E16: Reflecting on the riots at the US Capitol, plus: Georgia runoffs, vaccine distribution & more

we'll let your winners ride rain man david sacks and they've just gone crazy with it we should all just get a room and just have one big huge orgy because they're all just useless it's like this like sexual tension that they just need to release your feet we need to get murky all right and we're back and thank you to young spielberg with the all-in 1.5 extended edition remix we're going all in that was thank you to the super fans that was really incredible actually we're back we're back yeah shout out young spielberg with us the dictator chamoth paulie

hoppetea the rain man himself david sax is definitely an excellent driver and his dad lets him drive in the driveway and the queen of quinoa spectacular david freeburg is with us we did an emergency pod we just had all agreed we're taking a nice break nothing's gonna happen over the new year this is the down period and 2021 is going to be delightful and simple and then all hell breaks loose we could start with the vaccine we could start with the capital we could start with georgia now we have to start we have to start we have to start with the capital we have to start with the

capitals all right so let me just run through the series of events that occur here there's a certification process correct sax that goes on where the electoral college gets counted and somewhere at 10 am trump had a rally of thousands of supporters you were not there david correct you weren't at this round he was in quote-unquote miami right i think he's in the miami hilton on pennsylvania avenue right now and he put up that fake miami background but the truth is let's be honest here um trump came out at 10 a.m and had a rally jason can we just take

a step back for a second doesn't david sacks look like elliott gould in ocean's 11 right now he is a silver fox and are you i mean you were very public about being in miami over the new year you took your talents to miami and we see this background um so we can assume that dictators in his uh pool house poker room we know that freeberg's in a ritz carlton somewhere based on the furniture he's in his ritz carlton uh office and sax based on your background are you in miami right now yeah are you still there yeah i still i'm still i'm still here okay but david did you meet me or not i i haven't

i actually met him i did meet him i went to like a tech uh event the other night and he was there so were you wearing masks at the tech event were you wearing a mask they it was they were like no no i'll tell you there were masks indoors and then there was like coveted testing inside and then you could graduate to the outdoor patio part where people generally weren't wearing masks so were you in conversations with people with no masks on is that what you're saying at this yeah but you know everyone's been like covet tested like a zillion times

and it was outdoors and you know i'm willing to meet with people outdoors you know i generally don't do it indoors but i'm yeah i'm that i i've said that's my policy starting several months ago did we can we rewind to april with that photo of sac do we have it where he was in the ski mask and the goggles and the helmet and like the biohazard suit and like how things have changed he's like i'll go to miami and have a chat with someone yeah you could you could you you could definitely do uh how it started and how it's going uh split photo for it but but look you're like sharing a banana

split with someone like you know like well because on ebay and alibaba buying ventilators for his home triage center well i mean we had people from the who saying in march that the you know that the case the infection fatality rate was like 7 you know and the two big things we learned after that were number one that there was a huge distribution by age right and so somebody under 50 without comorbidities had a much much much lower risk and then also the thing we learned is that the there's there's maybe a 10x difference between the infection fatality rate and

the case fatality rate i mean you guys know all this yeah and so so once we learned those things um i mean i you you know i think a rational person takes things like that into account i changed my policy with respect to covet you know and and now especially that we have uh you know easy access to tests which weren't available you can get tested before going into a event so i i have a question to add on to that do you own a fur chewbacca outfit and were were you in washington dc yesterday with more paint on your nipples do you have a podium do you have a neck to waste a tattoo are you standing behind a podium let me hide the the viking horns that i've got stashed away here

all right listen there was a great there was a title can we title yesterday's event national lampoon siege of the capital i mean it was like animal house like you know yeah there was a great there was a great tweet by somebody saying this was uh this was like the storming of the bastille as perpetrated by the cast of animal house and there was another there's another great tweet saying uh the capital now appears to be under the control of a man in a viking mask the best one was i have lost all respect for nicholas cage's ability to steal the us constitution

apparently yeah whatever copies left all right so let's just go through the chain of events here and it was it was absolutely surreal because trump literally went out to a mob of people and said i want you to march down pennsylvania avenue and show the gop what it takes to have courage et cetera mike pence apparently told trump that he was not going to go to bat for him in the ceremonial process of counting the votes and lo and behold you're watching this you know the objections going on to the electoral account and you see the secret service come

rushing in and it becomes a you know very serious situation and when you watch some of the videos it is truly terrorizing that thousands of people overwhelmed the police and i guess i want to start with people's opinion on trump's culpability in inciting what was very dangerous behavior four people are dead um so you know while we're joking about the cosplay outfits a woman who was a an art and trump supporter who is a vet who did four tours uh from what i've read and i shared the video with you before literally you know as they broke into the building was trying to breach another area of the building and she's climbing through a window and gets shot

apparently by the secret service or the police and dies and so it's all fun and games until four people are dead and now somebody's lost their wife daughter sister jason i mean there could have been 400 dead there could have been fourth house absolutely yeah i mean this could have become a shootout at the okay corral i can't understand why the police showed the restraint they did i mean when you see them getting surrounded i don't know if you saw the one they didn't they didn't show restraint jason there was no police when you look at the amount of um security that's typically

there and has been there for other situations and then you compare it to the amount of security knowing for a month and a half that this was coming it's um it just doesn't make any sense to me so i'm a little i'm a little dumbfounded that you know you couldn't have seen this facebook group called you know hashtag storm the capital which had tens of thousands maybe hundreds of thousands of members in there plotting and scheming selling merchandise called storm the capital you know these guys were wearing printed sweatshirts that they had time to make

and nobody knew about it and nobody thought to reinforce um the security and barricade it and make sure that you couldn't go from the protest site to the cat i mean i it just seems like there's some level of complicity that needs to get found out here but there was a there was an interview i saw with an xdc police guy who said that i think folks were told to tamper down uh the police forces were told to tamper down on managing crowds and protests and riots following the controversy associated with blm a few months ago and spraying folks with pepper spray and water and all the physical techniques that were used

were so um outraging that that there was just more of a systemic concern about being too aggressive with protesters and as a result they went too far the other way uh it's it's not about it it just happens to be friedberg that when black people protested and brown people they got the tear gas and beaten with batons and then when the white people uh stormed the what the the capital in the same area they got uh walked down the steps and escorted out with a stern warning to not do it again i mean this is hypocritical and insane i i i don't know why you have to go there particularly um it it looked to me like what happened is that the capitol hill police simply got completely overwhelmed uh you look at

these you know giant this is a rally on the mall that turned into a mob well first it kind of turned into a tailgater then it turned into a mob and then it turned into an insurrection it kind of stumbled forward into progressive uh phases of uh of stupidity and disaster but it's it looked to me like the capitol hill police simply got overwhelmed they they obviously were unprepared they were surprised i think by this and i saw video of tons of tear gas being used i saw people getting tear gas like crazy and i think there was reports uh this morning on twitter that the whole

area in front of the capitol there was covered in that light film that remains after tear gassing so i don't think they were really pulling punches too much and i also think that uh that there will be prosecutions i think that uh the these people were captured on video there's a lot of talk on twitter and everybody is in favor of finding out who they are applying facial recognition and uh bringing charges so i think there will be a lot of charges unlike let's say the the blm protest this summer i don't remember anybody getting charged based on video of people writing or looting

and then i think you know the the the final difference actually with the blm protest is that if you've watched fox news at all in the last 24 hours the condemnation of what of the storming of the capital of what happened has been across the board both right and left everybody across the political spectrum has condemned it nobody is apologizing for it nobody on the right is looking for root causes to explain the reasons why it happened everybody is just condemning it and saying that it should never have happened and the people who did it should be prosecuted and

so i don't see any kid gloves here being used um you know either physically or glove sex is when you see officers being chased up the steps and uh or taking selfies you know which is one instance i don't want to just say that's the only indicative thing but when people are breaking through windows and just kind of being let go i mean they were obviously overwhelmed but i'm surprised more people didn't get shot let's just tackle this head-on in terms of the race issue well i have a i have a question for david before i make my statement david do you think that if this were

black and brown people storming the capital would there have been more or less than four deaths honestly i think would have been the same i just uh disagree yeah i disagree i really disagree and i'll tell you why um i think you have the best of intentions wanting to think that way but here's the way i see it i see a president that basically instigated a group of people who are fundamentally disenfranchised let's face it like there are there are a lot of very very reasonable republicans and a lot of very reasonable democrats the fringes of both parties are functionally mentally [ __ ] we know this okay and so what you see are extreme

on both sides who are just completely lost and looking for any excuse and so you have a president in the tail end of his presidency an anonymous presidency basically call them out nobody who actually had a job or anything to do could show up right so you had all these people show up it's a wednesday yeah it's a wednesday during the day i mean and what do you think happens they're there they're all frothed up you know um eric trump frothing them up donald trump jr frothing them up trump frothing them up giuliani frothing them up and all of a sudden as you said

stumbling into degrees of of craziness and stupidity to storm the capital and i just think to myself how could a president instigate this kind of action number one the second thing i think about is when black athletes peacefully protested uh something that they had the fundamental constitutional right to protest in the president's eyes they were sons of [ __ ] white people that stormed the [ __ ] capital the people's house yep were called patriots by the president's daughter and she and then we're told that they were loved by the president himself to me it's just an enormously stark contrast of a double standard i think that beyond the persecutions of the people i actually feel very bad for the people that stormed the capital i feel like these are folks

that are on the fringes who just need a vessel and trump is a vessel and then he instigates them and runs away you know what i mean he's a character he's lost these are less that these guys commit the crime and now they're going to go to jail i feel like the the culpability has to go all the way back to trump to holly to cruz these guys are those are the real scumbags in all of this freebird what are your thoughts on this and then i'll go back to sax and let him respond yeah i don't i don't think it's unreasonable to assume that if this was a black lives matter

and and it was black people involved or brown people involved in um in the same sorts of activities you saw yesterday that you would not see more shootings i don't think that's an unreasonable uh position to take obviously um i think there's this other circumstance which is that event preceding this one as i mentioned i saw an interview with the dc police former police direct director of the police or some i forgot what his title was where he highlighted that you know folks were kind of instructed to stand down following the blm controversies and so i think that's also kind of a reasonable point of view

and uh what about the president's culpability i mean i think that's one issue that's gonna have to be addressed post and i think we have to figure out what life post trump is going to be like because this is a level of chaos that nobody to sax's point all people condemned it's um yeah there's a there's a there's a theory which actually takes its origin from from hitler where uh hitler used this term the big lie and uh you know the theory is that you can create political propaganda by saying something that's so outrageous it is so improbable that people say there's no way this thing keeps getting said over and over

unless it's actually real um and this is sort of like the q anon pedophile ring in the pizzeria or the fact that the election was stolen from you it is such an outrageous statement um that that it seems to people uh that it only has to be true um because it is it is such an insane thing and if it is it's so insane and i am so incited by this thing so this is kind of a you know acknowledged as being uh you know a political propaganda technique that goes back a long time by the way hitler used it as a way to to use it as almost like a double bluff uh to blame

the jews um uh in in germany which was um uh you know an unfortunate kind of origin of the term but um uh but the term is used a lot now and saying like these sorts of events are ridiculous now what's gonna happen going forward i don't think big lies go away you can try and mute them on twitter and meet them on facebook or mute them on reddit but whether it's q anon or whatever is next this is becoming kind of a standard form now because of the way media is distributed anyone can say a big lie and it gets a lot of listeners and trump is totally culpable for that he made

some [ __ ] up he made a bunch of claims i mean if you guys haven't seen lindsey graham's speech yesterday it is absolutely worth watching that he gave late last night i saw it i saw it and he's like he's like i asked for the for the show me the eight the ten give me ten people that claim that they voted and they were under eighteen he's like they gave you one give me anyone that that uh was in prison or died and they gave me zero and he's like goes on and on for a couple minutes about how none of what was said about what happened in the election was true and it was all false

and he's like this is all just not true um and so i think trump is culpable for creating a falsehood and uh and uh you know having a megaphone and you know there were certainly of violence that is i think where the rubber is going to meet the road trump's going to be out of office in two weeks or less one way or the other do you uh and let me just take it to sacks um sacks i want to give you the time to respond to the the issue of uh the double standard uh in terms of race and blm and then also do you sacks if you're on biden's team coming in do you advise that you prosecute trump or investigate trump for this insurrection yes or no

okay so just to tie off on the the blm issue i i just you know i just normally don't think that race is the issue here um chamoth look i i don't know at the end of the day what the fatalities would have been if it had been a blm protest that that went awry but i will stick to what i said before which is i predict that you will see more prosecutions come out of this of the people who are involved i'm talking about the people who stormed the capitol then we saw from all the the blm protests over the summer i mean i don't remember any

prosecutions coming out of videotape of people being caught recorded looting and rioting and i predict you will see more here and again i think another difference again the extent there's a double standard uh i you know i remember a lot of left-wing news networks um calling the writing and looting the summer peaceful protests which they clearly were not you even had a book called in defense of looting and i don't hear anybody defending the storming of the capital nobody on the right so look to the extent there's a double standard i don't know that

it accrues to the the blm side of this but look i think that's kind of beside the point and not not the real issue here i mean jason to your question of is trump responsible yes i mean clearly 100 100 yes because he he is the one who who put forth this theory that the election was stolen and was constantly repeating it for the last two months two months ago right after the election there was an article published in the spectator called deplorables don't riot it was actually a pretty good op end it was written by a conservative and the conservative's point was

that you know all these windows and shops have been boarded up in anticipation of potential riding and looting with the election and all these conservatives are saying well who's do you know who are they afraid of you know not not us not the maga folks well then the theory was deplorables don't don't riot and and and the right was was proud of that two months ago and now we are seeing that well no the deplorables are rioting why is that what what changed over the last two months and what changed is the constant feeding to this group of people this idea starting

with trump but then perpetuated by you know different right-wing media organizations and other politicians who sort of were you know trying to curry favor with trump uh they were constantly pushing for this idea that the election was stolen so that these people on the mall who then riot and storm the capital believed that the election was being stolen from them so you know ultimately that responsibility goes is trump's so to be clear and reflecting back to you you're saying trump incited sedation is that the right word well sedition sedition doesn't seem like the wrong it doesn't seem like the exact right word to me i mean riot

it was it was certainly a riot now now did now look i mean you're talking about prosecuting a legal case uh you know if you want to look at the legal standard for incitement it has to be you know provoking people to take an imminent lawless act uh i think i think he lo if you want to see this mob as a gun i think he loaded the gun he pointed it in a certain direction but did he tell them to storm the capital no not specifically i think therefore it'd be a very hard case to prosecute but i think you know prosecuting him in a court of law is is sort of unnecessary and

redundant i mean i think that in the eyes of the public politically he has i think most people see that he's culpable and i even think of his political career i think he's i think he's disqualified himself from being uh a candidate you know at a national level again i mean if you look okay again just go back two months ago look at how much has changed two months ago just in the day or two after the election trump had narrowly lost but there was talk of him starting a new news network to rival fox there was talk about he could even be a candidate again in in 2024 it was not off the

table i think now it's it's clearly off the table and you've seen it it's partly because of the georgia runoffs which we should get to but again the republican candidates at least one of them had won that election two months ago and now they lost and that has a lot to do with trump's antics in the meantime of is just feeding this constant you know lie about the stolen election right i think there's a really important question about you know sorry but is it worth um prosecuting trump uh post fact um you know does that do more harm or good for for the country as a whole

certainly there will be a lot of people that would get great satisfaction of putting trump in prison a lot of people are calling for that but um we really do need to question the um you know the incredible divide in the nation and what's the best way to heal the divide the objective shouldn't be pursuing justice uh it should be about moving forward i'm not suggesting don't prosecute trump but i i think that it's worth it's worthy of noting that you know there is another way of framing this whole thing which is what's the best thing to do

going forward though on the flip side you could even make the case that one of the best things joe biden could do today or tomorrow is to announce a federal election uh review commission uh to actually look into wrongdoings at the state level with a 500 bipartisan yeah 100 yeah i mean it's a slam dunk case anyway if biden did that and he you know he basically embraced the the notion that a lot of folks are really angry about and said i'm listening to you i'm hearing you let me show you and at the same time they did not prosecute trump and you know let him go go off

into the distance and do his own thing maybe you start to kind of you know heal the rift a little bit but right now everyone's kind of inflamed and there is this like how do we prosecute him what do we do when he's you know do it you know and we're just continuing to kind of escalate the dialogue and increase the rift i just yeah so i look i think prosecuting trump at this point first of all legally that might be a difficult case to prove because of the need to prove that the um that he was trying to provoke uh an imminent lawless action

you know if he had been at the barricades you know pushing people forward yes but so i think legally it'd be a tough case and i think it would be it like you said it'd be unnecessarily uh divisive and partisan i don't know why we need to go there i mean at the end of the day any politicians stock and trade is their credibility and popularity and trump has fundamentally damaged the perception of him i think even among the right i have a huge issue with this and i'll tell you why it's because the folks that are now going to go to jail were instigated by this guy and the folks that were there in many ways were brought they were cajoled they were

instigated to travel from groomed to travel there to take the time out of their lives to basically then get fed this rhetoric and in a moment of just crazy mob like mentality to act out at the behest of the leader of the free world there has to be a consequence not just to those people because they in many ways are not the person to prosecute to the extent that you are going to put some of these people in jail which we look like it looks like we're going to and by the way let's be honest there is no inconceivable way that these people get charged with a misdemeanor that's not going

to stand right and the worst perpetrators of this when they get put in jail will get put in jail for five to ten years minimum and so what are we going to do when we look at ourselves in the eye and say these poor americans at the end of the day who were instigated by this guy and he yet again gets off scot-free while hundreds of americans who were basically in a peak of craziness fed by this guy does something and goes to jail and you have hundreds of lives and hundreds of families ruined even if we don't find a way to basically put trump in jail for this i can 100 guarantee you

i will bet a million bucks that now the southern district of new york gloves off every single state that can go after this guy gloves off and to the extent that joe biden had any incentive to basically like let this go away at the federal level gloves off in my opinion i really i really really need to say let's let's say that folks do go after trump what does that do if he gets put in jail or he you know gets uh there's some criminal proceeding brought against him what does that do to the 50 percent of the nation that truly support him and truly care about him i don't

you know i don't like like the balance of justice versus unification you know i think we're talking actually about 25 percent of the country i think i don't even think it sounds right or whatever it is like there's obviously a big voting block and a big block of the uh potential blockchain i think i think i think of the 70 million people that voted for donald trump i think there are half of them who would equally vote for a normal centrist candidate romney and nikki haley didn't necessarily believe in donald trump then i think there's the other 35 million and i do think that

there's a spectrum of those 35 and i think that you probably lost 10 or 15 million of them after the events of yesterday where they just threw their hands up in the air and said hey it would really only inflame 20 million is what you're saying correct and i think i agree with jamal right and those 20 million people are you know sad to say concentrated in about 10 states that don't functionally matter economically or otherwise um and so about the balance of justice versus unification certainly it sounds like you're saying ways heavily towards justice right like more more

folks will benefit from seeing him come to justice or would perceive justice then i think what it will allow i think it'll allow the republican party to recenter itself i think that's better for politics i think it's better for governance it's better for america i think it allows a lot of people to basically wake up out of this haze that they've been in four years and say wow wait a minute enough enough like i was on a really bad bender i did a couple things i really regret and i need to recenter myself how do you not find this turning into a tit for tat berlusconi italy brazil

israel kind of phenomenon where you know future leaders are then attacked and challenged and taken the best the best tweet i saw on this was this woman tweeted out that uh the following she said when the democrats lost in 2016 they knitted pink hats and donated to planned parenthood no they didn't no they didn't they invented a ridiculous russian conspiracy theory they david that like 10 people went to russia the russians no one went to jail you're like the last person you're like the last person who still believes in this well listen i still believe that they tried and i still believe i don't know that they succeeded but i think

mueller spent two years investigating this tens of millions of dollars 25 fbi and uh yeah those are all gop talking points the fact is manafort went to jail for something completely unrelated you must be the last person who still believes that trump won in 2016 because of russian interference i think that they i think he asked the ukraine for help and i think he asked the russians for help and i think that he would have gladly accepted the help now is it was it a a conspiracy no it wasn't a conspiracy never this is the problem with your russia talking point is that

you're trying to just say because he didn't get prosecuted which he's probably not going to get prosecuted for this either the guy was a serial offender okay and they were trying to get information from wikileaks and they were trying to get the the hacks and so i don't know why you can so clearly see what he's doing david when he incites this violence and then you don't see that he would he has no moral backbone or character and that he wouldn't accept foreign aid it's not that bastard here here's my view okay here's my view is that when you lose an election

as a candidate you have to look in the mirror and ask what you did wrong okay trump failed to do that two months ago instead of just taking the l and you know and he he could have blamed it on the fact that vaccine was one week late i mean there were there he you know instead of just accepting the loss he invented this conspiracy theory that the election was stolen and he's basically like freiburg said been pumping it month after month and you know his enablers you know have have perpetuated it until we had this you know total breakdown and storming of

the capital but again you know where was the democratic reassessment of why they lost in 2016 who on the democrat side looked in the mirror and said you know we shouldn't have lost that election you know what did we do wrong they didn't do that instead they blamed it all on russian interference or facebook you know all of a sudden facebook went from being a darling to being a scapegoat and there was uh russian ads being bought with rubles and tons of link forms confirmed done by the russians in order to uh ferment anti-hillary sentiment i mean no it actually happened it's true

it's true i don't know affect the election nobody could know that but it didn't yes we can because yeah it did it did some effort so now you're admitting there was russian interference so you were before saying there wasn't and now you're saying there was i'm talking about i'm talking about why somebody no no it's not because here here's the here's where you're being misleading is yes is it true that there was some fsb operative somewhere buying ads on facebook yes hundreds of them hundreds of them out of billions of impressions okay it was a microscopic

number of total impressions of the election and the people who actually looked at those ads thought they were absurd imagine some operative hold on let me finish my point imagine some operative in moscow trying to influence the american election by buying ads on facebook did they try yes look foreign intelligence services are trying all the time okay but was that they didn't try they did try yes okay and did trump and his family ask them no there was no help there's no proof of collusion there was no proof of collusion okay okay that's what we need to take

the meeting okay no that's what mueller he spent two years investigating it and found no collusion look so my point is again we're getting off on a rabbit hole here but my point was when when you as a candidate lose an election you have to take responsibility for that that was not done in 2016. it was not done certainly in 2020 by trump it is the problem with both our political parties that they would rather invent conspiracy theories and lies then acknowledge why people are rejecting them yeah i agree with this i i would say this but that is not the point

david you are right okay somewhere along the way we got stuck worrying about the pronouns that we use and which bathrooms should be or should not be transgendered while the american middle class was completely gutted from pillar to post that is what's created the boundary conditions for this every single time there's been an insurrection or an uprising or a revolution in america it has never been about ideology it has always been about economics always and economics is the tip of the spear in this country whether we like it or not it started with the boston tea party

you know it continued through the civil war it has always been about that topic so we all let it happen we all have a responsibility to fix it that though is a topic i think for another day because that's the grand arc of what we need to do in our generation and fix this inequality gap meanwhile we do have this tactical issue which is you have the leader of the free world in my opinion and i think in a lot of reasonable minded people's opinion instigating essentially at a minimum a riot and at the maximum some form of like treason it idiotic form of i don't i mean the problem is it's just it is just like it's just it's incomprehensible what it is

i've fallen on the side that we need to prosecute him now i was i was 50 50 on this but i'll tell you what's tipped me over is you know if we don't prosecute him there's this sort of like unfairness to it i think that's a very good point you made chamoth but i also think that he is go we need to wake people up from this fog they've been in to friedberg and i don't i think we have to free the the republican party to get back to some more version that is reasonable like you are sacks i would rather see the party the republican party has is is already rejecting trump so just look

at what's happened in the last 24 to 48 hours even after this storming of the capital okay you had republicans who who were just hours before objecting to the electors they basically were saying no i've changed my mind who is that lindsey graham but not ted cruz not that other kelly there are a few other ones who switched sides uh you had ex you had excellent speeches by lindsey graham and then romney i agree with that they spoke very very eloquently and just today elaine chao resigned as secretary transportation i think that's mostly significant she's david

she's a missionary party yeah look i think i think after georgia the republican party was already blamed trump for that and now after the storming of the capital they're ready to be done with him this idea that you need to prosecute trump to end his somehow end his relation with the republican party i think it will just backfire um i don't think that's what the point is i think the point is that nobody is above the law and when you when you lead you know what look the thing with the people that attended this rally is in any other situation and jason you said it earlier these are our veterans these are

the people that are like working good jobs they're trying to just keep america going they've always believed in american exceptionalism there was nothing wrong with that it was just perverted by this [ __ ] scumbag yep he is a complete piece of [ __ ] [ __ ] scumbag he's garbage and i think that's why you have to prosecute him i think you have to make an example of him i know that they with nixon they took a different approach but i just think he's too dangerous to leave unprosecuted because every time he has some bad behavior whether it was the ukraine

whether it's you know russian we can debate what level they wanted to engage with the russians or you know in the case of this uh riotous behavior you know i think he's not gonna stop that's the thing that i fear is i don't think he's gonna i would rather i would rather take every single person arrested and give them zero days in jail and add it all up and give it to trump well i i wouldn't i mean i i agree with you to to some degree that they were victims of this two-month propaganda campaign to convince uh the right that this election was stolen i think a lot of those

people who are storming the capital they were there not to steal an election because they were thought they were there to prevent the ceiling election and so yes they they have been duped by a lot of people including you know leading with with trump but including a lot of other people who should have known better uh but but that being said they did make the decision to hop the barricades smash the windows go into the capital there's some personal responsibility absolutely yeah we can't that's the tragedy of this woman like but let's talk about this woman for a

second and i think it's important to look at this specific case this is a person who's a veteran and she was inside the halls already and was trying to breach another area and she was just shot dead by secret service they might have been protecting the vp they might have been protecting nancy pelosi or mitch mcconnell who knows um but they shot her dead yeah i saw it on video i mean it's on video it's unbelievable and it i mean coming from a law enforcement family i can tell you that's a clean shooting if she was breaching and they told her do not come in here we're going to shoot you and they

were protected the secret service is protecting an asset they're allowed to shoot you like you can't jump that and she's a military vet she's from the air force i mean what is in her mind how wound up was she by trump and by this propaganda that when they told her do not breach the second door inside by the way you just said the key word you cannot be spun up in all of this by giuliani he's a [ __ ] [ __ ] you know he can barely like not wet his pants yeah you know you're not going to get spun up by sidney powell the only person that can really catalyze this is the person that has

the respect that comes with sitting in the seat that's called the presidency of the united states and he's the only one he's the only one we all know this because if giuliani was running this rally and said let's go storm the capital nobody would have done it we all know this look yeah what do you think about this woman david like think about the psychology of this person for a second the humanity of it you know i'll say something i think um man politics is um isn't the problem it's kind of a manifestation of the problem if you think about how crazy it is that i posted a tweet about this the other day because i've been

thinking about it a lot i think it's so crazy that you can show people a tv ad or a facebook ad and get them to change their mind on what to vote like um people are kind of shown stuff and the bigger problem is this kind of reductionism that's um that's kind of enveloped all of this you know if you go back a hundred years i guarantee you people were having deeper more civil conversations about differences of opinion and ways to govern and um and and laws uh to govern us and i think like you know it's so easy to put a 30-second kind of reductionist ad in front

of someone uh incite their kind of amygdala to to respond and change their mind about something or push them in some direction and i think that's the bigger issue with like what's been going on is people are kind of being pushed all the way to one side or pushed all the way to the other side um through this you know this this very kind of simple process there is no dialogue to decide what candidate to vote for or dialogue to decide um what path to take it's it's all insidious like lock his ass up you know kill them like everything has become extremely binary um and the gray scale

is really the reality and unfortunately we've kind of really hurt ourselves in this tribalism over objectivism kind of approach to how we uh talk as a society and how we debate and as a result people are pushed over the edge and i think this is a manifestation of that broader problem which i think is probably linked to the internet and short attention spans well this is going also why uh i think the gop has just been completely you know but it's not just the gop dominated now that what i'm saying they're all they they which i think is a good segue into georgia but you can share the same about aoc

and you could say that aoc is doing the same to the democratic party and they're they're you know equally frustrated with this extremist point of view or elizabeth warren or bernie sanders and they're you know none of them got the nomination though right none of but they could have and they were close and it was like hey look give everyone a million dollars okay great like and tax the rich 90 great like it's easy to say and and my point is by the way i think the root of a lot of this is um is people are programmed to be unhappy

right that's how you instigate people to take action the the bottom 10 percent of americans make more money and have a better position in life than the top 10 percent of kenyans and it's an incredible statistic if you think about it go to dollarstreak.org or dollarspeak.com and you can actually play around and see what different people live like around the world yet in the us we are told at every strata whether you're wealthy or or not wealthy relative to others in the united states that you should be better off and it is um you know happiness is the difference

between expectation and outcome and everyone's been set an expectation beyond what they currently have and as a result through programmatic work that is done on people in the united states we are being told you should be unhappy oh and by the way here's the short-term solution to resolve it and it's driving an incredible amount of um of behavioral shift and it really threatens democracy as we saw this week and you guys will remember my my big loser for the political loser for 2020 was the american uh democratic institution and i think we saw that uh this week

on the on the heels of that can i ask you guys what you think of this basically pelosi has told pence you have to invoke the 25th amendment or they're going to take up impeachment what do you guys think about that i think it's the right thing to do how do you do i think they have to be there has to be a backstop against you what do you mean you could do something crazy you could still well here's the thing i i i tweeted at free bahar about this if you are impeached uh successfully you can't run again um so i think that this is a um a way to put the nail in the coffin of trump even having the ability to run in 2024 which i think

is why the democrats are on the right side of history on this one that's my personality maybe they sign a non-prosecution agreement with him if he resigns and that that's kind of the final you know i mean that's what i would like to see but jason why can't you trust voters to make the right decision in 2024 i i um do i trust voters i it's not about trusting the voters it's more about do i think there should be ramifications for somebody's behavior that's that's my fear is that if he keeps getting away with stuff he could do something even more violent or dangerous as chamod said earlier

it's a miracle that a hundred people weren't shot dead and this wasn't a firefight i mean if somebody takes out a gun at any moment during that and people start shooting we could have hundreds of people americans dead not just the four who died and i think trump is absolutely capable of doing something in the last 14 days if he did this 15 days out why wouldn't he do something else seven days out or three days out he's a maniac i mean this is insane deranged criminal lunatic behavior it's completely possible that he could do something more dangerous in the last 14

days i know that that sounds crazy but look at what we saw yesterday i think i i think there is like a white knuckle element to the next two weeks i think we're all kind of white knuckling it to you know to see what's gonna happen uh we have 300 hours to go till biden has sworn in and i've got to admit like i i'm counting down the hours you know it's too insane nobody wants everything everybody's feeling everybody's feeling that um that being said i i just think that i'm more on on fr freeberg's point of view on this that we have this insane level of partisan warfare

in the us it's gone to like a whole another level and i just and and and trump has definitely made it worse and the storming of the capital is the you know is the zenith of it it's the apex but look the other side's been doing it too and the question is just how we de-escalate this insane person in the de-escalation chamath isn't biden like being elected i think it is yeah i think it is it's like we picked the most boring candidate who has the most milk toast middle of the road approach who who lindsey graham likes and who travel the world with i mean

lady g loves him well to the extent that biden has a mandate this is it i mean and he talked about it in his victory speech that night which was which was was quite good it's about bringing people together um now look i mean the the the issue one of the issues is you can't ignore the fact that democrats for the last four years have waged this insane partisan war against trump i mean let's not even go into the merits but you had this two-year mueller witch-hunt you then had this uh impeachment uh you know crusade which look if there was a lot of validity to the

impeachment why wasn't it used as a campaign issue last year i just think everybody knows let me ask you a question everybody knows that was hyper partisan and and my point is that yeah look i mean i think it's a good thing if biden can de-escalate things that that is that is i think why he won the election is that he was seen as more of a sane alternative let me ask you a question saks do you think it would have been do you think if trump had been impeached for the ukraine uh interference and pence had taken over we would not have seen what

we were seeing yesterday and the country would have been further along to healing uh so you know no i mean pence would not have invited or asked all of his supporters to come to the capitol to oppose the accounting the the counting of the electors i look that was a unique trump thing for you know he could not accept the loss and had to keep pushing and pushing and pushing on this idea that he that the election was stolen okay so it would have been a good idea no no it wouldn't no it wouldn't because if you had if you had impeached trump no well first of all he

was impeached okay but if you had voted for victim if you had removed him from office the senate had voted to convict over a phone call okay and look i'm not defending the phone call i'm not saying the phone call was perfect okay i know trump says it was perfect it was not a perfect phone call but you can't remove a sitting president for that okay look it was unseemly or whatever i think we all know what he was trying to do in that phone call but you can't remove a sitting president over that that was hyper partisan and so no the country would be much further apart today if you had

done that and and so the question now is well how do you bring it back together and i think i understand where where where tamatha's coming from i think that trump deserves morally culpably uh i think he he has a repudiation some repudiation but but i don't believe in locking him up or or prosecuting him that's only going to make things much more crime for this crime we we don't even know what else is out there i mean i think yeah there's other issues out there let's talk about georgia let's let's i think we've nailed the trump i mean unless anybody really feels like continuing to talk stacy abrams is a genius i mean my

gosh she should be in charge of everything yeah can we get her on the vaccine rollout well trump that's incredible it's incredible stacey abbas did an incredible job on the democratic side mobilizing turnout um but the reason why the republicans lost georgia is frankly trump i mean trump costs them georgia two months ago purdue beat ossoff in that election he won he won he won and and he's beaten him before i think he is uh i mean he's not the most wonderful candidate but i think he is a better candidate and he lost because of these antics over the last two

months culminating in that insane phone call that trump had with the georgia securities we talked about rather right i mean should he get you to fight for that sacks can't you just find me 11 000 votes look i i just think you know which one is more prosecutable sending people to the capitol or asking them and begging them to find him eleven thousand votes which one is more prosecutable to you saks since you're gonna be framing us let's wait jason hold on let's let's move on let's move away from the whole trump goes to jail for a second i just wanna i think it's important to talk

about georgia because i think david you're going to make a point yeah exactly i mean look i think we're getting hung up too much on the legalities and let's just talk about what's right and wrong you know which we is what we can agree on and let you know lawyers and prosecutors figure out the legalities um ramesh panuru from national view had a great quote about georgia he said that purdue and loffler could have survived any two of these three being unimpressive candidates georgia shifting purple and trump being a maniac and unfortunately you had three

out of three and that's why they lost if uh it was a great is a great quote uh you know you had the raffles burger call you know can't you just find the 11 000 votes the day before the election or two days for the election i mean that had to push swing voters and undecideds to the democrats and the other thing is that purdue and loffler weren't able to make the best argument that they had which is if you vote for us you end up with split you you prevent the democrats from having all the power in washington so unless you want to give all the power in washington to a

single party you need to vote for us that was the best argument for voting for them because there's a lot of people in this country who believe in splitting their ticket because they don't trust either party which is kind of where i'm at um but they were unable to make that argument effectively because trump was still hanging on to the idea that he was going to be president no i think david i honestly i think this comes down to the intelligence of the candidates kelly lofter is a [ __ ] she's an idiot david perdue's a good old boy he's an idiot they're

just stupid this actually speaks to a bigger problem which is the republicans could do so much better if they could actually find younger more vibrant intelligent people and instead they find these [ __ ] morons i don't know where they find them but you know they pulled kelly loffler out of some like backstage dallas beauty pageant and just kind of like fluffed her up and tried to get her to run she's a [ __ ] loffler loffler was a mistake loffler wasn't a mistake [ __ ] idiot did you read the story about her with the wnba but i mean george i mean it's unbelievable georgia

georgia is full of so many incredible politicians and they found that idiot that that was a huge mistake if they just voted or yeah i mean the governor made a huge mistake they put they appointed her to the last two months uh i so i agree that she's a particularly weak candidate but the republicans only needed one of these two elections and purdue had beaten assaf before i agree with you he's not necessarily the greatest candidate of all time but he has proved better than ossoff in the past including november and the reason why he lost two months later is because what's transpired in the last two months biden has acted presidential and trump has

done what he's done and that that made all the difference and and that by the way is why you're seeing the republicans breaking from trump they were already on their way to breaking with him and then you had this david story of the capital what are the implications for josh hawley and ted cruz i i think i think this was a blow to them because i think that what they were doing in terms of uh opposing the the the electors uh everybody knew it was sort of cynical and theater it was theater it was performative theater designed to curry favor with trump so that he might endorse them

in 2024 for the nomination and it was it was it was optionistic and the problem is it backfired horribly and you know people now see it for what it was and so yeah i think it's gonna ultimately they tried to do something optionistic that they thought would help them politically and i think it's gonna hurt them but wait i have to ask you guys do you guys know the backstory of loffler and the atlantic dream the wnba team it's tears honestly jason i'm going to get so angry because she is just a complete piece of [ __ ] please don't i i'm you can bring it up i i think she just

don't think saks and friberg are aware of this but i think she's a complete piece of [ __ ] she basically tells the story it's basically she was anti-blm and she was writing letters to the nba wnba to not allow the players to to be vocal about black lives matter with the you know after the killing of um the murder of george floyd and uh so what the team did if you look at that story is they backed warnock uh they got on the call with him they refused to say her name and uh they rallied the support of warnock uh who ultimately uh beat her and they refused

to say her name i just ever again if you the players are saying if you want to see courage the women that play in the wnba are some of the most incredible people yes these these are women that have basically stopped their athletic career stopped fame you know stopped all of the attention in some cases stopped fortunes to work on behalf of criminal justice reform to basically overturn you know uh unjust convictions these women are incredible and then to be suppressed to be able to say what was on their mind kelly loffler is a piece of [ __ ] and they basically wore these

vote warnock t-shirts every day at every game i mean imagine and then now they're i think going to be forced to go to those women yeah i give them uh sue bird i think is the uh was the leader of the whole movement yeah bravo to her all right moving on from politics i think we have to talk freeberg about the deployment of the vaccine um i i did a quick poll on twitter and twitter and the american people have asked that friedberg the queen of quinoa be responsible for the vaccine distribution going forward really i'm in let's do it uh i would what did you

i would get that vaccine into everyone's arms in 75 days i mean it was you would be such a stone cold yeah that would be amazing yeah i don't know free freebird what would you do differently and maybe you could describe you know we were supposed to be at a million a day we're at 350 trending towards 400. we did 1.5 million in 72 hours according to fauci at one point uh right after the new year so we're kind of like halfway where we need to be what would you do differently because the rollout seems we have more than 50 percent are on the shelves still in arms it is a wartime

scenario when war is happening you don't go home at 5 00 p.m and wake up at 9 00 a.m and clock out for an hour for lunch and you know you don't uh oh well don't run too fast you know you might trip you don't do any of that we've created incredible disincentives in the system by in fact cuomo put out a million dollar fine if uh if you get your vaccine out of line i mean think about the disincentive that creates now people are more scared about giving the vaccine to the wrong person then they are incentivized to give the vaccine to the right person and the reality is this is a group game this isn't an individual game it's not about who

gets vaccinated first and you'll live and you'll die we all need to get vaccinated as a group so that we all have immunity so that this virus stops spreading it doesn't matter if you're individually vaccinated it matters if we're all vaccinated because that's the only way we're all going to get out of the economic slump that is truly damaging this country right now and so the first step is create a military style operation figure out how many feet on the ground you know it's all a rate based system right how many are you running per day and then how do you achieve that objective

and over time you have your target rate per day you would scale it up over 75 days or whatever your rollout time frame needs to be and you would say this is how we're going to get there we need this number of people giving shots this many minutes apart and then you go figure out where you're going to give the shots and who's going to give them get the vaccines to where they need to get to take over all the gymnasiums and all the stadiums and all the open sports facilities around the country people can drive up stand in line get a freaking shot and 65 year olds get priority for

the first 30 days and then after 30 days your 65 and over crowd loses their priority and it's open season for who wants to get a shot you stand in line you get a shot walk in you got 3.8 million nurses in the united states you go contract 500 000 of them you give them a huge friggin one-time bonus to come and run this program you run 24-hour shifts in the gymnasiums around the country people come in they get shots they get out takes three minutes if you're feeling weird if you have risk of allergies you go sit in the other room you wait for two hours and there's a bunch of

roaming nurses keep an eye on you and you get this thing done that's it this is not that complicated and we can leverage the national guard to create the infrastructure to support these lines and get these things done we can go recruit there are plenty of nurses associations you can go people can work overnight shifts and get paid triple overtime get extra bonuses for doing this is a great way to kind of create an economic stimulus around this we can get this entire country vaccinated in 90 days and the way that uh israel is doing it is a great model

you know when they run out describe that yeah so at the end of the day if uh you know when you open when you take these things out of deep freeze you're at risk of them spoiling at that point because the mrna is very um you know can break and so it needs to be really cold and then you gotta give the vaccine very quickly otherwise the mrna can degrade and it's not effective and you have to defrost it in order to give it yes you defrost it then it's sitting there now you got to give it within a couple hours and if you've got extra juices complicated what they're doing in israel

is they're looking outside they grab the pizza guy that's on the bicycle truck on the bicycle cruising by they're like do you want a shot come on in they give them a shot they grab the next guy you do not need to track everyone that gets a shot you do not need everyone to show their id to get a shot you do not need to x y and z all the disincentives that create friction in the system of rolling out the vaccine need to be completely eliminated there's no qualifying criteria except maybe being 65 and over for the first 30 days and we've prioritized politics um over health and

safety we have made it the case that the teachers should get the shot first because the teachers unions created an uproar in california and said they're not going to go to work unless they so now the teachers are going to get it and the essential workers are going to get it which are people that are working in stores and warehouses and other stuff and meanwhile the people that can actually die from this 15 likelihood of death if you're over 85 are not getting it because they're not technically an essential worker so the prioritization where we've tried to create

these artificial politically motivated systems for defining who gets the vaccine and who doesn't is absolutely killing us and literally killing us 4 000 people died yesterday in the united states and so the system has [ __ ] up the incentives we've and don't bleep that out because that's exactly what it is the disincentives we've created are destroying um the rollout um the uh the governor's getting involved in creating models of prioritization that are politically motivated are killing us and and we should centrally plan this thing ward production act make a [ __ ] ton of the

stuff grab it all get a hundred million doses distributed into gymnasiums around the country get the nurses in there get the national guard it should have been federal i mean that's the key this should have been effort central planning is sometimes needed to get [ __ ] done we did it with the war production board during world war ii we did it with the manhattan project we there have been countless examples where we've had to centralize planning for a massive short-term event and this is one of those events and this needs to be um prioritized and organized centrally and it

needs to have the right-minded people on this not kind of people that are you know political operatives and not people that are working nine to five um well the good news is this is this is a war and we need to go win the [ __ ] war i mean trump trump has time he said he's at camp david this weekend so i think he can put some attention to it saks can i ask a question freeburg so you know uh what do you think about just using markets to distribute the vaccine it's a great idea i think you know you have to get the incentive such that kind based systems

are the incentive right because the objective here is to get as many people vaccinated as quickly as possible so take that being your objective and then figure out look you guys are going to get a thousand dollars per person vaccinated in the first 15 days and then you're going to get 500 and then you know whatever the transition is and then anyone can sign up to buy doses at a at a cost so they they have skin in the game right that's an alternative so let walgreens and cvs buy 50 million doses and then they're incentivized to get them rolled out as quickly as possible let them do

the work sure um and frankly if a few people have anaphylactic reactions across the country that's just the reality in war you have some casualties this can't be perfect it has to be good enough to win the war um well by the way when somebody goes into anaphylactic shock just to clarify that yeah you get an epi shot it's not fatal if you have an epipen that's right and so um so you know when you get a uh when you get a um uh you know a vaccine if you get one of these vaccines 40 to 60 percent of people are gonna have some sort of reaction you can have a fever because these are

these produce a ton of proteins in your body relative to what you would normally you know kind of experience with it with a dead vaccine there's a lot of vaccines in your body there's a lot of protein in your body your body reacts to get rid of that protein you produce all these antibodies very quickly so you end up having a fever you end up having some some allergic response or headaches or flushing or whatever so everyone's going to have a lot of people are going to have some sort of thing so one of the concerns is they want to have nurses available and they want to have this

feel like a controlled medical environment but again the reality is we have to sack it up we have to accept the fact that people are going to be uncomfortable it is not going to be an easy simple vaccine like you get the flu vaccine at walgreens it's going to be a little bit uncomfortable you may not have five or six nurses surrounding you and getting all the tlc that americans have become used to getting every time we you know brush our freaking teeth and uh and we're gonna have some people going to anaphylactic shock and they're gonna get epipen shots and and you know

um and we shouldn't be charging 1500 for epipen shots that's another you know important point but i think the market based model could work as well so hasn't israel done this right i mean israel they moved the old people to the front of the line but anybody can get in line if they've got extra doses that day they just keep sticking people they keep jabbing people until they run out all day long till they run out that's right and so they're probably at 20 of the population by now yeah so i i'm sure we all agree with everything you're saying it speaks to an enormous amount of

political incompetence i mean it's really really just unbelievable why we just don't have smarter people in charge of these things but zach i just want to ask you because you know there is the conservative argument on this which is um you know states the federal government shouldn't be doing everything and states need to kind of manage their populace and manage you know what what goes on locally you know what is the conservative i'm not asking you this and i'm not attacking you i'm just asking like what is the conservative argument for not doing central planning and central um

organization around vaccine distribution and delegating it to states and you know are are there you know do you think that there's a case against um you know for that that's pretty strong in within the republican party and within kind of conservative rights i i i i think if there's a conservative point of view on this it would just be that let markets distribute the vaccine they'll do a much better job i don't you know i think whether it's federal or state the question is who's more incompetent and i'm not really sure um i mean i i think the problem right now is that when you make vaccine distribution fundamentally

political then the debate becomes about exactly who's what is your position going to be exactly in line as opposed to just running the most number of people through the process as quickly as possible we're getting ourselves so twisted up in knots over making sure that the exact right person is in line that we're having you know vaccine go to waste yeah just to put that in context 21 million plus doses have been distributed in the united states 5.9 have made their way into people's arms in other words there are 15 millions over 75 percent of doses have not gone in people's arms and in california we have distributed 5.85

of the population's vaccines but we've only put 1.3 in people's arms so we are literally uh 4x where we should be we're at 25 of where we should be it is absolutely unbelievable that this is happening and if the government if the government's if the government stopped trying to do anything except you know look it it did operation warp speed that actually did help get vaccines done faster but if you just that was just money to your point sacks all they did was create a market where they basically pre-bought all the vaccines whether or not they were going to work

and then funded the market to go and produce them early that's all that it was so to your point that operation warp speed for everyone thinking it's a massive centrally controlled effort it was a market-based incentive they put it wasn't the manhattan project is what you're saying they put up a couple of millions yeah they put up a couple billion dollars and said to all these pharma companies go produce the vaccine and if it works we'll buy them if it doesn't work throw them away but let's get production going and that was it can i can i use this as a segue like

i mean what we're seeing is sort of we have a bunch of elected officials we give them you know an enormous amount of responsibility they also get this implied power and then you just you see sometimes in these acute moments they're totally derelict then i just want to move off of vaccines for a second then you get an elected official who is not acutely incompetent but it seems broadly grossly and consistently incompetent and i want to talk about chessa boudin and i i want to use sax's article which to be very honest david was probably one of the most incredibly

well-written things well done you have ever created i don't know jason do we have show notes can we put it in we'll put it in the show notes yeah we'll put a link in the show notes um it is so [ __ ] good what you wrote if everybody folks who are listening have a chance to read david's killer d.a the killer d.a um but it basically you know starts with a profile of this young woman seemed like an incredible woman that was killed by this uh drunk driver uh but anyways david do you want to talk about it yeah i mean so for the last with let's say for the last couple of months

i've been following the san francisco uh a couple of san francisco police department accounts on twitter and i was noticing these extraordinary tweets which are getting retweeted a lot about how they kept uh arresting and then having to let go of all these criminals who are committing burglaries and other crimes and you could see the frustration of the police department boiling off these tweets and you know basically they are sub-tweeting this new district attorney that we've had chase of boudin who was elected uh he's been in office about a year he's elected the end of

2019 and so i started doing a little bit of research and then we had this horrible new year's eve killing of this you know uh wonderful young woman uh hannah abe who came to america from japan for college and stayed here for work she was just 27 years old she gets killed by uh by by a a criminal someone who was released who was paroled by chase abudeen uh back in april he had been in jail for armed robbery uh chase uh released him as part of a plea bargain and then he was arrested five more times for stealing cars and other crimes most recently

two weeks ago and the d.a refused to press charges and that that's the reason he was out on new year's eve he stole a car and then there was this hit-and-run where he killed hannah and another woman and so you know i had already been noticing this issue and so i started doing some some research and i have a research assistant helping me with this is the only way i could put something like this together and we went pretty deep and we realized that the death of of hannah wasn't just an accident or an act of negligence by this d.a it was part

of an overall philosophy of decarceration that he has but he his his background is very interesting he was a child of parents who were in the weather underground who when he was just a baby committed armed robbery and were part of the murder which is david yeah david say the words they were domestic terrorists yeah they were they were that's right they were domestic terrorists uh they participated in an armed robbery against the brinks truck which is these were domestic terrorists that were competent when compared to what we saw yesterday in the capital like these are

highly capable domestic terrorists to be clear i don't know i don't know how capable they were their their robbery results in the death of two police officers and a brinks guard and they were put in prison his mother spent 20 years in prison she's now released her his father is still in prison uh for almost 40 40 years and he's described in interviews how his earliest memories are visiting his parents in prison and how this shaped his entire political outlook and he became a public defender which i think was a pretty good place for him i think if i

were an indigent you know criminal defendant i would want someone like chase of beauty on my side and but the problem is he ran for district attorney and he simply doesn't believe in prosecuting huge numbers of crimes uh you know certainly property crimes burglary shoplifting vandalism and those crimes have absolutely spiked in the city you know a 45 increase in burglaries in one year 35 percent increase in stolen cars 30 increase in homicides crimes are through the roof because he simply doesn't believe in putting people in jail well you

know can i just say this can i tell you sorry let me just uh point out there's a there's a little bit of a history to um to this notion that da's should change the criminal justice system there's a ted talk uh by a guy named adam faw sex i don't know if you've seen it or if any of you guys have watched it i i i was at the ted conference the year that he spoke but this guy um basically thought you know he made the case that it is the role and the opportunity for the district attorney for the prosecutor to change the criminal justice system from the prosecutorial side that you can

um you know kind of demotivate jail and and and other kind of um you know mechanisms of punishment uh and and push for uh for a rehabilitation program as an alternative and that the district attorneys can take this this roll on of changing the criminal justice system and it created a little bit of a mini movement and there was a lot of attention and follow-up after he gave his ted talk and i think san francisco in large part picked up on the uh the momentum coming out of this and other similar sort of stories about the d.a can really change the criminal justice system

and chesapeake really kind of capitalized on it in principle a lot of people are motivated from a good place when they elected him which is it is unfortunate a lot of people get trapped in a life of crime and the fact that they're in and out of prison is a result of the fact that they're put into the criminal justice system in the first place and parole is really harsh on people and all these other reasons why people's lives are ruined for simple mistakes and if they get an opportunity in life they can fix themselves and they can come out um in a better place

so there is a bit of an origin story it's not just like san francisco said let's get an anarchist to brda and destroy the world and kill us all like i think it came from a good and true place where this all kind of originated but obviously the experiment has gone severely awry in san francisco and his particular methods uh and his particular actions have certainly caused far more harm than anyone has seen any good as that's what we pointed out they've started a recall effort for him too well i think that i think the danger is not that you have um an enlightened political philosophy

i think that's actually quite great then that we can experiment i think the danger is both on the left and on the right where people cathartically deal with childhood trauma through their job and you know i don't know what jessa boudin has gone through and i feel very bad that he had an incredibly hard life um or complicated or maybe not i don't even know but i wouldn't want to know that he's trying to deal with his own experiences through his job because that's not his job meaning you know you don't want an activist d.a i think you want a d.a that's enforcing the laws and what

you do want is you want to elect politicians who change the laws to reflect our values yeah that would be a better through line i think and and really i mean if you look at what's happening in san francisco i think we've conflated income inequality which people in san francisco are very tuned into with essentially junkies people who are addicted to incredibly hardcore drugs that are very hard to get off of and we've had more deaths from overdoses of fentanyl than we've had from kovid by a magnitude of four or five i mean it is bedlam on the streets of san francisco and if you don't enforce

a basic rule of law what happens is the price of drugs gets cheaper more available more people try them more people get addicted and then more people come from other places because they know you have the lowest price on drugs and the price of drugs is inversely correlated with prosecution of drug crimes so prosecution of crime so this is why san francisco is spiraling and most drugs are purchased from criminal funds so you know criminal activity goes up to fund the drug purchasing so that that's the vicious cycle that's driving san francisco and there's a recall going on and

then in related news gavin newsom is now up to a million signatures in his recall which i think is two-thirds of the way there yeah they have until mid or late february they're going to get the votes and i think i think the question you know friedrich and i talked about this just on a phone call he and i caught up a couple days ago i think it is time guys for us to find an incredibly centrist thoughtful candidate and put them into the recall race um against uh newsome burke had the best idea which was kim kardashian which i think is incredible because she is very smart

she's very likable she's got enormous distribution she's like uh she's about to become a lawyer you know that'll be the amazing the best platform for kardashian to run for president look it's pretty clear you know recognition influence fame is what gets people elected you know not the best policy and not the greatest experience from jesse ventura to arnold schwarzenegger to donald trump robert ronald reagan i mean these are celebrities who i would argue in the case of jesse ventura arnold schwarzenegger or maybe even donald trump as well their celebrity was kind of you know it had hit

it's it's it's media-driven apex and and this was a second act and you know perhaps someone like that is a great fit here uh kim kardashian really fits the bill but um uh you know i that's just a shot in the dark but i do think someone like that needs to go up because if you put politician up again it's another one of these rolling events and for uh you know for the populist to kind of really find appeal it has to be a recognized person you know broadly recognized and liked person um governorjason.com i'm not ready to run for political office i'm 50 and when i'm 60 i would consider it actually but not right now i wonder what i've got to hop to i think

we all got to hop but i was going to say one thing which is the beginning of today's podcast was probably the punchiest it's ever been and i think it just speaks to the fact that there was so the bar was so high for trump to have done something that would have actually gotten us to actually argue and interrupt each other you know because we've been so incredibly like loving and protective of each other for four years on this topic but it literally took an armed insurrection for us to finalize the these well i mean i think it's good for people to see sacks maybe and i or chamoth and sax or

whoever disagree on some of these cases or friberg you know doesn't believe in prosecuting trump i think we actually had a split ticket there where saxon freeberg felt like we shouldn't prosecute trump and chamoth and i were in the prosecute trump one but i think we're all struggling with these issues all americans are struggling with these issues of how do you deal with a black swan event i think that's what's so unique about trump is and i think david you could speak to this is i don't think the system was designed for his level of crazy right like our system is based on norms

and traditions and trust just like venture investing is and we see this in venture investing some founder goes off the jumps the fence and all of a sudden you know yeah i mean we still i would say our system performed pretty well in terms of being stress tested and well look we still got two more weeks you know i think we're all kind of we're all kind of white knuckling it right now yeah yeah hopefully nothing else happens but but look if if trump's goal was a coup you know i think it's a strong word but if it like it totally failed i mean he didn't come close to

no uh to succeeding in a coup um the opposite in fact the opposite he again we talked about how i think his he destroyed his popularity over the last two months he he impacted his earnings by negative two billion dollars yeah so uh but but but you know but to this point about us agreeing or disagreeing you know i saw a whole bunch of uh fans of the pod like at mentioning me saying i wonder what saks is gonna say about this i don't know what like yeah and i'm kind of like like what do they think i'm gonna say like they think i'm gonna be supportive of this i mean you know like i i i think somehow you jason you've programmed the

viewers that i like i'm somehow like the the trump the trump guy uh you know because you're always trolling me as the trump supporter i mean i i would believe that russia was a hoax and that would have been treated the same climbing up those steps we all know that's not true some of these are self-inflicted wounds of your own gonna take some ownership there boys boys i gotta hop okay i love you very much happy new year happy new year our best i will say one thing before we meet next time i guarantee you some highly unexpected and highly

impactful thing will occur please know can we get back to talking about spax or the bachelor we didn't even even talk about uh my spac today oh yeah yeah anyway okay give it a plug go ahead and snap no i mean just explain to people he doesn't need to plug it double today it's insane all right we'll explain why poe ipoe is merging with sofi um it's an incredible company led by an incredible ceo anthony noto um you can read a little one pager on my website but um anyways guys more importantly to all the listeners out there happy new year to all of you guys let's make 2021

kick ass yep um i love you guys you i miss you i'll see you guys soon play poker soon oh look there's somebody yeah i got it interrupted i got to go all right we'll see you all i got introduced next time check us out young spielberg take us out young spielberg to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it we should all just get a room and just have one big huge orgy because they're all just useless it's like it's like sexual tension that they just we need to get back i'm going on