E18: Inauguration talk, breaking down the $1.9T stimulus, the case for recalling Gavin Newsom & more

hey everybody it's me jason calacanis welcome welcome hey everybody it's me jason thank god trump's out i hate trump and i love myself and they've just gone crazy everybody happy days over here again champagne cottage bottles popping both again happy days are here again yay sax is so happy trump's out of office he gave an amazing speech about how great biden's inauguration was welcome to the all-in podcast oh my gosh with me today in our post inauguration after glow is the dictator the queen of quinoa david friedenberg and riding the blue wave diving in no more red pills the blue wave is david

rain man sax is with us david how did it feel to watch biden's inauguration speech which you said hit all the notes and i see you wearing blue today let me have a sip of my woof click oh and tell us you've got the blue jacket the blue shirt and the blue headset on you've ridden the blue wave tell us how you feel with biden in office i'm going to drink my viv jason i'm just happy to see that uh that you're happy ah and uh it's it's does this mean does this mean that i that uh your trump derangement is over you're uh you've gone uh cold turkey you're on the wagon and uh

yeah i'm just happy i'm just happy to have my friend back and uh not have you part of this uh this trump derangement zombie horde that uh that you've been in for the last few years i uh i'll tell you two quick stories um the first one turned out not to be true but there was a new york times alert that came out this weekend saying that um they were gonna lift the travel plan and um for uh for a moment i was like i i was a i was a little in shock and you know my my i'm canadian my family's in canada i haven't seen them in a year my mom is 80 years old i haven't seen her in a year um and then the second was on the day the inauguration biden signed an eo um i guess that that you know starts to get basically um create a path to citizenship and there are um you know two women

in my life who i i think are just lovely lovely people who i've never been able to hire and uh and now this gives us a path to hire them and compensate them and the way that we wanted to and so in in these moments i started crying and uh i i've probably had three or four moments and i realized like holy [ __ ] i have had so much pent-up emotion waiting for honestly just like a normal average day um and like simple humane good things and i'm not i'm not trying to sort of jump on the biden bandwagon i think that he's got a lot of work to do but but i i do think that just at a level simple basic level of humanity it was a different it was a big sea change how did you take it freeburg i'm curious did you cry as well

i observed the inauguration it was interesting i didn't upgrade your firmware sorry we were supposed to push the two david firmwares for the ability to cry but did you feel any emotion of the three emotions we've given you in your programming did any of them move at all i don't remember i mean i don't remember the origin of my non-emotional um uh characterization uh jason but um yeah i think it's just based on every interaction we've ever had with you but continue right i guess that makes sense so um i feel like the biden um the biden moment uh on on inauguration day um it really did feel like a sigh of relief because so

much of trump love him or hate him has been driven by a degree of tension right i mean he came in uh to office on the premise that he was going to drain the swamp i mean that's kind of a very kind of active um you know position he's going to go in he's going to change things and and i think you know the biden tone is like let's take it down a notch let's all take a deep breath and i feel like that that generated a collective side relief i'll also say that i watch that with the eyes of someone who voted for trump um i didn't vote for trump uh but um i don't think i voted this year uh i can't remember it was in the middle of pandemic but um i basically feel like there's a lot of folks it's easy to say let's unite the country um when you're on the winning side and when you're not and you're sitting there and your guy

got kicked out of office and your guy claimed that he got kicked out because of fraudulent activity and you're one of the 46 percent of americans that are already disapproving of biden's performance in his first two days of office uh you don't look at that as a moment of relief you don't look at that as a moment of um of respite and i feel like there's a little bit of a missed point of view in terms of how we're all covering it and talking about it it certainly feels good to take the tension down and take take a deep breath and have leadership not be putting the tension out there but there's a lot of anger and disappointment still festering out there and i think we need to be very cognizant of why and what we can do

and it would have been nice to see biden not just say let's unite but actually step over the line and declare some of the policies and points of view of the other side as being valid and and engaging more directly on those points versus saying we'll all work together in the future and we're already seeing and we're already seeing this rift with mcconnell and others in terms of how to deal with the filibuster in a unified senate um and i i just don't think that we're there so um yeah yeah sax what are you what are your thoughts and then we'll go to youtube yeah i mean look i'm not gonna swoon over an octogenarian reading cliches off a teleprompter i'm sorry i just can't do it now that that being said uh you know the the the inauguration speech struck all the right notes of you know reconciliation lowering the temperature coming together these are the things you're supposed to say at an inauguration these are the presidential layups if you will it's kind of a weird thing that trump could never quite get these layups

in uh biden did what he was supposed to do and um and i agree that there is a sense of relief in the temperature being lowered and uh and this and the the situation washington feeling a bit depressurized and so i think he deserves credit for that that's all for the good i think the problem biden's going to have is not just sort of um the trump right opposing him but the uncivil warriors in his own party you know uncivil warriors i think was the most memorable line in his speech there are people i think you know on the left who aren't really on board with the reconciliation agenda i mean shortly after the election you had aoc proposing

a truth and reconciliation commission right uh to go after everyone from the the trump era i don't think that's exactly the kind of reconciliation binds talking about you have i think the repressive hand of big tech playing into this revenge agenda by acting as a speech cartel and now we have the rest of the tech stack jumping on board with the the speech cartel you had an announcement from a whole bunch of finance companies paypal stripe square that said they would uh cancel the accounts and by implication livelihoods of anyone connected to january 6. well what exactly does that mean i mean there were many thousands of people at this rally on the mall only

a few percent of them breached the capital an even smaller percentage engaged in violence but everybody who was at the mall and really everyone in the maga movement is quote unquote connected to to that protest so how many degrees of kevin bacon are we going to play in acting out these reprisals and i think the worst part of all is that now we have in congress a bill put forward by adam schiff that basically would create a domestic patriot act to uh to create giant new surveillance powers for the state to go after people they they deem to be traitors and seditionists and domestic terrorists and you know i actually tweeted a letter by rashida toleb of the squad opposing this it's

the first time i've stood with the squad i was proud to because the last thing the state needs right now is is more surveillance powers and this idea that we're fighting a war against fellow americans based on basically political dissent that's not going to create reconciliation that's going to lead to the next step in this um horrible tit-for-tat game just to build on this for a second um there was a rasmussen poll that came out today today is friday january 22nd so two days after the inauguration and biden's disapproval rating is 45 and you know all of a sudden you can think again as you said three days ago you know a lot of people were on the losing side and are now on the winning side and today um a lot of people that were on the winning side are quote unquote on the

losing side and you see how reflexive the reaction is it's like an auto hate right it's like auto disapproval and so if that's the case it just it just begs the question how much room and how much tolerance will we have as a society if we start to go after folks that is you know that effectively have an enormous amount of political dissent are there fringes of both parties that need to get basically found out exposed and put in jail whether they're antifa on the left or you know the far right extremists on the right absolutely but hopefully the fbi already has enough power to do that and that's already their remit and what we're not gonna have to do is pass an enormous number of laws i mean i've said this before like the patriot act was so crazy because it was a foreign actor and a foreign event on domestic

soil that created it but you know between the pandemic and now it happened in the capital a biological patriot act a domestic patriot act these are all in the offing and i think what we're going to have to do is again it sounds cheesy but find the common ground so that we can expose who are at the fringes of both parties who are the real crazy people round those folks up and deal with them with the laws that we have today because otherwise the unintended consequences for the overwhelming majority of the americans who are just normal folks is going to be a little scary i thought a really interesting reconciliation moment happened with the woman who stole nancy pelosi's laptop i don't know if you guys were

have read that story but this woman who stole the laptop and was considering selling it to the russians or something she's 22 years old she's obviously was misguided in doing this and the judge basically explained to her that she was releasing her to her mother's you know care and that her mother would go to jail if you know she did anything further um but she said listen you know you're a beneficiary of the constitution you are getting a speedy trial you are getting representation and she used it almost as a civics lesson and i think we had a discussion

maybe two episodes when the pod got a little hot um which was great for ratings by the way and for our relationships and it resulted in a reconciliation dinner that we had a little a little uh wives dinner our wives brought us together for dinner to just make sure everything was on the well chamoth brought us together for dinner uh um i mean it was it was a good thing because frankly jason i was starting to hate you just just a little bit uh but but i could feel the hate you know and uh chamoth uh being uh empathetic as he is recognized the situation and uh so we've decided to do you know at least a quarterly besties dinner

to make sure that uh yeah that the contentiousness does not get out of hand and interfere with our friendships which are more important than our politics ultimately that's what we all hope is comes out of this podcast which is a deeper understanding of reconciliation of of issues that we disagree on and breaking bread having a meal or having a civil conversation even if it gets a little heated keeping it civil is important i thought that this is the way to handle it a lot of these we're going to be able to use some amount of judgment on the people who storm the capital and say okay this person's misguided they took a selfie this person broke windows and then this

person you know through a fire extinguisher a cop and we have to make sure that the justice system is deployed in in a fair way and more surveillance and and more investigations i don't think that's the solution i think more surveillance more investigations absolutely because i think the fbi has the power today to do that and i think they should they like i said they should find every single person involved find the appropriate crime make sure that they're punished but the idea of passing broad sweeping surveillance powers over every american citizen is [ __ ] nuts bonkers and

by the way all that's all that's going to do is create these honey pots for foreign governments to want to attack anyways because if that capability exists it exists in code on servers somewhere and folks in china and other places will want to find out where that is and they will be attacking it all day long and so the last thing we need is we're already leaking enough information uh about ourselves online willingly and unwittingly um i don't want there to be a honeypot that's the first thing the second thing i just want to say is i thought it was incredible um what mitch mcconnell did just back to your comment jason about making sure folks get the right adjudication i think mitch mcconnell set the stage to have donald trump impeached and the reason i think that is this was the first time he was completely unequivocal which is that donald trump provoked all these folks and i think what it allows the republican party to

do is to get together under closed doors you know behind closed doors circle the wagons and say it's either him or us we choose right now and i think what's going to happen if i had to guess is that that allows a lot of people to break ranks and support the impeachment in the senate that's going to start on monday and i think there's a real chance now that that this impeachment goes through and he gets convicted i think it's worth just thinking about the implications of that um if you did that there are there are trump loyalists there aren't really gop loyalists um and uh i guess there are gop loyalists but there are a lot of trump loyalists that are not loyal to the gop at this point and sax you know correct me if i'm wrong but if trump does

actually create a fringe party does create a a patriot party as he suggested he might um you could see up to 20 million americans joining that party and you know that would reduce the ranks of the republican party significantly and then kind of my understanding is in political theory what would result is you always have a balance in the parties and so the parties kind of adjust left or right to create that balance ultimately it's just kind of the organic way this this works in order for the republican party to gain um it you would probably see a lot of membership move over the republican party which means that the democratic party is going to move further left and um you know think about the implications of that if trump does actually if they do actually kick trump out of the party and he does set up a french party you will likely see the democrats move

further left creating a much more um kind of conflicting story for some of the centrists than what they're telling today of what's going to happen in the future and that's a very different america in the next two to three years that could be created if they took that risk and i think they have to associate that calculus when they're making this decision you know you can talk about justice and wanting to kick him out of the party but the implications of him leaving the party are rather profound oh it would fracture the republican party it would be i guess the best historical analog would be when teddy roosevelt left the the party uh to form the bull moose party he actually fractured the republican party and that allowed um i think woodrow wilson to win the presidency uh beating taft um yeah i mean the republicans would basically lose every election um

from now until trump is no longer you know a force in american politics if he created i guess the or they'd have to they'd have to move left right i mean in order for them to gain you know more people they'd have to get the centrist democrats they'd have to move left and that'll give the democrats the ability to move left yeah i mean it it's it's a it would be a dream scenario for for the democrat party um i'm surprised i'd be surprised at the end of the day if if if enough republicans went along with this to to fracture the party but um look i i understand that on some basis you know trump trump caused what what happened at the capitol he convened everybody he rabble roused but i think that um frankly if you have a trial i think the

question we have to ask is like what agendas does this serve does this serve a reconciliation agenda or does this serve a revenge agenda i mean the guy's already out of office i thought we cancelled the trump reality show and this is like bringing it back for another season because this trial is going to be a [ __ ] show just like all things trump you have a trial in the senate and it's going to turn into a total farce okay and you know look i think cosmically trump was reckless he was responsible but when you actually look at the legal definition of incitement it's actually very hard to prove incitement so now trump's going to get his lawyers up there and they're going to be pushing back on this and it's going to consume the country for months and i just think we should be moving forward right now the government's already going to be first three days and done all right why would it take months i'm curious you're just saying you overhang from it they're going

to start at mid-february right it's not going to be three days this goes on until the trial's over i mean it's it'll be at least a week of of uh discussion right sex so saks is it do you think the gop preventing trump from being able to run again is worth the year the week of animosity let's call it i i don't i think we should just move on as a country um and i you know at the end of the day i think that's what's good for biden's agenda i mean this will become very consuming what's good for the gop though if you're if as a person who would align themselves with republicans mainly i would say what do you think is best for your party the party you're part of just moving

on just moving forward what if trump comes back and gets the nomination in 2024 i mean i think that is definitely a risk you you take um but i think that that risk um i you know i'll leave it to the voters to decide what what makes sense um interesting i i think that the only salvation for the republicans is to repudiate trump and and i actually agree with um with uh friedberg i think that this creates the opportunity for this i think trump wants to call it the patriot party to be sort of center right i think democrats probably ebb over time you know center left

and then the republicans actually are this interesting power broker because they can actually tack to the middle and be centrist you know about a social safety net combined with you know small government if you could somehow tiptoe and and and balance on that line i think that is the winning strategy that people want but i think that's that's my point is the republican party is going to have to move left in order to create balance between the two parties again because they're going to lose 20 million voters to the patriot party and that's the profound shift that's going to happen and when the republican party moves left the democrats are going to move further left and so maybe i don't think that moving that far left is a really winning strategy for no but i think i think friedrich is right so as an example i i think i can say this but like i i had a call this week with um the mayor of miami francis suarez what an unbelievably impressive guy

holy [ __ ] [ __ ] this guy is amazing um what he's done in miami is incredible um i mean the gdp growth is like chinese gdp growth ten percent eight percent six and a half percent he's running fiscal surpluses you know crime is down down down he's done an incredible job this guy is a fundamental centrist you know and when you talk about what his beliefs are i was like what is this guy is he a democrat is he republican i was like he's like honestly i'm a centrist you know and and so my point is if whoever tacks to the middle we'll find the ability to attract incredible

leaders that i think are are our next generation set of leadership so in that way trump as a change agent uh sax was a success in that he broke the system and this was peter thiel's kind of concept when he put him in and i know you don't speak for peter but peter's idea was hey this person's a change agent he's gonna be this you know drain the swamp person maybe that didn't happen but he has basically made everybody reconsider what party they want to be part of and what they actually want on the political agenda and now we're so we've never been more focused on politics and how our country runs in our lifetime have we well trump you're right that trump was a

classic disrupter you know keith rabboy has this line about founders that uh disruption is created by disruptive people and trump was you know one of those very disruptive people i mean it just to take two examples i mean he created a total realignment on our views around china i think it's now a bipartisan consensus that you know we should not keep feeding china uh and making you know keep feeding that the chinese tiger and turning into a dragon um everyone seems to think now that that some reappraisal is warranted and the other the other big issue was the forever wars of the middle east you know i think trump first created a realignment within the republican party when he said no more bushes he met no more of these stupid foreign wars

and i think that was an important realignment um so yeah i mean he's been a very disruptive figure i think that um everyone's breathing a sigh of relief because we've moved on i think that he unnecessarily was incendiary and sort of pressurized the situation but i think the best thing at this point is to move forward and not keep rehashing the trump era speaking of rehashing um i don't know if you guys know about what is happening with facebook but they have an oversight board they created last year in the spring and the oversight board is not to do the day-to-day policing of facebook and instagram and whatsapp activity but it is to be a place where people who have been have had content removed or have had their account suspended to appeal they have taken the trump case as it were and given it to their supreme court which is the oversight board

and the oversight board is uh going to make a judgment based on should trump get his social media accounts back they have complete autonomy from facebook they are funded by facebook with 120 or 130 million over the next six years so they're getting like 20 million dollars a year to run this they've got a really amazing bench of intellectuals public intellectuals and and they're sort of above facebook in this regard what do we think uh should happen to trump's social media accounts should he have a path to reclaiming them and would this uh board that exists as this of budsman as i talked about in the last episode what do we think of this process and do we think maybe twitter and youtube should join this oversight board let's separate these two things and actually jason you

just framed it perfectly let's separate the two issues one is is any of us comfortable with a random set of people that some people will like and other people not like making these decisions on our behalf that are not necessarily trained to make these decisions i mean these aren't elected trained judges or lawyers that sit for a bar exam these are just you know private citizens ultimately at the end of the day um i think that if you allow this to happen at scale there's going to be a bunch of decisions that you'll be okay with and support i think a lot of people probably are cheering when trump got blocked but if you can abstract it away and think about all the people that you actually care about what if the administration was on the other side and now all of a sudden you know these people to curry favor with the administration went in a different

direction and people that you cared about got blocked it is an untenable situation and i think this is the slippery slope that the framers never intended i don't think it should be people like this making any decision like this and in many ways it's a it's a fig leaf for these companies to pretend they're doing the right thing while they're really shirking the real responsibility friedberg you agree it's hard to say on the specifics so i think we should just take a broader point of view on this which is how do tech companies um create independence in the platforms that they're building so that they don't get scrutinized as monopolists and so there are several examples of this being done both successfully and not successfully across the tech ecosystem google made android open source and by making the android operating system open source they were able to have their own forked versions that they were able to install on phones with partners like htc and samsung and others

that they could then have their search engine be the primary search engine so the entire android operating system is available for anyone to work on for anyone to fork for anyone to use and then google's iteration of that open source platform and google's contributions which they were making regularly allowed them to kind of have a great commercial outcome without being the owner of the operating system having learned from the mistakes of microsoft in the past facebook tried to take a similar approach with libra and it was a total [ __ ] show and a disaster and i don't know where it is today but they tried to create this also independent board um to provide oversight uh and to you know to kind of do the you know all the open source work on the libra currency and facebook was going to then use that on their platform as their kind of you know

token uh cryptocurrency solution um and obviously there was so much scrutiny because no one believed the independence and i think we're hearing the same thing now about the facebook oversight board jack dorsey is now taking the same approach with blue sky which is meant to be this um open sourced um you know independently managed um social media protocol system and so twitter would effectively become an application layer on top of this open sourced approach to how do you decide what goes on social media how do you decide what's inappropriate and appropriate and what technology protocols are available for everyone to use and what business and and um arbitration protocols are available for everyone to use in an open source way and we'll see where jack goes with blue sky he seems to be doing a better job messaging and organizing teams of people

to work on this and i don't see the pushback that facebook is getting with their oversight board so unfortunately a lot of these the big tech platforms in order to avoid the monopolistic allegations and the allegations of control and influence uh they're creating independence uh independent systems and that's hit or miss and i don't think we yet know i think in the next year or two we'll see how blue sky libra the facebook oversight board and some of these other platforms what would you do david platforming what would you do let me just put it to you if you were in charge you were the ceo of facebook or twitter would you have a path to reinstating trump yes or no yeah let me just get freebergs would you yes or no reinstate trump oh yeah 100 we should have a

path to it i i think be like i've said in the past having some objective i think that number one i don't think it was inappropriate for them to kick him off the platform from a legal perspective i don't sacks and i might disagree but we can probably argue for an hour but i think from a freedom of speech point of view they're private companies with private accounts and they did what they wanted to do was it the right thing to do um i don't think that was the right thing so yeah give him a path to getting his account back free and so i think you need to create an objective system and you need to give everyone whether it's trump or whoever else everyone has to have the same set of standards that they're held to and then a universal approach that anyone can appeal and okay but that's the approach but knowing what trump did on january 6 would you let him back on your platform if you were ceo is the question i'm trying to get out of your freebird but okay david you go yeah i mean so so here's the fundamental problem is that the town square is now

owned by facebook and twitter the town square got privatized and our speech rights are now in the hands of mark zuckerberg and jack dorsey as a practical matter i mean you do not have speech rights in the modern world if you get d platform by big tech and until now there's been no way to appeal their decisions we have had no transparency into their decisions so i think facebook creating this appeals board is a step in the right direction but you know they're calling it their supreme court but i'll tell you my supreme court is the supreme court you know at the end of the day we all know that the most important part of a trial is jury selection and zuckerberg is still picking these 20 people and you know actually just in case in point he picked the top he picked the four and the four pick the next 16 and then they don't have an ongoing um

ability to pick the next ones and they have some amount of terms so just to give you that okay well fair enough and like i said look i don't want to criticize this move on its own because it is a step in the right direction we need an appeals process when people get cancelled okay um that part is good but but what i would like to see like i said my supreme court is the supreme court and they've spoken to this issue and i would like to see these social networking monopolies apply a first amendment standard a speech policy broadly consistent with the first amendment and sometimes that will mean allowing speech we don't like but it will result in a greater level of speech protection for all of us well it wouldn't just reach back on the platform no but hold on a sec if you're gonna go by that standard the problem is with this oversight

board concept is that it completely violates exactly what the supreme court is meant to be which is a country-by-country set of governance and standards and laws like i'm just looking at the oversight board people right now these people look incredibly well credentialed emmy palmer of israel catalina botero moreno of colombia nigat dad from pakistan helle thorning schmidt from denmark catherine chen from taiwan jamal green from the united states alan rusbridger from uk andreas sagio from hungary and it goes on and on how are we supposed to adjudicate a set of standards at a national level like when when we have the are all these people from all

these different countries supposed to opine on u.s constitutional right of free speech and have it the idea would be they would use some global standards but then also take into consideration local standards that's what they their stated purpose is and why they're so diverse the setup for that though jason is that then you know when when there's a you know the hindu nationalist bjp party has a specific point of view and so when modi wants to get elected there's going to be specific kinds of free speech laws there you know poland's going to have a different point of view and they're not going to respect what's happening in the oversight board case in point australia passed a potential law or is considering passing a law which is basically around if you know treating facebook and google uh as quasi publishers and that you know they're i think

that they have to pay some kind of royalty now for articles that are shared or published or whatever and google said i'm out and then facebook said i'm out too um and so what does that mean for you know 200 million people you're out what does that mean you're out you can make money when the getting's good and all of a sudden you build this public infrastructure when the country's rules change i i actually respect that more than trying to create some of this broad holistic governance committee because i think it's a [ __ ] show you can't cherry pick which laws you want to observe and respect and and then which laws you don't you know i i think trimath makes an excellent point about how difficult this is going to be to implement let me propose an alternative that actually comes from a former law professor of mine at the university of chicago richard epstein he made the point that

he wants to apply common carrier regulation at least in the u.s to these monopolies and the example he gives is that the railroad monopolies could not deny you service based on your political views and you know this is this is a um this is a real issue imagine you know going back in time you know we had the lincoln douglas debates for example the way that lincoln and douglas went around the country was by train imagine if some railroad magnate some oligarch said mr lincoln i don't like your views i'm not going to give you passage on my railroad monopoly the common carrier rules would have prevented them from doing that and what epstein suggests we do is

a if you're a essentially a um a monopoly a speech monopoly in the in the us one of these platforms that has uh you know gigantic network effects you have to apply the common carrier uh rules it's an interesting concept i think let's move on to um the economy uh and it'd be interesting we'll monitor obviously what the this oversight board does we're going to monitor uh what's going to happen with this uh january 6 uh sorry jason the last thing on this is you could you can tell if you if you graphed and i'm sure somebody uh listening to all in can graph and tweet this but if you graphed the price to earnings ratio of big tech as all of these issues have come out like

you know if you looked at a time series of their pe um and you put on their you know things like george floyd things like the capital riots you know all of these things that have created these um flash points issues around free speech flashpoints the the massacre in new zealand and christchurch that was live streamed on facebook all this stuff what you'll see is at least capitalism is voting that these companies will not be allowed to be companies much longer so the smart money is betting that they're going to be regulated and something's going to change it's going to be a quasi governmental organization exactly that the level of regulation at a government but government level um is going to be so onerous as to make these companies quasi nonprofits that work on behalf of countries they're going to become utilities

right they're getting they're going to get regulated like utilities at some point or they're going to have to adopt some governance like we've talked about or other options will emerge and i think what jack is doing with the is it blue sky is what they're calling it blue sky yeah yeah what they're really doing with blue sky is saying your profile and your data is going to be stored on some blockchain or some decentralized system like bitcoin or like any other peer-to-peer service which means it's not on their server twitter just pulls all that data together so we would all have our own domain names and calicanus.com or saks.com profile dot whatever the html equivalent is let's just call it dot social you know your sacs.social

url would be your profile on facebook twitter and everywhere else and when you post it to it it would post to facebook and twitter therefore they could say we don't actually host this stuff we're just pulling it together which then destroys their business model champ's point what do we think as a little aside is going to happen with the tick tock case now that trump is out of office and biden is in office we sort of alluded to china sacks being a super important thing that we all have consensus on now what should happen with tick tock and do you think biden will go after tick tock and say hey we got to get this out of here because it's you know essentially spyware and jack ma was just resurfaced and let's just talk about china for a second yeah i think the sad reality is that the whole tick tock thing is going to get swept under the rug um i think there'll be no restrictions on tick tock i think

what we need the issue with like with uh banning tick tock though is that it's just one place where china can collect data on all of us i mean the reality is there's thousands of places and so you know i do think that taking some action on tick tock is warranted but it would it it is a little bit of selective enforcement but what i would like to see is some guarantee some assurance that um that tick tock is not is collecting data in the way they're saying they're collecting it and that there's not um sort of spyware uh within the app and i don't think we know for sure whether there's spyware or not i'll say it i'll say it slightly differently i've maintained this for a while but it is inconceivable that inside of big tech in every single company that you define big tech is not at least one spy from russia china india israel pakistan saudi arabia did i tell you guys i had a spy working for me a climate no

you got arrested did i tell you guys about this no tell us the story it's public so i'll share it we had a data scientist um named hightower great guy uh worked on our remote sensing team and worked on our nitrogen model which predicted nitrogen content in soil and was very deep in the in the in the code base and everything and shortly after i had left i found out this so climate just for the audience my company i started and ran was acquired by monsanto in 2013 which is a big seed company a lot of people know it for other things and um and so i left and i found out that the guy quit went to the airport and the fbi intercepted him at the airport and they found tucked into his bag a thumb drive and he had downloaded all of our code base for our nitrogen models and he was taking them to give them to the chinese government and so he's in jail right now he's in prison in

the u.s right now but this was like the most non-descript super nice scientist data scientist guy uh you've ever met like you would have had zero suspicion and um and it turns out this is the point how many of those exist in facebook and by the way it was so easy for him to get access to our code base and he pulled all the stuff down and he had the whole model and you know there's a lot of uh articles about what happened in our case um but you're right it's happening all over the place and um and i don't think that we fully appreciate like how much of america's ip is stored in software uh and data and how accessible that is to employees inside of these organizations and that

the security is not adequate uh to protect that data and that ip and then the crazy thing is like you know when just to connect the two dots here on this jack muffin like when you saw that video where like you know basically he was forced to you know um show field team okay i'm okay and you know this is all about the chinese party held captive my gosh like i mean these are all quasi-governmental companies alibaba exists uh because of the largesse of the communist party in xi jinping if that wasn't clear after last week i mean and so to your point like you know if any company gets a hold of of us user data or otherwise it's effectively the chinese government getting a hold of that data yeah we don't need proof david when jack ma disappears and then comes back and looks he looked nervous on that video i'm no expert but he did not look like he was the jack ma

who was giving speeches and inspiring people and i don't know what this does to entrepreneurship in china but i mean who in china is going to start a company now and want to be the next jack ma or jeff bezos no i think i think jason it's even simpler what happens it makes it makes entrepreneurship even simpler meaning for those entrepreneurs that thought that there was a balance between financial imperative and moral imperative there's no balance you can flush the moral imperative down the [ __ ] toilet they china will allow you to get super rich and super successful as long as you super toe the line and that's the message right it's like what

uh putin did with uh kordakovsky in russia it's like he basically told all the oligarchs you work for us now and uh and it worked that's basically that it worked that's basically the message uh from the ccp to jack ma and to every other entrepreneur in china is you work for us now and by the way civil military fusion was part was was a policy expressly announced by president xi you know one other data point on this i think is really interesting is that biden just announced that he was keeping on christopher wray as the head of the fbi um christopher wray gave a speech back in july at the hudson institute about um the counter espionage efforts uh that the fbi has engaged in and he was saying that the fbi has more cases now related to uh to chinese

uh counterintelligence he said that the fbi is opening a new china related counterintelligence case every ten hours and two days and two a day and of the of the nearly 5 000 active fbi counterintelligence cases currently underway across the country almost half are related to china so this is directly from a speech he gave in july so i think it's really interesting now at the time that he gave the speech you know a lot of people were saying well this is just trump's more of trump's china baiting but i think that by biden keeping on chris christopher wray there's a continuity of policy there and i think you know focusing on tick tock is probably the wrong thing

we need a more comprehensive policy to deal with counterintelligence well it's a good start though to say if you hit scale we're not going to let you operate here and we want reciprocity adding to this uh outgoing secretary of pompeo and is the day before the inauguration uh tweeted i have determined that the people's republic of china is committing genocide and crimes against humanity in china targeting the uyghurs muslims and members of other ethnic and religious minority groups that's quite a bomb to leave the day before and i think this signals we are going to keep resetting this relationship and what an incredible opportunity for us to bring factories back here bring as we've talked about here manufacturing back correct freeburg

that's what i think oh let's keep going let's kick it off we got we got three three million factories in china i think we've got less than a hundred thousand in america let's go and it will be so glorious it will be so [ __ ] glorious i mean think about this right look think about the amount of money like at the end of the day what is a government's purpose is it to run a profit no you know that's our job right is it to run at break even i would actually say no i think it's to basically promote the prosperity of current and future generations of its citizens and so you should be investing so if this is the you should be an investment so if we're going to be printing you know trillions of dollars and you know we should talk about the stimulus bill because biden's going to rip in another 2 trillion which i think is the perfect segue and by the way and then after that there's going to be this it's amazing infrastructure bill put the money to work

let's reclaim a bunch of this capability on shore and let's re-build america okay uh freeburg you looked at the um 1.2 trillion dollar stimulus package that biden is proposing how much of that goes towards rebuilding factories in america well none so so remember yeah but it's 1.9 billion yeah it's 1.9 trillion 1.9 trillion yeah absolutely and so just to put that in context you know wall street has talked about there were going to be four um four massive stimulus bills you know since last april may i think they've talked about this and we're seeing this come to to fruition now and jamal correct me if you've heard differently but there's always been the expectation we would have the big first stimulus which we had last march

then a second stimulus people have been waiting for the state stimulus or the local government stimulus which this one now it captures and then the fourth program was always going to be infrastructure and we haven't seen details of the proposed biden infrastructure plan yet but i'm pretty sure it's going to have a lot of green energy uh stuff tied up in it but let's just let's just hit the numbers right so in 2009 post financial crisis to keep the global economy from collapsing um congress passed an 800 billion dollar aid package 800 billion was extraordinary at the time and we had never seen anything like it tarp and um last march if you'll recall we passed this emergency two trillion dollar package you

know more than 2x what we had during the financial crisis and now just in december right before the year wrapped up congress passed another 900 billion dollar package and now we're talking about this 1.9 trillion dollar package getting passed so we've eclipsed anything you could have ever con considered possible um in terms of fiscal stimulus at this point the m1 money supply which i sent the link out ahead of this for has gone up by 75 uh in just the past year and now if we break down the 1.9 trillion dollar stimulus bill um you know a huge chunk of it and this is what wall street's been waiting for is 350 billion dollars is going to state and local governments so think

about san francisco or the state of california um the city of chicago the city of new york all of these folks have seen their revenue decline and they've had to run massive emergency programs where's that money coming from they haven't been able to raise taxes they've had to put a hold on on receipts and so this is meant to bridge the gap at the local level and this is really important because so much of capital markets still very much fund local and state governments through municipal bonds and those bonds if they start to default are going to have a dangerous rippling effect in the economy so bridging the state and local government budgets with this 350 billion

dollar package turned out to be um you know an absolute need and the republicans prior to the the election were pushing hard against this and saying let those states fail they're mostly blue states let those cities fail they're mostly blue cities they're mismanaged they're they're being stupid about how they're operating so this is a big deal there's 160 billion for covid fighting some of which you know i throw up on 20 billion dollars for vaccination which equates to about 150 dollars per person they expect to vaccinate which is an extraordinarily high cost if you actually think about it on a first principles basis it's ridiculous how inefficient they're going to be at this 50 billion dollars for testing 40 billion dollars for protective gear and supplies

and what this indicates to me is so much of what goes on in government government spending is skating to where the puck used to be not skating to where the puck is going and it's almost like by the time this money gets deployed i'm not sure we're going to need as much protective gear and supplies i'm not sure we're going to need as much testing if we can actually get the vaccinations done in the next 90 to 100 days and much of the country starts to recover from this you know you've now got 150 billion dollar program sitting out there that doesn't need to be out there and it's a waste of money what we should be doing is taking that money and investing in biomanufacturing infrastructure so we can more quickly develop and deploy vaccines in the future what would it cost to build a factory just back of the envelope that was capable of making the next you know let's call it one two billion vacancy shots one two yeah it's it's not a lot so

let me i'll give you guys the unit economic build and you can do the math at home four grams per liter is the expected yield of a um of a biomanufacturing facility and a leader is like you know how many liters of water do you have in a tank you can build half million liter facilities for a couple hundred million dollars and that's four grams per liter every seven days and us vaccine or the the antibody therapies that we've seen the antibody therapies are about two grams and that'll save someone's life uh the the vaccines are a fraction of a gram

and so you can start to kind of do the math on how just a few billion dollars invested in building some of these biomanufacturing facilities that are modular and can be very quickly reprogrammed to make a new molecule can be used to support the future vaccine supply chain and the future anti-antibody therapeutic supply chain which is critically needed in this country and if i were to take 160 billion dollars for covet fighting give me 10 of that and we'll be ready for any virus in the future and we'll be able to print out vaccines for the whole country within 30 days um and so a little bit again of this is not really forward thinking it's scientists and doctors saying what they need what they're talking about is last year's need they're not thinking in terms of what the industrial supply chain needs are going to be in the future on an ongoing basis for this country at this point i'm not seeing it

and so i feel a little bit let down by that and i hope that the infrastructure programs that are going to be proposed in the next in the next bill will start to encompass some of that work paradoxically it's going to cost a trillion dollars to upgrade our nuclear weapons so we're literally going to spend a trillion dollars over the next decade open upgrading our nuclear weapon is that is that true that's nutty that's what i i'm reading a headline right here um here's my here's my little wish list for this infrastructure build i think um when you look at some of the most compelling work that's happened in the developing world so like if you're going to go and you know build a massive water facility or an energy installation um a lot of people are

worried hey listen i have to deal with you know local currency risk i have to deal with you know corruption i could have the government you know take away this facility from me without notice the rule of law may not be strong and the world bank has this mechanism where you can basically go and ensure you know for i think it's like one or two percent of your project costs the whole project and it really makes things work i would love to see the us government effectively create a program that is similar but different in the following way there are some enormous things america needs to do where the ip exists with our allies and there is an enormous fear what would happen if that ip leaked specifically to china one example is if you believe and you care about climate change

and the making of batteries um there's an enormous amount of ip that sits with the japanese um that you know if we could license and work with as a country we could build factories all over the country and we would be the leader in climate but that'll take the us government to basically work bilaterally with the japanese government to basically say listen if it takes the nsa to [ __ ] protect this [ __ ] we will do it um but you can run them they we could just give them their sovereignty and those facts you know these are these are these are for-profit companies that are you know relatively risk-averse they're not going to rip in 10 million bucks to 10 billion dollars to build you know a cathode plant in the u.s i would other people would um

but that's my hope in the infrastructure bill is that we take some of these things that have worked in the developing world and we use it to grease the skids in how we rebuild america it would be [ __ ] glorious and also just think about how much a nuclear power plant costs it's like six to nine billion dollars to build a nuclear power plant and we haven't built many new ones and we're on the way there but if part of this trillion dollars we could build 10 more of those energy independence would uh continue in global warming would go down uh anything to add there dave it looks like you want to come well i just did just one final word you know the um the the the great senate leader uh everett dirksen famously said that you know billion here are a billion there pretty soon you're talking about real money and now we're talking about a trillion here and a trillion there and these are really big numbers uh and i think we should be very concerned about debt and deficits

no one's really talking about this yet but all of this money has to be paid back at some point um well what's the worst that can happen david let's actually do that i'm i mean i'm asking the question in a non-joking way what is the worst that can happen oh i mean crisis inflation inflate well not not just so inflation because the government will eventually have to monetize the debt by printing more money the dollar stops becoming the world's reserve currency maybe bitcoin becomes the world's reserve currency maybe something else does um it could be lead to you know very severe to basically a debt crisis in the future what would that look like for companies and citizens of america well if you're middle if you're middle class your savings get wiped out you

know if you so so if you're super rich the reality is there's already been tremendous asset inflation so there's already been a lot of inflation but frankly if you are very rich and own assets in the stock market you're you're sort of you're protected you know but if you're a middle-class person with most of your savings in your bank account that money is not worth a lot less or your home yeah you get destroyed by that yeah it's really very sad so if you are in equities and the market is on a rip you know paying an extra couple of million dollars for your second home

is not a big deal because your equities have gone up more than that or equal to that and if you're right somebody who get makes income we have uh a separate issue well look this is this is a this is a bigger issue but but and i think we should talk about this at some point because this is what the grand fallacy of technology was supposed to be like you know if you if you break down capitalism into its two most natural states you have labor and you have capital right you have workers and you have owners and the biggest problem that technology did was it drove a wedge and it created an extremely small owner class and an extremely massive labor class and so the reality is that a very few very a handful of people can can get extremely wealthy by being owners of these next generation assets and then everybody else is essentially you

know rendered as labor um and so this wealth inequality just grows and grows and compounds um and so we have to figure out a way yeah how's that different than the past because i think it's got i think i think technology accelerated that dynamic well i think jumping in on this i mean i i think that technology creates bigger winner take all outcomes and that's fed into inequality but the good thing about tech or the tech ecosystem is that frankly we have option pools right we have broad-based ownership of these companies if you go work for a google or facebook or whatever um

you get all these brands yeah that's what 10 000 people that's 10 000 people that's no one and they're and they're replacing 2 million jobs with 10 000 people i mean this is this is why we need to have a hundred percent participation in the markets by everybody in the country joe greenblatt who i had on my podcast recently is a proponent of this chemotherapy so you tweeting about it when you're born in the united states we should put five thousand dollars in a 401k that you can't touch until you're 65 years old that is in whatever index funds and every person born gets that 5 000 and cannot touch it and then we see where it winds up it doesn't solve the problem that a lot of people have to climb up a hill first right they take on a lot of debt to get education to put themselves in a position to ultimately be able to generate the income to do that and i think

you know sure give them 5 000 in the beginning but it's not going to get them where they need to be but it does solve one portion of the problem which is they don't have participation and we could take out the wondering what your retirement is going to be like i think both of you are right i think like there needs to be um something that allows people to have a line of sight to savings like a lot a lot of about being invested in in anything where you own it whether it's real estate or whether it's a piece of artwork or whether it's stocks and bonds so many people don't even know how to begin and don't understand the concept of ownership and so they are stuck in being in the ghetto of labor and i think like one of the biggest things we can do is you can give them the taste of ownership so that they understand that difference so that they want to be an owner

yeah okay number one yes and then to david's point number two is we still have a responsibility to educate people so that they can actually have skills that they can monetize and we have a responsibility to do that and right now we make it so [ __ ] hard and we trick people because like we we send them down the path of getting a 200 000 art history degree and then they end up working at a starbucks and then which is impossible to monetize i mean it's free you can't monetize that you can't by the way by the way what you're saying is the reason i think retirement accounts were set up in the u.s was to shift away from pension fund models where people were getting a fixed income at retirement and shifting them to a model of equity and ownership in the markets where they could participate actively on a tax-free basis um but obviously it hasn't done enough you know

i think the big difference between the industrial revolution the first and second industrial revolution and where we are with software in the last two to three decades is the capital required right it's very little capital to build a highly valuable software business it required a lot of capital to build oil infrastructure and railroad infrastructure and factories and so to your point you get extraordinarily different outsized returns today than you did a hundred years ago as an owner versus labor the and the bridge to try and give people ownership through retirement accounts certainly hasn't been enough so so to your point to your point david i saw this study it was [ __ ] crazy i'm going to get the exact numbers wrong but the trend is accurate

when um when when people used to actively manage their 401k there was a very small participation rate but the mean return was off the charts and the amount of dollars as a function of their paycheck was off the charts call it you know 50 60 cents of every theoretical dollar you could put into it the minute that we went to passive and that you know you could sort of trickle money in the number of people that participated literally more than doubled but then the amount of that max dollar went off of a cliff and so the the problem that we've had is we haven't taught people you know we've misdirected some of them to say have a 401 k it replaces your pension

as if it's the solution that's still not the solution um and we need to have ways of teaching people how to actually manage it it's not that hard and the basics can be taught very simply but right now we are massively exacerbating this wealth gap the way that we behave and that all of this money that's going to go in this 1.9 trillion whatever how many trillion comes afterwards is frankly for the few that are smart enough to take advantage of it will be amazing but it'll still push the overwhelming majority of americans who are stuck in labor deeper and deeper into that ghetto and they'll never get up it is definitely every little bit helps right like if you have the

401k that helps and then you know educate people and i think if we gave everybody an isa at birth or an i you know an income sharing agreement for these 20 professions and the government provided why jason why is it that you know for example if to invest in a startup you either have to have more than five million dollars or more than you know a million 200k a year it's not more than they're going to change it and so if you're if you're a product manager that's like really really talented or if you're like you know somebody else who's just got a you know a phd in nuclear biology and frankly is you know is decided to teach for sixty thousand and you can't participate even though you have the intellect to judge like we're just like kind of like compounding it's even worse than that the person who's changing the accreditation laws at the sec and working on this

said i cannot i'm writing the accreditation laws and because i make 150k a year or whatever it is under 200k i can't participate and i'm the one responsible for the law that person must be one of the most sophisticated people in the world it literally is the most sophisticated person in the world when it comes to accreditation and that's why we need to move to sophisticated investor not accredited and just some test and if you did that every single uber driver lyft driver post mates driver airbnb host uh or a person who used the cash app or paypal would have said i can as one of the first users i have access to buy shares i'm just going to say this i'll buy them this problem has to get fixed because i think in the next 10 i think in the next 10 and 20 years

the united states is going to [ __ ] re-emerge like a phoenix and the reason the reason is going to be because of innovation around climate change and agriculture and biotechnology and technology these four areas are going to recast gdp but what that also means is that if we're going to create you know 20 or 30 trillion dollars a year for the next 10 and 20 years 300 500 trillion how the [ __ ] do we make sure that more than 18 people participate absolutely great well so i agree with a lot of what you guys are saying but i can tell you every single one of the companies that i've invested in are looking to hire people right now they cannot hire people soon enough it's their biggest challenge and it's not just coders it's sales people it's marketing

people it's hr people it's every every role in their company they have trouble trying to hire the right person and and and they give options to all those people so it's not just a small number of founders getting equity uh this is basically a new category of call it entrepreneurial labor it's labor who gets ownership in the company that's never existed before and really what this comes down to is we need more people participating in the new economy if you participate in the new economy then you get ownership and if you're in the old economy then you really are stuck in labor and so we need to do is spread the opportunity that that technology represents to more people

across part of the minimum wage maybe we should have a minimum equity participation so we have the minimum wage over here but if you're working for an entrepreneurial enterprise why not get a minimum you know participation in equity because the free market takes care of that i mean if you have the right market it hasn't taken care of it david no it has no no the free market has i agree with david the free market has the problem isn't that how does a person working at walmart ever participated in the walmart appreciation that's the point they will they will leave and go to a company that gives them equity and that's why you'll see this this that's convenient to say but if walmart's the only job within an hour of their house it's not they got to have the right skills jason and so this all comes back to education you know we gotta yeah who are in rank and file jobs the 30 million truck drivers cashiers etc have equity participation as a right

i think i think you're saying something different should they absolutely should the company that does that be created absolutely will they be rewarded with all the people that want to work there absolutely so now somebody should go and start that [ __ ] company okay i just think it's an interesting concept i mean we do have a minimum wage why not have a minimum jason participation you know the same woman that ran elon out of california lorena gonzalez she's doing another thing just proposed a new bill like do you want her to basically pick the equity thresholds

because that's what you're saying uh well no let's pivot let's put it to california okay let's pay over to another disaster california so the recall is uh well uh on its way they need to get 1.5 million signatures we're at 1.1 or 1.2 but we actually really need two because there's some verification process that goes on so in all likelihood we will see gavin newsom recalled we agree on that yeah i'll tell you this the stats i heard there's about a million call it a million million one signatures they've seen about an 85 percent verification rate today uh saks correct me if i'm wrong on this they're getting they're getting about 200 000 signatures a week um they're you know the cost for marketing and attracting people to get these signatures is coming in at like three to six bucks a signature so it's really not a lot of money's needing to be spent to get this done and um you know even if the verification rate drops to 75 or 65 you're still on track at this rate to hit the recall target by march 17th which is the deadline

and so it appears highly likely they're going to get there sax am i right on all that uh yeah i think they're at 1.2 million uh signatures that's what i heard and they're trying to get they're trying to get to 2 million to have a buffer so that you know they that you know they don't get pushed under the but 1.5 is the number they need yeah they need 1.5 million certified signatures seventy percent of the way they are according to the website recallgavin2020.com which think i think i think they will get there i think they'll get there and then their uh and then the recall election would take place about four to five months after uh after that there's a a couple of months where it moves through the finance committee the recall election

has to be budgeted and then um newsome would have the opportunity to set a date within i think 60 to 80 days roughly so i think we're looking at july for a a recall election and sex how how do you get um how does a candidate get on the ballot because champ um is asking for a friend wait a second i want to be on two that can should we have all four besties be on yeah we should we're probably going to have four kardashians on there so we might have four besties on there um kardashian yeah so the uh it's it's it's stunningly easy to be a replacement candidate we should expect there'll probably be about 150 replacement candidates on the ballot every every third tier seedless celebrity is gonna you know like you know back to gary

coleman did it like you know 20 years ago all every single celebrity that you're talking about yeah to try and boost their cue rating uh i'm sure we'll see kathy griffin on there i mean what she'd been doing um and so it's gonna be a farce can we deal with celebrities by the way can we talk about why he's getting recalled because i do get this question a lot from people in tech and out of tech and i just want to highlight some of the reasons i've heard and i'd love to hear why you guys think he's you know why there's this push against him but from people within the tech community i've heard that the ad hoc lockdown rules have really pissed a lot of people off in terms of when businesses are

allowed and not allowed to be open and kind of the responsiveness and the guiding principles around this during covid obviously the you know the inability to fight against the tax rate but no one wants to be publicly saying that um the failed vaccine roll out the failed testing um you know saks jamal jason what what do you guys think is the reason he's getting recalled what are the top five hypocrisy is number one i think it's the hypocrisy of going to those restaurants and then making people not go to the beach which is crazy and then i think number two is the virus we've only deployed 37 of our doses in california and that makes us you know of the major states that are putting out a lot of these vaccines uh one of the worst performers uh second

yeah we're talking about florida and new york are the other large states and they're at 56 49 and 50 we're still stuck at 37 california the cradle of innovation and technology and this bum he's a bum 37 percent deployed we should be leading should be 70 percent he's a bum can i get it wait wait it's it's new some derangement syndrome oh my god i'm just going to get a viral clip i'm trying to get a bottle of clothes you guys know you're besties jason just has a problem with anyone in authority you know i know it's the hair it's a problem it's the hair is too good french laundry the hypocrisy and then get to work so personally personality personality for you is the biggest driver is that right jason no it's it's literally the performance of their washington dc west virginia north dakota south dakota all 66 to

three percent of their vaccines employed they're double us now it's smaller states but still we're goddamn california here's what i would say as a list um number one we're the most heavily taxed number two we are we have some of the worst infrastructure in the country we have some of the lowest and poorest performing schools in the country we have the highest homeless rates for veterans in the country we have the worst preparedness for climate in the country um and so it's basically just a complete bungling at every level and so and then the fourth or the then the last which is the biggest one is we have now created an inhospitable culture for innovation and the biggest problem with that is if these climate jobs and these technology jobs and these biotechnology jobs pivot to more accepting and progressive um local and state

managements like austin texas and miami florida we lose these things forever this is a multi-generational decay that we're starting and so if we care about the state i love california i love san francisco i love how eclectic and unique and different it is i was always happy to pay 10 11 12 13 14 because it was worth it now i don't know what we get for it and so i think we i think i think he should get recalled i just think he's he's trash and yeah and just to just underscore the point on lockdowns um we now have certainly more cases we have more deaths and we have more deaths per capita than florida despite the fact that florida

has no lockdowns and a much older population and so i was just in florida a few weeks ago like um you know like chemoth was saying you know suarez the mayor there has created really a land of the free i mean it's really unbelievable you can go to bars you can go to restaurants there's no lockdown whatsoever they don't have as big a problem as california does right now why do you think that is because well because i think that the last scientific basis yeah i think the lockdowns only forestalled the problem um eventually the virus finds a way around them and i also think the thing that's happening in florida is that okay so my aunt lives there she's in her 70s she's not going to bars and restaurants because she knows she's highly at risk and so just because the government doesn't lock down doesn't mean that people don't take sensible precautions on their

own and so and so i think that what's happened is that people are going out to bars and restaurants are low risk and they're keeping the economy going over there and instead in california we have this very draconian lockdown policy and has put all these small businesses out of out of work no no it's worth it it's not a draconian lockdown policy it's a whip saw at oh it's open okay great now go and invest in a bunch of cat-backs to make sure there's outdoor dining oh hold on you're closed what is that that's just that's just stupid tons of restaurant bar owners in san francisco spent on average 30 thousand dollars building outdoor seating for their facility only to have it all shut down three and a half weeks later incompetent i mean can you imagine being an owner of that business what the it's unfair no i mean you would literally they're going to kill themselves

people will lose everything and there'll be suicides depression domestic violence and then this guy's having dinner at french laundry during the whole i mean it's just such a watch i just got a note what about that he will he's he's actually been banished from being at the french laundry apparently it's been renamed the sri lankan laundry and some notable sri lankan billionaire has bought the french laundry french laundry by the way they got a 2.6 million dollar ppp lawn that got forgiven so you know there's a there's a lot of heat on the french laundry as a whole what does it cost to go to french laundry 800 a person anybody who wants who's listening to this who wants to go to the french laundry stay at home pour a bunch of salt on whatever you're gonna eat okay melt a stick of butter in the microwave stick a butter in the microwave drink it and then basically take fifteen hundred dollars light it on fire you've been to the french laundry you're welcome here's what you

do take a really great steak trash and throw out percent of it that places and put the cube in the middle of a big large plate that is that that's not even nouveau riche it's just nouveau stupid oh i got trash meanwhile people are down in like texas getting like a a brisket burrito for four dollars but i think california really needs to fix this we need to figure out what's going on and i just want to ask one more question of you guys you don't think that this um you know because i was having this debate with my family about newsome and i was telling them about the perspectives i was hearing from tech people and why everyone's so against newsome and i've heard all these different things that you guys have shared today and you know they're

very you know and i'm hearing a lot of people kind of making the counterpoint like this is a very um difficult time it's been an impossible year for everyone everywhere so first of all you know new sim was dealt a pretty difficult hand to play and at the same time we are all psychologically primed to look for grass being greener on the other side i think a big part of you know certainly there's a lot of people leaving california my belief for texas and florida primarily because of taxes and then you justify it with all the things that are wrong with california but we're all really primed right now um with this notion that that it's a difficult place to be but we're also really having a shitty year we've had this pandemic businesses have been shut you know everyone's sick the economy is having issues i mean you know this was a really difficult hand that's been dealt

well i i don't buy that as an excuse for newsome i mean look it is true that we're going through a very difficult time but the reason i don't buy that as an excuse for newsom is because this is not april or may of 2020 when we thought the fatality rate was seven percent right and you know lockdowns could lock downs could be justified then but we now have so much more data we've seen that states that did not do lockdowns like florida and texas frankly have been no worse off than those that have done very severe lockdowns and so what is the point of continuing with this facade um and that is what i think we can legitimately blame newsome for is the failure to learn and to change courses based on data to adapt and where is the last briefing on most of the spread is not happening at businesses it's happening in homes and in california we have a particularly difficult problem because of multi-generational family homes especially in the latino communities

that have been hardest hit by kovit and the um the transmission just with diabetes as well but yeah the transmission rate in those communities is three to five x what it is elsewhere um and i think you know and that is not a result of businesses being open in fact those communities are also suffering the biggest hardships because businesses are closed well by the way this goes to the vaccination strategy just being so idiotic like you know if you wanted to be equitable then why weren't we just rolling through and basically getting those families to be vaccinated first independent of age you know you're you're you yeah apparently those are all these vaccination sites

nobody shows up i spoke to sfdph uh department of public health about this last week and they told me that they cannot get those communities they're very non-trusting of the vaccine and they're having a real struggle getting people to sign up to take the vaccine the problem is even if that is the case the problem is you should not be holding up vaccines for one community then get everybody else vaccinated so they overheat you cut the head off this [ __ ] transmission over 60 gets it that's it there's nothing to discuss let's wrap it up everyone everyone gets it but you allocate a certain number of doses to you you basically have like a tsa pre-check line if you're over 60 or you're in certain communities you jump to the front of the line and that's it but everyone can stand in line and put [ __ ] shots in arms because everyone i know that's over 65 can't even get an

appointment and it's [ __ ] um and the whole thing is it's incompetence so i think but i think what sack said is so right it's like in these moments jacal uh and friedberg like a light gets sean on the ability for people to figure things out and then you know what the intellectual capability of these people are and like look we saw the intellectual incapability of trump because we all stopped this guy could not adapt okay and um and so we are now seeing the intellectual incapability of gavin newsom and i just think they're they're part of the same lot they're just kind of

you know people who are um in over their head and they're beholden to people who got them there and their number one concern is staying in office which means appeasing a bunch of special interests uh speaking of special interest david sachs is still on tilt about uh conservatives being uh canceled uh david you wanted us to wrap with this uh wilkinson cancellation so every uh podcast we're going to have a right winger who's canceled and david's justification for putting them back on the platform god david well actually so yeah this is this is this is the uh issue of the week with david yes yes it's well this is actually it's not a it's not a left wing it so this is the

issue to draw on social media right now is that a writer named will wilkinson was just fired from his job and canceled but here's the thing it was he's not a conservative he's actually a liberal what and it was a yes and it was a right-wing tweet mob that got together to get him fired yes and so how did you get this mop together to get him cancelled explain it uh yeah so we're back everybody so much for the wives dinner my gosh yeah i'm gonna need another wives dinner well no i look i i feel the need to speak out on this because i gotta make it really clear that i do not support cancel culture when perpetrated by the right against the left i think it's what did he do okay so he posted a tweet making a joke that maybe was important not that funny basically saying

that if we want unity the one thing that like the trumpers and the bind supporters can agree on is hanging pence you know it's what it's hanging lynching minecraft lynching senses what's that do you use the word lynching or hanging he said he said hang i think no i think he said i said hang on maybe a taste and it's inciting violence on the march because it's in poor taste yeah well no look it it's it's a it's a it's a joke that's not actually that funny and maybe in poor taste what he's referring to is the fact that the you know that there were people on january 6 who were going after mike pence right that was sort of the joke anyway look he that's not the point he deleted it he apologized for it his bosses still fired him for it nobody believes that he was trying to

incite violence okay i mean come on we all know that was not inciting violence but um but the mob pretended that he was in order to create its phony outrage and then his bosses have to uh pretend that caterpillar doesn't yeah in order to appease the mob and they pretend like it was incitement to violence so they can fire him and then he even had to pretend that he was inciting violence because he had to then objectively apologize for it and there's this that's the thing about cancer culture i really don't like is just it's just so fake and phony we all have to pretend and things that aren't true in order to pacify some you know tweet mob whose outrage is manufactured anyway and i don't like seeing

the right doing this um and that's what i tweeted about and then we had all these people on the right responding to me saying an eye for an eye you know you know the left deserves this too now they're gonna get a taste of their own medicine and the problem with that is look you know you're you might win this particular battle but you're losing the war because you're now buying into the premise of cancelled culture you're now buying into this idea that we need to economically cancel people who disagree with us and i i really reject that it's certainly bad timing to say lynch or hang whichever word he used obviously lynching is a much worse word uh after people were chanting hang mike pence but he was making a commentary on that the joke didn't land and when the joke doesn't land you need to just take ownership of that and say that you shouldn't be canceled you just say it was a poor attempted humor i apologize

right and jason you know better than anybody else is when a joke doesn't land so yeah i mean here's one thing to learn about comedy people don't remember the jokes that don't land they they remember the ones that land okay everybody it's like investing in startups it's like you've got a lot of losers to find the few winners absolutely that's my i'm a volume guy you know that uh governor moth.com governorsacks.com governorfreeberg.com and government sorry can i just say jason jason if if newsom is recalled i i would like to put my name on the ballot and my my commitments are quite simple i just want to i'm going to cut the taxes to zero and i'm going to basically create an incredibly pro climate change um jobs and pro tech jobs and pro biotech jobs economy and i'm going to raise teacher salaries and i'm going to give everybody a school

can we maybe maybe maybe on the next episode we can all uh declare that we're running for governor and present our platforms oh let's do that let's do that next friday all right go to governor.com love you besties love you saks back at you we'll let your winners ride rain man david besties we should all just get a room and just have one big huge orgy because they're all just useless we need to get i'm going on