at them or hugged them or shook them hand, it was
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like he was a celebrity. Like he was the celebrity that he wanted to be. No remorse.
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>> Oh, no. He was reveling in his celebrity. The prosecution was convinced that not
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only did Daniel know exactly what he was doing when he killed Chip and Claudia, but the big question at trial, was
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Daniel in his right mind? Was he sane when committing the murders? Daniel's defense team intended to prove
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he wasn't. And this was the man they wanted to help make that case. >> So, my name is Dr. Matthew Sulier and
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I'm a child forensic psychiatrist. I was hired by his attorney in 2013 to evaluate him as part of his original
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trial. >> I sat down with Dr. Sulier in 2018 and again in 2025. >> My job really was to kind of explore his
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life history beginning with birth until the day I was meeting him and try to get
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a sense of what his life story is. um some of his more critical experiences in relationships, history of trauma, and
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specifically as it related to the defense, I needed him to tell me about what he did, and I needed to try to
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figure out if in fact he was if it was going to be my opinion that he was criminally responsible or not.
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>> Sulier first met Daniel a few months after his arrest. In 2013, I met him at the Yolo County Juvenile Hall and uh he
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was dressed in, you know, typical juvenile hall attire. He was a different kind of kid. I mean, when I I it does
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stick out to me that uh there was a coldness to him. Um despite even the number of hours that I spent with him, I
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didn't feel that I mean there was a heart or that there was there was a feeling in him. In fact, Daniel was
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still regularly thinking about killing people. He told Sulier that he had thoughts of harming his peers and the
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people taking care of him in juvenile hall. Then, just like FBI special agent Chris Campion, Dr. Sullier found himself
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on the receiving end of Daniel's homicidal thoughts. I asked him, "What are you thinking
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about?" And he said, "I'm thinking about killing you. I'm thinking about taking that pen on your table right there and
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shoving it in your neck. I'm thinking about taking your laptop and crushing it over your head."
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>> It wasn't the only time that a patient had threatened Dr. Sulier. So, while he
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took it seriously, it didn't deter him from trying to speak with Daniel again. He was able to go back a week later. Dr.
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Sulier believed that Daniel's desire to kill him and others was actually the result of an obsessive compulsive
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disorder. >> It's my belief that, you know, Daniel wasn't born a bad seed. I don't believe
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in that. Daniel clearly changed around the age of 10. Um, by everybody's observation and what we could gather
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about him, um, he wasn't a terrible kid up until age 10. But you don't think he was born that way?
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>> No. No. I I just The issue of psychopathy. Uh it it's clearly something that Yes,
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there's probably some level of genetic predisposition to it. Um but he wasn't a bad kid in preschool or kindergarten.
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There's no evidence of that of any kind. Um there's something that was unlocked in him. There were forces. There were
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things that experiences, things that happened to him that I think made him who he was.
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>> Dr. Sulier also believed that Daniel didn't want to be this way, that he had wanted to stop his compulsive behavior.
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>> In his case, he developed these morbid preoccupations about death, about killing people. Um, but again, the thing
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that it was important to note to me was that it was disturbing to him. He was going around telling everybody and
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anybody who would listen to him. Um he told school, he told a transporting police officer, he told his therapist,
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he told a psychiatrist, he told anybody that he wanted to kill everybody. I have
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these thoughts. I don't want to have them. Ultimately, he did act on them. But the precursor was sat masochistic
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sex, gore porn, all these things was an attempt in my mind to diminish the intensity of those preoccupations. And
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at first it worked. At first, it would dissolve those thoughts and feelings about killing other people, but
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ultimately that gave out and it wasn't sufficient and ultimately he then acted on it.
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>> But at some point, Daniel seemed to stop fighting his compulsions. The horror he had once felt had morphed
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into something else. rather than being repelled and upset by what he had done when he finally listened to those
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repetitive thoughts, he was actually excited about it, proud. What does that say?
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>> Um, that's disturbing. That's deviant. Again, that's the psychopathy in him that really lacks feeling. He just is
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unable to feel um compassion for those that he hurt at that time in 2013. And that's scary.
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But here's the important part. Daniel might have had strong compulsions to kill. Compulsions that he struggled to
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control, but Dr. Sulier concluded that Daniel was not legally insane. What would make him insane? What are you
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looking for? Is it like a memory of does he have all the details? Did he know what he did? you know, does he remember
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doing it? >> It is a very high standard. You have to be able to um lack an appreciation for
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what you did. So, for instance, while you're holding a knife, you think you're, you know, holding a spoon or
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something that's completely unrelated um and that you really fail to understand the morality of what you're
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doing, the consequences of what you're doing. It it's it's typically reserved for people that have very severe
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psychiatric illness. uh psychotic illness, uh people that are uh acting under the direction of delusions, their
00:24:21
voices, and none of this was true for Daniel. The fact that Daniel actually bragged about what he was doing and
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seemed to enjoy it, but also covering the bottom of his shoes with tape. What does that say to you when you're trying
00:24:38
to determine whether he's insane or not? >> It shows that he's engaging in logical
00:24:43
and linear behaviors. He's calculating, he's planning in a logical manner. We might disagree with what he's doing,
00:24:49
obviously, and it's terrible. Um, but it's not psychotically driven in any way. >> Dr. Sulier was convinced that Daniel
00:24:58
knew what he was doing when he committed the murders. But despite Sulier's professional assessment, Daniel's
00:25:06
defense team was determined to plead not guilty by reason of insanity. And they plan to prove that the medications
00:25:16
Daniel had taken made him that way. The drugs made me do it. >> Exactly. The drugs and anti-depressant
00:25:24
um specifically. And what I basically told defense is that I couldn't get on board with the idea of the defense of an
00:25:31
insanity particularly. I didn't believe that the anti-depressants caused him to act in that way or kill. So the defense
00:25:39
said thank you. and they went and found another expert. >> The defense called Dr. James Marangis to
00:25:46
testify as an expert witness. A neurologist and psychiatrist, he interviewed Daniel and his family
00:25:54
members several times and reviewed Daniel's previous medical records and police statements. Dr. America Kangas
00:26:03
testimony focused largely on SSRIs, a class of anti-depressants that included medications that Daniel had
00:26:11
been prescribed to treat severe depression. According to Merrick Hangus, the side
00:26:18
effect of those drugs could include extreme restlessness, outbursts of anger, and increased impulsivity.
00:26:28
Daniel, he said, was experiencing those side effects. The doctor believed that Daniel had endured trauma for years. And
00:26:37
that had, in part, made him more susceptible to dangerous side effects. Daniel's father, Bill Marsh, also
00:26:45
believed that Daniel's behavior was caused by medication. >> It turns your world upside down. Turns
00:26:53
your brain inside out. You think that's the only reason why he killed? >> I do. Yeah.
00:26:58
>> But isn't it just possible your son is a psychopath? >> Um, not in my mind. No.
00:27:05
>> And why? Why? Why are you so >> Because I I've raised him. I was around him all the time. And he was in my
00:27:13
estimation a normal kid until they um until they started feeding these drugs. >> Most important, Dr. Marra Kangas said
00:27:23
that on the day of the murder, Daniel had reported having an out-ofbody experience.
00:27:30
Marra Kangas couldn't prove when Daniel's dreamlike state began or how long it lasted. He just knew that
00:27:38
according to Daniel, it had started sometime that night. The doctor knew that Daniel, the defendant, had
00:27:46
motivation to lie about this dreamlike state. After all, Daniel hadn't said anything about it in his interviews with
00:27:55
special agent Chris Campion or Dr. Matthew Sulier. But still, Dr. Marangas felt that Daniel had been truthful to
00:28:05
him in his interview. >> I just fundamentally don't believe putting someone on an anti-depressant
00:28:12
generates any level of risk that you're going to go and do what Daniel did. >> That's Dr. Sulier again and he wasn't
00:28:20
convinced that medications could cause legal insanity. >> There are side effects. It can make you
00:28:26
more suicidal, more agitated, but it doesn't drive you to kill in the way he did in such a calculating and callous
00:28:32
manner. It just doesn't. >> And as prosecutor Amanda Zambour pointed out, Daniel was having those violent
00:28:39
feelings much earlier. when you actually looked at the medical records, he was having these thoughts and fantasies
00:28:47
before he was ever on Zoloft. Um, he wasn't taking his Zoloft as he was supposed to. A lot of times he would
00:28:53
just not take them. Um, he described selling some of his medications to other people. So, really there was no basis
00:29:00
for that. >> After 4 weeks of testimony, it would be up to the jury to decide, was Daniel
00:29:08
Marsh guilty? And if so, did he know what he was doing when he committed the murders? There was a lot at stake here
00:29:17
for Daniel and the community because one verdict would put Daniel behind bars for
00:29:24
the foreseeable future. The other meant Daniel would go to a psychiatric hospital for treatment.
00:29:34
[Music] You know, we felt very confident in the case, in the evidence, but there's
00:29:46
always that little bit of doubt. >> Prosecutor Amanda Zamour felt she had made the best case she could to the
00:29:52
jury. >> You had mostly women on the jury. Were you worried one woman might feel
00:29:59
sympathy for this young guy? Um, you know, it's it's always it's a 16-year-old boy at the time and so you
00:30:07
always worry about not just women but men that they could see their son and you know they feel sorry like how could
00:30:14
this this child have done this? But nearly 2 hours after closing arguments, the jury re-entered the courtroom
00:30:24
and the verdict was >> guilty beyond a reasonable doubt of of every single count of all the
00:30:30
enhancements of all the special circumstances. Unanimously, the jury had found Daniel
00:30:38
Marsh guilty on two counts of firstdegree murder along with additional quote enhancements that increase the
00:30:48
severity of the punishment he would face due to the depraved nature of the crime.
00:30:57
>> You see things on TV and you think, well, that's television. That couldn't possibly happen in such a
00:31:04
way. in in real life, but it was actually probably more horrifying. >> Cheryl Gleason sat on the jury of eight
00:31:12
women and four men. She explained to me why she believed Daniel Marsh was guilty. the stacks of binders of
00:31:21
pictures from the crime scene, the piles of evidence that we went through, hearing the accounts of the story, the
00:31:30
more evidence that came out in how meticulous and precise his actions were, how things
00:31:41
leading up to that, like going through the Junior Police Academy and how well he did at that, and
00:31:48
he was a smart kid. Really smart kid. >> Hearing weeks of gruesome testimony left
00:31:56
some jurors traumatized. >> It had a long-term effect that I wasn't really thinking would happen. To this
00:32:04
day, I cannot fall asleep without sleeping my face towards the door, the bedroom door. I can't turn my back on
00:32:12
the door to this day. >> Explain that to me. because he came through a window that he cut the screen
00:32:19
out of through the living room, but then came into their bedroom door. And so I just I see that as this thing that I
00:32:28
have to keep my eye on until I fall asleep. >> However, finding Daniel guilty was not
00:32:35
actually the end of the trial. The jury still had to make another decision. Was Daniel insane at the time of the
00:32:45
murders? While she had been confident that the jurors would find Daniel guilty of murder, prosecutor Amanda Zambour
00:32:54
wasn't as confident about the issue of insanity. >> Were you more nervous about that?
00:33:00
>> Yes. Because of that, you know, that immediate thought to see something this grave, the immediate thought is it
00:33:07
somebody would have to be insane to do something like this. they'd have to be out of their mind. Um, but then again,
00:33:13
when you go back and you hear him speak about just how happy and enthused that this made him, that he was laughing the
00:33:20
whole way home and giggling and wanted to relive it and kept these moments. And to see it up close is it's powerful.
00:33:30
So after delivering the guilty verdict, the jurors heard another day of arguments where the prosecution and
00:33:38
defense tried to prove that Daniel was either legally sane or insane at the time of the crime. And once again, it
00:33:49
was a quick decision for the jury. They found Daniel to be sane at the time he committed the murders of Claudia
00:33:57
Mopin and Chip Northup. >> It was just really clear that he was not insane. >> So if he's not insane, then what is
00:34:07
Daniel Marsh? >> He's a psychopathic killer. I think if he were let loose, he would be a serial
00:34:13
killer. He has an urge to kill. Ahead of the sentencing, the judge heard from members of Claudia and Chip's
00:34:23
family who talked about the deep losses they had suffered. Victoria Herd detailed the trauma that the family
00:34:32
experienced and told the court that her sister Laura had quote lost her mind to grief after discovering the bodies and
00:34:42
had still not recovered by the time of the trial. Victoria also recalled having to tell her children about their
00:34:50
grandmother's murder and how they sobbed and screamed in heartbreak. Victoria's message to the court was that
00:34:59
quote, "If Daniel is free, people will die. Another son, another daughter, another father, mother, brother, sister
00:35:11
will suffer as I have. Therefore, in honor of my mother, Claudia Mppen, and the legacy of love that she left behind
00:35:20
for us, it is my belief that the loving, compassionate action in this situation would be to request from the court the
00:35:29
maximum sentence allowable for the torture and murder of my mother and her husband, Chip Northup.
00:35:39
And then the judge handed Daniel a sentence. that prosecutor Amanda Zambour had been working to secure for weeks.
00:35:50
>> The judge sentenced Daniel Marsh to 52 years. Were you happy with that? >> It it was the maximum that he could have
00:35:58
done. Um had he been 16, he would have been eligible for life without the possibility of parole. Um but because of
00:36:04
his age, the max he could have gotten was 52 years to life. So we were very happy with that. The prosecution had
00:36:10
succeeded in their effort to put Daniel behind bars for a long, long time. When asked for comment on the case and
00:36:20
sentencing, Daniel's lawyers declined. While Daniel had been handed the longest sentence possible, he still would be
00:36:31
eligible for parole in 25 years. But in the meantime, the victim's families could take time to breathe.
00:36:41
>> When we received the conviction, it felt healing, like we could we could be free.
00:36:47
>> But it wasn't over yet, was it? >> It wasn't over, Aaron. No, it wasn't over.
00:36:53
>> It was not over. Not by a long shot. Because 4 years later, Victoria and the rest of Chip and Claudia's family would
00:37:05
find themselves fighting again as a new California law threatened to let Daniel go free much earlier than the judge had
00:37:15
ordered. >> So if he's out in 4 years, he knows us. He knows our names. Of course he does.
00:37:20
He's seen us in court. The capacity that he could get back on the streets and do
00:37:25
what he's done again. >> Yes. That fear is overwhelming. >> That's next on 15 inside the Daniel Marsh murders.
00:37:38
[Music] This series was reported by me, Aaron Morardi. Alan Pang is our producer. Mora
00:37:51
Walls is our story editor. And Jamie Benson is the senior producer. Megan Marcus is the vice president of podcast
00:38:00
editorial for CBS. Special thanks to 48 hours executive producer Judy Tyiggard along with 48
00:38:09
hours producers Judy Ryback, Stephanie Slifer, and Greg Fiser from Goat Rodeo. This podcast was written and produced by
00:38:19
Carara Schillin, Max Johnston, Jay Venibals, Isabelle Kirby McGawan, Megan Nadulski, and Ian Enright.
00:38:29
Additional reporting and recording by Cara Schillin. Our executive producers at Goat Rodeo are Megan Nadulski and Ian
00:38:38
Enright. Original theme in music by Hans Delshi with additional music from Paramount. Final mix by Rebecca Sidell.
00:38:50
Vendel Fulton is our fact checker. Our production manager is Carara Schillin. I'm Aaron Morardi. If you're enjoying
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this show, be sure to give it a rating and review. It helps more people find it and hear our reporting. If you liked 15
00:39:09
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